Vampires: Give them NEED to feed!!!!!

Lenikus · May 2016

I thought vegan vampires were a thing ?

dtm_samuraib16_ESO · May 2016

It would happen in real life, so yes, immersion.
Aside, feed BEFORE you start something like a dungeon.

Why do people always wait for things to be too late?
Gosh.

bloodenragedb14_ESO · May 2016

i dont know about you guys, but the reduction to fire is enough reason for me to feed before going into combat

though i will indeed get stage 4 when needing to do any sneaking

besides, im a lore nut, i like the upcoming changes, brings things more in line with how they have been doing things in the past games

timidobserver · May 2016

Maybe they could make this optional for roleplayers, but the benefits of vamp are not worth dealing with this in a combat scenario.

Uriel_Nocturne · May 2016

dtm_samuraib16_ESO wrote: »

@Uriel_Nocturne
No, I am actually very aware of the consequence.
This should be implemented with DB, hence DB is ideal for this.
And for crying out loud, if you're a Vampire, then do take care of him...
No need to keep him starved!

More, with this?
VERY BAD to starve him.
It will bring balance to an otherwise overpowered being.

No.

Reasons?

1) It absolutely shreds the Lore.
2) Vampires are much stronger at Stage 4 than at Stage 1. Some of us actually like being a force of unstoppable evil in the world.
3) Vampires are not overpowered in any way. I dare you to prove how they're overpowered.

Most importantly:
4) Feeding won't even kill an NPC. With Zenimax's abortion of a Justice System, you gain a bounty the second you start feeding. If your atrocious idea ever were implemented, you'd never be able to do anything due to a sky-high bounty nigh constantly.
5) I guess your idea just says "screw any other Elder Scrolls game. I think this is how vampires should work, and by the Gods, everyone else MUST BE wrong about how they want to play their Vampires".

Take your arrogance and just feed when you think you need to in your own game. Leave the rest of us out of it.

Just thinking about your terribad idea sorely pisses me off...

Van_0S · May 2016

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

Wrobel already stated stage one was for pve purposes (dungeons like city of ash).

All in all the change was pretty terrible and locks players into stage 4 even more so then before. I'll be ugly forever!

Why don't ZOS gives us a memento or ring (that slots in costume gear slot) that changes our appearance to stage 1 vampire?
@ZOS_GinaBruno, @ZOS_RichLambert, @ZOS_Wrobel

dtm_samuraib16_ESO · May 2016

Uriel_Nocturne wrote: »

dtm_samuraib16_ESO wrote: »

@Uriel_Nocturne
No, I am actually very aware of the consequence.
This should be implemented with DB, hence DB is ideal for this.
And for crying out loud, if you're a Vampire, then do take care of him...
No need to keep him starved!

More, with this?
VERY BAD to starve him.
It will bring balance to an otherwise overpowered being.

No.

Reasons?

1) It absolutely shreds the Lore.
2) Vampires are much stronger at Stage 4 than at Stage 1. Some of us actually like being a force of unstoppable evil in the world.
3) Vampires are not overpowered in any way. I dare you to prove how they're overpowered.

Most importantly:
4) Feeding won't even kill an NPC. With Zenimax's abortion of a Justice System, you gain a bounty the second you start feeding. If your atrocious idea ever were implemented, you'd never be able to do anything due to a sky-high bounty nigh constantly.
5) I guess your idea just says "screw any other Elder Scrolls game. I think this is how vampires should work, and by the Gods, everyone else MUST BE wrong about how they want to play their Vampires".

Take your arrogance and just feed when you think you need to in your own game. Leave the rest of us out of it.

Just thinking about your terribad idea sorely pisses me off...

Someone surely never visited Cyrodiil...
Plenty of proof right there.

Question, and this is a serious one:
When I read the forums, I read:
BOOOOHOOOOOHOOOO, content too weak.
BOOOOHOOOOOHOOOO, no challenge.
So, i figured: this uber being could use some fun, in the end, a WW has to feed continuously, so why not the Vampire?
I dared suggesting this, and I get a "Nono, me Vampire. Me not want challenge. Me like uber."

The question: What is wrong with you humans?
You make no sense to me.
You cry for one, but want the opposite.

Please do make up your mind?

Surak73 · May 2016

Your request is already partially implemented (there is already a penalty for not feeding, in terms of health regeneration which decreases from stage 2 to 4), and will be implemented even more with the next patch (damage from fire will increase from 0% in stage 1 to 25% in stage 4).

So, I think you can be happy with this.

The idea of death from not feeding is simply ridiculous, since no living (which means eating...) being in ESO dies from not feeding...

dtm_samuraib16_ESO · May 2016

Surak73 wrote: »

Your request is already partially implemented (there is already a penalty for not feeding, in terms of health regeneration which decreases from stage 2 to 4), and will be implemented even more with the next patch (damage from fire will increase from 0% in stage 1 to 25% in stage 4).

So, I think you can be happy with this.

The idea of death from not feeding is simply ridiculous, since no living (which means eating...) being in ESO dies from not feeding...

Not quite totally correct:
Sure, the WW does not die from not feeding, but he has to feed continuously to keep up his form.
If ANY being is fudged, it'd be the Werewolf.

Aside: seeing all the advantages a Vampire has, what would a minor "annoyance" matter?

Abeille · May 2016

There are many strains of Vampirism.

Lamae's one is stupidly overpowered when you compare to the others, since the sun doesn't harm her scions. It couldn't be much different, her being the original vampire.

Necrelios wrote: »

The vampire passives seem to contradict the lore anyways. Lamae Bal says to "FEED and grow stronger." not "Starve and grow stronger." I would be happy if they flipped the stages so they actually make sense.

When you think about it in game, from a character's point of view you do grow "stronger" if you feed, in the sense that you are more resistant and you get to full health faster. When you are starving, you are quicker and can use your vampire skills more frequently, and for us the players, that is more useful, which from a player's perspective make them "stronger" (but not from a character's perspective, if you get what I mean). It is like a spectrum, and the more you feed the "healthier" you are and, therefore, the closer you are to being a mortal, while if you starve yourself you get more feral. So, from a lore point of view, the way this particular strain of vampirism works seems about right.

Surak73 · May 2016

Nope: I was talking about every living being, not just WW. Or have you ever seen your breton/dunmer/argonian... die cause you hadn't nourished him with his food?... Such a thing would be totally out of place in ESO.

As for advantages/disadvantages, it seems to me that with the new patch the situation will be very well-balanced. You want the vampire advantages? You have to reach at least stage 2, but then you will have the disadvantages as well. You don't want the disadvantages (no fire penalty)? You have to remain at stage 1, but then you won't have the advantages (no buff to magicka recovery).

emily3989 · May 2016

dtm_samuraib16_ESO wrote: »

It would happen in real life, so yes, immersion.
Aside, feed BEFORE you start something like a dungeon.

Why do people always wait for things to be too late?
Gosh.

So me carrying 14000 iron ingots in my pocket does not break your immersion, but me not feeding does?

dtm_samuraib16_ESO · May 2016

Surak73 wrote: »

Nope: I was talking about every living being, not just WW. Or have you ever seen your breton/dunmer/argonian... die cause you hadn't nourished him with his food?... Such a thing would be totally out of place in ESO.

As said, the WW does not DIE from it, though his FORM does in a way.
And Vampires do need food, it's as simple as that.

As for the other races not eating?
Make a post about that, but those races have nothing to do in this topic.
Vampire is not a race, it's a "condition", quite something different.

Surak73 wrote: »

As for advantages/disadvantages, it seems to me that with the new patch the situation will be very well-balanced. You want the vampire advantages? You have to reach at least stage 2, but then you will have the disadvantages as well. You don't want the disadvantages (no fire penalty)? You have to remain at stage 1, but then you won't have the advantages (no buff to magicka recovery).

Well, about the buff, true.
When you have a valid point, you have a valid point.
But this can be altered so a stage 1 still has a (minor) Mag Regen.

But something about this: No one said you have to be stage 1.
As a stage 3, you have 2 hours I thought?, or even 6, someone said?
As a stage 4, you would have the same.
Meaning, you can go LOOOOONG time before you go to a buffet.

Just think about that...

emily3989 wrote: »

dtm_samuraib16_ESO wrote: »

It would happen in real life, so yes, immersion.
Aside, feed BEFORE you start something like a dungeon.

Why do people always wait for things to be too late?
Gosh.

So me carrying 14000 iron ingots in my pocket does not break your immersion, but me not feeding does?

What you carry in your backpack is also of no issue here.
Aside, I keep my bagpack darned light, if only for immersion's sake!

Tholian1 · May 2016

With champion points to help mitigate the fire damage, there will be no reason to feed at all unless you just want to look less ugly and move as slow as a tortoise while sneaking.

Zyle · May 2016

This would create so many problems it wouldn't be worth it to be a vampire. As much as OP would like to think we're comparing real life alternatives...vampires are fiction, in fact assuming they "have" to feed is purely based on more fiction. I think it's fine how it is now and I think it'll be okay with new changes.

If we remove the "must feed" suggestion, I would go with something along the lines of a small buff for a certain duration after feeding.

Annalyse · May 2016

The problem is that they don't make Stage 1 worth bothering to feed for. People don't care about less fire damage and better health regen - those are easily made up for with champion points, plus enchants and beverages if need be. But Stage 4 gives passives and faster use of the ultimate. Why would anyone be any other stage?

They should make Stage 1 give some sort of extra damage maybe (reflecting on a stronger vampire) and not take away the passive use. Make both stages equally desirable in terms of damage/skills, and people would at least have a choice.

Also, they should add the ability to feed on animals. Some vampires have a conscience.

dtm_samuraib16_ESO · May 2016

Sorry, being a Vampire Lord, I fail to see the problem with my suggestion.
Instead of having an endless stage 4, a timed stage 4 seems extremely doable, especially when the timers become insanely long in the DB DLC.

Ethromelb14_ESO · May 2016

LMar wrote: »

Heya. Have you read the patch notes for the upcoming dark brotherhood dlc? They are in the PTS section of the forum. There are changes coming to vampires with various different things happening at the 4 stages so that you have incentive tonbe at each one. Eg more fire damage at stage 4 and no fire damage at stage 1. But at stage 1 some of your passives do not activate

If we get all our passive abilities at stage 4, where the heck is the incentive to feed, when a vamp has to starve themselves to become more powerful? We have to feed to maintain our humanity, but be powerless at the same time. Sounds like being a vampire will be worthless, and a backwards nonsensical event.

Ethromelb14_ESO · May 2016

Necrelios wrote: »

The vampire passives seem to contradict the lore anyways. Lamae Bal says to "FEED and grow stronger." not "Starve and grow stronger." I would be happy if they flipped the stages so they actually make sense.

I made a thread addressing this exact issue, and even made some suggestions, but as usual the masses don't like change.

grumlins · May 2016

Well for one thing this isn't a survival game, you don't need to be like Kain in He Never Died and keep a fridge full of body parts. That's more like Ark Survival Evolved you're thinking of. And no that wouldn't fit into this title because it's not designed around having everyone feed and water themselves while playing. You don't carry around water containers or food while you're questing for the purpose of not dying from starvation without having the vamp/WW afflictions so it shouldn't be so if you do.

Ethromelb14_ESO · May 2016

dtm_samuraib16_ESO wrote: »

My vampire in the mean time has not fed in 5 levels, and I'm lvl 46.
Nothing, not the slightest drawback, save for some MINOR (yes, MINOR) annoyances.

I am requesting seizures.
The worst a feeding deprivation lasts, or the more hungry the Vampire becomes, the worst the seizures get, up to DEATH!
Which is a BLOODY logical situation, even for a Vampire.
He would simply drop dead, no matter where he is or what he's doing.

The Werewolf is sodding annoying to play, needing to eat more than he can actually do something, well, balance it out.
Add to the WW timer, like 1 to 2 minutes before end transmutation, and give us Vampires something to think about, before starving ourselves TO DEATH!
Vampire is just too simple to be.

Thoughts?
Keep it decent please.

I agree with your thoughts except the "drop dead" thing.

Shardaxx · May 2016

Need to feed would be stupid because most of the dungeons are full of undead/daedra and have nobody to feed on. What are you supposed to do, die of starvation halfway through a dungeon? But they are making some major changes to vamps in the next update.

Uriel_Nocturne · May 2016

dtm_samuraib16_ESO wrote: »

Uriel_Nocturne wrote: »

dtm_samuraib16_ESO wrote: »

@Uriel_Nocturne
No, I am actually very aware of the consequence.
This should be implemented with DB, hence DB is ideal for this.
And for crying out loud, if you're a Vampire, then do take care of him...
No need to keep him starved!

More, with this?
VERY BAD to starve him.
It will bring balance to an otherwise overpowered being.

No.

Reasons?

1) It absolutely shreds the Lore.
2) Vampires are much stronger at Stage 4 than at Stage 1. Some of us actually like being a force of unstoppable evil in the world.
3) Vampires are not overpowered in any way. I dare you to prove how they're overpowered.

Most importantly:
4) Feeding won't even kill an NPC. With Zenimax's abortion of a Justice System, you gain a bounty the second you start feeding. If your atrocious idea ever were implemented, you'd never be able to do anything due to a sky-high bounty nigh constantly.
5) I guess your idea just says "screw any other Elder Scrolls game. I think this is how vampires should work, and by the Gods, everyone else MUST BE wrong about how they want to play their Vampires".

Take your arrogance and just feed when you think you need to in your own game. Leave the rest of us out of it.

Just thinking about your terribad idea sorely pisses me off...

Someone surely never visited Cyrodiil...
Plenty of proof right there.

Question, and this is a serious one:
When I read the forums, I read:
BOOOOHOOOOOHOOOO, content too weak.
BOOOOHOOOOOHOOOO, no challenge.
So, i figured: this uber being could use some fun, in the end, a WW has to feed continuously, so why not the Vampire?
I dared suggesting this, and I get a "Nono, me Vampire. Me not want challenge. Me like uber."

The question: What is wrong with you humans?
You make no sense to me.
You cry for one, but want the opposite.

Please do make up your mind?

If this is how you think Vampires currently work in the game, then it's obvious that you don't actually play as a Vampire.

This wouldn't add "challenge", this would add pointless tedium to playing a Vampire.

Werewolves have to feed because their transformation is an Ultimate Ability. They must feed to lengthen it. Vampire characters have no transformation, they are Vampire all of the time.

The Lore states that Vampires don't have to feed to survive. They simply grow more monstrous and even stronger the longer they go without feeding.

In PvP, being a Vampire is a detriment, and Vampire players are typically the first to die.

You see this as crying on the Forums. I see it as the arrogance of an idle child who thinks that everyone should have to play Vampires to go along with his sad RP experience.

Your idea sucks ass. It won't get implemented.

This conversation is over.

dtm_samuraib16_ESO · May 2016

Ethromelb14_ESO wrote: »

I agree with your thoughts except the "drop dead" thing.

Well yes, we are already dead... we can't possibly become even deader.
However, with stage 4 becoming 2? 6? hours before "the end", it seems darned reasonable to me...

TX12001rwb17_ESO · May 2016

Abeille wrote: »

There are many strains of Vampirism.

Lamae's one is stupidly overpowered when you compare to the others, since the sun doesn't harm her scions. It couldn't be much different, her being the original vampire.

Necrelios wrote: »

The vampire passives seem to contradict the lore anyways. Lamae Bal says to "FEED and grow stronger." not "Starve and grow stronger." I would be happy if they flipped the stages so they actually make sense.

When you think about it in game, from a character's point of view you do grow "stronger" if you feed, in the sense that you are more resistant and you get to full health faster. When you are starving, you are quicker and can use your vampire skills more frequently, and for us the players, that is more useful, which from a player's perspective make them "stronger" (but not from a character's perspective, if you get what I mean). It is like a spectrum, and the more you feed the "healthier" you are and, therefore, the closer you are to being a mortal, while if you starve yourself you get more feral. So, from a lore point of view, the way this particular strain of vampirism works seems about right.

Her Bloodline is OP? more like the exact opposite, why they don't even have resistance to Poison or Disease, in all context her bloodline is primitive and inferior to the more evolved vampire bloodline that came after like the ones with fangs.

TX12001rwb17_ESO · May 2016

dtm_samuraib16_ESO wrote: »

Sorry, being a Vampire Lord, I fail to see the problem with my suggestion.
Instead of having an endless stage 4, a timed stage 4 seems extremely doable, especially when the timers become insanely long in the DB DLC.

Sorry to rain on your parade but your are not a vampire lord.

"Lord Harkon's definition of a vampire lord as mentioned in unused dialogue"
As what a king is to his subjects so are you to other vampires (And by you he means the Dragonborn)

Do you really think your a king to other vampires? I would like to hear another one, that joke was funny.

TX12001rwb17_ESO · May 2016

Necrelios wrote: »

The vampire passives seem to contradict the lore anyways. Lamae Bal says to "FEED and grow stronger." not "Starve and grow stronger." I would be happy if they flipped the stages so they actually make sense.

Your right about that, I can name another Instance like that which takes place in Dawnguard where Lord Harkon says something like "While on the ground you can fight with your claws and FEED TO REGAIN YOUR STRENGTH" not feed and regain your weakness, and that doesnt account for the fact it is not mentioned in lore anywhere that they starve to get stronger but much vampire lore would suggest the exact opposite, those who say feeding makes them stronger goes against the lore clearly haven't played Dawnguard where if you feed in VL form you get stronger, you can heal to full health and progress towards the next perk, they clearly haven't played Daggerfall either where if you don't feed/Kill everyday you grow weak and die.

Now as for ESO, it contradicts itself, now the vampires abilities on use will push you further to the next vampire stage which in itself would indicate your powered by blood...how can drinking that which powers your spells make you weaker?

dtm_samuraib16_ESO · May 2016

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Do you really think your a king to other vampires?

With Vampire Lord, my friend, I meant that my V-skills are maxed, as is my V-rank...
Nowhere did I imply I'd be "above" others.
If so, tell me where?

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Necrelios wrote: »

The vampire passives seem to contradict the lore anyways. Lamae Bal says to "FEED and grow stronger." not "Starve and grow stronger." I would be happy if they flipped the stages so they actually make sense.

Your right about that, I can name another Instance like that which takes place in Dawnguard where Lord Harkon says something like "While on the ground you can fight with your claws and FEED TO REGAIN YOUR STRENGTH" not feed and regain your weakness, and that doesnt account for the fact it is not mentioned in lore anywhere that they starve to get stronger but much vampire lore would suggest the exact opposite, those who say feeding makes them stronger goes against the lore clearly haven't played Dawnguard where if you feed in VL form you get stronger, you can heal to full health and progress towards the next perk, they clearly haven't played Daggerfall either where if you don't feed/Kill everyday you grow weak and die.

Now as for ESO, it contradicts itself, now the vampires abilities on use will push you further to the next vampire stage which in itself would indicate your powered by blood...how can drinking that which powers your spells make you weaker?

Bloody right, brother.
And thusfar: "it's against lore".

Vampies DO die if not fed in time.

TX12001rwb17_ESO · May 2016

dtm_samuraib16_ESO wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Do you really think your a king to other vampires?

With Vampire Lord, my friend, I meant that my V-skills are maxed, as is my V-rank...
Nowhere did I imply I'd be "above" others.
If so, tell me where?

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Necrelios wrote: »

The vampire passives seem to contradict the lore anyways. Lamae Bal says to "FEED and grow stronger." not "Starve and grow stronger." I would be happy if they flipped the stages so they actually make sense.

Your right about that, I can name another Instance like that which takes place in Dawnguard where Lord Harkon says something like "While on the ground you can fight with your claws and FEED TO REGAIN YOUR STRENGTH" not feed and regain your weakness, and that doesnt account for the fact it is not mentioned in lore anywhere that they starve to get stronger but much vampire lore would suggest the exact opposite, those who say feeding makes them stronger goes against the lore clearly haven't played Dawnguard where if you feed in VL form you get stronger, you can heal to full health and progress towards the next perk, they clearly haven't played Daggerfall either where if you don't feed/Kill everyday you grow weak and die.

Now as for ESO, it contradicts itself, now the vampires abilities on use will push you further to the next vampire stage which in itself would indicate your powered by blood...how can drinking that which powers your spells make you weaker?

Bloody right, brother.
And thusfar: "it's against lore".

Vampies DO die if not fed in time.

No they wouldn't die because blood is not what is animating them, daedric magic is animating them and how can something that is already dead, die?, Valerica was in the soul cairn for over 1000 years without blood.

The way I would fix it is do this, make it so vampires take damage in sunlight and it heavily effects their stats, do not have feeding tie to what powers u can and cannot use, have it so feeding simply makes the sun damage go away but it doesn't effect your powers or passives at all, maybe also have it so at stage 4 you cannot use "Blood" magic because u have no blood to draw power from, I actually like that idea that using abilities pushes you further to the next stage as it really distinguishes "Blood Magic" from normal magic.

Ethromelb14_ESO · May 2016

Vampire's Lore, and their skill-line, The ESO WAY:

1) Vampires are IMMUNE to the SUN, but BURN from FIRE ... of any type ... magic or non.

2) The vampire will be UNDEAD, but die by traditional everyday mortal means and causes. That's right! A properly placed arrow (with no special qualities, whatsoever) can kill a vampire, just like it would injure any humanoid. Yes, even in the knee. Pure genius!

3) The vampire that needs blood to survive, can now starve themselves without adverse effects to their existence. So much so, that the vampire that has truly perfected their fasting techniques can even gain more power as a result of abstaining from their curse. Our motto is, 'turn that curse in to your cures'.

4) Our vampires bare no resemblance or semblance to that of vampire-like traits or innate abilities, such as detecting in the dark. Our vampires are just like mortal humanoids, completely devoid of any magic base of reanimation and therefore incapable of doing any supernatural feats like run extremely fast, fight bare-handed, or my favorite - avoid falling to their "again" death. Woo! The perks are overwhelming.

5) Stealth ... Good ol' stealth. Did we mention that our vampires completely suck at it? That's right! A vampire is completely incapable of feeding on just any ol' body without an instant detection and bounty, by even the most Helen Keller like characters. Ain't it grand?

6) When feeding, our vampires will stay far away from their prey, so as to not contract germs of any sort, since we all know that dead creatures can still get horribly sick ... and die. Threats like walking dead pneumonia, and other diseases in the blood that can easily affect a blood drinking vampire.

7) Have you ever wondered how a vampire can be any deader? Well let us show you. Take away their ability to heal from damage. Yep, supernatural health recovery does not exist for our vampires - not only while they burn to death from the majority of overabundant fire dangers in our game, like fire traps, fire bugs, fire mages, fire titans, fire dragons, fire weapons, fire avatars, fire reptiles, fire environments, with red fire, blue fire and white fire! Did we mention how much we love fire? But then we got to thinking... We said, 'how can we be going so easy on vampires?' They have no helpful perks as it is, but we can do better ... let's decrease their ability to health recover by 75%. Why? Because we're cool like that. Are you excited? I'm excited.

8) Lastly, we thought, 'What vampire is complete without a conundrum?' So we decided the only way for a vampire's useless, and over-expensive active abilities to be of any use to them would be to insist they STARVE THEMSELVES, so they'll have to decide between one of two issues - constant threat of cremation at stage 4 or vampiric impotence at stage 1 from magicka being r*p*d by stiff costs.

We're on to something special ... ed here.