Xael wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

To be fair, overload is hitting me for much more than Soul Harvest/Incap - and the worst part is that the burst is not over after that Overload hits you once.

Now, this is usually no problem in 1v1, but when you're fighting other people and there are sorcs with 20k shield throwing overloads at you... well, I'd much rather take several incaps or soul harvests at that point.


I don't know why they made Incap to stun at any % range though, it seemed more balanced before.
Now it basicly rewards Xv1 gankers more, as they can always stun you with it.

Welcome back brother.

Like every PTS, people can't resist the chance to whine about Nightblades. The saddest thing is they always leave out history and or the other classes which do more or the same damage threshold. He is obviously crying from Stamplar standpoint which just got buffed to hell with Dawnbreaker. Not seeing anything about that, forgive me while I laugh at my 12k+14k+ tooltip of Dawnbreaker in Cyrodiil. Something I can weave and AC flawlessly (no pun) and melt ANYONE. But yes, lets focus on Nightblades. The only thing broken right now are Stam Sorcs which are absolute trash now.

Good to see you back on the forums, might want to bring a swimsuit, the tears are going to flood.

Flawless Dawnbreak has, and always will be nothing but a slotted ability to boost stats. Even with the changes my cresant sweep hits harder. Don't try and come at me with this crap about me just trying to nerf another class to hide my own. Up until last patch when stamplar got major mending and 8% damage mitigation with restoring focus, it wasn't even considered a "decent" stamina class for both PVE and PVP since 1.6 when they nerfed the hell out of jabs/CP. Nightblade has been notoriously overpowered since 1.5 and there is no hiding that. Stay on topic and stop being biased because you have a even easier time killing someone without having skill what so ever. The damage change to Incap strike does not solve anything regarding balance. It DOES way too much damage on PTS!

If you think about it, it really only costs 30 ultimate since you'll be getting 20 ult back on use

Lyar09 wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

To be fair, overload is hitting me for much more than Soul Harvest/Incap - and the worst part is that the burst is not over after that Overload hits you once.

Now, this is usually no problem in 1v1, but when you're fighting other people and there are sorcs with 20k shield throwing overloads at you... well, I'd much rather take several incaps or soul harvests at that point.


I don't know why they made Incap to stun at any % range though, it seemed more balanced before.
Now it basicly rewards Xv1 gankers more, as they can always stun you with it.

Welcome back brother.

Like every PTS, people can't resist the chance to whine about Nightblades. The saddest thing is they always leave out history and or the other classes which do more or the same damage threshold. He is obviously crying from Stamplar standpoint which just got buffed to hell with Dawnbreaker. Not seeing anything about that, forgive me while I laugh at my 12k+14k+ tooltip of Dawnbreaker in Cyrodiil. Something I can weave and AC flawlessly (no pun) and melt ANYONE. But yes, lets focus on Nightblades. The only thing broken right now are Stam Sorcs which are absolute trash now.

Good to see you back on the forums, might want to bring a swimsuit, the tears are going to flood.

Flawless Dawnbreak has, and always will be nothing but a slotted ability to boost stats. Even with the changes my cresant sweep hits harder. Don't try and come at me with this crap about me just trying to nerf another class to hide my own. Up until last patch when stamplar got major mending and 8% damage mitigation with restoring focus, it wasn't even considered a "decent" stamina class for both PVE and PVP since 1.6 when they nerfed the hell out of jabs/CP. Nightblade has been notoriously overpowered since 1.5 and there is no hiding that. Stay on topic and stop being biased because you have a even easier time killing someone without having skill what so ever. The damage change to Incap strike does not solve anything regarding balance. It DOES way too much damage on PTS!

FDB hits hard as hell now and its cheap. DBoS (the other morph) hits even harder and applies a knockdown to anyone not immune with the same cost.
Templars have been an excellent 1vX class since 2.1. There are plenty of good pvpers who have showcased this with videos myself included. Just because you are measuring the class by your obvious shortcomings does not make it canon.

Nightblades have not been notoriously OP since 1.5. In fact throughout the entirety of 1.6 I absolutely butchered NBs on my Stam Sorc due to my build and understanding of the NB class. Meanwhile the DK sat as the kingpin of Stam and everyone ignored it to focus on NBs despite my DK doing 20k heavy attacks 1 shotting just about everyone without a shield up. I suppose though I can make up whatever statistic I want based on the amount of forum whines by uninformed players. Posts like these have been commonplace since March 2015.

You complain about Incap yet I suppose other classes being able to perma dodge or do 18-20k heavy attacks is ok?I mean for crying out loud I was doing 20k+ heavy attacks on a Stam DK last night on PTS. People didn't even survive my openers let alone any type of followup I could potentionally do (if they were still alive) with any instant skill.
Mind you there are other abilities out there that do DD/CC more often (think frags) that are in the same ballpark. My magicka Sorc can put out frags on the regular that out damage your notorious pts Incap Strike. With all the ways to counter Nightblades I find it ridiculous people still have the nerve to whine about them. I guess when you are amongst your own kind (the forums) you find strength in numbers. You get one death recap and do not dissect the actual event and all of sudden the sky is falling and it's nerfin' time.

Xael wrote: »

Lyar09 wrote: »

Xael wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

To be fair, overload is hitting me for much more than Soul Harvest/Incap - and the worst part is that the burst is not over after that Overload hits you once.

Now, this is usually no problem in 1v1, but when you're fighting other people and there are sorcs with 20k shield throwing overloads at you... well, I'd much rather take several incaps or soul harvests at that point.


I don't know why they made Incap to stun at any % range though, it seemed more balanced before.
Now it basicly rewards Xv1 gankers more, as they can always stun you with it.

Welcome back brother.

Like every PTS, people can't resist the chance to whine about Nightblades. The saddest thing is they always leave out history and or the other classes which do more or the same damage threshold. He is obviously crying from Stamplar standpoint which just got buffed to hell with Dawnbreaker. Not seeing anything about that, forgive me while I laugh at my 12k+14k+ tooltip of Dawnbreaker in Cyrodiil. Something I can weave and AC flawlessly (no pun) and melt ANYONE. But yes, lets focus on Nightblades. The only thing broken right now are Stam Sorcs which are absolute trash now.

Good to see you back on the forums, might want to bring a swimsuit, the tears are going to flood.

Flawless Dawnbreak has, and always will be nothing but a slotted ability to boost stats. Even with the changes my cresant sweep hits harder. Don't try and come at me with this crap about me just trying to nerf another class to hide my own. Up until last patch when stamplar got major mending and 8% damage mitigation with restoring focus, it wasn't even considered a "decent" stamina class for both PVE and PVP since 1.6 when they nerfed the hell out of jabs/CP. Nightblade has been notoriously overpowered since 1.5 and there is no hiding that. Stay on topic and stop being biased because you have a even easier time killing someone without having skill what so ever. The damage change to Incap strike does not solve anything regarding balance. It DOES way too much damage on PTS!

FDB hits hard as hell now and its cheap. DBoS (the other morph) hits even harder and applies a knockdown to anyone not immune with the same cost.
Templars have been an excellent 1vX class since 2.1. There are plenty of good pvpers who have showcased this with videos myself included. Just because you are measuring the class by your obvious shortcomings does not make it canon.

Nightblades have not been notoriously OP since 1.5. In fact throughout the entirety of 1.6 I absolutely butchered NBs on my Stam Sorc due to my build and understanding of the NB class. Meanwhile the DK sat as the kingpin of Stam and everyone ignored it to focus on NBs despite my DK doing 20k heavy attacks 1 shotting just about everyone without a shield up. I suppose though I can make up whatever statistic I want based on the amount of forum whines by uninformed players. Posts like these have been commonplace since March 2015.

You complain about Incap yet I suppose other classes being able to perma dodge or do 18-20k heavy attacks is ok?I mean for crying out loud I was doing 20k+ heavy attacks on a Stam DK last night on PTS. People didn't even survive my openers let alone any type of followup I could potentionally do (if they were still alive) with any instant skill.
Mind you there are other abilities out there that do DD/CC more often (think frags) that are in the same ballpark. My magicka Sorc can put out frags on the regular that out damage your notorious pts Incap Strike. With all the ways to counter Nightblades I find it ridiculous people still have the nerve to whine about them. I guess when you are amongst your own kind (the forums) you find strength in numbers. You get one death recap and do not dissect the actual event and all of sudden the sky is falling and it's nerfin' time.

If the new dawnbreaker is that good then lets just make incapaciting strike deal magic damage again, stamina nb would rather use dawnbreaker instead anyway right?

Y'all have fun with this argument. Instead of it being about a single ability it has turned into a class balance war. I'm sure nothing will get changed and people will complain about it (to include those defending it). Enjoy your arguing folks I appreciate some of the feedback.

This is the solution you guys actually need.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2921780/#Comment_2921780

contact.opiumb16_ESO wrote: »

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

contact.opiumb16_ESO wrote: »

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

So magicka builds can proxy det whole raids for 15k+ with a standard skill and now are crying 'cos a stamina build might be able to hit one person with an ultimate for similar damage?? And you want to be taken seriously while saying it?

Seriously needing the LOL button back.

NB is general are way too OP than the other classes ! Proofs ? i counted on top20 players EU servers, 16 are right now NBs ? Balanced isn't it ? Considering that we have 4 classes, a balanced game shall be about 25% toon of each class in the top20. We have something like 75% NB now....

And if we were talking about class balance rather than magicka vs stamina balance that would have been relevant to this - but unless you can tell me how many of those are magicka NBs then it really isn't.

BTW what top 20 players do you mean exactly?

On my home campaign 3 of top 20 are NBs...
About 1/4 of those completing Maw Vet are NBs...
Sorcs seem to be holding the top 4 or 5 MA places and NBs are certainly not holding 75% of the top scores

So perhaps you can point me at the particular charts you are using for this because from what's actually on the servers it looks like NBs are in contention but not noticeably better... and even then most, I think, would admit that magicka NBs are currently significantly more powerful and versatile than stamina NBs.

This patch was always supposed to be about bringing balance back between magicka and stamina and part of that means that some ultimates will scale off stamina instead of nearly all off magicka - that means on a streamlined build with all buffs up they will hit like a truck because they are supposed to because they are ultimates. Per cast they will still deal a fraction of what something like meteor or dragon leap or banner does because it doesn't just hit hard but also hits multiple targets.

Yeah, the problem is : stam NB or getting buffs to be on par with magicka NB when the problem is how OP are magicka NB now.... so yeah, ppl go into a class balance discussion.

@SuraklinPrime my numbers comes from the only CP campain actually full in EU PC server. Need screen caps to believe me or WHAT ?

TF? I don't disbelieve just wasn't matching what I have access to but I don't play on TF much 'cos it is too laggy. I'd also be willing to bet many of them are proxy det vicious death bombing magicka NBs leeching AP by blowing up the zergs... which while OP is not really relevant to stamina NBs.

I honestly don't think stamina NBs will be OP after these changes but with all the trait and poison changes to consider it is hard to be sure - certainly it would be nice to be pulling the sort of DPS magicka builds get without thinking hard in PvE.. in PvP it's hard to be sure but I doubt one ability will be a game changer even for gankers, especially when you consider they lose camo hunter in this patch and WB spammers take a hit too..

Lyar09 wrote: »

Y'all have fun with this argument. Instead of it being about a single ability it has turned into a class balance war. I'm sure nothing will get changed and people will complain about it (to include those defending it). Enjoy your arguing folks I appreciate some of the feedback.

Yep sadly thats how it is.
Ppl are arguing over simple numbers i provided from tooltip values ive seen on potato builds talking about crits, empowers and what not.

*** it, just let it go live. Since stam sorcs didnt get crap again, might as well shut these fools up with 20k incap strike once it comes live. Ill bookmark this thread for when the QQ threads come out.

OMFG quit whining about nightblades!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Swapping Soul Harvest with Incapacting Strike will be a better choice IMO

And Yeah, people dont play as NBs dont generally realize that it takes a lot of skill for the player as well to be good.

Suru wrote: »

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Lyar09 wrote: »

Okay explain this then. I have 15% mitigation from cp...8% damage mitigation with restoring focus...18k physical resist....and 2.3k crit resist and I get hit for 10k plus incap strikes. Most people dont mitigate damage anywhere near what I do and I still get ridiculously hard. This is not balance. The ability is fine as is with damage on live. I like the knock down mechanic now

Can hit 10k soul harvests on live right now in a full gank build. I think the highest @Suru hit was 17k on live after CP cap. Could be wrong though, I think he has a screenshot.

rip this guy

Ishammael wrote: »

Why do people defend one-shot-one-kill gameplay?

What people don't know about this skill is, or don't consider is that since 1.2, ZoS has had this skill nerfed in the sense that it does not receive crit hit amp from stealth, say like you would with a surprise attack. They've taken away that skills ability to do that from stealth from and a NB's toolkit. So this skill won't do an ungodly amount of damage from stealth.


Quick testing on some mobs, SA will crit for 30k, while Soul Harvest will only do 15k from stealth. I'll do more testing on how it works on players on pts and live today.

Ahh there it is. This is AFTER CP cap, by the way. People are ignoring it though ;o

I think the damage is fine, the CC always happening with it is unnecessary though.

For the sake of balance the skill either needs to dramatically increase in cost
OR decrease in base damage.


Only way to slice it.



Also: GIVE TEMPLARS PHYSICAL DMG CRESCENT!!!