bowmanz607 wrote: »You know I don't fully understand people's problem with using v14 gear in pvp. Yes, they should update them. But there 8s no need to min/max in pvp. Gold v14 gear is perfectly viable in pvp. You don't lose a ton of stats or anything. It's not game changing to not min/max. Hell I still run around with v14 gold gear on some builds. Works fine. Some my gear is v15. Some is v16. How often do you die and say "o man I wish I had 500 more stamina or 200 more weapon damage. It is not a significant difference unless you min/max, which is not necessary for pvp to be viable. You just outplay and outsmart your opponent.
Imo.
This would be true if the meta wasn't burst and disappear.
@bowmanz607 i wonder if you will say the same when cp 180 and cp 200 gear comes out and you still can just buy cp 140 gear in vendors?
@Docmandu of course they are vr 14 it has been stated many times that for this dlc no vendor upgrade. Furthermore it doesnt sound like it will come with the next one either. Its one of those "no eta" things, you know.
bowmanz607 wrote: »You know I don't fully understand people's problem with using v14 gear in pvp. Yes, they should update them. But there 8s no need to min/max in pvp. Gold v14 gear is perfectly viable in pvp. You don't lose a ton of stats or anything. It's not game changing to not min/max. Hell I still run around with v14 gold gear on some builds. Works fine. Some my gear is v15. Some is v16. How often do you die and say "o man I wish I had 500 more stamina or 200 more weapon damage. It is not a significant difference unless you min/max, which is not necessary for pvp to be viable. You just outplay and outsmart your opponent.
Imo.
This would be true if the meta wasn't burst and disappear.
bowmanz607 wrote: »bowmanz607 wrote: »You know I don't fully understand people's problem with using v14 gear in pvp. Yes, they should update them. But there 8s no need to min/max in pvp. Gold v14 gear is perfectly viable in pvp. You don't lose a ton of stats or anything. It's not game changing to not min/max. Hell I still run around with v14 gold gear on some builds. Works fine. Some my gear is v15. Some is v16. How often do you die and say "o man I wish I had 500 more stamina or 200 more weapon damage. It is not a significant difference unless you min/max, which is not necessary for pvp to be viable. You just outplay and outsmart your opponent.
Imo.
This would be true if the meta wasn't burst and disappear.
ya but lets take hundings for instance. I have a 3pc hundings gold and a 2pc purple to get the 5pc. it is a v14 set. I get 293 damage from the 5pc. A gold 5 pc v16 gives 300 damage. Im sorry but a 7 weapon damage difference is not enough burst to kill squat. Again, min/max is not going to give you enough of an extra burst to really make a difference. It is about timing your burst properly, not making sure that you min/max that burst. ofcourse i am not saying that everyone should run around with v1 gear b/c it doesnt matter. I am simply saying that the minimal difference between v14 gear and v16 gear is not ehough, imo, to put you over the top in beating another player. For instance, with this next patch, i will run morug for the extra poison damage. combined with champ tree i would get about@bowmanz607 i wonder if you will say the same when cp 180 and cp 200 gear comes out and you still can just buy cp 140 gear in vendors?
yes i will. The new setup merely allows access to sets you didnt have access to before you reached those points. It has nothing to do with the power of the gear.
bowmanz607 wrote: »You know I don't fully understand people's problem with using v14 gear in pvp. Yes, they should update them. But there 8s no need to min/max in pvp. Gold v14 gear is perfectly viable in pvp. You don't lose a ton of stats or anything. It's not game changing to not min/max. Hell I still run around with v14 gold gear on some builds. Works fine. Some my gear is v15. Some is v16. How often do you die and say "o man I wish I had 500 more stamina or 200 more weapon damage. It is not a significant difference unless you min/max, which is not necessary for pvp to be viable. You just outplay and outsmart your opponent.
Imo.
bowmanz607 wrote: »bowmanz607 wrote: »You know I don't fully understand people's problem with using v14 gear in pvp. Yes, they should update them. But there 8s no need to min/max in pvp. Gold v14 gear is perfectly viable in pvp. You don't lose a ton of stats or anything. It's not game changing to not min/max. Hell I still run around with v14 gold gear on some builds. Works fine. Some my gear is v15. Some is v16. How often do you die and say "o man I wish I had 500 more stamina or 200 more weapon damage. It is not a significant difference unless you min/max, which is not necessary for pvp to be viable. You just outplay and outsmart your opponent.
Imo.
This would be true if the meta wasn't burst and disappear.
ya but lets take hundings for instance. I have a 3pc hundings gold and a 2pc purple to get the 5pc. it is a v14 set. I get 293 damage from the 5pc. A gold 5 pc v16 gives 300 damage. Im sorry but a 7 weapon damage difference is not enough burst to kill squat. Again, min/max is not going to give you enough of an extra burst to really make a difference. It is about timing your burst properly, not making sure that you min/max that burst. ofcourse i am not saying that everyone should run around with v1 gear b/c it doesnt matter. I am simply saying that the minimal difference between v14 gear and v16 gear is not ehough, imo, to put you over the top in beating another player. For instance, with this next patch, i will run morug for the extra poison damage. combined with champ tree i would get about@bowmanz607 i wonder if you will say the same when cp 180 and cp 200 gear comes out and you still can just buy cp 140 gear in vendors?
yes i will. The new setup merely allows access to sets you didnt have access to before you reached those points. It has nothing to do with the power of the gear.
The set bonuses aren't much different, its true. However, the stat glyphs are >25% higher for v16 gear (~650 vs ~850). Across 5 pieces of gear that ends up being quite a bit.
.bowmanz607 wrote: »You know I don't fully understand people's problem with using v14 gear in pvp. Yes, they should update them. But there 8s no need to min/max in pvp. Gold v14 gear is perfectly viable in pvp. You don't lose a ton of stats or anything. It's not game changing to not min/max. Hell I still run around with v14 gold gear on some builds. Works fine. Some my gear is v15. Some is v16. How often do you die and say "o man I wish I had 500 more stamina or 200 more weapon damage. It is not a significant difference unless you min/max, which is not necessary for pvp to be viable. You just outplay and outsmart your opponent.
Imo.
The gap between v14 and v16, especially in gold quality, is larger than that between for example v12 and v14. It is more than enough to choose the limited v16 set options over v14 ones, wich is exactly what was being criticized.
ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Just to confirm, below are the only sets that will be available from Rewards for the Worthy when the Thieves Guild update goes live:For the item sets listed above, we will be increasing the drop rate so you are guaranteed to receive a piece from one of these item sets each time, rather than only having a small chance to receive a piece from a large pool of possibilities. You will still be able to obtain the previously-available item sets from the Alliance vendors, and we are currently evaluating plans to alter their wares in the future (both to change the exact sets they offer, and to bring their wares up to VR16).
- Vicious Death
- Transmutation
- Marksman’s Crest
- Leki’s Focus
- Fasalla’s Guile
- Warrior’s Fury
Moving forward, we will regularly cycle out older item sets from Rewards of the Worthy so you are given a greater opportunity to acquire the newest item sets, and older item sets will be purchasable from the Alliance vendors.
NerfPlease wrote: »
lol this game has been going down a slippery slope for quite a while.Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »There are two issues that keep me from playing this game regularly. Above all other things.
- The first is the unpurgable snare on every gap closer. Even with the PTS changes its still terrible.
- The second is the sheer amount of UNNECESSARY CONTROL ZOS exerts over PvP gear choices. What gear we can have. Where we can get it from. What level we can get it in.
This behavior from ZOS KILLS build diversity and fun and makes everyone run the same FOTM builds. Anyone who thinks they do this because some gear combos would be OP, needs to revisit when ZOS released the champion system with a total of 3600 champion points. CP has a far greater impact on character strength then gear ever had.
I am sick to death of Eric Wrobels insistence on a "stack mitigation and burst" meta for PvP where everyone wears some combination of DPS sets with willpower/agility jewelry while spamming the hardest hitting skill. All the fun sets like vengeance leach, potentates, and other sustain or ultimate sets are out of the game. This game was so much more fun when the meta was resource management instead of burst.
I am sad to hear that even more of my favorite sets will be taken out of the rotation to promote "new sets and gear" I hope everyone loves prox det and vicious death. Everyone will be running it.
ZOS STOP RESTRICTING PVP GEAR.
ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Just to confirm, below are the only sets that will be available from Rewards for the Worthy when the Thieves Guild update goes live:For the item sets listed above, we will be increasing the drop rate so you are guaranteed to receive a piece from one of these item sets each time, rather than only having a small chance to receive a piece from a large pool of possibilities. You will still be able to obtain the previously-available item sets from the Alliance vendors, and we are currently evaluating plans to alter their wares in the future (both to change the exact sets they offer, and to bring their wares up to VR16).
- Vicious Death
- Transmutation
- Marksman’s Crest
- Leki’s Focus
- Fasalla’s Guile
- Warrior’s Fury
Moving forward, we will regularly cycle out older item sets from Rewards of the Worthy so you are given a greater opportunity to acquire the newest item sets, and older item sets will be purchasable from the Alliance vendors.
NerfPlease wrote: »
NerfPlease wrote: »
NerfPlease wrote: »
Let's see, sets that will increase the number of bowtards in cyrodiil, sets that will make healing obsolete, sets that will allow players to grief allies, force the game to take a hard shift to a magicka meta and further force players into universal cookie cutter builds - being made frequent and easily available rather than taking weeks to farm? Yeah, I see that as problematic.
I had thought we'd be spared at least a few weeks from Wrobel's itemization incompetence, but I guess not.
bowmanz607 wrote: »
i suggest you take a look at the posts that give the chances of actually getting set pieces on the pts forums.
additionally, i dont think it will take a hard magic turn. in fact this is the most balanced patch we have seen since 1.5 and even better than 1.5 for balance imo. What gives mag the edge is damage types. for instance ults and stam skills based off magic damage.
last, healing took a hit, but healing was too much. between smart heals, caps, etc. healing still outpaces dps. why? cause smart heals.
bowmanz607 wrote: »
i suggest you take a look at the posts that give the chances of actually getting set pieces on the pts forums.
additionally, i dont think it will take a hard magic turn. in fact this is the most balanced patch we have seen since 1.5 and even better than 1.5 for balance imo. What gives mag the edge is damage types. for instance ults and stam skills based off magic damage.
last, healing took a hit, but healing was too much. between smart heals, caps, etc. healing still outpaces dps. why? cause smart heals.
From Gina: "we will be increasing the drop rate so you are guaranteed to receive a piece from one of these item sets each time"
I interpret that to mean that they will be dropping every single RotW mail on Live. The numbers you mention were done WITHOUT this change, and were done without consideration of the fact that the vendor will be selling random jewelry pieces for these sets as well. Just the vendor alone made those time estimations wholly inaccurate, but the mail change means people could be outfitted in a week tops.
As for the magicka meta comment, with Wrobel in his infinite wisdom of making prox det as strong as he did, stam builds are going to blow up. Most of the pvp guilds are going heavy into magicka, that is usually an indication even if you can't read the tea leaves from the patch notes.
bowmanz607 wrote: »bowmanz607 wrote: »
i suggest you take a look at the posts that give the chances of actually getting set pieces on the pts forums.
additionally, i dont think it will take a hard magic turn. in fact this is the most balanced patch we have seen since 1.5 and even better than 1.5 for balance imo. What gives mag the edge is damage types. for instance ults and stam skills based off magic damage.
last, healing took a hit, but healing was too much. between smart heals, caps, etc. healing still outpaces dps. why? cause smart heals.
From Gina: "we will be increasing the drop rate so you are guaranteed to receive a piece from one of these item sets each time"
I interpret that to mean that they will be dropping every single RotW mail on Live. The numbers you mention were done WITHOUT this change, and were done without consideration of the fact that the vendor will be selling random jewelry pieces for these sets as well. Just the vendor alone made those time estimations wholly inaccurate, but the mail change means people could be outfitted in a week tops.
As for the magicka meta comment, with Wrobel in his infinite wisdom of making prox det as strong as he did, stam builds are going to blow up. Most of the pvp guilds are going heavy into magicka, that is usually an indication even if you can't read the tea leaves from the patch notes.
pts rotw only gave these items and that is what the numbers are based off. the vendor is also limited and carries random pcs.In fact, your claim is purley speculation.
also, you are speaking in terms of mag ruling in terms of killing zergs. ok. and people will start to spread out more with all the changes. This means that your precious bombs and vicious sets wont be as effective as you think. Also, steel tornado is still extremely useful for these groups. bombard is still going to be very usefull. perhaps more so in next patch. lets also not forget that not everyone is running around in ball groups and not wanting to fight that way and therefore there is no need to rely on those skills/sets.
last, no one really knows how these new sets are going to work in the game. if people start spreading out more, these sets wont mean that much. yes mag will be better, but not vastly better. This is all merely speculation at this point. it is impossible to test this effectively and we wont know how these changes will effect pvp until almost a month into release.
silky_soft wrote: »bowmanz607 wrote: »bowmanz607 wrote: »
i suggest you take a look at the posts that give the chances of actually getting set pieces on the pts forums.
additionally, i dont think it will take a hard magic turn. in fact this is the most balanced patch we have seen since 1.5 and even better than 1.5 for balance imo. What gives mag the edge is damage types. for instance ults and stam skills based off magic damage.
last, healing took a hit, but healing was too much. between smart heals, caps, etc. healing still outpaces dps. why? cause smart heals.
From Gina: "we will be increasing the drop rate so you are guaranteed to receive a piece from one of these item sets each time"
I interpret that to mean that they will be dropping every single RotW mail on Live. The numbers you mention were done WITHOUT this change, and were done without consideration of the fact that the vendor will be selling random jewelry pieces for these sets as well. Just the vendor alone made those time estimations wholly inaccurate, but the mail change means people could be outfitted in a week tops.
As for the magicka meta comment, with Wrobel in his infinite wisdom of making prox det as strong as he did, stam builds are going to blow up. Most of the pvp guilds are going heavy into magicka, that is usually an indication even if you can't read the tea leaves from the patch notes.
pts rotw only gave these items and that is what the numbers are based off. the vendor is also limited and carries random pcs.In fact, your claim is purley speculation.
also, you are speaking in terms of mag ruling in terms of killing zergs. ok. and people will start to spread out more with all the changes. This means that your precious bombs and vicious sets wont be as effective as you think. Also, steel tornado is still extremely useful for these groups. bombard is still going to be very usefull. perhaps more so in next patch. lets also not forget that not everyone is running around in ball groups and not wanting to fight that way and therefore there is no need to rely on those skills/sets.
last, no one really knows how these new sets are going to work in the game. if people start spreading out more, these sets wont mean that much. yes mag will be better, but not vastly better. This is all merely speculation at this point. it is impossible to test this effectively and we wont know how these changes will effect pvp until almost a month into release.
Zos already states this is a magika patch and next dlc will be stam. They have stealth nerfed penetration and everyone seems to be overlooking it. They also said heavy armor will buff next update. So that kinda rolls in why they have nerfed pen.
Pvp will now be magelight, bats, proxy and null. Then everyone waiting for the vd implosion.
bowmanz607 wrote: »NerfPlease wrote: »
this. not to mention there are many posts out there that show how hard it is to get pieces. plus, think about having to find the exact pieces you need etc.