Vet Levels Going Away?

Gidorick · January 2016

Spottswoode wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

RizaHawkeye wrote: »

So what? The Vet Ranks are removed but the champion points remain? So just points without a rank?

How does that change anything?

Now you have to have X number of champion points instead of X Veteran level for gear and such. So instead of 16 vet ranks we get HUNDREDS of Champion Point "levels"!!!! yay!

But seriously... what it does is it makes end game progression account wide. Just get another character to level 50 and BOOM... they now have as much capability as your most played, highest level character.

You realize, of course, that means that you can level all of your characters to top level once you get to 50? Meaning that levelling a new alt only takes about two weeks (6 hours a day) instead of two months? Frankly, I welcome it.

I totally get that. I think there is something to say about the fact that players are so eager to NOT play the game?

In the end the system we will get IS better than Veteran Ranks. I would rather have NO vet ranks than keeping Vet Ranks... but even more than that I was hoping we would see Vet Ranks converted to regular levels.... I think that would sustain the game better in the long term.

But yea...I agree removal of vet ranks is better than keeping it the way it is now.

JD2013 · January 2016

What's wrong with veteran levels is most people don't want to take time to level other characters and want everything instantly as opposed to having to work for it.

xAPxZeez · January 2016

I would like to see 10cp per vet level on 1 character per account and 1-2cp for all vet levels on ALL other characters on that account. Just to encourage people to level other characters to v16 before this release instead of just getting them to 50 and parking them. Those 1 character players would be encouraged to step outside their comfort zone and learn about other classes as they leveled them and the cross class knowledge would benefit them in the long run.

TalonShina · January 2016

JD2013 wrote: »

What's wrong with veteran levels is most people don't want to take time to level other characters and want everything instantly as opposed to having to work for it.

You sir are correct. My husband has two VR16 and another in the middle somewhere he is just now finishing Gold on his templar and I haven't really heard him complain about them and he hit VR16 on both characters before finishing Cadwell's

I am not opposed to the removal of Vet Ranks if they are set on it however, I want them to take their time a rush job breaks the game entirely and those that want the removal should encourage them to take their time with it instead of constantly saying TELL ME WHEN????

TheShadowScout · January 2016

All the important things have been posted...

Gidorick wrote: »

Yep... The champion points are going to function EXACTLY as they do now... We still don't know how they're going to give us the skill points of the 16 vet levels. Money is on some design where players will get an extra skill point every 5 levels of 1-50 or something.

BtW... its 15 extra attribute/skill points, not 16. Since level 50=V1, so that one doesn't count... could simply be done with a double helping of skill and atrribute points at every "X5" level, and a triple at every "X0" or more likely with an c-point driven mechanic, which would have the advantage that they could easily expand it later on if they decided to give us more attribute and skill points to play with someday...

RizaHawkeye wrote: »

I just hope they have a plan to extend the number of character slots beyond eight ...

I keep hearing rumours they are looking into it.
It would make sense... if people would pay for extra character slots (and I know I would) then why would they not want to take peoples money?

RizaHawkeye wrote: »

Wow, I must be tired because it just hit me:

All I really need to do is to get one character on my account to V16 ASAP, by any means possible, before they implement the change.

After that it's all magic bingo.

Edit: I think I'll start tonight.

Getting one to V16 might be a good idea. Just in case the champions come faster then expected (insert inappropiate mel brooks joke here

)
But yeah, that will be the main point. One V16, or 160 c-points shared among all - same effect, means all characters will be V16-equivalent in effect once they get to 50. And able to wear that rank of gear (might wanna save up, I expect many a guild store shopping spree to happen as soon as we get there...)

purple-magicb16_ESO wrote: »

See this is what I don't understand. They're killing their own game. Why credit for only 1 character? That discourages multiple (aka alt) char play. I would think if anything they would encourage players to fill all 8 of their char slots to maximize their play time potential. All the time I put into my other 3 chars to get them above V10 means nothing now and they start 6 steps back from my main (as a V16 they were behind him anyway but now more so) or else I can level them up further at my main's expense./shrug

Personally I don't expect the game to change much for me come the final phase of the champion system and veteran rank removals - I'll still do all of cadwells wth every alt, if only for all the other goodies - skill points, skyshards, mage guild books, wayshrine unlocks, etc.

The fun will be that ALL advancement on ANY character gets into the big account c-point pool.

In many games I find is hard to "waste time on an alt that could be spent on my main catching up to the fanatics...", the full champion system would mean, all play will be equally rewarding for all characters, no matter which character earns the c-point...

...so it can actually make sense to do cadwells on many alts, for all the newt things one can earn, of which the champion points benefitting every character on the account. (Yeah, grinding them out would work as well. For people who have the mental structure of a worker ant I guess... I couldn't do it, I couldn't bear the feel of my brain cells comitting suicide at such mindlessly repetetive gameplay...)

Enodoc · January 2016

It won't happen this month. Will it happen with Thieves Guild? Unknown, but unlikely (there's still a lot of unknowns for that to be a good idea). Will it happen with Dark Brotherhood? Unknown, but that's what my money's on.

What we know:

VRs are going away
Gear will somehow be based on CPs
CPs will remain account wide, so Veteran progression will become account wide
Cadwell's Silver and Gold will remain

What has been suggested by ZOS:

Gear requirements will take a direct switch from "VR14" to "140 CPs" (although many would like to see gear have no CP requirements at all, or use CPs in other ways that are less restrictive)
The 15 attribute/skill points from VRs 2-16 will be moved either into CPs up to 160, or into the 5s and 10s of the 1-50 levelling (my preference for the second)

What we don't know:

How content will depend on CPs (my preference - balanced in such a way so that Cadwell's is not seen as a forced requirement to get to later content like Craglorn)
Whether the Cadwell's Silver/Gold access restrictions will be lifted (this has been rumoured)
Whether a character's CPs will be displayed like their VR is now (my preference - absolutely not, show everything as Level 50)

Hope499 · January 2016

Paulington wrote: »

Definitely happening. ZOS said they'd let us know more info in the New Year (So, hopefully soon!).

We will all be dropped to level 50 and gear will have CP requirements instead of VR requirements.

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

A little context here before this gets too out of hand…
We’re still working on the system – nothing is finalized. (which is why we’re not really talking much about it yet)

The intention is that once you hit 50, champion points take over. Veteran Ranks are completely removed.

When Veteran Ranks are removed, we will convert any Veteran Ranks on your highest character into CP.

To get a rough idea of balance - think of 10CP = 1 VR. (so 160 CP will roughly = VR16)

Additional Details:
We’re planning on giving 2.5 CP for every VR level you’ve earned on your highest level character. (40 for a VR16 character)

When the conversion happens, any player with CP less than their old veteran rank * 10 will instead be given enough CP such that their total is VR * 10. For example: A player is VR14 with 75 CP, they will be given 65 CP (140-75) instead of 40, so that they can still equip any gear they may have.

We will make sure the 16 attribute picks you got from VR1 to VR16 will carry over. (current plan is an achievement that goes up in 10 CP increments until 160)

Keep in mind that none of the stuff above is 100% locked in. We're still implementing the feature - things are subject to change. It's important that everyone understands they are not suddenly going to have to have 501 CP in order to equip the top level gear. We will introduce new gear, with higher CP requirements sometime in the future, but we won't be making huge jumps. (i.e. - we won't go from 160 to 400 suddenly)

Once we finalize the system and lock in more of the details, we will discuss things in more detail and answer questions.

That sounds terrible....

This is a major change late in the game to the one of the games core mechanics....really bad idea imo. I have ZERO interest in playing another character.....I loved that it took a long time to work and finalize one....you had to actually put a bit of time into it...

Now? Pshhhhh, who cares. This change will probably be the day i stop playing....

Magdalina · January 2016

Hope499 wrote: »

Paulington wrote: »

Definitely happening. ZOS said they'd let us know more info in the New Year (So, hopefully soon!).

We will all be dropped to level 50 and gear will have CP requirements instead of VR requirements.

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

A little context here before this gets too out of hand…
We’re still working on the system – nothing is finalized. (which is why we’re not really talking much about it yet)

The intention is that once you hit 50, champion points take over. Veteran Ranks are completely removed.

When Veteran Ranks are removed, we will convert any Veteran Ranks on your highest character into CP.

To get a rough idea of balance - think of 10CP = 1 VR. (so 160 CP will roughly = VR16)

Additional Details:
We’re planning on giving 2.5 CP for every VR level you’ve earned on your highest level character. (40 for a VR16 character)

When the conversion happens, any player with CP less than their old veteran rank * 10 will instead be given enough CP such that their total is VR * 10. For example: A player is VR14 with 75 CP, they will be given 65 CP (140-75) instead of 40, so that they can still equip any gear they may have.

We will make sure the 16 attribute picks you got from VR1 to VR16 will carry over. (current plan is an achievement that goes up in 10 CP increments until 160)

Keep in mind that none of the stuff above is 100% locked in. We're still implementing the feature - things are subject to change. It's important that everyone understands they are not suddenly going to have to have 501 CP in order to equip the top level gear. We will introduce new gear, with higher CP requirements sometime in the future, but we won't be making huge jumps. (i.e. - we won't go from 160 to 400 suddenly)

Once we finalize the system and lock in more of the details, we will discuss things in more detail and answer questions.

That sounds terrible....

This is a major change late in the game to the one of the games core mechanics....really bad idea imo. I have ZERO interest in playing another character.....I loved that it took a long time to work and finalize one....you had to actually put a bit of time into it...

Now? Pshhhhh, who cares. This change will probably be the day i stop playing....

Well if you don't want to play another character, then don't play another character? This change won't affect you then pretty much at all. Your experience won't be lost since it'll be converted into champion points. There'll be no advantage in rolling an alt other than experiencing a different class/role, just like in the current system. The gear will be CP-gated so your progression will still matter(I do think it's a good idea as opposed to just having everything be lvl 50).

Also, that's what I used to think about other characters but now I have 3 v16's and I can't wait for removal of vet ranks to maybe make more;)

RizaHawkeye · January 2016

Alucardo wrote: »

I'm going to write quite a lengthy discussion on what I think about veteran removals, so hold on to your hats because this story is going to be full of romance, drama and about to be one emotional rollercoaster.
It's going to be quite large, so I'll break it down into chapters starting with one today.

WHAT I THINK ABOUT VETERAN RANK REMOVALS, CHAPTER 1
It will be a good thing.

Fin.

That was amazing!

The ending was truly unforgetable.

RizaHawkeye · January 2016

NightRibon23444 wrote: »

I think it's a damn joke ZoS is going ahead and doing this. There is no need and I know there are more out there that feel this way. I feel that this is going to be an Update that make me put the game down because they can never do anything right the first time. What's so wrong with the vet lvls now??? Oh let me think!! Nothing!!!

This is what I thought when I first heard about it. Then after reading the replies on this thread, I'm actually looking forward to it. I think it will make questing more fun and more people will return to playing the game rather than trying to grind their way to level V16. I have to admit, I was honestly dreading the endgame content.

It also allows a player to create multiple characters with some hope that they might actually play the game in the future.

The only thing that isn't clear to me is whether the cap is a soft cap. I'm not a fan of caps; if someone wants to grind away and get 800000 champion points, let them.

ItsGlaive · January 2016

RizaHawkeye wrote: »

So what? The Vet Ranks are removed but the champion points remain? So just points without a rank?

How does that change anything?

Allows you to participate in end game activities without first having to grind your way through silver and gold quests.

Brrrofski · January 2016

NightRibon23444 wrote: »

I think it's a damn joke ZoS is going ahead and doing this. There is no need and I know there are more out there that feel this way. I feel that this is going to be an Update that make me put the game down because they can never do anything right the first time. What's so wrong with the vet lvls now??? Oh let me think!! Nothing!!!

I've got 4 v16s. I have no desire to grind my way up to 16 on another 4. But if only have to get them to 50, I can have stam and magica on each class

Faulgor · January 2016

I don't know if a lot of people remember this, but at release a ton of people left once they hit V1 and realized they are only 1/3 through the game, despite being max level and having finished the main story. And only 2-3 months later they raised the cap to VR12.

ZOS has had feedback that their veteran system is driving people away since beta, and committed to removing/replacing it quite soon after release in 2014. That's why we got the champion system in the first place.

Pandorii · January 2016

Question. Does anyone know what will happen to food recipes? I make my gold off of provisioning, specifically selling vet 15 blue foods. LOL. I am speculating that it'll be scaled similar to the way that armor will be scaled, say a vet 15 recipe would require 150 CP to be able to use? Anybody know anything about this?

Hiero_Glyph · January 2016

While I understand the need to be untrusting of anything ZOS does to ESO at this point, most of the complaints against the removal of veteran ranks are completely unfounded. If you do the math (which almost all of the people against vet ranks being removed have not) going from level 1 to 50 w/ 160 CP requires almost the same amount of experience as it will going from level 1 to v16 currently. As others have noted several times, the advantage is that leveling alts becomes mostly painless (fighter's, mage's, alliance, lore books, etc. being the exceptions).

Additionally, upon hitting level 50 on an alt you can equip your best from another character so end-game content and Cyrodiil become far more enjoyable on alts. Better still, you can progress all of your characters (curret and future) just from playing any character that is level 50. While the details are still not finalized, this change is 100% better than the current system, and if ZOS rebalances Cadwell's Silver/Gold the number of grind spots just increased by over 10x.

willymchilybily · January 2016

RizaHawkeye wrote: »

So what? The Vet Ranks are removed but the champion points remain? So just points without a rank?
How does that change anything?

@RizaHawkeye Dont know if its been said, but the champion points "catch up" system is now working off an XP curve. (it requires significantly more XP to get 1 CP when you currently have 500 CP than when you have 0 CP)

The affore mentioned XP/CP curve includes the "champion point Cap" [currently 501] within its formula. This is of benefit because by changing this cap the total amount of XP/Grind required to reach "end game/gear cap" can be set.

For example first Vet ranks come in Vet 10, then increase, V12, V14, V16 gear. Each leap expanding the Grind required to be "max Level" for new players. This is bad for the games health as it can discourage new players and alt creation.

The new system can be used to ensure the ~15million(example only) XP / grind required to reach gear cap of 160CP is maintained for a new payer joining 3 or 4 years from now when it may be 300 CP. Simply by raising the CP cap above 501

mysterious · January 2016

i heard it too

wayfarerx · January 2016

Hiero_Glyph wrote: »

If you do the math (which almost all of the people against vet ranks being removed have not) going from level 1 to 50 w/ 160 CP requires almost the same amount of experience as it will going from level 1 to v16 currently. As others have noted several times, the advantage is that leveling alts becomes mostly painless (fighter's, mage's, alliance, lore books, etc. being the exceptions).

This right here. Nothing is really going to change for single-character-style players, but it will make life so much better for altoholics like myself.

Although there are those few players out there who want to keep the "v16" next to their name to show how awesome they are at chugging XP pots and AOE farming goblins. Maybe we can get an achievement put in for those folks, something like "Killed 10,000 goblins in Cracked Wood Cave while using an XP booster" and have it grant a title along the lines of "Perfect Roe Dumpster."

Jaeysa · January 2016

Pandorii wrote: »

Question. Does anyone know what will happen to food recipes? I make my gold off of provisioning, specifically selling vet 15 blue foods. LOL. I am speculating that it'll be scaled similar to the way that armor will be scaled, say a vet 15 recipe would require 150 CP to be able to use? Anybody know anything about this?

They said it would require a certain amount of champion points, or at least things like gear.

Regarding extra character slots: In their Reddit AMA they said they were interested in adding it; might be a crown store service. Please, take my money.

Regarding vet rank removal - please, take them. Take them away and never bring them back. I like champion points, I don't really like that I feel like I have to finish two other zones to do Craglorn or endgame on every single character. Level 50 gives you enough skill points and experience with your class so that you're not stuck there going 'wat' and gives you a decent investment of time without being cumbersome.

Sweatyrabbit · January 2016

Hope499 wrote: »

Now? Pshhhhh, who cares. This change will probably be the day i stop playing....

Sooo I can have your stuff? Gold and Mats?

Super excited for this change!

Stikato · January 2016

They are going away soon.

Well, I mean not quite soon, but they have been talking about it. They confirmed it. So...yeah, anytime now. Just not anytime soon. Eventually. Probably. I think so. It definitely could happen. I hope.

Oh crap, it's 2016! Lol

(Just being lighthearted, this is how me and my friends joke about it. I do hope they go away soon)

BabeestorGor · January 2016

Although I think I overall like the idea of vet ranks disappearing I am worried about the effect it will have on my gear.
Get 1st character to lvl 50. Others follow soon afterwards. Shortly thereafter get 160CP. Soon thereafter I'm trying to equip 8 characters for the end game. At least the VR grind gave people plenty of time to gather the kutas, tempers etc they needed.

Sevalaricgirl · January 2016

JD2013 wrote: »

What's wrong with veteran levels is most people don't want to take time to level other characters and want everything instantly as opposed to having to work for it.

That is absolutely not a fact.

I for one hate the vet ranks, why because I love playing alts, and it's ridiculous that I have to send my Breton hating, dark elf hating Bosmer to both of those alliances and oh wait, it's as if I never took her through an alliance before.

If I never have to grind silver and gold I will be happy.

JD2013 · January 2016

Sevalaricgirl wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

What's wrong with veteran levels is most people don't want to take time to level other characters and want everything instantly as opposed to having to work for it.

That is absolutely not a fact.

I for one hate the vet ranks, why because I love playing alts, and it's ridiculous that I have to send my Breton hating, dark elf hating Bosmer to both of those alliances and oh wait, it's as if I never took her through an alliance before.

If I never have to grind silver and gold I will be happy.

You realise that to get more champion points on said alt, you'll still have to go through those zones but likely as a different name, right?

You will of course have all champion points from your other character(s) already but those zones will still be there to explore.

Hope499 · January 2016

Magdalina wrote: »

Hope499 wrote: »

Paulington wrote: »

Definitely happening. ZOS said they'd let us know more info in the New Year (So, hopefully soon!).

We will all be dropped to level 50 and gear will have CP requirements instead of VR requirements.

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

A little context here before this gets too out of hand…
We’re still working on the system – nothing is finalized. (which is why we’re not really talking much about it yet)

The intention is that once you hit 50, champion points take over. Veteran Ranks are completely removed.

When Veteran Ranks are removed, we will convert any Veteran Ranks on your highest character into CP.

To get a rough idea of balance - think of 10CP = 1 VR. (so 160 CP will roughly = VR16)

Additional Details:
We’re planning on giving 2.5 CP for every VR level you’ve earned on your highest level character. (40 for a VR16 character)

When the conversion happens, any player with CP less than their old veteran rank * 10 will instead be given enough CP such that their total is VR * 10. For example: A player is VR14 with 75 CP, they will be given 65 CP (140-75) instead of 40, so that they can still equip any gear they may have.

We will make sure the 16 attribute picks you got from VR1 to VR16 will carry over. (current plan is an achievement that goes up in 10 CP increments until 160)

Keep in mind that none of the stuff above is 100% locked in. We're still implementing the feature - things are subject to change. It's important that everyone understands they are not suddenly going to have to have 501 CP in order to equip the top level gear. We will introduce new gear, with higher CP requirements sometime in the future, but we won't be making huge jumps. (i.e. - we won't go from 160 to 400 suddenly)

Once we finalize the system and lock in more of the details, we will discuss things in more detail and answer questions.

That sounds terrible....

This is a major change late in the game to the one of the games core mechanics....really bad idea imo. I have ZERO interest in playing another character.....I loved that it took a long time to work and finalize one....you had to actually put a bit of time into it...

Now? Pshhhhh, who cares. This change will probably be the day i stop playing....

Well if you don't want to play another character, then don't play another character? This change won't affect you then pretty much at all. Your experience won't be lost since it'll be converted into champion points. There'll be no advantage in rolling an alt other than experiencing a different class/role, just like in the current system. The gear will be CP-gated so your progression will still matter(I do think it's a good idea as opposed to just having everything be lvl 50).

Also, that's what I used to think about other characters but now I have 3 v16's and I can't wait for removal of vet ranks to maybe make more;)

Maybe I am confused then....I will wait to see what the change actually is....

Sweatyrabbit wrote: »

Hope499 wrote: »

Now? Pshhhhh, who cares. This change will probably be the day i stop playing....

Sooo I can have your stuff? Gold and Mats?

Super excited for this change!

Sure, no need for it anyway, whats your GT?

eventide03b14a_ESO · January 2016

Paulington wrote: »

Definitely happening. ZOS said they'd let us know more info in the New Year (So, hopefully soon!).

We will all be dropped to level 50 and gear will have CP requirements instead of VR requirements.

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

A little context here before this gets too out of hand…
We’re still working on the system – nothing is finalized. (which is why we’re not really talking much about it yet)

The intention is that once you hit 50, champion points take over. Veteran Ranks are completely removed.

When Veteran Ranks are removed, we will convert any Veteran Ranks on your highest character into CP.

To get a rough idea of balance - think of 10CP = 1 VR. (so 160 CP will roughly = VR16)

Additional Details:
We’re planning on giving 2.5 CP for every VR level you’ve earned on your highest level character. (40 for a VR16 character)

When the conversion happens, any player with CP less than their old veteran rank * 10 will instead be given enough CP such that their total is VR * 10. For example: A player is VR14 with 75 CP, they will be given 65 CP (140-75) instead of 40, so that they can still equip any gear they may have.

We will make sure the 16 attribute picks you got from VR1 to VR16 will carry over. (current plan is an achievement that goes up in 10 CP increments until 160)

Keep in mind that none of the stuff above is 100% locked in. We're still implementing the feature - things are subject to change. It's important that everyone understands they are not suddenly going to have to have 501 CP in order to equip the top level gear. We will introduce new gear, with higher CP requirements sometime in the future, but we won't be making huge jumps. (i.e. - we won't go from 160 to 400 suddenly)

Once we finalize the system and lock in more of the details, we will discuss things in more detail and answer questions.

So basically the CP, which was supposed to flavor your character and provide long term improvement is now going to effect what gear you can use? So those with high CP can be even more powerful than those with lower CP. I was wondering how they were going to widen the gap even further. Am I the only one who thinks this sounds like a terrible idea on paper?

wayfarerx · January 2016

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

Paulington wrote: »

Definitely happening. ZOS said they'd let us know more info in the New Year (So, hopefully soon!).

We will all be dropped to level 50 and gear will have CP requirements instead of VR requirements.

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

A little context here before this gets too out of hand…
We’re still working on the system – nothing is finalized. (which is why we’re not really talking much about it yet)

The intention is that once you hit 50, champion points take over. Veteran Ranks are completely removed.

When Veteran Ranks are removed, we will convert any Veteran Ranks on your highest character into CP.

To get a rough idea of balance - think of 10CP = 1 VR. (so 160 CP will roughly = VR16)

Additional Details:
We’re planning on giving 2.5 CP for every VR level you’ve earned on your highest level character. (40 for a VR16 character)

When the conversion happens, any player with CP less than their old veteran rank * 10 will instead be given enough CP such that their total is VR * 10. For example: A player is VR14 with 75 CP, they will be given 65 CP (140-75) instead of 40, so that they can still equip any gear they may have.

We will make sure the 16 attribute picks you got from VR1 to VR16 will carry over. (current plan is an achievement that goes up in 10 CP increments until 160)

Keep in mind that none of the stuff above is 100% locked in. We're still implementing the feature - things are subject to change. It's important that everyone understands they are not suddenly going to have to have 501 CP in order to equip the top level gear. We will introduce new gear, with higher CP requirements sometime in the future, but we won't be making huge jumps. (i.e. - we won't go from 160 to 400 suddenly)

Once we finalize the system and lock in more of the details, we will discuss things in more detail and answer questions.

So basically the CP, which was supposed to flavor your character and provide long term improvement is now going to effect what gear you can use? So those with high CP can be even more powerful than those with lower CP. I was wondering how they were going to widen the gap even further. Am I the only one who thinks this sounds like a terrible idea on paper?

They say that the top-end CP requirement for gear will start out low (160 CP has been floated by the devs) and that they will raise that requirement very slowly and that it won't reach anything like our current cap for a long time. I wish they would not gate gear this way but if they keep the threshold low it won't be too bad.

Sallington · January 2016

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

Paulington wrote: »

Definitely happening. ZOS said they'd let us know more info in the New Year (So, hopefully soon!).

We will all be dropped to level 50 and gear will have CP requirements instead of VR requirements.

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

A little context here before this gets too out of hand…
We’re still working on the system – nothing is finalized. (which is why we’re not really talking much about it yet)

The intention is that once you hit 50, champion points take over. Veteran Ranks are completely removed.

When Veteran Ranks are removed, we will convert any Veteran Ranks on your highest character into CP.

To get a rough idea of balance - think of 10CP = 1 VR. (so 160 CP will roughly = VR16)

Additional Details:
We’re planning on giving 2.5 CP for every VR level you’ve earned on your highest level character. (40 for a VR16 character)

When the conversion happens, any player with CP less than their old veteran rank * 10 will instead be given enough CP such that their total is VR * 10. For example: A player is VR14 with 75 CP, they will be given 65 CP (140-75) instead of 40, so that they can still equip any gear they may have.

We will make sure the 16 attribute picks you got from VR1 to VR16 will carry over. (current plan is an achievement that goes up in 10 CP increments until 160)

Keep in mind that none of the stuff above is 100% locked in. We're still implementing the feature - things are subject to change. It's important that everyone understands they are not suddenly going to have to have 501 CP in order to equip the top level gear. We will introduce new gear, with higher CP requirements sometime in the future, but we won't be making huge jumps. (i.e. - we won't go from 160 to 400 suddenly)

Once we finalize the system and lock in more of the details, we will discuss things in more detail and answer questions.

So basically the CP, which was supposed to flavor your character and provide long term improvement is now going to effect what gear you can use? So those with high CP can be even more powerful than those with lower CP. I was wondering how they were going to widen the gap even further. Am I the only one who thinks this sounds like a terrible idea on paper?

Worse than that, gear progression becomes purely an XP grind.

"Darn, I can't equip that piece yet. Better go farm cats for a week until I can."

Divinius · January 2016

Sevalaricgirl wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

What's wrong with veteran levels is most people don't want to take time to level other characters and want everything instantly as opposed to having to work for it.

That is absolutely not a fact.

I for one hate the vet ranks, why because I love playing alts, and it's ridiculous that I have to send my Breton hating, dark elf hating Bosmer to both of those alliances and oh wait, it's as if I never took her through an alliance before.

If I never have to grind silver and gold I will be happy.

And THIS is a perfect example of the whole problem.

Vet Ranks had two core problems that were the vast majority of all complaints:
1) They took for-freakin-ever to level
2) You pretty much had to do it in Cadwell's Silver and Gold.

Number 1 above has been significantly improved for a while now. They take WAY less xp and time than they used to.

Number 2 is still a problem (though the new DLC zones are helping).

The main thing people complained about was not that they have to level beyond 50... it was HOW they had to level beyond 50. Lots of people think that Cadwell's Silver and Gold are stupid. If there was an equally viable alternative to Silver and Gold where people could have leveled their vet ranks, far less people would have been complaining about them.

But the complaints about Silver and Gold just got attached to Vet Ranks themselves, and now ZOS is jumping though mad hoops trying to get rid of the Vet Ranks, while replacing them with a system where you still have to grind XP, and where Silver and Gold are still the most viable ways to do so.

Yes, the fact that CP is account wide is nice... for people that don't want to take the time to level other characters.

But the core problem with Vet Ranks isn't going to go away by removing Vet Ranks. It's going to go away by adding much more new content where people can gain xp (now just for CP, instead of Vet Ranks) past 50, so that the people that hate Silver and Gold can skip them.

Sevalaricgirl · January 2016

JD2013 wrote: »

Sevalaricgirl wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

What's wrong with veteran levels is most people don't want to take time to level other characters and want everything instantly as opposed to having to work for it.

That is absolutely not a fact.

I for one hate the vet ranks, why because I love playing alts, and it's ridiculous that I have to send my Breton hating, dark elf hating Bosmer to both of those alliances and oh wait, it's as if I never took her through an alliance before.

If I never have to grind silver and gold I will be happy.

You realise that to get more champion points on said alt, you'll still have to go through those zones but likely as a different name, right?

You will of course have all champion points from your other character(s) already but those zones will still be there to explore.

Having the zones there to explore does not force me to do them. Having them there is okay for my imperials but not my Bosmer.