Zos, any plans to nerf Nightblades? This is getting absurd...

Tryxus · December 2015

Xsorus wrote: »

or Templars/Dks need a buff

Roll with that, makes everyone happy

J2JMC · December 2015

BalticBlues wrote: »

J2JMC wrote: »

Any dk or templar who runs in a small group will never notice any imbalance with their class.

You obviously have never played Templar.
If you are in a small group meeting a large group,
NBs and Sorc can move out quickly of the danger zone.
Templars are snails and just are being rolled over.

The terrible moveability of Templars indeed could be buffed.
But not buff and no armor helps against instagibs from invisibility.
Permanent invisibility + instagib damage = god mode

How does the particular scenario you just described indicate class imbalance? Classes based around high mobility will escape better than classes without that much mobility? I bet you think templars being able to outheal nightblades is imbalanced as well...

Wizzo91 · December 2015

I have never seen a 10k SA in PVP (do you wear any armour or are you in a wedding dress). Most hit for 3-6k and 7-8k is very high. I play Sorc, Stamblade and DK and almost never get oneshotted unshielded at about 20k HP or even less. Players can only oneshot me out of stealth if they proc camo hunter and/or if I'm on my Vamp NB.

This seems to be a l2p issue tbh. There are some builds that can possibly pull off that high damage but those builds will have very low sustain and they will die fast if their first burst fails. It's a very situational build and fine imo.

I play stamblade a lot (iirc 28k stamina, 4k weapon damage, 2200 stam regen and 20k health). As a solo running stamblade you rely on that first burst out of stealth. If that fails a player on the same skill level has a good chance on killing you. Playing Stamblade requires very good movement, situational awareness and resource management in a straight up fight and you are very squishy. One crystal frag or WB hit of a player that knows what he is doing and you're done. Cloaking away is always an option of course, but most competent players have potions.

You will also have to rely on vigor/rally for heal and have to access to any shields. Making mistakes is definitely not as harsh on my Sorc.

As I play Sorc and DK also I know that if you survive the first burst Stamblades are very manageable in 1v1 situations. if you are 2v1 against a Stamblade he does not stand a chance, has to cloak and run or die. Sorcs and dks do a lot better in straight up fights.

I have no experience as a templar, but I know that they can very annoying on my stamblade. BoL to full life constantly I can't dish out enough damage to kill him. If the temp is good I will run out of stam and will have to cloak away.

It's all very situational.

SemiD4rkness · December 2015

Wizzo91 wrote: »

I have never seen a 10k SA in PVP (do you wear any armour or are you in a wedding dress). Most hit for 3-6k and 7-8k is very high. I play Sorc, Stamblade and DK and almost never get oneshotted unshielded at about 20k HP or even less. Players can only oneshot me out of stealth if they proc camo hunter and/or if I'm on my Vamp NB.

This seems to be a l2p issue tbh. There are some builds that can possibly pull off that high damage but those builds will have very low sustain and they will die fast if their first burst fails. It's a very situational build and fine imo.

I play stamblade a lot (iirc 28k stamina, 4k weapon damage, 2200 stam regen and 20k health). As a solo running stamblade you rely on that first burst out of stealth. If that fails a player on the same skill level has a good chance on killing you. Playing Stamblade requires very good movement, situational awareness and resource management in a straight up fight and you are very squishy. One crystal frag or WB hit of a player that knows what he is doing and you're done. Cloaking away is always an option of course, but most competent players have potions.

You will also have to rely on vigor/rally for heal and have to access to any shields. Making mistakes is definitely not as harsh on my Sorc.

As I play Sorc and DK also I know that if you survive the first burst Stamblades are very manageable in 1v1 situations. if you are 2v1 against a Stamblade he does not stand a chance, has to cloak and run or die. Sorcs and dks do a lot better in straight up fights.

I have no experience as a templar, but I know that they can very annoying on my stamblade. BoL to full life constantly I can't dish out enough damage to kill him. If the temp is good I will run out of stam and will have to cloak away.

It's all very situational.

Playing stamblade requires NOTHING to do well in pvv. Not even top gear. Just hit 3-4 buttons and you're gonna win 90% of your encounters.

Dositheus · December 2015

I play.. a Stam Sorc, a Magika Sorc, a Stam (switching from Magika) DK, A stam NB, and a Magika NB. 5 characters total. Honestly, this thread is full of too much hyperbole. There are a number of people who need to actually branch out and try other classes before they whine about them. There are a few things that need some tweaks, but at high end play... there are highly successful players with every combo. Highly successful against everything. It is kind of rude, and i generally stay away from saying such, but it is rather a L2P issue than obscene imbalance. There are some things that need tweaking, but nothing nearly as bad as people are making it out to be.

Wizzo91 · December 2015

SemiD4rkness wrote: »

Wizzo91 wrote: »

I have never seen a 10k SA in PVP (do you wear any armour or are you in a wedding dress). Most hit for 3-6k and 7-8k is very high. I play Sorc, Stamblade and DK and almost never get oneshotted unshielded at about 20k HP or even less. Players can only oneshot me out of stealth if they proc camo hunter and/or if I'm on my Vamp NB.

This seems to be a l2p issue tbh. There are some builds that can possibly pull off that high damage but those builds will have very low sustain and they will die fast if their first burst fails. It's a very situational build and fine imo.

I play stamblade a lot (iirc 28k stamina, 4k weapon damage, 2200 stam regen and 20k health). As a solo running stamblade you rely on that first burst out of stealth. If that fails a player on the same skill level has a good chance on killing you. Playing Stamblade requires very good movement, situational awareness and resource management in a straight up fight and you are very squishy. One crystal frag or WB hit of a player that knows what he is doing and you're done. Cloaking away is always an option of course, but most competent players have potions.

You will also have to rely on vigor/rally for heal and have to access to any shields. Making mistakes is definitely not as harsh on my Sorc.

As I play Sorc and DK also I know that if you survive the first burst Stamblades are very manageable in 1v1 situations. if you are 2v1 against a Stamblade he does not stand a chance, has to cloak and run or die. Sorcs and dks do a lot better in straight up fights.

I have no experience as a templar, but I know that they can very annoying on my stamblade. BoL to full life constantly I can't dish out enough damage to kill him. If the temp is good I will run out of stam and will have to cloak away.

It's all very situational.

Playing stamblade requires NOTHING to do well in pvv. Not even top gear. Just hit 3-4 buttons and you're gonna win 90% of your encounters.

You are talking serious BS. Obviously you are a troll or it is a really bad case of l2p.

90% of encounters against AFK or very bad players. Ganking is not as easy as it sounds against players that are actually playing (I'm not talking about jumping people on horses etc. but picking out players in larger grps or sieges.). Average sorcs have shields up most of the time, Nightblades are moving in stealth etc.

It's called combat awareness. Everyone get's instakilled sometimes. It happens. Deal with it. But most of the time you should be expecting it when you are sieging, fighting etc. If you are expecting it you can easily deal with it. If the NB failed an average player has a good chance of killing the NB if he does not cloak and run.

EDIT: Oh yea and if it's that easy - make a stamblade and stream for a couple of hours. I will pay for your gear if you kill 90% of players you engage by just hitting 3-4 buttons.

WreckfulAbandon · December 2015

Wow, that is a seriously hard hitting Ambush and SA. I said in my balance thread that I believe the armor debuff should be removed from SA but it looks like you were already marked by the time SA hit you. Still, an armor debuff added to a spammable high damage ability doing physical damage is a bit much...

Ambush should have minimum range as well so ppl can't be completely locked out of doing anything.

And to the ppl asking for softcaps back, I don't see why so many ppl suggest this (both here and elsewhere). All softcaps will do is ensure that everyone has capped health, magic, stam, damage, regen, etc. Sure it will bring hybrids back but I think most builds will just end up being ridiculously similar. I still have screencaps of my DK with overcharged everything back in the day, and guess what, I was far from the only one... play your way becomes max everything or L2P...

VincentBlanquin · December 2015

problem is, when you encounter small scale pvp or 1 vs 1 you most probably encounter bis players and maybe experienced too. thats the point of champion system account wide. if you roll new class and expect everything will be easy as you see it in death recap you will be unpleasantly surprised. stop complaining. game is broken at almost everything, but nerfing classess dont help, its drop in bucket

Dualrifle · December 2015

Can OP post their stat here as well.... I'm curious what kind of stat are you running....

Calboy · December 2015

Don't worry. The nightblade nerf will be here soon and it will be a glorious day for eso. Any class that is allowed to pick it's fights and kill people without the mechanics allowing the victim to fight back and disappear when it doesn't work out is overpowered . I can't wait to see the nb years all over these forums when it comes!

Xjcon · December 2015

ralonasan wrote: »

BalticBlues wrote: »

ralonasan wrote: »

If you don't want to get 1 shot, build around surviving gankers

Artjuh90 wrote: »

always funny to see people QQ about getting oneshotted with no health investment.

Didn't you read what we have posted in this thread?
Half of your points in health + 7 pieces HA + massive resistance
= nothing helps against instagibs from invisibility

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

Nightblades are not the only ones that can give you one. 20k damage in less than a second

But NBs are the only ones that can generate this damage out of permanent invisibility.

As you do not seem to understand how permanent invisibility + instagib damage is OP:
How would you feel about a Templar that could heal out of permanent invisibility?
Give each class permanent invisibily, and then let's see how this is a L2P issue.

Permanent invisibility needs to go, sorry. This god mode is killing the fun and the balance.

You're blatantly wrong because I survive the best NB one shots in game @TheBull @rokrdt05 by hitting buttons.
Stop perpetuating falsehoods.

I understand every player has the right to play whatever way they want and play whatever skills they want. But that doesn't mean that they are justified in crying nerf every time they die to someone who is just better.

And perma invis? are you mad? L2pots and magelights. not utilizing blatantly obvious tactics to counter stealth makes it a clear L2P issue.

Wait isn't this exactly what happened to Dk?

WreckfulAbandon · December 2015

Calboy wrote: »

Don't worry. The nightblade nerf will be here soon and it will be a glorious day for eso. Any class that is allowed to pick it's fights and kill people without the mechanics allowing the victim to fight back and disappear when it doesn't work out is overpowered . I can't wait to see the nb years all over these forums when it comes!

So which mechanics exactly do NB's use that don't allow you to fight back?

Tryxus · December 2015

Calboy wrote: »

The nightblade nerf will be here soon and it will be a glorious day for eso

No it won't, it'll just be more rage atop the usual QQ

Just boost the other classes and leave NB the way they are now. Anyone asking/wanting for more nerfs should quit this game and go play Hello Kitty Online

Xjcon wrote: »

ralonasan wrote: »

BalticBlues wrote: »

ralonasan wrote: »

If you don't want to get 1 shot, build around surviving gankers

Artjuh90 wrote: »

always funny to see people QQ about getting oneshotted with no health investment.

Didn't you read what we have posted in this thread?
Half of your points in health + 7 pieces HA + massive resistance
= nothing helps against instagibs from invisibility

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

Nightblades are not the only ones that can give you one. 20k damage in less than a second

But NBs are the only ones that can generate this damage out of permanent invisibility.

As you do not seem to understand how permanent invisibility + instagib damage is OP:
How would you feel about a Templar that could heal out of permanent invisibility?
Give each class permanent invisibily, and then let's see how this is a L2P issue.

Permanent invisibility needs to go, sorry. This god mode is killing the fun and the balance.

You're blatantly wrong because I survive the best NB one shots in game @TheBull @rokrdt05 by hitting buttons.
Stop perpetuating falsehoods.

I understand every player has the right to play whatever way they want and play whatever skills they want. But that doesn't mean that they are justified in crying nerf every time they die to someone who is just better.

And perma invis? are you mad? L2pots and magelights. not utilizing blatantly obvious tactics to counter stealth makes it a clear L2P issue.

Wait isn't this exactly what happened to Dk?

Yeah, DK used to be the king of PvP. But many ppl (mostly Sorcs) kept begging for nerfs and ZOS listened to them. Now DK are harder pressed as battlefield controllers, having received many nerfs before they got the right one (the one to Reflective Scales)

WreckfulAbandon wrote: »

Calboy wrote: »

Don't worry. The nightblade nerf will be here soon and it will be a glorious day for eso. Any class that is allowed to pick it's fights and kill people without the mechanics allowing the victim to fight back and disappear when it doesn't work out is overpowered . I can't wait to see the nb years all over these forums when it comes!

So which mechanics exactly do NB's use that don't allow you to fight back?

The same that other classes have as well: Stun, Snare, Root,...

Catblade · December 2015

#Nonerfdecember

Tryxus · December 2015

Or better yet: check my signature

#esosafn

Stop the Nerfs and Start the Buffs

Tankqull · December 2015

Greiver wrote: »

Egonieser wrote: »

I have np with nightblades i just don't get how can some of them pull off the absurd numbers.
I have a stamina and magicka NB, my stamblade has 4.1k weapon damage - yet i've never recalled hitting anyone for 10k+ with ambush or surprise attack from stealth. Yet i get hit that constantly, how much more damage can you stack to pull it off? And this is with maces/mauls, both dual weild and 2handed with sharpened+CP.

If your at 4.1k weapon damage you surprise attack should be hitting for 9-10k. From stealth, add in 10% more bonus.
Buffed up weapon damage for me I get just below 4k and mine hits for 9675 in the tooltip.

10k cyro dmg requires a 20k tooltip value... goodluck finding 11k while you upgrade from barely under 4k to 4.1k...

zornyan · December 2015

Tankqull wrote: »

Greiver wrote: »

Egonieser wrote: »

I have np with nightblades i just don't get how can some of them pull off the absurd numbers.
I have a stamina and magicka NB, my stamblade has 4.1k weapon damage - yet i've never recalled hitting anyone for 10k+ with ambush or surprise attack from stealth. Yet i get hit that constantly, how much more damage can you stack to pull it off? And this is with maces/mauls, both dual weild and 2handed with sharpened+CP.

If your at 4.1k weapon damage you surprise attack should be hitting for 9-10k. From stealth, add in 10% more bonus.
Buffed up weapon damage for me I get just below 4k and mine hits for 9675 in the tooltip.

10k cyro dmg requires a 20k tooltip value... goodluck finding 11k while you upgrade from barely under 4k to 4.1k...

Not really, since a crit on an nb has a 1.6 modifier. So an 10k tooltip will crit for 11k in cyro, even more from stealth with extra stealth bonuses.

shadelon · December 2015

From a stamblade. . . L2P.

Lots of people have already said it. Our real power comes from stealth. You take us out of stealth one on one and we shatter really easily. That's why they call us glass cannons. We can do a lot of damage but we break very easily. And hate to break it to you, but my whole guild pretty much has way more than 20k health. Your argument holds no water.

cosmic_niklas_93b16_ESO · December 2015

WreckfulAbandon wrote: »

Calboy wrote: »

Don't worry. The nightblade nerf will be here soon and it will be a glorious day for eso. Any class that is allowed to pick it's fights and kill people without the mechanics allowing the victim to fight back and disappear when it doesn't work out is overpowered . I can't wait to see the nb years all over these forums when it comes!

So which mechanics exactly do NB's use that don't allow you to fight back?

Well, so many times I've had NB's just run away from me after trying to gank me in the sewers when they fail to kill me and I start fighting back so they just cloak out of there, I'd say that one needs some adjusting so they can't just cloak up and run away whenever they feel like. And AoE won't always work, and as I'm a PVE'r I don't have the detection morph of magelight and potions are too expensive to use it anytime a NB tries to gank me, lol. And as I'm a PvE'r I don't have access to that detection skill in alliance war rank.

khele23eb17_ESO · December 2015

cosmic_niklas_93b16_ESO wrote: »

WreckfulAbandon wrote: »

Calboy wrote: »

Don't worry. The nightblade nerf will be here soon and it will be a glorious day for eso. Any class that is allowed to pick it's fights and kill people without the mechanics allowing the victim to fight back and disappear when it doesn't work out is overpowered . I can't wait to see the nb years all over these forums when it comes!

So which mechanics exactly do NB's use that don't allow you to fight back?

Well, so many times I've had NB's just run away from me after trying to gank me in the sewers when they fail to kill me and I start fighting back so they just cloak out of there, I'd say that one needs some adjusting so they can't just cloak up and run away whenever they feel like. And AoE won't always work, and as I'm a PVE'r I don't have the detection morph of magelight and potions are too expensive to use it anytime a NB tries to gank me, lol. And as I'm a PvE'r I don't have access to that detection skill in alliance war rank.

So basically your problem is you own NBs so hard they have to run away from you. And youre a PvE player without even access to all the tools you should have for PvP. And you want the class to be nerfed. Brilliant.

I love it. Noone in this thread gets their ass handed to them by NBs on a regular basis, noone gets destroyed every time they face a NB in fact most present the NBs as annoyance not a threat in their personal experience and yet: NEEEERF!

Also, some of you seem to be fighting breton-redguard halfbreeds with maxed both magica and stamina resource pools and access to both stamina and magicka skill morphs.

Angarato · December 2015

SemiD4rkness wrote: »

Can't believe people are trying to defend this kind of burst in a game where you run around with 20k hp.

you can get way more hp than that, or you can slot radiant magelight but i guess its easier to just ask for nerfs

Catblade · December 2015

Is this thread still a thing?

FriedEggSandwich · December 2015

Dositheus wrote: »

I play.. a Stam Sorc, a Magika Sorc, a Stam (switching from Magika) DK, A stam NB, and a Magika NB. 5 characters total. Honestly, this thread is full of too much hyperbole. There are a number of people who need to actually branch out and try other classes before they whine about them. There are a few things that need some tweaks, but at high end play... there are highly successful players with every combo. Highly successful against everything. It is kind of rude, and i generally stay away from saying such, but it is rather a L2P issue than obscene imbalance. There are some things that need tweaking, but nothing nearly as bad as people are making it out to be.

Completely agree, well said. Experience is relative; it's easy to think you can't improve any more due to you being so much better than you were before, therefore anyone wiping the floor with you must have an unfair advantage, they can't possibly be that much better than you.

There are some unfair mechanics in pvp currently, but not many. There are viable counters to most things, including stam NBs. It's a big game; if you consider magicka/stamina variants you could argue there are 8 classes in the game. It takes a lot of time to learn everything; all the animations, particle effects, audio cues, meta strats/combos, your opponents' skills and passives etc. There are no red sparks, white sparks or telegraphs in pvp to prompt you to block, bash or roll. You gotta learn to play.

Malmai · December 2015

This guy joined on October and he started Nerf topics already with 1million vine threads.

SemiD4rkness !

FriedEggSandwich · December 2015

Malmai wrote: »

This guy joined on October and he started Nerf topics already with 1million vine threads.

SemiD4rkness !

Forum booster maybe. Post lots of controversial stuff and watch the agrees and awesomes roll in.

UltimaJoe777 · December 2015

Catblade wrote: »

Is this thread still a thing?

Sadly, yes. If not toward Nightblades then toward something else... The complaints and arguments never cease!

Volkodav · December 2015

Leave Nightblades alone! They're just fine as they are. Dont nerf or buss them,[please.

khele23eb17_ESO · December 2015

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

Catblade wrote: »

Is this thread still a thing?

Sadly, yes. If not toward Nightblades then toward something else... The complaints and arguments never cease!

Im starting to think the best way to deal with these threads is not to get into a heated debate but to ignore them. How many pages can 3-4 people fill if everyone else just ignores the topic?

lolo_01b16_ESO · December 2015

Catblade wrote: »

Is this thread still a thing?

Yes, but the thread title should be changed to "I'm to lazy to learn how to counter nbs, does anyone feel the same?

Malmai · December 2015

lolo_01b16_ESO wrote: »

Catblade wrote: »

Is this thread still a thing?

Yes, but the thread title should be changed to "I'm to lazy to learn how to counter nbs, does anyone feel the same?

No i will make Nerf thread and wait for ZoS to start nerfing...