God_flakes wrote: »

MountainHound wrote: »

God_flakes wrote: »

MountainHound wrote: »

Simple fact, You won't beat a core team of 12 with 24 pugs, as proved tonight. I would charge in expecting them to be with me, then baaaaam half are still alive trailed back to the keep (or dead) and no where near the crowns body.

Very very very true. However, you can't build a core without kissing some frogs. Kwim? Herding and teaching pugs is draining, aggravating and time consuming. It is a selfless, often thankless task. But the gems you find in the rough are worth every minute. Some of dc's very best were once pugs and or casuals of eg, el, no mercy, etc.

And Telel, I love your last post. I appreciate your dedication to your faction. It is admirable!

I agree and we need to keep the "pugs" away from the slaughter house. It isn't fun for them to go back and back to be slaughtered by the same people.

Also, us DC need to REZ each other alot more and not say TY as soon as we get up to die again! A TY shouldn't not even be needed it should be mandatory!

Exactly!!!! Which is why I have offered to herd pugs again like I once did. I assure you I WILL prevent them from being farmed. It sickens me to see them feed the enemy repeatedly.

Yup, and when were done with them, they will be some of the best small scale fighters the Covenant has to offer......We will make life takers and heartbreakers out of em!

wow this is getting dramatic now

WE ARE SPARTANS

I have no words to describe what I just witnessed.....it's just.....

I hope DC uses the opportunity eek up in score since they're no longer getting the special star sticker bonus.

But I love how 3 bars of EP can't rally to take a scroll when its literally brought up to our own keep, then just lets the keep get steamrolled. I can't even......

Dkill wrote: »

Are we still arguing about this, i can see the level of unemployment in this community is above 15%. Lest come to terms:

DC United
- Get on Channel Command
- have good ideas
- Dont bash on your faction PUGS they are good players without a group.
- Dont think you are better than me because you are not
- Lest have a goal

Them we can think in winning campaign one more time, for now farm all that AP because winter is coming......

what gives you the right to think that I am not better than you? See, it's this kind of arrogance that leads to a toxic community...

ScarecrowBoat wrote: »

Dkill wrote: »

Are we still arguing about this, i can see the level of unemployment in this community is above 15%. Lest come to terms:

DC United
- Get on Channel Command
- have good ideas
- Dont bash on your faction PUGS they are good players without a group.
- Dont think you are better than me because you are not
- Lest have a goal

Them we can think in winning campaign one more time, for now farm all that AP because winter is coming......

what gives you the right to think that I am not better than you? See, it's this kind of arrogance that leads to a toxic community...

Gotta read that in context. I'm sure he means the same thing as you just said.

Minno wrote: »

Dkill wrote: »

Are we still arguing about this, i can see the level of unemployment in this community is above 15%. Lest come to terms:

DC United
- Get on Channel Command
- have good ideas
- Dont bash on your faction PUGS they are good players without a group.
- Dont think you are better than me because you are not
- Lest have a goal

Them we can think in winning campaign one more time, for now farm all that AP because winter is coming......

I'll add an extra bullet:

- play the map to gain points. I don't think we have the underdog bonus on this campaign to help

No we don't have the underdog, and yes i did not meant to be arrogant thanks for the clarification...

So much negativity in this thread, it's unbelievable. The way I see it, we all have different ways of having fun in Cyrodiil. No one person's way is better than another's. I completely agree with Dkill about not having any room to talk. If you did not help us take anything, then you cannot criticize us on how we lose it. It's happened already, anyways, it's done. That is just how we like to play, and we can't blame you for wanting to win, because that's how you want to play, but don't come up in zone and start barking orders after you have either been gone from the game for a while, or have spent most of your time in the sewers. That just isn't fair to the people who have worked hard to claim the keeps and emperorship.

Another thing that I noticed. It seems like the pugs, and others, treat the PvP guilds of DC like butlers. We are expected to do whatever you want us to do. While we will work WITH you, we will not work FOR you. Do not misinterpret this in a way that seems like we don't care about what happens to DC. We simply are here to have fun, like you, and are looking for a good fight with other good teams.

The alliances would, honestly have no direction without organized pvp guilds. While there are some Zone leaders, some of the pugs just play for the hell of it, or because they want to fight and don't care about winning. We need some driving force that all the pugs can rally behind. We need a sense of direction, and the PvP guilds give us that. With the difficulty of the NPCs in keeps, and the other alliances zerging, its hard to get anything done if you don't have a zerg as well. That is, unfortunately, the way it is.

Callidus_Est wrote: »

So much negativity in this thread, it's unbelievable. The way I see it, we all have different ways of having fun in Cyrodiil. No one person's way is better than another's. I completely agree with Dkill about not having any room to talk. If you did not help us take anything, then you cannot criticize us on how we lose it. It's happened already, anyways, it's done. That is just how we like to play, and we can't blame you for wanting to win, because that's how you want to play, but don't come up in zone and start barking orders after you have either been gone from the game for a while, or have spent most of your time in the sewers. That just isn't fair to the people who have worked hard to claim the keeps and emperorship.

Another thing that I noticed. It seems like the pugs, and others, treat the PvP guilds of DC like butlers. We are expected to do whatever you want us to do. While we will work WITH you, we will not work FOR you. Do not misinterpret this in a way that seems like we don't care about what happens to DC. We simply are here to have fun, like you, and are looking for a good fight with other good teams.

The alliances would, honestly have no direction without organized pvp guilds. While there are some Zone leaders, some of the pugs just play for the hell of it, or because they want to fight and don't care about winning. We need some driving force that all the pugs can rally behind. We need a sense of direction, and the PvP guilds give us that. With the difficulty of the NPCs in keeps, and the other alliances zerging, its hard to get anything done if you don't have a zerg as well. That is, unfortunately, the way it is.

Negativity aside (because its water under the bridge), here's my bullet response:

- we can't say how to have fun. I dont think anyone here advocates for total dictation on what you can or can't do to enjoy the game (cheating as exception obviously.) What I can comment on is that while absence can bring saltiness to players that worked their butts off, saying their opinion isn't valid because of said absence is super ludicrous. That means no pug can have a valid battle tactic idea or opinion until they stay for an extended time. Toxic behavior because it erodes respect at all levels.

- why we think we can critize: next time pay attention to the calls for Chuck in zone. It outnumbers rest of the guilds put together. That means Chuck has a brand now, and expectation of pvp wins and to help do what most of the new players can't do without training.. But when those mistakes happen, expect biteback. Because Chuck is the group with all pugs and ability to play the map at a fast pace. If that group is in one location with said pugs, you force DC into defense when offense should be priority (like retaking of glade to defend scrolls since it locks both gates.)

- reason for thread: last 3 cycles preIC had been fantastic to DC. That's advertising that despite underdog status, DC can and will pillage. That means more new players will reroll to DC when they see it in pvp. When players see a major pvp guild protect emp keep at the expense of how players play the game and enjoy it, I'd say we had a valid reason to call via public forums.

- I'll say this and say it again, you cannot have main pvp guilds without pugs and vice versa. It's a chicken/the egg argument and we all know belittling either side is destructive; it offsets that delicate balance between how green groups turn to vets. But if your mistakes as a pug or main group repeat, I think it's valid to call you out on that.

- Butler issue relates to that branding issue I bring up. Pugs look up to you main guilds and want that skill. In turn you as a guild gotta protect that reputation. Without it, your a pug group that pvd. With it, you can gain allies to help your moves around the map.

- minimum number to ideally take a keep is 5-10. @prefar and company on thornblade after main guilds ditched it proved the minimum number (in small scale combat against a 15 max group online). More players though mean more creative ways to hit targets and take keeps. Hence the current meta for 24 player raid groups.

- rally force for DC is when we have 3 scroll keeps. It promotes pvp because the average player has no patience to retake those keeps by themselves when superior forces are hitting the gates. Players at ash would have had the forces to retake other keeps had the strategy called in zone happened; utilization of emp power to steam roll and reclaim.

This isn't a lesson for only one guild, its a lesson for future players; to be apart of this community means every action and mistake impacts. How to handle it after the fact is what separates the class in all of us; protect that respect as it opens doors.

Hotemper is my hero 3 mill point i think the close player is one of us as well and is 1 mill behind, so for those of you that don't have the time or the desire to achieve this please keep your mouse shut and support your EMP. By the way by right once you become an Emp the map is yours and is up to you to rally the faction to help defend and invade team Orange.

This is Hotemper hafter 30 hours of not sleep "Long life for the EMP"

Long gone are the days when emperors were capped during prime time and lost during prime time...now it's just a matter of who has the oceanic crew to do the work for them, or who has the day off from work/school/unemployed

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

MountainHound wrote: »

God_flakes wrote: »

MountainHound wrote: »

Simple fact, You won't beat a core team of 12 with 24 pugs, as proved tonight. I would charge in expecting them to be with me, then baaaaam half are still alive trailed back to the keep (or dead) and no where near the crowns body.

Very very very true. However, you can't build a core without kissing some frogs. Kwim? Herding and teaching pugs is draining, aggravating and time consuming. It is a selfless, often thankless task. But the gems you find in the rough are worth every minute. Some of dc's very best were once pugs and or casuals of eg, el, no mercy, etc.

And Telel, I love your last post. I appreciate your dedication to your faction. It is admirable!

I agree and we need to keep the "pugs" away from the slaughter house. It isn't fun for them to go back and back to be slaughtered by the same people.

Also, us DC need to REZ each other alot more and not say TY as soon as we get up to die again! A TY shouldn't not even be needed it should be mandatory!

Pugs? Oh yeah, the people who type LFG over and over again in zone chat only to be answered with silence.

Yea, point was raised earlier on that. Difficult situation since people are more than willing to start groups for pugs. But they don't want to deal with the reality that they want the glory of facing off against the top dogs and you can't do that with all green troops.

My advice to the newbies, avoid Azura Star. You'll never break those balls groups. Instead find Trueflame, haderus, and chillrend. There you should find smaller fights without lag (I'm guest on Trueflame and just ventured to haderus last night.).
You will still be outnumbered, but as DC that's part of the fun and challenging aspect of cyro. In the end you'll be a better player.

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

MountainHound wrote: »

God_flakes wrote: »

MountainHound wrote: »

Simple fact, You won't beat a core team of 12 with 24 pugs, as proved tonight. I would charge in expecting them to be with me, then baaaaam half are still alive trailed back to the keep (or dead) and no where near the crowns body.

Very very very true. However, you can't build a core without kissing some frogs. Kwim? Herding and teaching pugs is draining, aggravating and time consuming. It is a selfless, often thankless task. But the gems you find in the rough are worth every minute. Some of dc's very best were once pugs and or casuals of eg, el, no mercy, etc.

And Telel, I love your last post. I appreciate your dedication to your faction. It is admirable!

I agree and we need to keep the "pugs" away from the slaughter house. It isn't fun for them to go back and back to be slaughtered by the same people.

Also, us DC need to REZ each other alot more and not say TY as soon as we get up to die again! A TY shouldn't not even be needed it should be mandatory!

Pugs? Oh yeah, the people who type LFG over and over again in zone chat only to be answered with silence.

Actually Telel answers them with offers to let them into their guild, train them, equip them, and make sure they can get groups as often as this one can be there.

That they then make the choice to remain alone is not this one's fault. Especially as this one's own fun is limited by the twirling of mickey's hands over all twelve of those precious precious numbers.

MountainHound wrote: »

Wha

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

MountainHound wrote: »

God_flakes wrote: »

MountainHound wrote: »

Simple fact, You won't beat a core team of 12 with 24 pugs, as proved tonight. I would charge in expecting them to be with me, then baaaaam half are still alive trailed back to the keep (or dead) and no where near the crowns body.

Very very very true. However, you can't build a core without kissing some frogs. Kwim? Herding and teaching pugs is draining, aggravating and time consuming. It is a selfless, often thankless task. But the gems you find in the rough are worth every minute. Some of dc's very best were once pugs and or casuals of eg, el, no mercy, etc.

And Telel, I love your last post. I appreciate your dedication to your faction. It is admirable!

I agree and we need to keep the "pugs" away from the slaughter house. It isn't fun for them to go back and back to be slaughtered by the same people.

Also, us DC need to REZ each other alot more and not say TY as soon as we get up to die again! A TY shouldn't not even be needed it should be mandatory!

Pugs? Oh yeah, the people who type LFG over and over again in zone chat only to be answered with silence.

"pugs" is just a term, what would you like people to be called that run on their own / in an "unorganized" group?

fodder

Close but no cigar. Wasn't for lack of trying either you guys put us on the back foot lots of times. Seemed to be operating on a more unified front though. EP's priorities made me /facepalm more than once in the closing days. Like why push Faregyl when its controlled by DC and interrupt their push for a scroll rather than going after the other AD scroll, thus resulting in both AD and DC doubleteaming us. EP logic.