Constructive criticism! PvP is lacking

apostate9 · October 2015

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

The play style absolutely deserves derogatory words.

But, thing is.. if grinding AP is your goal, the way to do is be in a aeing blob that overwhelms people based on numbers.

There is little to no skill involved in the play style past "follow crown" and having voice communications.

They do it because it's easy and it gives them good AP. Take away the good AP and they won't do it as much.

And what does take skill in this game? What is this skill you keep speaking of?

Relmyna · October 2015

briandivisionb16_ESO wrote: »

Zergs will hide in stealth e.g. in a random barn where nobody would check, no objectives in there. They will hide until enough enemy players are in one area and then run over them, usually doing this you can farm really decent AP. If you repeat it a few times you can net yourself a position on the top 100 players.

Do you play DC? If so, were you one of the people my group of like 10 was farming at the Ales farm the other night on Trueflame? I'd really like to know why they kept running back to be killed after the 3rd or 4th time. If they didn't want to get farmed, why did they keep running back after the farming was obvious?

Wycks · October 2015

They can make 4-5 very fast simple changes that will effect zergs and make the game 1000% more fun.

1. Remove barrier
2. Remove purge
3. Remove negate
4. Make siege do more dmg esp oils
5. Add immunity timers to snares and cc

Changes that might take longer

6. Design keeps that help the defenders instead of the attackers (the keep design in ZOS is god awful). Who designs a keep that allows the attackers to have an advantage?
7. Create counter AEO skills that effect groups larger than 12. If more than 12 people are within 2-3 meteres of each other ability dps multiplies.
8. Create a smite hammer - if you zerg with more than 25 people a giant hammer smites you into the ground.

The benefits are a no brainer, less lag and more fun fights.

Right now almost everyone I know logs at night not because its late, but because they get steamrolled by 2-3x thier numbers.

dodgehopper_ESO · October 2015

I've found at times its best to be in the blob for rewards, and that can be fun if you're battling equal rivals. It doesn't take the place of going out there with what I call a small skirmish group and just having fun though. I do agree that something is a bit off about how pvp works, and it definitely favors damage dealers and healers over playing the pure-tank role. I've more or less given up Tanking in favor of a more aggressive approach, but I can remember a time when it was actually fun to tank.

I don't think you should knock someone for being 50 though, trust me, you're going to be 50 sooner than you realize. I've had some good times teaming up with pensioners in the past, many of whom were heavy duty pvp'ers. Don't knock them, they are here to enjoy the game the same as you, and frankly have as much right to the computer as you have to the tv.

I think battleground buffs are not a good idea, and if they're going to have this, they need some kind of countering mechanic to keep factions from being in lockdown. Might it be realistic that a faction can lock down a zone? Maybe. Is it fun? Probably not. Let people's sucess in pvp be determined by skill and skill alone, not by an excessive buff from their faction. People should pvp because they enjoy pvp, not because of the points they earn either.

apostate9 · October 2015

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

The play style absolutely deserves derogatory words.

But, thing is.. if grinding AP is your goal, the way to do is be in a aeing blob that overwhelms people based on numbers.

There is little to no skill involved in the play style past "follow crown" and having voice communications.

They do it because it's easy and it gives them good AP. Take away the good AP and they won't do it as much.

And what does take skill in this game? What is this skill you keep speaking of?

briandivisionb16_ESO wrote: »

show previous quotes

apostate9 wrote: »

you broadly derided like 50% of the population of Cyrodiil as pugs, bombzergs, or whatever...so you must be better than that, right?

I resent that.
This language 'pugs' 'bombzergs' isn't meant to stereotype. It is simply the language everyone is using.
I'm sorry. Thank you apostate for bringing this to light, though. I completely agree there should be no such thing as any of these, OK -derogatory- words, but basically the mechanics ZOS hands us at the moment sadly definies playstyles.

You can break a zerg. You just can't do it with 3 dudes. You can solo gank, run siege. I challenge this oft repeated assertion the PVP is MAKING people do something bad, when they would otherwise be playing some exalted new form of PVP that is much more "skillfull-er".

It isn't true. People run pain trains because it works in many situations, and if you can't find a way to defeat them, that is on you. Not them. The point of AvA isn't to do stuff that is hard, it is to do stuff that works. This is AvA PVP and large groups categorically ARE part of the desired meta. ZOS told you it was. Did you think a 24 man platoon was gonna spread out 50 ft from each other and challenge their foes on the parapets to come down and have 24 separate duels??

What did you think 24 vs 24 or 50 vs 50 players was going to look like? I admit the AOE caps are a bad thing, and other gripes like that can be addressed by ZOS individually. But these 3 page screeds about how bad PVP sucks...I am just saying, they make it sound like it is just the author that sucks.

My guild runs small squads, big raids, scouting parties, bomb-trains, whatever the situation calls for that we have the ability to do in order to WIN. That is the object of the war sim. Winning.

I've done more than a few barn farms myself, in fact. And if I got you with one, well-- thanks for the donation. Stop walking into them?

dodgehopper_ESO · October 2015

bob.ellisonb16_ESO wrote: »

They can make 4-5 very fast simple changes that will effect zergs and make the game 1000% more fun.

1. Remove barrier
2. Remove purge
3. Remove negate
4. Make siege do more dmg esp oils
5. Add immunity timers to snares and cc

Changes that might take longer

6. Design keeps that help the defenders instead of the attackers (the keep design in ZOS is god awful). Who designs a keep that allows the attackers to have an advantage?
7. Create counter AEO skills that effect groups larger than 12. If more than 12 people are within 2-3 meteres of each other ability dps multiplies.
8. Create a smite hammer - if you zerg with more than 25 people a giant hammer smites you into the ground.

The benefits are a no brainer, less lag and more fun fights.

Right now almost everyone I know logs at night not because its late, but because they get steamrolled by 2-3x thier numbers.

I disagree. They need to make Tanks focus on the health bar, and not be split between health and the other two stats. If people had to choose between health for tanking activities, and stam/mag for damage, it would be a better game. Right now its just too easy to max out an insane barrier -and- max out insane damage, as well as heal self and any number of other things. The health bar should scale something, and I believe what it should do is reduce the cost of sprinting, blocking, dodging, breaking free, and bashing. It should also help return resources from light/heavy attacks. In short, there should be an excuse to be a Warrior-Knight build, instead of a spell flinger, and I believe this is the best resolution of that. Additionally, the magnitude of tank-power effects should be based on health as well, not magic/stamina. In this way a tank can get more out of the likes of rune, spike armor, immovable, than a dps. The dps can still do it and will recover faster innately, while the warrior-tank has to use his mouse and warrior skills more. In short: Tanking is not the problem, the problem is that people have been able to have their cake and eat it too.

rfennell_ESO · October 2015

apostate9 wrote: »

And what does take skill in this game? What is this skill you keep speaking of?

Well, I don't really know what you can really consider skill... but I know what isn't and zerging isn't.

Now leading the zerg, sure that's pretty hard to balance out the group... make sure you have the barriers, the heals, the timing of proxy, and good decision making. That's a skill for sure, but the rest of the zerglings are doing simpler things than a 1v1 would do and generally have simpler bar setups.

If you are sitting their raging trying to sublimate the spamming of steel tornado into "I r teh skilledz", little discussion is necessary.

If you were to reduce AP gains like XP gains, but go even further... like 50% reduction of AP total at a number and another 50% at another (and so on). Zerging would no longer be something you saw as often.

Water takes the easiest path and so do people.

firstdecan · October 2015

SneaK wrote: »

I think removing certain AOE caps would allow smaller groups to tactically bust zergs. Pretty sure that would be an easy fix as well.

Docmandu wrote: »

The skill that was added to "break" / "counter" zergs is actually mostly used by the zergs to kill non-zerg-balled players.

I just wanted to put these two quotes side by side......

briandivisionb16_ESO wrote: »

Problem
These casual guilds are destroying competitive players.
These casual zergtrains are destroying players that like to strategize.

I am sorry. No. Forgive me.

The way the game works is destroying competitive players.
The way the game works is destroying players that like to strategize.

Now I feel the need to rehash the responses that most people get when they state what they dislike about the game.

L2P. Maybe your strategy is not as 733T as you'd like to think.
Maybe we should just give everyone an 'I win' button and take all the challenge out of the game.
If you're not up to a certain challenge, improve your character or group with others.
This is an MMO, not some other type of game. Maybe this game is not for you.

On a serious note, this game does not have the PvP you want. You want a dueling or small skirmish type of PvP, and ZoS hasn't introduced it to the game. They want big, constant, ongoing chaotic PvP, which is what Cyrodiil is designed for. The zergs will form as long as the game mechanics allow large numbers of people to play together. Zerging is a strategy, it's a simple and effective one that works. Surviving in one / through one takes its own tactics.

If you 'competitive players' can't compete with a simple and effective strategy, maybe it's time for a rethink.

Zerging is only a problem for the tiny portion of the community that feels some kind of entitlement based on their own perception of elitism. Everyone else just calls it 'playing the game.'

rfennell_ESO · October 2015

firstdecan wrote: »

On a serious note, this game does not have the PvP you want. You want a dueling or small skirmish type of PvP, and ZoS hasn't introduced it to the game. They want big, constant, ongoing chaotic PvP, which is what Cyrodiil is designed for. The zergs will form as long as the game mechanics allow large numbers of people to play together. Zerging is a strategy, it's a simple and effective one that works. Surviving in one / through one takes its own tactics.

If you 'competitive players' can't compete with a simple and effective strategy, maybe it's time for a rethink.

Zerging is only a problem for the tiny portion of the community that feels some kind of entitlement based on their own perception of elitism. Everyone else just calls it 'playing the game.'

Plenty of dueling, skirmishing and small scale pvp in the Imperial City. More than the game has ever had really.

SneaK · October 2015

Buff Magic/Prox Detonation

Buff siege damage

Those two things would dramatically help in fighting back against zergs, it's pretty simple.

firstdecan · October 2015

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

show previous quotes

firstdecan wrote: »

On a serious note, this game does not have the PvP you want. You want a dueling or small skirmish type of PvP, and ZoS hasn't introduced it to the game. They want big, constant, ongoing chaotic PvP, which is what Cyrodiil is designed for. The zergs will form as long as the game mechanics allow large numbers of people to play together. Zerging is a strategy, it's a simple and effective one that works. Surviving in one / through one takes its own tactics.

If you 'competitive players' can't compete with a simple and effective strategy, maybe it's time for a rethink.

Zerging is only a problem for the tiny portion of the community that feels some kind of entitlement based on their own perception of elitism. Everyone else just calls it 'playing the game.'

Plenty of dueling, skirmishing and small scale pvp in the Imperial City. More than the game has ever had really.

I've seen the zerg trains run through IC. I've also seen a lot more solo / small group PCP in IC. I'm not disagreeing with your premise, but most of the PvP in IC seems very ganky / cut throat / opportunistic, not really strategic.

I think the primary difference is that there's no real PvP objectives in IC, combined with the much quicker respawn times. You're either in a Zerg wandering around aimlessly seeing how much you can kill, or you're solo / small group doing the same thing. In Cyrodiil, there's keeps and resources to capture, and the moment one is flagged the zergs descend down upon the skirmish looking for action.

What would probably diversify the conflicts in Cyrodiil (instead of having zerg v zerg on a flagged battlefront) is having an NPC spy or spotter network that would provide periodic heatmaps of opposing player populations. This would give players more choices about where to direct their efforts, which of course leads to more confusion on the battlefield. At a minimum, this would encourage the more strategic players to think through more of the logistics of their invasions, and allow the blind zergers to just find each other and butt heads. This would also encourage players to spread out more, since high concentrations of players would be obvious to the enemy.

apostate9 · October 2015

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

show previous quotes

apostate9 wrote: »

And what does take skill in this game? What is this skill you keep speaking of?

Well, I don't really know what you can really consider skill... but I know what isn't and zerging isn't.

Now leading the zerg, sure that's pretty hard to balance out the group... make sure you have the barriers, the heals, the timing of proxy, and good decision making. That's a skill for sure, but the rest of the zerglings are doing simpler things than a 1v1 would do and generally have simpler bar setups.

If you are sitting their raging trying to sublimate the spamming of steel tornado into "I r teh skilledz", little discussion is necessary.

If you were to reduce AP gains like XP gains, but go even further... like 50% reduction of AP total at a number and another 50% at another (and so on). Zerging would no longer be something you saw as often.

Water takes the easiest path and so do people.

Spamming Steel Tornado requires no more or less skill than spamming some other skill. Press 3. 33333. Is 33343334333 more "skillfull"?

What about: 22222

Or even, 123444?

Come on...

The skill is in the big picture. Yes raid-leading is hard, but following and contributing to the team is not as easy as some make it sound, or they wouldn't be here crying that they can't figure it out. Taking direction and using discretion and observation are skills. Nobody can honestly think that this game is mechanically hard to play, so we clearly aren't talking mechanics, but strategy.

And if you don't think the "zerg" are employing strategy, you are dead wrong.

phairdon · October 2015

Make pvp specific maps for small scale action. Cyrodiil is an alliance war zone. Place is about armies fighting for territory & scrolls.

apostate9 · October 2015

firstdecan wrote: »

show previous quotes

SneaK wrote: »

I think removing certain AOE caps would allow smaller groups to tactically bust zergs. Pretty sure that would be an easy fix as well.

show previous quotes

Docmandu wrote: »

The skill that was added to "break" / "counter" zergs is actually mostly used by the zergs to kill non-zerg-balled players.

I just wanted to put these two quotes side by side......
show previous quotes

briandivisionb16_ESO wrote: »

Problem
These casual guilds are destroying competitive players.
These casual zergtrains are destroying players that like to strategize.

I am sorry. No. Forgive me.

The way the game works is destroying competitive players.
The way the game works is destroying players that like to strategize.

Now I feel the need to rehash the responses that most people get when they state what they dislike about the game.
L2P. Maybe your strategy is not as 733T as you'd like to think.

Maybe we should just give everyone an 'I win' button and take all the challenge out of the game.

If you're not up to a certain challenge, improve your character or group with others.

This is an MMO, not some other type of game. Maybe this game is not for you.

On a serious note, this game does not have the PvP you want. You want a dueling or small skirmish type of PvP, and ZoS hasn't introduced it to the game. They want big, constant, ongoing chaotic PvP, which is what Cyrodiil is designed for. The zergs will form as long as the game mechanics allow large numbers of people to play together. Zerging is a strategy, it's a simple and effective one that works. Surviving in one / through one takes its own tactics.

If you 'competitive players' can't compete with a simple and effective strategy, maybe it's time for a rethink.

Zerging is only a problem for the tiny portion of the community that feels some kind of entitlement based on their own perception of elitism. Everyone else just calls it 'playing the game.'

QFT.

If a person can't compete in the game that really *is*, you aren't being competitive. You're being obtuse. Get in the game, or choose one more to your liking. Other players in Cyrodiil aren't conspiring to make anyone rage quit, they are simply playing the game they bought.

rfennell_ESO · October 2015

apostate9 wrote: »

Spamming Steel Tornado requires no more or less skill than spamming some other skill. Press 3. 33333. Is 33343334333 more "skillfull"?

Not by much.

But 3,4, dodge roll, move,3, move to take away los, 5, bar switch, rebuff, bar switch, 3, dodge roll, 2.

Sure is.

apostate9 · October 2015

rfennell_ESO wrote: »

show previous quotes

apostate9 wrote: »

Spamming Steel Tornado requires no more or less skill than spamming some other skill. Press 3. 33333. Is 33343334333 more "skillfull"?

Not by much.

But 3,4, dodge roll, move,3, move to take away los, 5, bar switch, rebuff, bar switch, 3, dodge roll, 2.

Sure is.

Are you contending people in PVP...I gotta get this straight. Hold on.

(Stifles laughter)

People in PVP don't...dodgeroll? Nobody in a big group ever switches bars? Are we gonna have this conversation now? Really?

SneaK · October 2015

SneaK wrote: »

I think removing certain AOE caps would allow smaller groups to tactically bust zergs. Pretty sure that would be an easy fix as well.

Docmandu wrote: »

The skill that was added to "break" / "counter" zergs is actually mostly used by the zergs to kill non-zerg-balled players.

@firstdecan "I just wanted to put these two quotes side by side......"

Yea, I only said the first one.. I personally don't see many proxy det zergs. Even then, sheer numbers are always going to win at current. That's the argument, right? So, a proxy det zerg/WB zerg/LIGHT ATTACK zerg/whatever is still going to wipe out a 6 man group in a close encounter, and that's honestly not the real problem. The problem is the skillset to bust them up doesn't exist right now. So the zergs have no fear whatsoever and therefore don't need to approach any situation tactically. They can just storm into the hallway of the bridge without worrying about oil, or being snared and proxy'd. If there were a counter for them (siege/proxdet/something), smaller groups would at least have a fighting chance TO SLOW THEM DOWN and pretend they matter in the overall scheme of things. But nope, why bother playing objectively when all that's going to happen is you're going to get zergbombed and you can't do anything about it but join a 24 man group. Might as well take your 6 man group to gank loners out there PvE'ing. <<--- Which goes full circle, those ganked, join the numbers cause of security, and wait for it...... zerg.

briandivisionb16_ESO · October 2015

Thanks for all the comments guys. Some positive, some negative. Most in support.
Hopefully a lot of constructive material for the devs to digest here. Unfortunate it takes such organisation to get attention for long standing and increasingly evident issues! Actually, unfortunate doesn't cover it for me. Oh well.

To those saying this is a zerg game, think there was a guild leader there or something. Well, I think you're narrow minded and don't think you see the games potential - smallscale in this game is great! Guess thats why some of us hang around, trying to avoid 'these scrubs' (Ha!) and get some fun the way we want to play.

Will keep grabbing quotes, sorry if I missed yours.
Bloody hard work.
...........One more tag for good luck! @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_BrianWheeler

Korah_Eaglecry · October 2015

Joins game built around large scale PvP and cries about it.

Go back to WoW and SWTOR you Flavor of the Week Plebeian.

Maidenname · October 2015

Zergs, isn't that what Zenemax has been showing us in their advertisement since Day1? A mega server supporting massive battles? The only problem is they couldn't handle the lag.... Otherwise, they didn't misrepresent their marketing. True, many skillful players hate zergs, but when a small numbers were killed by another more skilled players and gotten " teabagged.... " Well, they will in return with vengeance in larger number and that fuel the Zerg ball fest further. But, please be honest and admit it, Zenemax has been advertising cyrodiil as one giant massive battle. ...

k2blader · October 2015

@OP, wow. This is a game. How dare people who don't play like you have fun in this game.

ESO PvP has always been zergy. It's kind of the point of their PvP. If you really can't stand that, it probably isn't the game for you.

Egonieser · October 2015

I agree with most points, however I do not agree with Having godmode proxy dets and uncapped AoE, it is already exploited beyond belief.

All you need is a "organized" group with everyone having proxydet slotted.
Hide or stealth, wait for zerg to approach, leader gives command and makes everyone activate their proxy - pops rapidman and charges in the enemy zerg (which is twice or more bigger than theirs) and spreads out, but also making sure proxydet circles cover each other and the entire area between those 12 people - at the same time spamming devouring swarm, steel tornado, fire ring or w/e AoE ability they have slotted and you know what happens?
The massive zerg got wiped by 12 people literally the very second all the proxydets went off simultaneously.. So no - it does not need a buff, it just needs people who know how to use it and the EP on EU Azura use it very well at the moment, almost every single night.

I know it's a valid tactic and a skilled one, BUT it does exactly the thing you describe. 12 People should not have a godly power by any means, it just shouldn't happen. They use it to "grind" people and AP with little to no resistance not to bust up and prevent zergs. They in fact encourage them so they can farm them which just turns the tables and the problem is still there.

Rather, the problem should be stopped at it's roots. Give people more incentive to solo or do small groups and penalize large zergs drastically. You had a good idea about debuffs. Perhaps smth like x% damage reduction or x% healing reduction/increased incoming damage or such per each player in the group past say... 10 people. Would also make sense from a lore perspective as being in a large, unorganized crowd with *** going off everywhere makes you more disorientated, more susceptible to backstabbin', surprise attacks etc as your character is less aware of his surroundings and distracted/unable to focus well. So it could be easily "explainable" from a lore point of view why the debuff is in place.

I am not pro giving people even more Overpowered skills, proxy/magicka detonation already hits far too hard than it should do and people use it as a regular, common skill both in PvP and PvE and in solo encounters. Especially sorcerers - deadliest combo while dual weilding - Detonation+Curse (both 4 have seconds detonation time), then apply mages wrath (which has a 4 second execute range), within those 4 seconds use entropy for 20% dmg and 20% next spell bonus (total 40% increase) - pop a frag which will hit insanely hard - then both curse and detonation will fire off at the SAME time bringing even the tankiest chars down to their knees and mages wrath execute will kick in. And all this happens in 4 Seconds, the last 3 hits happen so fast and hit so hard you have no chance to heal or react, you also can't dodge out of it or escape, once applied, full force of it will kill very fast. And none of this would be possible without the detonation skill, it is just already a huge gamechanger for some builds, nevermind in the hands of skilled and organized players. So... no buffs to it please, my sorc already finds most encounters too easy with it.

TX12001rwb17_ESO · October 2015

They should add friendly fire which can result in accidently killing your own alliance members, that will stop people from zerging in Cyrodiil with the risk of killing each other, if you want to AoE go do it somewhere else.

Maybe have it so your first attack would do nothing if you accidenly hit them but if you hit them twice within 3 seconds you will deal damage to them, that would probably fix zerging.

CaptainObvious · October 2015

Step 1, if your party is larger than the current opposition, then proximity detonation backfires and causes friendly fire. Since you kill yourself, then AP are deducted based on how many of your alliance are killed.

Wollust · October 2015

I don't run in these huge groups of +40. I found those groups ridiculous. But then again.. I actually wouldn't have a problem with these kinda groups if it wasn't for certain things:

AoE-Caps: This just protects the zergs and encourages the balling up on the crown. Why? Because you get free damage mitigation. What a stupid system. Remove this. Seriously.

Lag: It's a fact that those megazergs lag out the servers. I wish it was possible to have hundreds of players fighting each other (not as a single huge ball, but rather spread out at the keep or wherever. You know.. Lord of the rings style and stuff

) but it simply isn't. The servers don't allow us to do so. And there are people trying to defend the mega scale battle by saying this is how the game was advertised. It's true, that's how they did it. But it's simply not possible. The game can't handle it so don't do it. It's ZoS fault but it's also the players fault for doing it even though they know better. And yes, you're an *** if you say that's how you wanna play it and do not care about lagging everything out for everyone. I don't believe anyone saying this is how they enjoy PVP, through much lag.

Steel Tornado: What a skill. Not only do you get the highest weapon damage through dual wield, you also get the most broken AoE-skill: 12.5m range, decent base damage and it's also a freaking execute. What the hell? Impulse got nerfed but this thing is still unchanged?

Proxy Detonation: The one ability with the potential of being a zerg buster. Sadly, the damage increase is capped with 5 targets. Which is wrong, this ability shouldn't have a capped increase. And well.. No AoE-caps as well and this little baby will be the solution to many problems.

In the end, it all comes down to AoE-caps being the most broken thing in this game. Not only do they increase the calculations for the servers (thus causing lag) but they also protect a playstyle that seriously shouldn't be promoted: A balling up on the crown with a ton of people to mitigate damage and kill everything by choo choo.

briandivisionb16_ESO · October 2015

Maidenname wrote: »

Zergs, isn't that what Zenemax has been showing us in their advertisement since Day1?

*edited for clarity* (I worked hard on this lol:)

But lets be serious because we're going round in circles now. (Spamming Impulse and Steel Tornado?) Hahaha

Olivierko · October 2015

I love it when people defend their way of playing trying to convince themselves that they enjoy playing the game in 2 fps and that it was 'how Zenimax intended' it to be.

Just lovely guys, a tear of joy slips down my cheek.

briandivisionb16_ESO · October 2015

CaptainObvious wrote: »

Spoiler
AoE-Caps: This just protects the zergs and encourages the balling up on the crown. Why? Because you get free damage mitigation. What a stupid system. Remove this. Seriously.

I think this is one of the most apt points

SeptimusDova · October 2015

This one cannot blame zergs. A hairless one can defend itself from a single Alfiq. So the Alfiq attack in numbers. Large numbers 50 or more is a conservative number. By using screeching meow and claws to legs and bollocks they can bring the mightiest warrior to their knees.

You cannot blame the Alfiq for fighting the way they do. Nor can you blame the players, Any players for that matter for playing the game as Zenimax designed it. "gzalzi vaberzarita maaszi"

Ahzirr Traajijazeri

The players have adapted to the current game conditions.Should ZoS change the conditions? Some conditions? Which ones?
Above ground Cyrodiil has become dull and boring. So few flowers to eat.

But will ZOS make any changes? The ones they have seemed to make are expected if one was to be a Skooma user.

apostate9 · October 2015

briandivisionb16_ESO wrote: »

Thanks for all the comments guys. Some positive, some negative. Most in support.
Hopefully a lot of constructive material for the devs to digest here. Unfortunate it takes such organisation to get attention for long standing and increasingly evident issues! Actually, unfortunate doesn't cover it for me. Oh well.

To those saying this is a zerg game, think there was a guild leader there or something. Well, I think you're narrow minded and don't think you see the games potential - smallscale in this game is great! Guess thats why some of us hang around, trying to avoid 'these scrubs' (Ha!) and get some fun the way we want to play.

Will keep grabbing quotes, sorry if I missed yours.
Bloody hard work.
...........One more tag for good luck! @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_BrianWheeler

I think you mean me. And your accusation of narrow-mindedness is a bit off the mark. I am not the one who wants the mechanics of the game I bought to adapt to me, instead of the reverse. You emphasize that there are good small-scale fights in Cyrodiil. I agree. So go enjoy them! Why are you complaining? It sounds like cognitive dissonance, and this is made more obvious by your use of the *play how you want* bromide and your desire to *show off your skill*. You don't just want to play your own way, you want the "bombzergs" to play your own way too, so you can be better at ESO. They aren't going to.

It sounds like the way you want to play is by having honor duels in the middle of a war. Your inability to reconcile your failure to excel in PVP while doing so, with your self-image as a "competitive player"... is making you angry.

You can play the way you want. ZOS never promised you it would have an outcome equal to that of someone who learns the game. You can be a NB healer. You can attack zergs solo. You can put all your points into health and then be a Mage. Knock yourself out. But if the outcome is not what you wanted...<shrug>

The game is not "broken" just becuase you haven't learnt to play it yet.