Come on ZoS, look at all the posts! 0 Stam regen while blocking will ruin this game!

Rescorla_ESO · August 2015

Kilandros wrote: »

Rescorla_ESO wrote: »

Kilandros wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Couple things:
We understand this is topic that is near and dear to everyone's heart. It will take some adjustment from certain play styles that some of you have grown accustomed to.

We look at feedback from multiple places. (/feedback, /bug, social media, other websites, guild meetings...etc) Not just forum posts.

Like Eric has said a few times, we're pretty happy with the change - there might be some tweaks, but overall this is something we feel is a really good thing for the long term health of the game.

If you guys were genuinely concerned with the "long term health of the game," you would have sunk whatever resources were and are necessary to fix the abysmal performance in Cyrodiil.

You may want to reread the patch notes. How many complaints have you read from PTS players that lag is still bad?

I've lost count of the number of MMOs I've played since EQ1 that have made major changes like this for the betterment of the game. The skilled players always find a way to adapt to the changes and still do well.

This sub forum is literally littered with posts RE: poor performance, crashing, etc. on the PTS. I don't know what game you're playing, but it isn't this one.

Also, I didn't even comment on the stam issue. As far as I'm concerned, as long as large fights at near unplayable at peak hours, it really doesn't matter what our skills are supposed to do because they won't actually do it.

The crash bugs on PTS have absolutely nothing to do with the performance lag in Cyrodil that has plagued the game for months. @ZOS_BrianWheeler discussed the fix (involving how the game processes AOE abilities) he was putting in weeks ago on the PVP forum and the patch notes document the change is live on PTS I've yet to see anyone complain that the same performance lag in Cyrodil that has plagued the game for months was not fixed. The real test will be when the game goes live but in the limited number of skirmishes I have been involved with in Memorial district I had no lag whatsoever.

Preyfar · August 2015

KerinKor wrote: »

How about providing some well-argued justification for that assertion, rather than ZOS' usual dictatorial "we say it so it must be true" type of thing?

I can give you some. I do a lot of higher end content, both PVP and PVE. I run with some really good crews. And almost all the tanks just sit there, shields up, taunting, doing NOTHING else. There's no dynamic, there's no challenge. When I used to tank it was the same. It got boring, and boring REALLY fast. Hold shield, spam buffs, taunt and just... stand there. Avoid the AOEs, but otherwise, there was no reason to even move unless I lost aggro or was particular dungeon bosses.

People have been moaning and whining for months that the game is too easy. TOO EASY! And ZOS finally stepped up and said "Hey, we're doing something about it!".They're balancing out mega-damage builds and making it so tanks have to do something other than right-click.

They listened to feedback. They changed and improved the game to be more dynamic. I WAS against the change at first, but I came to terms with it and it's not as bad as I dreaded it to be. It makes tanks actually have to play the game, and that's NOT a bad thing.

Rinmaethodain · August 2015

Preyfar wrote: »

KerinKor wrote: »

How about providing some well-argued justification for that assertion, rather than ZOS' usual dictatorial "we say it so it must be true" type of thing?

I can give you some. I do a lot of higher end content, both PVP and PVE. I run with some really good crews. And almost all the tanks just sit there, shields up, taunting, doing NOTHING else. There's no dynamic, there's no challenge. When I used to tank it was the same. It got boring, and boring REALLY fast. Hold shield, spam buffs, taunt and just... stand there. Avoid the AOEs, but otherwise, there was no reason to even move unless I lost aggro or was particular dungeon bosses.

People have been moaning and whining for months that the game is too easy. TOO EASY! And ZOS finally stepped up and said "Hey, we're doing something about it!".They're balancing out mega-damage builds and making it so tanks have to do something other than right-click.

They listened to feedback. They changed and improved the game to be more dynamic. I WAS against the change at first, but I came to terms with it and it's not as bad as I dreaded it to be. It makes tanks actually have to play the game, and that's NOT a bad thing.

The "im bored as a tank because all i do is hold and block" is the fault of boring tanks and OP DPSes

NERF ALL DPS! BRING BACK FUN IN DUNGEONS NOT BURN BOSS AND BYPASS ALL MECHANICS

NERF ALL DPS!

Thats how silly you all look who claim that tanks are at fault for "boring experience" tanks were choosen as scapegoats of ESO to let ZOS continue DPS supremacy. DPS master race foreva. Thats why @ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_RichLambert wont give us a proper explanation and logic behind this ubernerf, because..... it would make no sense.
Thats why they just hide away and post empty statements like "we are happy with change".

Dungeons boring? All boss mechanics skipped? OH IM SURE its the fault of tank doing his 2k dps. Im sure it has nothing to do with 20k dps burning bosses like matches. Keep saying that tanks are at fault for boring experience. Maybe one day you will believe it.

Personofsecrets · August 2015

Lionxoft wrote: »

Personofsecrets wrote: »

Lionxoft wrote: »

The lack of stamina regen while blocking is one of the top 5 best major design changes. If you can't play without holding block for days then it's a huge L2P.

What makes the change good?

I think it's fairly obvious. It forces tanks to actually be a part of the game instead of taping down RMB. It forces them to solve how they will return their resources.

Just a side story of where I've seen a similar mechanic change. I remember when DC Universe Online implemented PvP counter mechanics where bosses could break your block, knock you down and do massive damage if you were blocking at the wrong time or too long. Before that change tanks would spend more than 90% of the time in raids just holding block for the exact same reasons tanks hold block in ESO. It was grab aggro->block. Rinse and repeat. This new change encourages active gameplay or clever use of game mechanics to overcome. There's certainly nothing wrong with that but people complained like it was the end of the world. Same story here. You'll get over it eventually or you'll just stop playing the game because it was too hard for you.

Love this change. A++

A. If it is fairly obvious, then why is there such dissent?

B. How are tanks not actually part of the game? That thought you have is a red herring.

Side story from me:

Back when I played Yugioh the game was very enjoyable. From 2003 to 2007 the meta game involved a system of forcing trades that would eventually leave the opponent at a card disadvantage. From there on that card disadvantage could spiral out of control until there were no resources left and the life points of the opponent could be attacked. Finding those moments to cause an opponent card disadvantage was challenging and fun. Individual games could take a whopping 30 minutes to complete.

Eventually, in 2008, a set called Phantom Darkness came out and that changed the game forever. Some of the new cards were so powerful that they invalidated old ways of playing that many enjoyed. The research & development team never has really turned back. Cards have kept getting more powerful and keep leading to faster games. Is there still strategy in Yugioh? Yes, it is still very fun for many people. Yugioh will never change back though and to this very day people still get together online to play a 2003 format because it was so widely enjoyed.

This is how I see the stamina regeneration nerf. It is a change passed down by the developers detached from what tanks are doing, players who are not skilled in the current ways of playing are ushering it on, the change is going to invalidate strategies that people enjoy, and all we will have left are the fond memories of not having to be stuck up a tamplar's backside during the final boss fight of AA and those times when we had to not blow through our resources against a tank in PVP.

@ZOS_RichLambert , I was hopeful that this heavy handed nerf had a chance of being reverted after that ESO Live. I suppose, contrary to what Eric said, the change is set in stone and the half of players who you admit have given negative feed back are to do what, take their lumps?

GhostShadows · August 2015

i tested it on pts, i spent the 5k crowns they give on pts all in the 3 pots, and spent all the pots in 3 days, i must say working like intended!!!

kaorunandrak · August 2015

Posted this in another thread talking about this but since this is the one they seem to want to be active in here:

Blocking stops your regen and resets the 2 second regen timer. So if your smart blocking and getting hit with heavy attacks every other second, like many have said AXES come to mind, for me as a stamina DPS PVPer, wrecking blow and crystal frag spammers come to mind you can and will lock your self into no stamina regen.

Are there ways to over come this?
* Farm pledges and trials to up your undaunted so you get the resource return passive on synergies.
* Stack tons of stamina so you have a larger window to block before having to restore stamina.
* Focus on reducing block cost to negligible levels via enchants.
* Cap out alchemy for medicinal use and chug stamina potions every 40-45 seconds.
* Farm the ever loving hell out of cp to stack reduce stamina cost and block cost.
* Build for engine guardian and use low cost abilities to spam for max up time.
* Roll a DK and build for earthen heart spam for stamina heal and ultimate generation for resource heal.
* Roll a Templar and hope for tons of bodies on the floor for repentance stamina heal.
* Have a dedicated Templar magika build with you and eat their shard and have them running repentance.
* Maximize out of block damage mitigation for less time having to block.
* Don't use any stamina abilities out side of block.
* Use a roll dodge every 6 seconds instead of block and stack for roll dodge reduction.
* Roll a night blade and run siphon toggle.

Now that's just off the top of my head and primarily this works for PVE, the problem for me is that is not where my concern is focused. My concern is in my end game which is the pvp zone, this is where lots of the suggestions up top go out the window or at the very least and less dramatic become much more difficult and unrealistic to pull off. In pvp your focus is killing and survival, you constantly move in and out of groups attempting to take out high priority targets and back up and safeguard your own using high cost high damage high utility and cc abilities. This is an environment where you have sorc blasting around spamming crystal frags on you and if you don't block or dodge your dead. Nightblades going in and out of stealth spamming ambush and concealed weapon and if you don't block your dead.

This is the environment where I have tested it and this is the environment where I have seen the most issue. Here's a few
* Change effects stamina users the most limiting defensive options and when coupled with the roll dodge change and the normal rampant use of CC in game forces stamina users into to many no way out or damned if you do damned if you don't situations
* Puts unneeded stress on a already super stressed resource stamina is used to block, bash, CC break, roll dodge, sneak, buff, debuff, heal, attack, and sprint.
* Does nothing to stop magika builds from block casting. "Bat bombing" is alive and well folks so is frag spam and molten spam.
* Pushes a hybrid magika/stamina play style for stamina users that the game doesn't support yet unless your running around with 500+ cp
* Pushes "smart blocking" in an environment where every enemy attack requires a smart block and suffers from severe sometimes crippling latency issues.
* Forces cookie cutter build's, play styles, and team make ups to compensate for change. This does not reflect the ESo "Play how you want!" rally cry.
* No compensation or self restoration options to help with change.
* DOESN'T STOP BLOCK CASTING
* Heavy armor still doesn't mitigate enough damage to not block.

There are other paths that could have been taken to addressing the issues that led to this "change", as it stands now I see this change as a buff to magika users and nothing more. They need to address the power level difference between stamina and magika they are putting in with this and the roll dodge change. There needs to be some type of stress removal off our stamina bars, perhaps a much greater increased stamina heal from heavy attacking. Access to a cheap damage shield or mitigation tool that costs magika but scales off of stamina, a change to how resources regen going for a 1 second regen versus the current 2. And more stress needs to be applied to magika bars plain and simple, magika users get away with too much already they don't need any more help.

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_RichLambert

Personofsecrets · August 2015

GhostShadows wrote: »

i tested it on pts, i spent the 5k crowns they give on pts all in the 3 pots, and spent all the pots in 3 days, i must say working like intended!!!

And which way is that?

RinOkumara · August 2015

mateoz wrote: »

ZoS please make a change after casting a magicka skill next 4 seconds you dont regen magicka.

Seriously how do you things like AA HM or HR HM will go if your tank ran out of stam???

I agree that most Vet pledge wont be a big problem but there are such thing as VDSA last boss or hard mode trials. Try to tank em before saying l2p.

But vet dsa last boss dosen't take much stamina away????

GhostShadows · August 2015

Personofsecrets wrote: »

GhostShadows wrote: »

i tested it on pts, i spent the 5k crowns they give on pts all in the 3 pots, and spent all the pots in 3 days, i must say working like intended!!!

And which way is that?

make u spent much more potions than wat u can craft, purely financial change.
i m subed Yet, and i get 1500 crowns for it, but if i will need spent 5k to be competitive on pvp, they expect i spent crown packs.

trimsic_ESO · August 2015

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Couple things:
We understand this is topic that is near and dear to everyone's heart. It will take some adjustment from certain play styles that some of you have grown accustomed to.

We look at feedback from multiple places. (/feedback, /bug, social media, other websites, guild meetings...etc) Not just forum posts.

Like Eric has said a few times, we're pretty happy with the change - there might be some tweaks, but overall this is something we feel is a really good thing for the long term health of the game.

I believe this is a great change in PVE. This will encourage people to block strategically instead of simply holding block during the whole encounter. It's more fun because it's a more dynamic gameplay based on actions calling for an appropriate reaction.

This being said, this is also a huge nerf in PVP. In PVP you can't focus on just one target, and holding block if you are at the front line is a matter of staying alive. And that's my concern: if a defensive playstyle based on being a tank at the front line is no more viable, can the DK have in exchange one or two class skills based on stamina that can deal a fair amount of damage like NB, templars, and now sorcs have? Some sort of a reasonnable trade off? (Magicka DK have lava whip)

Wreuntzylla · August 2015

From a PvP perspective, ZoS has essentially decided that it will make more money catering to FPS style combat than typical MMO coordinated play.

Are they right? Maybe. If their game is played predominantly by casuals or solo DPS PvPers. Typically, more people play DPS than any other archetype. I am uncertain on the solo versus coordinated play stats though.

Permitting everyone to have a chance at a kill by simply mashing one button arguably causes less forum rage than a perma-blocker, who adds variety to the meta, but prevents DPS from winning every fight. However, it also dumbs the game down to a Hello Kitty level.

Contraptions · August 2015

This is my view from a PVE perspective:

I think the underlying problem with tanking is that tanks aren't really needed, and this change is going to make things worse. This game supposedly has the trinity but currently tanks seem to have a comparatively minor/useless role. ZOS, you should be encouraging people to play as tanks, not introducing nerfs that make tanking seem even more undesirable.

While this change is ostensibly meant to "increase PVE challenge", I think it only seems to disproportionately affect tanks, while healers and DPS are pretty much still doing the same thing. Most people think tanks aren't necessary, are boring to play and require no skill. And that's true, except in high end PVE, because everything else does laughable damage. I have seen people take unblocked heavy attacks from bosses and get up good as new after a heal. I have seen people stand in fire and LIVE. I have seen tanks that don't use a shield and think that taunt is a DPS skill. Is this gameplay we want to encourage?

The problem is both that enemy mobs don't hit hard enough with their special attacks. and that they take too long to use their skills. The average dungeon mob usually gets one or two attacks off before they die. I'm not blaming DPSes for killing them too quickly, because that's what they're meant to do. The least ZOS could do is to give the mobs more of a fighting chance through various skill sets. Imagine if ZOS made all mobs like the ones in DSA that had more skill variety. Give mobs Healing Springs, wards, Stampede and other skills. To make things fair, I suggest increasing the damage from sources that can be avoided (ie. blockable attacks, interruptible attacks, AOEs), but reducing the auto-attack damage from NPCs. Everyone, not just the tank, has to respond appropriately in combat.

Next, tanking is not just about "taunting and holding block". Tanks are not only meant to absorb damage but also to prevent it. Facing cones and directional attacks away from your teammates, rooting adds, interrupting casts, spawning AOEs away from the team, all these prevent damage before it is even dealt. A good tank positions mobs and himself in a way that makes the encounter easier to manage. (think Maw of the Infernal's fire pools and outranging Hiath's flame AOE) I know interrupting is not exclusive to tanks, but they're the best equipped to do it, given their melee range and their 1H/S passive. But given how everything dies so quickly, the tank has no chance to do most of this before the encounter is over. And I'm not surprised that the DPS who just finished pulling off his awesome rotation is annoyed that while he does all the work, he gets the same reward as the guy who was "taunting and holding block" the entire fight.

Please ZOS, this change isn't good for the future of tanking. I'm all for making combat more interesting, but I don't think this is the way to do it.

yodased · August 2015

AbraXuSeXile wrote: »

this is rock paper scissors lizard spock yoda bin telephone ukelele.

Well, we all know exactly who wins that game every time, it's not even fair to be honest.

Etharian · August 2015

LazyLewis wrote: »

Playing this game in every class and every style since day 1 I will go down on paper and say getting rid of Stam Regen while blocking will destroy this game and is the biggest nerf this game has ever faced. PvE and PvP both. Look at all the forums posts, look at everything everyone has being say since PTS was released. Please please don't do this.

LOL looka t the posts? like it or not... you guys are the minority. trying to spam post about stam regen.

You are what? 10 ppl here posting? there are what? thousands of ppl that do not even come here that would probably disagree with you.

So yes ZOS stand your ground, stick with your changes!

Stalwart385 · August 2015

Dracane wrote: »

Stalwart385 wrote: »

cjthibs wrote: »

Anyone else realize those complaining only use hyperbole to justify their position?

The only folks putting out any calm rational arguments are in favor of the change. Pretty telling.

False. People who agree never use reasoning. It's always "this is the best" or "I love this change ZoS". Which tells me they are PvP burst builds that rather not state why. My comment above yours is example of giving reasoning without hyperbole. There are many, many well laid out reasons why this change was poorly done.

I beg to differ. Many of us have pve tank builds and frequently tank in dungeons or trials.
We want more tactical gameplay, which Zenimax gave to us with this change. Many things in the game are usefull now and having more diversity can't be unhealthy for a game.

Many things are useless now also, like stamina regeneration. Not sure how this leads to build diversity when there are very specific ways to bypass the nerf, for when perma block is necessary. Any build using stamina regeneration is now out of the question. Any build used now could have been used before. That means there are less viable builds. I don't find it more tactical at all just more micromanaging and disengaging from the actual fight.

Stalwart385 · August 2015

Etharian wrote: »

LazyLewis wrote: »

Playing this game in every class and every style since day 1 I will go down on paper and say getting rid of Stam Regen while blocking will destroy this game and is the biggest nerf this game has ever faced. PvE and PvP both. Look at all the forums posts, look at everything everyone has being say since PTS was released. Please please don't do this.

LOL looka t the posts? like it or not... you guys are the minority. trying to spam post about stam regen.

You are what? 10 ppl here posting? there are what? thousands of ppl that do not even come here that would probably disagree with you.

So yes ZOS stand your ground, stick with your changes!

Polls say they are in the majority, at least 2:1.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/206319/poll-no-stamina-recovery-while-blocking

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/202628/poll-stam-regen-on-blocking/p1

Rinmaethodain · August 2015

Etharian wrote: »

LOL looka t the posts? like it or not... you guys are the minority. trying to spam post about stam regen.

You are what? 10 ppl here posting? there are what? thousands of ppl that do not even come here that would probably disagree with you.

So yes ZOS stand your ground, stick with your changes!

LOL look at that post, he is supporting 0 stamina regen while blocking and doesent bother to bring any logical argument to support why he advocates for this change. Trying to spam post and give ZOS false feedback.

There are what? thousands of ppl that do not even come here that would probably agree with us and voice up against "0 stamina regen while blocking"

Oh look, another "one of 10 people posting" on the "0 stamina regen while blocking" posted on my personal wall, one of many voices supporting anti-stamina-ubernerf movement that i get trought different communication channels:

"You should talk to Eric Wrobel or something about the whole "no stam regen while blocking", your comment on the "This is why no-stam regen while blocking REALLY screws you over" post was everything I (and lots of other tanks) thought about (and way more) when I (/ we) heard of that "no stam regen while blocking", that post really showed everyone the pain of being a tank in the next update, with randoms, in pvp etc......"

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2098392/#Comment_2098392

Dracane · August 2015

OLIVI3R wrote: »

Pretty happy with the change huh?

You were happy with buffing altmer and Bosmer too before Sypher and others said it's ridiculous.

I guess the fact you are happy about 0 Stam regen is because Deltia has said its okay.

Well, I'm not watching any of these YouTube icons. I prefer figuring out things by myself

I am a roleplayer and an Altmer fan and since this Altmer-Breton thing in Teso has always been a problem, I was happy that they finally buffed Altmer.

Saturn · August 2015

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Couple things:
We understand this is topic that is near and dear to everyone's heart. It will take some adjustment from certain play styles that some of you have grown accustomed to.

We look at feedback from multiple places. (/feedback, /bug, social media, other websites, guild meetings...etc) Not just forum posts.

Like Eric has said a few times, we're pretty happy with the change - there might be some tweaks, but overall this is something we feel is a really good thing for the long term health of the game.

In my opinion the nerf is not that significant, but it does however make non-templar healers useless in PvE as only templars have abilities that restore stamina to other players. Dragonknights have the selfish passive that gives a bit of stamina when using certain skill tree abilities, Nightblades have (another) selfish passive that increases stamina recovery (which is useless now) after using Shadow abilities.

Further, you are making all the tanking sets with "x amount of stamina regen", like with the 3-piece of your new Endurance set. What the nerf does is essentially making stamina regen redundant for tanks and making non-templar healers useless in most PvE situations.

If you look closely at a lot of the forum posts and feedback that people have given you, it is very likely that most people aren't suggesting a full reverse of the nerf, but rather proposing 50% or 25% stamina regen when blocking, this would mean that it wouldn't be utterly essential to have a templar tossing shards and using repentance to keep your stamina up, plus all those stamina regen buffs wouldn't be made redundant.

Lastly, do you developers even play tanks? Have you tried timing blocks on boss fights where the bosses hit for some 30-60k damage when you aren't blocking? If you miss a block you die, if you die as the tank, the boss will lose taunt, run off and kill the entire group in most cases, and the poor tank who missed a block will be blamed by all the other people in the group..

Just take all of this into your considerations please.

Saturn · August 2015

Dracane wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Couple things:
We understand this is topic that is near and dear to everyone's heart. It will take some adjustment from certain play styles that some of you have grown accustomed to.

We look at feedback from multiple places. (/feedback, /bug, social media, other websites, guild meetings...etc) Not just forum posts.

Like Eric has said a few times, we're pretty happy with the change - there might be some tweaks, but overall this is something we feel is a really good thing for the long term health of the game.

It is indeed healthy for the game. Nobody expects everyone to be fine with this change and everyone has to adjust his/her playstyle to adapt to this change. But it is not impossible.
There are great tools, snyergies, sets and abilities that players can use, that weren't used that much until now. This is a direct buff for many things in the game. Just like the Bolt Escape and roll dodge change was a rather indirect buff for some abilities.

You guys also introduced an interesting set together with this change, the Black Rose set which sounds incredibly strong and should support blocking. I even think, with all the available tools together, permablocking can still be possible, it only requires more sacrifises.

@KerinKor They don't need to justify this change, as it is obvious why they had to make this change.

The black rose set is useless, but I can tank fine in my current Live setup. Shieldplay jewellery enchants help a lot. Tanking groups without a templar to give you shards or repentance is rather bothersome, and I am playing a Dragonknight that gets resources back when dropping an ultimate, poor Sorcerer tanks have even less going for them now

WRX · August 2015

MaximusDargus wrote: »

Etharian wrote: »

LOL looka t the posts? like it or not... you guys are the minority. trying to spam post about stam regen.

You are what? 10 ppl here posting? there are what? thousands of ppl that do not even come here that would probably disagree with you.

So yes ZOS stand your ground, stick with your changes!

LOL look at that post, he is supporting 0 stamina regen while blocking and doesent bother to bring any logical argument to support why he advocates for this change. Trying to spam post and give ZOS false feedback.

There are what? thousands of ppl that do not even come here that would probably agree with us and voice up against "0 stamina regen while blocking"

Oh look, another "one of 10 people posting" on the "0 stamina regen while blocking" posted on my personal wall, one of many voices supporting anti-stamina-ubernerf movement that i get trought different communication channels:

"You should talk to Eric Wrobel or something about the whole "no stam regen while blocking", your comment on the "This is why no-stam regen while blocking REALLY screws you over" post was everything I (and lots of other tanks) thought about (and way more) when I (/ we) heard of that "no stam regen while blocking", that post really showed everyone the pain of being a tank in the next update, with randoms, in pvp etc......"

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2098392/#Comment_2098392

It does not screw tanks over. I am a horrid PvE player and can tank fine. How do you explain many players making the slight adjustments and playing completely fine, mean while requiring a level of skill now also?

It shouldn't be so easy.

Saturn · August 2015

SkylarkAU wrote: »

I have a build in the works that can solo tank sweepers without blocking at all.. PvE tanking is set for a renaissance !

Sounds interesting, but it probably only works on certain sweepers I would imagine, the ones with healing shields would be impossible to kill unless you had an insane burst and I can't imagine being able to be a damage sponge to take some of their 20-40k hits while being able to kill them would be possible. The sweepers that only heal when killing players and have all their attacks as predictable ground AoEs are quite easy to solo or two man though.

bowmanz607 · August 2015

IMO i love the change. Just want devs to know that not everyone hates the change.

CP5 · August 2015

Bashev wrote: »

Darlgon wrote: »

I have a question for those who have tested it. Frankly, its on my list to test, but I don't seem to have time to really find out. Plus I have an Argonian DK, so I have lots of OTHER PASSIVES that will still regen sta. (along with Bosmer, Kajiit, Redguard and others with racials that I dont know.. yet.)

Is it.. hold block and the passive Sta regen stops?

or

Hold block and still regen, but get hit while holding block and the Sta regen stops?

Did anyone notice?

When you hold block stamina stops. Release block and after 2 seconds you receive stamina regen tick. Ig you hold block 5 seconds release for 1 hold for 1 release for 1 hold for 1 release for 1 you wont receive any stamina regen ticks.

This is my real problem. Want to block an attack someone is spamming that'll hard cc you if you don't? (hint WB) Well I hope you don't mind having no stamina regen as they'll cast it more than once every 2s. Want to bash a target to stop them from casting? All they need to do is keep trying and eventually you'll spend all your stamina bashing and have none regenerating. It discourages the kind of play ZOS seems to want since any moment you block you are denying yourself stamina for so long. And as of now I don't feel heavy attacks are a competent solution. @ZOS_RichLambert, I get you don't want people to hide behind a shield at all times, but as of now tanks aren't that widely regarded of a thing and this change will not only make them less appealing, but it will also hurt the game if you want it to remain more reactionary (ie, See someone attacking, block only that one attack = no regen).

WRX · August 2015

CP5 wrote: »

Bashev wrote: »

Darlgon wrote: »

I have a question for those who have tested it. Frankly, its on my list to test, but I don't seem to have time to really find out. Plus I have an Argonian DK, so I have lots of OTHER PASSIVES that will still regen sta. (along with Bosmer, Kajiit, Redguard and others with racials that I dont know.. yet.)

Is it.. hold block and the passive Sta regen stops?

or

Hold block and still regen, but get hit while holding block and the Sta regen stops?

Did anyone notice?

When you hold block stamina stops. Release block and after 2 seconds you receive stamina regen tick. Ig you hold block 5 seconds release for 1 hold for 1 release for 1 hold for 1 release for 1 you wont receive any stamina regen ticks.

This is my real problem. Want to block an attack someone is spamming that'll hard cc you if you don't? (hint WB) Well I hope you don't mind having no stamina regen as they'll cast it more than once every 2s. Want to bash a target to stop them from casting? All they need to do is keep trying and eventually you'll spend all your stamina bashing and have none regenerating. It discourages the kind of play ZOS seems to want since any moment you block you are denying yourself stamina for so long. And as of now I don't feel heavy attacks are a competent solution. @ZOS_RichLambert, I get you don't want people to hide behind a shield at all times, but as of now tanks aren't that widely regarded of a thing and this change will not only make them less appealing, but it will also hurt the game if you want it to remain more reactionary (ie, See someone attacking, block only that one attack = no regen).

Every class has multiple CC abilities. If they want to spam WB, then CC them.

CP5 · August 2015

WRX wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

Bashev wrote: »

Darlgon wrote: »

I have a question for those who have tested it. Frankly, its on my list to test, but I don't seem to have time to really find out. Plus I have an Argonian DK, so I have lots of OTHER PASSIVES that will still regen sta. (along with Bosmer, Kajiit, Redguard and others with racials that I dont know.. yet.)

Is it.. hold block and the passive Sta regen stops?

or

Hold block and still regen, but get hit while holding block and the Sta regen stops?

Did anyone notice?

When you hold block stamina stops. Release block and after 2 seconds you receive stamina regen tick. Ig you hold block 5 seconds release for 1 hold for 1 release for 1 hold for 1 release for 1 you wont receive any stamina regen ticks.

This is my real problem. Want to block an attack someone is spamming that'll hard cc you if you don't? (hint WB) Well I hope you don't mind having no stamina regen as they'll cast it more than once every 2s. Want to bash a target to stop them from casting? All they need to do is keep trying and eventually you'll spend all your stamina bashing and have none regenerating. It discourages the kind of play ZOS seems to want since any moment you block you are denying yourself stamina for so long. And as of now I don't feel heavy attacks are a competent solution. @ZOS_RichLambert, I get you don't want people to hide behind a shield at all times, but as of now tanks aren't that widely regarded of a thing and this change will not only make them less appealing, but it will also hurt the game if you want it to remain more reactionary (ie, See someone attacking, block only that one attack = no regen).

Every class has multiple CC abilities. If they want to spam WB, then CC them.

Hard cc, with one quick break? They will be down some stamina breaking out but they still regen while attacking but if they put you on the defense once every 2s then you get no stamina. Just a point I want them to address.

Personofsecrets · August 2015

GhostShadows wrote: »

Personofsecrets wrote: »

GhostShadows wrote: »

i tested it on pts, i spent the 5k crowns they give on pts all in the 3 pots, and spent all the pots in 3 days, i must say working like intended!!!

And which way is that?

make u spent much more potions than wat u can craft, purely financial change.
i m subed Yet, and i get 1500 crowns for it, but if i will need spent 5k to be competitive on pvp, they expect i spent crown packs.

You know what, I think with Eric's clueless comment, that players will have to use more stamina potions now, that you could be on to something.

Personofsecrets · August 2015

@ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_MattFiror

If the nerf makes tanking more fun, then why don't we feel that way? Why have we pointed out the reasons that it makes tanking less fun?

If the nerf makes tanking more interactive, then why don't we feel that way? Why have we pointed out the reasons that it makes tanking less interactive?

If you developers are happy with the change, then why don't many of us tanks feel that way? Why are you happy with something that many players are not happy with?

If you developers are open to feedback and the nerf isn't set in stone, then why will you, at most, only be making minor adjustments to the nerf? Why are any of us here giving feedback to you at all?

Rescorla_ESO · August 2015

yodased wrote: »

AbraXuSeXile wrote: »

this is rock paper scissors lizard spock yoda bin telephone ukelele.

Well, we all know exactly who wins that game every time, it's not even fair to be honest.

You never know. Will the Force protect Yoda against Spock's shoulder pinch?

Baphomet · August 2015

You can roll-cast, you can animation cancel and you can charge attacks while channeling - they need to get rid of that too before they start nerfing block-casting. And that doesn't need a nerf to begin with - period.