Rescorla_ESO wrote: »ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »Couple things:
- We understand this is topic that is near and dear to everyone's heart. It will take some adjustment from certain play styles that some of you have grown accustomed to.
- We look at feedback from multiple places. (/feedback, /bug, social media, other websites, guild meetings...etc) Not just forum posts.
- Like Eric has said a few times, we're pretty happy with the change - there might be some tweaks, but overall this is something we feel is a really good thing for the long term health of the game.
If you guys were genuinely concerned with the "long term health of the game," you would have sunk whatever resources were and are necessary to fix the abysmal performance in Cyrodiil.
You may want to reread the patch notes. How many complaints have you read from PTS players that lag is still bad?
I've lost count of the number of MMOs I've played since EQ1 that have made major changes like this for the betterment of the game. The skilled players always find a way to adapt to the changes and still do well.
This sub forum is literally littered with posts RE: poor performance, crashing, etc. on the PTS. I don't know what game you're playing, but it isn't this one.
Also, I didn't even comment on the stam issue. As far as I'm concerned, as long as large fights at near unplayable at peak hours, it really doesn't matter what our skills are supposed to do because they won't actually do it.
I can give you some. I do a lot of higher end content, both PVP and PVE. I run with some really good crews. And almost all the tanks just sit there, shields up, taunting, doing NOTHING else. There's no dynamic, there's no challenge. When I used to tank it was the same. It got boring, and boring REALLY fast. Hold shield, spam buffs, taunt and just... stand there. Avoid the AOEs, but otherwise, there was no reason to even move unless I lost aggro or was particular dungeon bosses.How about providing some well-argued justification for that assertion, rather than ZOS' usual dictatorial "we say it so it must be true" type of thing?
I can give you some. I do a lot of higher end content, both PVP and PVE. I run with some really good crews. And almost all the tanks just sit there, shields up, taunting, doing NOTHING else. There's no dynamic, there's no challenge. When I used to tank it was the same. It got boring, and boring REALLY fast. Hold shield, spam buffs, taunt and just... stand there. Avoid the AOEs, but otherwise, there was no reason to even move unless I lost aggro or was particular dungeon bosses.How about providing some well-argued justification for that assertion, rather than ZOS' usual dictatorial "we say it so it must be true" type of thing?
People have been moaning and whining for months that the game is too easy. TOO EASY! And ZOS finally stepped up and said "Hey, we're doing something about it!".They're balancing out mega-damage builds and making it so tanks have to do something other than right-click.
They listened to feedback. They changed and improved the game to be more dynamic. I WAS against the change at first, but I came to terms with it and it's not as bad as I dreaded it to be. It makes tanks actually have to play the game, and that's NOT a bad thing.
Personofsecrets wrote: »
I think it's fairly obvious. It forces tanks to actually be a part of the game instead of taping down RMB. It forces them to solve how they will return their resources.
Just a side story of where I've seen a similar mechanic change. I remember when DC Universe Online implemented PvP counter mechanics where bosses could break your block, knock you down and do massive damage if you were blocking at the wrong time or too long. Before that change tanks would spend more than 90% of the time in raids just holding block for the exact same reasons tanks hold block in ESO. It was grab aggro->block. Rinse and repeat. This new change encourages active gameplay or clever use of game mechanics to overcome. There's certainly nothing wrong with that but people complained like it was the end of the world. Same story here. You'll get over it eventually or you'll just stop playing the game because it was too hard for you.
Love this change. A++
GhostShadows wrote: »i tested it on pts, i spent the 5k crowns they give on pts all in the 3 pots, and spent all the pots in 3 days, i must say working like intended!!!
ZoS please make a change after casting a magicka skill next 4 seconds you dont regen magicka.
Seriously how do you things like AA HM or HR HM will go if your tank ran out of stam???
I agree that most Vet pledge wont be a big problem but there are such thing as VDSA last boss or hard mode trials. Try to tank em before saying l2p.
Personofsecrets wrote: »GhostShadows wrote: »i tested it on pts, i spent the 5k crowns they give on pts all in the 3 pots, and spent all the pots in 3 days, i must say working like intended!!!
And which way is that?
ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »Couple things:
- We understand this is topic that is near and dear to everyone's heart. It will take some adjustment from certain play styles that some of you have grown accustomed to.
- We look at feedback from multiple places. (/feedback, /bug, social media, other websites, guild meetings...etc) Not just forum posts.
- Like Eric has said a few times, we're pretty happy with the change - there might be some tweaks, but overall this is something we feel is a really good thing for the long term health of the game.
AbraXuSeXile wrote: »this is rock paper scissors lizard spock yoda bin telephone ukelele.
Playing this game in every class and every style since day 1 I will go down on paper and say getting rid of Stam Regen while blocking will destroy this game and is the biggest nerf this game has ever faced. PvE and PvP both. Look at all the forums posts, look at everything everyone has being say since PTS was released. Please please don't do this.
Stalwart385 wrote: »Anyone else realize those complaining only use hyperbole to justify their position?
The only folks putting out any calm rational arguments are in favor of the change. Pretty telling.
False. People who agree never use reasoning. It's always "this is the best" or "I love this change ZoS". Which tells me they are PvP burst builds that rather not state why. My comment above yours is example of giving reasoning without hyperbole. There are many, many well laid out reasons why this change was poorly done.
I beg to differ. Many of us have pve tank builds and frequently tank in dungeons or trials.
We want more tactical gameplay, which Zenimax gave to us with this change. Many things in the game are usefull now and having more diversity can't be unhealthy for a game.
Playing this game in every class and every style since day 1 I will go down on paper and say getting rid of Stam Regen while blocking will destroy this game and is the biggest nerf this game has ever faced. PvE and PvP both. Look at all the forums posts, look at everything everyone has being say since PTS was released. Please please don't do this.
LOL looka t the posts? like it or not... you guys are the minority. trying to spam post about stam regen.
You are what? 10 ppl here posting? there are what? thousands of ppl that do not even come here that would probably disagree with you.
So yes ZOS stand your ground, stick with your changes!
LOL looka t the posts? like it or not... you guys are the minority. trying to spam post about stam regen.
You are what? 10 ppl here posting? there are what? thousands of ppl that do not even come here that would probably disagree with you.
So yes ZOS stand your ground, stick with your changes!
Pretty happy with the change huh?
You were happy with buffing altmer and Bosmer too before Sypher and others said it's ridiculous.
I guess the fact you are happy about 0 Stam regen is because Deltia has said its okay.
ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »Couple things:
- We understand this is topic that is near and dear to everyone's heart. It will take some adjustment from certain play styles that some of you have grown accustomed to.
- We look at feedback from multiple places. (/feedback, /bug, social media, other websites, guild meetings...etc) Not just forum posts.
- Like Eric has said a few times, we're pretty happy with the change - there might be some tweaks, but overall this is something we feel is a really good thing for the long term health of the game.
ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »Couple things:
- We understand this is topic that is near and dear to everyone's heart. It will take some adjustment from certain play styles that some of you have grown accustomed to.
- We look at feedback from multiple places. (/feedback, /bug, social media, other websites, guild meetings...etc) Not just forum posts.
- Like Eric has said a few times, we're pretty happy with the change - there might be some tweaks, but overall this is something we feel is a really good thing for the long term health of the game.
It is indeed healthy for the game. Nobody expects everyone to be fine with this change and everyone has to adjust his/her playstyle to adapt to this change. But it is not impossible.
There are great tools, snyergies, sets and abilities that players can use, that weren't used that much until now. This is a direct buff for many things in the game. Just like the Bolt Escape and roll dodge change was a rather indirect buff for some abilities.
You guys also introduced an interesting set together with this change, the Black Rose set which sounds incredibly strong and should support blocking. I even think, with all the available tools together, permablocking can still be possible, it only requires more sacrifises.
@KerinKor They don't need to justify this change, as it is obvious why they had to make this change.
MaximusDargus wrote: »
LOL looka t the posts? like it or not... you guys are the minority. trying to spam post about stam regen.
You are what? 10 ppl here posting? there are what? thousands of ppl that do not even come here that would probably disagree with you.
So yes ZOS stand your ground, stick with your changes!
LOL look at that post, he is supporting 0 stamina regen while blocking and doesent bother to bring any logical argument to support why he advocates for this change. Trying to spam post and give ZOS false feedback.
There are what? thousands of ppl that do not even come here that would probably agree with us and voice up against "0 stamina regen while blocking"
Oh look, another "one of 10 people posting" on the "0 stamina regen while blocking" posted on my personal wall, one of many voices supporting anti-stamina-ubernerf movement that i get trought different communication channels:
"You should talk to Eric Wrobel or something about the whole "no stam regen while blocking", your comment on the "This is why no-stam regen while blocking REALLY screws you over" post was everything I (and lots of other tanks) thought about (and way more) when I (/ we) heard of that "no stam regen while blocking", that post really showed everyone the pain of being a tank in the next update, with randoms, in pvp etc......"
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2098392/#Comment_2098392
I have a build in the works that can solo tank sweepers without blocking at all.. PvE tanking is set for a renaissance !
When you hold block stamina stops. Release block and after 2 seconds you receive stamina regen tick. Ig you hold block 5 seconds release for 1 hold for 1 release for 1 hold for 1 release for 1 you wont receive any stamina regen ticks.I have a question for those who have tested it. Frankly, its on my list to test, but I don't seem to have time to really find out. Plus I have an Argonian DK, so I have lots of OTHER PASSIVES that will still regen sta. (along with Bosmer, Kajiit, Redguard and others with racials that I dont know.. yet.)
Is it.. hold block and the passive Sta regen stops?
or
Hold block and still regen, but get hit while holding block and the Sta regen stops?
Did anyone notice?
When you hold block stamina stops. Release block and after 2 seconds you receive stamina regen tick. Ig you hold block 5 seconds release for 1 hold for 1 release for 1 hold for 1 release for 1 you wont receive any stamina regen ticks.I have a question for those who have tested it. Frankly, its on my list to test, but I don't seem to have time to really find out. Plus I have an Argonian DK, so I have lots of OTHER PASSIVES that will still regen sta. (along with Bosmer, Kajiit, Redguard and others with racials that I dont know.. yet.)
Is it.. hold block and the passive Sta regen stops?
or
Hold block and still regen, but get hit while holding block and the Sta regen stops?
Did anyone notice?
This is my real problem. Want to block an attack someone is spamming that'll hard cc you if you don't? (hint WB) Well I hope you don't mind having no stamina regen as they'll cast it more than once every 2s. Want to bash a target to stop them from casting? All they need to do is keep trying and eventually you'll spend all your stamina bashing and have none regenerating. It discourages the kind of play ZOS seems to want since any moment you block you are denying yourself stamina for so long. And as of now I don't feel heavy attacks are a competent solution. @ZOS_RichLambert, I get you don't want people to hide behind a shield at all times, but as of now tanks aren't that widely regarded of a thing and this change will not only make them less appealing, but it will also hurt the game if you want it to remain more reactionary (ie, See someone attacking, block only that one attack = no regen).
When you hold block stamina stops. Release block and after 2 seconds you receive stamina regen tick. Ig you hold block 5 seconds release for 1 hold for 1 release for 1 hold for 1 release for 1 you wont receive any stamina regen ticks.I have a question for those who have tested it. Frankly, its on my list to test, but I don't seem to have time to really find out. Plus I have an Argonian DK, so I have lots of OTHER PASSIVES that will still regen sta. (along with Bosmer, Kajiit, Redguard and others with racials that I dont know.. yet.)
Is it.. hold block and the passive Sta regen stops?
or
Hold block and still regen, but get hit while holding block and the Sta regen stops?
Did anyone notice?
This is my real problem. Want to block an attack someone is spamming that'll hard cc you if you don't? (hint WB) Well I hope you don't mind having no stamina regen as they'll cast it more than once every 2s. Want to bash a target to stop them from casting? All they need to do is keep trying and eventually you'll spend all your stamina bashing and have none regenerating. It discourages the kind of play ZOS seems to want since any moment you block you are denying yourself stamina for so long. And as of now I don't feel heavy attacks are a competent solution. @ZOS_RichLambert, I get you don't want people to hide behind a shield at all times, but as of now tanks aren't that widely regarded of a thing and this change will not only make them less appealing, but it will also hurt the game if you want it to remain more reactionary (ie, See someone attacking, block only that one attack = no regen).
Every class has multiple CC abilities. If they want to spam WB, then CC them.
GhostShadows wrote: »Personofsecrets wrote: »GhostShadows wrote: »i tested it on pts, i spent the 5k crowns they give on pts all in the 3 pots, and spent all the pots in 3 days, i must say working like intended!!!
And which way is that?
make u spent much more potions than wat u can craft, purely financial change.
i m subed Yet, and i get 1500 crowns for it, but if i will need spent 5k to be competitive on pvp, they expect i spent crown packs.
GhostShadows wrote: »Personofsecrets wrote: »GhostShadows wrote: »i tested it on pts, i spent the 5k crowns they give on pts all in the 3 pots, and spent all the pots in 3 days, i must say working like intended!!!
And which way is that?
make u spent much more potions than wat u can craft, purely financial change.
i m subed Yet, and i get 1500 crowns for it, but if i will need spent 5k to be competitive on pvp, they expect i spent crown packs.
AbraXuSeXile wrote: »this is rock paper scissors lizard spock yoda bin telephone ukelele.
Well, we all know exactly who wins that game every time, it's not even fair to be honest.