Eclipse is a completely broken skill, Let me Count the Ways...

dodgehopper_ESO · August 2015

If I didn't think of one, and you know more please feel free to add to the list. The big question I have is why would anyone ever use this skill when it is in such a sorry state.

1. This skill is a debuff, but is treated as a crowd control. Because of this it actually helps give players cc immunity rather than be the debuff it is meant to be.
2. This skill rarely allows you to target the difficult enemies, in other words the ones it would actually be useful on (NPC bosses, minibosses, and toughs).
3. Despite being clearly designed as a counter to defensive posture and dragon scales, this skill ironically causes Dragon Knights to be STRONGER when they have their reflect up. Yes this is correct, if you eclipse a dragon scaled DK you buff his speed x1000. Does this make sense to anyone?
4. Despite being part of the 'Dps skill line' for Templars, this skill does no actual dps, and actually slows your dps down because you have to fight to get a target you can actually hit with it.

ZOS in your list of powers that need reworking, you seriously need to look at this power. It has been broken for a year, and it actually seems like it is getting worse. It is terrible in pvp and pve. It serves no real purpose because it doesn't even work for the purpose it is served. If it had a damage component FIRST and this secondary effect secondarily it might have some role. This power has gotten worse rather than better since release. Please for goodness sake fix it.

dodgehopper_ESO · August 2015

I had another thought how this skill could be useful. Make it an AoE and possibly also a mild cc. Then and only then might it actually have some use. The fact that it is treated like a CC makes me think that perhaps it SHOULD be one. This skill needs to stop pretending to be something it is not.

yodased · August 2015

Eclipse has its limited uses.

Against players that don't know the skill it is quite effective.

1v1 against casters will annoy them and break their rotations.

Mostly it is broken though, yes.

Imdrefan · August 2015

Come PvP with me and I'll show you it's uses. *evilgrin*

dodgehopper_ESO · August 2015

Imdrefan wrote: »

Come PvP with me and I'll show you it's uses. *evilgrin*

Sure, let me bring my DK so you can buff me with a speed buff.

failkiwib16_ESO · August 2015

Honestly I just slot it for fun and giggles, it's not completely useless it is just irrelevant. I slot it in Vet CoA against atronach adds and in cyrodiil to see people gank themselves.... I join groups as a healer, so I can't be blamed for slotting skills that "support" can I ? xD

Emma_Overload · August 2015

I was SO disappointed when I found out Eclipse didn't work on bosses... what is the point?

lolo_01b16_ESO · August 2015

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

The big question I have is why would anyone ever use this skill when it is in such a sorry state.

It's good for killing stamina nb, since they often don't break it and their ultimates soul harvest and soul tether both get reflected be it.

Isbilen · August 2015

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

Imdrefan wrote: »

Come PvP with me and I'll show you it's uses. *evilgrin*

Sure, let me bring my DK so you can buff me with a speed buff.

You act like the movement speed bug is a good thing for the DK, but most often it's just 30K+ fall damage.

Azurulia · August 2015

I'm not one to generally say this, but in this particular instance...

OP? Yeah. He mad.

themdogesbite · August 2015

Eclipse is broken in a totaly wonderfull way really. Is there something it completly isnt bugging out?

Kaspar · August 2015

The Unstable Core morph does base ~1800 damage to nearby enemies so it's fun in Cyrodiil when there's a bunch up of enemy players... it synergizes in a chain reaction. Pop corn anyone? It's a bit aggravating that it won't cast all the time though it's great when you see a Sorcerer explode himself.

Paradox · August 2015

It is a CC... It's the same as negate in almost every conceivable way.

Joy_Division · August 2015

It's so good ZoS nerfed it. In 2.1, only one eclipse can be active.

That was sarcasm, in case it wasn't clear.

dodgehopper_ESO · August 2015

Kaspar wrote: »

The Unstable Core morph does base ~1800 damage to nearby enemies so it's fun in Cyrodiil when there's a bunch up of enemy players... it synergizes in a chain reaction. Pop corn anyone? It's a bit aggravating that it won't cast all the time though it's great when you see a Sorcerer explode himself.

That might be true as a heavily specified mage build but with cc immunity such as it is, you must admit that it takes heroic effort in a cyrodiil battle to actually fire it off.

I'm revisiting this old topic I've posted about because nothing actually has been done about this ability at all. I'm bringing this topic back to light for this reason.

Nallenil · August 2015

Eclipse: All ranks of Eclipse now have the area of effect time bomb from Unstable Core. More than one caster can apply time bombs, so two casters could each apply a time bomb.

tinythinker · August 2015

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

If I didn't think of one, and you know more please feel free to add to the list. The big question I have is why would anyone ever use this skill when it is in such a sorry state.

1. This skill is a debuff, but is treated as a crowd control. Because of this it actually helps give players cc immunity rather than be the debuff it is meant to be.
2. This skill rarely allows you to target the difficult enemies, in other words the ones it would actually be useful on (NPC bosses, minibosses, and toughs).
3. Despite being clearly designed as a counter to defensive posture and dragon scales, this skill ironically causes Dragon Knights to be STRONGER when they have their reflect up. Yes this is correct, if you eclipse a dragon scaled DK you buff his speed x1000. Does this make sense to anyone?
4. Despite being part of the 'Dps skill line' for Templars, this skill does no actual dps, and actually slows your dps down because you have to fight to get a target you can actually hit with it.

ZOS in your list of powers that need reworking, you seriously need to look at this power. It has been broken for a year, and it actually seems like it is getting worse. It is terrible in pvp and pve. It serves no real purpose because it doesn't even work for the purpose it is served. If it had a damage component FIRST and this secondary effect secondarily it might have some role. This power has gotten worse rather than better since release. Please for goodness sake fix it.

Sounds like #3 is a bug, but there are suggestions on the table for fixing the ability in general if ZOS decides it wants to do so. One of my suggestions for modest changes to improve templars includes this fun item:

Reclassify Eclipse and its morphs as non-CC abilities that cannot be removed by Break Free. They could still be cleansed/purged.

This would make it much more useful in PvP. Would be even better if it *couldn't* be cleanse/purged but I think just getting it as non-CC would be hard enough to sell to ZOS.

ZOS_Julien · August 2015

Thread moved in Combat section.

dodgehopper_ESO · August 2015

Nallenil wrote: »

Eclipse: All ranks of Eclipse now have the area of effect time bomb from Unstable Core. More than one caster can apply time bombs, so two casters could each apply a time bomb.

I'm actually aware of this change, but it doesn't solve the issue that most enemies are CC immune and therefore Eclipse Immune. In the time it takes to actually target someone (or an npc) with this ability, you could have just actually done real dps or real debuffing (dark flare for instance). This is the fatal flaw with this skill. Additionally, this skill can be CC Broken and Purged, which is absolutely ridiculous. At least with purge it forces a decision on the part of a player/team whether they keep purges going. Its a fair counter but its not a free get out of jail cc immunity. As someone stated earlier yes it is a glitch/bug with the DK speed boost. My point is that even excluding this glitch/bug issue the skill is and has always been utterly broken. Its a great idea that's never worked and when you compare it to reflective scales there is no comparison which power is exponentially better. The thing that really annoys me about this is that Eclipse was clearly designed as a counter to Scales & Defensive Posture. The Dk-Scales-Speed-Bug just made me post about this topic yet again.

Killa4hire89 · August 2015

I personally feel that eclipse would be an awesome skill if they would remove the cc from it. DK reflect doesn't feed cc immunity to their opponent and neither should eclipse or its mprphs. Amazing when used on a sorcs atro though

Kaliki · August 2015

Paradox wrote: »

It is a CC... It's the same as negate in almost every conceivable way.

No its not.

Considering you can only cast it on one player at a time the "C" that stands for Crowd doesn't really seem to fit any more.
Nor does the "C" that stands for Control since players can still run around and cast plenty of abilities even when affected by it.

kungmoo · August 2015

another bug with eclipse you missed.... though its one that affects the target not the caster

if you use a channeled skill while hit with eclipse it will animation lock you when it reflects it back at you
most notable during round 7 of VDSA when you try to use radiant destruction to burn down the boss when he gets below 30% and he casts it on you mid channel... have to roll dodge to be able to do anything at that point.. if your skill doesn't kill you first