Motifs and Ring of Mara are in the Crown Shop!!!

P3ZZL3 · April 2015

@Iluvrien To be fair, I don;t think it will effect the prices of the motifs to much. The vast majority will not want to give ZoS cash, so will get the in game gold to do it. I mean, 25k for either the elf or barbarian or primal isn't really a lot.

Leonguide · April 2015

P3ZZL3 wrote: »

@Zargorius @Leonguide lol - it's not so much the unique element in all honesty. Anyone can farm the damn things. It's more that I was under the impression that finding these items, searching for them, etc was a strong part of the game. The adventure element of it (not just the scripted quests) *shrugs* When you're referring to things like the Purple Motif books, or even the rarest of drops like the Dwemer Book, just feels like a cop out by sticking them in the crown store is all.

I'm fairly sure Nirncrux will be in the store soon and it's easier to buy it than farm it. And as far as I know most people want the drop items for their gear rather than Nirn produced items?

Just my 2 cents.

If it's not the unique element then why does it matter that someone else got it easier? You found it! On your own! In a sack inside a barn! Be proud damn it!

Zargorius · April 2015

P3ZZL3 wrote: »

@Zargorius @Leonguide lol - it's not so much the unique element in all honesty. Anyone can farm the damn things. It's more that I was under the impression that finding these items, searching for them, etc was a strong part of the game. The adventure element of it (not just the scripted quests) *shrugs* When you're referring to things like the Purple Motif books, or even the rarest of drops like the Dwemer Book, just feels like a cop out by sticking them in the crown store is all.

I'm fairly sure Nirncrux will be in the store soon and it's easier to buy it than farm it. And as far as I know most people want the drop items for their gear rather than Nirn produced items?

Just my 2 cents.

Mah, for me searching for motif's has always been a random log-on/log-off game, no joy to be found there. Fortunately my first crafting char started right at the beginning so he had all motifs already thanks to the good drop % that we used to have. I was conteplating getting Daedric but looking for it is pointless due to RNG and getting ripped off by some "entrepreneur" on the market does not appeal to me. Now instead of grinding for it(that takes precious time) or grinding for gold to buy it (that takes precious time) I can instead convert my hard won cash and spend the time in actually enjoying the game. Not everyone has 8 hours a day to dedicate to ESO, all this is very convenient and I hope the XP Pots will hit the store soon as well.

P3ZZL3 · April 2015

@Zargorius Each to their own I guess. And I'm in my 40's holding down a 60hr week my friend as an average. So not exactly an 8hr a day type

Zargorius · April 2015

P3ZZL3 wrote: »

@Zargorius Each to their own I guess. And I'm in my 40's holding down a 60hr week my friend as an average. So not exactly an 8hr a day type

Thing is, ZOS needs to make money somehow. The B2P/F2P model with in-game store is what works as to date. It's here to stay, it is a model that works. The player perception is changing as well, the market is shifting. I understand people's resistance to it, unfortunately there have been some less than optimal implementation of it however the IAP model will become more and more present. Important part is to make the companies understand that they need to make us have fun so we will give them money and not force us to give them money in order to have fun.

P3ZZL3 · April 2015

@Zargorius Oh I do understand the model. It's one of the reasons I've never got into MMO's - or at least one of the main reasons. I was convinced this would be a good move from a friend and to be honest, I've had some very good times over the last 3 mths (signed up in Jan).

I do feel it's the way things have been implemented. It feels very much like a cash grab. There are ways to do things, to transition things. But when focus is very clearly towards to the Cash Shop and not about fixing some of the obvious glaring issues in game play it is cause for concern.

I just honestly don't know how the way these things have been done was signed off from marketing. I mean, it makes no sense. Let's pss off the community and see how that goes. No sane marketing director would sign off on it (and if this is the case mr marketing director and you're sitting there nodding your head - I sympathise).

Anyhows, as with most people, I'll continue playing without subscription and enjoying it but I'll be keeping an eye out for new MMO's - there's a couple of potential interest hitting beta soon.

LameoveR · April 2015

Last day i've done something epic in real life, gotta my 40$ and wanna buy this motif pack.
And i'll look epic now even in game. Deal with it!

Zargorius · April 2015

P3ZZL3 wrote: »

@Zargorius Oh I do understand the model. It's one of the reasons I've never got into MMO's - or at least one of the main reasons. I was convinced this would be a good move from a friend and to be honest, I've had some very good times over the last 3 mths (signed up in Jan).

I do feel it's the way things have been implemented. It feels very much like a cash grab. There are ways to do things, to transition things. But when focus is very clearly towards to the Cash Shop and not about fixing some of the obvious glaring issues in game play it is cause for concern.

I just honestly don't know how the way these things have been done was signed off from marketing. I mean, it makes no sense. Let's pss off the community and see how that goes. No sane marketing director would sign off on it (and if this is the case mr marketing director and you're sitting there nodding your head - I sympathise).

Anyhows, as with most people, I'll continue playing without subscription and enjoying it but I'll be keeping an eye out for new MMO's - there's a couple of potential interest hitting beta soon.

I can tell you my point of view. I started the game on initial release and after the first hype went away, the issues have become glaringly evident. ZOS made rookie mistakes for an MMORPG, it was clear they didn't have experience or think some stuff through properly. The continous bugs, the quest grind and the botswarms forced me out of game after 2 good months.

Since then it's clear they got their stuff together. Lot of things have improved immensely, whoever starts now has no idea how many problems there were.

As for the cash shop, people will see any kind of in-game monetisation as cash-grabs. Truth is, you need to sell where there is demand. Appearance changes, name changes etc.. can only give you so much, it's not the stuf on which people spend their money continously. On the other side, just compare what ZOS is doing with for example Cryptic and their Neverwinter Nights - that is a textbook example of ALL F2P practices glaringly applied to a MMORPG - the best part being that it's still most convenient to buy from gold sellers and not from Cryptic themselves! I hope ESO never goes into that direction, haven't seen anything that points to it so far. If the game stays B2P it still not so bad as they have better customer retention (initial investment - people tend to play longer). If the game goes completely F2P that will cause problems as then ZOS will need to implement special mechanics to make people stay straight away and that means changes to the early game power curve, daily reward mechanics and other stuff.

Keron · April 2015

I sincerely hope that ZOS sees and acknowledges the difference between motifs and materials. The motifs I am honestly not so very much concerned with, because the really time consuming part of crafting is still the research and the continuously required resource is materials.

Let's be honest, most of those willing to shell out almost 35€ (that is the price in EU for 5500 crowns) respectively 13€ (1500 crowns) for the rarer books in the crown store, most probably will have already paid the ingame gold to get them. You buy them once, you have them. Sets like Hundings will still require you to spend a couple months worth of research time. Traits like Nirnhoned will still fund a healthy crafting economy. The upgrade materials will still be the main commodities.

In my humble opinion (just to make sure a certain person gets that I express my opinion only), this rage about the motifs is a "sky is falling" reaction. As long as it doesn't get worse (tempers, nirncrux, etc.), let them milk the whales.

Also, the motifs ARE cosmetic (again, my opinion) in every significant aspect. They do not change the properties of the crafted item. They are not even always visible - I still see a substantial amount of players in PvP who wear costumes just for the sake of not giving away information on their setup (without judging whether this is reasonable or not). More than 90% of the items I'm asked to craft are Daedric. Most don't even realise that heavy Dwemer is 10 times as stylish as Daedric. In the end, you had to shell out 40k gold for the one motif really worth it. Now you have to spend 13€.

EDIT: I admit that my opinion may be biased because I found the last missing motif (imperials) just two days before it was released to the crown store, even 2 of them on the same day (Reaper's March Vet10, one in a random backpack, one in the house area of the public group dungeon, if anyone is interested), one of which I sold for 100k. So the motifs are not on my radar anymore at all.

AngryNord · April 2015

milan.verploegenb16_ESO wrote: »

Spending 250 euros to buying tons of imperial motifs, quickly selling them all for 70-80k (price is probably dropping right now), use the few million gold you earn to buy legendary upgrade materials, v14 gold jewelry, random high lvl rare gear you couldn't afford otherwise.... For those that do not see how this is an indirect version of pay to win, I pity your wits.

At most you can buy one per character you have. And they're bound, so you can't re-sell them.

Dionysusjones · April 2015

Provisioning recipes next? Same concept. This is the problem with being "OK" with one way to buy past RNG drops, it will lead to other things.

P3ZZL3 · April 2015

@AngryNord Pretty sure they are account wide, not character bound.

Although that does bring up the question of drop rates. IF they are selling them, then surely logic would dictate to push customers to the site, then the drop rate will have to be nerfed. In real terms, anyone at v1 could make 30-40k in a day pretty easily. 2 at most. So why spend real cash in the shop. We shall see I guess

fromtesonlineb16_ESO · April 2015

Dionysusjones wrote: »

Provisioning recipes next? Same concept..

Fundamentally different concept.

Motifs - totally a cosmetic thing
Food/Drink - performance enhancers

Faulgor · April 2015

I found it amusing that the (heavily overpriced) common High Elf motif has an image of characters with Ancient Elf medium armor in the Crown Store. It's like a scam within a scam.

But I'm a good guy so I /bugged it.

Islyn · April 2015

jircris11 wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

omgggg p2w confirmed

lol may i ask how this is p2w? still need he style materials and for dwemer they go for 3k a pop...so yea crafters are still spending crap tons of coin.

He was being sarcastic. Also @Nifty2g yeah ya better use /sarcasm from now on *presses lol button*

LameoveR · April 2015

P3ZZL3 wrote: »

@AngryNord Pretty sure they are account wide, not character bound.

I don't know what is not clear in words " All Crafting Motifs are usable by one character on your account"

P3ZZL3 · April 2015

@AngryNord Ahhh - I take it back

Zershar_Vemod · April 2015

Wonder what items they'll completely devalue next?

Let's just kill whatever economy that game has. Remove guild kiosks and just use the crown store for everything...!

Aneima · April 2015

starkerealm wrote: »

Ashtaris wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

Though one has to wonder if they'll be giving a ninja nerf to drop rates . . .

They already did. Drop rates went way down when 1.6 hit. I guess, in retrospect this was the obvious reason for it.

I'm not sure if the dropped rate changed, but certainly the chances of finding motifs changed when they started filling cabinets and other containers with Legerdemain items. I will admit that farming motifs is much harder now. I did so to make some in-game gold and was an enjoyable part of the game. Now farming motifs will be almost as worthless as the equipment crafting writs.

The statistical drop rate probably wasn't changed. But the table was expanded with legerdemain trash. So, before, you were rolling the dice for a motif, a recipe, a random piece of trash gear, or motif stones. Now you're rolling the dice for a motif, recipe, random piece of trash gear, fence trash, clothing, or motif stones. And, fence trash has a fairly high drop rate. So, in the end, the result is the same. This is in combination with the justice system making motif farming more time consuming and... yes, there was a ninja nerf to the drop rates.

Yes I noticed a drop rate as well, then we were hit with this motif crown store news. Now keep in mind the nerf for legendary materials from hirelings.....does that mean legendary mats are coming to the crown store? I'd be willing to say yes they are.

SantieClaws · April 2015

Funny also that there has been so much talk from ZoS about the balance of economy in game. They cite it often as their reasons for not having an AH (though the actual reasons are more probably related to technical limitations on the megaserver).

Why then, if the in game economy is so very important, would they provide an alternative means of obtaining one of the drivers of the economy (rare motifs and the things crafted from them)?

Oh right .. bags o cash!

If it sells they will sell it. Don't assume anything is sacred unless very very specifically tell us otherwise. Even then take that with a pinch of Moon Sugar.

Does it affect the way I play? Not really. I'm mostly a wandering around picking flowers and dancing randomly sort of person. Will it tick off a lot of other people? You betcha!

Edited: For punctuation worthy of a khajiit.

ssfiit · April 2015

I so saw this coming. This whole Pay2Win mindset. This entire thing is made to brainwash players. They said nothing in the store will be made as an item that will give you a gain over others. It's obviously a lie.

Before, you need to work hard to search everything, and it pays off when you finally find a purple motif. You can either use it on your toon, or sell it for like 20k gold. If you want it bad enough, you are gonna buy it or raffle it from your guild. Finding a purple motif is part of the fun of the game. You feel an accomplishment finding a ultra rare item. And feel great cause you can sell it for a good amount if you dont want it.

Now, anyone can just spend $10 or whatever real money an buy 1500 crowns to buy this motif. Its not rare anymore. Again. the Pay2Win mindset.

Here's it all begin. guess what's next. They are going to make it ultra rare as drops. No one is going to get one. Then people will be forced to buy it.

Keron · April 2015

Soon in store:

"Sky Is Falling !!11eleventy"-costume, complete with apocalyptic monk choirs, white flag to wave and lots of tears.

xMovingTarget · April 2015

Keron wrote: »

Soon in store:

"Sky Is Falling !!11eleventy"-costume, complete with apocalyptic monk choirs, white flag to wave and lots of tears.

I would buy that. Sounds interesting.

RainfeatherUK · April 2015

ssfiit wrote: »

I so saw this coming. This whole Pay2Win mindset.

Well you would have to be pretty foolish not to.

The whole premise of dropping subs places income pretty much entirely on the cash-shop. To make that functional they will break almost any promise or moral reasoning to make money. The P2W mindset as you call it, develops because the cash shop only functions when its lucrative/ worth a players time.

Most people buy things for status, or for advantage. Which is why pots that are less useful than in game ones, or mounts dont get very far. People will always take the path of least resistance unless an item becomes 'essential'. Ta da - P2W makes money.

Hence why so many of us were arguing against F2P or B2P in any form. Just hoping CU comes out before ZoS becomes the next Perfect World Entertainment.

wOOOOt_of_SD · April 2015

What happend here ZOS??

You saw that motifs are in big demand and is a big part of the ingame Trading,
and you decided to get a bit of the action?

You meddle with the ingame economy, by taking a well traded ingame product, and offering it for $$.
How can you have such poor judgement?

It has nothing to do with p2w - but it has everything to do with changing the entire ingame economy.

Dont you understand that you have to keep the Crown shop seperated from the playerbased economy to keep the balance.
Also, it just makes you look bad and greedy.

Crown shop should ONLY sell stuff that is cosmetic AND something that does not change the game in any way.

fromtesonlineb16_ESO · April 2015

wOOOOt_of_SD wrote: »

Dont you understand that you have to keep the Crown shop seperated from the playerbased economy to keep the balance..

LOL.

The 'player-based economy' is so broken by the crass guild-based system that it doesn't need defending, it needs to die and hopefully this is the first serious wound.

redsteelb16_ESO · April 2015

My gut reaction is this is NOT good.
Selling Motifs is NOT a convenience item.

Using pressure tactics (Senche-Leopard) and putting items on the store that are the goal for crafters to find while playing the game, specially the Dwemer motif. No longer rare if you can simply buy it, even if it is expensive.

I was all for the B2P .....but between EXP boost coupled with the long grid of the champion system, and now rare items being sold and pressure tactics.....I think I'm quickly losing interest in this game.

I'm shocked at how quickly this game became a cash shop.

LameoveR · April 2015

It's a part of DLC!

Enodoc · April 2015

LameoveR wrote: »

It's a part of DLC!

And now it has been decided that they will offer some of them by themselves.

But this picture-quote is originally with reference to new motifs, not existing ones.

SantieClaws · April 2015

Without the DLC ....