Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

I think sub holders here are making out a lot better then Star Trek Online sub holders.

This is the type of language people use when they realize they are in a bad situation but are trying to rationalize their way out of cognitive dissonance. It's like trying to negotiate with terrorists or an angry wife

Bouvin wrote: »

From Matt Frior on today's reddit AMA.

http://www.reddit.com/r/elderscrollsonline/comments/2tfb48/welcome_to_the_eso_tamriel_unlimited_aua/cnym1sh

We are not going to keep up our 2014 pace of updates in 2015 - and our future update pace will focus more on new adventures and game experiences than system changes. It's time to let the game breathe a little - we've done so many new features so quickly that we want to make sure everyone is on the same page with us. 1.6 alone has a complete rebalancing of most player abilities - we don't want to do that again, for example. Our #1 priority right now is getting Tamriel Unlimited launched on PC, and then focusing on a successful console launch. While we do those things, we have other teams already working on DLC and expect to see that start rolling out at some point after console launch settles down.

..1.6 is going to be the last major update before console launch, for obvious reasons. We will continue to do interim updates as necessary. As Paul said in another thread on this AMA, we're now developing for 4 platforms at once, and it is inherently more complex. We're committed to having content hit all the platforms at roughly the same time, so it will necessarily slow things down a bit.

Lol could they be any more clear what they think about their PC customers ? we will get new playable content in perhaps what august?so all we get is parts of justice system (no sandboxy pvp part) and parts of champion system (veteran ranks will stay for another 6+ month) in like i guess 10 month (1.5 was novemberish or something right?). So no new dungeons no new trials nothing beside bug fixes while we (customers who normally would subscribe) pay $150. My 6month suscribtion "just" lapsed I will have to pay till June or something is this really fair?
The more I think about it the angrier I get how can they stand there smileing in the camera and say we listened to customers ?did we really asked them :"please take our money and prepare the console version with it while you stop updating our game for month and make it b2p for them"?
but well we we had a some nice updates they already had before launch (craglorn) and some nice small but brilliant ideas (great new veteran dungeons and the undaunted dailies) and nobody would argue that they did not try to bring new stuff in till October or so last year. We should have been wiser when they announced that 1.6 would take double the normal time, we should have been wiser when they pushed it back again and we should have been wiser when they never committed to any timeline about what would happen after 1.6.
Am I being to dramatic?

Thread title updated to reflect our answer.

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Razzak wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Razzak wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Razzak wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Razzak wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Razzak wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

There is absolutely no reason to pay the sub after 1.6 comes out until they provide new content.

ZOS have promised ( ) that the shop will only sell baubles and fripperies, so there's no need to have crowns. Just play 1.6, and gain those CP grinding in Craglorn, for free.

New content will come out - they've already developed the content we were promised but was withheld until it went pay to play - but we don't know how much or how regularly, so again it doesn't make sense to permanently sub.

As for when it comes out, well either they stagger PC and console releases (so we can test for them) or PC releases will be delayed until console players need new content, which won't be for a while...

Either way I think it might be a while before we get anything new after 1.6.

And as for 1.7 and the removal of VR... well, don't hold your breath.

Except by your own peculiar brand of logic, the only way they'll be earning money is if they continue to release new content. So why would they hold back on releasing that content?

Cash shop is their main future money making machine. New content is mainly for PR, so they don't lose as many players as they would if they didn't make any.
Except those DLCs that will be coming this year. That was already paid by us.

I'm not sure how you guys work out these financials.

If upcoming content isn't in the game already, your subscription for the past year doesn't entitle you to that content. The same way that if they stayed on the subscription system and you cancelled, you wouldn't be entitled to the new content.

Your sub pays for the months you got it for. That's it. I'm completely bemused by this constant insistence that your money was somehow funneled into secret accounts for secret DLC that you would have totally gotten for "free" later.

Who was talking about secret accounts? You do know this is not some "Da Vinci code", right? There's nothing secret about it. If ESO was not going B2P, 1.6 would already be out, because their entire team would be working on a sub based ESO and not on cash shop and cash shop items while we were under the impression they are trying their hardest to give us new content in 4-6 weeks stages. They kept quiet simply because they didn't want to lose those months of subs.
Looks like we are both bemused. It's just that I am bemused with the fact that you are so short sighted. But, to be fair, it's your right, so ... hidey ***, silver ... and everything else that goes along with your fairytales.

And you have proof that the timeline for 1.6 (something completely unrelated to the payment model change) would have been different?

Of course not. Evidence is so pesky, isn't it?

One team of let's say 50 devs. In one case they ALL work on new content and they need 2, 3 months of work to do it. In another case, many of those 50 work on cash shop and it's items. Do you really believe what's left of those 50 will be able to achieve the same amount of work as original 50 devs?

They aren't the same teams.

Presto! I've made 1.6 come out on the same timetable, regardless of how the payment model changes!

You didn't really read what I wrote, did you?

starkerealm wrote: »

Razzak wrote: »

One team of let's say 50 devs. In one case they ALL work on new content and they need 2, 3 months of work to do it. In another case, many of those 50 work on cash shop and it's items. Do you really believe what's left of those 50 will be able to achieve the same amount of work as original 50 devs?

That's not how development teams work. Or, "You can't make a baby in a month by impregnating nine women."

It was a very simplified example. But, since you understand more of development (not to say anything about conception) let me ask you this. What would those devs that were working on cash shop and it's items, work on otherwise? If ESO was not going to go B2P? I don't know exactly, as Nere pointed out, you don't know exactly, but since we are all just guessing ...

It's not like a cash shop takes a lot of effort.

And you're right about one thing: you're guessing. So stop dressing your guesses up as truth.

"We are not going to keep up our 2014 pace of updates in 2015 - and our future update pace will focus more on new adventures and game experiences than system changes. It's time to let the game breathe a little - we've done so many new features so quickly that we want to make sure everyone is on the same page with us. 1.6 alone has a complete rebalancing of most player abilities - we don't want to do that again, for example. Our #1 priority right now is getting Tamriel Unlimited launched on PC, and then focusing on a successful console launch. While we do those things, we have other teams already working on DLC and expect to see that start rolling out at some point after console launch settles down."

Guessing, ha?

Actually, you're just wrong now.

That quote shows that the development team is slowing down for reasons completely unrelated to the cash shop. Ironically, many people on these boards were demanding a slowdown on updates ("until they can do them right") until now.

"Our number 1 priority right now is getting Tamriel Unlimited launched on the PC." That's the cash shop, among other things. So yes, the development is slowing down because of the cash shop; sure, there are other factors too, but that's part of it. It takes a while to draw a pretty wedding gown that everybody can wear while they questing and to animate it for all the different races, and wedding dresses are important for a fantasy role-playing game, after all.

grimjim398 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Its not like this sort of direction wasnt hinted at when the announcement was made that they intended to release the game to Console. There was plenty back then who speculated the only way they were going to make it work with MS and Sony was a B2P/F2P model.

Now that it has come to happen. Its nothing but the sky is falling and DOOOMMMM.

I really cant wait for March 17th. Or atleast sometime mid next month. Because those who are truely bothered with this will be out of here. And maybe just maybe the forum fires will subside.

You're serious, I suppose. Because the loyal subscribers who are angry at this about-face on the part of dear, earnest Zenimax are going to take all the forum drama with us when we leave? And all the new players who are playing the game for free (after having bought it for $15 bucks at wherever they find it) are going to be ideal and loyal citizens of the forums and never cause any drama. Right.

For reals. These forums are going to become about 1000x worse once the age 8-16 get their hands on ESO because they don't need a CC for the sub fee. Clearly that guy hasn't been on the Destiny forums. That's what you get when you inject an adolescent playerbase with no long term allegiance to the game. They sit there and *** and moan about this and that, even though they are going to stop playing in 3 weeks anyway.

Thinking more about this, I think i would be satisfied if they could get something like Orsinium in our hands before console launch.

At least it would be a small bone they could throw us, as a thank you, for the subs over the year.

Vulix wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

I think sub holders here are making out a lot better then Star Trek Online sub holders.

This is the type of language people use when they realize they are in a bad situation but are trying to rationalize their way out of cognitive dissonance. It's like trying to negotiate with terrorists or an angry wife

No, Cryptic screwed us. Unlike Korah I couldn't even unsub, because I had an LTS.

Star Trek moved a lot of systems over to a semi-real money currency. One where you either pay another player real money for it, or you grind until your eyes bleed.

They nerfed the drop rates to push you towards buying lockboxes. Seriously, there was a time when lockboxes sat on the uncommon table and would gleefully replace about half your green drops. Blues went from something you'd see every couple days to something you'd almost never see.

The biggest change, at launch, was that ships, which used to be just an EC purchase got moved over to the new currency as well. Which meant that you couldn't just try out different ship classes to see which one worked for you.

And, they moved two of the ships into the cash shop. Took them out of the game, and said, "nope, now you need to pay us real money for these."

Initially, they flat out took away ALL the ships, and were going to force you to buy them every time you ranked up for the semi-real currency...

For reference, in Star Trek, your ship is basically a class, and separate character all it's own. They don't level up, but when you hit new ranks (every 10 levels) you advance to the next tier of ship. You can fly lower tier ships at higher ranks, but you're at a severe disadvantage for doing so. So, during the F2P beta, there was a time frame where Cryptic was literally demanding you pay them for leveling up.

cravnbeer wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Vulix wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

I think sub holders here are making out a lot better then Star Trek Online sub holders.

This is the type of language people use when they realize they are in a bad situation but are trying to rationalize their way out of cognitive dissonance. It's like trying to negotiate with terrorists or an angry wife

No, Cryptic screwed us. Unlike Korah I couldn't even unsub, because I had an LTS.

Star Trek moved a lot of systems over to a semi-real money currency. One where you either pay another player real money for it, or you grind until your eyes bleed.

They nerfed the drop rates to push you towards buying lockboxes. Seriously, there was a time when lockboxes sat on the uncommon table and would gleefully replace about half your green drops. Blues went from something you'd see every couple days to something you'd almost never see.

The biggest change, at launch, was that ships, which used to be just an EC purchase got moved over to the new currency as well. Which meant that you couldn't just try out different ship classes to see which one worked for you.

And, they moved two of the ships into the cash shop. Took them out of the game, and said, "nope, now you need to pay us real money for these."

Initially, they flat out took away ALL the ships, and were going to force you to buy them every time you ranked up for the semi-real currency...

For reference, in Star Trek, your ship is basically a class, and separate character all it's own. They don't level up, but when you hit new ranks (every 10 levels) you advance to the next tier of ship. You can fly lower tier ships at higher ranks, but you're at a severe disadvantage for doing so. So, during the F2P beta, there was a time frame where Cryptic was literally demanding you pay them for leveling up.

STO has prob the best f2p model. You can get everything you need in time. The sub isn't a bad deal, worth it if you spend money on the game especially leveling.
Free player gets a free ship up to t4. If you play during winter event, anniversary event, summer event you can get a free t5-6 ship ( the t5 can be made t5u free)
Every day each character you have can get 8k dilithium so in a couple of months a player could buy a t6 ship without spending a dime.

DCUO's model is probably actually better. At least for subscribers. Lock Boxes can be cracked by any subscriber for free, they automatically get DLC (including new classes) for free. The store doesn't leak into in game systems, so you're not paying some interim currency to craft, or whatever.

STO actually does have dilithium costs on... well, nearly anything they can get away with. Sure, you can get it from a lot of sources, but then it goes back out all over the place.

Also, a T5.5 is not the same thing as a T6 ship.

Oh, right, and grinding 8k of dilithium a day can easily take 4 hours. So, what you're saying is, if you want to work a part time job for the next three months, you can have this thing for free.

Another 6 months of VR system?! Oh Gods, Bal take me now. >_<

geoffreyb14_ESO wrote: »

ZoS: Will 1.7 be available on the PC before console launch or not. A simple yes or no will do. (Hint: I'm really hoping you say Yes.)

big ol nope a dope. 1.6 will be last update till after "console release dies down"
dev speak for when we damn well please lol

DDuke wrote: »

jjf42001_ESO wrote: »

geoffreyb14_ESO wrote: »

ZoS: Will 1.7 be available on the PC before console launch or not. A simple yes or no will do. (Hint: I'm really hoping you say Yes.)

big ol nope a dope. 1.6 will be last update till after "console release dies down"
dev speak for when we damn well please lol

Read: when the console players playing "Skyrim with friends" finish leveling.

I'd expect no more updates until 2018.

And the first of them land in sanctum : oh why can't I kill them with my bow I shoot them right in the head

I can't see patches for PC being aligned with console. ZOS simply needs to work through a release on new platforms which realistically is time consuming. They also mentioned DLC development will be on hold. This may not mean system and balancing patches which are not included in DLC (they are free).

I still expect the PC version to be the beta version for release and expect patches sooner here than for console once released. I've seen content for more than 1 DLC from over 6 months ago so 1 or 2 are likely very near PTS quality.

Inevitably though there will indeed be a large gap from 1.6 through the next real DLC. I just hope all justice and champion system upgrades do not come strictly through DLC. Likely we see 1 or 2 free patches prior.

Well, it is pretty obvious the pace of updates is going to slow down. Nobody really knows how long it will be until some new content is released, but it could definitely be a while.

So, let us assume that all of the whiny posters in these negative threads are absolutely correct:

1) B2P is in fact Satan and Adolph's love child, and
2) you won't see any new content until you are all at retirement age, if then.

Given those "facts", I just have one question... why are any of you still here?

geoffreyb14_ESO wrote: »

This is not a negative thread as you suggest. Actually, you are the troll.

Maybe on your planet this is not considered to be a negative thread, but here on Earth it is. And by the way, Welcome. I hope you enjoy your visit.