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1.6 ULTIMATE GENERATION, CHANGE IT! WHAT WE KNOW
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OtarTheMad✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I didn't read all the post but I just have to say that why should ZOS change it if it has not been tested by players in PTS yet? Also when they say that the current Ultimate generation is complex I believe that they are speaking of the fact that some class skills run off of Spell crit and some Weapon crit (even though the spell might be magicka based)
Also some things way work off of Weapon crit but the bonus damage it does runs off of spell. Some use weapon damage but use spell crit etc. By simplifying it they are making it easier to understand that Magicka spell= Spell crit and Stamina spell= Weapon crit. No confusion and it makes things easier on the developers when they introduce new spell lines.
I am not one to jump to conclusions, I want to test Update 6 first and see where it's at with a lot of things. I am little worried about how my NB is going to work but they mentioned Stamina morphs for class skills so you never know... wait and see before you ask them to change it.1 -
Dracane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The new system is awesome. It's fair, so AoE exploiters won't have an advantage. I was skeptical first, but the system is a great solution. Now everybody is equal and Ultimates become a bit more unique and are not spammed frequently.
What that means ? You have to use your brain from time to time
I'm curious, if Nightblades and Dragonknights are even capable to do this. Auri-El is my lord,
Trinimac my ward,
and Magnus my mind.8 -
technohic✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I have been gone for a few months so maybe I don't get it, but do you guys find holding block and spamming AOEs is fun?1 -
Dracane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I have been gone for a few months so maybe I don't get it, but do you guys find holding block and spamming AOEs is fun?
Yes, most people do. Because thinking less is more fun.
I myself don't even use AoE's O.o I hate making this in PvP, just like I hate AoE bomb groups/trains.
Keepers of Cyrodiil (an Aldmeri PvP guild) in all honor. But each time I was with them, it was just horrible, boring and pretty much a suicide commando. I prefer fighting with elegance.
Auri-El is my lord,
Trinimac my ward,
and Magnus my mind.5 -
technohic✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I have been gone for a few months so maybe I don't get it, but do you guys find holding block and spamming AOEs is fun?
Yes, most people do. Because thinking less is more fun.
I myself don't even use AoE's O.o I hate making this in PvP, just like I hate AoE bomb groups/trains.
Keepers of Cyrodiil (an Aldmeri PvP guild) in all honor. But each time I was with them, it was just horrible, boring and pretty much a suicide commando. I prefer fighting with elegance.
About the last thing I remember with my templar was just diving in, spamming blazing shield while aoeing.. It was all cool because "ZOMG, I can solo huge mobs and watch bubble pop and kill them all" but it was boring as hell.2 -
c0rp✭✭✭✭✭
✭For solo players it will be even harder. At the moment it is possible to gain enough Ultimate in a 1vX (lets say 1v5) to have some sustain if the enemies are playing bad. Now such fights will be nearly impossible to win.
[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Rude and Insulting Comments]
Sounds like it will be working as intended then.
Force weapon swap to have priority over EVERYTHING. Close enough.
Make stamina builds even with magicka builds.
Disable abilities while holding block.
Give us a REASON to do dungeons more than once.
Remove PVP AoE CAP. It is ruining Cyrodiil.
Fix/Remove Forward Camps. They are ruining Cyrodiil.
Impenetrability needs to REDUCE CRIT DAMAGE. Not negate entire builds.
Werewolf is not equal to Vamps/Bats.2 -
PBpsy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭It is quite amusing that you guys believe that those changes are going to change the usefulness of AOE in situations where it is required and turn the game in to the snipe&light attack everything like a [snip] no mater the situation turd of a game you seem to want to play. These changes are going make AOE even more prevalent in both pvp and pve especially with the aoe cap removal and the reduction in survivability,resource due to less up time on support ultimate. People that use their 'brain' that is the people that know when to use the right tool for the job will just have to get a bit better positioning and use more mitigation buffs and shields while alternating AOE and single target in an even stricter manner for conservation of resources. It's hardly going to be less efficient for us, just a bit slower and dull. You guys of course are still going to go in hour long wipe grinds in easy dungeons trying to use your brain behind a corner using snipe in a fight that was clearly designed as a AOE dps check. good luck.
[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Rude and Insulting Comments]Edited by ZOS_UlyssesW on January 1, 2015 5:10PMESO forums achievementsProud fanboiElitist jerkTrollHaterFan of icontested(rainbow colors granted)1 -
Dracane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭It is quite amusing that you guys believe that those changes are going to change the usefulness of AOE in situations where it is required and turn the game in to the snipe&light attack everything like a [snip] no mater the situation turd of a game you seem to want to play. These changes are going make AOE even more prevalent in both pvp and pve especially with the aoe cap removal and the reduction in survivability,resource due to less up time on support ultimate. People that use their 'brain' that is the people that know when to use the right tool for the job will just have to get a bit better positioning and use more mitigation buffs and shields while alternating AOE and single target in an even stricter manner for conservation of resources. It's hardly going to be less efficient for us, just a bit slower and dull. You guys of course are still going to go in hour long wipe grinds in easy dungeons trying to use your brain behind a corner using snipe in a fight that was clearly designed as a AOE dps check. good luck.
Amusing.
[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]Edited by ZOS_UlyssesW on January 1, 2015 5:08PMAuri-El is my lord,
Trinimac my ward,
and Magnus my mind.1 -
Komma✭✭✭✭✭I like the ultimate change. You will still gain from passives also. It wont be as bad as some think.Kohma Kozzy-cr160-Stamblade
Komma-cr160-Magicblade
Komma the Great-cr160-Stam DK
Kommah-cr160-Mag DK
Komma Kozzy-cr160-Mag Templar
Kommuh Kozzy-cr160-Stam Templar
Komma the White-cr160-Mag Sorc
The Tazmanian Devil-cr160-Stamsorc
OTG4 -
Rydik✭✭✭✭I like the ultimate change. You will still gain from passives also. It wont be as bad as some think.
Q&A from foundry p2
How will abilities like Carve or passives that generate additional Ultimate work in 1.6 given the new changes? Did you change passives with ultimate generation, for example with Werewolf?
EW: We have done a lot of modification to different passives to support the new system. As far as abilities go, that ties in well with our buff and debuff changes we have made. Currently there are some abilities that can give you a similar type of bonus. Like Spiked Armor and Immovable give you Major Armor and Major Spell Resistance, but you can’t stack those if you use two abilities that give you those buffs, it just refreshes the timer. So there is a Minor Ultimate Generation buff that certain abilities will give you and when you use that ability you will gain 1 Ultimate a second for a couple of seconds.
Still sucks.Edited by Rydik on December 26, 2014 4:17PM2 -
Aenlir✭✭✭If they want to put ultimates on a cool down, they should just do it. It's pretty silly to weave in light attacks in aoe situations. You should gain ultimate naturally from performing your roll well. Also, with the default UI they would have to add some sort of visual effect or timer for the players who don't use add ons.
This is understandable for pvp, but it is a huge nerf to pve. If I am doing 3k aoe dps, I will gain ultimate the same as the other dps doing single target on trash. So, I think they have to make all aoe abilities like carve to provide ultimate for using aoe in the right situations.3 -
Sanct16✭✭✭✭✭
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@ZOS :EW: We balanced the amount of Ultimate generation per second that the buff gives you around someone with 1 ability and 1 light attack weave every second with a 50% critical strike rating.
Could you please clarify if there will still be Ultimate gain for dealing damage. All I hear is that you don't want to force people in using crit build and you balanced it so it fits with people using average crit builds to everyone is on the same level. For boss fights, where the only way to gain Ultimate is basically to crit, this makes perfect sense. However, in normal fights, where you don't even need to crit in order to gain ultimate so that the ultimate gain does not really depend on your crit rating this would be a HUGE nerf for everyone and would make all classes feel a LOT less powerful/fun to play. As this patch's intention is obviously to make the game easier for casual players, I think this would be somehow counter productive. I guess it won't help the overall mood if you get *** by packs of trashmobs unless you have a group or highend gear and a perfect rotation.
- EU - Raid Leader of Banana Zerg Squad
AD | AR 50 | Sanct Fir'eheal | ex Mana DK @31.10.2015
EP | AR 50 | Sanctosaurus | Mana NB
AD | AR 44 | rekt ya | Mana NB
AD | AR 41 | Sanct Thunderstorm | Mana Sorc
EP | AR 36 | S'na'ct | Mana NB {NA}
AD | AR 29 | Captain Full Fist| Stam DK
AD | AR 29 | Sanct The Dark Phoenix| Stam Sorc
EP | AR 16 | Horny Sanct | Stam Warden
EP | AR 16 | Sánct Bánáná Sláyér | Mana DK
DC | AR 13 | ad worst faction eu | Stam Sorc
DC | AR 13 | Lagendary Sanct | Mana NB
>320.000.000 AP2 -
Rune_Relic✭✭✭✭✭
✭They should have just fixed 'in combat' and activated ult regen when in combat...deactivate ult regen when out of combat.
That way everyone builds ult the same (healer/tank/dps). It then becomes a matter of using it wisely for the right moment or blowing your wad at the earliest opportunity. Either way no one is more god like then anyone else. It comes down to skill/intelligence of when to use it and when not. Most importantly it is a bonus ability (as intended) and not a spammable skill (unintended) like some people use it.
Do you want to be the one without ultimate at that critical point when everyone is on the last dregs of health ?
Anything that can be exploited will be exploited1 -
its got nothing to do with Ultimate gain being too complicated. it has EVERYTHING to do with Ultimate gain being too easy in the game, players dropping ultimates on rotation, every 5/10 seconds. that's not how ultimates were intended to be used. they are supposed to be an emergency button, the big bang, the oh crap button. while im not a huge fan of the new system, rewarding players for better knowledge of their toon is a good thing, it has been ABUSED for the last year, and I can definitely see why they are going to try something new5
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Volla✭✭✭haha i just love the new idea of the Ultimate function
it will be great
Bat ftw is gone and its gonna be more balanced this way
this dude is probably a FOTM DK class.7 -
nalimoleb14_ESO✭✭✭✭AssaultLemming wrote: »I could care less about pvp because the PvP system is a joke anyway, and from the start there should have been separate PvP skills and gear. And now yet again the PvE players get the crap nerfed out of us in the interest of balancing a fundamentally broken PvP system.
Couldn't have said it better.
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Zershar_Vemod✭✭✭✭✭Oh look, a knee-jerk reaction.House Nyssara (NA)
Black Market Traders
Order of the Lamp Post
Thorn Brigade
VR15 Nightblade Vampire0 -
Spangla✭✭✭✭As a PVPer I can say this will ruin the game.
Made a thread about this already.
Noobs think they die because of these "op" people who batspam - they think this change will stop them dieing.
It wont - they die because they are bad...
All this change will do is cause them to die in a more boring, linear playstation 1 type combat style way.
Sack devs - the current team need to remove there bumbling fingers from the throat of this game.
The end.
P.S Be sure to post you agreement that I was right in my thread on this once 1.6
hits and ruins the game.
Here is an example of the dev teams logic.
Snipe is causing problems when hitting from sneak.
Ok - Nerf Sneak (consequently ruining other builds)
Buff Snipe.
Problem remains good one11 -
I love how everyone thinks Nightblades tanks have no skill.
First thing, its not a one button spam fest.
Unlike EVERY other class a NB has NO personal shielding In the class skill trees.
They have to rely on a good variety of skills to be able to do what they do.
When fighting a large group, most of my time is spent casting shields and trying to survive. I assume most of the time for a DK is spent trying to just survive.
Its a far cry from being a one button pulse spammer.
As Spangla said," All this change will do is cause them to die in a more boring, linear playstation 1 type combat style way."
"Noobs think they die because of these "op" people who batspam - they think this change will stop them dieing.
It wont - they die because they are bad..."
LOL!!3 -
facemace✭✭I think you will see a lot more people slotting ults simply based on class tree "while an ability is slotted" passives...
And then just not using them.2 -
DeLindsay✭✭✭✭✭
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They already have, Gina specifically said that current abilities/passives that generate additional Ultimate will continue to do so in 1.6. We will have the new 8 second temporary buff for Ultimate gain and the current few abilities/passives for additional gain (some/all are being "balanced" for 1.6). Gone are ALL other ways to gain Ultimate. No more Block, damage dealt, on hit, crit, Healing done for Ultimate gain. This has NOTHING to do with making the game easier for casuals as you put it, and everything to do with what multiple people have said over and over again, to reduce the amount of players that drop Ultimates every ~6 seconds, which was never intended by ZoS. That and building Ultimate outside of combat as well.Could you please clarify if there will still be Ultimate gain for dealing damage. All I hear is that you don't want to force people in using crit build and you balanced it so it fits with people using average crit builds to everyone is on the same level. For boss fights, where the only way to gain Ultimate is basically to crit, this makes perfect sense. However, in normal fights, where you don't even need to crit in order to gain ultimate so that the ultimate gain does not really depend on your crit rating this would be a HUGE nerf for everyone and would make all classes feel a LOT less powerful/fun to play. As this patch's intention is obviously to make the game easier for casual players, I think this would be somehow counter productive. I guess it won't help the overall mood if you get *** by packs of trashmobs unless you have a group or highend gear and a perfect rotation.0 -
Tankqull✭✭✭✭✭
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Not that I don't agree with you but if true where is the giant DK nerfI think I have never agreed more with a post on this forum since I registered.
What ZOS proposed was uncalled for and such a major change that it is almost impossible to fathom how this game will look when they launch 1.6.In end game pve the amount of systems and content they have to balance around this change is massive. I do not expect that the game will be playable at launch in places like Vet dungeons and trials.
I know how it will look. We'll see a whole lot less continuous Batswarm and Veil of Blades Spamming Impulse groups. I can't fathom how this would be considered a bad thing except from those pretty much entrenched in Impulse Spam Bat Swarming Blob running combat...shrug. Go ZoS!
Those Impulse groups will be able to hit n run but they won't have the sustainability they have now. That's a good thing in my book.
Another PVPer that thinks that all the game systems should be balanced around the fact that they couldn't get out of the way of the huge AoE spamming zerg.
Awesome
Of course.
PvE matters this [_____] much.
PvP matters this [______________________________] much. Shrug.
PvP is where class balance matters most and will almost always be the primary consideration when changes are made to skills and classes. PvP is the most competitive aspect of the game. Get used to it.
You know that the real problem with arena based PvP is that it will force the game into balance around it as its so easy to see who is winning an loosing.
standard cost are increased, the ultimate gain is normalized between everybody so no longer 3+ standards for one nova/atronarch. ain´t enough nerves for you?I never use light attack exept with bow. Its counterintuitive, boring, tiring, animations suck, and canceling is borderline cheating. Am I a bad player ? My best pvp kill streak is 141, roaming solo, no bow, no snipe ... Btw, with this méthod of generating ulti, no one yet noticed that it gives a huge disadvantage to melee player compared to range (staff, bow) ?
i do not know any build wich has no range option all of them have it either by destro/resto staffs or a bow in the second weapon slot.Edited by Tankqull on January 13, 2015 10:37PMspelling and grammar errors are free to be abused
Sallington wrote: »Anything useful that players are wanting added into the game all fall under the category of "Yer ruinin my 'mersion!"0 -
spryler✭✭✭A) I totally approve of this change to Ult generation
Having said that, I'm really going to miss being able to drop a second DK standard while my first one is still up. Edited by spryler on January 13, 2015 10:52PM5 -
MADshadowman✭✭✭✭✭Haven't read most of the comments, cause there are too many now, but one thing i'd like to know is:
What if you have a toon that has 2 melee weapons on both bars, let's say sword and board + 2 handed, that has to attack a ranged target with class skills, cause he can't get close enough to the target to use light attacks? Does that mean this toon will not generate any ultimate in this situation?2 -
Tankqull✭✭✭✭✭
✭MADshadowman wrote: »Haven't read most of the comments, cause there are too many now, but one thing i'd like to know is:
What if you have a toon that has 2 melee weapons on both bars, let's say sword and board + 2 handed, that has to attack a ranged target with class skills, cause he can't get close enough to the target to use light attacks? Does that mean this toon will not generate any ultimate in this situation?
yes (beside ultimate gain via passives giving you 2 ults per usage of skills from skilline X like mountains blessing(DK) or prism(temp) etc)
and that why it should be changed from light/heavy to any attack as mentioned before by someone on page 2Edited by Tankqull on January 13, 2015 11:11PMspelling and grammar errors are free to be abused
Sallington wrote: »Anything useful that players are wanting added into the game all fall under the category of "Yer ruinin my 'mersion!"1 -
Naivefanboi✭✭✭✭I think I have never agreed more with a post on this forum since I registered.
What ZOS proposed was uncalled for and such a major change that it is almost impossible to fathom how this game will look when they launch 1.6.In end game pve the amount of systems and content they have to balance around this change is massive. I do not expect that the game will be playable at launch in places like Vet dungeons and trials.
I know how it will look. We'll see a whole lot less continuous Batswarm and Veil of Blades Spamming Impulse groups. I can't fathom how this would be considered a bad thing except from those pretty much entrenched in Impulse Spam Bat Swarming Blob running combat...shrug. Go ZoS!
Those Impulse groups will be able to hit n run but they won't have the sustainability they have now. That's a good thing in my book.
yea doesnt mess with pve solo builds at alll...................1
