kijima wrote: »

Wait a sec, before we talk about changing heals and debuffs, before anything gets changed that will effect 1,000's of people, maybe have a look at what you can change first.

Lets talk about the 2.2 seconds you mentioned. Obviously it means you got hit twice by snipe (morphs) in a row. There are a few circumstances where you'll get hit with two arrows.

1. If you have been detected but you are still in sneak and then get hit with snipe (morphs) you'll get stunned, which then makes it easy for the next follow up arrow to get you down to 10-20% you are talking about.

It's a very simple mistake, and loads of people get caught out by this. I myself love using this tactic on other wannaba legolasses that are running around with a FOTM bow. They snipe you and get detected but stay in sneak mode, when you fire back a snipe on them it stuns them, then you can hit them again and usually finish them off with a heavy or venom.

2. Sorry about this next bit, but that's just bad situational awareness being hit by two snipes. When you hear the arrow coming, dodge roll is your friend.

3. Then there is a DK with flappy flap, or invis pots, did I say dodge roll? Shield stacking, blocking.

So many things to be done, and while there are so many bow users in cyro it's probably a good time to work out a solid defence for them.

kijima wrote: »

Glad you said a potential stacking health debuff when you don't know, sure it's worth looking into and I agree with you on that, and like you have not looked into either if it truth be told. If it's the case then sure thing lets get something done about it. Warrants a look into for sure, but lets not nerf the thing into the ground.

What I was saying that before the OP has to worry about it is plain and simple, don't get hit twice, and there are things you can do easily to stop it.

While I've probably been guilty before of saying to someone L2P I'm not really fond of that style of comment, which is what I stated the thing about being in stealth while detected, getting hit and then stunned. Not everyone has clued onto that one, I actually thought that was helpful and wasn't meant to be a L2P negative comment. The stun thing is nearly the only way you'd get hit by two snipes from the same person, that and bad situational awareness, and really a roll dodge isn't hard to do if that's the case.

Sorry if I cam across as an a$$, wasn't my intention OP.

Tintinabula wrote: »

are you sure you're not being hit with lethal arrow from a bow with the befouled enchant?

Sypherpkub17_ESO wrote: »

Tintinabula wrote: »

are you sure you're not being hit with lethal arrow from a bow with the befouled enchant?

2 Lethal arrows from the same person will reduce your healing by 100%.

Just like how 2 Dark Flares from one templar will reduce your healing by 100%.

This doesn't apply to reverberating bash (I don't think so at least).

Rylana wrote: »

Reposted from the other thread, my assessment of Lethal arrow

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Ok, so now having experienced fully the impact of the new snipe on all four classes and using it on a strong weapon power/stamina build, I am ready to make the following conclusions based on real in game live testing.

As the user, it is very solid, low cost, but seems a little too much, I will get into this in a moment. By too much I do not mean range or damage, the stacking debuff effect feels way too strong. So strong in fact that my nightblade bow user is about twice as powerful as she was before the change. DPS has increased over 25% both in burst and sustain. For single target damage, there is nothing that even approaches its power, especially at range. You can get the same raw output with two hander, yes, but at much higher risk. The actual difference becoming negligible in power vs taking way more damage in close. As a projectile, there are counters that can cause it to backfire as well, as will be noted later.

On my DK, snipe is just a novelty to experience. Due to reflective scales, anyone that tries to shoot me either does zero damage to me or flat out kills themselves (a stray lethal arrow when I am previously engaged with multiple targets and already depleted can of course still be deadly). DK has a hard counter, nuff said.

On my Sorc ranged caster, snipe is deadly as hell, unless I am shield stacked through the roof, and kiting is all I can do. It becomes cat and mouse range vs range, and without purge on the bar running constantly the heal debuff eventually wins every time. However, only a choice few players that actually understand how a sorc works ever realize how deadly they really are, and played properly a sorc can beat most bow users with class skills, if they know the right timings to kite and reengage. That being said, it is still absolute murder to tank the damage while still putting out enough yourself to secure the kill. At worst youll die pretty quickly, at best youll edge out the bow user or force a draw. You cant even close to melee as it can be fired point blank, which is a serious issue honestly.

On the templar bomber/heal build things become very very tricky. Managing heals vs cleanses vs actually doing damage is not possible given the amount of stamina blocking uses, the debuff applying no matter what, and the cost of actually healing the damage. A templar will ALWAYS lose vs an equally skilled opponent due to this. You can force a draw by simply purge/purify and shield stacking/power healing, but you will not have enough magicka or stamina to actually counter attack. its either draw or loss in almost every engagement, even against one bow user. Two or more is certain death.

On the nightblade (which is also my bow user mentioned above) you run into the same issue as the sorc fundamentally, its a resource/who shoots first moment, and if you arent carrying a hard cleanse, youre toast, period. That being said, you can escape virtually any time and still come back almost immediately by breaking tab lock with a quick cloak.




So to summarize

- Lethal arrow needs to have the debuff stacking removed completely
- It needs its 3-5 meter dead zone readded. Not even a melee templar shield stacker dare gets in range, only a DK can counter this build. there should never only be one hard counter to any skill, especially one that can only be accessed by 1/4 of the classes.
- The damage is fine
- DKs with reflect are the hard counter, with healers/casters being the most susceptible, but mostly due to the constant debuff reapplication/stack.
- The ability/weapon is sufficiently balanced to have point/counterpoint in the game, but unless that stacking and close range issues are addressed, it is in fact overpowered currently.