Unstable Wall - is this intended?

JDar · November 2014

sigh nevermind

Maulkin · November 2014

FluffiestOne wrote: »

Fluffies guide how to get unstable wall to hit 2.5k/second

Have 14 people stand in it.

It's not just the unstable wall.

There are screenshots of Blockades of Frost doing 2k damage to a single target. That's the morph that doesn't explode. That's a 500dmg tick on Frost (note: not Fire, not a Vampirism scenario) AND the total damage is being delivered a lot quicker than 4 secs. That's what people are talking about.

Unstable wall has an issue with the explosion being uncapped but that will not increase the damage on a single target, just your DPS against many players.

Rylana · November 2014

Its obvious that certain players have figured out a way to make the damage hit all at once instead of tick as intended.

They flame anyone who points out they are doing this because it is their new "awesome" toy exclusive to them that puts them above others.

Like everything else abused in the past, it will be fixed, of course, but they are going to abuse it to the bitter end and mock everyone they kill with their broken toy until then.

jkirchner71ub17_ESO2 · November 2014

Tripwyr wrote: »

I hate having to repeat this, but the animations support the core game mechanics, not the other way around. Cancelling animations does not allow you to cast any faster than without.

Try Block / Cast / Block / Cast / Block / Cast Impulse as quick as you can then just do Impulse / Impulse / Impulse in succession. You can absolutely cast Impulse faster by canceling the full Impulse animations. I only know this because someone mentioned the "impulse spamming monkeys" do it all the time so they can peak out Impulse DPS. Whether or not it is intentional is for Zeni to decide - in some MMOs I have played this is called "clipping" as you are "clipping" out animations and is considered legitimate gameplay but not sure what Zeni's stance is.

Armitas · November 2014

Rylana wrote: »

Its obvious that certain players have figured out a way to make the damage hit all at once instead of tick as intended.

I tried out unstable wall for my dps rotation a few months back. It lowered my dps but what I found was that you could stack unstable wall up to 3x so that you could have an explosion going every second. With elemental blockade you should be able to stack it 4x so that every second you get hit for 500 4x. I think that may be how they are doing it.

Basically the skill just lays on top of it self for every cast until you have 4 ground dots stacked on top of itself.

Maulkin · November 2014

Armitas wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Its obvious that certain players have figured out a way to make the damage hit all at once instead of tick as intended.

I tried out unstable wall for my dps rotation a few months back. It lowered my dps but what I found was that you could stack unstable wall up to 3x so that you could have an explosion going every second. With elemental blockade you should be able to stack it 4x so that every second you get hit for 500 4x. I think that may be how they are doing it.

How do you get that? At weapon damage and magicka soft-cap it does 125 per tick. 4x125 = 500. So you would expect to get 500 dmg per second from 4 stacked WoEs.

Considering people charge breaches with 3k HP, 1k-2k worth of shields and constant healing, you should be fine against one player DPS'ing you for 500 per sec. You can easily outheal oil that does 800dps for example.

Armitas · November 2014

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

Armitas wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Its obvious that certain players have figured out a way to make the damage hit all at once instead of tick as intended.

I tried out unstable wall for my dps rotation a few months back. It lowered my dps but what I found was that you could stack unstable wall up to 3x so that you could have an explosion going every second. With elemental blockade you should be able to stack it 4x so that every second you get hit for 500 4x. I think that may be how they are doing it.

How do you get that? At weapon damage and magicka soft-cap it does 125 per tick. 4x125 = 500. So you would expect to get 500 dmg per second from 4 stacked WoEs.

Considering people charge breaches with 3k HP, 1k-2k worth of shields and constant healing, you should be fine against one player DPS'ing you for 500 per sec. You can easily outheal oil that does 800dps for example.

I divided 2000/4. No idea how they get 500 per tick. esohead can barely get half that at 5000 magicka 500 weapon damage. The last time people were getting unsual damage they were using scorching rune to open a window that allowed them to stack buffs. I wonder if something like that is going on again. A lot of prior fixes are now seemingly reverted in 1.5 so...maybe?

500a tick would be survivable, but if you can layer 4 in one location it's 2000 a second. That gives you 2 seconds to get out or you're dead. If two people are staggering it then it could be as short as 1.1 seconds.

Maulkin · November 2014

Armitas wrote: »

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

Armitas wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Its obvious that certain players have figured out a way to make the damage hit all at once instead of tick as intended.

I tried out unstable wall for my dps rotation a few months back. It lowered my dps but what I found was that you could stack unstable wall up to 3x so that you could have an explosion going every second. With elemental blockade you should be able to stack it 4x so that every second you get hit for 500 4x. I think that may be how they are doing it.

How do you get that? At weapon damage and magicka soft-cap it does 125 per tick. 4x125 = 500. So you would expect to get 500 dmg per second from 4 stacked WoEs.

Considering people charge breaches with 3k HP, 1k-2k worth of shields and constant healing, you should be fine against one player DPS'ing you for 500 per sec. You can easily outheal oil that does 800dps for example.

I divided 2000/4. No idea how they get 500 per tick. esohead can barely get half that at 5000 magicka 500 weapon damage.

Well there's obviously other stuff involved, like flawless dawnbreaker +13%, probably combat prayer +11%, maybe standing under your banner(?) +20%.

These 3 alone would push the damage up by 44% and if your base damage was 130 that's gonna increase it to ~200. Still pretty far off.

Aoe_Barbecue · November 2014

Malveria wrote: »

And please don't pretend it takes skill to do this. Admit you're as cheap as you actually are. As one of your members neatly said 'exploiting is just optimal play'.

First, Nala is not in NM. Second, I am unsure how you and your guild lead misconstrued "optimal play =/= exploiting", which were my literal and exact words for, "exploiting is just optimal play." Judging from your, and his, past blundering don't color me surprised. =/= is a does not equal sign typically.

Aoe_Barbecue · November 2014

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

Armitas wrote: »

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

Armitas wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Its obvious that certain players have figured out a way to make the damage hit all at once instead of tick as intended.

I tried out unstable wall for my dps rotation a few months back. It lowered my dps but what I found was that you could stack unstable wall up to 3x so that you could have an explosion going every second. With elemental blockade you should be able to stack it 4x so that every second you get hit for 500 4x. I think that may be how they are doing it.

How do you get that? At weapon damage and magicka soft-cap it does 125 per tick. 4x125 = 500. So you would expect to get 500 dmg per second from 4 stacked WoEs.

Considering people charge breaches with 3k HP, 1k-2k worth of shields and constant healing, you should be fine against one player DPS'ing you for 500 per sec. You can easily outheal oil that does 800dps for example.

I divided 2000/4. No idea how they get 500 per tick. esohead can barely get half that at 5000 magicka 500 weapon damage.

Well there's obviously other stuff involved, like flawless dawnbreaker +13%, probably combat prayer +11%, maybe standing under your banner(?) +20%.

These 3 alone would push the damage up by 44% and if your base damage was 130 that's gonna increase it to ~200. Still pretty far off.

Fairly certain it's a display error on the recap, because I was the guy with the unstable wall in OP's image, and even with the sharpened bug, my individual walls never tic'd for significantly more than 200 or so.

eventide03b14a_ESO · November 2014

OtarTheMad wrote: »

I doubt it. The damage of 504 seems a little more likely what zos intended than the other ones for obvious reasons.

If the normal damage is 504 why wouldn't they score over 1k on a crit? OP why didn't you dodge?

eventide03b14a_ESO · November 2014

Sorry, but I see these threads a lot where people complain about getting one-shotted by a bow attack or some other nonsense when in reality it's a L2P issue. If you don't understand the mechanics of the game or how AoE's work then yes you will get killed by something like the walls. I see it all the time in PvP. People that don't "break free" or "dodge". Dodging is the easiest mechanic in this game to master and I see people fail to use it all the time. I don't see anything off with these numbers. I have over 3k health in Cyrodiil and I'm wearing junk at V10 so 1k or even a 2k hit shouldn't instakill most people unless you are just really low and have really bad gear. In that case I'd just say suck it up till you get higher.

WraithAzraiel · November 2014

Wow, in every one of these threads. The NM chuckles come crawling out of the woodwork to say how much you suck and subtly defend a brokenass skill. This pattern is amazing. Keep it up!

The problem is the individual being killed by these attacks isn't given time to react. It is not humanly possible if you didn't see the caster tossing them out. That's if they let the whole animation play, if they cancel it - as some have come to do with add-ons or manually, then it's impossible to counter.

Should we what? Dodge roll at every encounter just in case?

Be reasonable people, the skill is broken and is the new Impulse.

WraithAzraiel · November 2014

Davadin wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

My only issue with this skill as it stands relates to the AOE cap.

If it is indeed not obeying a cap of 6 (9 for power extraction) like all other AOE, then it should be adjusted thus.

Wall of elements always did crazy high DPS, but since it fires forward people tend not to use it (like combat prayer heals)

Some people found an application where this skill is beastly. Big deal.

But fix the cap.

AoE cap getting unleashed (except for healing) next patch. why cap somethig getting uncapped at the next release?

So you'd rather people just suck it up and deal with knuckleheads spamming a broken skill to "lul-iwin" all over Cyrodiil?

Nope, and to my understanding, when the AOE cap gets lifted, the damage will be changed. Instead of doing full damage to all people hit by a particular skill - a la Unstable Wall and Elemental Blockade - the damage will be spread as evenly as possible among all the people hit.

I could be wrong but that's how I understood it.

eventide03b14a_ESO · November 2014

babylon wrote: »

Sanct16 wrote: »

Different casts stack on the ground, not in death recap. If you get hit for 2k with it, it means you got 2k damage from one single cast. Kinda high for a skill with a tooltip damage of probably less than 150 per tick, don't you think?

It's a DoT, so any listed damage is for the duration of that DoT (each icon = duration of one DoT + explosion). OP was basically just standing in the red taking damage over and over. Also is the OP a vamp by any chance? Might explain why the damage is so consistently high.

That wouldn't explain the ice wall though. But you're right, he clearly just stood there in multiple walls while probably in a keep. Based on the screenshot he's clearly indoors and didn't notice the whole ground was on fire.

Subtomik · November 2014

@Wraithazraiel im waiting for when you are going to show me this exploit. if you can i will gladly eat crow.

but like i said, time to stop talking and start recording.

Aoe_Barbecue · November 2014

WraithAzraiel wrote: »

Wow, in every one of these threads. The NM chuckles come crawling out of the woodwork to say how much you suck and subtly defend a brokenass skill. This pattern is amazing. Keep it up!

Since you seem averse to being revealed as a dimwit, it seems good advice not to provide reason for response from those you mention.

-an NM chuckle

eventide03b14a_ESO · November 2014

Malveria wrote: »

Nala_ wrote: »

this thread was made by someone who doesnt understand how the ability he called bugged, even works, lmao

I assumed there must be some reason as to how I'm getting this sort of damage on my recap. Thus the reason for me asking whether or not it is intended. If it is, so be it. If it's not, well. Please don't pretend the casters have any skill.

And as far as I'm concerned, I don't see how something that is only meant to do less than 200 damage in each tick can suddenly do ten times that amount in three seconds or less. I registered 5078 damage in less than three seconds from only two different people. Considering I had 2900 health, I had to have been healed through and survived 2178 minimum damage before the final blows that killed me.

In less than three seconds.

If this is intended, then so be it. Just another marker of how pathetic the ability balancing in this game is.

And please don't pretend it takes skill to do this. Admit you're as cheap as you actually are. As one of your members neatly said 'exploiting is just optimal play'.

It was clear from the screenshot that you were standing in a place with no room to move. You put yourself in a position that was ideal for the sort of AoE stacking
that killed you. It also only showed the last five spells that hit you. We have no idea what was pummeling you before that. Basically had you not cornered yourself against what was clearly at least two different destruction staff casters then you could have just moved out of the damn way and this thread never would have existed.

eventide03b14a_ESO · November 2014

Rylana wrote: »

Its obvious that certain players have figured out a way to make the damage hit all at once instead of tick as intended.

How is that obvious? Because you see the total damage in a recap?

eventide03b14a_ESO · November 2014

WraithAzraiel wrote: »

Wow, in every one of these threads. The NM chuckles come crawling out of the woodwork to say how much you suck and subtly defend a brokenass skill. This pattern is amazing. Keep it up!

The problem is the individual being killed by these attacks isn't given time to react. It is not humanly possible if you didn't see the caster tossing them out. That's if they let the whole animation play, if they cancel it - as some have come to do with add-ons or manually, then it's impossible to counter.

Should we what? Dodge roll at every encounter just in case?

Be reasonable people, the skill is broken and is the new Impulse.

Don't back yourself against a wall where you can't react. If you do then expect this to happen. People will continue to use these skills as long as they work.

WraithAzraiel · November 2014

Aoe_Barbecue wrote: »

WraithAzraiel wrote: »

Wow, in every one of these threads. The NM chuckles come crawling out of the woodwork to say how much you suck and subtly defend a brokenass skill. This pattern is amazing. Keep it up!

Since you seem averse to being revealed as a dimwit, it seems good advice not to provide reason for response from those you mention.

-an NM chuckle

Adverse. And I mention it because it's a pattern I, myself, have noticed.

In every single thread I've looked at pertaining to the morphs of Elemental Wall, there you are and all your friends, yelling at people, insulting them, calling them stupid for letting themselves die, telling them to QQ less and L2P moar. Instead of offering ANY constructive comment whatsoever. You all immediately go on the offensive.

And yet I'm the dimwit. I made an observation, it's truth bothers you, you retaliate with personal insults.

What else can you throw at me, pumpkin?

WraithAzraiel · November 2014

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

WraithAzraiel wrote: »

Wow, in every one of these threads. The NM chuckles come crawling out of the woodwork to say how much you suck and subtly defend a brokenass skill. This pattern is amazing. Keep it up!

The problem is the individual being killed by these attacks isn't given time to react. It is not humanly possible if you didn't see the caster tossing them out. That's if they let the whole animation play, if they cancel it - as some have come to do with add-ons or manually, then it's impossible to counter.

Should we what? Dodge roll at every encounter just in case?

Be reasonable people, the skill is broken and is the new Impulse.

Don't back yourself against a wall where you can't react. If you do then expect this to happen. People will continue to use these skills as long as they work.

If that were the situation most people are experiencing the abuse of the damage dealt by Unstable Wall and Blockade of Elements or whatever it's called, then sure I could agree with your post.

But for some (likely most), they're breaching an objective (be it an outpost or a keep) and there some knucklehead is, sitting with probably a friend, spamming the hell out of those skills and animation canceling them so the visual queue's necessary for combat reaction aren't there.

WraithAzraiel · November 2014

Subtomik wrote: »

@Wraithazraiel im waiting for when you are going to show me this exploit. if you can i will gladly eat crow.

but like i said, time to stop talking and start recording.

I answered you in the other thread.

Aoe_Barbecue · November 2014

WraithAzraiel wrote: »

Aoe_Barbecue wrote: »

WraithAzraiel wrote: »

Wow, in every one of these threads. The NM chuckles come crawling out of the woodwork to say how much you suck and subtly defend a brokenass skill. This pattern is amazing. Keep it up!

Since you seem averse to being revealed as a dimwit, it seems good advice not to provide reason for response from those you mention.

-an NM chuckle

Adverse. And I mention it because it's a pattern I, myself, have noticed.

In every single thread I've looked at pertaining to the morphs of Elemental Wall, there you are and all your friends, yelling at people, insulting them, calling them stupid for letting themselves die, telling them to QQ less and L2P moar. Instead of offering ANY constructive comment whatsoever. You all immediately go on the offensive.

And yet I'm the dimwit. I made an observation, it's truth bothers you, you retaliate with personal insults.

What else can you throw at me, pumpkin?

I have a pretty good knuckleball, since you are asking.

Sometimes the most constructive advice is being told to stop being dumb. The goal is for one to stop being dumb. It's not our fault your feelings are in a twist.

KBKB · November 2014

Guys guys we are arguing with children. Make love to your woman, buy some beer, go for a gamble or grow a beard to remind yourself you're not 12/14 like these guys and just leave it. Fighting with them is the equivalent of banging your head against a brick wall, we all know they exploit even if they weren't doing so now they have a damning track record. Pride yourself in fair play and your up bringing like 95% of the server does and leave them to their witty 3 letter retorts and terribly lame image postings.

Might I add I reached the age conclusion because each of their posts have not given me any reason to think otherwise, I think if you take a step and do so you will see it too. If they aren't 12/14 then god help their parents.

BB outttttttt

KBKB · November 2014

Subtomik wrote: »

Black-Bird wrote: »

Guys guys we are arguing with children. Make love to your woman, buy some beer, go for a gamble or grow a beard to remind yourself you're not 12/14 like these guys and just leave it. Fighting with them is the equivalent of banging your head against a brick wall, we all know they exploit even if they weren't doing so now they have a damning track record. Pride yourself in fair play and your up bringing like 95% of the server does and leave them to their witty 3 letter retorts and terribly lame image postings.

I may only be 12 but I'm old enough to f*ck your b*tch

Nailed my point to the wall thanks! night all! =D

Subtomik · November 2014

Ps I offered to help anyone concerned replicate any bug they think is occuring.

Sorry that you are just bashing us and know nothing "suspect" is occurring and that's why you won't take me up on my offer.

Subtomik · November 2014

And you nailed mine. All you have is ad hominem. Otherwise put your money were your mouth is and prove it.

Rylana · November 2014

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Its obvious that certain players have figured out a way to make the damage hit all at once instead of tick as intended.

How is that obvious? Because you see the total damage in a recap?

It is obvious because it happened to me, and i dont stand like an idiot in red circles or floor attacks. In my experience it was over 6000 stacked damage before I could even react (under a second) from ONE person.

WraithAzraiel · November 2014

Aoe_Barbecue wrote: »

WraithAzraiel wrote: »

Aoe_Barbecue wrote: »

WraithAzraiel wrote: »

Wow, in every one of these threads. The NM chuckles come crawling out of the woodwork to say how much you suck and subtly defend a brokenass skill. This pattern is amazing. Keep it up!

Since you seem averse to being revealed as a dimwit, it seems good advice not to provide reason for response from those you mention.

-an NM chuckle

Adverse. And I mention it because it's a pattern I, myself, have noticed.

In every single thread I've looked at pertaining to the morphs of Elemental Wall, there you are and all your friends, yelling at people, insulting them, calling them stupid for letting themselves die, telling them to QQ less and L2P moar. Instead of offering ANY constructive comment whatsoever. You all immediately go on the offensive.

And yet I'm the dimwit. I made an observation, it's truth bothers you, you retaliate with personal insults.

What else can you throw at me, pumpkin?

I have a pretty good knuckleball, since you are asking.

Sometimes the most constructive advice is being told to stop being dumb. The goal is for one to stop being dumb. It's not our fault your feelings are in a twist.

How's your slider?