Every major update reminds me why relying on 3rd party add-ons for basic features...

Vuron · August 2014

epoling wrote: »

And folks, they said from the start that they wanted this game to have a very minimalist UI. It's not broken, it just isn't what people who have played MMOs for a while have gotten used to. Add-ons are nice, but they aren't required. Yeah, I have some I like and use. I could play without them and adjust and be perfectly fine.

The majority of complaints in this thread have nothing to do with the minimalist UI. Most are talking about core mechanics which are already part of the UI but just severely lacking. The complaints aren't coming from the point of view of what we're "used to" in games.

ZOS has implemented a guild store, but it has no search feature. Really? Adding a search feature has no impact on how minimalist or cluttered the UI might become.

Having a tracking system of your researched traits is implemented in the game, but you have to be located at a crafting station to use it? You also need to log on to individual characters in order to track.

The inventory was implemented with no ability to filter items. Again, adding a single button to perform this operation has nothing to do with a minimalist UI.

The list of examples goes on and on with mail, chat, quest logs, character sheet info, etc.

The original argument stands. This game is simply missing basic components and functions which should be available and are not. ZOS is relying on addon creators to supply this functionality which leads to issues when the API gets changed, creators quit, or creators have something better to do than update their addon 5 minutes after the patch.

People have begun to rely on many of these addons as basic, standard features and will complain when they are not available or working correctly.

Pausekey · August 2014

twev wrote: »

Pausekey wrote: »

mdosheab16_ESO wrote: »

Another patch that has broken all the addons was the final straw for me. I've cancelled my subscription for now and will see how things go over my remaining 90 days.

I loved ESO, and I still want to. But to call it a 'high maintenance' relationship is an understatement.

Well I guess its your choice in the end, but while frustrating, having to redo add-ons isn't the end of the world. I run 25 add-ons at all times, on all characters. I use Minion to update them, saves me a ton of time. I had 2/3 of them up to date by the end of the patch release day. It took me about 10 min to completely redo my settings on my main, and the more difficult add-ons to setup save the settings across all characters. So I was done, 15 min for entire account and back to playing like nothing happened.

What add-on do you use for Harvest Map, when Harvest Map doesn't work while the guild functionality is shut down, and the data gets overwritten and lost while they swap back and forth?
And the last conversation I had with the author, he said he was unsubbing and there are no replacements that cover that info.

What add-on do you use for ZrMiniMap, since the original author quit a while back, and there aren't any workable substitutions that reliably update of work similarly?

I have 19 other add-ons covering inventory management, research management, and much else that are still 'Out of Date' as of 3 minutes ago, and I have no clue whether those authors are still active or not.
Many of those add-ons either have no alternate, or they're just as out of date for some time now.

The original pool of add-on authors has been much reduced by authors giving up and leaving in frustration, and new authors don't seem to be joining in any numbers to replace the ones who left.

I know it's fashionable to point out that it's not Zeni's responsibility to coddle add-on authors, but to originally invite them in to augment game play, and tout a robust add-on environment and then chase them away with a stick is counterproductive to those of us who only stick around paying the sub and playing the game because the add-ons make the game live up to it's potential of fun for us.

As it stands now, I'm just coasting thru the balance of my 6 month sub, because I buy/sub/play one game at a time, and I'm waiting to see whether I have to move on or not.

Harvest Map is a bust. I have it, and use it for the current map I am on, but once I have out leveled the area I have no need to go back. It would be nice for future character play-throughs, but at the end of the day its not necessary to me.

Updated version of the mini map.
http://www.esoui.com/downloads/info605-ZrMiniMap-Updated.html

As it stands all of my add-ons work fine. Some say out of date, but they all work. Research assistant was down for a day, that has been fixed. I use Advanced Filters for inventory management

Tubben · August 2014

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

3. Even if the first two things weren't true, it's still not ZO's problem. Addons are maintained by third-party developers. It's their job to fix addons if an update breaks them.

It is if i cancel my subscription because i cant stand that lousy UI

Gillysan · August 2014

People who aren't using addons in this game have no idea what they are missing.

I agree with the OP however give it time. Things will surely settle down, game hasn't even been out 6 months.

I vote that if an addon shows it's useful and popular by the community, that ESO give the authors a free year subscription.

Vuron · August 2014

Gillysan wrote: »

I vote that if an addon shows it's useful and popular by the community, that ESO give the authors a free year subscription.

How about if an addon shows it's useful and popular by the community then it is added into the core functionality of the game?

onlinegamer1 · August 2014

Pausekey wrote: »

twev wrote: »

Pausekey wrote: »

mdosheab16_ESO wrote: »

Another patch that has broken all the addons was the final straw for me. I've cancelled my subscription for now and will see how things go over my remaining 90 days.

I loved ESO, and I still want to. But to call it a 'high maintenance' relationship is an understatement.

Well I guess its your choice in the end, but while frustrating, having to redo add-ons isn't the end of the world. I run 25 add-ons at all times, on all characters. I use Minion to update them, saves me a ton of time. I had 2/3 of them up to date by the end of the patch release day. It took me about 10 min to completely redo my settings on my main, and the more difficult add-ons to setup save the settings across all characters. So I was done, 15 min for entire account and back to playing like nothing happened.

What add-on do you use for Harvest Map, when Harvest Map doesn't work while the guild functionality is shut down, and the data gets overwritten and lost while they swap back and forth?
And the last conversation I had with the author, he said he was unsubbing and there are no replacements that cover that info.

What add-on do you use for ZrMiniMap, since the original author quit a while back, and there aren't any workable substitutions that reliably update of work similarly?

I have 19 other add-ons covering inventory management, research management, and much else that are still 'Out of Date' as of 3 minutes ago, and I have no clue whether those authors are still active or not.
Many of those add-ons either have no alternate, or they're just as out of date for some time now.

The original pool of add-on authors has been much reduced by authors giving up and leaving in frustration, and new authors don't seem to be joining in any numbers to replace the ones who left.

I know it's fashionable to point out that it's not Zeni's responsibility to coddle add-on authors, but to originally invite them in to augment game play, and tout a robust add-on environment and then chase them away with a stick is counterproductive to those of us who only stick around paying the sub and playing the game because the add-ons make the game live up to it's potential of fun for us.

As it stands now, I'm just coasting thru the balance of my 6 month sub, because I buy/sub/play one game at a time, and I'm waiting to see whether I have to move on or not.

Harvest Map is a bust. I have it, and use it for the current map I am on, but once I have out leveled the area I have no need to go back. It would be nice for future character play-throughs, but at the end of the day its not necessary to me.

Updated version of the mini map.
http://www.esoui.com/downloads/info605-ZrMiniMap-Updated.html

As it stands all of my add-ons work fine. Some say out of date, but they all work. Research assistant was down for a day, that has been fixed. I use Advanced Filters for inventory management

Harvest map works fine if you edit your SavedVariables folder and edit the HarvestMap.lua to fix the account name.

I have started using LUI for minimap (I turn off the rest of LUA, I only use minimap, although it has many other features). Group member positions and PvP Keep status do not update on it properly, but as far as it being a minimap, it works fine with no FPS drop.

nerevarine1138 · August 2014

Tubben wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

3. Even if the first two things weren't true, it's still not ZO's problem. Addons are maintained by third-party developers. It's their job to fix addons if an update breaks them.

It is if i cancel my subscription because i cant stand that lousy UI

Then ask them to change the UI instead of whining about them not also doing the addon developers' jobs for them.

They won't change the UI, because many (if not most) players like the minimal UI the way it is. But you're complaining to ZO about something they have no responsibility for or control over.

onlinegamer1 · August 2014

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Tubben wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

3. Even if the first two things weren't true, it's still not ZO's problem. Addons are maintained by third-party developers. It's their job to fix addons if an update breaks them.

It is if i cancel my subscription because i cant stand that lousy UI

Then ask them to change the UI instead of whining about them not also doing the addon developers' jobs for them.

They won't change the UI, because many (if not most) players like the minimal UI the way it is. But you're complaining to ZO about something they have no responsibility for or control over.

Choose one of the following:

1. Minimal UI. You can only get more information through add-ons.
2. Maximal UI. All UI elements can be turned of via user settings.

ESO's flaw (read: horrible designers, producers and development team) is that they chose 1 instead of 2.

Tandor · August 2014

theyancey wrote: »

You could add on an add on updater that takes care of that automatically. You could test your add ons on PTS and relay any problems to the person who made it. You could make your own. Or you could just whine.

Not to mention that you could stick with the default UI, as doubtless a good many of those who have no technical issues with the game have done. Just because you're used to having something in another MMO doesn't mean that you need to have it here. Most add ons are simply designed to hand the game to you on a plate, like showing all the skyshards on the map, rather than - shock, horror - finding them. They're not essential.

nerevarine1138 · August 2014

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Tubben wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

3. Even if the first two things weren't true, it's still not ZO's problem. Addons are maintained by third-party developers. It's their job to fix addons if an update breaks them.

It is if i cancel my subscription because i cant stand that lousy UI

Then ask them to change the UI instead of whining about them not also doing the addon developers' jobs for them.

They won't change the UI, because many (if not most) players like the minimal UI the way it is. But you're complaining to ZO about something they have no responsibility for or control over.

Choose one of the following:

1. Minimal UI. You can only get more information through add-ons.
2. Maximal UI. All UI elements can be turned of via user settings.

ESO's flaw (read: horrible designers, producers and development team) is that they chose 1 instead of 2.

Well, you're right that they made a mistake in choosing option 1. They should have just disallowed addons in the first place. That would have solved everyone's problems.

Tandor · August 2014

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Tubben wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

3. Even if the first two things weren't true, it's still not ZO's problem. Addons are maintained by third-party developers. It's their job to fix addons if an update breaks them.

It is if i cancel my subscription because i cant stand that lousy UI

Then ask them to change the UI instead of whining about them not also doing the addon developers' jobs for them.

They won't change the UI, because many (if not most) players like the minimal UI the way it is. But you're complaining to ZO about something they have no responsibility for or control over.

Choose one of the following:

1. Minimal UI. You can only get more information through add-ons.
2. Maximal UI. All UI elements can be turned of via user settings.

ESO's flaw (read: horrible designers, producers and development team) is that they chose 1 instead of 2.

Well, you're right that they made a mistake in choosing option 1. They should have just disallowed addons in the first place. That would have solved everyone's problems.

Apart from original TES fans who would have screamed blue murder at being denied one the most significant aspects of the original games, i.e. modding.

The problem is that once a developer decides to allow, even encourage, addons, it follows that he must minimise the UI in order to give the modders plenty of slack to pick up. As it happens, this game is one that plenty of players want to enjoy with a minimal UI anyway so the system works very well, provided those who depend on addons are prepared either to test them on the PTS when new updates are issued, and provide the appropriate feedback, or else disable them temporarily after an update while the modders update the addons.

OrangeTheCat · August 2014

The people here who say 'just use Minion; one click and my add-ons were all up to date in 10 seconds', while generally true, are failing to take into consideration add-ons that are no longer being maintained. Minion won't save you. Half of my dozen of so add-ons are still out of date and three of those crash. No doubt the authors got fed up with this buggy game and left. So I had to spend quite a bit of time finding maintained substitutes for these add-ons. So it's not always a "10 seconds" inconvenience; stop trivializing the problem. I mostly use add-ons for things that any responsible software company would have implemented themselves. e.g. item stacking in the guild bank, etc., things that patch the glaring deficiencies in the game's UI.

nerevarine1138 · August 2014

OrangeTheCat wrote: »

The people here who say 'just use Minion; one click and my add-ons were all up to date in 10 seconds', while generally true, are failing to take into consideration add-ons that are no longer being maintained. Minion won't save you. Half of my dozen of so add-ons are still out of date and three of those crash. No doubt the authors got fed up with this buggy game and left. So I had to spend quite a bit of time finding maintained substitutes for these add-ons. So it's not always a "10 seconds" inconvenience; stop trivializing the problem. I mostly use add-ons for things that any responsible software company would have implemented themselves. e.g. item stacking in the guild bank, etc., things that patch the glaring deficiencies in the game's UI.

I'll take "Things that are not ZO's problem," for 600, Alex.

Ok, here's the answer: "These people are responsible for maintaining their add-ons. If they don't, the add-ons will break."

BUZZ

What are third-party add-on developers?

Correct!

I'll take "Whiterun Wolfhound" for 200, Alex.

Cogo · August 2014

I havnt used a single addon since launch. Game works fine for me.

Attorneyatlawl · August 2014

daneyulebub17_ESO wrote: »

theyancey wrote: »

You could add on an add on updater that takes care of that automatically. You could test your add ons on PTS and relay any problems to the person who made it. You could make your own. Or you could just whine.

Well, the 1st of your points is a spotty solution at best--the updaters are fairly beta-ish, require upkeep and updating themselves, and you still have to deal with broken updates and bugs--which are legion after a major game update.

The 2nd misses my point 100%, but thanks for suggesting I take the time to beta test addons on the PTS when the whole point of my post is I don't want to mess with this crap.

For the 3rd, see the preceding.

As to your 4th point--I wasn't whining--I was reiterating a basic flaw with a game that relies so much on 3rd party volunteer scripters to fill in its gaps.

Quoted for truth. Having to rely on addons for what is really basic and standard functionality in MMO titles is very aggravating. All due respect to addon volunteers of course and not to minimize their donated time and code, but..

Addons depend on third party authors .
Addons aren't always well integrated.
Addons require constant updates.
Addons can't accomplish many things such as real (not faked) buff tracking or nameplates due to api limitations.
Addons break with most patches.
Addons often have performance or crash issues.
Addons are not the place for basics like timestamps in chat or a minimap.

Finally addons are not something many new players look for right a anyway thus their first impression of the game is poor due to the lack of Ui basics everyone is used to and are industry standard for good reasons. You only get one first impression and right now the UI is a shoddy one for new players to come into.

I have harped on this topic since early beta. They had most of the expected functionality such as seeing more than one quest at a time, nameplates, Minimap, etc as options, combat log tab, and all those goodies. They were the removed as a pre-launch pr move due to community whines by people who hadn't even played the game.

Attorneyatlawl · August 2014

I do hope that now that we are past launch, the UI flaws get some love... I doubt we'll get a substantial response but I hope the cm team such as @Zos_GinaBruno and @ZOS_JessicaFolsom‌ can at least forward this up the chain once more.

jelliedsoup · August 2014

Use around 20 addons. An add-on manager sounds like a plan.

daneyulebub17_ESO · August 2014

Tandor wrote: »

theyancey wrote: »

You could add on an add on updater that takes care of that automatically. You could test your add ons on PTS and relay any problems to the person who made it. You could make your own. Or you could just whine.

Not to mention that you could stick with the default UI, as doubtless a good many of those who have no technical issues with the game have done. Just because you're used to having something in another MMO doesn't mean that you need to have it here. Most add ons are simply designed to hand the game to you on a plate, like showing all the skyshards on the map, rather than - shock, horror - finding them. They're not essential.

Sure, many addons supply features for easy moders.

That's not what we're talking about here.

I personally don't use any that show nodes and shards or even crafting info, as I feel it ruins the fun of discovering those things myself.

I do however expect basic features in an MMO to be in the actual game.

But... unlike any MMO I've ever played, the designers have inexplicably left the responsibility for them to 3rd party scripters. (While requiring us players to find the addons, install them, set them up and update them.) Seriously, no game has it all--but I've never seen anything like what this one lacks in terms of standard MMO tools.

Here's a few off the top of my head:

Want to see what you just looted without opening you're bag or turning OFF auto-loot? You need an addon.

Want to hear a chime when someone sends you a tell, rather than it get lost in the text of your chat window so you never even see it? You need an addon.

Want to have the ability to do a basic search in the Guild Store? You need an addon.

Want to get a basic combat log in a chat window so you can see damage/heals/crits? You need an addon.

Want to silence the annoying, repetitious NPC banker's dialog that triggers every freaking time you jump out/in to the bank interface to go between Bank, Guild Bank, Guild Store? You need an addon.

This isn't about cheats, or having things handed to us. It's not even about filling in features that were consciously left out--like a minimap, which I can understand as conscious design decisions. It's about very basic stuff that there's just no excuse not to have in game in a modern MMO.

enem · August 2014

I only use a couple of addons, mainly to help me keep track of things such as research and provisioning knowledge across my 8 characters, but i rely on Advanced Filters a lot, helps immensely when dealing with the current everything-in-one-list view in the inventory and bank interfaces.

and I got to thinking ...

I wouldn't be able to do any of this on the PS4 version (if I ended up playing that (if it ever releases)) what a disaster that will be if the Zos UI is the only thing the player has available to them.

KhajitFurTrader · August 2014

daneyulebub17_ESO wrote: »

I do however expect basic features in an MMO to be in the actual game.
[...]
It's about very basic stuff that there's just no excuse not to have in game in a modern MMO.

Pausekey · August 2014

Tandor wrote: »

theyancey wrote: »

You could add on an add on updater that takes care of that automatically. You could test your add ons on PTS and relay any problems to the person who made it. You could make your own. Or you could just whine.

Not to mention that you could stick with the default UI, as doubtless a good many of those who have no technical issues with the game have done. Just because you're used to having something in another MMO doesn't mean that you need to have it here. Most add ons are simply designed to hand the game to you on a plate, like showing all the skyshards on the map, rather than - shock, horror - finding them. They're not essential.

Some are essential to my style of play. You may not find them to be that way, but for PvP and group content the ones I use are a must. Lots of the add-ons are time savers, or hand holders depending on your view, but the UI, combat and dps logs are built for functionality. So yes I do need to have them. They allow me to play the way I want to. If I didn't have them I would not be here.

Cogo · August 2014

daneyulebub17_ESO wrote: »

I do however expect basic features in an MMO to be in the actual game.

But... unlike any MMO I've ever played, the designers have inexplicably left the responsibility for them to 3rd party scripters. (While requiring us players to find them, install them, set them up and update them.) Seriously, no game has it all--but I've never seen anything like what this one lacks in terms of standard MMO tools.

Here's a few off the top of my head:

Want to see what you just looted without opening you're bag or turning OFF auto-loot? You need an addon.

Want to hear a chime when someone sends you a tell, rather than it get lost in the text of your chat window so you never even see it? You need an addon.

Want to have the ability to do a basic search in the Guild Store? You need an addon.

Want to get a basic combat log in a chat window so you can see damage/heals/crits? You need an addon.

Want to silence the annoying, repetitious NPC banker's dialog that triggers every freaking time you jump out/in to the bank interface to go between Bank, Guild Bank, Guild Store? You need an addon.

This isn't about cheats, or having things handed to us. It's not even about filling in features that were consciously left out--like a minimap, which I can understand as conscious design decisions. It's about very basic stuff that there's just no excuse not to have in game in a modern MMO.

Basic? You know what an MMORPG is right? There are no "basic" features in any MMORPG other then its an online, nonestop multiuser roleplaying game.

What the game is, has different types. Just like other games. "basic" I think is what you are used too. ESO is a new type of MMO and sets its own "basics"

All your suggestion above I really enjoy being without. Zenimax allows addons. Be happy with that. Even in WoW you need addons to raid.

By your suggestions, I wonder if you read what ESO is. Its about immersion, story, almost to be in it. I dont want a minimap that ruins that. They even said that the UI will be clean and let addons work since thats always been the TES way.

What they can do is extend on their own "basic" systems. And they are.
Thing they can do is better logs, saving text emails, store searches, yes

Modern MMO? Without innovation and go with your own Vision, we would still be playing Muds....or UO.

I have to note that quite a lot want combat log of damage. Why? For once, you get to see for yourself what works and not......instead of calculating numbers.

And for autoloot. I never understood that. But its a feature they give you.

Cogo · August 2014

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

daneyulebub17_ESO wrote: »

theyancey wrote: »

You could add on an add on updater that takes care of that automatically. You could test your add ons on PTS and relay any problems to the person who made it. You could make your own. Or you could just whine.

Well, the 1st of your points is a spotty solution at best--the updaters are fairly beta-ish, require upkeep and updating themselves, and you still have to deal with broken updates and bugs--which are legion after a major game update.

The 2nd misses my point 100%, but thanks for suggesting I take the time to beta test addons on the PTS when the whole point of my post is I don't want to mess with this crap.

For the 3rd, see the preceding.

As to your 4th point--I wasn't whining--I was reiterating a basic flaw with a game that relies so much on 3rd party volunteer scripters to fill in its gaps.

Quoted for truth. Having to rely on addons for what is really basic and standard functionality in MMO titles is very aggravating. All due respect to addon volunteers of course and not to minimize their donated time and code, but..

Addons depend on third party authors .
Addons aren't always well integrated.
Addons require constant updates.
Addons can't accomplish many things such as real (not faked) buff tracking or nameplates due to api limitations.
Addons break with most patches.
Addons often have performance or crash issues.
Addons are not the place for basics like timestamps in chat or a minimap.

Finally addons are not something many new players look for right a anyway thus their first impression of the game is poor due to the lack of Ui basics everyone is used to and are industry standard for good reasons. You only get one first impression and right now the UI is a shoddy one for new players to come into.

I have harped on this topic since early beta. They had most of the expected functionality such as seeing more than one quest at a time, nameplates, Minimap, etc as options, combat log tab, and all those goodies. They were the removed as a pre-launch pr move due to community whines by people who hadn't even played the game.

Standard? Most Eve players dont use any addons. Standard is what the game said it should be.

If we gonna talk standard then lets talk leveling. Standard for reaching highest level in an MMO is 3-6 months, because thats what it took in EQ.

Regarding the UI. I am very happy with it. Its smooth, none cloggy and I can focus on the game....not on buttons. A tell window would be nice, yes.
The UI is clean for a reason......so as many players as possible can use addons they want to use.

Cogo · August 2014

daneyulebub17_ESO wrote: »

...sucks.

Two of 'em crash right away. Now get to log out, then go spend 20 minutes updating them all. Assuming they have updates yet.

Joy.

This kind of crap is what I always think of when some doofus chimes in with: "Duh, what are you complaining about--there's an add-on for that" when a basic, common-to-mmos-but-missing-in-ESO feature is brought up.

You are wrong. Zenimax was clear long before launch that the UI would be small and addon friendly.

I enjoy no addons. Its really cool to fight and "know" how I am doing without looking at an addon. You know.....thinking.

Cogo · August 2014

Lynx7386 wrote: »

Zos is outsourcing half of their game feature coding to people that will do it for free. Clever, but for those of us who refuse to use add-ons, it's a major issue.

Basic features should be included in the product.

What a wrong statement. LONG before release Zenimax did several statements about a clean UI and support for addons.

Outsourcing? You mean like WoW doing?

I dont use any addon. I dont have any major issue. Minor maybe but they keep improving the game. What major issue do you mean?

Exarch · August 2014

I fail to see how the story, or the immersion is better served by having the entire inventory dumped into an indivisible scrolling list, rather than separate individually-accessible view-all containers. I suppose I'm just one of the philistines who don't understand that a new car that comes without cupholders, or a central console storage space, is being bold and innovative rather than failing to build upon what has come before.

Gillysan · August 2014

This seems to be a thread more about growing pains, LMAO

kijima · August 2014

This will be a long post, feel free to skip, but this is my take on add-ons.

@Attorneyatlawl‌ I agree with some of the things you are saying, but a lot of what you said is easily avoidable. Use add-ons that people have a lot of success with, the ones that have download counts in the 10's of thousands will help, and when you know you are up for an update, turn all your add-ons off before the game update, and then update your add-ons. As for the game crashing or being slower due to add-ons, well my experience thus far is exactly the opposite. I run at an average of 36FPS (not great I know, but it's okay) and that's both with and without my 10 add-ons I constantly run, and I've never crashed because of any of them.

A little off topic if I continue, but for those that haven't used addons, take some time to look at what they can offer you. I have about 10 running at the moment and I like them all and they do very, very different things.

Most of them assist in time management, and yes while I need to update them when a new big patch comes out, the time my add-ons saves me is worth FAR more than the little time required to downloading my 10 add-ons (I think all of them are under 1mb)

I've not come from an add-ons background, skyrim and oblivion etc were all PS3 for me, and what I've come to realize is you hamper yourself not having add-ons, and here is why.

1. You waste time without their help
2. You make avoidable mistakes because information isn't "at hand"
3. You won't be as competitive without them

And I'll give you just one example of three points I've stated.

1. Running Roomba has helped me stop wasting time stacking items in my own bank and my guild banks where I actively store things. When the guild bank is full @ 500/500 and I can't deposit whatever it is I want to deposit, I can run roomba and within a minute all the items in the guild bank have been re-stacked, and space might have gone from a full 500 to 450 and I can deposit what I need and move on quickly to whatever it is I want to do.

2. I've deconstructed gear that I could have learned traits from, now I have a little red icon (can't remember the mods name) next to the itemif I haven't learned that trait. It stops me deconstructing gear I need to learn.

3. Having a meter on my enemies means I could see when they are at 30% or less health and then use something like impale to greater effect as that skill works best when the target is under 30%. Or maybe you are using siege and don't want to light up a keep (keeps light up at under 50% of wall remaining for those that don't know) With meters, I can see where the door/wall is and stop just before I get to 50%, it's great for someone that does advanced attacks before the zerg comes-a-knocking. Before having that and on, I was guessing where 30% might be on their health bar or 50% on a door/wall.

All very simple add on's and they have added a lot to my experience and more so, my effectiveness in game.

I would urge anyone playing the game currently not running add on's to at the very least just look at what add on's are available and it's not cheating, if you think of it like that without actually having a look at what add on's are available, then you are missing out.

If you spend 30 mins at a bank where you could spend say 5 tops, then you are wasting what precious game time you have set aside doing mundane things that shouldn't keep you away from questing, killing or crafting. Unless of course banking is indeed your thing.

I have one mod, it's an outfitting mod that lets me save an outfit with weapons, jewelery and Armour fitout for a specific task, I can then save my 'speed' gear as exactly that, speed. So if I'm scroll grabbing, I can just select that outfit and at the touch of one button I can change all my gear over quickly. It just makes for good time management in game. Does that help me or give me an advantage while I'm going toe to toe with a combatant in Cyrodiil? No, but it does give me more time in say a 2hour block of playing that I might have set aside rather than fapping about with bank items, gear and so on when I can be spilling blood on the battlefield instead.

That's my thoughts anyway, right or wrong.

Ojustaboo · August 2014

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Tubben wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

3. Even if the first two things weren't true, it's still not ZO's problem. Addons are maintained by third-party developers. It's their job to fix addons if an update breaks them.

It is if i cancel my subscription because i cant stand that lousy UI

Then ask them to change the UI instead of whining about them not also doing the addon developers' jobs for them.

They won't change the UI, because many (if not most) players like the minimal UI the way it is. But you're complaining to ZO about something they have no responsibility for or control over.

some addons have been downloaded a fair few times.

Skyshards 772,000

Harvestmap 506,000

lorebooks 454,000

wykkyds framework over 415,000

lootdrop over 321,000

inventory grid view 253,000

sous chef 224,000

Before release Zenimax said they wanted to encourage people to write various addons for many of the requested features, the way they now communicate with the addon guys well if I had written one, I would have given up supporting it a couple of months ago.

They do have a responsibility and they do have control as they decide what the api lets the modders do.

Cyberdown · August 2014

I really hated this system in WOT as well. You would go through effort to get the games UI to where it should be (not that this games UI sucks) and then next patch comes and everythings broken and you have to deal with a Spartan UI for a few days/weeks....and that's if the author is around to fix it.

Basic things like skyshard map and that addon that puts info on the mouse over info on resources....just stick that in game already.