Rare Motifs = In-game currency isn't enough for some players (ARGH!)

KariTR

I hate BoP with a passion. I really hope that Zeni continues to use it only in moderation.

Look, this is a new game and only Zeni have the data necessary to decide whether drops need to be reduced, bosses need to be tweaked, class skills need to be adjusted etc. You just have to trust that game companies know what they are doing when changes are made, because generally players sure as hell don't. As evidenced by the plethora of unrealistic and totally self-serving suggestions.

In the greater scheme of things, it doesn't matter that Mr Vet10 2 weeks after the game launched had a greater chance of picking up a rare motif than we did, It just doesn't. That motif has long been consumed and chances are it was consumed by a player-character that didn't even resubscribe.

babylon

KariTR wrote: »

That motif has long been consumed and chances are it was consumed by a player-character that didn't even resubscribe.

Err, the goldsellers are selling these for real money. As are the early exploiters (real money or tons of ingame currency).

At this point, the only solutions are as we have posted, ZOS needs to do this to restore the game.

• increase drop rates and make all motifs and recipes bind to account on pickup
• increase drop rates significantly so all players can get what they want

Either one of the two possible options above will take the profit away from the goldsellers and exploiters, as well as returning a sense of fun and exploration back to the real players when we search buildings.

KariTR

It's already been pointed out to you that gold-sellers will use whatever they can to get people to their sites. Of all the bot activity in this game, I have never once seen a bot opening a container, so I would love to know where they got these motifs they supposedly have from.

Don't believe the spam. Trust Zenimax to know what they are doing. Carry on and play your game.

babylon

No, ZOS needs to do what we are suggesting. So far all they have done is damage the game experience for real players, so now it's time to listen to some outside help (us players).

reggielee

what a moron, paying 200 real dollars for a cosmetic look to an online games char armor. geeze, I wish i had that dolts number, I could sell them anything

KariTR

How is a lower drop rate on a cosmetic item damaging your, sorry 'our', game?

signed
Real Player

babylon

reggielee wrote: »

what a moron, paying 200 real dollars for a cosmetic look to an online games char armor. geeze, I wish i had that dolts number, I could sell them anything

As was posted earlier in thread it's probably the exploiters/goldsellers faking the WTB for 200 dollars or crazy ingame gold amounts (trying to set precedents for the prices).

snowmanflvb14_ESO

ipkonfigcub18_ESO wrote: »

Good job on nerfing the rare Motifs, Zenimax. Now we have players asking for real currency for the Daedric Motif in the game. You've made it so rare that some players are charging up to $200 via PayPal to obtain the item from them. (and you better bet players are paying out real cash for items like this in your game)

If you're going to continue to nerf item drops like this in your game then you should greatly expect to see players abusing your games system even more in the near future. I don't care if every player later has the Daedric Motif skins - to me it's just fun stuff to have. And I don't care if Johny-Nose-Picker doesn't want other players having it because his snot-nose thinks he should only be the unique player in the game.

Stop nerfing items that give players a chance to have fun and put a stop to players extorting other players within your game.

Step up to the plate, Zenimax, and start doing something about these types of abuse in your game. You developed this game but as of late you seem to have about-faced us.

You have two options here and one of them making Motifs bind-on-pickup. The other is to just let players enjoy the game with the previous drop rates and have fun.

Perhaps you should report the players selling items such as the motifs for cash.

KariTR

snowmanflvb14_ESO wrote: »

ipkonfigcub18_ESO wrote: »

Good job on nerfing the rare Motifs, Zenimax. Now we have players asking for real currency for the Daedric Motif in the game. You've made it so rare that some players are charging up to $200 via PayPal to obtain the item from them. (and you better bet players are paying out real cash for items like this in your game)

If you're going to continue to nerf item drops like this in your game then you should greatly expect to see players abusing your games system even more in the near future. I don't care if every player later has the Daedric Motif skins - to me it's just fun stuff to have. And I don't care if Johny-Nose-Picker doesn't want other players having it because his snot-nose thinks he should only be the unique player in the game.

Stop nerfing items that give players a chance to have fun and put a stop to players extorting other players within your game.

Step up to the plate, Zenimax, and start doing something about these types of abuse in your game. You developed this game but as of late you seem to have about-faced us.

You have two options here and one of them making Motifs bind-on-pickup. The other is to just let players enjoy the game with the previous drop rates and have fun.

Perhaps you should report the players selling items such as the motifs for cash.

I suggested the same thing, but I very much suspect it was someone having a crack in zone chat. Like wine, humour doesn't travel well

ShintaiDK

Daedric is just a style. Playing 200$ for it means you are plain stupid. And I got some bridges to sell to you as well.

Personally I would never wear daerdric either.

Rocksteady

Who does it hurt when "Random person" enters their credit card info into a shady website only to find they were just as shady as they seemed to be? Doesn't hurt me. In fact, it makes me kinda happy and I would laugh really hard if I ever saw somebody do it. After 20 mins of laughing at them I would neglect to advise them that they should contact their bank and report their card as "stolen". Really though, what the hell do I care if dumb people get voluntarily robbed via the internet? I wonder how many of you are just angry because you tried to buy some of this "CHEAP GOLD" or "SUPER CHEAP ULTRA RARE MOTIF" only to find that they were just looking to steal your credit card and not give you any gold.

Blackwolfe5

Yes, who does it hurt? Well, it promotes botting, it promotes hacks, it promotes further goldselling. And we've seen how bad the bot infestation is in ESO.. so..

Fairydragon3

babylon wrote: »

No, ZOS needs to do what we are suggesting. So far all they have done is damage the game experience for real players, so now it's time to listen to some outside help (us players).

What you are suggesting would be no different than just letting you start off with the ability to craft all styles. This is not a single player game where everything is just handed to you just because you are high enough level. and you went to the right place. Try actually playing the game as it is, an MMORPG, Player interaction is all you need. Make friends, participate in the economy. Eventually you will get it. But really stop trying to dumb down this game that already pretty much throws everything you need at you. you just have to be diligent, and patient with the rare stuff.

driosketch

Rocksteady wrote: »

Who does it hurt when "Random person" enters their credit card info into a shady website only to find they were just as shady as they seemed to be? Doesn't hurt me. In fact, it makes me kinda happy and I would laugh really hard if I ever saw somebody do it. After 20 mins of laughing at them I would neglect to advise them that they should contact their bank and report their card as "stolen". Really though, what the hell do I care if dumb people get voluntarily robbed via the internet? I wonder how many of you are just angry because you tried to buy some of this "CHEAP GOLD" or "SUPER CHEAP ULTRA RARE MOTIF" only to find that they were just looking to steal your credit card and not give you any gold.

I can see at least one scenario where said stolen card is used to fund more bot and spam accounts.

babylon

Fairydragon3 wrote: »

What you are suggesting would be no different than just letting you start off with the ability to craft all styles..

Not at all - returning to the pre-nerf drop rates combined with binding the motifs and recipes to account still means players will need to search through many boxes to get all the things they want.

What it will do is make it possible again to find these items, and will completely remove the profit from the goldsellers and exploiters.

The game will be back to where it should be, as far as container loot goes.

Rocksteady

driosketch wrote: »

Rocksteady wrote: »

Who does it hurt when "Random person" enters their credit card info into a shady website only to find they were just as shady as they seemed to be? Doesn't hurt me. In fact, it makes me kinda happy and I would laugh really hard if I ever saw somebody do it. After 20 mins of laughing at them I would neglect to advise them that they should contact their bank and report their card as "stolen". Really though, what the hell do I care if dumb people get voluntarily robbed via the internet? I wonder how many of you are just angry because you tried to buy some of this "CHEAP GOLD" or "SUPER CHEAP ULTRA RARE MOTIF" only to find that they were just looking to steal your credit card and not give you any gold.

I can see at least one scenario where said stolen card is used to fund more bot and spam accounts.

That is correct... I forget sometimes of the horror stories and screenshots of bot armies simply because I've honestly never encountered more than a few node harvesting trains that never bothered me much(I understand I'm a minority). And as for the economy, I've played enough MMOs to know that after a couple years, none of this inflation will really mean anything as there will be gold sinks galore and new fancy items to trade that make the old ones obsolete.

Fairydragon3

babylon wrote: »

Fairydragon3 wrote: »

What you are suggesting would be no different than just letting you start off with the ability to craft all styles..

Not at all - returning to the pre-nerf rates combined with binding the motifs and recipes to account still means players will need to search through many boxes to get all the things they want.

It will make it possible again to find these items, and will completely remove the profit from the goldsellers and exploiters.

The game will be back to where it should be, as far as container loot goes.

Takes away player interaction, you are not stopping the gold sellers at all, they will just move on to another strategy. Just report anyone advertising this RMT and they get banned. Simple as that, but I want to make it clear to ZOS.

I dont want this suggestion to be implemented, it takes away from the fact this is an MMO, where a big part of the fun factor, is player interactions. I don't want to go around looting thousand of containers, getting multiple copies, hoping I get the motif I want, I have made a couple of friends and fellow crafter though some of my transactions for these items, same thing when I bought a vampire bite, they were being sold for 20-40k, and people were being ripped off. I love how the person who bit me, was friendly and helpful, for only 5k, I gave him a 1k tip

PLEASE DON'T CHANGE THE BASIC FUNCTIONS OF YOUR GAME JUST TO COMBAT BOTS AND EXPLOITERS, THEY WILL GET AROUND IT ANYWAY AS KNOW YOU ARE WELL AWARE. i ASK THAT YOU CONTINUE YOUR FIGHT AGAINST THEM, AND WE WILL HANDLE THE ECONOMY



to my fellow players, please dont be stupid and give in to RMT, since that is the reason bots find their way back into the game. They willsteal your info and buy more accounts

Sakiri

Up the drop chance, bind on pick up.

Done.

babylon

Fairydragon3 wrote: »

babylon wrote: »

Fairydragon3 wrote: »

What you are suggesting would be no different than just letting you start off with the ability to craft all styles..

Not at all - returning to the pre-nerf rates combined with binding the motifs and recipes to account still means players will need to search through many boxes to get all the things they want.

It will make it possible again to find these items, and will completely remove the profit from the goldsellers and exploiters.

The game will be back to where it should be, as far as container loot goes.

Takes away player interaction, you are not stopping the gold sellers at all, they will just move on to another strategy.

It will completely remove this particular source of income from the goldsellers and exploiters (RNG loot from containers). Player interaction is retained through selling all other items (ones gained from hard work and crafting for example), and through group ventures such as dungeons and all the rest like guilds and chatting, and so on. Stop with the hysteria.

As for what else they move onto or continue doing, tackle that in a separate initiative. This issue however can be solved by the measures we have suggested - either:

• increase drop rates and make all motifs and recipes bind to account on pickup
  OR
• increase drop rates significantly so all players can get what they want

I prefer the first of the two upon much consideration.

It's a solid suggestion and there is no possible reason not to implement it.

Skirmish840

So I'm guilty of not reading the whole damn thread, 1stly I haven't seen a Motif in F'n ages and I LOOT EVERYTHING, it's not fun, I spend half my night deleting crap out of my bag ffs in the unlikely chance I get to find a motif "yeah right" I like rare, not impossible.

Why can't Zenimax and Co. trace the black market sell site transactions to real players, I mean I don't know crap about tracing anything on computers, but really, did this company make this game the way it is and never have foreseen the *** that is now occurring, never have a plan B or contingencies. I'm not paying for a F'n motif with my hard earned cash, I'd be happy to pay ingame currency that I worked hard to earn, you know that cut I get after rapid gear decay has had it's unfair share.

Lock the damn Motif's and other rare's to "BOP account wide" it would really snag me if I picked up a motif on the one char I didn't need it on and couldn't transfer it to the right one, same with gear, then lift drop rates to a reasonable level, still rare but not impossible.

/Sigh

Reenlister

Not to get in a debate about the how to fix, I will just say that something is way wrong with the new drops.
Since the nerf I have not found a single motif of any kind, plus like others have said, I am pretty annoyed at opening containers marked as having something in them only to find
"EMPTY CONTAINER"
As far as the RMT issue, well at this rate the bots and the sellers are running the show, and not much has proven very helpful, but anyone can see that the recent trend has been to suck the life out of anyone trying to buy something, and if you don't think the RMT groups are the ones big time behind the attempt to inflate and control the current economy, then just wow....

Iorail

Reenlister wrote: »

As far as the RMT issue, well at this rate the bots and the sellers are running the show, and not much has proven very helpful, but anyone can see that the recent trend has been to suck the life out of anyone trying to buy something, and if you don't think the RMT groups are the ones big time behind the attempt to inflate and control the current economy, then just wow....

Right here and for the looks of it, ZoS made it that way with the nonsense changes they, and only they believe to be good. They shoot themselves not only on the foot but on the head also. Good job ZoS, Good Frikking Job!

F7sus4

badmojo wrote: »

So what's the solution? Nothing is rare because people might sell it? No thanks.

The solution I've proposed was making it hard-drop instead of random-drop, so you will find every book if you know the right place. The same way Mages' Guild lorebook are being found.

Takanami

I completely agree OP
increase drop rate so its above 0.03% (may be exaggerating a TINY bit) but make them bind to account

wrlifeboil

Iorail wrote: »

Reenlister wrote: »

As far as the RMT issue, well at this rate the bots and the sellers are running the show, and not much has proven very helpful, but anyone can see that the recent trend has been to suck the life out of anyone trying to buy something, and if you don't think the RMT groups are the ones big time behind the attempt to inflate and control the current economy, then just wow....

Right here and for the looks of it, ZoS made it that way with the nonsense changes they, and only they believe to be good. They shoot themselves not only on the foot but on the head also. Good job ZoS, Good Frikking Job!

The motif sellers must be kicking themselves for selling those motifs during the first 2-3 weeks. I thought 30k gold was expensive for daedric. Now that seems be too cheap.

starkerealm

Takanami wrote: »

I completely agree OP
increase drop rate so its above 0.03% (may be exaggerating a TINY bit) but make them bind to account

The drop rate itself (probably) didn't change. They just put horrific diminishing returns on the drops. So if you don't get it from the first thing you search, you might as well log out and back in an hour or two later.

Raash

If z-max raises thé droprates back to pre nerf they could go all thé way and just make consol commands free. How about a /additem deadra motif? Not convinient enough? Just make /additem allmotifs. I hope they never sink that low and gives in to the "I want it now so I demand to have it NOW"-crowd.

Blackwolfe5

Natually changing the droprates to the pre-nerf values would have to be combined with other changes as well. The nerf felt like more of a panic move instead of a real fix.

Nox_Aeterna

It was too much i will have to agree.

Right now it is just ridiculous.

They just shot themselves in the foot , now people need the buy the mofits from the actual gold sellers to acquire them lols.

And while my guild does offer any item at mats cost to its members, which means one way or the other i will have the gear without having to deal with the people selling it , i would rather have the motifs myself , reason i lvled the skill and research tons of traits non stop.

Epsilon_Echo

Lul wot?

Ok let me see if I can completely recreate this argument in a different setting so it sounds as ridiculous as it really is.

"Did you hear? Some dude broke into the car dealership and stole alot of their cars. I mean, there are still cars left, just not the model I wanted. Screw those car dealer guys! I mean now they screwed me over and I have to go buy a stolen car from that thief. How dare they!"

This is ridiculous. Drop rate in any game has NOTHING to do with fairness and balance. Drop rate is completely at the whim of the dev and has been since the dawn of video games. What kind of world do we live in where somebody else cheats the system and other people think that entitles them to a free handout of whatever was stolen so everything is "even-steven".

Now if you'll will excuse me I have to go grind in cyrodiil for that "Covenants Greatsword" that rng has it out for me not to get.