So, where's the skill-line to those who are faithful "men" instead of vamps or WW?

bg22

This isn't a thread to talk about the ridiculousness of Vamp abilities, or anything like... But simply a question toward the dev's - Where is the skill-line that only those of use remaining faithful to the race of "men"?

Slighty unbalanced that only by choosing vampire/WW you can gain a skill-line, but lose nothing. How about making just fighter guild skills available to non-vamp/ww players?

That seems like the logical thing to do...

ArgonianAssassin

How about a Dawnguard skill line focused on the hunting of werewolf/undead targets? I'd prefer that over making Fighters guild unavailable to such a large portion of the player base, and your idea would make Intimidating Presence unavailable to all these players, and that's unacceptable.

killingspreeb16_ESO

how about make fighters guild only work in pve and make something like dawnguard skill line avaible for player not affected by licantrophy or vampirism (for vampire/werewolf they can add clan/packs for unlock additional skill)

Eivar

skill lines based on the divines, you get to pick one to follow and get a skill line associated with that deity

ErilAq

The thing is that Vampirism and Lycanthropy are curses (or gifts) from daedric princes Molag Bal and Hircine, granting normal mortals extra powers (with unpleasant side effects and weaknesses) so a "normal being" skill line is the racial abilities.

JoseDelgadoCub17_ESO

I put skill points into monster skill line.

ChampionSheWolf

Because the Fighter's Guild is the Dawnguard skill line. Seriously, being a werewolf certainly isn't a big deal, and being a vamp will be getting nipped soon enough as it is. Furthermore, Dawnguard wasn't formed until the 2nd era, and that's a rumor how it even started, and was a small sect located in the Riften province, so even barring all that I doubt they would be some widespread group. They also weren't the specialist vampire hunters (and only vampire hunters) they were in the Dawnguard expansion as the rumor says they were there to guard some prince that was turned into a vampire, not destroy them.

Anastasia

ArgonianAssassin wrote: »

How about a Dawnguard skill line focused on the hunting of werewolf/undead targets? I'd prefer that over making Fighters guild unavailable to such a large portion of the player base, and your idea would make Intimidating Presence unavailable to all these players, and that's unacceptable.

---

Ooooh ArgonianAssassin --- I SOOOOO like that idea! Yummy lil boost for those who take a stand for the light and focus on that in their build!

It wouldn't be me though, as I am of the darkside ^-^.

But, your idea is awesome!!

The_Sadist

There isn't any because why would there be?
They should add more options (lich springs to mind) but outside of that there shouldn't be a 'oh you're a normal person here have a skill line' option.. The price of being a vampire / werewolf comes at a cost, this cost is meant to make an individual question becoming a vampire / werewolf... the alternative is stay normal and not receive the positives and negatives associated with either disease.

Brittany_Joy

cbrown15_ESO wrote: »

Because the Fighter's Guild is the Dawnguard skill line. Seriously, being a werewolf certainly isn't a big deal, and being a vamp will be getting nipped soon enough as it is. Furthermore, Dawnguard wasn't formed until the 2nd era, and that's a rumor how it even started, and was a small sect located in the Riften province, so even barring all that I doubt they would be some widespread group. They also weren't the specialist vampire hunters (and only vampire hunters) they were in the Dawnguard expansion as the rumor says they were there to guard some prince that was turned into a vampire, not destroy them.

I am purdy sure we are in the 2nd Era. ZoS even said they wanted to add more to the werewolf and vampire skill line. So we might see an equivalent patch similar to Dawnguard for ESO.

Also to answer the OP's question the skill line you are wishing for is already in the game known as the fighter's guild which has dawnguard-like abilities such as the crossbow. Kinda silly to ask for something that is clearly already in the game.

ChampionSheWolf

Brittany_Joy wrote: »

I am purdy sure we are in the 2nd Era. ZoS even said they wanted to add more to the werewolf and vampire skill line. So we might see an equivalent patch similar to Dawnguard for ESO.

Also to answer the OP's question the skill line you are wishing for is already in the game known as the fighter's guild which has dawnguard-like abilities such as the crossbow. Kinda silly to ask for something that is clearly already in the game.

And that was the point. The 2nd Era Dawnguard is not the same as the Skyrim Dawnguard. The ones in the 2nd Era were formed as bodyguards, not vampire hunters.

bg22

Brittany_Joy wrote: »

cbrown15_ESO wrote: »

Because the Fighter's Guild is the Dawnguard skill line. Seriously, being a werewolf certainly isn't a big deal, and being a vamp will be getting nipped soon enough as it is. Furthermore, Dawnguard wasn't formed until the 2nd era, and that's a rumor how it even started, and was a small sect located in the Riften province, so even barring all that I doubt they would be some widespread group. They also weren't the specialist vampire hunters (and only vampire hunters) they were in the Dawnguard expansion as the rumor says they were there to guard some prince that was turned into a vampire, not destroy them.

I am purdy sure we are in the 2nd Era. ZoS even said they wanted to add more to the werewolf and vampire skill line. So we might see an equivalent patch similar to Dawnguard for ESO.

Also to answer the OP's question the skill line you are wishing for is already in the game known as the fighter's guild which has dawnguard-like abilities such as the crossbow. Kinda silly to ask for something that is clearly already in the game.

Yeah, except for... No.

The vamps/ww's have access to the fighters guild skills as well and this is the 2nd era, so you're completely wrong in every way. Thanks tho.

Nox_Aeterna

Lose nothing :P?

Hehehehe

ok OP , make all "men" lose "nothing" then we will talk.

Iceman_mat

Fighters of Akavir skill tree. Doesn't give bonuses against werewolf or vampire but gives it's own bonuses like vampire or werewolf that has it's own special way of being initiated. Though they would be OP to start balance them into the other 2 so that it gives a trifecta within a trifecta (DC vs AD vs BP / Were vs Vamp vs Aka) which would add more player choice and option.

For those who choose neither of these or the "nah *** that" just work in a player bounty system (seen as vampire? 1k gold on your ass) and players will balance it out. Just need to balance the reward vs what counts as being "seen" / "seen as vampire / wolf".

Or nerf the *** out of both of them. That works too.


-Cheers

Brittany_Joy

bg22 wrote: »

Brittany_Joy wrote: »

cbrown15_ESO wrote: »

Because the Fighter's Guild is the Dawnguard skill line. Seriously, being a werewolf certainly isn't a big deal, and being a vamp will be getting nipped soon enough as it is. Furthermore, Dawnguard wasn't formed until the 2nd era, and that's a rumor how it even started, and was a small sect located in the Riften province, so even barring all that I doubt they would be some widespread group. They also weren't the specialist vampire hunters (and only vampire hunters) they were in the Dawnguard expansion as the rumor says they were there to guard some prince that was turned into a vampire, not destroy them.

I am purdy sure we are in the 2nd Era. ZoS even said they wanted to add more to the werewolf and vampire skill line. So we might see an equivalent patch similar to Dawnguard for ESO.

Also to answer the OP's question the skill line you are wishing for is already in the game known as the fighter's guild which has dawnguard-like abilities such as the crossbow. Kinda silly to ask for something that is clearly already in the game.

Yeah, except for... No.

The vamps/ww's have access to the fighters guild skills as well and this is the 2nd era, so you're completely wrong in every way. Thanks tho.

You don't have to be negative. and I am not wrong at all because there is nothing to disprove. We are in the 2nd era and ZoS shared that they would add more to the whole werewolf and vampire skill line. The fighter's guild was also influenced by the dawnguard shown in Skyrim, the crossbow and added bonus damage to monsters prove that. However the lore is basically what Cbrown said, they were not monster hunters in the 2nd era but they did exist in the 2nd era.

I see you want an exclusive skill line that no werewolf or vampire has access to but that just seems like nitpicking and bickering about such a small thing. In the end, you still have the fighter's guild skill line which basically offers what you want but you just want to take away from other players. Why do you feel the need to take something away from certain players and 'cause segregation? There is no need for such selfish behavior.

bg22

[/quote]
You don't have to be negative. and I am not wrong at all because there is nothing to disprove. We are in the 2nd era and ZoS shared that they would add more to the whole werewolf and vampire skill line. The fighter's guild was also influenced by the dawnguard shown in Skyrim, the crossbow and added bonus damage to monsters prove that. However the lore is basically what Cbrown said, they were not monster hunters in the 2nd era but they did exist in the 2nd era.

I see you want an exclusive skill line that no werewolf or vampire has access to but that just seems like nitpicking and bickering about such a small thing. In the end, you still have the fighter's guild skill line which basically offers what you want but you just want to take away from other players. Why do you feel the need to take something away from certain players and 'cause segregation? There is no need for such selfish behavior.
[/quote]

So, it makes sense that vamps n' ww's can use the skill line that is meant to fight them? By your logic, I as niether a vamp or a ww, should have access to both of those skill-lines w/o being either.

In other words, you're a vampire and your comments are biased so please save your time, and mine and stop putting forth comments, they're irrelevant.

Iceman_mat wrote: »

Fighters of Akavir skill tree. Doesn't give bonuses against werewolf or vampire but gives it's own bonuses like vampire or werewolf that has it's own special way of being initiated. Though they would be OP to start balance them into the other 2 so that it gives a trifecta within a trifecta (DC vs AD vs BP / Were vs Vamp vs Aka) which would add more player choice and option.

For those who choose neither of these or the "nah *** that" just work in a player bounty system (seen as vampire? 1k gold on your ass) and players will balance it out. Just need to balance the reward vs what counts as being "seen" / "seen as vampire / wolf".

Or nerf the *** out of both of them. That works too.


-Cheers

Exactly this. ^

dodgehopper_ESO

Vigil of stendarr makes more sense to me in this era.

The_Sadist

That logic works both ways, you're not a vampire and your comments are therefore biased so please stop posting in order to save everyone's time.

Vampires and werewolves in the fighter's guild doesn't have any impact on a normal individual outside of 'we don't have our own club house'. Me dealing more damage to undead does not put a non-vampire/werewolf at a disadvantage.

Basically stop trying make fighter's guild ban vampires/werewolves, because it's not going to happen.

IF they do release a third 'vampire/werewolf hunter' specific world skill you'll also receive a debuff alongside the new passives and whatnot which will make you question becoming said hunter in the first place.

I don't understand all of the complaining, werewolves are indistinguishable from normal races and so is a well fed vampire.. the idea of them being in the fighter's guild is completely realistic.

tylarthb16_ESO

Could have fighters guild and mages guild lines suspended while afflicted.

Phoenix99

It's fine as it is with the selection.. the thing is, that instead of making WW and vamp flavor picks (vamps very weak during the day and rather strong during the night, WWs have inherit weakness when not in WW form, but in WW from it's a melee beast), they made Vamp mandatory and ridiculously strong in conjunction with some other classes, while WW got the flavor, but also got the bugs, so it's rather unplayable.

Baphomet

Because the fighter guild skill line is sort of a lackluster skill line for fighting vampires and werewolves (and stamina based only), I kinda like idea of a Dawnguard and Silverhand skill lines. Each could/should have just a few passives and actives in them. Dawnguard could be magicka based and Silverhand stamina based.

The_Sadist

Baphomet wrote: »

Because the fighter guild skill line is sort of a lackluster skill line for fighting vampires and werewolves (and stamina based only), I kinda like idea of a Dawnguard and Silverhand skill lines. Each could/should have just a few passives and actives in them. Dawnguard could be magicka based and Silverhand stamina based.

What would the debuff be?

Furthermore, given these are specifically aimed at player based vampires / werewolves, would it be safe to assume werewolves / vampires will gain spells / passives which deal more damage to these Dawnguard / Silverhand individuals? Balancing and whatnot.

ChampionSheWolf

bg22 wrote: »

Yeah, except for... No.

The vamps/ww's have access to the fighters guild skills as well and this is the 2nd era, so you're completely wrong in every way. Thanks tho.

Except no, WW's had acess to Dawnguard. I was one. Dawnguard, in the 4th Era, is vampire hunters only. Dawnguard in the 2nd Era, if and when they are formed, are guardians of a vampire prince.

ArgonianAssassin

Phoenix99 wrote: »

It's fine as it is with the selection.. the thing is, that instead of making WW and vamp flavor picks (vamps very weak during the day and rather strong during the night, WWs have inherit weakness when not in WW form, but in WW from it's a melee beast), they made Vamp mandatory and ridiculously strong in conjunction with some other classes, while WW got the flavor, but also got the bugs, so it's rather unplayable.

Hey, please check out my vampire suggestion on this same sub forum, let me know what you think, I believe you'll quite like it. (:

Bhakura

I wondered that myself. That is also one of the reasons why so many people become a vamp or ww just for the extra skill line.
People who stay "clean" shouldnt be punished by denying any advantage the diseased population gets. Make no mistake, this isnt a small group anymore its a population, if anything, larger then people who dont become a vamp or ww.
Seeing tons of vamps during ingame daytime, and why shouldnt you, it only rewards, the negatives, pfft, to easy to counter, slap a resistance ring on and there, no more negatives, or even pick a race with innate resistance to counter the negatives and dont even need a ring or necklace anymore.
In all TES games that had vampirism or werewolf traits it turned the game upside down, there where negatives that made you play way differently.
In ESO, you can just run around unpunished for your choice, so theres no reason NOT to choose it. Fine, but give some love to the non undead-furball people as well or end up with a playerbase that only consists of diseased characters and a handfull of "healthy" loners who dont wanna be either.
maybe you shouldnt have called it Elderscrolls Online, but Underworld Online.

bg22

Bhakura wrote: »

I wondered that myself. That is also one of the reasons why so many people become a vamp or ww just for the extra skill line.
People who stay "clean" shouldnt be punished by denying any advantage the diseased population gets. Make no mistake, this isnt a small group anymore its a population, if anything, larger then people who dont become a vamp or ww.
Seeing tons of vamps during ingame daytime, and why shouldnt you, it only rewards, the negatives, pfft, to easy to counter, slap a resistance ring on and there, no more negatives, or even pick a race with innate resistance to counter the negatives and dont even need a ring or necklace anymore.
In all TES games that had vampirism or werewolf traits it turned the game upside down, there where negatives that made you play way differently.
In ESO, you can just run around unpunished for your choice, so theres no reason NOT to choose it. Fine, but give some love to the non undead-furball people as well or end up with a playerbase that only consists of diseased characters and a handfull of "healthy" loners who dont wanna be either.
maybe you shouldnt have called it Elderscrolls Online, but Underworld Online.

Well said. And that's the point. Despite the small fix today, even if vampires/ww's were over-powered at night, but incredibly vulnerable during the day it would satisfy the "normal" crowd, which as you said, has basically become a minority.

The bases of my original post is just that, there's everything to gain and nothing to lose when it comes to being a vampire, which is incredibly contradicting to TES lore. In my opinion, one of two things need to happen to fix this issue (because it is so bad, that ppl that I know are/have literally canceled their subs), either these skill-lines (vamp/ww) need to suffer greatly in some manner equal to the weight of the benefits, or the band-wagon needs to be denied access to another skill-line that "normals" have, i.e. Fighters-guild or the implementation of another skill-line.

Having the majority of the population being vampires is simply uncalled for. Vanilla ESO will be known as you said, Underworld Online.

Eivar

I still like my idea, of introducing either a Divines skill line, or a priesthood of Arkay, something that would be precluded from WW or Vamps, maybe not specifically set up to fight them, but having a couple magicka based abilities against Daedric influences(ie undead, werewolves, vamps)

The_Sadist

And you're basically saying "I'm at 12 year old who thinks Twilight is secretly awesome but can't admit it on the internet because I think I'm an epic troll." It seems pretty accurate, no?

You reject the notion of having a third world skill being implemented and your only solution is to kick vampires and werewolves from the fighter's guild despite the logic thrown in your face. You're being childish, throwing around insults and baiting because you can't form an actual counterargument.. Go read some lore.

Here's some for you, from the immortal blood book no less! 'I told him what I could. There was but one tribe in Cyrodiil, a powerful clan who had ousted all other competitors, much like the Imperials themselves had done. Their true name was unknown, lost in history, but they were experts at concealment. If they kept themselves well-fed, they were indistinguishable from living persons. They were cultured, more civilized than the vampires of the provinces, preferring to feed on victims while they were asleep, unaware.'
Werewolves are also NORMAL in appearance and the only indication they're werewolves is when they shift.. which they can go out and do in the wild.

Once again, come up with a solution that doesn't involve kicking people from guilds and get back to me.

bg22

Eivar wrote: »

I still like my idea, of introducing either a Divines skill line, or a priesthood of Arkay, something that would be precluded from WW or Vamps, maybe not specifically set up to fight them, but having a couple magicka based abilities against Daedric influences(ie undead, werewolves, vamps)

I like the idea as well. Creating a 3rd "world-skill" along the lines of ww/vamp seems like it would have been a no brainer. It's the same concept of 3 Alliances. The number keeps balance. I don't really care where the skill-line come from, so long as it has abilities on par w/ vamps and ww's.

And I'm already loving the tears from vampires in /zone. Crying because abilities were fixed. Not nerfed, but fixed. It's great.

xxslam48xxb14_ESO

bg22 wrote: »

- Where is the skill-line that only those of use remaining faithful to the race of "men"?

WHAT! So what your saying is if we are argonian or mer we aren't able to use this new skill line?!?! Yeah right how about a hist skill line only for argonians? Yeah how about that!

Thechemicals

Vamps and WW arent my thing and like most others, i was expecting a skill line for Dawnguard or Slayers, but instead we recieved the fighters guild.

Im going to guess that they didnt want to pigeon hole vampire and werewolf players by telling them they cant participate in quests from a Dawnguard or slayer line so they just made fighters guild for the masses and removed Dawnguard altogether.

The Dawnguard were the coolest and best answer to not wanting to be a vamp and they instead provided an advantage to players for being that and a disadvantage to those who said no to vamp/ww ism.