Camping Bloodfiend and Werewolf Spawns

mcatchlovb16_ESO

Who cares really? Get a life and move on. Go quest and come back another night or switch instances. It's not hard to get bitten.

ChairGraveyard

I suggest those that want bites join either

Dark Motherhood - Vampire Bites

Moonspeakers - WW Bites

These guilds will hook you up with free bites from players in the guild, or help you get to the spawn and get bit that way.

pokebreaker

Zershar_Vemod wrote: »

YgolohcysP wrote: »

Are you people serious?

You are sending in support tickets for players who are not AFK and farming a mob because you both want it and they are faster/better than you at killing it?

All I have for this thread is a big LoL!

You do know the official stance is that ZOS is against WW/Vamp camping right?

Zershar_Vemod, please provide a reference to ZOS' "Official Stance" on WW/Vamp camping.
As I always say, I do not condone mob camping, but I also don't condone players trying to scare other players using fictitious statements from ZOS.

Until a definitive post is cited about ZOS' being against WW/Vamp camping, the rumors are crap. The two quotes made by another poster above do not state that. They merely say they encourage users to report the incidents with a specific title, so that they may further investigate the issue.

I am not one to refute factual evidence, but this constant deception that disgruntled players are employing, saying that ZOS "Stated it was wrong", is BS. There has yet to be an official statement outlawing the camping. While griefing may very well be against the rules, they would have to check each individual case to ensure the elements of griefing are present; in which case, those who are camping the mobs for "Role Playing" reasons, or "lore", or whatever, wouldn't necessarily fall into the category of griefing, and would be allowed to continue.

Anyone have an ACTUAL clearly stated outlawing of WW/Vamp Camping?

Khazaad

Lava_Croft wrote: »

You do realize that nobody is going to get banned for killing mobs, however you are wasting customer support's time with these silly reports. Time they could spend on doing actual work and helping out people with actual problems.

It's griefing. There's nothing wrong with issuing a complaint. It does more for the community than your post. @Lava_Croft‌

Zershar_Vemod

pokebreaker wrote: »

Zershar_Vemod wrote: »

YgolohcysP wrote: »

Are you people serious?

You are sending in support tickets for players who are not AFK and farming a mob because you both want it and they are faster/better than you at killing it?

All I have for this thread is a big LoL!

You do know the official stance is that ZOS is against WW/Vamp camping right?

Zershar_Vemod, please provide a reference to ZOS' "Official Stance" on WW/Vamp camping.
As I always say, I do not condone mob camping, but I also don't condone players trying to scare other players using fictitious statements from ZOS.

Until a definitive post is cited about ZOS' being against WW/Vamp camping, the rumors are crap. The two quotes made by another poster above do not state that. They merely say they encourage users to report the incidents with a specific title, so that they may further investigate the issue.

I am not one to refute factual evidence, but this constant deception that disgruntled players are employing, saying that ZOS "Stated it was wrong", is BS. There has yet to be an official statement outlawing the camping. While griefing may very well be against the rules, they would have to check each individual case to ensure the elements of griefing are present; in which case, those who are camping the mobs for "Role Playing" reasons, or "lore", or whatever, wouldn't necessarily fall into the category of griefing, and would be allowed to continue.

Anyone have an ACTUAL clearly stated outlawing of WW/Vamp Camping?

Sorry about the delay ~100 pages of threads related to this so I had to get creative in searching.

Here is the thread, http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/74574/psa-stop-the-werewolf-vampire-grieifing-want-to-be-a-were-vamp-think-again/p1 Just browse the multiple ZOS posts.

pokebreaker

Zershar_Vemod wrote: »

Sorry about the delay ~100 pages of threads related to this so I had to get creative in searching.

Here is the thread, http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/74574/psa-stop-the-werewolf-vampire-grieifing-want-to-be-a-were-vamp-think-again/p1 Just browse the multiple ZOS posts.

^^^
Ok, so I went through all of the posts that ZOS Representatives made on the provided thread, concerning the issue, and have listed them below. There is only one statement made that clearly states an action being against the Terms of Service, so I Bolded the text in Quote 3, made by ZOS_GinaBruno, which states "...We still have a close eye on the situation, and we will be taking action on anyone who is violating our Terms of Service by charging real money or scamming other players..." This tells me the only action they have found that is a TOS violation is, charging real money for in-game services, and scamming (accepting in-game money from another player, and not providing the agreed upon item/service). So while camping and killing the Vamp/WW spawns is frowned upon due to player dissatisfaction, it does not seem to be an actionable TOS offense, and ZOS will not, as of yet, do anything to another player about it.

ZOS_TristanK wrote: »

Hi there, folks. Thank you for letting us know. We will investigate exactly what's happening here based on reports and tickets that you submit. In order to help us investigate more quickly, when you see an incident, please include the phrase "werewolf/vampire camping" in your ticket.

ZOS_JordanH wrote: »

Greetings. This is a friendly reminder to refrain from attacking other forum members. We are investigating the issue being discussed in this thread and we ask that you keep all communication civil and on-topic. The more information you can provide here, the better we can investigate. When submitting a ticket about this issue, please remember to include the phrase "werewolf/vampire camping" in your ticket.

Thank you for your cooperation and help as we investigate.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey guys! Just wanted to give you all a quick update on this. We still have a close eye on the situation, and we will be taking action on anyone who is violating our Terms of Service by charging real money or scamming other players.

We'd also like to remind you that there are multiple spawn points to get bit. Of course, we're not going to tell you where they are exactly. You'll have to explore to find them!

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

We are continuing to monitor vampire and werewolf spawn availability. We have a few suggestions that may help those of you who are on the hunt (some of which are mentioned in this thread.)

• There are multiple spawn points at any given time during the availability period for each. We encourage seeking them out, especially if you see that one is being camped.
• Some people are giving away bites for free. Keep an eye out for those opportunities, and if you are able, consider paying it forward for the next person. The more the community comes together to combat those who are griefing, the less viable the griefing and price gouging will be.
• Join a guild that provides free vampire and werewolf bites to its members.
• If you're in an instance that is very crowded during the availability period, try relogging to be placed in a different instance.

SilverMatrix

An even simpler solution is to make it so Vamps cant kill Vamps and Werewolves cant kill Werewolves. And personally, I don't see why a game should be about Monopolizing aspects of a game for personal self funding. Unfortunately, no rules are being broken, but if you are one of those charging ridiculous amounts of gold for bites and camping spawn sites to do so, you are in fact being selfish and disrupting a part of the game all players should be able to enjoy. And by the way... Reporting is not just to get people banned but to give developers an idea of potential problems and allow for the changing of rules. If you really think people aren't going to complain about others ruining their gameplay, you are mistaken. Furthermore, in regards to wasting developers time... We all pay to play. Developers are on that payroll. They are, in fact, there to handle these things and no complaint is a waste of time. In short, "The Customer Is Always Right". As for comparing it to crafting, no one can stop people from leveling their own crafting skills should they choose to do so. If you want to compare this correctly, someone would need to be able to keep another from crafting. So far as I know, this is not possible and just like crafting, people that want to get a bite from the game and not some high rolling player, should be able to do so. For all who are annoyed with this, there is hope. There are several guilds that host dates when they are willing to give free bites to anyone in several locations. Also players that camp sites to offer free bites. I would encourage you to find these fine folk and attain your goals in this way. Fortunately for all of us there are players willing to combat this "problem", even if the dev's will not. For all of you gold scammers... Feel free to slander this all you like. It IS a free country. Just remember, me and others are entitled to their opinions as well.

jrblaney1sub17_ESO

I like the rare spawn idea, making it exciting and more uncommon to get a bite. To fix this problem what should be done is to increase the number of spawns and randomize their locations so that they can't be camped. Guildies will tell each other about it when they find a spawn and then boom, 20 players got a bite.

All lvl 35+ areas should have a chance at vamps and werewolves randomly spawning. If people thing the specific time thing is important, then keep it, but make like 10 sets of mobs spawn at that time and make them spawn at random locations spread out around all level 35+ areas.

jrblaney1sub17_ESO

The vamps can't kill vamps and werewolves can't kill werewolves is also a really good idea

Skeletun

pokebreaker wrote: »

Zershar_Vemod wrote: »

Sorry about the delay ~100 pages of threads related to this so I had to get creative in searching.

Here is the thread, http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/74574/psa-stop-the-werewolf-vampire-grieifing-want-to-be-a-were-vamp-think-again/p1 Just browse the multiple ZOS posts.

^^^
Ok, so I went through all of the posts that ZOS Representatives made on the provided thread, concerning the issue, and have listed them below. There is only one statement made that clearly states an action being against the Terms of Service, so I Bolded the text in Quote 3, made by ZOS_GinaBruno, which states "...We still have a close eye on the situation, and we will be taking action on anyone who is violating our Terms of Service by charging real money or scamming other players..." This tells me the only action they have found that is a TOS violation is, charging real money for in-game services, and scamming (accepting in-game money from another player, and not providing the agreed upon item/service). So while camping and killing the Vamp/WW spawns is frowned upon due to player dissatisfaction, it does not seem to be an actionable TOS offense, and ZOS will not, as of yet, do anything to another player about it.

ZOS_TristanK wrote: »

Hi there, folks. Thank you for letting us know. We will investigate exactly what's happening here based on reports and tickets that you submit. In order to help us investigate more quickly, when you see an incident, please include the phrase "werewolf/vampire camping" in your ticket.

ZOS_JordanH wrote: »

Greetings. This is a friendly reminder to refrain from attacking other forum members. We are investigating the issue being discussed in this thread and we ask that you keep all communication civil and on-topic. The more information you can provide here, the better we can investigate. When submitting a ticket about this issue, please remember to include the phrase "werewolf/vampire camping" in your ticket.

Thank you for your cooperation and help as we investigate.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey guys! Just wanted to give you all a quick update on this. We still have a close eye on the situation, and we will be taking action on anyone who is violating our Terms of Service by charging real money or scamming other players.

We'd also like to remind you that there are multiple spawn points to get bit. Of course, we're not going to tell you where they are exactly. You'll have to explore to find them!

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

We are continuing to monitor vampire and werewolf spawn availability. We have a few suggestions that may help those of you who are on the hunt (some of which are mentioned in this thread.)

• There are multiple spawn points at any given time during the availability period for each. We encourage seeking them out, especially if you see that one is being camped.
• Some people are giving away bites for free. Keep an eye out for those opportunities, and if you are able, consider paying it forward for the next person. The more the community comes together to combat those who are griefing, the less viable the griefing and price gouging will be.
  
• Join a guild that provides free vampire and werewolf bites to its members.
• If you're in an instance that is very crowded during the availability period, try relogging to be placed in a different instance.

I bolded some text in the quote from Folsom that I thought was interesting.

[*] Some people are giving away bites for free. Keep an eye out for those opportunities, and if you are able, consider paying it forward for the next person. The more the community comes together to combat those who are griefing, the less viable the griefing and price gouging will be.

I think "Griefing" is a TOS violation. And wouldn't standing at a spawn point killing a mob repeatedly for no other reason than to stop others from achieving an in game goal be considered griefing?

I really don't think there is any way for us to know if ZOS has or has not taken action against players for this. At least not until a players says they were "punished" in some way or received a warning (I don't see that happening) or ZOS states they have taken action against it.

Personally I have no interest in "getting bit" and wish vamp/WW was a PvP component in the game. Like some type of bounty system where we could hunt them for a certain time period after they attack (bite) someone.

poochie

Why not just have "ANY" 40+ vampire or werewolf count instead of having to be in a specific area at a specific time. Plenty of each in the veteran zones.

Adramelach

OmniDo wrote: »

The solution is to simply make an alternative solo-dungeon where Vampire NPC's exist that can infect players, or offer them the option to be turned upon completion of a group-only dungeon quest.
This would add some adventure to the mix, and remove the possibility for public grieving.

Its really quite simple.
Players enter a dungeon on a certain night (same time as the current spawn rules for bloodfiends and werewolves) where they have the opportunity to interact with a certain NPC, and/or face a spawn of infectious bloodfiends that can spread the disease (or both).

The Vampire NPC could engage the players in some opportunistic dialog, similar to the current quest line, that might go something like this:

Vampire NPC: "So you want to follow in the footsteps of Lamae? You must first defeat <insert insidious vampire here> and drain their blood into a Flask. Bring the blood to us so we may purify it, and if you are worthy, Lamae will grant you the gift of eternal night, that you may subvert the crimes of Molag Bal!"

After completion of the quest, players can then proceed with the existing vampire quest line par normal.

This would alleviate the current vampire bite supply and demand (amusing that is even a thing in an MMO) issue, whilst simultaneously eliminating the potential for grieving and scamming.

A little logic, a few placed quest dialog lines spoken by some unaccredited voice actor/actress, and viola.

Next Question?

I was astounded that the entire vamp/wolf bite thing wasn't handled using instanced solo quests. It's absolutely the right way to handle it, and it amazes me that it's just done via random respawning world mobs that can be exploited like that. It's so obvious, that I have to assume that for whatever reason, Zenimax consciously decided to do it this way to support the bizarre and annoying "economy" of bites that we have now.

The ability for a group of players to effectively launch a 'denial of service' attack against the rest of us in order to create an artificial scarcity, and thus allow for inflated pricing, is incredibly bad design, in my opinion.

To say "well, you're just whining because they can kill the mob faster than you" isn't really fair, either, unless of course the mobs are designed for VR10 players in the first place making it an even playing field. If their placement and challenge level is designed for lower-level players (as is the case) of 40-50 level, then it's inherently biased against players that arrive there "naturally" as they level up, if the sites are being camped on by VRx players that can easily out-perform the "whiners" as they can achieve far higher dps and take the mobs out with brutal efficiency while you attempt to progress. I believe it would only be whining if all players present were of generally equal capability, and not a situation where a group of over-powered players of far higher level were denying content to players of a lower, and appropriate level, for that content.

Loxy37

I've got a WW and Vamp which both times I got the spawn way. What I have started doing when I find the spawns is saying in Guild first and the general. I invite 3 to a group and let them get the gift. I tell them not to kill the spawn and 99% respect this. I remember when my first character hit the 40 zone, all the spawn zones where camped but its possible to find ones that aren't on those Google maps as I have both times.

Also once a week I will bite someone for free with both WW and Vamp. I do this because I so detest people who exploit others.

beowulfsshield

It's griefing, plain and simple. There are a couple of good ideas in this thread about how to stop it, hopefully ZO pays attention.

CausticSky

YgolohcysP wrote: »

Are you people serious?

You are sending in support tickets for players who are not AFK and farming a mob because you both want it and they are faster/better than you at killing it?

All I have for this thread is a big LoL!

I havent gotten that far yet to experience this and I agree that people can kill it as long as they want. But the problem is that they're all be *** bags and charging people $ and in game $ to be infected. That wasn't the purpose of having those npcs in the game. I don't think they should be banned for it but I think they need to find a way to fix this so people can't make profits from it.

Aeradon

I like the idea of "explore and get bit randomly". Wouldn't want ZoS to spoil it. They can, however, have a travelling merchant NPC spawn at scheduled times.

This mysterious NPC could be a normal looking guy, with a normal dialog about how dangerous these woods are. Maybe when asked about strange things in the woods they will say they pick stuff up from the dead adventurers. So when you check their store, there's this weird item "Unidentified Venom" or "Ornate Relic" that sells for 20k. Upon activation activates RNG of getting either bites randomly.

You won't be sure where to find it, what you're gonna get, but you know you paid for something and has something to hold on to. Fits the game perfectly. NPC can't be killed tho.

the.dzeneralb16_ESO

If there is anything to fix it would be to make a CoD like system for bites, camping the spawns should be fine. Firstly because there is nothing wrong with killing any mobs for any reason. Secondly, because the spawns are fairly random with the exception of some, so they can't be blocked. I did it and my first 2 finds were both killed, then I found a third all within 30 minutes. Thirdly, people are free to role play any ways they want, including killing all vampires/wolves.

Phazzle

Look, if they are camping the spawns so that they can charge extra for bites, as you suggest then that's just the way it goes. Is it a jerk thing to do? Sure it is, but it's not trolling.

If you are really a roleplayer then why the hell would you allow a nasty creature like a vampire to repeatedly beat on you anyway? Isn't it more 'roleplaie' to pay a vampire for a bite or join a vampire guild?

But I digress. Sometimes MMO economies can be brutal but that doesn't mean they are broken. When I played WoW I mastered glyphmaking and used a combination of addons to aggressively price my competitors out of the market by frequently undercutting them. I don't lose any sleep over it.

Scarcity is the mark of a realistic economy. The economy isn't broken until there is too much availability. The people camping spawn zones are just good businessmen. Go out and farm 15k worth of gold.

Sleepydan

The right answer is we need to enable pk, but you damn care bears won't have any of that now will you.

Self regulating is too hard, need mommy and daddy zenimax to come help you!

Kelbar

Good stuff. BTW after religiously checking Reapers March for a month I received my free bite from a bloodfiend on my main toon. Plus, I completed the blood matrons quest at level 23. Also, I have never received any contact from Zenimax regarding this issue. Both from my tickets and my posts. So as far as I can see they don't really give a rip. Sorry to those of you who don't want to pay. My best suggestion, is the advice that is already out there: wait till level 35 & just run quests in the zone on vampire night or WW night. Less hassle.

SadisticSavior

I found bloodfiends over the weekend. They were completely uncamped (like, by no one at all) and close to the road. I detailed my experience in the link in my signature below.

I found them right before dawn, inside the red circle on that map.

Soulharvester

TLDR: Whaa vamp bite, suxors you, dont a be farmbot, hands across tamriel? the end... I am freaking tired... I have been up for like 97 hours... Yes I intentionally derped my dont a be farmbot...

I just report em.

Is it wasting someones time, yes I imagine it is.

Keep in mind those people that get reported are just like anyone else we run into.

They are keeping this game going in there way, just like I try to keep the game going in my way. We are not always going to agree, and it is not going be an always smurfy gathering where everyone hugs and smiles, etc...

We have one thing in common already, and that is we both liked this game enough to play it... So thats a start right? /hugs?

So campers, camp less or at the least, if you see a low level trying to get the bite help em out, just by showing a random act of kindness, you help yourself in the longrun, you just made a new player enjoy the game that much more.

Which helps build a solid foundation and this game needs it... So let em get it. People are going to still pay either way, it is not going to hurt any market whatsoever... Just change the venue, the audience. Work for it!

People trying to get the bite, report anyone that is disrupting your game play, a quest mob grief is by definition, a disruption; it is keeping you from getting a quest that you want.
It does not get any more basic than that.

We all have reported spammers in chat, we have also prob reported a farming bot killing a dungeon boss before. Its no different. They stood in one spot, they reacted towards a mob and did not care who was around them or how many times they were reported.

At least the farm bots did not try to embarrass us in zone chat. Look what you are emulating, the very thing that cost many subscribers to just give up.

So, my question to a WW/Vamp spawn camper/griefer, what exactly are you trying to accomplish by doing this?

Nothing worse than a new player coming into the game and seeing that farmbot behavior, a farming bot response to a quest mob.

Remember how bad it was, there were 100s if not 1000s of bots, everywhere.
Its ok right, they were just killing mobs, taking harvesting nodes, trying to set a zone chat economy, ripping us off so they can have what, an ingame currency...

Its madness! You are becoming what you probably hated most about the game...

You would all be better off if you just started working together, this way no one has the time wasted and you dont get your account put in a reps inbox. Probably not the best place to be either.

I only responded to this since I have seen a recent increase in people doing the camping thing and of course people that are just getting tired of it.

At least in reapers anyway, not sure about the other areas...

DARK_EVIL-GODS21

Lava_Croft wrote: »

You do realize that nobody is going to get banned for killing mobs, however you are wasting customer support's time with these silly reports. Time they could spend on doing actual work and helping out people with actual problems.

Actually you do get banned for this because it's considered "impeding another person's progress."

leepalmer95

DARK_EVIL-GODS21 wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

You do realize that nobody is going to get banned for killing mobs, however you are wasting customer support's time with these silly reports. Time they could spend on doing actual work and helping out people with actual problems.

Actually you do get banned for this because it's considered "impeding another person's progress."

Killing a randomly spawning mob doesn't hinder peoples progress. No matter how annoying it is.

People need to calm down. they can't prevent everyone from getting a bite, eventually it will spread, give it 4-5 more days and the first wave to people will get there bite back, which will give a big boost free bites.

People need to realise that despite it being annoying that people are camping, this exact same thing happened when the game was released on pc, and it naturally evened out when biters>requests. Just be patient.

Lifeshield

I wonder how many of the people complaining will go forward and charge people for infections themselves?

eliisra

leepalmer95 wrote: »

People need to realise that despite it being annoying that people are camping, this exact same thing happened when the game was released on pc, and it naturally evened out when biters>requests. Just be patient.

Indeed. Also these guys camping, they're lowbies. Once a majority of players reaches higher VR ranks, it's no longer worth anyone's time to camp NPC's for hours. Why bother lol? So you can sell a bite once a week for a little bit more gold. It's all peanut money for a VR12+ that undoubtedly have more important things to do.

I do get the griefing aspect. It's not just about selling over priced bites. Half the guys just killing the NPC's to *** you of. But kids wont stay in level 40 zones forever. There's more effective ways to harass, scam and troll in ESO, something these juveniles will discover once they get higher levels.

On PC people stopped camping completely after 3 weeks or so. Also why there's never going to be some "solution" added. It sorts itself out. Bites will stabilize around 5k. That's standard price when you ask "favours" from random players. Crafting, biting or whatever, they want money for time spent and service.

Glaiceana

eliisra wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

People need to realise that despite it being annoying that people are camping, this exact same thing happened when the game was released on pc, and it naturally evened out when biters>requests. Just be patient.

Indeed. Also these guys camping, they're lowbies. Once a majority of players reaches higher VR ranks, it's no longer worth anyone's time to camp NPC's for hours. Why bother lol? So you can sell a bite once a week for a little bit more gold. It's all peanut money for a VR12+ that undoubtedly have more important things to do.

I do get the griefing aspect. It's not just about selling over priced bites. Half the guys just killing the NPC's to *** you of. But kids wont stay in level 40 zones forever. There's more effective ways to harass, scam and troll in ESO, something these juveniles will discover once they get higher levels.

On PC people stopped camping completely after 3 weeks or so. Also why there's never going to be some "solution" added. It sorts itself out. Bites will stabilize around 5k. That's standard price when you ask "favours" from random players. Crafting, biting or whatever, they want money for time spent and service.

Yeah I've also seen that 5k seems to be the average for bites. I'd like to join or start a guild that's purpose is to offer free werewolf bites to people who really want them. Seems like a decent service.

schrodinger_the_Khajiit

This one always bites for free

bigbabyleonb16_ESO

Who cares.

I paid 10K for a bite and when my week is up i'll give a bite for free by the shrine.

If people want to charge then so be it but you do know there is a thread about free bites and meet ups for them?