Camping Bloodfiend and Werewolf Spawns

dba.2000_ESO

pokebreaker wrote: »

On another note,what's wrong with player's trying to control the market? With the amount of people that I've seen getting their free bite, there should be plenty of good samaritans willing to pass their bite on for free. Nobody FORCES any other player to buy a bite. They see a service that they aren't willing to wait to obtain, and they decide they are willing to pay for it. It's truly the buyers that keep the sale of bites alive. If people stop buying them, people will eventually give up on trying to sell them...but that won't happen, because everyone wants instant gratification.

People are FORCING players to either buy a bite or find someone to bite them for free, by impeding a players ability to use the game mechanics to receive a bite from an actual werewolf.

I didn't sign on 'to play the game the way I want play' by having the game dictated to me by griefers and spawn campers.

If there was a mechanism in place to kill spawn campers, you people might have a valid argument, but until that happens, I'll be considering it griefing.

Kelbar

NukaCola wrote: »

Do you really think people camp the spawn sites so others can't get bitten? That would be a massive waste of time. That 15k is not that much cash!

It is just common sense to sell a WEEKLY COOLDOWN. But it is not a viable farm situation by anyway you look at it.

I know it to be a fact and I have footage of the campers throwing a temper tantrum when I called them out on it.

Umbra

People are blocking player's progress and roleplay:
1) Because of campers, player can't receive a bite;
2) Therefore, player can't receive a quest;
3) Therefore, player can't complete a quest;
4) Therefore, that campers are griefers and should be reported.

Interesting, what the developers think about it?

alex394053

killedbyping wrote: »

I dont get it. Why would you report spawn farmers ?
This IS the ingame economy in action. They are working on holding their monopoly on bites to make the money.
Even thou it is a bit unfair for somebody, but it still how the things are even in real life.
If you now a source of money farming you have to be first to get it and then fight to hold it.

Heh. Very sophisticated PoV, but wrong. It is NOT a real world, it is a game with subscription fee. This fee is paid to the hired 'gods' of this fantasy world. And their duty is to make you have fun and not to make you upset.
Also if you draw parallels with the real economy, there are always regulations and special institutions to fight against monopoly. What are you talking of is old-school capitalism that is out-dated.

oldkye

I think the devs should do something one way or another either support bite selling and give a option to bite and trade the money in the same transaction so people can't be scammed or not allow people to bite other people thus taking away the market.

Just banning people who kill the monsters is hardly a "fix" though it will die down once more people are vampires some people are legitimately role playing or don't realize those monsters people want alive(If I got banned for trying to help what looked like a group of people fighting a monster I'd be pretty upset).

Syntse

To people that think there's nothing wrong with this or that it's just economy etc.

Let's think of scenario that if player collision would be in place in this game. And bunch of players would block accesses to Fighters guild, Mages guild, Undaunted, Main quest entrances etc and allowing pass only if you pay 20k for it. And there is nothing that you can do about it like get bunch of friends together and clear the way. Still think this would be just fine?

Now if you even slightly thought that maybe just maybe it would not be ok, then you should see in the same way why it is not ok to block content of vampirism or werewolf from other players.

Then there are of course those people that just think that if something is in game and it can be exploited for personal gain it is ok. Even better if you do not have any risks doing it.

Kelbar

I just got the WW scratch for free, and when I get the Bloodmoon skill I am going to give it for free. I think it is great if a player has money to tip for the scratch of the WW or the bite of a vamp. I won't turn it down. I just despise the rude little jerks who kill the npc's that can turn you for free, mock players who aren't turned, and extort money to turn you.

Kelbar

Always remember to add bite scammers to your ignore list. It gets very peaceful on zone chat when you do.

NukaCola

When you are buying or selling a bite remember to ask for a written message of the trade. This way there is a document where both players agree to trade. Taking a screenshot of the chat works too. If the seller or buyer refuses he's probably a scammer.

Diakos

killedbyping wrote: »

I dont get it. Why would you report spawn farmers ?
This IS the ingame economy in action. They are working on holding their monopoly on bites to make the money.
Even thou it is a bit unfair for somebody, but it still how the things are even in real life.
If you now a source of money farming you have to be first to get it and then fight to hold it.

Monopoly's are also heavily penalized in the "real world" and often carry massive fines, hell even competitors agreeing on a common minimum price face repercussions.

Andy22

NukaCola wrote: »

When you are buying or selling a bite remember to ask for a written message of the trade. This way there is a document where both players agree to trade. Taking a screenshot of the chat works too. If the seller or buyer refuses he's probably a scammer.

For someone that have played EvE Online, this sounds ofc all hilarious. Thats because "trust" is one of the most valuable resources in EvE, which means a GM or CCP (the Company behind EvE) will gladly advice and state that its your own fault trusting a "stranger". So scaming and building monopolies are thought as very valid ways to make money in EvE and personally i think thats what makes this sandbox MMO great. Its a real "do/play however u want" type of MMO, but ofc the actual combat mechanic is quite boring

On the other hand, most MMO company's want to provide a "smooth" theme-park PvE experience, rather than a capitalistic market "sandbox".

As example if u would translate this "bite selling" to EvE, what would happen is that u contact/agree upon a "trusted/reputable" third party source (player), who would get the money from the buyer and after the seller did "bite" him, he would transfer the gold to the seller, while taking a little cut like 1-5% of the total transaction sum.

In eve this is usually done to-do any kind of big, risky transaction, where u cant enforce a real "binding" contract between 2 parties. So both parties use a trusted third party to solve this "trust" problem.

FrauPerchta

If you can only infect on player a week then why not limit the ability to kill bite giver NPCs to once a week as well. Problem solved.

DragonMother

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom‌ made it very clear that camping the mobs that spread the disease is against the community rules because it is detrimental to those that are waiting to be infected and causes a disruption in others experience. If you cannot find something else to do at your level other than camp, you are no better than the damned bots the company is battling against. If you do not recall the post she left in regards to this very same issue, you might wish to look at her posting history to find it.

Kelbar

DragonMother wrote: »

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom‌ made it very clear that camping the mobs that spread the disease is against the community rules because it is detrimental to those that are waiting to be infected and causes a disruption in others experience. If you cannot find something else to do at your level other than camp, you are no better than the damned bots the company is battling against. If you do not recall the post she left in regards to this very same issue, you might wish to look at her posting history to find it.

could you post that article?

DragonMother

Kelbar wrote: »

DragonMother wrote: »

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom‌ made it very clear that camping the mobs that spread the disease is against the community rules because it is detrimental to those that are waiting to be infected and causes a disruption in others experience. If you cannot find something else to do at your level other than camp, you are no better than the damned bots the company is battling against. If you do not recall the post she left in regards to this very same issue, you might wish to look at her posting history to find it.

could you post that article?

Looking for it now, will update once I find her comment. I'm pretty sure she was encouraging players to report the people camping these mobs for they are breaking several game policies.

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

We are continuing to monitor vampire and werewolf spawn availability. We have a few suggestions that may help those of you who are on the hunt (some of which are mentioned in this thread.)

• There are multiple spawn points at any given time during the availability period for each. We encourage seeking them out, especially if you see that one is being camped.
• Some people are giving away bites for free. Keep an eye out for those opportunities, and if you are able, consider paying it forward for the next person. The more the community comes together to combat those who are griefing, the less viable the griefing and price gouging will be.
• Join a guild that provides free vampire and werewolf bites to its members.
• If you're in an instance that is very crowded during the availability period, try relogging to be placed in a different instance.

It was another CSR that stated it.

ZOS_TristanK wrote: »

Hi there, folks. Thank you for letting us know. We will investigate exactly what's happening here based on reports and tickets that you submit. In order to help us investigate more quickly, when you see an incident, please include the phrase "werewolf/vampire camping" in your ticket.

I can state from experience that relogging to try another instance does work. My recommendations for hunting werewolves and vampires in groups on different instance layers, it makes it easier to cover a greater area and if one is spotted on one layer, you can travel to the group member to receive the bite.

Kelbar

You're awesome DragonMother!

Kelbar

Remember to download fraps to record the campers, it is free to record 30 seconds at a time

StonedFlyingLamb

If you want to become a vamp/ww that badly and are not willing to pay/wait for a long time just play till veteran content where you can get easily bitten.

Kelbar

oh last night I got the WW scratch for free. But that is beside the point. I wouldn't care so much about the charging to bite. But, the players camp the NPC's to intentionally keep it away from other players. They camp for hours to do this. I have Fraps video recordings of it, and I am telling them that there are several players who want the mobs, in order to get turned. They ignore us and butcher them in front of us as fast as they can.

Zephyr

When I first read about it, it was supposed to be a Long quest chain for it, back when they were doing "Factions" and after "Exalted" you could turn to one of them, Vamp or WW. With that idea, I could understand the prices being 30k each, but as is its a matter of chance. ZoS has already stated there is nothing they will do over people camping a spawn, it isn't griefing and it isn't against the ToS. If someone wants to spend hours of their time waiting for a spawn, let them. If you wanted it badly enough you would be standing beside them.

Kelbar

Zephyr wrote: »

When I first read about it, it was supposed to be a Long quest chain for it, back when they were doing "Factions" and after "Exalted" you could turn to one of them, Vamp or WW. With that idea, I could understand the prices being 30k each, but as is its a matter of chance. ZoS has already stated there is nothing they will do over people camping a spawn, it isn't griefing and it isn't against the ToS. If someone wants to spend hours of their time waiting for a spawn, let them. If you wanted it badly enough you would be standing beside them.

would you please post that article?

7788b14_ESO

Lava_Croft wrote: »

You do realize that nobody is going to get banned for killing mobs, however you are wasting customer support's time with these silly reports. Time they could spend on doing actual work and helping out people with actual problems.

You do realize Zen stated in a another thread for us to report them as they were looking into this. It is a form of griefing to attack spawns next to players who are trying to get infected in order to draw aggro and kill them thus directly interfering with someone else's game play.

7788b14_ESO

pokebreaker wrote: »

Nox_Aeterna wrote: »

roflcopter wrote: »

I said this in another thread and think it would work out fine for this issue. At least temporarily.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/comment/710616


Make players who are vampires / werewolves pvpable, they should be treated no differently than the mobs. In town, in the middle of maps, in my kitchen. If this is the stance people take, I should be able to rid them off the map just like the mobs. That should even the playing scale.

Players who are "monsters" should be treated as such.

I will agree with this only if i can also start the atk , cause you know , monsters dont usually just stay there waiting till you decide you want to fight them.

Ofc , that would mean i would be able to prey on players being a vet player ... that would be fun :P.

I would be all over this. Don't let this game have fully open-world PvP..., because all these whiners that are used to getting everything they want in Single-Player games, would lose their minds. Never heard of ganking? Gone' Learn Today!


None of this is directed at a specific person, but more of a general rant.


Some people, sad to say, just aren't cut out for MMOs; something to do with having to deal with other people, whether good or bad. Some folks want everything to be a single-player experience, where they can achieve everything they want, without anything or anyone holding them back.

I DO NOT support people scamming other people by way of taking another players money (as a payment for service), then logging off and not providing the agreed service. Yeah, of course this can happen in real life, but game communities have to have some boundaries for things like that. Just like in Grand Theft Auto V, a game about murder, theft, violence, and just general crime; the online play still has a limitation of players not being allowed to constantly destroy other players' personal vehicles. If they do, they have to pay that players' insurance fee to get the car back, and if they continue to do it, they end up getting segregated into a Dunce Server, where they can only play with other "griefers" for about 2-3 days. Funny enough, people that play with friends, really hate being in there, and don't want to go back.

That being said, I don't have problem with people killing the mobs. The week prior to getting my mob bite, 50 or more people got infected that night. The day I got mine, another 50 or more go theirs. The following spawn time AFTER I had mine, I escorted a group around calling out spawn locations so they could get their bites, and I personally saw atleast 30 or more people get it then. Pretty much everyone that was there waiting from pre-spawn, got theirs. So it's not like its impossible to get the free version.

On another note,what's wrong with player's trying to control the market? With the amount of people that I've seen getting their free bite, there should be plenty of good samaritans willing to pass their bite on for free. Nobody FORCES any other player to buy a bite. They see a service that they aren't willing to wait to obtain, and they decide they are willing to pay for it. It's truly the buyers that keep the sale of bites alive. If people stop buying them, people will eventually give up on trying to sell them...but that won't happen, because everyone wants instant gratification.

Bottom-line, I don't condone people scamming other players by accepting their money, and intentionally not providing the agreed service. However, I do support players killing the mobs and selling the bites. There are plenty of opportunities to obtain the bite for free, so another player shouldn't be administratively punished due to another player's laziness and childish need to have everything NOW.

Next thing you know, people will be filing CS complaints because another player won't sell them a trait weapon they need for research. God forbid crafters NOT share the uncommon traits, in an attempt to be one of few with it, and be able to make some money in the short-term.

There is plenty of money to be made in this game. I don't craft and have plenty of money from quests and mobs. Why sell bites to get money NOW when it's not necessary. Players who camp at spawn locations to get infected don't interfere with your gameplay so why interfere with theirs. Who's really acting childish here.

pokebreaker

7788b14_ESO wrote: »

There is plenty of money to be made in this game. I don't craft and have plenty of money from quests and mobs. Why sell bites to get money NOW when it's not necessary. Players who camp at spawn locations to get infected don't interfere with your gameplay so why interfere with theirs. Who's really acting childish here.

While I completely get where you are coming from with other means of making money, you are missing the point. People who sell bites are not always necessarily the same people who camp spawn locations. Thus, there is no point to being upset with sellers, but instead target the "griefers". I make money fine without selling a bite, but since there are buyers available, why wouldn't I sell to them? Selling a bite at 10k -15k, is not only a nice jump in my gold count, but also saves me grind time having to acquire it through boring quests and trash gear sales. If your morals/ethics keep you from profiting off of others' laziness, that is your problem, not ours. I'm not paying $15 per month to care.

There were people killing the WW/Vamps spawns before, during, and after I got bit by an NPC; YET, myself and many others still managed to get bit by a spawn mob at level 23, which is still technically VERY early for me to even be in that area.

pokebreaker

DragonMother wrote: »

DragonMother wrote: »

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom‌ made it very clear that camping the mobs that spread the disease is against the community rules because it is detrimental to those that are waiting to be infected and causes a disruption in others experience. If you cannot find something else to do at your level other than camp, you are no better than the damned bots the company is battling against. If you do not recall the post she left in regards to this very same issue, you might wish to look at her posting history to find it.

Looking for it now, will update once I find her comment. I'm pretty sure she was encouraging players to report the people camping these mobs for they are breaking several game policies.

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

We are continuing to monitor vampire and werewolf spawn availability. We have a few suggestions that may help those of you who are on the hunt (some of which are mentioned in this thread.)

• There are multiple spawn points at any given time during the availability period for each. We encourage seeking them out, especially if you see that one is being camped.
• Some people are giving away bites for free. Keep an eye out for those opportunities, and if you are able, consider paying it forward for the next person. The more the community comes together to combat those who are griefing, the less viable the griefing and price gouging will be.
• Join a guild that provides free vampire and werewolf bites to its members.
• If you're in an instance that is very crowded during the availability period, try relogging to be placed in a different instance.

It was another CSR that stated it.

ZOS_TristanK wrote: »

Hi there, folks. Thank you for letting us know. We will investigate exactly what's happening here based on reports and tickets that you submit. In order to help us investigate more quickly, when you see an incident, please include the phrase "werewolf/vampire camping" in your ticket.

So, from those CSR quotes alone, it tells me that they are investigating reports, which is what they do for EVERY report made to them about anything... Just because they encourage incident reports to help their investigation, does NOT mean that its against the rules, OR that they will take negative action against report players.

Unless there is a more definitive CSR statement about the matter, these quotes are nothing more than acknowledgements of reported concerns. It's more like their gathering data to figure out how to tweak things so that player interactions for this are more limited. One step closer to a subscription based single-player game

pokebreaker

Syntse wrote: »

To people that think there's nothing wrong with this or that it's just economy etc.

Let's think of scenario that if player collision would be in place in this game. And bunch of players would block accesses to Fighters guild, Mages guild, Undaunted, Main quest entrances etc and allowing pass only if you pay 20k for it. And there is nothing that you can do about it like get bunch of friends together and clear the way. Still think this would be just fine?

Now if you even slightly thought that maybe just maybe it would not be ok, then you should see in the same way why it is not ok to block content of vampirism or werewolf from other players.

Then there are of course those people that just think that if something is in game and it can be exploited for personal gain it is ok. Even better if you do not have any risks doing it.

The problem with that argument, is that it isn't the case. You can't make up a scenario that doesn't exist in this game, then try to correlate it to the issue at hand. Because if that was the case, this would just get turned right back into a single-player game again, because so many people just don't want to play with other people in the first place. As of current, PLENTY of people get bit during EVERY spawn cycle, even while there are people killing the mobs (which I've also seen happen by people trying to pull aggro from each other to get bitten first).

pokebreaker

dba.2000_ESO wrote: »

pokebreaker wrote: »

On another note,what's wrong with player's trying to control the market? With the amount of people that I've seen getting their free bite, there should be plenty of good samaritans willing to pass their bite on for free. Nobody FORCES any other player to buy a bite. They see a service that they aren't willing to wait to obtain, and they decide they are willing to pay for it. It's truly the buyers that keep the sale of bites alive. If people stop buying them, people will eventually give up on trying to sell them...but that won't happen, because everyone wants instant gratification.

People are FORCING players to either buy a bite or find someone to bite them for free, by impeding a players ability to use the game mechanics to receive a bite from an actual werewolf.

I didn't sign on 'to play the game the way I want play' by having the game dictated to me by griefers and spawn campers.

If there was a mechanism in place to kill spawn campers, you people might have a valid argument, but until that happens, I'll be considering it griefing.

Funny, because your argument goes both ways. While I don't condone spawn camping, and am often the one person in zone chat willing to help people out, versus the general ridicule they receive for asking a question; I also didn't sign on to have my gameplay dictated by others either. Why should others be subjected to limitations placed on them, just because you don't like it? If that was the case, we should start reporting people that don't freely GIVE us a Research Trait item that we need for our craft. Technically they are blocking set bonus content by being stingy with what they have, and not sharing, all so that they can be one of few to have it, and make all of the money for themselves. On top of that, what about those that charge you for that research item, instead of giving it to you for free?

Mucera78

killedbyping wrote: »

I dont get it. Why would you report spawn farmers ?
This IS the ingame economy in action. They are working on holding their monopoly on bites to make the money.
Even thou it is a bit unfair for somebody, but it still how the things are even in real life.
If you now a source of money farming you have to be first to get it and then fight to hold it.

Real life ? We are talking about Vampires, who cares about real life in that setting ?
It was simply bad design on developers part as they should have foreseen what would happen and didnt.
People do not care about other peoples enjoyment as a general rule of thumb and abuse where ever they can.
Solution: Make it a questline as proposed above by someone else and leave the open world NPCs in.
If someone does not want to bother himself with a quest he can still buy the bite from other players, period.

Pele

Ishau wrote: »

Well imo I think once you become a vampire or werewolf then the mobs that turned you should become green friendly mobs. Why would you want to kill people that are your own kind?

That way pretty much straight away the camping of the mobs becomes much less of a problem as they cannot be killed by the people making money off of them being killed.

I have no interest at all in becoming a vampire, but I think logically speaking once you are bitten it would make sense that those vampires won't attack you because you are one of them.

roflcopter wrote: »

I said this in another thread and think it would work out fine for this issue. At least temporarily.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/comment/710616


Make players who are vampires / werewolves pvpable, they should be treated no differently than the mobs. In town, in the middle of maps, in my kitchen. If this is the stance people take, I should be able to rid them off the map just like the mobs. That should even the playing scale.

Players who are "monsters" should be treated as such.

Quick Edit:
Heck only make it only for the same times that the werewolves and vampires spawn

Best suggestions in this thread.

Zershar_Vemod

YgolohcysP wrote: »

Are you people serious?

You are sending in support tickets for players who are not AFK and farming a mob because you both want it and they are faster/better than you at killing it?

All I have for this thread is a big LoL!

You do know the official stance is that ZOS is against WW/Vamp camping right?