Dungeon XP NERFED - Only way to XP is to grind QUESTS

Dovel

ryujinjakka74b14a_ESO wrote: »

No lvling XP in dungeons just killed this game for me. Will be playing Wildstar over this for sure now if this is not fixed. I mean really...I get more xp for killing mobs outside of dungeons...and no loot... wth is going on? canceling asap till this gets fixed.

You might be in for a shock then. Wildstar dungeon setup doesn't reward XP for kills. You only get a fixed XP reward at the end. If you kill 100 creatures or sneak through and just kill the end Boss you still get the same reward.

Singular

dsaras wrote: »

Ragnar_Lodbrok wrote: »

Thats well and good, but Zenimax's focus is great pve story content, via the traditional Elder Scrolls way. Maybe someone will make Dungeonsonly MMO someday so you can grind the same encounter a hundred and twenty times a day for fun.

I can't understand you? You are visiting evey thread about dungeons an telling people to do quests. What's your problem? I don't get it why do you care. No one is asking to nerf quest xp or in any way change current quest system, no one is trying to change the gameplay you like, so why are you so opposed to people who are asking to give them a chance to play this game their way?
You say story content is the traditional elder scrolls way? Since when? For me personally elder scrolls was always about freedom. I could travel in any direction from the beggining of the game, exploring the land and dungeons without doing a single quest.
I see some people whiteknighting every aspect of the game. Guys it's very simple. I'm also a huge fan of the series. I would like this game to be awesome but it has some major drawbacks and fixing those would benefit all. Having one eay to play an mmo without an alternative is a serious issue. And to all those people saying that other who don't like the game as it is now can leave.. guys have you ever played an mmo? This is a sub game mmo. If pepople will be leaving zos will be losing money. Less money - less content, less updates or even f2p.

Well said! I sincerely hope it doesn't go f2p.

Fix dungeon xp!!!

cigarsmoker

I am a serious soloist, when I'm running around the world I don't want to be tethered to some other body that needs me to follow it or that I need to make sure is following me.

Until it comes to dungeons. I would even rather do the 'solo public dungeons' as a group even if it's just a duo. Even back in the day I was a serious dungeon raid runner in WoW. And I love the play of being in a group.

I usually played the dungeons for the loot. Give me that awesome McGuffin of awesomeness! But the exp for killing the mobs should be equal to that of killing a mob of the same level outside the dungeon. I kill a level 25 mob it should give me the exp for a level 25 mob no matter where that mob is BASED ON MY LEVEL. That means if somehow as a level 1 I kill a level 25 mob I should get a HUGE amount of exp, but if I am above level 25 I should get less and less exp for that mob until I am getting just 1 exp per kill.

Named mobs are harder and should subsequently give better drops and exp no matter where those named mobs happen to pop up. The so called 'grind' is going to be there no matter what choose to do: Quest or Dungeons. You need to kill mobs either way it's just a matter of where they happen to be.

Also what exactly was this exploit for killing mobs in dungeons? Did they give so much more exp than over world mobs?

Badh0rse

Simple: Fix or Fail

baraka101

Weevah wrote: »

baraka101 wrote: »

hwesterbergb14_ESO wrote: »

"I wouldn't complain that they need to fix the game.....I would not play the game because it isn't what I want for my gaming experience."

Uh, that's the point. You wouldn't play the game... Is it in Zeni's best interest to alienate a big chunk of their player base?

And yes, there is something stopping you from questing with a group. Unless you are on the same steps of the same quests, it's almost impossible to group to do quests. If you are out of synch on a step you can't even see each other on the map half the time. It's a BIG PAIN.

This is actually an extremely unfriendly grouping game. Can't help people on previous quest steps. You can't redo dungeon quests, so trying to help friends through dungeons can be a pain (for instance, one dungeon you need a disguise to get through a part, but if you've already done the quest, you cannot get it a second time through). No mentoring or leveling down to help friends, etc.

Many MMOs have questing, yes, but they don't FORCE you to quest. SWTOR you could level entirely in PVP if you wanted. Everquest 2, you could level without doing many quests, if you wanted. BUT you could do quests if you wanted. CHOICE. Wow, what a concept.

I don't get why you think it's a bad thing for a game to give the player choices. The problem with the game as it stands now is that they did stick too much to the single player experience. That means that once we are done with it, we're done with it. It will not have longevity in its current state.

Most MMOs do do that you are correct. However it was my understanding that this game isn't meant to be like most MMOs. It is meant to be an Elder Scrolls MMO.

Anyone who has played The Elder Scrolls games know that it has always been about the quests and story because that is pretty much all a single player game can be about. In making this game a MMO they allow people to group together and complete objectives and give you incentives for doing those objectives. But to allow people to bypass the very essence that is TES would ruin the uniqueness of the game and take away from what makes the series so great.

If people are playing this game thinking and expecting it to be like every other MMO out there I understand why they are upset that you don't have a choice in leveling via PvP or dungeons. But this isn't meant to be just another MMO....It is meant to be Elder Scrolls, which has emphasis on quests and story progression and a MMO, which allows people to group together and complete group based objectives and to interact with other people and have a sense of community.

They have done a fantastic job balancing what Elder Scrolls IS with what a MMO offers when it comes to group and co operative play with one another. I will say again. If you are not a fan of a game that has heavily invested in its quests and not being able to dungeon grind or PvP grind your way to max level then I suggest finding a new game. YES I understand that some of the MMO community who have this "MMOs = this" type mentality will leave. Good. I doubt it will be near enough people to cause this game to "fail" and I do not mind not playing with people who do not appreciate the game.

Again, this is forcing people into one playstyle (questing).

I can see how running dungeons is not Skyrim gameplay. Nobody wants to bypass the essence of TES, we want to build and enchance it. Take it new places. Allow it to be enjoyed, even by those who were not originally Elder Scrolls fans.

Zenimax did not do a fantastic job balancing co operative play and you offered no arguments for that statement.

You had a worthy post until you called for your fellow players to leave the game.

I and many other do not see this a forcing people into one play style, we see it as the game having a focus. Who didn't think that an Elder Scrolls game wasn't going to have a focus on quests and story progression? This whole thing isn't about balance of a game, it is about gamers having different likes when it comes to what they like to do in games.

I know this is the first MMO in 10 years that I have been legitimately hooked on. I and many others have been waiting for an MMO that allows you to take your time and enjoy your leveling experience more than how fast can I get to max level so I can raid.

I think the difference here, and I know you guys will have no problem telling me I am wrong if I am, but the reason you guys are upset is not because there isn't incentives and rewards for doing dungeons and other group content, but that there isn't continuous incentives and reward for repeat the same content over and over again. Allowing you to repeat the same dungeons over and over again getting rewarded for it with xp would take away from the focus of the game, which is quests and story progression.

There are a lot more people out there than you probably think that actually enjoy leveling and questing more than grinding dungeon content as a means of leveling. When I suggest to look for another game to play that allows you to do that, I suggest because I do not want this game to become another non focused try to make everyone happy MMO. There is nothing wrong with having a focus in a game. People like myself and many others are happy with the focus that Zen went with rewarding you and giving you incentive to do the group content while not taking away from the leveling/character progression part that many people have been waiting for in an MMO.

There are other games out there that focus more on group content over leveling/questing. If that is your thing, by all means you do you but please let us who enjoy this game because of the amazing story and quests continue to enjoy it and not have that focus go away because the game doesn't cater to every type of gamer.

And yes you do have every right to voice your concern about a game that you paid for. I would never try to say that you couldn't or shouldn't. I am just trying to explain where some of the other people on the other side are coming from and why we don't want to see a change.

Krohm

baraka101 wrote: »

Weevah wrote: »

baraka101 wrote: »

hwesterbergb14_ESO wrote: »

"I wouldn't complain that they need to fix the game.....I would not play the game because it isn't what I want for my gaming experience."

Uh, that's the point. You wouldn't play the game... Is it in Zeni's best interest to alienate a big chunk of their player base?

And yes, there is something stopping you from questing with a group. Unless you are on the same steps of the same quests, it's almost impossible to group to do quests. If you are out of synch on a step you can't even see each other on the map half the time. It's a BIG PAIN.

This is actually an extremely unfriendly grouping game. Can't help people on previous quest steps. You can't redo dungeon quests, so trying to help friends through dungeons can be a pain (for instance, one dungeon you need a disguise to get through a part, but if you've already done the quest, you cannot get it a second time through). No mentoring or leveling down to help friends, etc.

Many MMOs have questing, yes, but they don't FORCE you to quest. SWTOR you could level entirely in PVP if you wanted. Everquest 2, you could level without doing many quests, if you wanted. BUT you could do quests if you wanted. CHOICE. Wow, what a concept.

I don't get why you think it's a bad thing for a game to give the player choices. The problem with the game as it stands now is that they did stick too much to the single player experience. That means that once we are done with it, we're done with it. It will not have longevity in its current state.

Most MMOs do do that you are correct. However it was my understanding that this game isn't meant to be like most MMOs. It is meant to be an Elder Scrolls MMO.

Anyone who has played The Elder Scrolls games know that it has always been about the quests and story because that is pretty much all a single player game can be about. In making this game a MMO they allow people to group together and complete objectives and give you incentives for doing those objectives. But to allow people to bypass the very essence that is TES would ruin the uniqueness of the game and take away from what makes the series so great.

If people are playing this game thinking and expecting it to be like every other MMO out there I understand why they are upset that you don't have a choice in leveling via PvP or dungeons. But this isn't meant to be just another MMO....It is meant to be Elder Scrolls, which has emphasis on quests and story progression and a MMO, which allows people to group together and complete group based objectives and to interact with other people and have a sense of community.

They have done a fantastic job balancing what Elder Scrolls IS with what a MMO offers when it comes to group and co operative play with one another. I will say again. If you are not a fan of a game that has heavily invested in its quests and not being able to dungeon grind or PvP grind your way to max level then I suggest finding a new game. YES I understand that some of the MMO community who have this "MMOs = this" type mentality will leave. Good. I doubt it will be near enough people to cause this game to "fail" and I do not mind not playing with people who do not appreciate the game.

Again, this is forcing people into one playstyle (questing).

I can see how running dungeons is not Skyrim gameplay. Nobody wants to bypass the essence of TES, we want to build and enchance it. Take it new places. Allow it to be enjoyed, even by those who were not originally Elder Scrolls fans.

Zenimax did not do a fantastic job balancing co operative play and you offered no arguments for that statement.

You had a worthy post until you called for your fellow players to leave the game.

I and many other do not see this a forcing people into one play style, we see it as the game having a focus. Who didn't think that an Elder Scrolls game wasn't going to have a focus on quests and story progression? This whole thing isn't about balance of a game, it is about gamers having different likes when it comes to what they like to do in games.

I know this is the first MMO in 10 years that I have been legitimately hooked on. I and many others have been waiting for an MMO that allows you to take your time and enjoy your leveling experience more than how fast can I get to max level so I can raid.

I think the difference here, and I know you guys will have no problem telling me I am wrong if I am, but the reason you guys are upset is not because there isn't incentives and rewards for doing dungeons and other group content, but that there isn't continuous incentives and reward for repeat the same content over and over again. Allowing you to repeat the same dungeons over and over again getting rewarded for it with xp would take away from the focus of the game, which is quests and story progression.

There are a lot more people out there than you probably think that actually enjoy leveling and questing more than grinding dungeon content as a means of leveling. When I suggest to look for another game to play that allows you to do that, I suggest because I do not want this game to become another non focused try to make everyone happy MMO. There is nothing wrong with having a focus in a game. People like myself and many others are happy with the focus that Zen went with rewarding you and giving you incentive to do the group content while not taking away from the leveling/character progression part that many people have been waiting for in an MMO.

There are other games out there that focus more on group content over leveling/questing. If that is your thing, by all means you do you but please let us who enjoy this game because of the amazing story and quests continue to enjoy it and not have that focus go away because the game doesn't cater to every type of gamer.

So what are all you guys gonna do that think ESO should be solo questing top to bottom when the new zone comes out that you have to have a group to do period, that the trials are 12 person raids? You guys who like solo wont see that content unless you come play with us group type folks.

I'm on work travel but when I get some time I'm going to find the statements the devs made back in beta were they wanted people to be able to level by dungeons and pvp also.

You guys keep saying go play something else, well we could go tell you the same thing, WOW and its many clones offers you to level by just questing so just saying...

If you want the game to grow it has to appeal to many different play styles, not just solo play


Btw I hate instancing and want open world dungeons like EQ1.

baraka101

Krohm wrote: »

baraka101 wrote: »

Weevah wrote: »

baraka101 wrote: »

hwesterbergb14_ESO wrote: »

"I wouldn't complain that they need to fix the game.....I would not play the game because it isn't what I want for my gaming experience."

Uh, that's the point. You wouldn't play the game... Is it in Zeni's best interest to alienate a big chunk of their player base?

And yes, there is something stopping you from questing with a group. Unless you are on the same steps of the same quests, it's almost impossible to group to do quests. If you are out of synch on a step you can't even see each other on the map half the time. It's a BIG PAIN.

This is actually an extremely unfriendly grouping game. Can't help people on previous quest steps. You can't redo dungeon quests, so trying to help friends through dungeons can be a pain (for instance, one dungeon you need a disguise to get through a part, but if you've already done the quest, you cannot get it a second time through). No mentoring or leveling down to help friends, etc.

Many MMOs have questing, yes, but they don't FORCE you to quest. SWTOR you could level entirely in PVP if you wanted. Everquest 2, you could level without doing many quests, if you wanted. BUT you could do quests if you wanted. CHOICE. Wow, what a concept.

I don't get why you think it's a bad thing for a game to give the player choices. The problem with the game as it stands now is that they did stick too much to the single player experience. That means that once we are done with it, we're done with it. It will not have longevity in its current state.

Most MMOs do do that you are correct. However it was my understanding that this game isn't meant to be like most MMOs. It is meant to be an Elder Scrolls MMO.

Anyone who has played The Elder Scrolls games know that it has always been about the quests and story because that is pretty much all a single player game can be about. In making this game a MMO they allow people to group together and complete objectives and give you incentives for doing those objectives. But to allow people to bypass the very essence that is TES would ruin the uniqueness of the game and take away from what makes the series so great.

If people are playing this game thinking and expecting it to be like every other MMO out there I understand why they are upset that you don't have a choice in leveling via PvP or dungeons. But this isn't meant to be just another MMO....It is meant to be Elder Scrolls, which has emphasis on quests and story progression and a MMO, which allows people to group together and complete group based objectives and to interact with other people and have a sense of community.

They have done a fantastic job balancing what Elder Scrolls IS with what a MMO offers when it comes to group and co operative play with one another. I will say again. If you are not a fan of a game that has heavily invested in its quests and not being able to dungeon grind or PvP grind your way to max level then I suggest finding a new game. YES I understand that some of the MMO community who have this "MMOs = this" type mentality will leave. Good. I doubt it will be near enough people to cause this game to "fail" and I do not mind not playing with people who do not appreciate the game.

Again, this is forcing people into one playstyle (questing).

I can see how running dungeons is not Skyrim gameplay. Nobody wants to bypass the essence of TES, we want to build and enchance it. Take it new places. Allow it to be enjoyed, even by those who were not originally Elder Scrolls fans.

Zenimax did not do a fantastic job balancing co operative play and you offered no arguments for that statement.

You had a worthy post until you called for your fellow players to leave the game.

I and many other do not see this a forcing people into one play style, we see it as the game having a focus. Who didn't think that an Elder Scrolls game wasn't going to have a focus on quests and story progression? This whole thing isn't about balance of a game, it is about gamers having different likes when it comes to what they like to do in games.

I know this is the first MMO in 10 years that I have been legitimately hooked on. I and many others have been waiting for an MMO that allows you to take your time and enjoy your leveling experience more than how fast can I get to max level so I can raid.

I think the difference here, and I know you guys will have no problem telling me I am wrong if I am, but the reason you guys are upset is not because there isn't incentives and rewards for doing dungeons and other group content, but that there isn't continuous incentives and reward for repeat the same content over and over again. Allowing you to repeat the same dungeons over and over again getting rewarded for it with xp would take away from the focus of the game, which is quests and story progression.

There are a lot more people out there than you probably think that actually enjoy leveling and questing more than grinding dungeon content as a means of leveling. When I suggest to look for another game to play that allows you to do that, I suggest because I do not want this game to become another non focused try to make everyone happy MMO. There is nothing wrong with having a focus in a game. People like myself and many others are happy with the focus that Zen went with rewarding you and giving you incentive to do the group content while not taking away from the leveling/character progression part that many people have been waiting for in an MMO.

There are other games out there that focus more on group content over leveling/questing. If that is your thing, by all means you do you but please let us who enjoy this game because of the amazing story and quests continue to enjoy it and not have that focus go away because the game doesn't cater to every type of gamer.

So what are all you guys gonna do that think ESO should be solo questing top to bottom when the new zone comes out that you have to have a group to do period, that the trials are 12 person raids? You guys who like solo wont see that content unless you come play with us group type folks.

I'm on work travel but when I get some time I'm going to find the statements the devs made back in beta were they wanted people to be able to level by dungeons and pvp also.

You guys keep saying go play something else, well we could go tell you the same thing, WOW and its many clones offers you to level by just questing so just saying...

If you want the game to grow it has to appeal to many different play styles, not just solo play


Btw I hate instancing and want open world dungeons like EQ1.

I never mentioned that I think ESO should be solo questing top to bottom. I mentioned that it has a focus on questing and story progression. There is nothing saying you cannot group with people to do quest content. Now if people think that it is not friendly in allowing you to meet up with people and group with them to do quests that is a completely different argument than dungeon grinding or not getting enough xp after completing a dungeon after the first time.

I am not sure why people instantly think that quests must be done solo. I have some RL friends that grouped with in the beginning when we were all starting out, but as we started leveling I different paces we couldn't group together as much. That didn't stop me from finding people around my level and communicating with them and befriending them to do quests together. I almost never quest by myself because I have made friends in game that I get along with and enjoy playing with that level around the same pace I do and for a lot of us that is a huge part of group aspect of a MMO, being able to meet new people you do not know and become friends and do quests/trade/just talk with etc...

So having this game focus on questing and story progression does not mean it is geared towards solo players only. They still have group content available that has to be completed with groups and I am all for those however I and many others are strongly against the instanced dungeons being able to be grinded as a way to level. I play in a group 90% of the time I am on (and I am sure a lot of other people do as well) and not all of us who are against this just do "quests" 100% of the time we are logged on either. There is plenty of other stuff that requires you to be interactive with others besides just "group dungeons."

I understand that end game content will be geared towards groups and I look forward to meeting people my level and grouping up with them to do this content together just like I look forward to possibly meeting new people to group with while I am making may way to 50 and then through the veteran ranks.

dsaras

And i think you are totally wrong about the game focused on questing and leveling.

First of all this is not a skyrim multiplayer, this is an eso themed mmo. If this was a skyrim multiplayer with the exact same freedom skyrim offers the situation would be different. This game on the other hand is a pure mmo. Yes it is a bit different but still it's more mmo than skyrim.

Arguments? You have classes, you have fixed story on rails. You have fixed drop (no "you can take whatever you see"). Your progression is on rails. You can't go wherever you want, because there are level brackets for each zone and etc..

I don't get it why people are trying to convince themselves and others that this game is something totally different. Yes it has it's differences.. a bit different crafting, a bit more freedom while choosing skillset, but it's still an mmo. It's not a bad thing we simply want it to be a good mmo. Even the whole story driven thing is far from unique (~hint~ swtor.. and we all know how it ended... and i can still remember the same "this is not wow, enjoy leveling and story" thing).

Then again i'm going to repeat myself. How does having better balanced dungeons and leveling, influences you - a player who enjoys leveling while questing? How does that hurt you, that other people can level by doing dungeons? The only thing i hear is the same "this is a questing game" thing, but Sir, who are you to know the long time vision of ESO devs? I thought their goal was to make a very good elder scrolls based mmo. And in 2014 a very good mmo is not the one which limits it's players or forcing them to adjust to certain brackets, especially mmo that comes from the series known for it'S freedom.

Lastly if this is an exclusively story driven mmo only focused on that aspect of the game only, i'm even more dissapointed, because now, after you reach 50, there is no exclusive story, you simply have to go through other factions quests. In my opinion this is a sign of lazy design or a game that launched too early, before finishing whole content for a release and not a trait of a ~story driven game~

This all criticism is not because i don't like this game or i want it to fail. Opposite i want to give feedback for it to be a better game.
P.S. sorry for my bad english

Krohm

baraka101 wrote: »

Krohm wrote: »

baraka101 wrote: »

Weevah wrote: »

baraka101 wrote: »

hwesterbergb14_ESO wrote: »

"I wouldn't complain that they need to fix the game.....I would not play the game because it isn't what I want for my gaming experience."

Uh, that's the point. You wouldn't play the game... Is it in Zeni's best interest to alienate a big chunk of their player base?

And yes, there is something stopping you from questing with a group. Unless you are on the same steps of the same quests, it's almost impossible to group to do quests. If you are out of synch on a step you can't even see each other on the map half the time. It's a BIG PAIN.

This is actually an extremely unfriendly grouping game. Can't help people on previous quest steps. You can't redo dungeon quests, so trying to help friends through dungeons can be a pain (for instance, one dungeon you need a disguise to get through a part, but if you've already done the quest, you cannot get it a second time through). No mentoring or leveling down to help friends, etc.

Many MMOs have questing, yes, but they don't FORCE you to quest. SWTOR you could level entirely in PVP if you wanted. Everquest 2, you could level without doing many quests, if you wanted. BUT you could do quests if you wanted. CHOICE. Wow, what a concept.

I don't get why you think it's a bad thing for a game to give the player choices. The problem with the game as it stands now is that they did stick too much to the single player experience. That means that once we are done with it, we're done with it. It will not have longevity in its current state.

Most MMOs do do that you are correct. However it was my understanding that this game isn't meant to be like most MMOs. It is meant to be an Elder Scrolls MMO.

Anyone who has played The Elder Scrolls games know that it has always been about the quests and story because that is pretty much all a single player game can be about. In making this game a MMO they allow people to group together and complete objectives and give you incentives for doing those objectives. But to allow people to bypass the very essence that is TES would ruin the uniqueness of the game and take away from what makes the series so great.

If people are playing this game thinking and expecting it to be like every other MMO out there I understand why they are upset that you don't have a choice in leveling via PvP or dungeons. But this isn't meant to be just another MMO....It is meant to be Elder Scrolls, which has emphasis on quests and story progression and a MMO, which allows people to group together and complete group based objectives and to interact with other people and have a sense of community.

They have done a fantastic job balancing what Elder Scrolls IS with what a MMO offers when it comes to group and co operative play with one another. I will say again. If you are not a fan of a game that has heavily invested in its quests and not being able to dungeon grind or PvP grind your way to max level then I suggest finding a new game. YES I understand that some of the MMO community who have this "MMOs = this" type mentality will leave. Good. I doubt it will be near enough people to cause this game to "fail" and I do not mind not playing with people who do not appreciate the game.

Again, this is forcing people into one playstyle (questing).

I can see how running dungeons is not Skyrim gameplay. Nobody wants to bypass the essence of TES, we want to build and enchance it. Take it new places. Allow it to be enjoyed, even by those who were not originally Elder Scrolls fans.

Zenimax did not do a fantastic job balancing co operative play and you offered no arguments for that statement.

You had a worthy post until you called for your fellow players to leave the game.

I and many other do not see this a forcing people into one play style, we see it as the game having a focus. Who didn't think that an Elder Scrolls game wasn't going to have a focus on quests and story progression? This whole thing isn't about balance of a game, it is about gamers having different likes when it comes to what they like to do in games.

I know this is the first MMO in 10 years that I have been legitimately hooked on. I and many others have been waiting for an MMO that allows you to take your time and enjoy your leveling experience more than how fast can I get to max level so I can raid.

I think the difference here, and I know you guys will have no problem telling me I am wrong if I am, but the reason you guys are upset is not because there isn't incentives and rewards for doing dungeons and other group content, but that there isn't continuous incentives and reward for repeat the same content over and over again. Allowing you to repeat the same dungeons over and over again getting rewarded for it with xp would take away from the focus of the game, which is quests and story progression.

There are a lot more people out there than you probably think that actually enjoy leveling and questing more than grinding dungeon content as a means of leveling. When I suggest to look for another game to play that allows you to do that, I suggest because I do not want this game to become another non focused try to make everyone happy MMO. There is nothing wrong with having a focus in a game. People like myself and many others are happy with the focus that Zen went with rewarding you and giving you incentive to do the group content while not taking away from the leveling/character progression part that many people have been waiting for in an MMO.

There are other games out there that focus more on group content over leveling/questing. If that is your thing, by all means you do you but please let us who enjoy this game because of the amazing story and quests continue to enjoy it and not have that focus go away because the game doesn't cater to every type of gamer.

So what are all you guys gonna do that think ESO should be solo questing top to bottom when the new zone comes out that you have to have a group to do period, that the trials are 12 person raids? You guys who like solo wont see that content unless you come play with us group type folks.

I'm on work travel but when I get some time I'm going to find the statements the devs made back in beta were they wanted people to be able to level by dungeons and pvp also.

You guys keep saying go play something else, well we could go tell you the same thing, WOW and its many clones offers you to level by just questing so just saying...

If you want the game to grow it has to appeal to many different play styles, not just solo play


Btw I hate instancing and want open world dungeons like EQ1.

I never mentioned that I think ESO should be solo questing top to bottom. I mentioned that it has a focus on questing and story progression. There is nothing saying you cannot group with people to do quest content. Now if people think that it is not friendly in allowing you to meet up with people and group with them to do quests that is a completely different argument than dungeon grinding or not getting enough xp after completing a dungeon after the first time.

I am not sure why people instantly think that quests must be done solo. I have some RL friends that grouped with in the beginning when we were all starting out, but as we started leveling I different paces we couldn't group together as much. That didn't stop me from finding people around my level and communicating with them and befriending them to do quests together. I almost never quest by myself because I have made friends in game that I get along with and enjoy playing with that level around the same pace I do and for a lot of us that is a huge part of group aspect of a MMO, being able to meet new people you do not know and become friends and do quests/trade/just talk with etc...

So having this game focus on questing and story progression does not mean it is geared towards solo players only. They still have group content available that has to be completed with groups and I am all for those however I and many others are strongly against the instanced dungeons being able to be grinded as a way to level. I play in a group 90% of the time I am on (and I am sure a lot of other people do as well) and not all of us who are against this just do "quests" 100% of the time we are logged on either. There is plenty of other stuff that requires you to be interactive with others besides just "group dungeons."

I understand that end game content will be geared towards groups and I look forward to meeting people my level and grouping up with them to do this content together just like I look forward to possibly meeting new people to group with while I am making may way to 50 and then through the veteran ranks.

But thats just it, I don't know if you did any of the beta weekends, pts server or followed all there posting all over the net but for who wanted the option for dungeons or pvp, ZOS told us we could and yea we did so even into early access, so yea were upset they nerfed the xp.

Also can you guys please post up the so called post were the devs stated the way to level in this game is questing only cause I sure don't see it. If they did that people would go what and unsub.

I always respect others opinions but you can't force people to play the game your way and say deal with it or go play some other game, like I said before there has to be a few different avenues to max level. Questing is actually done pretty dam well in this game but like all things it gets old and other activities need to be viable.

I didn't play WOW but I did play Rift and I hated the sit in the city dungeon que crap, I wanna see people sitting outside the entrance bsing and trying to get groups together.

Michan

I don't get it why people are opposed to dungeon grinding when you get tired of questing. You do know that end game is all about doing raids and dungeons in MMOs? So why do you want to force us having a carrot stick until we get to that stage? We are all going to do the same thing at highest level anyway.

I will probably never level an alt, even though I like Templar better than Nightblade. I just can't take the grind again.

I will remind you people again. A game is about having fun, not a carrot stick to fun things.

Torasi

As I have played through this game on a couple of different toons, I have come to learn one important thing about the leveling system. It. Is. Slow. There's no way to "speed level" your character. It's not supposed to be fast, by the time you reach level 10 you should be properly geared for PvP encounters in Cyrodil. The only way to be ready for that is to do the quests that gear you up. With BC being the first dungeon and at the low level of 11-13 being the recommended level, it seems that the ZOS team wants you to focus on the quests up until that point so that you can be well versed by the time you get there. That being said I fully agree that a dungeon based game makes a happy community of players and gives the game a brighter side to the more veteran level MMO players. I think that there is a balance to be found here and ZOS needs to find it through add ons.

Nina

Michan wrote: »

I will probably never level an alt, even though I like Templar better than Nightblade. I just can't take the grind again.

I can say the same.

I like some of the quests very much, but it is still a system that punishes severely if you don't follow the path (with some kind of pattern related to the quests including books, skyshards,...), especially at lower levels when the game is giving the character that need to be leveled to reach its coolness.

For me is healing and tanking my favourite activities, something that involves group efforts, continuity, tactics, continous activity non-stop (as opposed to feeling like that rat in a maze hurrying to random spots on the map with lots of chatter when what I want is to get the cool abilities and be useful for others).

However, I personally think that the grouping experience I've had in teso has been really great despite the hardship and confusions, people has been all over very positive and willing to try new things and that illustrates, to me, something else that I think is important in a mmorpg; community and that is something that need to be nurtured.

No, I don't think the public dungeons really qualifies as good places to meet new people not for long term social interaction at least.

Guilds works, but again what are people to do together?

I've done some duoing with my spouse and a friend. Inconvenient. It requires too much discipline on harmonising quest-chains, random solo-locked instances and that is when I wish the most for nonstop uninterrupted killing in some dungeons that are not crowded into a zerg race to tag mobs as fast as possible to get any xp at all (realism anyone? It reminds me of old Ultima Online with hordes camping timed boss spawns...what a strange "adventure" that was). I find zerging quite antisocial.

Anyways, to Mr Lodbrok, the last season of Ragnar and the other Vikings is so good ...though bit disturbing.

sleepspasmnub18_ESO

You guys are seriously missing out on some excellent stories by wanting to bypass all of that. The only other mmo I've played that had such interesting story lines was the secret world.

Mufasa

crimsonBZD wrote: »

Michan wrote: »

This is ridiculous. As a mmo veteran, I pretty much do dungeons and spend little time questing. This is why I am leveling 1 level per 2 days. Because I do 4-5 quests or so, and then I log out. This is a heckuva long whipping you are giving us MMO lovers.

I am SEVEN levels below my quest requirement, and it's just getting higher and higher. If I had done dungeons I wouldn't struggle at bosses or 2+ mobs (usually heavy geared with stuns).

I am now lv30, sick and tired of the grinding. I want to have fun with players, not compete with them on who talks to the witch first that disappears after someone has talked to her.

People, you want a story in the game? Well, I want a story about the good times in dungeons. I don't care about voice over dialogues, they could just be voiced in particular areas. Because I just skip them, as a lot of MMO veterans does, I am positive.

If this game does not fix DUNGEONS I will be leaving it for the next MMO coming out in June. I am getting more impatient about questing in this game than I have ever in a MMO. I like the setting and all, and on other MMOs I would have done dungeons if they weren't a WoW copy or very bad in general. But this game has potential. But your decisions on the dungeon leveling and chest running competition (that makes everything go even slower), is a VERY BAD decision. You are basically making your userbase smaller by forcing them to quest all the way to lv50 veteran rank 10. Not everyone will put up with this questing *** and I have seen many in my guild just quit the game at lv20ish.

I just disagree with all of this.

edit: for some more information, I personally am glad they didn't pander this game out as a standard MMO, that's apparent by the fact that you're playing it as one and it's not working out for you. I see this complaint often.

I play it like I played skyrim, except every character inevitably uses magick. I play about equal time in 1st and 3rd and am loving it. I would play exclusively in first, but that hardcore PvP style play with all the cc and f'in people up isn't really possible in 1st person yet.

But yeah, it's not a "standard" MMO, and I hope it never becomes one.

So why should you only be able to play it how YOU like? Why do we not have the flexibility to play it and progress evenly no matter how we want to play it, be it Questing, dungeons, or pvp?

EzikielStorm

This issue didnt really bother me until VR1, then i realised that you basically have to complete an entire other faction of quests before you are supposed to go in a dungeon...

Yes we might be able to complete one or two of the dungeons, but all loot is for VR5 anyway so there is no real point.

So its gone from being able to do 3 different dungeons per "tier" through out your 1 to 49 journey, which was a fun way to get away from the quest grind sometimes, straight to nothing but quest grind until VR5.

If this is driving you crazy already OP then i really dont think you are going to make it passed VR3.

I dont like the "flavour/atmosphere" of my factions VR1 to VR5 content, so i might not even make it myself

Meneleas

EzikielStorm wrote: »

This issue didnt really bother me until VR1, then i realised that you basically have to complete an entire other faction of quests before you are supposed to go in a dungeon...

Yes we might be able to complete one or two of the dungeons, but all loot is for VR5 anyway so there is no real point.

So its gone from being able to do 3 different dungeons per "tier" through out your 1 to 49 journey, which was a fun way to get away from the quest grind sometimes, straight to nothing but quest grind until VR5.

Wow didn't realise that. Makes the lack of xp in dungeons even more a massive pita.

FoulOrder

Well, I've never really played an MMO before now. I have played all the Elder Scrolls games and have loved them. I crack up with the comments that say "do the quests--this is Elder Scrolls!" However, it's an MMO, and the quests are largely broken when trying to quest in a group. I bought this game 1) because the Elder Scrolls world is fantastic, and 2) to quest with my son who is in a another country. He and I have been trying to play together, but the questing system is not group friendly.

So, for those who defend questing as the best way to play the game, are you actually playing an MMO or are you playing ESO as a subscription based single-player game?

Believe me, my son and I would love to play with an emphasis on questing but more and more we find we're not in the same instance, or our quest is really a single-player quest, or we have to quest separately but "play together" because the questing system with NPCs really doesn't work when playing as a group.

In the end, it seems as though Elder Scrolls should stick to making awesome single-player games, and leave the MMO making to people who know what they're doing. I'm not going to pay a subscription to play a game that fails in the basics.

Nina

FoulOrder wrote: »

In the end, it seems as though Elder Scrolls should stick to making awesome single-player games, and leave the MMO making to people who know what they're doing. I'm not going to pay a subscription to play a game that fails in the basics.

This is how I feel as well. Also, without the promise of a better future at higher levels does it make me wonder why I should level and put in the effort at all?

I am trying hard to understand this, for my own benefit; I do really enjoy a few singleplayers, like Dragon Age, Dragon's Dogma (with some unusual multiplayer/community feeling) and my absolute favourite being Mass Effect. Still, those games have more to offer in certain ways and makes me live with the single-player world.

I did experience similar doubts in SWTOR and quickly left because of the additional way MY character was behaving in dialogues. The last thing there might seem very quirky and I accept that most found it fun and amusing, but still the game didn't quite make it as expected, so people reacted to the package they were served and I do the same now with ESO.

I wonder if this bad feeling related to questing is born from the first year of WoW leveling as a holy-priest..."Kill 10 Rats!", "Kill 15 Giant Rats!" and "Kill 100 Even Bigger Rats!" was a nightmare. Eventually some real-life friends took pity on me and we ran through the levels together to end up with shared death and glory with Ragnaros and Deathwing. This improved greatly with the group finder, for me at least.

In ESO is it not a functional group finder since it ignores the need for certain roles and while it can be full of feelings of achievement is the 3xp per kill not something that can keep people wanting to do dungeons.

FoulOrder wrote: »

Believe me, my son and I would love to play with an emphasis on questing but more and more we find we're not in the same instance, or our quest is really a single-player quest, or we have to quest separately but "play together" because the questing system with NPCs really doesn't work when playing as a group.

I sympathise.

My first reaction to those quests, the zerg-open dungeons and the 3xp/kill system in proper (realistic?) dungeons was simply that I couldn't play this and that I felt like such a fool for getting my spouse to play this game under the false pretenses/impression of playing together (though we try and manage much of the time, but it is still lacking and mostly about running).

Fortunately is my spouse far more hard-headed than me and got me going after we talked about it with the hopes that it would end up better later on.

Nina

Not to forget: The hardest parts of the quest-chains are often solo-instanced so "Better not come unprepared to do DPS".

Anastasia

SuperScrubby wrote: »

Ragnar_Lodbrok wrote: »

Then why play mmorpg's? Questing is what rpg's are about.

Eeeeh, I wouldn't necessarily ...

I'm also not a big fan of being able to level them up by just swapping and turning in a quest. Takes away from the actual character progression or "immersion" if you will when your character gets better with actually using said weapon. I want my character to eventually max everything out the longer I play said character.

---

Without being snarky in the least, may I then ask WHY ARE YOU DOING IT THAT WAY? You object to someone being able to level through a quest and then "changing their primary weapon or swapping it just before turning in the quest" ... ? If you 'want to level a particular weapon', then stick with it as you do the various quests. We will later after 50 be able to go to other factions areas, perhaps you could level another weapon at that time? I'm just feeling like we, the player have the choice here on this particular topic.

Have fun this week!

Badh0rse

This is still going on? They haven't released any type of statement concerning this atrocity? What the bleeping, bleep, bleepity, BLEEP! This seems like such a no brainer to me ... FIX IT! I understand some people are happy the way it is ... frakkin great for them. A very, very, large number of us want dungeon xp and want to do dungeons for most of leveling so let us! Now I know some of you are going to retort "I love questing." and "This is Elder Scrolls, go play a dif game if you don't like it." ... go eat a bowl of ***** Why are you questing fan boys so defensive about this topic? YOU like to quest .. great go do it and stay out of conversations that largely don't concern you. ANYWAY, if anyone has heard anything on this topic pls post or msg me. This is a game breaker and I am def on the fence at this point.

Ausfin

Ragnar_Lodbrok wrote: »

You act like you have to solo quests. How about grouping up for them? You guys just want to grind dungeon content ad nauseum. Next you'll ask for dungeon finders so you can never leave town. Yes thats what mmos are about, not. Go back to WoW if you want that.

Whats the point in grouping up for questing? Nothing will be a challenge as there will be no chance of death. Two or more people engaging groups of monsters that have been designed to be solo'able ... that's how we are "meant" to play in this Massively Multiplayer Online environment? Steamroll the solo content in group? Doesn't that seem a little bit silly?

I know this game is not wow or "wow clone" and I am glad of it. But dungeons are a big part of PvE content in any MMO. Having you, and many others like you, imply that I am some kind of a lesser being because i want to challenge myself with other people is quite frankly insulting and hypocritical.

No one is asking for dungeon xp to be boosted to the point where it becomes the faster than questing. We are just asking that we be rewarded for taking part in that content. Rather than effectively preventing us from playing how we want to play.

Gohlar

I don't log in anymore, neither do the people I play with. What really killed us was the realization that even after 50, you're looking at a lot of questing to get to VR5 and start doing dungeons.

It's such a shame. The dungeons are there, the pvp is decent. The content exists. If you ever decide to better utilize it Zenimax, we will probably return.

Mothanos

I can tell you already that if you pis s off dungeon crawlers and pvp fanatics they might go the way of SWTOR
I think we can all agree that we want Zenimax to be succesfull to build a better mmo

Give people a choice on how they want to level up, be it trough grinding mobs / running dungeons / doing pvp in Cyrodiil !

This game needs to survive as i have seen so many mmo fall into to free to play market and die off a silent death or becomes pay to enjoy

make changes Zenimax...for the love of god dont nerf exp in area's people like to play the game in as 90% off all mmo's went free to play within 1 year.
Dont fall inside that market becuase you were to stuborn to open up more ways to let players level up and play the game they want to play it.

Getorix

Personally I prefer questing to grinding, I mean I really really hate grinding. But I have no desire to stop other people from doing it.

My only guesses as to why zennimax has done this is to combat exploits people were using in dungeons( It was happening I saw it with my own eyes) and or to combat account resellers/power levelers.

I can understand either of those excuses as long as they fix them soon because the results of examples are far worse than pissing the few people who can stand to grind out levels on just mobs.

Ausfin

Changing things to prevent exploits I am glad for, so long as it does not impact on in a massive and negative way on the community as this has. I would prefer to have cheater, botters and hackers be able to exploit something for a short period of time than see all the people that enjoy the same aspect of MMO's that I do leave before the game has got off the ground.

rubalcaba93b14a_ESO

I'm in the same boat. This game plays like single player except in dungeons. I get together with my friends to do dungeons and then when we finish we all go our seprate ways because there is no incentive to do dungeons more than once. Dungeons are the only thing that present a challenge to a group everything else is just faceroll. I know I will most likely be unsubbing but I will keep checking the news on this game to see if it improves

Stautmeister

i love how ironic it is that the argument vs dungeon grinding is: Its an elder scrolls game its quest based.
If my memory is correct you could also level up through crafting and random slaying of monsters in dungeons. Basically level up by doing whatever you want.
If you wanted you could theoretically reach level 50 without doing a single quest.

Now i like how they approached this game like SWTOR: There is a main quest for your character and their is a main quest for your faction that runs you through the different zones.
These quests are the story ones, the rest of the quests is mainly lore/zone flavour. Add background but do not advance the story.
The faction and main quests i enjoyed a lot. and i loved how it evolved over the zones. This questline im looking forward to. (it also had the most interesting boss fights)
However after 50 levels im now in vet content. While i like to see the faction quest. I honestly have problems with helping out spirit X with their imprisonment. Or Cleansing ritual site Y. Its tedious and offers nothing in the way of the enjoyment i get from the actual storylines.

In skyrim i did the mainquests, not the miscelaneous.
So technically id like to complain about ESO not being like Skyrim questwise!
(2 sides of the coin)

Now about the dungeons.
Im a tank. SnB, Full passives, heavy armor, block cost reduction etc. I spend around 90 skillpoints to get my tanking build perfected.
Useless and wasted. I either take over a minute per mob to kill, or have to switch to 2 handed dps on my off bar (its what i use now).
In my perfect world i could do the mainquest till im underlevelled: Do some dungeons, Check for skyshards/public dungeons, explore a bit, maybe do a sidequest if i feel like it. Help out my guild in pvp.
This is what i feel was implicated as possible.

1-50, sure this is the case.
Vet rank. Impossible
1. no dungeons to do (vet 5/10 only)

All there is: questing. 3 dolmens. 4 public dungeons.
Rince and repeat for over 24 hours.

People are not asking to make this game less story based, or take out the questing. What they ask is make this game more like skyrim, let me do what and still get a reasonable xp/h comparable to questing or maybe even slightly lower. But not non existing.

Marmalade

I find it hilarious that people keep on coming out with this 'wow clone' crap. If anybody raises a valid argument against ESO or how something could be improved to help people enjoy the game the ES fanboys come out of the darkness with no reasonable argument just splurg out the 'go back to wow' line. Its pathetic.

There were plenty of MMOS before World of Warcraft that allowed players to gain exp though dungeons. Its a fundamental part of MMORPGs.

This isn't a single player game, its supposed to be something you enjoy with friends but the lack of experience in dungeons and pvp combined with the disastrous group mechanics just seem to be forcing us to play alone.

Singular

Marmalade wrote: »

I find it hilarious that people keep on coming out with this 'wow clone' crap. If anybody raises a valid argument against ESO or how something could be improved to help people enjoy the game the ES fanboys come out of the darkness with no reasonable argument just splurg out the 'go back to wow' line. Its pathetic.

There were plenty of MMOS before World of Warcraft that allowed players to gain exp though dungeons. Its a fundamental part of MMORPGs.

This isn't a single player game, its supposed to be something you enjoy with friends but the lack of experience in dungeons and pvp combined with the disastrous group mechanics just seem to be forcing us to play alone.

I've never played WOW, but I find the grouping tools here utterly lacking and am annoyed at the various xp nerfs - they were total. Far, far too much.