Hybridization is not complete

SoloPlayerZP

The problem is if you have a minor buff like minor brutality on DK and then want to use blue alliance potions for the major buffs you only get major sorcery which increases your spell damage. The spell damage will then be higher than the wepaon damage buffed from minor brutality and due to dynamic scaling the game will use your spell damage to calculate the values, making your minor buff completely irrelevant. The only way to benefit from the minor brutality buff would be to also get the major brutality buff either through sacrificing a skill slot or through running green alliance potions. Either would put a rather mag dk focused build at disadvantage.

Solution: let green and blue alliance potion give major buffs from either type.

Edit: this is from a PvP perspective.

i11ionward

This must be completed from any perspective. The same problem applies to munduses, poisons, and so on.

Tannus15

yup, it's super annoying.

especially since some classes get free access just for having a skill slotted on the back bar, while other classes need to use a GCD to maintain a buff.

it's really important now to get access to both buffs because there is less variety of classes in a group composition now, so you're likely to miss out on one or the other.

StaticWave

Or a stamsorc using SPELL crit potions because the class has Minor Prophecy.

VinnyGambini

Fully agree, hybridization is far from complete.

MashmalloMan

It's exhausting getting my hopes up every single update, expecting this to be completed... "Surely it's this update, it's been about 3 years.."

Nope. I become increasingly jaded about how simple this is to update where as I originally understood it would take a little time. A little time is 1-2 updates, not 3 years.

I can only assume they've forgotten at this point when this should be priority 1 in terms of game balance. Stop starting a bunch of projects and leaving them half finished please and thank you

React

It's super frustrating they never finished this. I personally think hybridization as a whole was a mistake as it effectively halved the number of unique feeling specs in the game, but at the very least you'd expect them to FINISH the system if they're set on keeping it..

MashmalloMan

React wrote: »

It's super frustrating they never finished this. I personally think hybridization as a whole was a mistake as it effectively halved the number of unique feeling specs in the game, but at the very least you'd expect them to FINISH the system if they're set on keeping it..

Hybridization isn't the problem, the design philosophy and follow up is. If it was handled better it wouldn't be an issue. There is very easy ways to make classes have multiple playstyles without relying on the old mantra of "Green Bar" vs "Blue Bar", which effectively makes real unique feeling specs like you request. I'd argue the old setup was shallow and unintuitive and despite the downsides of hybridization, is largely positive and supported by most of the community.

Eg. Pet Sorc vs No Pet Sorc.. could apply this logic to other classes, but they haven't. The only attempt I've seen towards this is Grave Lord's Sacrifice for Necromancer where you make a pivotal decision about using a 3s Blastbones rotation. They could take this so much further, but GLS is just a bad skill by design. Even in the example of Pet Sorcs, No Pet Sorc isn't competitive, not even close so sacrificing 20% of your DPS just to role play is usually not worth it.

For Warden, I'd also give them a Pet vs No Pet option, give them incentives to play differently. So many players don't want to use bear, but it's the best way to play the class by a massive margin. Give alternatives.

I'm not saying the gap needs to be perfect, but it should be within reason and follow basic game design.. Lets say Pet Sorc had great aoe dps, then No Pet Sorc should have better single target dps or vise versa, but by a marginal gap of like 5%.

Also if a setup is more complicated, reward the player. Maybe GLS is the easier rotation for Necro, so it has 5% less ST dps, but players will still prefer it if they find it more enjoyable to use. 5% is negligible enough to not push you out of all content in the game.

acastanza_ESO

StaticWave wrote: »

Or a stamsorc using SPELL crit potions because the class has Minor Prophecy.

At least on Sorc you can use blue pots and dark deal your stam back from them, I'd say other classes have it a bit worse there without access to that resource conversion.

MashmalloMan

acastanza_ESO wrote: »

StaticWave wrote: »

Or a stamsorc using SPELL crit potions because the class has Minor Prophecy.

At least on Sorc you can use blue pots and dark deal your stam back from them, I'd say other classes have it a bit worse there without access to that resource conversion.

Yeah honestly, I've gotten used to it in pvp at this point, but it's still counterintuitive and against what I actually need.

For pve, can't really pull it off as easily.

Quethrosar

StaticWave wrote: »

Or a stamsorc using SPELL crit potions because the class has Minor Prophecy.

glad i hate stamsorc.

Tannus15

personally i'd love to see the "max resource = damage" changed to "total non health resource = damage" so that we aren't stuck stacking 64 attributes into 1 stat and all enchants on the same stat.

It would be really nice to have a more balanced resource pools, and for certain skills like bound armaments or inner light to benefit everyone. not to mention resource set bonuses being more universal

ForumSavant

I assume certain buffs are kept to certain classes to retain some amount of diversity in groups.

Silaf

Actually i prefer if zos revert it as it was before.
At the moment for me it only took away class identity by removing the morfs and giving them to stamina.

Tannus15

StaticWave wrote: »

Or a stamsorc using SPELL crit potions because the class has Minor Prophecy.

if you're running a scribing skill now you can tack major savagery on it to cover this which is nice.

Stafford197

How about next year? Or maybe in a couple years? Or maybe not at all?

Neither us nor ZOS knows when it’ll be finished

necro_the_crafter

I would like to see sustain become fully hybrid, while damage kept separate.

Would be nice if they just implemented different classifications with its own scalers to abilities, for example:

1. Spell - mag costing ability. Scales from spell damage and max magika. Would favour mag oriented builds
2. Skill - stam costing ability. Scales from weapon damage and max stamina. Would favour stam oriented builds
3. Universal - cost highest resourse. Scales from highest damage and max resourse. Mostly utility spells and heals.
4. Alternate - cost lowest resourse. Scales from highest damage and max resourse. Mostly utility spells and heals.
5. Apex - cost both resourse. Scales from average of both damage values and both resourses. Will be good no matter what path you choose, good for class signature abilities like Whip, Assassins Will, Deep Fissure, Blastbones, Hauntuing Curse, Puncturing Sweep, Pragmatic Fatecarver.


This, instead of previous system that had 2 specs per class, and contruary to cuurent system that has 1 bis meta setup would put all the builds on a spectrum, allowing a vast varieties of builds, and PvE and PvP group compositions.

Renato90085

as a stam sorc endgame player
because nb is almost no longer needed, including healer
so I am the only one in the group who cannot get 6% crit rate while provided 6% crit rate

MashmalloMan

necro_the_crafter wrote: »

I would like to see sustain become fully hybrid, while damage kept separate.

Would be nice if they just implemented different classifications with its own scalers to abilities, for example:

1. Spell - mag costing ability. Scales from spell damage and max magika. Would favour mag oriented builds
2. Skill - stam costing ability. Scales from weapon damage and max stamina. Would favour stam oriented builds
3. Universal - cost highest resourse. Scales from highest damage and max resourse. Mostly utility spells and heals.
4. Alternate - cost lowest resourse. Scales from highest damage and max resourse. Mostly utility spells and heals.
5. Apex - cost both resourse. Scales from average of both damage values and both resourses. Will be good no matter what path you choose, good for class signature abilities like Whip, Assassins Will, Deep Fissure, Blastbones, Hauntuing Curse, Puncturing Sweep, Pragmatic Fatecarver.


This, instead of previous system that had 2 specs per class, and contruary to cuurent system that has 1 bis meta setup would put all the builds on a spectrum, allowing a vast varieties of builds, and PvE and PvP group compositions.

This is literally how the game direction was going for awhile and players chose to request more hybridization over less. "Spell's" were from classes, "Skills" were from weapons, thus why weapon and spell damage were named that way. Over time, Stamina builds became more popular, but players complained they lacked any real idenity because they couldn't use their class skills resulting in about 7/10 of their non ultimate skills being exactly the same. It looked something like Volley, Poison Injection, Trap Beast, Caltrops, Twin Slashes, Steel Tornado, and a spammable.

CP 1.0 scaled heavily towards Martial or Magical damage, you couldn't do both, so even though ultimates dynamically scaled, stamina players were forced to use Ballista on back bar, then of course, you slot Dawnbreaker front bar for 3% weapon damage. At that point, 9/12 skill slots are identical no matter what class you picked. That time period was very very very very very stale. Even Magicka classes were effectively all the same for each class because they had less options too, they just weren't tied to specific weapon, guild, or world skills.

They eventually added 1 or 2 skills on each class that scaled from highest max resource, the way hybridization is today on everything. Streak for example was the only class skill a Stam Sorc could use that had decent damage, that scaled from Magicka. Everything else was useless, dealing like 1 third of what it should.

For the "Universal" and "Alternate" idea, this already exists on Arcanist, for whatever reason, they haven't even bothered testing it on other classes yet, but it would definitely free up a lot of morphs for better skill diversity. Some good examples where these could be implemented are skills like Betty Netch, Rune Focus, Flame Skull, Jabs, etc. All of these morphs have a Stamina vs Magicka option that do nearly the exact same thing. If one morph changed its cost to highest or lowest max resource, then the other morph could be changed to something completely unique.

The "Apex" idea is already in use as well for DK's Whip, again, they have yet to implement this for any other class which leads me to believe they're drawing a line in the sand to say that these rare instances are especially unique to the identity of those 2 classes. I think this is flawed logic, but thats just what it seems like they're banking on right now.

For the point about meta DPS diversity being reduced, by definition it stands for "most effective tactics available". You could add 10 unique builds to every class that the player is forced to use by introducing arbitrary barriers and players will still find the specific build that results in them getting the highest DPS possible even when the differences between them are negligible or the content they want to use it in, doesn't matter. The point is, meta is not something any game design company should chase to resolve because it's literally impossible, the best thing they can do is bring up everything else to be similar enough that people not meta chasing aren't overly punished. I'm not saying class design is perfect as I mentioned earlier in a previous comment, but reverting hybridization or introducing roadblocks like we had before will not bring back "meta dps diversity".

So in summary, no thanks to 1/2, we've moved on from that, ZOS isn't going back.

Yes please to occasionally adding 3/4/5 like Arcanist and DK have, sharing is caring.

Urvoth

React wrote: »

It's super frustrating they never finished this. I personally think hybridization as a whole was a mistake as it effectively halved the number of unique feeling specs in the game, but at the very least you'd expect them to FINISH the system if they're set on keeping it..

Exactly, we went from effectively 12 classes to 6, 7 now with Arcanist. They're probably never going to add a total of 5 new classes, so that playstyle gap is just lost.

necro_the_crafter

MashmalloMan wrote: »

This is literally how the game direction was going for awhile and players chose to request more hybridization over less. "Spell's" were from classes, "Skills" were from weapons, thus why weapon and spell damage were named that way. Over time, Stamina builds became more popular, but players complained they lacked any real idenity because they couldn't use their class skills resulting in about 7/10 of their non ultimate skills being exactly the same. It looked something like Volley, Poison Injection, Trap Beast, Caltrops, Twin Slashes, Steel Tornado, and a spammable.

CP 1.0 scaled heavily towards Martial or Magical damage, you couldn't do both, so even though ultimates dynamically scaled, stamina players were forced to use Ballista on back bar, then of course, you slot Dawnbreaker front bar for 3% weapon damage. At that point, 9/12 skill slots are identical no matter what class you picked. That time period was very very very very very stale. Even Magicka classes were effectively all the same for each class because they had less options too, they just weren't tied to specific weapon, guild, or world skills.

They eventually added 1 or 2 skills on each class that scaled from highest max resource, the way hybridization is today on everything. Streak for example was the only class skill a Stam Sorc could use that had decent damage, that scaled from Magicka. Everything else was useless, dealing like 1 third of what it should.

For the "Universal" and "Alternate" idea, this already exists on Arcanist, for whatever reason, they haven't even bothered testing it on other classes yet, but it would definitely free up a lot of morphs for better skill diversity. Some good examples where these could be implemented are skills like Betty Netch, Rune Focus, Flame Skull, Jabs, etc. All of these morphs have a Stamina vs Magicka option that do nearly the exact same thing. If one morph changed its cost to highest or lowest max resource, then the other morph could be changed to something completely unique.

The "Apex" idea is already in use as well for DK's Whip, again, they have yet to implement this for any other class which leads me to believe they're drawing a line in the sand to say that these rare instances are especially unique to the identity of those 2 classes. I think this is flawed logic, but thats just what it seems like they're banking on right now.

For the point about meta DPS diversity being reduced, by definition it stands for "most effective tactics available". You could add 10 unique builds to every class that the player is forced to use by introducing arbitrary barriers and players will still find the specific build that results in them getting the highest DPS possible even when the differences between them are negligible or the content they want to use it in, doesn't matter. The point is, meta is not something any game design company should chase to resolve because it's literally impossible, the best thing they can do is bring up everything else to be similar enough that people not meta chasing aren't overly punished. I'm not saying class design is perfect as I mentioned earlier in a previous comment, but reverting hybridization or introducing roadblocks like we had before will not bring back "meta dps diversity".

So in summary, no thanks to 1/2, we've moved on from that, ZOS isn't going back.

Yes please to occasionally adding 3/4/5 like Arcanist and DK have, sharing is caring.

Yeah I know about early cp system, been playing myself since Tamriel Unlimited.
Martial vs Magical was based not only on cp choises but also for a big part on race choise. Dunmers used to have flat 9% fire damage that got changed to 7% fire 2% frost 2% lightning and then to weapon/spell damage. Altmers had 4% bonus damage to all elements. Theese were a significant boosts that made mag specs outshine stams on patches when they were on equal footing. But for the most part stam would perform batter in full pen group due to them having crit chanse and flat weapon damage modifier from medium armor as well as op, for its time, maelstorm dual wield and bow.

Also yeah, for classification that i suggested, I used stuff that is already in the game, I just want it to be applied to each and every ability. So every ability would be classified. And apllication of above mentioned classification would allow ZoS to revisit old abilities that require updates, shaking up the game a little, making more playstyles avalibale to every player, no matter the content they do. I would like also for ZoS to go as far as creating an icon/descripton of each ability class, so it would be easier for new players to understand what their ability scales with, and what resourse they should build for skillset that they want to use.

As for stam versus mag, I would like for ZoS to either finish with weapon/spell damage nonsense we have, like jewelry weapon/spell damage enchants giving both, only difference is 10 regen to mag or stam (why?). Iw would be more interesting if we instead had a enchants for a damage types, like increase weapon ad spell damage of lightning abilities by X, or poison abilities by X, etc. As we already have an elements type essense runes to craft theese enchants, we would only need potency runes that turn them into jewelry damage glyph. And its also opens a room for multi damage glyphs, that cower broader spectre of elements, but for lower amount, as well as for bleed essence rune. Minor sorcery, brutality, savagery, prophecy isnt hybridised too. Potions still providing either brutality or sorcery. I would like to see redundancy removed and other uniqe effects added in its place.
OR I want them to deconstruct this changes to damage buffs, fall back, and implement different scaling from mag and stam, weapon/spell damage once again. We are in a quite different game now, a lot of classes now have offensive/defensive stamina skills, so shouldnt be so problematic as it was back then, when classes had 1-2 stamina skills at best. Its just that in between state that causes frustration, and a desire to finally see the change no matter what direction it takes.
I believe it can work either way.

MincMincMinc

StaticWave wrote: »

Or a stamsorc using SPELL crit potions because the class has Minor Prophecy.

but, but, but, that would buff sorcs, and we cant have that.


In all reality it seems like zos is setting up for a massive stat overhaul once all other systems are touched. I dont see why they wouldnt just turn weapon and spell damage into just damage. same goes for pen and crit. Could even do it for resists and readjust the cases like light armor spell resist to just % spell mit.

MashmalloMan

@necro_the_crafter @MincMincMinc .. I'm just replying to both at the same time.

My point was, they're not backtracking to pre-hybridization, the game is better off whether a few people on the forums disagree or not. They're moving forward. I agree on adding some unique skills like DK and Arcanist have to more skills, but I also don't want it everywhere. Not every class or skill line needs them, but some skills could definitely use it like some of the ones I listed. So many new morphs could be made instead of redundant choices.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/596681/update-33-combat-preview/p1

This best describes their design philosophy for when they hybridized skills, but sets and CP 2.0 were ongoing so it has been about 3 years now. Of note, Gilliam mentions that stats and named buffs for weapon/spell damage and weapon/spell critical chance will eventually be combined like they did for Armor and Offensive Penetration.

If I were to guess how it would look:

Power = Weapon/Spell Damage... This way the stat stands out from "Damage Done" since a combined "Damage" would look a bit too similar.

• Remove Sorcery, keep Brutality. Same way they removed Ward, but kept Resolve.

Critical Chance = Weapon/Spell Critical Chance... or if they're feeling redundant again lol... "Offensive Critical Chance"... but I guess that implies it doesn't work for healing, so maybe not. I find that wording silly either way.

• Remove Prophecy, keep Savagery. Same way they removed Facture, but kept Breach.

Once this happens, they need to make new minor class buffs because it defeats the purpose if 2 are exactly the same. I'd argue we're already at that point, but they seem to think that it's okay the way it is while we wait as they purposely didn't hybridize them when they did it for other sources.

I'm not going to find the comments, but when the enchants were changed to add 10 mag or stam recovery, it was basically done as a bandaid because they hybridized them due to a patch or 2 where all DK's ran weapon damage and all Templars ran spell damage regardless of your build type. Based on your pve comps, you had to switch your enchants to use DK's or Templars minor buff. I think they wanted to handle it later with the stat combination, but they were forced to change it early because it was causing problems. I doubt the 10 recovery thing will stay once they finish hybridization, but who knows, maybe they've come to love it, I'd prefer them to make a new enchant like penetration, crit chance, or damage done.

MincMincMinc

@MashmalloMan

I agree, many will want to live in the past. For the most part they are standardizing in a good direction.

Although there are various aspects where they made horrendous choices.

• Elsweyr weapon reworks. Basically deleted the dizzy swing and s&b playstyles
• Summerset character mobility >> see my previous thread
• Combat clarity .... easy sum up is why are detrimental counterplay mechanics hidden with no telegraph, but dumb pointless abilities shoot massive tentacles the size of seige equipment. What is more important to see?
• Mechanic clarity..... WTF does offbalance do? Status effects? Why do I have to go to a 3rd party improperly informed website that isnt updated to try and understand what they do. Nobody has been able to explain to me how offbalance was healthier to the game than the old dizzy swing. I could rant for pages on how this was a huge step in the wrong direction.

I do wish the stat combining could be done sooner. I imagine they need to standardize a lot of systems first. Food, armor glyphs, mundus, etc.

The WD enchants giving extra recovery was in the wrong direction. There is far too much recovery in the game right now.

I dont get the PVE players who call for class diversity through minor buffs. The main reason we dont have a greater diversity was due to PVE people wanting all dots and hots to stack. Why run unique dots or hots, when everyone in the raid can just run the most efficient one? The power of hybridization would be to bring this back and instead of needing mag and stam morphs, you can have two unique mag morphs or two unique stam morphs.

SoloPlayerZP

StaticWave wrote: »

Or a stamsorc using SPELL crit potions because the class has Minor Prophecy.

But this still is less efficient because you probably have high stamina regen on stam sorc and you don’t get the 30 percent regen buff on it. Instead you get the 30 percent on your way lower mag recovery which adds way less total recovery that way.

StaticWave

SoloPlayerZP wrote: »

StaticWave wrote: »

Or a stamsorc using SPELL crit potions because the class has Minor Prophecy.

But this still is less efficient because you probably have high stamina regen on stam sorc and you don’t get the 30 percent regen buff on it. Instead you get the 30 percent on your way lower mag recovery which adds way less total recovery that way.

Yes. Not only do I not get the 30% stam recovery, but i’m also not getting the 8k stam every 45s. But if I were to choose between sustain or 12% more crit rate, I’d choost the crit rate everytime. Sustain is easy to find, but 12% crit rate is not.

notyuu

MincMincMinc wrote: »

@MashmalloMan

[*] Mechanic clarity..... WTF does offbalance do? Status effects? Why do I have to go to a 3rd party improperly informed website that isnt updated to try and understand what they do. Nobody has been able to explain to me how offbalance was healthier to the game than the old dizzy swing. I could rant for pages on how this was a huge step in the wrong direction.

Simple, you don't know to press F1 when you're in the game, the in game compendium/help menu is quite extensive you know.




but slight snark aside, zos REALLY should advertise this function more...

MashmalloMan

notyuu wrote: »

MincMincMinc wrote: »

@MashmalloMan

[*] Mechanic clarity..... WTF does offbalance do? Status effects? Why do I have to go to a 3rd party improperly informed website that isnt updated to try and understand what they do. Nobody has been able to explain to me how offbalance was healthier to the game than the old dizzy swing. I could rant for pages on how this was a huge step in the wrong direction.

Simple, you don't know to press F1 when you're in the game, the in game compendium/help menu is quite extensive you know.



but slight snark aside, zos REALLY should advertise this function more...

I think the point they were making was that the game's important information isn't intuitive and readily available for the player, the F1 menu is just an excuse to avoid striving for better UI design. Most games don't need a help menu to explain every little nuance. I mean this is an MMORPG so I get it being useful, but it shouldn't be a crutch.

Also. Very funny that the description for off balance in that menu is unnecessarily long and also too vague. It lasts for a "duration" and can't be applied again for a "duration"... It's 7 seconds up, 15s down, 22s total. Is that so hard? How much extra damage for heavy attacks? How much extra resources? Why is this not pertinent information for a help menu form the creators themselves. Even in your attempt to prove it can be done in game, it actually can't lol.

Same thing with status effects in the F1 menu, they're all vague, don't illustrate how their damage scales or compares to each other. How difficult would it be to put in variables like tooltips that would show the exact damage they do based on your current stats. I mean I know this information because I've done the tests, but that information should be available to every player at a glance, no help menu or math required. I certainly don't enjoy doing all this on the side if the game could do it for me.

As an example, Diablo 4 actually has pretty decent tooltips that show all damage as a % in addition to the actual damage they deal, with tags and descriptions for named highlighted effects. A % wouldn't work as seamlessly for ESO right now because it uses max resource and damage for scaling, but it's just really refreshing and easy to understand vs this game. I shouldn't have to make a brand new toon with 0 passives, cp, and gear, but also cp 160, in order to compare damage sources. Luckily websites do this work for us or it would be impossibly difficult to compare everything.

Critical Chance... 219 = 1%. Why does the player need to know an arbitrary number they need to break out a calculator for. Crit Resist, Armor, Penetration, similar thing.

Is this source direct or dot? Is this source aoe or st? What is this sources status effect chance?

I don't really care if ZOS claims it's a coding limitation based on a 15 year old engine, there is workarounds to these things, it's most definitely an excuse, anything and everything is possible if they cared enough to dedicate some of their budget towards it. People said hybridization, spell crafting, and new classes weren't possible because of PS4/XBOX ONE, yet here we are.

All of the additional information could be added to the tooltips when you hover your mouse over the highlighted text, they could even simplify the current ones by removing minor/major buff/debuff explanations by hiding them behind the new highlight/expand feature.

necro_the_crafter

Hybridisation is itfelf questionable, and we as a player dont have any clear devs vision for it.

Right now its going on a path to combine all of damage scaling towards higher number, which is a good thing, becuase pre-hybridisation players use to chase one stat pool (mag or stam/wpn or spell), and now they dont have to worry about that.

But as a leftovers we have such a huge systems like alchemy and enchanting that are still arent fully hybrid. And while enchanting recived an update that combined wpn+spell damage, alchemy is so much more complex where every ingridient was created to combine into supporting either stam sustain + weapon damage/crit or mag sustain + spell dmg/crit. And in order to fix that they would have to come up with new effects, or maybe inroduce new stats into the game.

And for hybrid stats, I came up with a idea, what if we had more offensive stats, that would be much more narrow and specific like:

Thauamaturgy - increases DoT damage (replaces savagery or prophesy, wichever they remove);
Precision - increases Direct damage (replaces sorcery or brutality, wichever they remove);

The way i would like them implemented - that would be a stat, that would scale with your damage number. And then certain wepons or armor can interact with a scaling.

Like, lets say 1 of precision and 6000 damage is a 1% direct damage increse.
Then having same 1 with 3000 damage would be a 0.5% increase, if scaling is linear.
But in order for it to be balanced it have to scale up to a point, or basicly have a soft cap of, lets say 8000 damage, after which scaling should see a diminishing returns, and a hard cap lets say on 10000 damage after which any additional damage dosent interract with it.
And about weapons, lets say lightning staff could increase precision scaling by 20%, and returning to our first example:
1 precision and 6000 damage is now 1.2% increase of a direct damage.

Maybe it would introduce much more power creep, but if they would implement such systems cautiosly, and adjust damage itself beforehand, this would be a solution to hybridising alchemy, as well as new ways to build your charatcer (which is most fun in roleplay game for a lot of people) to fit for yours desired playstyle.

MincMincMinc

notyuu wrote: »

MincMincMinc wrote: »

@MashmalloMan

[*] Mechanic clarity..... WTF does offbalance do? Status effects? Why do I have to go to a 3rd party improperly informed website that isnt updated to try and understand what they do. Nobody has been able to explain to me how offbalance was healthier to the game than the old dizzy swing. I could rant for pages on how this was a huge step in the wrong direction.

Simple, you don't know to press F1 when you're in the game, the in game compendium/help menu is quite extensive you know.

but slight snark aside, zos REALLY should advertise this function more...

I honestly never used the F1 menu. Also can we all agree that the description there is not the best, offbalance there is vague and not really helpful in any substantial way.

• How long does it last?
• How much bonus damage? (pretty sure they removed this, or removed it for pvp?)
• How many resources return?
• How long is the cooldown?

My main point was just that they went from old dizzy to new and confusing dizzy.

• OLD: Long cast time + clear animation which spans 5+ average human reaction times, simple intuitive counterplay, rewarding upon success.
• NEW: Random debuff applied based on an invisible cooldown. Offbalance debuff animation is basically invisible in today's visuals. Unkown offbalance values as listed above. Impossible counterplay: Example being that medium attacks (animation canceled) will trigger the stun which can come from any enemy nearby. On top of the unclear gameplay, having a stun not linked to the GCD system allows guaranteed ultimate drops.
  
  IDK one seems clear with intuitive play/counterplay, the other doesn't.

December7854

necro_the_crafter wrote: »

I would like to see sustain become fully hybrid, while damage kept separate.

Would be nice if they just implemented different classifications with its own scalers to abilities, for example:

1. Spell - mag costing ability. Scales from spell damage and max magika. Would favour mag oriented builds
2. Skill - stam costing ability. Scales from weapon damage and max stamina. Would favour stam oriented builds
3. Universal - cost highest resourse. Scales from highest damage and max resourse. Mostly utility spells and heals.
4. Alternate - cost lowest resourse. Scales from highest damage and max resourse. Mostly utility spells and heals.
5. Apex - cost both resourse. Scales from average of both damage values and both resourses. Will be good no matter what path you choose, good for class signature abilities like Whip, Assassins Will, Deep Fissure, Blastbones, Hauntuing Curse, Puncturing Sweep, Pragmatic Fatecarver.


This, instead of previous system that had 2 specs per class, and contruary to cuurent system that has 1 bis meta setup would put all the builds on a spectrum, allowing a vast varieties of builds, and PvE and PvP group compositions.

Sorry if this post is old but I kinda wish they would do more with #3 but with alternating damage types as well. Most classes have some unique damage type (fire/poison for dk, shock/physical for Sorc, etc) but the morph choices for skills could broaden if your damage and damage type scaled with max stat.