Concerns About Tel Var Currency and Flower Satchels in the Imperial City

XSTRONG

fred4 wrote: »

XSTRONG wrote: »

14k telwar for killing one boss, if you control IC you can easily get 200k telwar within 1 hour.

XperiencedTBAG wrote: »

Regarding Tel Var farming rates, it's indeed challenging on busy servers, but with the right strategies and during certain times, it's possible to reach those high numbers, even if it's not common.

Bosses spawn every 15 minutes. Within one hour, you have 6 x 4 = 24 bosses available. I believe the exact drop size is 13.7K, but let's round it to up to 14K. 24 x 14 = 336K Tel Var. The following is what achieving that number would entail:

• Your faction owns IC throughout the period.
• You're alone farming bosses.
• You spend 2.5 minutes per boss.

The fastest I've seen someone solo a boss was around 90 seconds. You then need time to get to the next one. In the case of Noble's, you'll have to search for it. You'll be in a full PvE setup, or something close to it. A typical soloing time for me, in a PvP setup, is 5 minutes, not 90 seconds.

You've either benefitted from an IC so empty that you've been able to do the above, or you made a rough calculation about something you don't actually do in order to support your argument.

In the first case, there was no opposition, no cartel, and you benefitted from an empty server. You took a huge risk by carrying that much Tel Var without banking. Banking would have taken time. You got lucky no one else flipped flags, nor did they steal a boss from you on the opposite side of the map, nor did they gank you.

In the second case you forgot to factor in the practical matters. Tel Var are shared between players partaking in a kill. You can take out 336K Tel Var via boss farming per instance of IC, not per player working there. If your faction owns the city and you have time to do bosses as they spawn, time to bank, and time to keep holding the city, there's more than one of you. The share for individual players gets cut to a fraction as a result.

In practice, I agree up to ~100K Tel Var per hour can happen, but it's completely unpredictable. It means you live in IC and were lucky to be there at the right time.

I can't speak to the statistics for PS EU. It sounds to me like it's simply deserted.

First of all I never said I farm 200k tel war in 1 hour, im just saying its possible.

14000 or 13700 per boss
If you are a dedicated tel war farmer you can kill the boss in 2-3 mins solo.

6 bosses x 3 mins = 18 min "boss kill time" + 1 min run time " finding next boss are easy and not time consuming in a loop = 84k telwar within 24 mins

And when those 6 bosses are killed "24 mins" rince repeat boss 1 have spawned again.

Of course you own all flags and have x4 multiplier if you own IC.

.

LaintalAy

fred4 wrote: »

I am an IC player on PC EU. There's a bunch of stuff here that I find hard to believe. I know you're talking about console, but there is no cartel on PC EU that I'm aware of. Maybe that's a function of the game dying on console, and thus few players are around? I see no evidence you get the same with a healthy population. It's also not possible to farm 200K to 400K an hour on PC EU. That might have been almost possible many years ago, before IC became it's own campaign. However, ever since it did, the place is always busy. Not everywhere, but as far as boss farming goes, yes it is, even throughout the night. There's a bunch of competition. Tel Var are split between players participating in a kill. Tel Var gain fluctuates wildly, but I'd say 20K to 40K per hour is more realistic than 200K to 400K. Faction ownership also varies. It's not like any one faction has an iron grip on IC.

The place merely isn't for the faint-hearted. You want to get to know it well, you want to enjoy all aspects of it, you want to know what you're doing, but you also have to go with the the flow. Sometimes that means PvP, sometimes Tel Var farming. There are times where a faction completely dominates and the zerg train does the boss rounds, but I often find I can make the most Tel Var by going against the flow. You don't need to be the member of a cartel. In fact, you want to be an individual to take the most Tel Var out IMO, e.g. so you don't share kill rewards. You want to be a solo nightblade. I don't particularly mean ganking. While that's a possibility, nightblade also helps to survey the place, figure out boss spawns, squirrel away bosses, solo them, then disappear as soon as they're dead. The opportunist player, NB or not, who starts solo farming bosses when their faction almost owns the city, but others are still busy fighting over the last flag, those are the ones who make the most Tel Var. No cartel can stop you from doing that. In fact, if they do the PvP, they're doing you a favor, and if bosses are overfarmed, you can still do well killing mobs while your faction owns the city. You just need to be flexible and have the right (gank-proof) build. That said, if you're serious about approaching IC this way, it helps to have a nightblade in every faction.

I do agree that Apothecary Parcels have an impact on alchmey prices. When they were introduced years ago, Columbine prices fell. This, however, works both ways. The efficacy of harvesting is reduced, if you intend to sell that stuff. On the other hand prices in guild stores are cheaper. You have greater buying power. This basically seems a wash to me. I've never had an issue making gold for basic supplies and I don't exclusively do it via Tel Var. It also comes from daily writs, surveys, motif sales, and so on. Knowledge of market trends helps, but there are evergreen items other than reagents. For example Dreugh Wax is a useless substance in my book (personal opinion), which makes for a great income source.

As for new players, I don't buy this is an issue. You don't need to make custom potions for overland. Figuring out your gold-making niche - if that's what you need / want - is more of a long term thing, e.g. if you stay in the game long enough you grow beyond questing. But also the market always shifts. It's par for the course. Alchemy prices have varied drastically over the years, especially when you look at individual reagents. Ways of making gold have varied. IC is the PvPers way of doing it, but on PC EU that's merely competitive with other methods, which have included Infinite Archive, Elsweyr dragon farming, and so on, mostly whatever the hot new thing is. That said, the overall market on PC EU, and PC NA I believe, has fallen recently. This has been reflected in the value of Tel Var too. They're worth less now, as is Dreugh Wax, as is Perfect Roe, and so on. I see nothing much wrong here. In fact, I see a lot right with Alchemy Parcels being available from a PvP activity, because potions and poisons, and a variety of them, are arguably as essential to PvP, if not more so, than they are to PvE.

but there is no cartel on PC EU that I'm aware of

There were several last time I logged in:
One that monopolises Windhelm. They were previously in Clockwork City. There are another 3-4 that have an outlet in Vivec; with supplementary outlets in Mournhold and/or Grahtwood. They used to include a spot in Belkarth, but that was before the dungeon/trial finder inception.

They boast in their MOTD that they are part of the 'whatever alliance'. From what I can tell, they all make multiple bids on multiple traders across these major locations and pool their respective funds to ensure that they mostly retain a presence in these major locations.

I doubt highly that these folk will be buying reagents (flowers) with TelVar. If they are aggressively farming Tel var, there must be something more profitable that they can buy and resell? Hakeijo?

I don't have any experience in spending Tel Var, so I don't know hat can be bought.

LPapirius

One think for sure, it's way past time ZOS put some new stuff in the tel var store for us to spend our tel var on.

GuuMoonRyoung

LaintalAy wrote: »

fred4 wrote: »

I am an IC player on PC EU. There's a bunch of stuff here that I find hard to believe. I know you're talking about console, but there is no cartel on PC EU that I'm aware of. Maybe that's a function of the game dying on console, and thus few players are around? I see no evidence you get the same with a healthy population. It's also not possible to farm 200K to 400K an hour on PC EU. That might have been almost possible many years ago, before IC became it's own campaign. However, ever since it did, the place is always busy. Not everywhere, but as far as boss farming goes, yes it is, even throughout the night. There's a bunch of competition. Tel Var are split between players participating in a kill. Tel Var gain fluctuates wildly, but I'd say 20K to 40K per hour is more realistic than 200K to 400K. Faction ownership also varies. It's not like any one faction has an iron grip on IC.

The place merely isn't for the faint-hearted. You want to get to know it well, you want to enjoy all aspects of it, you want to know what you're doing, but you also have to go with the the flow. Sometimes that means PvP, sometimes Tel Var farming. There are times where a faction completely dominates and the zerg train does the boss rounds, but I often find I can make the most Tel Var by going against the flow. You don't need to be the member of a cartel. In fact, you want to be an individual to take the most Tel Var out IMO, e.g. so you don't share kill rewards. You want to be a solo nightblade. I don't particularly mean ganking. While that's a possibility, nightblade also helps to survey the place, figure out boss spawns, squirrel away bosses, solo them, then disappear as soon as they're dead. The opportunist player, NB or not, who starts solo farming bosses when their faction almost owns the city, but others are still busy fighting over the last flag, those are the ones who make the most Tel Var. No cartel can stop you from doing that. In fact, if they do the PvP, they're doing you a favor, and if bosses are overfarmed, you can still do well killing mobs while your faction owns the city. You just need to be flexible and have the right (gank-proof) build. That said, if you're serious about approaching IC this way, it helps to have a nightblade in every faction.

I do agree that Apothecary Parcels have an impact on alchmey prices. When they were introduced years ago, Columbine prices fell. This, however, works both ways. The efficacy of harvesting is reduced, if you intend to sell that stuff. On the other hand prices in guild stores are cheaper. You have greater buying power. This basically seems a wash to me. I've never had an issue making gold for basic supplies and I don't exclusively do it via Tel Var. It also comes from daily writs, surveys, motif sales, and so on. Knowledge of market trends helps, but there are evergreen items other than reagents. For example Dreugh Wax is a useless substance in my book (personal opinion), which makes for a great income source.

As for new players, I don't buy this is an issue. You don't need to make custom potions for overland. Figuring out your gold-making niche - if that's what you need / want - is more of a long term thing, e.g. if you stay in the game long enough you grow beyond questing. But also the market always shifts. It's par for the course. Alchemy prices have varied drastically over the years, especially when you look at individual reagents. Ways of making gold have varied. IC is the PvPers way of doing it, but on PC EU that's merely competitive with other methods, which have included Infinite Archive, Elsweyr dragon farming, and so on, mostly whatever the hot new thing is. That said, the overall market on PC EU, and PC NA I believe, has fallen recently. This has been reflected in the value of Tel Var too. They're worth less now, as is Dreugh Wax, as is Perfect Roe, and so on. I see nothing much wrong here. In fact, I see a lot right with Alchemy Parcels being available from a PvP activity, because potions and poisons, and a variety of them, are arguably as essential to PvP, if not more so, than they are to PvE.

but there is no cartel on PC EU that I'm aware of

There were several last time I logged in:
One that monopolises Windhelm. They were previously in Clockwork City. There are another 3-4 that have an outlet in Vivec; with supplementary outlets in Mournhold and/or Grahtwood. They used to include a spot in Belkarth, but that was before the dungeon/trial finder inception.

They boast in their MOTD that they are part of the 'whatever alliance'. From what I can tell, they all make multiple bids on multiple traders across these major locations and pool their respective funds to ensure that they mostly retain a presence in these major locations.

I doubt highly that these folk will be buying reagents (flowers) with TelVar. If they are aggressively farming Tel var, there must be something more profitable that they can buy and resell? Hakeijo?

I don't have any experience in spending Tel Var, so I don't know hat can be bought.

Dude... you completely missed the topic. They are not talking about large trading guilds, they are talking about tel var farming groups that monopolize the entire server. They don't let anybody pvp in IC, or farm anything in IC, they threaten people, harass people constantly, that is what the topic is about, not large trading guilds.

EdjeSwift

Going through this whole thread this morning, there isn't a system issue here, the apothecary satchels are fine, the problem is the players and that's where you can ask ZoS to step in.

There is nothing wrong with players playing the game and using things to their advantage, this is going to happen, players are selling their services for running people through trials and getting them titles, skins, and so on. If players want to farm Tel Var to their hearts content they are free to do so, they are also free to spend that Tel Var how they want do what they want with the benefits. There is absolutely nothing wrong with any of this.

What is wrong, if true, is the harassment. If you feel targeted by harassment, report them. Simple as that. People are always going to find ways to use current game systems to their advantage and as long as they follow the rules everything is fine even if you don't like how they do it, they're using the tools allotted to play the game. The second they step out of the rules and do things like targeted harassment then you can ask for help, but asking for large systemic change across 3 platforms because you don't like what's happening in your game takes it too far.

Jaraal

Personofsecrets wrote: »

The idea that there is a monopoly has been given, but one has to think that projecting such economics onto a PvP zone is appropriate for that idea to start to work. It's also the case that anyone can start a group and go into the Imperial City. Maybe that seems preposterous or too hard, but I've watched players start the game and do exceptional things within a very short amount of time. It just takes the right mind and determination to create a group that goes in and challenges the monopoly.

And that's the whole solution in a nutshell. Tired of 'cartels' keeping you from farming TV for flower sacks? Gather your own group and start making it more difficult for them. Or go into the sewers where they aren't present. I can tell you from experience that you will make just as much telvar nonstop destroying trash packs per minute as you will trying to solo bosses.

Those are the choices. Either beat the 'cartels' at their own game, go where they are not, or sit on one's hands and do nothing.

XSTRONG

One serious question, On PC where do Potion/Flower sellers get their Flowers?

Thread after thread talking about the expensive potions but no one ever say where the flowers come from.

I would say close to every flower/potion sold in this game is from Tel War.

See a problem?

Now take that problem and say a handful of players control the whole market on a certain server thats a big problem in my opinion.

Yeah there are casual that got a stack from farming but seriously how many farm Flowers to feed a whole server with potions? Give me their number.

Jaraal

XSTRONG wrote: »

One serious question, On PC where do Potion/Flower sellers get their Flowers?

I've never bought a flower sack in all my time playing ESO. But I make all my own tri-pots (use a stack a day in PvP), food, and poisons... and they all use columbine. And even after that, I still have thousands of columbines left over I could sell if I wanted to. And where do I get all these flowers? From alchemy surveys.

And here's a tip: If you get to an alchemy survey and there's less than two columbine spawns, then run or port away and go back until there is. Sometimes you'll get three, and rarely four. I've never seen five at once, but it's possible.

XSTRONG

Jaraal wrote: »

XSTRONG wrote: »

One serious question, On PC where do Potion/Flower sellers get their Flowers?

I've never bought a flower sack in all my time playing ESO. But I make all my own tri-pots (use a stack a day in PvP), food, and poisons... and they all use columbine. And even after that, I still have thousands of columbines left over I could sell if I wanted to. And where do I get all these flowers? From alchemy surveys.

And here's a tip: If you get to an alchemy survey and there's less than two columbine spawns, then run or port away and go back until there is. Sometimes you'll get three, and rarely four. I've never seen five at once, but it's possible.

I know that old alchemy survey trick but thanks anyway.

Jaraal

XSTRONG wrote: »

Jaraal wrote: »

XSTRONG wrote: »

One serious question, On PC where do Potion/Flower sellers get their Flowers?

I've never bought a flower sack in all my time playing ESO. But I make all my own tri-pots (use a stack a day in PvP), food, and poisons... and they all use columbine. And even after that, I still have thousands of columbines left over I could sell if I wanted to. And where do I get all these flowers? From alchemy surveys.

And here's a tip: If you get to an alchemy survey and there's less than two columbine spawns, then run or port away and go back until there is. Sometimes you'll get three, and rarely four. I've never seen five at once, but it's possible.

I know that old alchemy survey trick but thanks anyway.

So you already knew the answer, but asked the question anyway?

I see.

XSTRONG

Jaraal wrote: »

XSTRONG wrote: »

Jaraal wrote: »

XSTRONG wrote: »

One serious question, On PC where do Potion/Flower sellers get their Flowers?

I've never bought a flower sack in all my time playing ESO. But I make all my own tri-pots (use a stack a day in PvP), food, and poisons... and they all use columbine. And even after that, I still have thousands of columbines left over I could sell if I wanted to. And where do I get all these flowers? From alchemy surveys.

And here's a tip: If you get to an alchemy survey and there's less than two columbine spawns, then run or port away and go back until there is. Sometimes you'll get three, and rarely four. I've never seen five at once, but it's possible.

I know that old alchemy survey trick but thanks anyway.

So you already knew the answer, but asked the question anyway?

I see.

I know running back and forth to a survey changes your survey outcome yes but I dont think that answer any questions.

Jaraal

XSTRONG wrote: »

Jaraal wrote: »

XSTRONG wrote: »

Jaraal wrote: »

XSTRONG wrote: »

One serious question, On PC where do Potion/Flower sellers get their Flowers?

I've never bought a flower sack in all my time playing ESO. But I make all my own tri-pots (use a stack a day in PvP), food, and poisons... and they all use columbine. And even after that, I still have thousands of columbines left over I could sell if I wanted to. And where do I get all these flowers? From alchemy surveys.

And here's a tip: If you get to an alchemy survey and there's less than two columbine spawns, then run or port away and go back until there is. Sometimes you'll get three, and rarely four. I've never seen five at once, but it's possible.

I know that old alchemy survey trick but thanks anyway.

So you already knew the answer, but asked the question anyway?

I see.

I know running back and forth to a survey changes your survey outcome yes but I dont think that answer any questions.

Sorry, I thought you asked "One serious question, On PC where do Potion/Flower sellers get their Flowers?"

And I can tell you that you'll get more flowers to sell by getting surveys on multiple characters than you will by farming tel var and buying sacks.

EdjeSwift

XSTRONG wrote: »

I know running back and forth to a survey changes your survey outcome yes but I dont think that answer any questions.

It answered part of the question, you asked "On PC where do Potion/Flower sellers get their Flowers?"

Surveys was an answer. PC and PS4 are wholly different beasts when it comes to trading, economy and the such. Your "I would say close to every flower/potion sold in this game is from Tel War." comment couldn't be farther from the truth on PC. We can do all our crafting writs in less than a minute per character, farming is super easy due to how we play the game and knowing how/where to get our herbs.

We've had tens of pages long forum discussions on columbine and the fact that people are out there farming it in in the wild and flipping them on the traders. Bot accusations, starter zone farmers, it's all there, you know what's almost never been brought up? Tel Var abuse, that's because it's not a thing, you've got better RoI on PC doing farming the old fashioned way than Tel Var farming and flipping.

XSTRONG

I stay strong in my opinion, almost every flower and potion in this game are from Tel War.

And i know im not wrong.

XSTRONG

Jaraal wrote: »

XSTRONG wrote: »

Jaraal wrote: »

XSTRONG wrote: »

Jaraal wrote: »

XSTRONG wrote: »

One serious question, On PC where do Potion/Flower sellers get their Flowers?

I've never bought a flower sack in all my time playing ESO. But I make all my own tri-pots (use a stack a day in PvP), food, and poisons... and they all use columbine. And even after that, I still have thousands of columbines left over I could sell if I wanted to. And where do I get all these flowers? From alchemy surveys.

And here's a tip: If you get to an alchemy survey and there's less than two columbine spawns, then run or port away and go back until there is. Sometimes you'll get three, and rarely four. I've never seen five at once, but it's possible.

I know that old alchemy survey trick but thanks anyway.

So you already knew the answer, but asked the question anyway?

I see.

I know running back and forth to a survey changes your survey outcome yes but I dont think that answer any questions.

Sorry, I thought you asked "One serious question, On PC where do Potion/Flower sellers get their Flowers?"

And I can tell you that you'll get more flowers to sell by getting surveys on multiple characters than you will by farming tel var and buying sacks.

So youre saying the true reason behind the outrages prices for potions on PC are crafters doing their daily writs?

If someone comes here saying they have 1k columbine dosent say me anything, ok you have 1k columbine thats not on the market whats the problem?

Put those 1k Columbine on market and they will be sold in a day, do you have 1k Columbine the next day?

Personofsecrets

For a while, I traded in flowers. It's pretty easy to buy them and then sell the crafted units for profit. Of course, that doesn't say where the flowers originally came from.

Maybe around 2020 or 2021, it was right before IC started becoming really popular, I began learning the Tel-Var circuit. I've probably spent a couple of million on Tel-Var stones on flowers alone and still have thousands of flowers despite not doing much farming since then. Eventually, I became harassed out of IC by a player who would play on multiple accounts at the same time to undo my progress flipping districts. They also told me that they would go after me and did a number of harassing things. That is where my position of "do better enforcement of already existing rules" comes in. And support did fail there.

Still though, it only took a few of myself and a few friends to wipe them up, but I didn't feel like making such a group all of the time. It could have been very well within reason to create an opposing group with enough interest.

Of course, I still do gather materials, do surveys, and participate in events. The satchels though are by far the best source of flowers that have lasted me a long while. I've even sold of portions of the horde from time to time and still have plenty left over. And that's all with VERY Columbine hungry builds that use Tri-Pots or like Immovability. I'm sort of shocked to see how bad the archival fortune rate for flowers is. I think that one is supposed to purchase Provisioning ingredients for the best returns though.

wolfie1.0.

XperiencedTBAG wrote: »

wolfie1.0. wrote: »

XperiencedTBAG wrote: »

opalcity wrote: »

How do you know that people who are farming tel var are buying flower satchels?

None of this sounds factual.

I can’t get into it but I know. I don’t have any clue about other servers. But this is happening on PlayStation EU server.

you know that the best way to stop these people from these farms is to find them in IC and kill them right?

steal half their Tel Var from them and you cut production in half.

Sure, that’s a nice theory. But when these players control the entire Imperial City, they often roll in groups, making it nearly impossible for solo players or smaller groups to take them down. If you enter their territory, you’ll get harassed. It’s not as simple as just hunting them—you’re suggesting something like cutting mold off bread and expecting it to be edible. The problem runs deeper, and until significant changes are made, this unfair dominance will continue.

I feel my point still stands. Even the beat ball groups can be overrun. So do so. Or create a similar group of the same faction and decrease farming size

As for harassment claims, if you feel you are being harassed then that's a matter for a support ticket providing you have evidence to support.

wolfie1.0.

XperiencedTBAG wrote: »

Blood_again wrote: »

XperiencedTBAG wrote: »

The individuals controlling the area are doing so to protect a lucrative business involving real-life money.

If you have proof about real-money operations, just report it.
Seller accounts would be banned, you horrible problem is solved.

XperiencedTBAG wrote: »

These individuals use the gold to influence traders in Mournhold, leveraging their widespread guild presence to dominate the flower market. They employ aggressive tactics, including kicking out and bullying anyone who does not adhere to their rules, thereby maintaining their upper hand and control over the market.

What is this about?! Just to dramatize your IC problem?
If somebody bully you - you report them and blacklist them.
Kicking out may be from their guild. Don't be in a guild with toxic people. As I see, you have your own guild: hire your trader and trade. What's a problem? Who can control you here?

I see you try to picture your opponents as some kind of criminal syndicate. It looks silly.
If they break the rules - you report them, they are banned.
If they don't break the rules, you may compete in game.
Make it simple.

The main pain problem in your posts is about IC, I see. You're a guildmaster. What's a problem to create a PvP wing in your guild if you want to farm IC so much?
You're trying to change the in-game vendors instead, because of IC farm... sounds very strange.

Well, if it were as easy as you say, everything would be perfect. If you read my post, you’d see the specific issues I mentioned. I don’t have any problem with people farming. They can do what they want, as long as they respect the game’s terms of service.

If they break the YOS and you have proof report it.

Amottica

XperiencedTBAG wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

XSTRONG wrote: »

Im on PSeu and I can confirm there is a Telwar cartel on this server that owns IC

What information is available to confirm this? It would require a small number of players who are able to pawn the server at will or that no one else is interested in going into IC ever.

Confirming this issue is simple. Just visit the Imperial City on the PlayStation EU server. You'll see a small group of players dominating the area, making it nearly impossible for others to farm effectively. It's not about a lack of interest; it's about a few players controlling the zone and resources. Check the Guild traders for further evidence of this monopoly.

This does not confirm anything. It merely suggests that there is a small group of players who are so superior that no other group on the server can ever defeat them. While it would be a sad commentary on the rest of that server's player base, there is nothing in the statement actually to prove it to be the case.

Not to mention that it does not confirm anything to suggest someone else needs to do the confirming.

CameraBeardThePirate

XperiencedTBAG wrote: »

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

Uh, no thanks. Apothecary Satchels are the best way for PvPers to get their mats for crafting potions. If you don't like the fact that some people are farming Tel Var effectively, get a group of players together that can mop the floor with them. They'll go away.

So why can't we buy flowers with Alliance Points then? This isn't about liking or disliking the fact that some people are farming Tel Var effectively. It's about addressing the imbalance and making the game fairer for everyone. Buying flowers with Alliance Points would provide an alternative method for players to obtain the necessary materials for crafting potions without having to deal with the current monopolistic behavior in the Imperial City. Let's find a solution that works for all players, not just those who dominate Tel Var farming.

"Monopolistic Behavior" just sounds like you can't kill their group. Get some players together to wipe them. I promise you they will leave. Players that are specced for farming TelVar will not be optimized for PvP.

Jaraal

XSTRONG wrote: »

If someone comes here saying they have 1k columbine dosent say me anything, ok you have 1k columbine thats not on the market whats the problem?

Put those 1k Columbine on market and they will be sold in a day, do you have 1k Columbine the next day?

The drop rate for columbine from the apothecary parcels is around 1,000 for every 285,000 - 300,000 tel var spent. Now I guarantee you that I can go out and harvest 1,000 columbine by myself from nodes and surveys before a player can earn 300k tel var solo from farming bosses.... at least on PC where addons make everything a lot simpler. And yes, OP is complaining about tel var cartels, but what's to stop someone from making an overworld harvesting cartel... oh, wait. That's exactly what the bot farmers do. So it must be just as profitable, eh?

And yes, I would totally support being able to buy apothecary satchels with AP. Unfortunately ZOS has decided that the best stuff (including tradable polymorphs, costumes, Hakeijos, flowers, and whatnot) are all tel var only, while most AP loot is bind on pickup.

freespirit

I have never brought the Apothecary Sacks my Tel Var goes on Hakeijo.

I do however sell 100's of Columbine most weeks, for years I've collected surveys and been to lazy to do them, now I do a few every week!

It literally is the easiest source of flowers in the game and with plentiful harvest slotted, high numbers of them too.

Jaraal

freespirit wrote: »

It literally is the easiest source of flowers in the game and with plentiful harvest slotted, high numbers of them too.

Yes, getting 200 columbine from one survey is not unheard of. And I have one character who collects all the non-alchemy surveys, as I never reset those. A different character does all the alchemy surveys when I have a lot of free time to maximize the spawns.

kargen27

XperiencedTBAG wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

XperiencedTBAG wrote: »

wolfie1.0. wrote: »

XperiencedTBAG wrote: »

opalcity wrote: »

How do you know that people who are farming tel var are buying flower satchels?

None of this sounds factual.

I can’t get into it but I know. I don’t have any clue about other servers. But this is happening on PlayStation EU server.

you know that the best way to stop these people from these farms is to find them in IC and kill them right?

steal half their Tel Var from them and you cut production in half.

Sure, that’s a nice theory. But when these players control the entire Imperial City, they often roll in groups, making it nearly impossible for solo players or smaller groups to take them down. If you enter their territory, you’ll get harassed. It’s not as simple as just hunting them—you’re suggesting something like cutting mold off bread and expecting it to be edible. The problem runs deeper, and until significant changes are made, this unfair dominance will continue.

With all the other ways to get materials I still don't see this as creating a monopoly type situation. That includes just tagging along with the group with a character from the same alliance.

If you think tagging along with a group from the same alliance will solve the problem, you’re wrong. The monopoly on PS EU is real and brutal. These players dominate the Imperial City, harass anyone who dares to farm there, and will even switch to a different alliance just to kill you. You might not see it as a monopoly, but that’s because you’re not dealing with it. Maybe buy a PlayStation ESO copy and see for yourself.

I'm not seeing a monopoly because one can not exist so long as there are alternative ways to get the same materials. You can get the same materials from doing surveys and they rack up fairly quick. It isn't good that a group is preventing others from enjoying Imperial City but trying to play it off as creating a monopoly on materials doesn't help your concerns.

There being no monopoly maybe if you concentrated on the harassing nature of the groups a solution might be found. Taking away an incentive for them to be there takes that incentive away from all. It isn't a good solution to the perceived problem.

freespirit

Jaraal wrote: »

freespirit wrote: »

It literally is the easiest source of flowers in the game and with plentiful harvest slotted, high numbers of them too.

Yes, getting 200 columbine from one survey is not unheard of. And I have one character who collects all the non-alchemy surveys, as I never reset those. A different character does all the alchemy surveys when I have a lot of free time to maximize the spawns.

Afaik max per node is 12 I've never seen more.(without plentiful slotted it's 4 or 6 so 8 or 12 with plentiful) so 6 x 12..... 72 per survey if you lucked in with 6 columbine nodes... not unheard of but even resetting if I see more than 2 columbine nodes I will then pick them.

MidniteOwl1913

fred4 wrote: »

XSTRONG wrote: »

14k telwar for killing one boss, if you control IC you can easily get 200k telwar within 1 hour.

XperiencedTBAG wrote: »

Regarding Tel Var farming rates, it's indeed challenging on busy servers, but with the right strategies and during certain times, it's possible to reach those high numbers, even if it's not common.

Bosses spawn every 15 minutes. Within one hour, you have 6 x 4 = 24 bosses available. I believe the exact drop size is 13.7K, but let's round it to up to 14K. 24 x 14 = 336K Tel Var. The following is what achieving that number would entail:

• Your faction owns IC throughout the period.
• You're alone farming bosses.
• You spend 2.5 minutes per boss.

The fastest I've seen someone solo a boss was around 90 seconds. You then need time to get to the next one. In the case of Noble's, you'll have to search for it. You'll be in a full PvE setup, or something close to it. A typical soloing time for me, in a PvP setup, is 5 minutes, not 90 seconds.

You've either benefitted from an IC so empty that you've been able to do the above, or you made a rough calculation about something you don't actually do in order to support your argument.

In the first case, there was no opposition, no cartel, and you benefitted from an empty server. You took a huge risk by carrying that much Tel Var without banking. Banking would have taken time. You got lucky no one else flipped flags, nor did they steal a boss from you on the opposite side of the map, nor did they gank you.

In the second case you forgot to factor in the practical matters. Tel Var are shared between players partaking in a kill. You can take out 336K Tel Var via boss farming per instance of IC, not per player working there. If your faction owns the city and you have time to do bosses as they spawn, time to bank, and time to keep holding the city, there's more than one of you. The share for individual players gets cut to a fraction as a result.

In practice, I agree up to ~100K Tel Var per hour can happen, but it's completely unpredictable. It means you live in IC and were lucky to be there at the right time.

I can't speak to the statistics for PS EU. It sounds to me like it's simply deserted.

Yes, thanks for this, I kind of thought something was off but I couldn't put a finger on it.

Jaraal

freespirit wrote: »

Jaraal wrote: »

freespirit wrote: »

It literally is the easiest source of flowers in the game and with plentiful harvest slotted, high numbers of them too.

Yes, getting 200 columbine from one survey is not unheard of. And I have one character who collects all the non-alchemy surveys, as I never reset those. A different character does all the alchemy surveys when I have a lot of free time to maximize the spawns.

Afaik max per node is 12 I've never seen more.(without plentiful slotted it's 4 or 6 so 8 or 12 with plentiful) so 6 x 12..... 72 per survey if you lucked in with 6 columbine nodes... not unheard of but even resetting if I see more than 2 columbine nodes I will then pick them.

Right, I was thinking of the non-alchemy node drop rate. Thanks for that.

MidniteOwl1913

I usually am able to farm all the alchemical plants I need (they aren't all flowers BTW, Nirnroot and Wormwood are right there...). However, as a crafter, I spend time every day farming resource nodes. I have also fully researched all of the plants and properties and can sub some ingredients. Although I know for some things it changes the properties to something not as desirable.

I looked a the telvar Alchemical Sachet when I was looking at what to spend telvar on to make some gold and didn't think it was a very good deal. But that's just me.

wolfie1.0.

I need to get my glasses checked...

olsborg

CGPsaint wrote: »

XperiencedTBAG wrote: »

In stark contrast, farming Tel Var in the Imperial City, even under the bad conditions, nets around 200k-400k Tel Var per hour.

I'm having a hard time believing that anyone is farming 200K-400K Tel Var per hour consistently.

Only during event, and who has the patience to farm more then 2 hours a day rly, the same bosses over and over. I dunno.