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Magicka Sorcerer PvP Domination!
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Luede✭✭✭✭✭StaticWave wrote: »StaticWave wrote: »StaticWave wrote: »well, it's not that sorc is completely op. the class just joins the tankiness of some other classes. whether that's good or bad can be decided by others, the fact that there was a buff is perfectly ok.
Sorc is the tankiest spec right now, there’s no contest. It’s also the only spec that can almost negate a Jerall build.
Giving it 10% max mag was more than enough to elevate it to S tier. Giving it a burst heal under a shield elevated it to OP status. Here is a screenshot of a sorc tanking 4k DPS without Vigor:
There are also numerous complaints about Sorc tanking whole groups of people in Cyro too.
What’s absurd is people like me who tested the shield on PTS opposed the change, but so many sorc mains wanted it to go thru when they didn’t even participate in the PTS lol… What is the point then? You don’t need to see actual data to know this shield change would be broken. It defeats the whole concept of tradeoff and puts Sorc in the same boat as NB being stealthy and having amazing heals/tankiness 🤣🤣
tanking 4k dps doesn't seem particularly impressive to me, all the other classes can do that too, but maybe I'm just not understanding you correctly.
I should also mention that I play no procc, no cp. The game may be a little more balanced, although sorc has always benefited well from a pure stat build. but at least you can't take as much as in the cp campaign.
Tanking 4k DPS without Vigor, which was mandatory on Sorc, is not impressive? Ok…
do we have a maths problem here? 4 k dps is 20k damage in 5 seconds, that was perfectly possible before with a shield build and every other class with a burst heal can do that without any problems
So you’re telling me if every class but Sorc drops Vigor, they can also tank 4k DPS? Please prove that to me right now. I can’t believe I’m hearing this lolol
how do you define tanking here? standing around, pressing a button and holding 4k dps? can all, or 4 k dps tanking without your resources decreasing? i don't know, but outside of duels it's probably completely irrelevant0 -
xylena_lazarow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
Relevant in 1v1, 1vX, and Xv1 target focus... only not relevant for AoE strats.how do you define tanking here? standing around, pressing a button and holding 4k dps? can all, or 4 k dps tanking without your resources decreasing? i don't know, but outside of duels it's probably completely irrelevantPC/NA || CP/Cyro || RIP soft caps0 -
StaticWave✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭StaticWave wrote: »StaticWave wrote: »StaticWave wrote: »well, it's not that sorc is completely op. the class just joins the tankiness of some other classes. whether that's good or bad can be decided by others, the fact that there was a buff is perfectly ok.
Sorc is the tankiest spec right now, there’s no contest. It’s also the only spec that can almost negate a Jerall build.
Giving it 10% max mag was more than enough to elevate it to S tier. Giving it a burst heal under a shield elevated it to OP status. Here is a screenshot of a sorc tanking 4k DPS without Vigor:
There are also numerous complaints about Sorc tanking whole groups of people in Cyro too.
What’s absurd is people like me who tested the shield on PTS opposed the change, but so many sorc mains wanted it to go thru when they didn’t even participate in the PTS lol… What is the point then? You don’t need to see actual data to know this shield change would be broken. It defeats the whole concept of tradeoff and puts Sorc in the same boat as NB being stealthy and having amazing heals/tankiness 🤣🤣
tanking 4k dps doesn't seem particularly impressive to me, all the other classes can do that too, but maybe I'm just not understanding you correctly.
I should also mention that I play no procc, no cp. The game may be a little more balanced, although sorc has always benefited well from a pure stat build. but at least you can't take as much as in the cp campaign.
Tanking 4k DPS without Vigor, which was mandatory on Sorc, is not impressive? Ok…
do we have a maths problem here? 4 k dps is 20k damage in 5 seconds, that was perfectly possible before with a shield build and every other class with a burst heal can do that without any problems
So you’re telling me if every class but Sorc drops Vigor, they can also tank 4k DPS? Please prove that to me right now. I can’t believe I’m hearing this lolol
how do you define tanking here? standing around, pressing a button and holding 4k dps? can all, or 4 k dps tanking without your resources decreasing? i don't know, but outside of duels it's probably completely irrelevant
Tank as in not break a sweat against a full dmg player. 4k DPS is a lot in PvP. It’s what you would see in low end DoT builds and high end burst builds over the course of a long fight. If you can do 4k DPS, you can kill 99% of players you see.
So when I said Sorc can tank 4k DPS without Vigor, which is always top 1 healing for every other class, then there is a huge balance problem.Platform:
PC NA
Main:
Static Wave - AD stamsorc4 -
Luede✭✭✭✭✭ah, you're talking about an average value in a long fight, where the damage spikes are naturally much higher for someone to die at all. I think I simply misunderstood you here.
as such, 4k is completely irrelevant, no class dies if the damage distribution is right, what is relevant is what is caused as a damage spike, only that is relevant0 -
Bushido2513✭✭✭✭✭xylena_lazarow wrote: »
Not exactly. This person is saying something I agree with in general. It's not so much about the details but more that we're talking about something every class can do. There's always going to be advantages to each class like warden being able to out shield projectiles while stunning people, NB being able to disappear at will, etc. Big picture though, sorc has just stepped up to the level of everyone else. They are no more or less killable than any other class that can also do good damage.
Will this stalemate a 1v1, absolutely but the game isn't about the 1v1 and sorcs will still die when outnumbered or bombed. That's just the overall state of the game and not particular to sorc really1 -
Bushido2513✭✭✭✭✭StaticWave wrote: »StaticWave wrote: »StaticWave wrote: »well, it's not that sorc is completely op. the class just joins the tankiness of some other classes. whether that's good or bad can be decided by others, the fact that there was a buff is perfectly ok.
Sorc is the tankiest spec right now, there’s no contest. It’s also the only spec that can almost negate a Jerall build.
Giving it 10% max mag was more than enough to elevate it to S tier. Giving it a burst heal under a shield elevated it to OP status. Here is a screenshot of a sorc tanking 4k DPS without Vigor:
There are also numerous complaints about Sorc tanking whole groups of people in Cyro too.
What’s absurd is people like me who tested the shield on PTS opposed the change, but so many sorc mains wanted it to go thru when they didn’t even participate in the PTS lol… What is the point then? You don’t need to see actual data to know this shield change would be broken. It defeats the whole concept of tradeoff and puts Sorc in the same boat as NB being stealthy and having amazing heals/tankiness 🤣🤣
tanking 4k dps doesn't seem particularly impressive to me, all the other classes can do that too, but maybe I'm just not understanding you correctly.
I should also mention that I play no procc, no cp. The game may be a little more balanced, although sorc has always benefited well from a pure stat build. but at least you can't take as much as in the cp campaign.
Tanking 4k DPS without Vigor, which was mandatory on Sorc, is not impressive? Ok…
do we have a maths problem here? 4 k dps is 20k damage in 5 seconds, that was perfectly possible before with a shield build and every other class with a burst heal can do that without any problems
So you’re telling me if every class but Sorc drops Vigor, they can also tank 4k DPS? Please prove that to me right now. I can’t believe I’m hearing this lolol
This person is saying sorc is more survivable than other classes that have similar damage. This may need a little adjustment but so do all the others so remind me again how is this different from the nightblade that repeatedly heals to full health and can disappear at will, the warden that can heal to full health and auto stun me, the dk that can ult and get resources, a heal and either a shield or defense/ pen, or a place that can't be killed under bubble and rune, Arcanist, etc?
Any of those classes can be just as tanky and have the same level of damage.
If sorc doesn't have to use vigor big whoop being that sorc has crap bar space compared to other classes anyway, jeez give em a slot. Ask NB for one, they've got plenty of bar space to go around.5 -
TechMaybeHic✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭When I see "sorcs are NOW on the level of everyone else" like they were weak before beyond just not having a reliable burst heal; I am reminded that there are some NBs that still think they are underpowered.
There are still bad NBs out there and still bad sorcs. Sorcs always could make use of their damage when they could kite back and forth, if they were good but not just face tank it. Now they can still unload heavier ranged damage than anyone AND can face tank.
Edited by TechMaybeHic on March 12, 2024 3:29PM2 -
Aces-High-82✭✭✭✭Compared top my 40k HP bowsorc I lost HP, chc, chd, damage, mitigation, mobility and sustain in order to achieve 59k mag while gained 6k bigger shields and 2k higher heal. Not even talking about effective hps due to less surge procs, vigor and CW weaving (2.5 k heal at with 40k HP). Had to opt for worse CP either.
Yet ppl cryin a river about mag scaling lol5 -
katorga✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Aces-High-82 wrote: »Compared top my 40k HP bowsorc I lost HP, chc, chd, damage, mitigation, mobility and sustain in order to achieve 59k mag while gained 6k bigger shields and 2k higher heal. Not even talking about effective hps due to less surge procs, vigor and CW weaving (2.5 k heal at with 40k HP). Had to opt for worse CP either.
Yet ppl cryin a river about mag scaling lol
Ya, I'm still not convinced max mag is the best option. I'm still max health, max spell damage and it is working well. I replaced the pet heal with the new vibrant shroud heal. I just can't get on board with saddling myself with a less than entry level set.
I sort of wish they had taken the regenerative ward morph and turned it into a burst heal on par with what NB or DK has.
I wish crit surge was changed to function passively while on either bar, like siphoning attacks.
2 -
StaticWave✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Aces-High-82 wrote: »Compared top my 40k HP bowsorc I lost HP, chc, chd, damage, mitigation, mobility and sustain in order to achieve 59k mag while gained 6k bigger shields and 2k higher heal. Not even talking about effective hps due to less surge procs, vigor and CW weaving (2.5 k heal at with 40k HP). Had to opt for worse CP either.
Yet ppl cryin a river about mag scaling lol
Because it is currently broken lol. Top tier magsorcs on PC NA are all saying it is, and quite frankly it doesnt require much testing to see why it isn’t.
And btw, you can get 50k max mag in Pariah/Heartland. It’s THAT easy to stack max mag. I don’t think people realize how strong the 10% max mag buff is. Sorc is freed from having to use max mag sets
Platform:
PC NA
Main:
Static Wave - AD stamsorc2 -
Aces-High-82✭✭✭✭You wont kill anybody besides pve Andys with HL/Pariah. Again why should I put a single point into mag when HP sorc hast it all now. Either you go full max mag ~70k in order to somewhat compensate for the losses in the other mentioned areas or you build HP on sorc.
I tested mag stacking for two days only for now, yet I am pretty set that HP stacking is better when in groups (more skill/gear options) or in open world PvP in general.2 -
Turtle_Bot✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭StaticWave wrote: »Aces-High-82 wrote: »Compared top my 40k HP bowsorc I lost HP, chc, chd, damage, mitigation, mobility and sustain in order to achieve 59k mag while gained 6k bigger shields and 2k higher heal. Not even talking about effective hps due to less surge procs, vigor and CW weaving (2.5 k heal at with 40k HP). Had to opt for worse CP either.
Yet ppl cryin a river about mag scaling lol
Because it is currently broken lol. Top tier magsorcs on PC NA are all saying it is, and quite frankly it doesnt require much testing to see why it isn’t.
And btw, you can get 50k max mag in Pariah/Heartland. It’s THAT easy to stack max mag. I don’t think people realize how strong the 10% max mag buff is. Sorc is freed from having to use max mag sets
I mean, sure you can get to 50k max mag in those sets, but it hits like a wet noodle and has no real kill potential against remotely competent players.
A few notes:
- It reaches 50k with the 10% from expert summoner, which currently doesn't display in build editor.
- All armor has mag only enchants (cannot reach if all tri-stat)
- DDF is at max (30) stacks
- 64 attributes into mag
- All mag CP slotted
- Race is high elf (max mag + damage bonuses)
- Recovery buffs from tri-stat pots included
The ward size is also really bad unless there is something wrong in the editors calcs/display
Note:
- Bastion CP is active (toggled on)
- Even accounting for the 10% max mag missing from the editor display that gives the shield a value of 7200 with a 3k heal
Crushing shock spam + ele sus is not going to wear anyone that is even remotely competent down enough for a streak into meteor combo to actually kill (unless they deliberately greed it and mess up) and if you don't want to lose out on the following:
- Sustain from dark exchange (build has only 1500 mag rec when buffed)
- major maim that vibrant shroud gives
- major prophecy/savagery from inner light
- Breach from ele sus (with only 5k pen? lmao)
Then there's no room for a delayed burst skill like haunting curse or fury.
I can see the build working, but it won't be doing anything more than the current tank builds that all classes already do which is being nothing more than a nuisance and picking off bad players that never heal.2 -
i11ionward✭✭✭✭Turtle_Bot wrote: »StaticWave wrote: »Aces-High-82 wrote: »Compared top my 40k HP bowsorc I lost HP, chc, chd, damage, mitigation, mobility and sustain in order to achieve 59k mag while gained 6k bigger shields and 2k higher heal. Not even talking about effective hps due to less surge procs, vigor and CW weaving (2.5 k heal at with 40k HP). Had to opt for worse CP either.
Yet ppl cryin a river about mag scaling lol
Because it is currently broken lol. Top tier magsorcs on PC NA are all saying it is, and quite frankly it doesnt require much testing to see why it isn’t.
And btw, you can get 50k max mag in Pariah/Heartland. It’s THAT easy to stack max mag. I don’t think people realize how strong the 10% max mag buff is. Sorc is freed from having to use max mag sets
I mean, sure you can get to 50k max mag in those sets, but it hits like a wet noodle and has no real kill potential against remotely competent players.
A few notes:
- It reaches 50k with the 10% from expert summoner, which currently doesn't display in build editor.
- All armor has mag only enchants (cannot reach if all tri-stat)
- DDF is at max (30) stacks
- 64 attributes into mag
- All mag CP slotted
- Race is high elf (max mag + damage bonuses)
- Recovery buffs from tri-stat pots included
The ward size is also really bad unless there is something wrong in the editors calcs/display
Note:
- Bastion CP is active (toggled on)
- Even accounting for the 10% max mag missing from the editor display that gives the shield a value of 7200 with a 3k heal
Crushing shock spam + ele sus is not going to wear anyone that is even remotely competent down enough for a streak into meteor combo to actually kill (unless they deliberately greed it and mess up) and if you don't want to lose out on the following:
- Sustain from dark exchange (build has only 1500 mag rec when buffed)
- major maim that vibrant shroud gives
- major prophecy/savagery from inner light
- Breach from ele sus (with only 5k pen? lmao)
Then there's no room for a delayed burst skill like haunting curse or fury.
I can see the build working, but it won't be doing anything more than the current tank builds that all classes already do which is being nothing more than a nuisance and picking off bad players that never heal.
50k max magic is roughly equivalent to 5k WD/SPD. 4.5k WD/SPD you have in the screenshot. In total 5k+4.5k=9.5k WD/SPD.
Normal stats for a player not going max magic is 25k max resource and 7k WD/SPD, totalling the same 9.5k WD/SPD.
There's also penetration, but it's harder to calculate for different classes and I think it will make not much difference
I don't think sorc hits like a wet noodle compared to the other classes, although most of his skills are easy to block or dodge.
About Hardened Ward IV in UESP Build Editor, it's just a bug in the software and it ignores your magic and always counts your shield size by HP.
2 -
Turtle_Bot✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭i11ionward wrote: »Turtle_Bot wrote: »StaticWave wrote: »Aces-High-82 wrote: »Compared top my 40k HP bowsorc I lost HP, chc, chd, damage, mitigation, mobility and sustain in order to achieve 59k mag while gained 6k bigger shields and 2k higher heal. Not even talking about effective hps due to less surge procs, vigor and CW weaving (2.5 k heal at with 40k HP). Had to opt for worse CP either.
Yet ppl cryin a river about mag scaling lol
Because it is currently broken lol. Top tier magsorcs on PC NA are all saying it is, and quite frankly it doesnt require much testing to see why it isn’t.
And btw, you can get 50k max mag in Pariah/Heartland. It’s THAT easy to stack max mag. I don’t think people realize how strong the 10% max mag buff is. Sorc is freed from having to use max mag sets
I mean, sure you can get to 50k max mag in those sets, but it hits like a wet noodle and has no real kill potential against remotely competent players.
A few notes:
- It reaches 50k with the 10% from expert summoner, which currently doesn't display in build editor.
- All armor has mag only enchants (cannot reach if all tri-stat)
- DDF is at max (30) stacks
- 64 attributes into mag
- All mag CP slotted
- Race is high elf (max mag + damage bonuses)
- Recovery buffs from tri-stat pots included
The ward size is also really bad unless there is something wrong in the editors calcs/display
Note:
- Bastion CP is active (toggled on)
- Even accounting for the 10% max mag missing from the editor display that gives the shield a value of 7200 with a 3k heal
Crushing shock spam + ele sus is not going to wear anyone that is even remotely competent down enough for a streak into meteor combo to actually kill (unless they deliberately greed it and mess up) and if you don't want to lose out on the following:
- Sustain from dark exchange (build has only 1500 mag rec when buffed)
- major maim that vibrant shroud gives
- major prophecy/savagery from inner light
- Breach from ele sus (with only 5k pen? lmao)
Then there's no room for a delayed burst skill like haunting curse or fury.
I can see the build working, but it won't be doing anything more than the current tank builds that all classes already do which is being nothing more than a nuisance and picking off bad players that never heal.
50k max magic is roughly equivalent to 5k WD/SPD. 4.5k WD/SPD you have in the screenshot. In total 5k+4.5k=9.5k WD/SPD.
Normal stats for a player not going max magic is 25k max resource and 7k WD/SPD, totalling the same 9.5k WD/SPD.
There's also penetration, but it's harder to calculate for different classes and I think it will make not much difference
I don't think sorc hits like a wet noodle compared to the other classes, although most of his skills are easy to block or dodge.
About Hardened Ward IV in UESP Build Editor, it's just a bug in the software and it ignores your magic and always counts your shield size by HP.
ok, thanks for letting me know about ward on UESP. I was wondering what was going on there.0 -
StaticWave✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Aces-High-82 wrote: »You wont kill anybody besides pve Andys with HL/Pariah. Again why should I put a single point into mag when HP sorc hast it all now. Either you go full max mag ~70k in order to somewhat compensate for the losses in the other mentioned areas or you build HP on sorc.
I tested mag stacking for two days only for now, yet I am pretty set that HP stacking is better when in groups (more skill/gear options) or in open world PvP in general.
The point wasn't to say I have damage with HL/Pariah. The point was you can stack max mag extremely easy on Sorc because of the 10% max mag/stam buff. The point was you could play in two 5 piece sets that give no mag buff and still have a 50k mag pool if you invest in it. The point was Sorc is freed from wearing max mag sets, like this:
1) Shattered/Clever:
2) Rallying/Clever:
HP sorc is not the play anymore, and I can guarantee you that. You can tank 7k DPS in a 52k max mag build without Vigor. That's without the strongest HoT in the game. You're acting like Sorc is still a bad class when these changes just elevated it to top tier status. Nothing in the game can parse it down now. Not even a 7k DPS build. You will have to 1 shot them to have any chance of killing them. Sorc is OP, and it's a fact.
Platform:
PC NA
Main:
Static Wave - AD stamsorc5 -
Bushido2513✭✭✭✭✭StaticWave wrote: »Aces-High-82 wrote: »You wont kill anybody besides pve Andys with HL/Pariah. Again why should I put a single point into mag when HP sorc hast it all now. Either you go full max mag ~70k in order to somewhat compensate for the losses in the other mentioned areas or you build HP on sorc.
I tested mag stacking for two days only for now, yet I am pretty set that HP stacking is better when in groups (more skill/gear options) or in open world PvP in general.
The point wasn't to say I have damage with HL/Pariah. The point was you can stack max mag extremely easy on Sorc because of the 10% max mag/stam buff. The point was you could play in two 5 piece sets that give no mag buff and still have a 50k mag pool if you invest in it. The point was Sorc is freed from wearing max mag sets, like this:
1) Shattered/Clever:
2) Rallying/Clever:
HP sorc is not the play anymore, and I can guarantee you that. You can tank 7k DPS in a 52k max mag build without Vigor. That's without the strongest HoT in the game. You're acting like Sorc is still a bad class when these changes just elevated it to top tier status. Nothing in the game can parse it down now. Not even a 7k DPS build. You will have to 1 shot them to have any chance of killing them. Sorc is OP, and it's a fact.
I see both points here. What's best in a build is what works best for that player. There is no actual best build, class, bar setup, etc
Sorc is definitely S tier for it's own reasons but also now stands shoulder to shoulder in those that were already in or near that bracket.
I've had hard times parsing down a lot of classes and builds that still have enough damage to require me to alternate defense and offense. This is nothing new to the game just more so need to sorc and even then before this buff I already had a build that was hard to kill that could also hit good damage. Obviously this change will boost that but not to a degree that other classes will be utterly blown away or even be made to be A tier. There will just be a lot of S tier classes2 -
katorga✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭StaticWave wrote: »Aces-High-82 wrote: »Compared top my 40k HP bowsorc I lost HP, chc, chd, damage, mitigation, mobility and sustain in order to achieve 59k mag while gained 6k bigger shields and 2k higher heal. Not even talking about effective hps due to less surge procs, vigor and CW weaving (2.5 k heal at with 40k HP). Had to opt for worse CP either.
Yet ppl cryin a river about mag scaling lol
Because it is currently broken lol. Top tier magsorcs on PC NA are all saying it is, and quite frankly it doesnt require much testing to see why it isn’t.
And btw, you can get 50k max mag in Pariah/Heartland. It’s THAT easy to stack max mag. I don’t think people realize how strong the 10% max mag buff is. Sorc is freed from having to use max mag sets
Hmm, I can't reach 50K in Pariah/Heartland on Esobuilder... I'm manually adding 10% to mag because expert summoner passive check box does change values. All points in mag, mag mundus, mag blue CP, all mag enchants on armor, arcane rings, ghostly eyebowl food.
PVP showing a 5.6K shield with a 3.7K heal.1 -
Bushido2513✭✭✭✭✭StaticWave wrote: »Aces-High-82 wrote: »Compared top my 40k HP bowsorc I lost HP, chc, chd, damage, mitigation, mobility and sustain in order to achieve 59k mag while gained 6k bigger shields and 2k higher heal. Not even talking about effective hps due to less surge procs, vigor and CW weaving (2.5 k heal at with 40k HP). Had to opt for worse CP either.
Yet ppl cryin a river about mag scaling lol
Because it is currently broken lol. Top tier magsorcs on PC NA are all saying it is, and quite frankly it doesnt require much testing to see why it isn’t.
And btw, you can get 50k max mag in Pariah/Heartland. It’s THAT easy to stack max mag. I don’t think people realize how strong the 10% max mag buff is. Sorc is freed from having to use max mag sets
Hmm, I can't reach 50K in Pariah/Heartland on Esobuilder... I'm manually adding 10% to mag because expert summoner passive check box does change values. All points in mag, mag mundus, mag blue CP, all mag enchants on armor, arcane rings, ghostly eyebowl food.
PVP showing a 5.6K shield with a 3.7K heal.
Could be me but shield number seems low while the heal seems correct.0 -
StaticWave✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭StaticWave wrote: »Aces-High-82 wrote: »Compared top my 40k HP bowsorc I lost HP, chc, chd, damage, mitigation, mobility and sustain in order to achieve 59k mag while gained 6k bigger shields and 2k higher heal. Not even talking about effective hps due to less surge procs, vigor and CW weaving (2.5 k heal at with 40k HP). Had to opt for worse CP either.
Yet ppl cryin a river about mag scaling lol
Because it is currently broken lol. Top tier magsorcs on PC NA are all saying it is, and quite frankly it doesnt require much testing to see why it isn’t.
And btw, you can get 50k max mag in Pariah/Heartland. It’s THAT easy to stack max mag. I don’t think people realize how strong the 10% max mag buff is. Sorc is freed from having to use max mag sets
Hmm, I can't reach 50K in Pariah/Heartland on Esobuilder... I'm manually adding 10% to mag because expert summoner passive check box does change values. All points in mag, mag mundus, mag blue CP, all mag enchants on armor, arcane rings, ghostly eyebowl food.
PVP showing a 5.6K shield with a 3.7K heal.
What race were you and what mythic?Platform:
PC NA
Main:
Static Wave - AD stamsorc0 -
StaticWave✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭StaticWave wrote: »Aces-High-82 wrote: »Compared top my 40k HP bowsorc I lost HP, chc, chd, damage, mitigation, mobility and sustain in order to achieve 59k mag while gained 6k bigger shields and 2k higher heal. Not even talking about effective hps due to less surge procs, vigor and CW weaving (2.5 k heal at with 40k HP). Had to opt for worse CP either.
Yet ppl cryin a river about mag scaling lol
Because it is currently broken lol. Top tier magsorcs on PC NA are all saying it is, and quite frankly it doesnt require much testing to see why it isn’t.
And btw, you can get 50k max mag in Pariah/Heartland. It’s THAT easy to stack max mag. I don’t think people realize how strong the 10% max mag buff is. Sorc is freed from having to use max mag sets
Hmm, I can't reach 50K in Pariah/Heartland on Esobuilder... I'm manually adding 10% to mag because expert summoner passive check box does change values. All points in mag, mag mundus, mag blue CP, all mag enchants on armor, arcane rings, ghostly eyebowl food.
PVP showing a 5.6K shield with a 3.7K heal.
Ignore the resto skills. But you can see the max mag in Pariah Heartland. Not saying the build has dmg to kill decent players. I wanted to show people how easy you can stack 50k max mag now.
Platform:
PC NA
Main:
Static Wave - AD stamsorc0 -
katorga✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭StaticWave wrote: »StaticWave wrote: »Aces-High-82 wrote: »Compared top my 40k HP bowsorc I lost HP, chc, chd, damage, mitigation, mobility and sustain in order to achieve 59k mag while gained 6k bigger shields and 2k higher heal. Not even talking about effective hps due to less surge procs, vigor and CW weaving (2.5 k heal at with 40k HP). Had to opt for worse CP either.
Yet ppl cryin a river about mag scaling lol
Because it is currently broken lol. Top tier magsorcs on PC NA are all saying it is, and quite frankly it doesnt require much testing to see why it isn’t.
And btw, you can get 50k max mag in Pariah/Heartland. It’s THAT easy to stack max mag. I don’t think people realize how strong the 10% max mag buff is. Sorc is freed from having to use max mag sets
Hmm, I can't reach 50K in Pariah/Heartland on Esobuilder... I'm manually adding 10% to mag because expert summoner passive check box does change values. All points in mag, mag mundus, mag blue CP, all mag enchants on armor, arcane rings, ghostly eyebowl food.
PVP showing a 5.6K shield with a 3.7K heal.
Ignore the resto skills. But you can see the max mag in Pariah Heartland. Not saying the build has dmg to kill decent players. I wanted to show people how easy you can stack 50k max mag now.
got it, thanks!
I can't make it work with HC/Pariah as you have, not a playable build. Got to drop a skill for major resolve buff, but then can drop 1 piece chudan for domihaus. MIght have to try this tonite.
51K mag, 31K health. 7.1K shield, 4678 heal per eso builder.
If I shift around to 37K health 44K mag, shield goes to 8.6 and 5678 heal. My damage tooltips stay within 1%. Per eso builder. So you still might be shooting yourself in the foot stacking so much mag; there is probably a sweet spot around 40K health and mag. Assuming the build editor is calculating correctly.Edited by katorga on March 13, 2024 3:17PM1 -
xylena_lazarow✭✭✭✭✭
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I'm not sure why some players think Sorc needs to face tank like a DK or Temp, so I'll just agree to disagree.Bushido2513 wrote: »Big picture though, sorc has just stepped up to the level of everyone else
There is some frustration here in trying to explain to uninformed players the significance of 4k dps or 8k dps in a 1v1, or that 1v1 scenarios do in fact pop up quite frequently in Cyro and BGs, or that 1v1 dps is extremely relevant in any situation involving Xv1 target focus which is a very much intended aspect of any scale group play in this PvP.PC/NA || CP/Cyro || RIP soft caps0 -
Bushido2513✭✭✭✭✭xylena_lazarow wrote: »
I'm not sure why some players think Sorc needs to face tank like a DK or Temp, so I'll just agree to disagree.Bushido2513 wrote: »Big picture though, sorc has just stepped up to the level of everyone else
There is some frustration here in trying to explain to uninformed players the significance of 4k dps or 8k dps in a 1v1, or that 1v1 scenarios do in fact pop up quite frequently in Cyro and BGs, or that 1v1 dps is extremely relevant in any situation involving Xv1 target focus which is a very much intended aspect of any scale group play in this PvP.
So if streak was as potent as it used to be id say being able to have tank wouldn't be as important but at this point people can and will catch up to you with relative ease and have high damage to boot. I see this as an opportunity to not have to run when outnumbered so much and I have to play the game that I'm given so I'm in favor of more defense at this point. If streak was what it once was and proc / overall damage wasn't as high I'd be less in need or favor of the heal.
1v1 happens and so does 1vx, I'm saying that ZOS isn't concerned with those scenarios for the most part. As evidence I'd say look at the sets and changes over the years. They clearly trend towards grouping up. They have made it so that you're sooooo much more protected and stronger in a group vs being solo.
1v1 is entirely skewed at this point. Currently if anyone doesn't want to die 1v1 they don't have to and at the same time many cheese 1v1 builds exist to the point where you tend to only duel certain people because the wrong cheese build can definitely not die and possibly win ZOS has done no patches or changes that help this and in some cases easily made the problem worse.
1v1 and 1vx exist in this game but are very much not supported. There is so much that could be improved in dueling but have you seen any changes to that nice mode in years?
In order of what little attention ZOS gives cryo group v group is at the top and dueling is at the bottom.
Also everyone talks about 1v1 but put this sorc up against a zerg or bomb procs and it'll die or stalemate like most everything else which is just the overall direction of the game3 -
xylena_lazarow✭✭✭✭✭
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Suppose I agreed with you that Sorcs should hold their ground as well as DKs. You would do well to reread Static's posts. Sorcs aren't just holding their ground, they're doing it better than any DK, they're doing it against full max damage glass cannons, and unlike DKs that need to run Coag + Vigor + hots, Sorcs do it with literally one skill.Bushido2513 wrote: »I see this as an opportunity to not have to run when outnumbered so much and I have to play the game that I'm given so I'm in favor of more defense at this point.
Years of players complaining about "tanks that do damage" but this is fine? Okay. Sure. Have fun.PC/NA || CP/Cyro || RIP soft caps5 -
Bushido2513✭✭✭✭✭xylena_lazarow wrote: »
Suppose I agreed with you that Sorcs should hold their ground as well as DKs. You would do well to reread Static's posts. Sorcs aren't just holding their ground, they're doing it better than any DK, they're doing it against full max damage glass cannons, and unlike DKs that need to run Coag + Vigor + hots, Sorcs do it with literally one skill.Bushido2513 wrote: »I see this as an opportunity to not have to run when outnumbered so much and I have to play the game that I'm given so I'm in favor of more defense at this point.
Years of players complaining about "tanks that do damage" but this is fine? Okay. Sure. Have fun.
We could go back and forth all day about what one class can do that another can't. Sorc for instance can't just disappear with the press of a button, refil resources just for using ult, etc.
But to your point, yes in a 1v1 sorc has reached the status of other classes and joins team stalemate in some cases.
I'd advise the same thing I advise when taking down any tanky class, either move on or group up and take them down. Grouping up is the path ZOS is obviously pushing with changes like these so unless we're fixing everything I don't see why we focus on just the most recent thing.
This isn't fine and people should state their opinions but at the end of the day the game is what it is and in that context sorc is just the latest but definitely not the only offender so let's keep that in mind.2 -
xylena_lazarow✭✭✭✭✭
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Not reached. Exceeded. By a lot. With only one skill where every other brawler needs multiple bar slots.Bushido2513 wrote: »But to your point, yes in a 1v1 sorc has reached the status of other classes
Static showed this with hard numbers but the significance of those numbers is still sadly lost on this forum.PC/NA || CP/Cyro || RIP soft caps3 -
katorga✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭xylena_lazarow wrote: »
Suppose I agreed with you that Sorcs should hold their ground as well as DKs. You would do well to reread Static's posts. Sorcs aren't just holding their ground, they're doing it better than any DK, they're doing it against full max damage glass cannons, and unlike DKs that need to run Coag + Vigor + hots, Sorcs do it with literally one skill.Bushido2513 wrote: »I see this as an opportunity to not have to run when outnumbered so much and I have to play the game that I'm given so I'm in favor of more defense at this point.
Years of players complaining about "tanks that do damage" but this is fine? Okay. Sure. Have fun.
Well that is almost every class now, so no reason for Sorc not to join the party (Sorry necros).
You want to fix it, follow the proc set standard:
All heals scale from max mag/stam.
All damage skills scale from max weapon/spell damage.
All shields, block mitigation, dodge roll costs and so on scale from max health.
No exceptions. Now builds have a hard time being good at everything all the time.7 -
Bushido2513✭✭✭✭✭xylena_lazarow wrote: »
Not reached. Exceeded. By a lot. With only one skill where every other brawler needs multiple bar slots.Bushido2513 wrote: »But to your point, yes in a 1v1 sorc has reached the status of other classes
Static showed this with hard numbers but the significance of those numbers is still sadly lost on this forum.
It's almost meaningless to point to what one skill does for a class that other classes don't have access to, we'd be here all day going back and forth. Sorc and plar both have executes. Where's my auto lock on execute with busted scaling?
Nobody is really debating what static is saying regarding the 1v1. This game is not balanced around 1v1 or even 1vx. in group v group you wouldn't really notice this change in the same way I believe.2 -
StaticWave✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭@xylena_lazarow There is no point arguing with them. Bushido always talks about data when arguing but when I showed multiple clips and CMX screenshot he says “this needs more time to bake”.
Several people who barely played discussed with me how they could play their Sorc in U41, like @IncultaWolf and @gariondavey. They are currently facetanking in BGs and IC in a full damage build with very little deaths. The buffs Sorc got elevated it from a shelf class to a top tier class, to the point that someone who doesn’t play it can just hop on and perform super well relative to other classes.
You can’t argue with them, not even with evidence. It’s clear they WANT this buff to stay. So be it.Edited by StaticWave on March 14, 2024 1:42AMPlatform:
PC NA
Main:
Static Wave - AD stamsorc6 -
StaticWave✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Oh btw, here's a clip of a me dueling my friend where I did 6.2k DPS vs him. He only had Shield and Surge for healing. No Vigor:
https://youtu.be/P-uZzvJRRD8
Watch how he goes from execute range to full HP with 2 casts. Is this fair? Is it fair to tank 6.2k DPS with literally just shield spamming, whereas other classes, and myself included in that video, have to combine 3 HoTs and a burst heal to do so? You tell mePlatform:
PC NA
Main:
Static Wave - AD stamsorc3