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why dont people use the activity finder for dungeons much?

kumenit_taeynav
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ive been thinking about "those" types of dungeon runners a lot. the ones who charge ahead of the group, those who fake their role to get through the queue faster, the ones who ultimately arent team players in an activity specifically for teams. why dont they use the activity finder tool to set up the group they want to run?
they could add or remove so many different criteria and then queue/port into the dungeons they want to do. they could set up a 4 dps group so no one needs to fake their roles and focus on their dps, they could set up a level requirement to avoid low dps players, they could call their group a pledge speed run, and so on and so forth. basically, why are they still messing up the dungeon experience for people who didnt sign up for a group like that? they could find like-minded players and avoid the standard queue which enforces role requirements
  • Hapexamendios
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    Because getting in as a fake role is likely quicker than finding a like minded group. Would be better if people who want to run dungeons a certain way did use the finder. However, often when I have looked at it, there's nothing listed.
  • spartaxoxo
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    The whole point of faking is to save time. They aren't doing it to ruin someone else's experience. They are doing it because it's the fastest way to get a group.
    Edited by spartaxoxo on February 9, 2024 4:30AM
  • Erickson9610
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    ive been thinking about "those" types of dungeon runners a lot. the ones who charge ahead of the group, those who fake their role to get through the queue faster, the ones who ultimately arent team players in an activity specifically for teams. why dont they use the activity finder tool to set up the group they want to run?
    they could add or remove so many different criteria and then queue/port into the dungeons they want to do. they could set up a 4 dps group so no one needs to fake their roles and focus on their dps, they could set up a level requirement to avoid low dps players, they could call their group a pledge speed run, and so on and so forth. basically, why are they still messing up the dungeon experience for people who didnt sign up for a group like that? they could find like-minded players and avoid the standard queue which enforces role requirements

    You could ask the same thing of the other people: why aren't the slow runners, the story-oriented players, and the casual players using the Group Finder to make groups of their own? They could set their criteria, port into the dungeon they want to do, set up a 2 Damage Dealer, 1 Healer, 1 Tank group, focus on teamwork, call their group a dungeon story run, so on and so forth. They wouldn't be messing up the experience for the people who didn't sign up for a group like that, and they could find like-minded players to avoid the standard queue which has players who won't always conform to their preferences.

    The same arguments can be applied to any group of people who are deemed unfavorable to any playstyle. Why not give the Group Finder a try, instead of telling other people to use it instead?
    Edited by Erickson9610 on February 9, 2024 5:32AM
  • spartaxoxo
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    Honestly, most people use activity finder for farming transmutes or pledges. They aren't there to hear the story or be leisurely. So it makes more sense for the ones in the minority to use the group finder.
  • Aislinna
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    ive been thinking about "those" types of dungeon runners a lot. the ones who charge ahead of the group, those who fake their role to get through the queue faster, the ones who ultimately arent team players in an activity specifically for teams. why dont they use the activity finder tool to set up the group they want to run?
    they could add or remove so many different criteria and then queue/port into the dungeons they want to do. they could set up a 4 dps group so no one needs to fake their roles and focus on their dps, they could set up a level requirement to avoid low dps players, they could call their group a pledge speed run, and so on and so forth. basically, why are they still messing up the dungeon experience for people who didnt sign up for a group like that? they could find like-minded players and avoid the standard queue which enforces role requirements

    "Those" types of players are not the ones unhappy with the regular queue. The activity finder is for the people, like you, who are unhappy with the regular queue. Use the activity finder and set up the type of run you want to experience instead of complaining the world didn't adjust to you.

  • Kite42
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    How many transmute crystals do you get from running dungeons via group finder? I've yet to use it. If it's only one though that would be a nope from me.
  • kumenit_taeynav
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    @Kite42 you can use the group finder to assemble your group and then do whatever dungeon by queuing up and instantly getting in which would give you the same rewards as just using the queue as normal but with the added benefit of being with people who have the same goal as you (pledges/gear farming/story/achievements)
  • Kite42
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    So I can use it to satisfy the random dungeon requirements and collect 10 transmutes? Okay, I'll look into it.
  • Grizzbeorn
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    I don't run with randos, so the activity finder is useless to me.
      PC/NA Warden Main
    • spartaxoxo
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      Kite42 wrote: »
      So I can use it to satisfy the random dungeon requirements and collect 10 transmutes? Okay, I'll look into it.

      Yes. Just make sure after you have formed the group in the group finder, you use the activity finder as normal.
    • colossalvoids
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      Due to reward distribution and game systems the only people who are DF "mains" now are ones in pursuit of quick xp, stone farmers and ones who here to fill the sticker book mainly, talking more-less experienced players, are obviously they're mostly matched with zos's target audience - random people who's expectation is to do the dungeon in slow to average paste. They're "mains" because they are able to lead and advance quicker making group either follow closely or choose their way of dealing with it.

      The solution might be to remove transmutation stones from there entirely making them either a repeatable quest farm for casuals and vet hm reward in abundance for vets. Or make stones drop only when you're not queuing via DF but porting manually.

      New tool however fits slow run lovers perfectly and probably should be their default choice if no changes occur.
      Edited by colossalvoids on February 9, 2024 9:05AM
    • FeedbackOnly
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      It resolves a complaint for people who want to to read and listen to quests.

      Overall I think we need an tutorial on group finder. I know it seems obvious to us but some people are clueless
    • Braffin
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      We have no idea how many people are currently using group finder. Filled groups are unlisted rather quick afaik, so the amount of listings isn't really helpful either.

      That said: As there are even more options than before now to create a specified group of likeminded people, there is no reason anymore to queue completely random if you aren't up for it.

      Seems more to be only an issue for people, which pretend their preferred playstyle to be the default and singularily rightful one and nobody else should use dungeon finder.

      Well, this players are wrong. It's as easy as that. But if they decide that staying unsatisfied is more important than using group finder for themselves, it's ok too.
      Never get between a cat and it's candy!
      ---
      Overland difficulty scaling is desperately needed. 9 years. 6 paid expansions. 24 DLCs. 40 game changing updates including One Tamriel, an overhaul of the game including a permanent CP160 gear cap and ridiculous power creep thereafter. I'm sick and tired of hearing about Cadwell Silver & Gold as a "you think you do but you don't" - tier deflection to any criticism regarding the lack of overland difficulty in the game. I'm bored of dungeons, I'm bored of trials; make a personal difficulty slider for overland. It's not that hard.
    • ganzaeso
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      The group finder's default filters are way too strict to see what groups are available to join. I created a general group the other day and had to really adjust the filters to see it on a second account. Default filter should be no filter so you see every group; even the ones you can not join.
    • spartaxoxo
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      ganzaeso wrote: »
      The group finder's default filters are way too strict to see what groups are available to join. I created a general group the other day and had to really adjust the filters to see it on a second account. Default filter should be no filter so you see every group; even the ones you can not join.

      Yup. Absolutely agree. This is a major cause of people thinking there's no groups.
    • AcadianPaladin
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      I generally only run dungeons I can solo and prefer soloing them when I'm not on a tank. I will occasionally pug a normal dungeon (that I know I can solo) on a healer simply to practice responding to unforeseen hijinks and surprises.

      I won't pug on a dps because the wait is too long and low chance of getting a real healer and real tank.

      I won't pug as a tank because most pugs have no idea how to work with a tank. Basic stuff like let the tank lead, wait until the tank has drawn aggro and set conditions on the battlefield before engaging. If attacked, bring your attacker to the tank instead of running around and spreading out the fight. I only tank with friends and solid voice comm.

      If I really wanted to run more dungeons with groups, I'd seek out a guild interested in my priorities.
      PC NA(no Steam), PvE, mostly solo
    • ceruulean
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      spartaxoxo wrote: »
      ganzaeso wrote: »
      The group finder's default filters are way too strict to see what groups are available to join. I created a general group the other day and had to really adjust the filters to see it on a second account. Default filter should be no filter so you see every group; even the ones you can not join.

      Yup. Absolutely agree. This is a major cause of people thinking there's no groups.

      Yeah +1 agree, it takes too many button clicks to see what's available. Have to sort by normal/veteran difficulty when it doesn't even work correctly because the text still says normal when it's vet, then sort by trial/arena/zone/pvp, then by fiddling with drop-down menus, and then also sort by role. It would be nice if the filter defaulted to listings made in chronological order.
      Edited by ceruulean on February 9, 2024 6:41PM
    • moo_2021
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      How many would run daily PUGs if there is no transmute crystal?

      Why would ZOS keep giving crystals if not to help people use PUG to do quests or pledges?
    • Palumtra
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      Because people either solo or have premade groups as pugs can be......chaotic, to say the least.
      PCEU - Tank main
    • peacenote
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      While not a speed runner, I can say I only use Activity Finder for Trials.

      I actually think the Activity Finder is great. But if I'm going to run a dungeon, I'm going to queue with Dungeon Finder. This way I can get people who are looking for specific dungeons and people who are willing to run any dungeon. To me that is more valuable than finding like-minded players. But, I also tend to queue up to dungeons with at least one person I know, such that it's never an issue to carry the group if we get a newbie.

      Maybe it's luck, but I've never had a huge issue with speed runners. Once, I got into a group during the Undaunted event, where I was queued alone, we got FG I, and the speed runner was so fast they killed the final boss before the rest of us got close, and we didn't get credit. And I thought "oh I guess this is a problem." But I can actually count on one hand the times a speed runner truly ruined my experience in a dungeon. Because I like to replay dungeons, I figure if I get a fast group who isn't patient enough for the quest, I know I'll be back again and have another chance.

      To me the worst team members in a dungeon are people who refuse to listen to nicely worded advice on mechanics when we wipe multiple times to mechanics.
      My #1 wish for ESO Today: Decouple achievements from character progress and tracking.
      • Advocate for this HERE.
      • Want the history of this issue? It's HERE.
    • AcadianPaladin
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      moo_2021 wrote: »
      How many would run daily PUGs if there is no transmute crystal?

      Why would ZOS keep giving crystals if not to help people use PUG to do quests or pledges?

      I have a list of almost a dozen non-DLC dungeons that I can solo on normal and, assisted by alts, can cycle through Maj's and Redbeard's pledge schedule such that I normally do a pledge per day - which nets me one transmute crystal. I love doing those dungeons and am not in it for the crystals. I can easily earn 50 per month repairing walls in Cyrodiil if that's all I want. No amount of crystals will tempt me into running unknown (random) dungeons with unknown (pug) players.
      PC NA(no Steam), PvE, mostly solo
    • MidniteOwl1913
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      spartaxoxo wrote: »
      The whole point of faking is to save time. They aren't doing it to ruin someone else's experience. They are doing it because it's the fastest way to get a group.

      Yes, but they don't care about ruining other people's runs either. It is all about them and what they want. I doubt that the thought they could use group finder to avoid doing that ever occurs to them...
      PS5/NA
    • spartaxoxo
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      spartaxoxo wrote: »
      The whole point of faking is to save time. They aren't doing it to ruin someone else's experience. They are doing it because it's the fastest way to get a group.

      Yes, but they don't care about ruining other people's runs either. It is all about them and what they want. I doubt that the thought they could use group finder to avoid doing that ever occurs to them...

      They expect groups of players that don't like them doing it to kick them or leave.
      Edited by spartaxoxo on February 11, 2024 7:06AM
    • FlopsyPrince
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      I haven't even looked into that choice. It didn't exist when I last played and I don't run that many dungeons.
      PC
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    • moo_2021
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      spartaxoxo wrote: »
      The whole point of faking is to save time. They aren't doing it to ruin someone else's experience. They are doing it because it's the fastest way to get a group.

      Yes, but they don't care about ruining other people's runs either. It is all about them and what they want. I doubt that the thought they could use group finder to avoid doing that ever occurs to them...

      I have never seen anyone refusing to slow down when asked. Usually nobody asks, including myself.


      Faking is not a problem unless it's a DLC dungeon they're not capable of soloing.
    • jerj6925
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      spartaxoxo wrote: »
      The whole point of faking is to save time. They aren't doing it to ruin someone else's experience. They are doing it because it's the fastest way to get a group.

      They may not be doing it to ruin someone's game play but it does. Kind of like saying a person who cheats in a pvp game doesn't mean to hurt anyone, it's just a fast way to the top of the leader board.

      Lies are lies, no two ways about it.
    • Jaimeh
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      jerj6925 wrote: »
      spartaxoxo wrote: »
      The whole point of faking is to save time. They aren't doing it to ruin someone else's experience. They are doing it because it's the fastest way to get a group.

      They may not be doing it to ruin someone's game play but it does. Kind of like saying a person who cheats in a pvp game doesn't mean to hurt anyone, it's just a fast way to the top of the leader board.

      Lies are lies, no two ways about it.

      That's not a good comparison, one goes against TOS the other is just inconsiderate behaviour, and tbf if someone was queued as a dps but they were just light attacking wouldn't you also call them a liar?

      I don't like fake roles either, but I like it when DDs have a taunt: those are the best runs, they are really fast and effective, and if it's a good player they'll know how not to kite a lot, and they will do enough damage so the adds die quick without having stacking problems. Unfortunately most DDs who fake role don't do any of these things and then you get a messy run which is indeed not fun.
    • AvalonRanger
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      I've never seen great "fake tank" as both healer and DD role.
      They're below the average DD mostly. They're not only fake tank or healer, but also bad DD.
      My playing time Mon-Friday UTC13:00-16:00 [PC-NA] CP over2000 now.
      I have [1Tough tank] [1StamSorc-DD] [1Necro-DD] [1Real Healer]
      But, I'm Tank main player. Recently I'm doing Healer.

      2023/12/21
      By the way...Dungeon-Meshi(One of Famous Japanese fantasy story comic book) got finale...
      Good-bye "King of Monster Eater".
    • spartaxoxo
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      jerj6925 wrote: »
      spartaxoxo wrote: »
      The whole point of faking is to save time. They aren't doing it to ruin someone else's experience. They are doing it because it's the fastest way to get a group.

      They may not be doing it to ruin someone's game play but it does. Kind of like saying a person who cheats in a pvp game doesn't mean to hurt anyone, it's just a fast way to the top of the leader board.

      Lies are lies, no two ways about it.

      There is two ways about it because there's no rule against fake tanking. Whether there should be or not, all players involved are playing by the agreed upon rules, unlike the cheater in a PvP game.

      Personally, I think it's disrespectful to your team to not slot a taunt. I used to try to vote kick such players. But the vote kick was seldom successful. So I decided that I just wouldn't DPS for those folks anymore.

      If everyone who complained about fake tanking actually kicked those people from groups, and the people who don't like them were the vast majority of the playerbase in those dungeons as is claimed, there would not be a lot of fake tanks. The ones who leave group or stay in group but refuse to kick and instead complain about it later are refusing to use the tools designed to help the playerbase police the situation. And if the players decided that it was not a problem through their actions, then it's not a wonder that ZOS doesn't bother to police it either.

      The player base as a whole has validated that play style. So, now it's just one more style you may encounter in random finder. A popular one too.
      Edited by spartaxoxo on February 11, 2024 9:36PM
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