Should Wardens have a skill that makes mundane wild animals neutral?

Grizzbeorn

Yes. I would like to be able to co-exist with animals as a Warden.

amig186 wrote: »

I thought the subject in question was a skill that makes animals passive, not them being automatically passive just because you're a warden.

Yeah, the OP was asking for a skill-line.
I've always imagined it like Reputation in a Faction system; either way, something you have to work for/exert effort and time toward.

TybaltKaine

Other. (Please comment)

Just give everyone access to a Calm spell, as it has been for most of the series history.

Braffin

Other. (Please comment)

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Braffin wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Braffin wrote: »

No, wardens shouldn't be able to do so. Really doesn't fit the lore (private headcanon excluded of course).

https://en.m.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Wardens

Don't harass mundane animals and respect their territory. Then they won't attack. A warden should know that.

I don't see how it doesn't fit the lore. Wardens already effect animals' temperament by making animals attack for the aide of the warden. And if a warden needed to be in animals' territory for some reason, it's better they calm them than kill them.

Bring lore examples then.

Sure, it may be possible, that some animals aren't aggressive towards a warden, like his bear already does.

But all wildlife, all over tamriel? That's not reasonable lore-wise. They attack Wyrdesses, they attack druids and of course they also attack wardens.

It's part of these animals very nature to be predators. Wardens should respect and defend that instead of trying to change it.

What's next? Lesser undead not attacking necromancers because the latter want to farm in peace? Lol, really.

Using calm or command animal on random animals has been a part of the Elder Scrolls franchise for a long time? So, I don't really see why Wardens wouldn't be a good fit for a calm themed spell.

Like the single player games, they could make it a single target spell, I suppose.

Sure, Necromancers would be a decent fit for a turn undead themed spell.

I don't oppose a single-targeted and active calm spell, like they were present in most TES games. Warden still isn't fitting for that tho. Calm spells were always tied to the school of illusion and available for all mages. Putting this spell into the mages skill line and extend it to also affect people therefore would be more fitting imo.

But I don't want to see this sort of skill as passive. I know, it may be a farmers wet dream, but hasn't any base in lore.

Braffin

Other. (Please comment)

Anifaas wrote: »

Skipping 'mundane' enemies is already possible with shadowy disguise, unnatural movement, Faun's Lark Cladding and to an extent shadow rider.

All of the listed possibilities have a common ground tho: It's not possible to loot while using them.

Any skill invented should of course also follow this rule.

whitecrow

Yes. I would like to be able to co-exist with animals as a Warden.

It would certainly make me more inclined to play my warden.

tsaescishoeshiner

Food for thought: if you want to make friends with an animal, I wouldn't start by calling it mundane

Tryxus

Other. (Please comment)

Or maybe instead of a passive, it could be a blessing instead? Like the Voice of the Sky blessing from reading the etched tablets on the way to High Hrothgar.

Jaraal

This was a thing in EverQuest, where druids could mingle with animals that were normally KOS to other classes.

nathamarath

Other. (Please comment)

What a great idea. I usually sneak around animals in general and especially near nodes regardless my chars' races but having an ability to actively charm them would be fun. Until then one maybe could use Fauns Lark Cladding myth item. BTW: There is a goat in Alik'r -yes, that one XD- that will follow you as long as you don't leave Alik'r and don't sacrifice it to a snek.

Necrotech_Master

No. Not being attacked by weak overland creatures would be an unfair advantage.

being limited to wardens would be way too unbalanced for one

for 2 if you dont want to kill things...dont, if you run past something and it does aggro well just keep on running, eventually it will tether and deaggro

also not like any overland mob is any kind of threat

if you need a lore reason, well its still a wild animal and your intruding on its territory, it doesnt matter if you are a bosmer, a warden, or even dr. dolittle

kargen27

Other. (Please comment)

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Braffin wrote: »

No, wardens shouldn't be able to do so. Really doesn't fit the lore (private headcanon excluded of course).

https://en.m.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Wardens

Don't harass mundane animals and respect their territory. Then they won't attack. A warden should know that.

I don't see how it doesn't fit the lore. Wardens already effect animals' temperament by making animals attack for the aide of the warden. And if a warden needed to be in animals' territory for some reason, it's better they calm them than kill them.

As was pointed out earlier in the thread they do not. According to an earlier post they use memories of the aspect of an animal. Hope I got that right didn't scroll back up to look.

kargen27

Other. (Please comment)

Another concern is this would be one more thing the server has to track and we have been told some really bad changes were made to the game to try and improve performance. We don't need to add more stress to the server.

spartaxoxo

Yes. I would like to be able to co-exist with animals as a Warden.

kargen27 wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Braffin wrote: »

No, wardens shouldn't be able to do so. Really doesn't fit the lore (private headcanon excluded of course).

https://en.m.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Wardens

Don't harass mundane animals and respect their territory. Then they won't attack. A warden should know that.

I don't see how it doesn't fit the lore. Wardens already effect animals' temperament by making animals attack for the aide of the warden. And if a warden needed to be in animals' territory for some reason, it's better they calm them than kill them.

As was pointed out earlier in the thread they do not. According to an earlier post they use memories of the aspect of an animal. Hope I got that right didn't scroll back up to look.

"Wardens weave spells to cause plants and fungi to grow rapidly. They can also call animals to come to their aid, and wield frost spells to combat their foes."

"Zeht's Tears, that's a question as tall as the seas around Graven Deep. And I'll note, unrelated to dungeons or whatnot, but I couldn't help it. As I myself was curious, I looked into your question. What "everyone knows" about Wardens could fit in a two-page pamphlet. They draw their powers from the Green. They command animals, sling the frost of the north like it's cod at a High Isle fish market, and channel nature to heal wounds both fair and foul."

Wardens can literally use command animal in the lore. If they can use that, I don't see why they couldn't also use calm on one, theoretically.

ETA: those are from UESP link from above. The latter is one of the citations.


Also I'm not saying it would be a good idea necessarily from a balance or performance perspective, those are legit concerns so I'd agree it would need restraints. But from a lore perspective, it fits right in imo.

Araneae6537

Yes. I would like to be able to co-exist with animals as a Warden.

I think it should be an optional passive in a world skill line, along with shadowy rider (give DB something else befitting a murderhobo assassin)

amig186

Yes. I would like to be able to co-exist with animals as a Warden.

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

being limited to wardens would be way too unbalanced for one

for 2 if you dont want to kill things...dont, if you run past something and it does aggro well just keep on running, eventually it will tether and deaggro

also not like any overland mob is any kind of threat

if you need a lore reason, well its still a wild animal and your intruding on its territory, it doesnt matter if you are a bosmer, a warden, or even dr. dolittle

If they're not a threat anyway then why is it way too unbalanced? Running past mobs won't work when a bear or wolf pack is hanging around a chest or a node and you need to stand still right in front of them to collect it. Of course, it should be limited to overland animals since the ones in dungeons are usually possessed or controlled by something anyway.
I think every class should have a little something unique and interesting like this to stand out.

(edited for typo)

Necrotech_Master

No. Not being attacked by weak overland creatures would be an unfair advantage.

amig186 wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

being limited to wardens would be way too unbalanced for one

for 2 if you dont want to kill things...dont, if you run past something and it does aggro well just keep on running, eventually it will tether and deaggro

also not like any overland mob is any kind of threat

if you need a lore reason, well its still a wild animal and your intruding on its territory, it doesnt matter if you are a bosmer, a warden, or even dr. dolittle

If they're not a threat anyway then why is it way too unbalanced? Running past mobs won't work when a bear or wolf pack is hanging around a chest or a node and you need to stand still right in front of them to collect it. Of course, it should be limited to overland animals since the ones in dungeons are usually possessed or controlled by something anyway.
I think every class should have a little something unique and interesting like this to stand out.

(edited for typo)

they actually do become passive in some areas after you finish the quests

the grahtwood public dungeon, the area with the atronachs in south reapers march, several areas in greenshade or malabal tor, some areas of stonefalls

and i still completely disagree that something like this should be on a single class

it would be entirely unfair if 2 players were running to a chest, but 1 of them couldnt aggro the enemies near the chest, you should be forced to actually deal with those enemies

spartaxoxo

Yes. I would like to be able to co-exist with animals as a Warden.

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

it would be entirely unfair if 2 players were running to a chest, but 1 of them couldnt aggro the enemies near the chest, you should be forced to actually deal with those enemies

That already happens with stealth. Also, I don't think classes should be balanced around the occasional incidental competition for chests.

Necrotech_Master

No. Not being attacked by weak overland creatures would be an unfair advantage.

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

it would be entirely unfair if 2 players were running to a chest, but 1 of them couldnt aggro the enemies near the chest, you should be forced to actually deal with those enemies

That already happens with stealth. Also, I don't think classes should be balanced around the occasional incidental competition for chests.

i was using chest as an example: could be a node, thieves trove, chest, etc

stealth wont stop an enemy from attacking you while you are interacting with said object, you get pulled out of stealth while using those

amig186

Yes. I would like to be able to co-exist with animals as a Warden.

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

amig186 wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

being limited to wardens would be way too unbalanced for one

for 2 if you dont want to kill things...dont, if you run past something and it does aggro well just keep on running, eventually it will tether and deaggro

also not like any overland mob is any kind of threat

if you need a lore reason, well its still a wild animal and your intruding on its territory, it doesnt matter if you are a bosmer, a warden, or even dr. dolittle

If they're not a threat anyway then why is it way too unbalanced? Running past mobs won't work when a bear or wolf pack is hanging around a chest or a node and you need to stand still right in front of them to collect it. Of course, it should be limited to overland animals since the ones in dungeons are usually possessed or controlled by something anyway.
I think every class should have a little something unique and interesting like this to stand out.

(edited for typo)

they actually do become passive in some areas after you finish the quests

the grahtwood public dungeon, the area with the atronachs in south reapers march, several areas in greenshade or malabal tor, some areas of stonefalls

and i still completely disagree that something like this should be on a single class

it would be entirely unfair if 2 players were running to a chest, but 1 of them couldnt aggro the enemies near the chest, you should be forced to actually deal with those enemies

That already happens all the time, even without stealth. Two players run in, one player gets the aggro, the other gets the loot. But sure, I guess it doesn't have to be class limited, it's just one of them nice-to-haves.

spartaxoxo

Yes. I would like to be able to co-exist with animals as a Warden.

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

it would be entirely unfair if 2 players were running to a chest, but 1 of them couldnt aggro the enemies near the chest, you should be forced to actually deal with those enemies

That already happens with stealth. Also, I don't think classes should be balanced around the occasional incidental competition for chests.

i was using chest as an example: could be a node, thieves trove, chest, etc

stealth wont stop an enemy from attacking you while you are interacting with said object, you get pulled out of stealth while using those

I was referring to chest as an example as well. You do, but if you sneak up to them, quite often you can just take it without them detecting you. I have gotten stuff in that manner plenty of times. I have also beat people to chests by stealthing through delves. And then even though I had to fight, others were so far behind they didn't stand a chance of catching up or even noticing I had taken it.

Sometimes I'll get the node and then get hit right after a successful loot.

This is actually one of the flavor things that make exploring on my sneak Khajiit fun, wouldn't care if something similar was on another class as well. I would agree it shouldn't be passive but I'm sure there are ways to add restrictions to produce similar results as stealth

Necrotech_Master

No. Not being attacked by weak overland creatures would be an unfair advantage.

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

it would be entirely unfair if 2 players were running to a chest, but 1 of them couldnt aggro the enemies near the chest, you should be forced to actually deal with those enemies

That already happens with stealth. Also, I don't think classes should be balanced around the occasional incidental competition for chests.

i was using chest as an example: could be a node, thieves trove, chest, etc

stealth wont stop an enemy from attacking you while you are interacting with said object, you get pulled out of stealth while using those

I was referring to chest as an example as well. You do, but if you sneak up to them, quite often you can just take it without them detecting you. I have gotten stuff in that manner plenty of times. I have also beat people to chests by stealthing through delves. And then even though I had to fight, others were so far behind they didn't stand a chance of catching up or even noticing I had taken it.

Sometimes I'll get the node and then get hit right after a successful loot.

This is actually one of the flavor things that make exploring on my sneak Khajiit fun, wouldn't care if something similar was on another class as well. I would agree it shouldn't be passive but I'm sure there are ways to add restrictions to produce similar results as stealth

they already kind of have something like that, its the passive i think in the dark brotherhood tree which reduces your aggro radius by 50% when riding a mount

i dont know why that is in the dark brotherhood skill line honestly, it would make more sense to reduce aggro range by 50% when stealthed, and is something anyone could use

Billium813

Other. (Please comment)

If Wardens want to burn one of their 12 Passives on an incredibly niche thing like "When you cast an Animal Companions ability while you are in combat, pacify all woodland creatures", then whatever. It sounds great for RP, it sounds ridiculous for the other 99% of the game.

Nestor

Yes. I would like to be able to co-exist with animals as a Warden.

Animals do not attack NPCs in the game other than a few specific instances. Why are we picked on?

We should have a Passive, as part of maybe the World Skill line that allows animals to be passive.