What is holding ESO back from being the GOAT MMO for YOU?

TaSheen

AzuraFan wrote: »

TaSheen wrote: »

It's really weird that you mentioned that. Daughter just got off the WoW pts (or whatever it's called there) and the upcoming patch has NPCs you can use to fill out a full group for instances/dungeons. I'm not going to quote the whole thing but she was VERY impressed - said it was just like running with real people....

So maybe eventually the companion thing might get expanded, I don't know. I still don't like sidekicks so it won't matter to me!

Hopefully the WoW NPCs will be more useful than ESO's.

I don't see companions as sidekicks. I see them as a way to complete group content solo, or at least that's the way I was hoping to use them. I don't use companions in single-player games. I never take Lydia (or anyone else) in Skyrim, etc., because there's no group content (thank goodness!). For me, they're a way to fill group slots. Guild Wars' NPCs didn't have personalities or anything. But they could fight and survive on par with an average player, unlike Mirri, Bastian, and company.

They're all "sidekicks" to me. I can't stand having to mess about with someone else (ANYONE else) in a game any more. After years in WoW and RIFT, running with family guilds, doing instances over and over..... Not happening ever again. And even if those NPCs are "more like real people" - um. I'll just pass thanks.

M0ntie

BUGS. Failure to listen to and fix issues reported on PTS. These are enough to drive me away from the game, and I've seen plenty of people leave because of it.
Here are examples:
The main questline of the latest release is STILL bugged, even though the issue was reported on the PTS.
The ability to leave an instance while in combat. This was very strongly objected to in PTS, was released into production anyway, was taken out (original functionality restored), then put back into production again.
vSE was seriously bugged on release (frost cages prioritising tanks) and it took AGES for it to get fixed. The targetting on unlevel ground is still dodgy.

Also, the character costumes and outfits are very dull. Hip flaps are ugly, yet outfits still have them. No decent cloth physics. I'd love it if robes flowed and we could have capes.

Lags

Cooperharley wrote: »

DISCLAIMER: ESO is probably my favorite game I've played, truthfully. Definitely my favorite MMO. Is it perfect? Of course not! No game is. What I'm curious about here is what YOU guys believe to be holding ESO back from being the greatest. This is for constructive criticism for ZOS and I personally GREATLY appreciate all the work that they constantly put into the game!

If you think ESO is perfect, you wouldn't change a thing, etc. then this poll is not for you Feel free to chime in obviously! Free speech of course, but mainly just curious what the playerbase thinks! Cheers and Happy Saturday!

all of the above. It had all the potential in the world but they have just chosen the wrong direction. The terrible rewards. The terrible lack of incentive for people to do better. The terrible communication. The terrible performance. The lack of pvp updates. The constant tearing down of endgame players/players that want to put in effort (such as nerfing animation canceling, cast times on ultimates, the slowing down of combat, or any of the other terrible combat changes theyve made over the last few years).

This game could have been amazing. It was amazing. They could have brought up low effort players, like with the arcanist and oakensoul, without tearing down higher effort players. They could have given players incentive to improve, and rewarded them properly for doing so. Instead they've chosen to hard target a revolving door of casuals, when eso was already one of, if not the most, casual friendly larger mmo to exist. And they've chased away so many community members because of it. Guild leaders, content creators, addon creators, event organizers, website creators, players who cared and wanted to add to the community. In favor of players who will play for a couple months and then leave. Its just sad all around.

Amottica

Which MMORPG is GOAT is a matter of opinion or what exactly is being measured.

Case in point, ESO is my favorite game. We have a great combat system that breaks away from that of other major MMORPGs and with one character we can play any role though some classes do excel at some roles better than others. Some of the posts acknowledged they voted for what was their favorite game which is not the same as it being a GOAT.

However, if we are going to be neutral about this then WoW is the GOAT of P2P/B2P hands down. While it has fewer players than it used to, it has had more players at it's peak than any MMORPG has ever accomplished and it is doubtful another game will come close. It has also had longevity as a major MMORPG that no other has had.

rpa

Seriously ESO is not the Goat MMO, I can't play a goat or even a toaster. Its not greatest game of all time because MMO genre is not the greatest. Better games in other genres (other than pure sandbox or PvP games) tend to have limited viable gameplay. ESO has plenty of annoying flaws, most of will never be fixed no matter how much players nag for it. I have no problem dropping ESO for half year+ to give a potentially good replacement a proper try. Too bad other available MMOs I have tried this far suck even more. If I knew a better one I would be playing that.
Edit: about WoW, I did not try it when it was supposedly good. I've given it an extended try several times (I think first was during Draenor but I started with base with included up to Pandalandia) and it was not better and every time it's been worse than before. What a waste of extensive game world.

Melilotta

Nothing! Of course it's not perfect, since nothing is, but still it's the greatest of all time MMORPG for me, just as the Elder Scrolls are the greatest game series for me.
Sure, it has its share of issues, but compared to other games, none other that I tried has been so absorbing and so much fun for me.

IZZEFlameLash

I'd actually say non-game part is the problem. I'd like to see the game managed by people that actually play their own games and other competing games instead of looking at spreadsheets without proper context understanding.

Rowjoh

SilverBride wrote: »

ESO has not been "dumbed down". It was brought to a level that most players find reasonble and enjoyable. Struggling to do everything is not something most players want.

As far as The Endless Archive, I have not once mentioned "the best rewards". I don't even know what "the best rewards" would be. I just want a few furnishings, which I can easly earn the Archival Fortunes for by just doing Arc 1 and not even having to beat Tho'at.

But mostly I want to be able to enjoy more than just Arc 1 up to but not past that boss.

Everyone knows ESO has been dumbed down to a ridiculously easy level over the years. Its so easy, players can level a new character to max just wearing underwear and without a weapon. I did it once

I'm not advocating that 'struggling to do everything' is right either, but in a massive game where there's precious little challenging content after a good balance had once existed, clearly makes ESO a game firmly tailored for the casual masses by definition.

And as soon as something a little more challenging such as Endless Archive comes along, the complaints typically flood in!

Elsonso

SilverBride wrote: »

ESO has not been "dumbed down". It was brought to a level that most players find reasonble and enjoyable. Struggling to do everything is not something most players want.

Rowjoh wrote: »

Everyone knows ESO has been dumbed down to a ridiculously easy level over the years. Its so easy, players can level a new character to max just wearing underwear and without a weapon. I did it once

ESO has been made easier over the years. I think this is because there aren't enough people playing the game that can get to max level in underwear and no weapon.

My assumption is that a lot, if not all, of the people who talk about how easy ESO is, how everything is a one shot or face roll, would not be saying this if they were a new player in the first week of the game with no prior knowledge of the game. I get that experienced players have an easier time with all parts of the game. This is neither surprising nor unexpected. I would be more surprised if they didn't.

In any case, I think that difficulty tends to work against GOAT. A GOAT MMO will be just hard enough where the challenge is rewarding, yet not so hard that people leave, either because it is too challenging, or because the game is beaten and presents no more challenge.

Rowjoh

Elsonso wrote: »

In any case, I think that difficulty tends to work against GOAT. A GOAT MMO will be just hard enough where the challenge is rewarding, yet not so hard that people leave, either because it is too challenging, or because the game is beaten and presents no more challenge.

Spot on. ESO was in this space for a couple of years before the balance was irreparably plunged head first into the casual gamer category.

Amottica

Elsonso wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

ESO has not been "dumbed down". It was brought to a level that most players find reasonble and enjoyable. Struggling to do everything is not something most players want.

Rowjoh wrote: »

Everyone knows ESO has been dumbed down to a ridiculously easy level over the years. Its so easy, players can level a new character to max just wearing underwear and without a weapon. I did it once

ESO has been made easier over the years. I think this is because there aren't enough people playing the game that can get to max level in underwear and no weapon.

My assumption is that a lot, if not all, of the people who talk about how easy ESO is, how everything is a one shot or face roll, would not be saying this if they were a new player in the first week of the game with no prior knowledge of the game. I get that experienced players have an easier time with all parts of the game. This is neither surprising nor unexpected. I would be more surprised if they didn't.

In any case, I think that difficulty tends to work against GOAT. A GOAT MMO will be just hard enough where the challenge is rewarding, yet not so hard that people leave, either because it is too challenging, or because the game is beaten and presents no more challenge.

It has only been due to power creep that aspects of the game have become easier. Our characters are significantly more powerful than they were a few years ago. I understand this power creep has been ramping up for years before I started playing the game.

Beyond that, some changes have made the game even more challenging. The change made long ago to buff LAs and nerf heavies, instead of their original scaling being directly related to how long one channels the basic attack, did a lot to increase the skill curve. I have heard this from top raiders who understand how this change had a negative impact on the game even though they themselves have mastered it. That is very much the opposite of being dumbed down.

Rowjoh

Amottica wrote: »

Beyond that, some changes have made the game even more challenging. The change made long ago to buff LAs and nerf heavies, instead of their original scaling being directly related to how long one channels the basic attack, did a lot to increase the skill curve. I have heard this from top raiders who understand how this change had a negative impact on the game even though they themselves have mastered it. That is very much the opposite of being dumbed down.

Not at all.

Because the part of the game you are describing is miniscule in comparison to the multitude of humongous continents of easy peasy dumbed down gameplay and content.

How else do you think a level 10 player in basic gear can successfully solo every single quest in the game, world bosses, public dungeons and all the base game normal dungeons blindfold, yet as soon as content is released with a modicum of challenge such as Endless Archive, there's an outcry and it inevitably gets dumbed down in line with pretty much everything else, in order to appease the casual crowd.

True that there has been a lot of balancing and re-balancing over the years, most of it being ridiculously over powered or nerfed to extinction. There was even a time when ZoS had the balance in a good place - something for everyone in fair proportion - but the fact remains that the net result is that ESO now caters to the casual gamer in all but a small percentage of actually challenging content.

Pixiepumpkin

• class identity similar to how class identiy works in world of warcraft, GW2 or swtor
• weapon identity simialr to how weapons feel in new world
• combat that feels more connected/visceral similar to how new world plays
• harvesting that is more engaging similar to how harvesting works in new world (the actual gather animation/mechanic)
• less focus on the crown store and more focus into putting rewards in game
• housing that has more function. I think ESO housing is already top notch, but I'd like to see even more function added and or more skins for the available functions (more craft station styles that are not locked behind a very expensive paywall) and some kind of game mechanics tied to housing. Sleep buffs etc. More interactive furniture like being able to use nightstands as storage, wardrobes and chests for storage.

Overall I think the team creating this game are doing good, but for myself the things I listed above would crank it up a massive notch for me.

BXR_Lonestar

Honestly, I already think it is the best MMO out there, but if I have one complaint, its the combat system. Not a big fan of the DPS paradigm, as there really truly only one way to make an endgame viable DPS character, regardless of what role you play, your mostly just running through your rotation (even tanks and healers have skills they have to rotate through to keep good uptimes on group buffs), and the fact that you have to light attack weave at a high level in order to get what is considered "decent" dps - now around 70-80k dps.

I would love to see them undo hybrdization so that there is some diversity between stam/mag builds, and go back to the old method of stats/damage scaling so that max stats builds are viable again. I felt like there was a larger variety of builds that were endgame viable when the game was set up this way.

Similar complaint about support builds - there is really only one way to build a support character, and that is to build for offense. There is absolutely no reason why to take defensive/survivability buffs in PVE because of the presence of one-shot mechanics. I wish healer ultimates and some tank ultimates would allow a veteran groups who knew what mechanics were coming to bypass those mechanics through well-timed use of their ultimates, allowing them or their group to survive what would otherwise be a OHK mechanic.

Outside of that, its an Elder Scrolls game. Not quite the depth of Skyrim or Oblivion, but with it being an MMO, I think it would be difficult to expect that kind of depth in the world, but what it lacks in depth, it makes up with scale - we literally get to go basically everywhere in the Elder Scrolls Universe. So In spite of my complaints about the combat system, I still think the game is overall very good.

Drinks_from_Ponds

I already really enjoy the game, the community is nice, there is a lot to do with crafting, pve, pvp, etc. As others have said there are things that need to be addressed like pvp, bugs that go unfixed and not being able to earn items from achievements and everything behind the crown store. I buy a ton of stuff from the crown store already, but it would be really cool to work towards achievments and get items that way too.

I wish fishing had things you could add on like clothing, bobbers you can buy etc like in WoW that would change the look of your hook, or even different fishing poles we could equip. It would be fun to have tournaments too like they have in WoW.

One other thing I think would be fun to have is Mythic+ like we have with Endless Archive but a group instance where you could queue up with 4 people and test your abilities.

I left WoW because of the toxic community and how the game just became about gear score and the never ending vertical ceiling, but those few things I wish could be carried over here especially with fishing.

pecheckler

Need more PvP content. And more players to play with and against. Merging Xbox and PS would help in that regards. Shorter queue times for battlegrounds and an always populated Cyrodiil!

AzuraFan

Elsonso wrote: »

My assumption is that a lot, if not all, of the people who talk about how easy ESO is, how everything is a one shot or face roll, would not be saying this if they were a new player in the first week of the game with no prior knowledge of the game. I get that experienced players have an easier time with all parts of the game. This is neither surprising nor unexpected. I would be more surprised if they didn't.

I play in overland/delves/public dungeons 99% of the time, and I rarely see players one shotting anything or face rolling. And they're not newbies - they have 1000+ CP. I have 1800+ CP and I rarely one shot anything. I can kill things quickly, but rarely one shot.

I also often do the "Kill X World Bosses" weekly endeavor, and so I show up to the usual bosses where a crowd of players is waiting for the boss to spawn. The boss spawns, and if everyone was doing 100k DPS, it would burn down within 5 seconds. I've seen that happen, but rarely. There are times where it's been up for a good 20 seconds or so. With 5+ players there.

Without data, it's difficult to know what percentage of the playerbase finds ESO too easy. But only a small percentage of the playerbase is on the forums, and then a percentage of those on the forums talk about the game being too easy. So probably less than 50% (probably lower than that) find the game easy. But only ZOS knows.

The reason I could be wrong about it being a small number is that ZOS seems to be releasing more and more content targeted to gamers who do find the game too easy. They'd be silly to do that if it's not a large percentage of the player base. So I don't know. Only ZOS knows.

ldzlcs065

Class change token, Auction House, Official gold-crown exchange

boi_anachronism_

Sarannah wrote: »

Two things really:
1: The dps gap. (Shouldn't exist)
2: The way dungeons are broken/abuse of other players. (fake roles/speedrunning/etc)

My guy, most of the major dps gap, the 60k 110k range is skill based not gear based. You can legitimately break 90k with overland and crafted gear and that is a fact. Everything in life has that. A casual football player who does pickup games will not be on par with a professional who dedicated hours of training weekly to it, no? I woud challange you to name a single game that doesnt have a skill gap in one way or another. Even skyrim has that.

Ezhh wrote: »

Bugs (especially ones mentioned during PTS) not getting fixed very quickly.

Class and set-imbalances. I know arcanist is the new thing, but does it really have to be overtuned to the point that it's the only parse DD most trial groups will accept? This makes the game more and more monotonous. Did most class sets from EA really need to be completely worthless? Why can't completely un-used sets be given a buff so they might not be terrible?

Monetization. I'd love to do more with housing, but not when new houses cost more than I can buy a new game for.

Its not. Dks and templars (contrary to popular belief they still hit 130k at the high end and have the best execute in the game by a mile) are still absolutely used. This is coming from experience of high level content with raiding.

Amottica

Rowjoh wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

Beyond that, some changes have made the game even more challenging. The change made long ago to buff LAs and nerf heavies, instead of their original scaling being directly related to how long one channels the basic attack, did a lot to increase the skill curve. I have heard this from top raiders who understand how this change had a negative impact on the game even though they themselves have mastered it. That is very much the opposite of being dumbed down.

Not at all.

Because the part of the game you are describing is miniscule in comparison to the multitude of humongous continents of easy peasy dumbed down gameplay and content.

How else do you think a level 10 player in basic gear can successfully solo every single quest in the game, world bosses, public dungeons and all the base game normal dungeons blindfold, yet as soon as content is released with a modicum of challenge such as Endless Archive, there's an outcry and it inevitably gets dumbed down in line with pretty much everything else, in order to appease the casual crowd.

True that there has been a lot of balancing and re-balancing over the years, most of it being ridiculously over powered or nerfed to extinction. There was even a time when ZoS had the balance in a good place - something for everyone in fair proportion - but the fact remains that the net result is that ESO now caters to the casual gamer in all but a small percentage of actually challenging content.

We are level 10 for what, 30 seconds? One can level up to 50 in a day. A long weekend if we go slow. So the difficulty at level 10 is insignificant.

It is at level 50 with some CP is where we play 99% of our time. Speaking of normal base game dungeons is also not important as they were intended to be easy and always have been.

With vet, and especially vet HM content it is the power creep that has been the issue. I stated that in the quoted post but it seems to have been edited out. A great example is the older trials on vet and even vet HM are easier than many of the newer trials because the newer trials were designed for the current power level and the older trials are not adjusted which makes them easier. That power creep is also why older vet dungeons are easier.

So yes, my comment when looked at in full, was spot on and power creep has been the major force in why older content is easier, not that things have been dumbed down.

wolfie1.0.

The lack of character defining moments and game altering changes that are character and character choice specific.

boi_anachronism_

Amottica wrote: »

Rowjoh wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

Beyond that, some changes have made the game even more challenging. The change made long ago to buff LAs and nerf heavies, instead of their original scaling being directly related to how long one channels the basic attack, did a lot to increase the skill curve. I have heard this from top raiders who understand how this change had a negative impact on the game even though they themselves have mastered it. That is very much the opposite of being dumbed down.

Not at all.

Because the part of the game you are describing is miniscule in comparison to the multitude of humongous continents of easy peasy dumbed down gameplay and content.

How else do you think a level 10 player in basic gear can successfully solo every single quest in the game, world bosses, public dungeons and all the base game normal dungeons blindfold, yet as soon as content is released with a modicum of challenge such as Endless Archive, there's an outcry and it inevitably gets dumbed down in line with pretty much everything else, in order to appease the casual crowd.

True that there has been a lot of balancing and re-balancing over the years, most of it being ridiculously over powered or nerfed to extinction. There was even a time when ZoS had the balance in a good place - something for everyone in fair proportion - but the fact remains that the net result is that ESO now caters to the casual gamer in all but a small percentage of actually challenging content.

We are level 10 for what, 30 seconds? One can level up to 50 in a day. A long weekend if we go slow. So the difficulty at level 10 is insignificant.

It is at level 50 with some CP is where we play 99% of our time. Speaking of normal base game dungeons is also not important as they were intended to be easy and always have been.

With vet, and especially vet HM content it is the power creep that has been the issue. I stated that in the quoted post but it seems to have been edited out. A great example is the older trials on vet and even vet HM are easier than many of the newer trials because the newer trials were designed for the current power level and the older trials are not adjusted which makes them easier. That power creep is also why older vet dungeons are easier.

So yes, my comment when looked at in full, was spot on and power creep has been the major force in why older content is easier, not that things have been dumbed down.

Something to remember is that power creep isnt one sided. With the advent of oakenbuilds an average player that does any trials easily knocks out the 40k mark. Even in vet dlcs dungeons the major issue I see even on the 200cp-300cp players is no knowledge of mechs not the lack of required burn. A 21k burn on a 3m (about 42k for a 21m) is more then enough for everything. In addition in u35 it was also the high end players who complained to a great degree that the nerf of both heavy and light attacks impacted newer players more then anyone. We know that we have the skill and knowledge to find something else and work around it, they dont.

As for power creep that exists in a fashion in everything. Example: in climbing this is why in the 1970s a 5.12 climb was professional and top of the game and now folks who train a few hrs a week can achieve it if the training is targeted and efficient. The top is now 5.15 They have better gear, better resources and more specialized facilities to train in. That goes for any sport otherwise Olympic records would remain the same year in year out. Some People will always strive for the highest level. What we largely have is both a skill and knowledge creep, not a completely raw damage creep alone that exists in a vacuum as people seem to believe. Its a 10 year old game, some folks will inevitably master it. Skill wise, knowledge wise, and mechanic wise.

There are two other major factors one being the adjustments to skills and the second is the introduction of specific sets, especially high skill sets that allow for this. Bahsei, coral, kinras, these players have the skills that have been honed to use them well. Even dungeon sets like nirn, which an average player has access to without trial gear and even overland ones that contribute. Crafted gear and overland can net you a 90k parse with skill factually, we are talking flat stat sets here. I can hit above 45k on a 3m in orders wrath and mother sorrow and 39-40k ish without cp. That is skill creep. Knowledge is also something average players dont have if they dont go looking for it. Experienced players have spent hrs pouring over number to figure out how to buff their groups properly. It doesnt just happen. We talk about the "back in the day" power standards but the fact is that even then there was a significant gap. Average players were not hitting 40k. They were in the 20-25k range with high end around 35-40k. Keep in mind this is long before the 21m. So translated you are looking at 40-50k vs 70k-80k buffed, thats a huge difference.

The other largely ignored part is support sets. They create the vast majority of the content damage creep. Remember 21m dummies represent the optimal buffs you can get not the average, that is largely support. High level players have the knowledge to buff our groups properly and also the skill to proc them. We curate what our supports need to create that.

"Power creep" is inevitable from skill. knowledge creep is the fault of zos for not creating better in games guides and tutorials. Examples being explanations of 5 piece sets, stats like penetration, and tool tips which are in many cases very complicated.

As far as content for higher level players? Looking at the older vs newer trials. The new ones like vdsr and and vse actually discourage high burn for all but the most advanced players. They hinge on more advancd mechanics. They have little to no dps checks. Like mol back in the day you can play the mechanics indefinitely until you beat the boss. If you over burn the twins in dsr for example you send them into bash mechanics with atros out that usually end in a wipe, reef guardian is the same and you can send as many players as you want down. Even bahsei is like that. It is only rghm that was actually designed for real power creep. In fact it is many of the older trials that have hard checks. Hof has ramping damage in execute for example. Vas has a timed enrage mechanic for felms and lothis. Even hel ra hm i atill see more adance players fail at because of mechanics and how hard the boss hits tanks. Vaahm also requires good burn for final as well as decent skill for chain lightning mechanics. Most of the very new content like ea and world bosses are designed to encourage group play. Even at my level i can not solo them. Ea I typically get to about arc 5 by myself. I typically go in with a friend.

Yes hard modes will be harder because they move with the times and are designed for the top end but none of them are impossible at 80k dps except rockgrove. Trial hardmodes are designed for the highest level players, thats the point of them, same as all hardmodes were back in the days. The same with dungeons and as i already mentioned no vet dlc requires insanely high damage, just average damage is fine as long as you have good mechanical knowledge. Thats what they are moving towards.

kargen27

ESO is still the best MMO going but it was much better before we had account wide achievements forced on us.

_Zathras_

1. Monetization. Outside of an online game from the Asian continent, ESO has the worst monetization for a MMO in western games. AND the feature creep of what is offered in the store, vs what is NOT earnable in-game just increases over the years.

I always go back to how they originally marketed ESO. Matt really sold us on it being DAoC2, and there wouldn't be a Cash Shop. And now here it is.

2. Communication, or lack thereof. This has been an ongoing sore point for years, so why dig into it yet again. Expectations = zero at this point.

ESO has a lot going for it. However, over the years the cons have tipped that scale so far that literally any other gaming choice is a better one. Supporting ESO is supporting a gambling-centric, macrotransaction-centric gaming model. I say macro, because when you are spending $120+ for an in-game house, and $50+ for cosmetics, there's nothing micro about that.

3. Lack of an Auction House. I mean, come on. This isn't 2003 DAoC. Let's move that clock forward like the rest of the world has.

I used to refer all my friends to ESO. I'd even set them up in-game if they started to play. Now no one will touch it, so..

Rowjoh

Amottica wrote: »

We are level 10 for what, 30 seconds? One can level up to 50 in a day. A long weekend if we go slow. So the difficulty at level 10 is insignificant.

It is at level 50 with some CP is where we play 99% of our time. Speaking of normal base game dungeons is also not important as they were intended to be easy and always have been.

With vet, and especially vet HM content it is the power creep that has been the issue. I stated that in the quoted post but it seems to have been edited out. A great example is the older trials on vet and even vet HM are easier than many of the newer trials because the newer trials were designed for the current power level and the older trials are not adjusted which makes them easier. That power creep is also why older vet dungeons are easier.

So yes, my comment when looked at in full, was spot on and power creep has been the major force in why older content is easier, not that things have been dumbed down.

Not so spot on I'm afraid.

Power creep was addressed a long time ago when it got out of hand, so its got very little to do with it, and everything to do with the game being continuously adjusted down and made suitable for casual gamers. The main components of the game have been so dumbed down, from the skills, passives, class passives and overall stat adjustment to the introduction of mythic items such as Oakensoul and the Velothi Ur-Mage's Amulet etc that casual gamers can win blindfold with one hand tied behind their back

There's no jeopardy except from the small percentage of challenging content that remains, but even most of that has been nerfed to some extent, and it wont be long until Endless Archive suffers the same fate.

New/no cp players can beat world bosses, public dungeon bosses etc and succeed at any quest as early as level 10 which is about 20 minutes in by the way, because everything is so ridiculously easy. When we get to max level (possible in about 20 hours) you can slot a mythic and become a casual God!

In what other MMO worth its salt can you do that ? !

Warhawke_80

Other

I'm not going to complain so much of difficulty, but of consequences...ESO lacks the consequences of a TES game this is especially apparent in things like Vampirism (It's just a skin and some buffs) Lynchtrophy (same) Cursed items (there are none) Nocturnal dangers (again there are none) the game is a safe happy sappy playpen.

IT IS NOT TAMRIEL

At least not the Tamriel I grew up with.


So what do I want?
I want to find a cursed sword in a deleve that has a tendency to randomly make me kill people I like which makes me go on a world spanning quest to get rid of the damned thing.

I want to be attacked by werewolves at night while riding through a relatively "safe" part of a forest. I want those Werewolves not to be there a week later because of reasons

I want to make a bargain with a Pirate ghost that only appears one when the moon is in a certain phase.


I want a living world full of danger and dynamism and that dosen't mean I have to study my spreadsheet to figure out the point spread and to anyone that says that's not a mmo Good because anything less is BORING


Okay....glad I could get that off my chest.

TaSheen

I don't have a dichotomy problem here. I started playing TES in 1994 when Arena released. I haven't missed a single player title since, and my hours of play over the series is.... massive - in the neighborhood of 100k hours over the series lifetime.

ESO is at least as much fun as Oblivion. The earlier games were "victims" of their time - games were in their toddler stages when Arena, Daggerfall, and Morrowind were released. Oblivion was a fairly major upgrade - I loved the more intricate questing though I was not happy about the .... um.... potato-head characters. The world itself though was quite well done - and the horses were certainly much better than anything ESO has offered.

Skyrim remains my real love in this series, because it can be whatever I want it to be (player made addons....) ESO can never be that - because ESO is what its DEVS want it to be. Still, ESO is fun and a very expansive fully realized world some centuries removed in the past of the other games.

It's.... a game out of time, for me. The 2nd Era had little info published - and that's why the devs chose that Era for this game. Almost nothing that happens "here" can affect the "earlier but later" games. Which is why some things people really want just aren't happening - without a dragon break.... which I certainly hope won't happen.....

[Sorry - I HATE typos.... *sigh*]

IZZEFlameLash

I don't think ESO is made easy necessarily. You can clearly see that once you've done random normals enough times with real completely random people. This issue is made super apparent with any DLC dungeons with complete random groupies. You see plenty of people not learning to bash-interrupt, not engage in mechanics, not doing enough DPS to the point that your tank build is doing more DPS and etc. And often times, the wipe is a thing because if you are on DPS, bosses still hit hard enough for you to unable to tank the hit for long. If you are on a tank, you are basically spending longer on a fight and people start leaving.

Top PvE players often forget that they are running with a group of fellow competent players and that creates additional level of power creep beyond new trial sets with coordinated group composition. Of course, a group composed of PvE guildmates will roll over everything old contents. While complete random groups will depend on the RNG on the groupmates where pendulum swings between 'impossible to complete' to 'push over'.

Araneae6537

Story/dialogue choices, ways to develop your character through the game’s stories and interactions with other characters, choices that have repercussions within your own personal story. Many MMOs lack this entirely. ESO has some. SWTOR was amazing in this regard; I enjoyed the regional stories but what were really amazing were the class stories, that you were given hard choices sometimes, and you could play against type and this would be recognized by other characters in your story. This is what really engages me with the stories in a game and makes me want to replay stories with different characters.

But in all other important ways, ESO is GOAT for me.

Poss

Definitely the PvP for me. When the game first came out, their style of player vs player was absolutely genius. I’d never played anything like it, and the fact it fit into the lore too. I’m still blown away by the concept of Cyrodiil. Then it just got forgotten about. It gets a lil aesthetic update here and there (a suspect tree removed from the grounds of Glademist still tickles me 😂) and the odd set or two thrown into the works but that’s it. Very sad.

I’m not gonna start listing all the issues with PvP as this isn’t the thread but we all know what’s wrong with it. But my point is, Cyrodiil has ALWAYS had the potential to be the best kind of PvP of any game. We’re talking Fortnite level of popularity if it just had a little bit of love and attention.