Veteran may be a bit too harsh

Veakoth

ok so veteran rank lvl 1 - lvl 2
My friend and i are dedicated at playing our templar and dk and we are finding the content quite hard and challenging which i like. I suspect a lot of other won't since it seems very nasty to solo but the difficulty isn't the problem its perfect.
the real problem is every mob seems to give 42 xp and quests give 1.5k exp and the xp required at veteran rank 1 is 425k, this took the entirety of quests in glenumbra and stros m'kai to do as well as finding every single point of interest. The time it took us to get 1 lvl in veteran we made approx 25 levels in normal. It feels as though we are required to do absolutely every quest and point of interest in both aldmeri dominion and daggerfall to get enough experience to level our chars to rank 10 vet.
that's a heck of a lot of quests with no option or relief from grinding which a lot of players find relaxing when back and forth gets to be tedious, it also removes any motivation to fight the mobs or farm for loot.
the xp system punishes us for having 3 or more in a team while we level from 1-50 and it punishes us for having to few when we level from vet 1 - 10, thats how it feels to me atm, other ppl can make their decision.

in short, were being pigeon holed into doing not only a lot of quests but pretty much every single quest and what seems to require a group to do giving us zero alternatives to level

Gierolf_Whitecoatb16_ESO

no its not too hard, your trying to level too fast. slow the F down. Games not even officialy out yet and your already trying to hit end game. go roll new toons and take your time. actually listen to the quest givers. go enjoy a dungeon or two, or ten, or twenty. go blast people in pvp. dont complain that its taking you forver to level as Im sure that Vetran levels are seperate from your 1-50 for a reason.

Kybotica

I agree with the previous poster. This game isn't designed to be an easy rush to cap MMO. You're missing out on half the game by skipping all the quest content. There is no possible way you guys have even bothered to read the dialog in this game's questing. That makes me sad. Try to slow it down, enjoy the game. Ignoring content in order to rush to endgame will result in you mising the point, and also in you having far fewer people to play with. Well, fewer at least for a week or so.

Dixa

Veakoth wrote: »

ok so veteran rank lvl 1 - lvl 2
My friend and i are dedicated at playing our templar and dk and we are finding the content quite hard and challenging which i like. I suspect a lot of other won't since it seems very nasty to solo but the difficulty isn't the problem its perfect.
the real problem is every mob seems to give 42 xp and quests give 1.5k exp and the xp required at veteran rank 1 is 425k, this took the entirety of quests in glenumbra and stros m'kai to do as well as finding every single point of interest. The time it took us to get 1 lvl in veteran we made approx 25 levels in normal. It feels as though we are required to do absolutely every quest and point of interest in both aldmeri dominion and daggerfall to get enough experience to level our chars to rank 10 vet.
that's a heck of a lot of quests with no option or relief from grinding which a lot of players find relaxing when back and forth gets to be tedious, it also removes any motivation to fight the mobs or farm for loot.
the xp system punishes us for having 3 or more in a team while we level from 1-50 and it punishes us for having to few when we level from vet 1 - 10, thats how it feels to me atm, other ppl can make their decision.

in short, were being pigeon holed into doing not only a lot of quests but pretty much every single quest and what seems to require a group to do giving us zero alternatives to level

first world problems and all.

you still have two factions worth of not just quests, but SKYSHARDS. veteran ranks don't get you another skill point, just more stats.

it's time for you to realize this is not wow. this is not a wow-type mmorpg where rushing to 50 nets you any real advantages. with no global ah, there is no economic advantage. you won't see an advantage over other players in pvp until you start to get higher vr ranked gear.

there are over 300 skill point to be had and my money bets you guys probably only have 80. there are over 120 possible from your first faction alone.

Grigs

Nobody should be telling the OP how to play his game. The game was designed to "play your own way" If you are forced to group or grind, that is not much choice. Freedom to play your way means I can solo or group or both. I can grind or slow motion level. I can skip or jump. If end game is only doable in group, that is not freedom.

edit: Thank you for the heads up OP.

Veakoth

I'm sitting on nearly 10 skills i cant use because i have everything I need and a lot of stuff i don't. I don't know what i have to say to try to make you guys understand that leveling in veteran mode will kill the experience of a lot of players who don't like the leveling before vet.

You guys preach play the game the way you want then you criticize speed levelers, it's naive, hypocritical and rude.
you say the game isn't designed to be rushed to cap, this may come as news but it is, they want us to do what we want, I did and i enjoyed it.

The whole point of the opening post was to inform you that your in for a shock and you need to prepare with your friends to do vet levels in groups and not solo. I also wanted people to understand there will be solo people waiting around spamming zone chat for group invites and being unable to do anything till they get one.

Anyway you don't have to listen, just get to 50 and see for yourself, i'm done trying to warn ppl and getting told off for it.

xFusionx

I can't comment on the veteran ranks, I only have a lvl20 character right now, but I do agree with the OP. This game is designed to play as you want in almost every-way from designing the look of your character, to speccing out your build, to crafting and PvP. That's why it's an awesome game and why so many of us like it.

Why anyone would believe their particular play-style is the best and try telling someone else how to play the game is beyond me. Micro-manage your experience, not someone else's.

Hanokihs

What you do is your preference, nobody should really be arguing that. But TES in general is a series of games that focuses more on easy-going exploration with a few challenges in-between. Grinding and speed-leveling are fine, but the devs put a lot of work into giving the game more of a heart and feel, which is why you get really bored/annoyed really fast if you go a speedy route. It probably DOES seem very punishing, because it's not the experience the game is largely set up for. ESO is quite story-driven like all the other Elder Scrolls games, and ideally, the "perfect" play style they have in mind would be somewhere midway between the two hemispheres of "rush" and "lollygag."

You know: Play hard enough to not fall behind and get slaughtered when you wander into a new area, but play easy enough to still be interested in everything, and find at least a little challenge somewhere.

LonePirate

Veakoth wrote: »

the real problem is every mob seems to give 42 xp and quests give 1.5k exp and the xp required at veteran rank 1 is 425k, this took the entirety of quests in glenumbra and stros m'kai to do as well as finding every single point of interest. The time it took us to get 1 lvl in veteran we made approx 25 levels in normal. It feels as though we are required to do absolutely every quest and point of interest in both aldmeri dominion and daggerfall to get enough experience to level our chars to rank 10 vet.

Oh the horrors of having to play the game the way it was designed! How truly awful it must be to live in a world like that </sarcasm>

I don't think it is a coincidence that there are 10 Veteran levels and there are 10 major zones in the two enemy factions which you play after completing your own faction.

Have you thought about trying the quests and dungeons in Cyrodiil? Or do they not help progress players in the Veteran ranks?

Menacer

If the OP's comments are true, then that is just terrible. 425k to VR2, and you are getting 42!?!?!?!?! exp per kill? And 1.5k exp per quest? That will totally ruin(like Stewie says) the experience for EVERYBODY. I don't care if you are a slow leveler or a fast one.

Personally I wish that the VR could be grinded in PvP or through dungeons. That way I can enjoy the content of the other factions with an ALT. Now the only way to level VR is to grind every single quest.

I am level 37 at the moment and I love everything about the game. I really hope that VR does not ruin it for me.

Menacer

LonePirate

Menacer wrote: »

If the OP's comments are true, then that is just terrible. 425k to VR2, and you are getting 42!?!?!?!?! exp per kill? And 1.5k exp per quest? That will totally ruin(like Stewie says) the experience for EVERYBODY. I don't care if you are a slow leveler or a fast one.

Personally I wish that the VR could be grinded in PvP or through dungeons. That way I can enjoy the content of the other factions with an ALT. Now the only way to level VR is to grind every single quest.

I am level 37 at the moment and I love everything about the game. I really hope that VR does not ruin it for me.

Menacer

Why would you not be able to grind the dungeons in the Veteran ranked zones? You can do so in the 1-50 zones so why would the rules change for Veteran content?

I don't think the game was ever intended to be an easy slog or rush to VR10. We may not all agree with that decision and whether it is good or bad. However, if it is indeed as difficult as PTS players stated before the game went live, then that should please the throngs of supposedly hardcore players who repeatedly claimed the game was too easy based on watching some videos or playing in one of the Beta weekends. A game's difficulty can be measured in time and not by the scaling of the enemies; but I'm guessing some of the hardcore players do not like time based difficulty hurdles like this one. If the Craglorn zone has a VR10 entry requirement, there certainly will be no rush for ZOS to release it as not many people will hit VR10 in the next several weeks.

Not only that, but this is not a game designed to be completed in 50-100 hours like standard games. This game was constructed with the intent of giving players several hundred hours of content. One way that is accomplished is by increasing the difficulty and leveling requirements. I am sorry that some people do not like to level via quests. If there is an aspect of the game you do not like or you want changed, you can always provide your opinion via the /feedback option in the game or voice your opinions in threads here or on Reddit where ZOS seems to patrol regularly.

Menacer

LonePirate wrote: »

Why would you not be able to grind the dungeons in the Veteran ranked zones? You can do so in the 1-50 zones so why would the rules change for Veteran content?

I don't the game was ever intended to be an easy slog or rush to VR10. We may not all agree with that decision and whether it is good or bad. However, if it is indeed as difficult as PTS players stated before the game went live, then that should please the throngs of supposedly hardcore players who repeatedly claimed the game was too easy based on watching some videos or playing in one of the Beta weekends. A game's difficulty can be measured in time and not by the scaling of the enemies; but I'm guessing some of the hardcore players do not like time based difficulty hurdles like this one. If the Craglorn zone has a VR10 entry requirement, there certainly will be no rush for ZOS to release it as not many people will hit VR10 in the next several weeks.

Not only that, but this is not a game designed to be completed in 50-100 hours like standard games. This game was constructed with the intent of giving players several hundred hours of content. One way that is accomplished is by increasing the difficulty and leveling requirements. I am sorry that some people do not like to level via quests. If there is an aspect of the game you do not like or you want changed, you can always provide your opinion via the /feedback option in the game or voice your opinions in threads here or on Reddit where ZOS seems to patrol regularly.

My response is to your first paragraph.

You ask why would it change, you should be able to grind the dungeons and stuff. Well why did they change the mob experience gain? At level 37 I am getting 150-200 per mob kill. In VR1 you get 47? Why did they change that? So my assumption (I know what that means) is they nerfed the fudge out of mob exp in VR dungeons (meaning I only need to kill 9000 mobs at 47 exp a pop to level, meaning no you cannot grind) as well. I could be wrong, but doubt it.

Menacer

Gierolf_Whitecoatb16_ESO

Veakoth wrote: »

I'm sitting on nearly 10 skills i cant use because i have everything I need and a lot of stuff i don't. I don't know what i have to say to try to make you guys understand that leveling in veteran mode will kill the experience of a lot of players who don't like the leveling before vet.

You guys preach play the game the way you want then you criticize speed levelers, it's naive, hypocritical and rude.
you say the game isn't designed to be rushed to cap, this may come as news but it is, they want us to do what we want, I did and i enjoyed it.

The whole point of the opening post was to inform you that your in for a shock and you need to prepare with your friends to do vet levels in groups and not solo. I also wanted people to understand there will be solo people waiting around spamming zone chat for group invites and being unable to do anything till they get one.

Anyway you don't have to listen, just get to 50 and see for yourself, i'm done trying to warn ppl and getting told off for it.

no, your being told off because your complaining that end game content is too hard to blast through on your own, in a multiplayer 'Massively Multiplayer Online' Game, which you have already reached 'end game' of BEFORE THE OFFICIAL RELEASE EVEN.

Look at the shelf span of good MMOs. do you know why World of Warcraft had trouble finding someone to topple it out of its throne? because everyone coming from WoW expects a new MMO to be able to be blasted through, and play end game content for a month then get bored and quit till the next expansion, etc. this is the reason that MMOs have gone FtP with micro transactions that you end up shelling out 5 times as much money for a fraction of the enjoyment you would just by paying a subscription fee for the time youd play. These games were not meant to be played within a 40 hour timeframe, they were meant to be played within a 4000 hour time frame.

Hanokihs

Also food for thought: Why would they have every little thing 100% ironed out, yet? The game hasn't even been officially released, so end-game content is probably way down near the bottom of their "to implement" list. It's likely that they intend to fix it, but if I were them, I certainly wouldn't make it a priority right now. When enough people get there, they'll have real incentive to fix it. But fixing the basic stuff toward the beginning of the game is most important at the moment, because it's what 90% of players are gonna see.

GrimSolace

Im glad the game is a challenge. 2nd comment i perfect, i could not have said it any better +1!

Gierolf_Whitecoatb16_ESO

Hanokihs wrote: »

Also food for thought: Why would they have every little thing 100% ironed out, yet? The game hasn't even been officially released, so end-game content is probably way down near the bottom of their "to implement" list. It's likely that they intend to fix it, but if I were them, I certainly wouldn't make it a priority right now. When enough people get there, they'll have real incentive to fix it. But fixing the basic stuff toward the beginning of the game is most important at the moment, because it's what 90% of players are gonna see.

my thoughts exactly, its an MMO, you rush to end game because you want to then *** that theres nothing to do, when the developers of said game made it in the spirit that you wont rush and enjoy the game, giving them a little bit to iron out the kinks and work on some end game content.

Gierolf_Whitecoatb16_ESO

Hanokihs wrote: »

Also food for thought: Why would they have every little thing 100% ironed out, yet? The game hasn't even been officially released, so end-game content is probably way down near the bottom of their "to implement" list. It's likely that they intend to fix it, but if I were them, I certainly wouldn't make it a priority right now. When enough people get there, they'll have real incentive to fix it. But fixing the basic stuff toward the beginning of the game is most important at the moment, because it's what 90% of players are gonna see.

my thoughts exactly, its an MMO, you rush to end game because you want to then *** that theres nothing to do, when the developers of said game made it in the spirit that you wont rush and enjoy the game, giving them a little bit to iron out the kinks and work on some end game content. Im happy to see that before the games even out though ZoS has made an attempt to fix the first few zones of their bugs already.

Kaiem

I'm actually glad to hear VR are a challenge in terms of the time it takes. You keep saying its impossible to level solo yet it obviously isn't, it's just slow. This is how MMORPGs used to be before WoW, you could level solo but it was much quicker to get a group and play together. DAoC was probably te most fun I have ever had leveling in a game!

Astelo

are you aware of that Zenimax told us there is about 150h of content for your own faction (lvl 1-50) and 150h for lvl 50+ and 150h for lvl 50++.
So i think it has to be that you cant reacht vr1 -> vr 2 not as fast as 49 -> 50
no problem you want and like speed leveling but the vr wont go this fast

Captainkrunch96

They are meant to take a REALLY long time. probably to keep players like you, who just rush, and give you something to do.

Veakoth

Opinion after opinion all stating i should play the game the way you believe it should be played. Once and for all for the record, I am not complaining, i stated i like the challenge. This post was made to let people know they need to prepare for it.

FYI I rush content so i can enjoy the end game content which is what i enjoy most, then i make a character and enjoy the game, lore and story line which is what i like second most, i am a hardcore gamer people like me exist, get over it.

aegis156

I see a lot of people complaining about others not bothering to read the quests. Why bother? Its all the same go here do this BS I got a neat little icon that tells me where to go and the tracked quest tells me what to do. Everything else is pointless

Shaun98ca2

aegis156 wrote: »

I see a lot of people complaining about others not bothering to read the quests. Why bother? Its all the same go here do this BS I got a neat little icon that tells me where to go and the tracked quest tells me what to do. Everything else is pointless

All games in general are this. Any game ever made or that will be ever made is pointless. The quests in TESO are dressed up to be more interesting like watching a virtual interactive movie but less on the interactive.

Not sure why your playing the game killing monsters is pointless killing other players is pointless.

Its all about perspective.

charlesbr

stop winning, this is the way it is, till the mostly players hit level 50, then they can increase the exp gain for them to keep up with the rushers on pvp #noskill #winbyadvantage guys

Grigs

Veakoth wrote: »

Opinion after opinion all stating i should play the game the way you believe it should be played. Once and for all for the record, I am not complaining, i stated i like the challenge. This post was made to let people know they need to prepare for it.

FYI I rush content so i can enjoy the end game content which is what i enjoy most, then i make a character and enjoy the game, lore and story line which is what i like second most, i am a hardcore gamer people like me exist, get over it.

This is classic Authoritarian Vs Libertarian. Some people can not stand the fact you like to do something they do not, so they ridicule and try to shame you into playing the way they do.

They then try to change the game rules and game to force you to be like them, this is called Authoritarian. The "my way or highway" approach.

I say, do what you want, so long as what you want does not impact anyone else.

Long live freedom!

Sabbatus

LonePirate wrote: »

Menacer wrote: »

If the OP's comments are true, then that is just terrible. 425k to VR2, and you are getting 42!?!?!?!?! exp per kill? And 1.5k exp per quest? That will totally ruin(like Stewie says) the experience for EVERYBODY. I don't care if you are a slow leveler or a fast one.

Personally I wish that the VR could be grinded in PvP or through dungeons. That way I can enjoy the content of the other factions with an ALT. Now the only way to level VR is to grind every single quest.

I am level 37 at the moment and I love everything about the game. I really hope that VR does not ruin it for me.

Menacer

Why would you not be able to grind the dungeons in the Veteran ranked zones? You can do so in the 1-50 zones so why would the rules change for Veteran content?

I don't think the game was ever intended to be an easy slog or rush to VR10. We may not all agree with that decision and whether it is good or bad. However, if it is indeed as difficult as PTS players stated before the game went live, then that should please the throngs of supposedly hardcore players who repeatedly claimed the game was too easy based on watching some videos or playing in one of the Beta weekends. A game's difficulty can be measured in time and not by the scaling of the enemies; but I'm guessing some of the hardcore players do not like time based difficulty hurdles like this one. If the Craglorn zone has a VR10 entry requirement, there certainly will be no rush for ZOS to release it as not many people will hit VR10 in the next several weeks.

Not only that, but this is not a game designed to be completed in 50-100 hours like standard games. This game was constructed with the intent of giving players several hundred hours of content. One way that is accomplished is by increasing the difficulty and leveling requirements. I am sorry that some people do not like to level via quests. If there is an aspect of the game you do not like or you want changed, you can always provide your opinion via the /feedback option in the game or voice your opinions in threads here or on Reddit where ZOS seems to patrol regularly.

Also, why is group content at higher levels a bad thing? That was one of the most enjoyable and memorable parts of EverQuest - spending time with my friends getting a rare item or working on AA experience.

The small group game got perverted into speed-run loot vending machines by other games in the genre, where most stuff can be done solo and things are handed to you with very minimal effort. Easily predictable AI and content that was nothing but a mad zerg rush to the end game.

In a word, boring - sitcoms in a genre that needed epic drama.

And now ZOS ends all that.

Kudos to them. If they have recaptured that small group game, where you never get to the point of overpowering the content, where you are challenged and engaged as a team - well, if ZOS has accomplished that a lot of people like myself are going to be cheering them on. We needed a great fantasy MMO.

Bravo.

It's about time someone re-introduced effort and challenge. I say, game on.

Veakoth

Sabbatus, I agree completely this veteran content is epic, its hard, its challenging, it drives you to fight harder and swap out your skills. Also the boss fights are terrific and we can still 2 man the dark anchors even with lieutenants which is little unexpected but they are still fun.

The time it will take to level is good for those who want to enjoy the lore and the game as a whole which is fine.
Here are several problems.
It's not good for those who want to pvp, play casually but still do endgame or simply explore all the zones on 1 character.

PvP - Veteran ranked players do not suffer the cyrodil cap and come into cyrodil with nearly twice the stats and precede to roll the pvp players who have simply joined at lvl 10. This forces the pvp players to leave and level against their will in a leveling system that takes a long time.

Casuals - There will be quite a few people having trouble completing the zones forcing them to group up a lot which i guess is a good thing. But for those who want to do endgame content like adventure zones they must first reach rank 10 which is roughly 2200-2500(taking into account quests with double xp) quests since mobs give seriously low xp and the xp required to level is increased by 425k each level to an assumed total of 4.25mil at lvl 10.

krapmyself

Why do you want to get to lvl 10 VR so fast? Is the sweetest of all sweetie sweet rolls there waiting for you?

What do you get for it?

Vodkaphile

lol, guy is 50 and in Veteran content before the official release and is complaining it's too hard to level.

What?

Veakoth

Vodkaphile wrote: »

lol, guy is 50 and in Veteran content before the official release and is complaining it's too hard to level.

What?

If you can't read don't write

Griefer

Just a thought, and this might just be me, but after reading the posts, it seems that people are just looking at the Veteran ranks as additional levels. And they want to power through these just as if they were leveling. If this was the case, and the exp curve needed to be kept in line with the rest of the levels, then they would have just made the game be levels 1 - 60.

The longer and harder they make it, the more of an achievement it will feel like for each one obtained. People will complain about it, people complain about everything, this is a universal truth, but there will also be the satisfaction of getting it earned.

Its just time and effort. With these two things, veteran ranks are available to every player, and its up to the player as to how fast they would like to earn them. And if you don't want to put any time or effort in, then obviously you don't get anything out of it.

I for one, hope people chose not to take advantage of the Veteran ranks, and opt to just be lazy because they are too hard. Each one of these people will be easy targets in pvp... not that they weren't already..


-Grief.