What are the minimum requirements (DPS) to complete any top-tier content, such as godslayer?

isadoraisacat

Tradewind wrote: »

isadoraisacat wrote: »

He flat out seems to be ignoring help.

That is not fair at all. I really wish to know how I (or we) can make this:

Galeriano wrote: »

If it's LA weaving that causes Your hand issue than You can just stop doing it. One light attack once every 10 seconds and good job with the ability rotation is enough to get 110k+ parses which is more than enough to clear everything.

Can you please help me (or us) and provide all the details about it?

"110k with One light attack once every 10 seconds and good job with the ability rotation" This will be more than enough to complete any top-tier content.

[Snip

My point is find a group to run with and have fun.
That’s what I did. Who wants to run with Elitists who will shun you? It reminds me of kids In school trying to be friends with the popular jocks who bully them when there are like minded other kids at the lunch table asking to hang out.

Let it go these people won’t change. Find ways to enjoy the game with like minded people. It’s not healthy to waste your time on it.

[Edited quote]

syphoner1

As long as the Ha builds will be able to complete the content provided in the game, even the trifectas, i dont see the nerf as a problem. They cant touch the dps of the LA builds and wont. but to tell someone they need to run a LA build to complete these achievements isnt right. We have alot of people in our guild that cant use a LA build due to physical retraints or horrible internet service. We need multiple ways to complete all content. Also seeing a build with no weapon attacks that will possibly out perform HA builds is disturbing. Hopefully it will get toned back before release. As for the current going requirements for dps being asked for content, thats whoever is putting the group togethers problem. I run an HA build that does 70k on the dummy and thats what i run in content. I also have a 101k parse on the same character with some skill changes but i wont run it in content and its only there cause i wanted to see how far i could push it. but im confident i can complete anything with the 70k build as long as we have the group buffs to allow me to transfer that parse to live content.

FantasticFreddie

syphoner1 wrote: »

As long as the Ha builds will be able to complete the content provided in the game, even the trifectas, i dont see the nerf as a problem. They cant touch the dps of the LA builds and wont. but to tell someone they need to run a LA build to complete these achievements isnt right. We have alot of people in our guild that cant use a LA build due to physical retraints or horrible internet service. We need multiple ways to complete all content. Also seeing a build with no weapon attacks that will possibly out perform HA builds is disturbing. Hopefully it will get toned back before release. As for the current going requirements for dps being asked for content, thats whoever is putting the group togethers problem. I run an HA build that does 70k on the dummy and thats what i run in content. I also have a 101k parse on the same character with some skill changes but i wont run it in content and its only there cause i wanted to see how far i could push it. but im confident i can complete anything with the 70k build as long as we have the group buffs to allow me to transfer that parse to live content.

?????? You directly contradict yourself here.

alcoraptor

Again, there are multiple arguments all over the place here.

For Sunspire, you need to be able to kill a 3m target dummy in 50 seconds, maximum, in order to pass the portals on HM - and that's only to get a complete. For GS, you need to do it in less than that.
It can be done with HA builds, yes. There are several GS, PB etc runs out there with 1-bar HA teams - however, they are generally highly optimised, experienced teams that have run it many times on non-1 bar characters.

As to what your actual argument seems to be about - the upcoming nerf to 1 bar builds - there are two major factors.

One - ZoS has made it very clear that they do not want 1 bar builds to be equal to 2-bar builds - and at the moment, they are.
They can parse as high, if not higher, than a lot of players with 2-bar builds. They are not weak builds by any stretch of the imagination.

Two - the upcoming nerf is not that significant.
Like I said in the other thread, I can parse 94k on live, and 81k on the PTS with the same build - and that's with the current issue with the medium armor passive. I'm expecting that 81k to go up to around 88k once that issue is fixed.
You can do most content with that, so I really don't see what the issue is.

As an addition to point one, from a personal perspective, there has to be a challenge in the game in order to retain players.
The 1-bar HA sorc build, for example, is trivial. Hold LMB and use 3 skills occasionally, and get 90k+ dps with insane survivability.
For me (and a lot of other players, by the sounds of it), that takes the challenge out of the game.
Godslayer, Planesbreaker and achievements like that are supposed to be difficult to get. They're designed as the top-tier achievements that you have to really work to get. If everyone can get them with minimal effort, what's left to work towards?

I don't have GS, and probably never will - I don't have the dps for it - and I accept that. At the end of the day, not everything has to be achieveable by everyone.
I think the balance that ZoS is striking here is actually very good - they're leaving 1-bar builds as perfectly viable for the majority of content - while still keeping some achievements as challenging.

syphoner1

FantasticFreddie wrote: »

syphoner1 wrote: »

As long as the Ha builds will be able to complete the content provided in the game, even the trifectas, i dont see the nerf as a problem. They cant touch the dps of the LA builds and wont. but to tell someone they need to run a LA build to complete these achievements isnt right. We have alot of people in our guild that cant use a LA build due to physical retraints or horrible internet service. We need multiple ways to complete all content. Also seeing a build with no weapon attacks that will possibly out perform HA builds is disturbing. Hopefully it will get toned back before release. As for the current going requirements for dps being asked for content, thats whoever is putting the group togethers problem. I run an HA build that does 70k on the dummy and thats what i run in content. I also have a 101k parse on the same character with some skill changes but i wont run it in content and its only there cause i wanted to see how far i could push it. but im confident i can complete anything with the 70k build as long as we have the group buffs to allow me to transfer that parse to live content.

?????? You directly contradict yourself here.

How do you figure? they are nerfing HA builds but then giving us a mythic that allows you to do more damage than a HA build with no weapon attacks? if that is the case then why nerf it? It should be tiered. keep the LA builds top tier then next would be HA then would be skill spams.

Galeriano

syphoner1 wrote: »

FantasticFreddie wrote: »

syphoner1 wrote: »

As long as the Ha builds will be able to complete the content provided in the game, even the trifectas, i dont see the nerf as a problem. They cant touch the dps of the LA builds and wont. but to tell someone they need to run a LA build to complete these achievements isnt right. We have alot of people in our guild that cant use a LA build due to physical retraints or horrible internet service. We need multiple ways to complete all content. Also seeing a build with no weapon attacks that will possibly out perform HA builds is disturbing. Hopefully it will get toned back before release. As for the current going requirements for dps being asked for content, thats whoever is putting the group togethers problem. I run an HA build that does 70k on the dummy and thats what i run in content. I also have a 101k parse on the same character with some skill changes but i wont run it in content and its only there cause i wanted to see how far i could push it. but im confident i can complete anything with the 70k build as long as we have the group buffs to allow me to transfer that parse to live content.

?????? You directly contradict yourself here.

How do you figure? they are nerfing HA builds but then giving us a mythic that allows you to do more damage than a HA build with no weapon attacks? if that is the case then why nerf it? It should be tiered. keep the LA builds top tier then next would be HA then would be skill spams.

"Allows to more damage than HA build" needs to be taken with a grain of sault.

Will it be possible to do more dmg with it than with HA setup? Yes.
Will majority of people be able to do it? No.

Fact that You wont have to perform extensive light attack weaving doesn't mean You will be suddenly free of way more important things like keeping perfect DoT uptimes, monitoring buffs and debuffs, weaving abilities fast one after another etc. These things are way more important than LA weaving and they are harder to master.

Agenericname

syphoner1 wrote: »

FantasticFreddie wrote: »

syphoner1 wrote: »

As long as the Ha builds will be able to complete the content provided in the game, even the trifectas, i dont see the nerf as a problem. They cant touch the dps of the LA builds and wont. but to tell someone they need to run a LA build to complete these achievements isnt right. We have alot of people in our guild that cant use a LA build due to physical retraints or horrible internet service. We need multiple ways to complete all content. Also seeing a build with no weapon attacks that will possibly out perform HA builds is disturbing. Hopefully it will get toned back before release. As for the current going requirements for dps being asked for content, thats whoever is putting the group togethers problem. I run an HA build that does 70k on the dummy and thats what i run in content. I also have a 101k parse on the same character with some skill changes but i wont run it in content and its only there cause i wanted to see how far i could push it. but im confident i can complete anything with the 70k build as long as we have the group buffs to allow me to transfer that parse to live content.

?????? You directly contradict yourself here.

How do you figure? they are nerfing HA builds but then giving us a mythic that allows you to do more damage than a HA build with no weapon attacks? if that is the case then why nerf it? It should be tiered. keep the LA builds top tier then next would be HA then would be skill spams.

If they were using their vision of combat as the basis to gauge this all by, Id guess that they would want the traditional 2 bar build to be the highest, then mythic reducing LA damage, then HA.

If you look at it in terms of CPM, it makes sense. If you look at it in terms of making a viable alterantive to Oakensoul builds, it makes a little more.

As it stands currently, unless youre pretty good with a 2 bar build, youre better off with Oakensoul.

It also wont eliminate the need for LAs. Sets that require LAs as a proc condition still require them, they just wont necessarily tank your damage if you miss some. They also generate ultimate.

Galeriano

Tradewind wrote: »

isadoraisacat wrote: »

He flat out seems to be ignoring help.

That is not fair at all. I really wish to know how I (or we) can make this:

Galeriano wrote: »

If it's LA weaving that causes Your hand issue than You can just stop doing it. One light attack once every 10 seconds and good job with the ability rotation is enough to get 110k+ parses which is more than enough to clear everything.

Can you please help me (or us) and provide all the details about it?

"110k with One light attack once every 10 seconds and good job with the ability rotation" This will be more than enough to complete any top-tier content.

[Snip]

[Edited for conspiracy theory]

I was talking specifically about situation where LA weaving itself causes some physical issues but player is capable to manage perfectly everything else in two bar dynamic rotation.

In that case base DPS numbers will still be very high and light attack will be just needed to use once every 10 seconds for ulti generation because once You use light attack You start basic ulti gen which gives You 3 ultimate per sec for 9 seconds.

That still requires for a player to gain experience with two bar dynamic rotation just without LA weaving.

TaSheen

JamesForums wrote: »

Legitimate question, how do you block someone on the forums?

Any mention of DPS gets overwhelmed by emotion from certain users. I would like to engage in meaningful conversation while filtering out those who wish to continually bring up disingenuous arguments?

Click on the person's name on one of his posts; if his profile isn't private, in the top right area of the profile is a little "person" icon; click that, click Ignore in the dropdown.

If the profile is private, go to your own profile page, click on the Edit Profile icon, in the left sidebar fiind Ignore List, click that; partway down the page is a text field where you can enter the person's name into your ignore list.

Jaimeh

Tradewind wrote: »

HA users cannot do 120k inside the portal. I know this.

So, can you please help me understand why something is being nerfed if it's already weak?

Because the point of the mythic wasn't for people to be able to do trifectas with it.

Cloudrest

I got Godslayer in the middle of the Bahsei meta, where you had to micromanage your max magicka ontop of doing the mechanics and performing your rotation on a 2-bar build. I was pushing 80-90k single target DPS on Lokke/Yoln, with upwards to 120k AOE DPS on Yoln.

I retired from pushing Trifectas (and trials altogether) after getting Dawnbringer, and I've even started using an Oakensoul HA build myself for dungeons with friends. Why? Because it's incredibly low effort and I've burned out on grinding gear and re-learning rotations every patch. It's great for that, it really is; and I applaud ZOS for the accessibility it brings to the game and how it's opened up veteran content to new players.

Trifectas, to me, do not fall under the category of 'accessible', however. They're the hardest achievements in all of ESO. You don't need to do Godslayer. It's not a requirement. It's an optional endgame achievement that exists for people to aspire to; a monumental task that only a small percentage of players will ever accomplish. It's prestigious to have, and it and other trifectas should remain this way.

If Oakensoul and a Heavy Attack build allows someone to finally clear Veteran Sunspire when they weren't able to before, that's amazing and I 100% support that. If it allows someone to complete a Dungeon Trifecta? That's amazing. It's healthy for the game-- but I don't think it should bring someone to the cusp of completing Trial Hardmodes or Trial Trifectas and I'm happy ZOS is making it proportionally effective to the amount of effort it requires, whilst still keeping it as a very viable option.