I do not want Sorcerer buffs.

Fugus

ZhrIcon wrote: »

TLDR: "Don't look to your neighbor in envy of his possessions and circumstance, but utilize your own life and possessions to create a better circumstance befitting of you."
Sorc doesn't need all of this stuff that other classes have, just make their own tools work in the current iteration of the game.

I really don't understand the "give the Sorc a burst heal" sentiment. Isn't the game already homogenized enough? One thing that has always been a staple of at-least Magsorc gameplay is shields. Although I do agree with StaticWave that shields should not go back to being uncritable, maybe have one of the morphs give a baseline of crit resist WHEN ACTIVE. Also, lower the battlespirit shield % reduction and don't let shields stack unless another shield is cast by a player other than the Sorc themself. That frees up bar space (another gleaming issue of the Sorc) and keeps that original class fantasy alive. I don't need my magsorc to feel like my magblade, magnecro, etc. Work on keeping the classes own fantasies up to snuff with shifting changes of each patch and really double down on making the classes feel unique. Look at Stamsorc, everyone is just as fast as a Stamsorc now (fast, hard hitting burst with bleed pressure but squishy was their old class fantasy), so what do they have now? Oh that's right, nothing. They have a spammable that works similar to the psijic spammable, even has the same casting animation, and an Assassin's Will knock off. Sorc could use some class fantasy tuning again. Streak and pets isn't really enough in my opinion. Obviously none of these ideas are perfect, but just do SOMETHING to keep the class feeling unique.

My personal view on it is that they really shouldn't have pushed for the hybridization route as hard as they have. When you have the main thing your class is thought of being the thing that they are the least viable at doing, you have gone too far.

My personal view, they should have actually embraced the classless aspect of Elder Scrolls instead. Take the current classes they have and instead have them considered specializations and each character can only have 1 specialization at a time.

Then you would just be choosing your race at the start and then whichever specialization you choose you get access to those 3 skill tress as well. Then, if you want to try something else, respec and choose a new specialization that time. Each player could try it all without having to reroll, while each specialization could be just that, specialized and balanced without having to worry about hurting other classes or forcing a square block into a round hole trying to make stamina sorc be a thing or magicka dragon knight.

Also, part of the issue with hybridization comes down to the fact that you are removing the weaknesses of some classes from them while forcing others to retain theirs.

Case in point, the Dragon Knight, his whole point was to get in close and mess stuff up where he could deal damage and soak it up, then you give him strong heals to go with it.

Then you have the Sorcerer, their whole point was to stay away and deal damage at a distance. So, you got rid of its ability to keep that distance when you buffed everyone elses ability to close that distance but also made sure that it couldn't soak up that damage like the others could.

Also, the Dragon Knight has heals being passively added to their abilities and done without even being thought about while the sorcerers has to be deliberate and so on.

I learned just leveling my 2-handed tree that even it has a passive bubble on one of it's spammable DPS moves as well.

Turtle_Bot

OBJnoob wrote: »

There you go-- just give it the crystal weapon treatment. Make it so they can't stack like brrrofski said.

I understand what you other guys are saying but what sense does it make for sorcs to have 3 burst heals in their kit? I mean that's wasteful and silly isn't it?

Makes a lot of sense actually.
- Matriarch would be the group (AoE) heal (which makes sense since the group can cover the pets being focused down).
- The new heal would be the self heal/single target heal which is meant to be the Oh Crap! I need healing now! button.
- Dark conversion would be used for its intended purpose of sustain instead of as a main heal.

You could even nerf the heal value on dark conversion or change it to a HoT instead of a burst heal by doing this. A HoT on dark conversion instead of a burst heal would actually make a lot more sense for the ability too, since with its cast time, its clearly supposed to be used when you have some breathing room to get resources and health back up and provide an additional benefit for when re-engaging and not as an Oh Crap! button to save you from the brink of death like it's currently being forced into due to how outdated/much of a liability pets are in pvp.

OBJnoob

So give them a burst heal they sacrifice their shield for and doesn't require a pet. You sure you fellas want sorc fixed? Maybe you'd just be happier playing... Anything else at all?

I dunno. Our little agreement was cool when we kept it simple. We've come a long way from there in a short time.

I don't think I can go along with these suggestions anymore. I'm not interested in changing the fundamental way sorc is played. I just want them to be better at what they do.

Turtle_Bot

OBJnoob wrote: »

So give them a burst heal they sacrifice their shield for and doesn't require a pet. You sure you fellas want sorc fixed? Maybe you'd just be happier playing... Anything else at all?

I dunno. Our little agreement was cool when we kept it simple. We've come a long way from there in a short time.

I don't think I can go along with these suggestions anymore. I'm not interested in changing the fundamental way sorc is played. I just want them to be better at what they do.

I think you missed my point. I suggested making 1 of the shield morphs into a heal because, even now, we still have people complaining about "shields OP", so to keep them quiet and allow sorc the option of getting a burst heal (our agreed 1st point), I made the suggestion of turning 1 morph of the shield into a heal so that shields and healing couldn't stack which would only give those same complainers even more excuses to needlessly hate on sorc.

The other reason is that it doesn't remove shields at all from sorcerer as the bigger hardened ward would still be there allowing those who enjoy shields to continue using them, but allows an option for those who don't enjoy shields to play another way instead without giving up something.

I'd be perfectly fine if dark conversion was reworked into a proper burst heal (it was one of my original suggestions), and I don't think it would be as OP as many claim it to be (see back in U33 for proof), but it got so many complaints from people saying that stacking shields with reliable healing on sorc would be "OP", so I made the suggestion of reworking 1 morph of shields instead to prevent stacking and give sorcs the option to choose their playstyle.

The other option I proposed, that would probably suit your playstyle better, was to make shields have an "execute scale" where they get bigger values (up to 50% stronger) if they're cast while at lower health (under 50%). This gives shields a way to partially mitigate their weakness of recovering from huge burst, the same way that investing into more max health partially mitigates healings weakness of being burst down before the heal can be cast.

Either way, I still just want to see the 2 things we all agreed on before be given to sorc:
- a proper burst heal
- access to major prophecy/savagery
How ZOS goes about it is entirely up to them. I was merely providing suggestions with reasons to help give them ideas which they can either use or ignore.

StaticWave

Turtle_Bot wrote: »

OBJnoob wrote: »

So give them a burst heal they sacrifice their shield for and doesn't require a pet. You sure you fellas want sorc fixed? Maybe you'd just be happier playing... Anything else at all?

I dunno. Our little agreement was cool when we kept it simple. We've come a long way from there in a short time.

I don't think I can go along with these suggestions anymore. I'm not interested in changing the fundamental way sorc is played. I just want them to be better at what they do.

I think you missed my point. I suggested making 1 of the shield morphs into a heal because, even now, we still have people complaining about "shields OP", so to keep them quiet and allow sorc the option of getting a burst heal (our agreed 1st point), I made the suggestion of turning 1 morph of the shield into a heal so that shields and healing couldn't stack which would only give those same complainers even more excuses to needlessly hate on sorc.

The other reason is that it doesn't remove shields at all from sorcerer as the bigger hardened ward would still be there allowing those who enjoy shields to continue using them, but allows an option for those who don't enjoy shields to play another way instead without giving up something.

I'd be perfectly fine if dark conversion was reworked into a proper burst heal (it was one of my original suggestions), and I don't think it would be as OP as many claim it to be (see back in U33 for proof), but it got so many complaints from people saying that stacking shields with reliable healing on sorc would be "OP", so I made the suggestion of reworking 1 morph of shields instead to prevent stacking and give sorcs the option to choose their playstyle.

The other option I proposed, that would probably suit your playstyle better, was to make shields have an "execute scale" where they get bigger values (up to 50% stronger) if they're cast while at lower health (under 50%). This gives shields a way to partially mitigate their weakness of recovering from huge burst, the same way that investing into more max health partially mitigates healings weakness of being burst down before the heal can be cast.

Either way, I still just want to see the 2 things we all agreed on before be given to sorc:
- a proper burst heal
- access to major prophecy/savagery
How ZOS goes about it is entirely up to them. I was merely providing suggestions with reasons to help give them ideas which they can either use or ignore.

Stacking shield with healing is actually pretty OP tho lol.

Brrrofski

StaticWave wrote: »

Turtle_Bot wrote: »

OBJnoob wrote: »

So give them a burst heal they sacrifice their shield for and doesn't require a pet. You sure you fellas want sorc fixed? Maybe you'd just be happier playing... Anything else at all?

I dunno. Our little agreement was cool when we kept it simple. We've come a long way from there in a short time.

I don't think I can go along with these suggestions anymore. I'm not interested in changing the fundamental way sorc is played. I just want them to be better at what they do.

I think you missed my point. I suggested making 1 of the shield morphs into a heal because, even now, we still have people complaining about "shields OP", so to keep them quiet and allow sorc the option of getting a burst heal (our agreed 1st point), I made the suggestion of turning 1 morph of the shield into a heal so that shields and healing couldn't stack which would only give those same complainers even more excuses to needlessly hate on sorc.

The other reason is that it doesn't remove shields at all from sorcerer as the bigger hardened ward would still be there allowing those who enjoy shields to continue using them, but allows an option for those who don't enjoy shields to play another way instead without giving up something.

I'd be perfectly fine if dark conversion was reworked into a proper burst heal (it was one of my original suggestions), and I don't think it would be as OP as many claim it to be (see back in U33 for proof), but it got so many complaints from people saying that stacking shields with reliable healing on sorc would be "OP", so I made the suggestion of reworking 1 morph of shields instead to prevent stacking and give sorcs the option to choose their playstyle.

The other option I proposed, that would probably suit your playstyle better, was to make shields have an "execute scale" where they get bigger values (up to 50% stronger) if they're cast while at lower health (under 50%). This gives shields a way to partially mitigate their weakness of recovering from huge burst, the same way that investing into more max health partially mitigates healings weakness of being burst down before the heal can be cast.

Either way, I still just want to see the 2 things we all agreed on before be given to sorc:
- a proper burst heal
- access to major prophecy/savagery
How ZOS goes about it is entirely up to them. I was merely providing suggestions with reasons to help give them ideas which they can either use or ignore.

Stacking shield with healing is actually pretty OP tho lol.

It doesn't have to be as strong as dragon blood or other class burst heals. But a semi decent heal that doesn't require two bar slots or resto.

If you make it so shields can't stack, they have a heal and a shield. Something which any other class can do right now. Sorcs would just have a bigger shield and lesser burst heal compared to a lesser shield and bigger heal.

KilianDermoth

StaticWave wrote: »

Stacking shield with healing is actually pretty OP tho lol.

Any other class has access to exactly this. Templars for example can even shield stack (their in class shield + light armor shield for example) + have a reliable burst heal that cant be killed and doesnt have to be double slotted. And they even get a superior Ball of Lightning skill next patch.

So you are saying templars are just absolutely OP right now? Cool, maybe we should try to tell this all the templar mains.

ForumBully

I can't believe we're even worried about 2 stacking shields after seeing 12 stacked vigors...and there's even some debate as to whether that's problematic

OBJnoob

@Turtle_Bot Fair enough.

@ForumBully Different topics of discussion aren't they? Not to put words in anyone's mouth but I think this discussion is trying to balance sorcs in 1v1 scenarios versus other classes... Or even small-scale 1v2s and 4v4s. Not so much Sorc -v- Zerg.

ForumBully

OBJnoob wrote: »

@Turtle_Bot Fair enough.

@ForumBully Different topics of discussion aren't they? Not to put words in anyone's mouth but I think this discussion is trying to balance sorcs in 1v1 scenarios versus other classes... Or even small-scale 1v2s and 4v4s. Not so much Sorc -v- Zerg.

It is different but to see the worry about something like shield stacking while so much other absurdity exists makes me laugh. Even in a 1v1 scenario, theres very little about the Sorc toolkit currently, or slightly stronger, that makes me lose sleep while DKs are as they are. Every other class has a case for buffs presently.

Bushido2513

StaticWave wrote: »

Turtle_Bot wrote: »

OBJnoob wrote: »

So give them a burst heal they sacrifice their shield for and doesn't require a pet. You sure you fellas want sorc fixed? Maybe you'd just be happier playing... Anything else at all?

I dunno. Our little agreement was cool when we kept it simple. We've come a long way from there in a short time.

I don't think I can go along with these suggestions anymore. I'm not interested in changing the fundamental way sorc is played. I just want them to be better at what they do.

I think you missed my point. I suggested making 1 of the shield morphs into a heal because, even now, we still have people complaining about "shields OP", so to keep them quiet and allow sorc the option of getting a burst heal (our agreed 1st point), I made the suggestion of turning 1 morph of the shield into a heal so that shields and healing couldn't stack which would only give those same complainers even more excuses to needlessly hate on sorc.

The other reason is that it doesn't remove shields at all from sorcerer as the bigger hardened ward would still be there allowing those who enjoy shields to continue using them, but allows an option for those who don't enjoy shields to play another way instead without giving up something.

I'd be perfectly fine if dark conversion was reworked into a proper burst heal (it was one of my original suggestions), and I don't think it would be as OP as many claim it to be (see back in U33 for proof), but it got so many complaints from people saying that stacking shields with reliable healing on sorc would be "OP", so I made the suggestion of reworking 1 morph of shields instead to prevent stacking and give sorcs the option to choose their playstyle.

The other option I proposed, that would probably suit your playstyle better, was to make shields have an "execute scale" where they get bigger values (up to 50% stronger) if they're cast while at lower health (under 50%). This gives shields a way to partially mitigate their weakness of recovering from huge burst, the same way that investing into more max health partially mitigates healings weakness of being burst down before the heal can be cast.

Either way, I still just want to see the 2 things we all agreed on before be given to sorc:
- a proper burst heal
- access to major prophecy/savagery
How ZOS goes about it is entirely up to them. I was merely providing suggestions with reasons to help give them ideas which they can either use or ignore.

Stacking shield with healing is actually pretty OP tho lol.

Not by today's damage standards I think. I believe a dk, Warden, and especially nb would give you a run for your money.

I would say yes going back to no crit Shields would be way too much but I've been in many fights where just having a heal under my stacked shields would have kept me alive but still having to work to stay alive.

Also fights as I last saw them were rarely 1v1 it's usually always at least 2v1 ratio so I'm ok with the idea of just giving sorc a way to deal with some situations like say a templar shooting a radiant while his nb friend hits with cw spam.

Sergykid

sorcs have kinda an identity now, nothing should be changed really.
magsorcs are in a good spot, they are just harder to perform than they used to, and so the "majority" sees it as weak. But will be even better with coming shield buffs.
stamsorc is in a very good spot already, think that any buff to "sorc" will boost this style too

Bushido2513

Sergykid wrote: »

magsorcs are in a good spot, they are just harder to perform than they used to, and so the "majority" sees it as weak. But will be even better with coming shield buffs.
stamsorc is in a very good spot already, think that any buff to "sorc" will boost this style too

Your second statement contradicts the first a bit. Are they in a good spot or harder to perform?

Let's compare, dk is in a great spot and not hard to use at all really.

NB is in a good spot but has a learning curve if you weren't already used to it.

Warden is in a good spot and in some cases is as easy or easier than dk.

So when you say in a good spot but harder to perform, that's not really that good with respect to good spots other classes are in I think.

acastanza_ESO

ForumBully wrote: »

I'm a little turned off of the burst heal idea now, there have been some great points for and against...I like the idea of a passive Crit chance increase to make Surge better and help damage as well.
As much as I hate the bird, I think that is the burst heal option for the foreseeable future.

The Bird is an actually terrible constant liability and it has to go, or something seriously has to change with it. No other class is saddled with a burst heal that is just as likely to kill you (and your whole dang group by turning into a plaguebreak bomb) as it is to actually be there to actually heal you when you need it.

ForumBully

acastanza_ESO wrote: »

ForumBully wrote: »

I'm a little turned off of the burst heal idea now, there have been some great points for and against...I like the idea of a passive Crit chance increase to make Surge better and help damage as well.
As much as I hate the bird, I think that is the burst heal option for the foreseeable future.

The Bird is an actually terrible constant liability and it has to go, or something seriously has to change with it. No other class is saddled with a burst heal that is just as likely to kill you (and your whole dang group by turning into a plaguebreak bomb) as it is to actually be there to actually heal you when you need it.

I agree, but I don't think ZoS sees or appreciates that liability. They see it as a fun mechanic.

Sergykid

Bushido2513 wrote: »

Sergykid wrote: »

magsorcs are in a good spot, they are just harder to perform than they used to, and so the "majority" sees it as weak. But will be even better with coming shield buffs.
stamsorc is in a very good spot already, think that any buff to "sorc" will boost this style too

Your second statement contradicts the first a bit. Are they in a good spot or harder to perform?

Let's compare, dk is in a great spot and not hard to use at all really.

NB is in a good spot but has a learning curve if you weren't already used to it.

Warden is in a good spot and in some cases is as easy or easier than dk.

So when you say in a good spot but harder to perform, that's not really that good with respect to good spots other classes are in I think.

by good spot harder to do i mean sorcs reach 90 kmph with 7 gear shifts while dks and dens reach 100 kmph with 5 gear shifts.

strength is there, not as easy deployed anymore. Soon gear shifts come down to 6. Stamsorc can reach 100 kmph as others but still has 6-7 shifts. So buffing this class is debatable.

Bushido2513

ForumBully wrote: »

acastanza_ESO wrote: »

ForumBully wrote: »

I'm a little turned off of the burst heal idea now, there have been some great points for and against...I like the idea of a passive Crit chance increase to make Surge better and help damage as well.
As much as I hate the bird, I think that is the burst heal option for the foreseeable future.

The Bird is an actually terrible constant liability and it has to go, or something seriously has to change with it. No other class is saddled with a burst heal that is just as likely to kill you (and your whole dang group by turning into a plaguebreak bomb) as it is to actually be there to actually heal you when you need it.

I agree, but I don't think ZoS sees or appreciates that liability. They see it as a fun mechanic.

The bird is trash in PVP and PvE when pushed to any sort of limit and is thus likely not fun for anyone.

Though in a 1v1 it's technically op when setup correctly so maybe ZOS is basing their math on that scenario.

AdamLAD

How about we just allow wards to be 100k in strength no satire 👀

boi_anachronism_

NB is a class that requires extremely high skill to play in pve well. Idk what people are talking about with this. In pve they were not good at all last patch falling behind sorc by a huge margin. No one seems to understand that you can't nerf nb for pvp without destroying it for pve...

MetallicMonk

Nightblade is extremely easy in PvE and super easy in PvP after they've changed its healing. While the damage is overtuned for PvP atm it's way more the access to survivability and healing a class like that has that is the least thought idea I think I've ever seen.

In no other game will a ganker fail a gank on you, go back into stealth, and proceed to spam a 10k+ burst heal on themselves. It's actually so poorly designed and not thought out it seems like it's done on purpose as a troll.

Jsmalls

StaticWave wrote: »

Hybridization + old shield is a recipe for disaster. Here's a random max magicka build I put together with 56k mag, 2.6k regen, and 22k HP. Impen isn't needed because old shields weren't crittable. ZERO investment into HP other than DDF and max HP is still 22k. Infused Resto staff back bar for perma 452 SD because Defending isn't needed. Stam sustain is plenty with Energy Overload gives 1k stam back and High Elf passive. Check the stats and the tooltip for Vigor and Curse/Frag/Ele Wep:











Almost 19k Curse tooltip, 15.5k Frag tooltip before the 66% extra damage (or 25.5k with the 66% extra damage), and 14k Elewep tooltip. Vigor tooltip is also 26k. All of this while having a 25k total shield (Hardened + Dampen) that can't be critted.

Sorc would become one of the most broken classes in an instant if we buffed it to its old glory.

@StaticWave

I mean I know you threw it together but come on, let's not put a setup together for tooltips to make the class look like they have insane damage when they don't. This setup doesn't have major resolve, needs potion for major sorcery (which means no extra stamina recovery), has 19k health walking into the fight, has non existent stamina recovery despite having a stamina spammable and virtually all health pool heals tied to stamina (overload won't be enough sustain nor will you have good uptime of it if you're depending on it for stamina). You'd be micromanaging your shields the entire fight spending 2 gcds applying them and having to reapplying them before finishing any chance at a burst cuz you'll die in two moves with those resistances and health pool. Mine as well just do a 10k spell damage build with nothing else into it and post those tooltips, would at least be higher.

grzes848909

Main problem are the pets. They are good in pve but god awful in pvp and its universally due to having to take 2 abilitiy slots, and every sorc can agree that bar space is always the problem in almost every build. If they were to make them only take one space people would consider actually using them, also as a trade off there should be timer for how long the pet is actually summoned; maybe like 1-4 min; idk the deatails wouldn't be up to me.
Another thing, there is one pet that nobody ever uses: ''the Summon Unstable Clannfear'' whos ability is the same as twilight matriarch but only heals you for same price as the twilight matriarch; its crap tbh. One could replace the instant heal it provides with passive heal that ticks every 2 seconds for as long its alive and or either have additional ability to increase that hot by casting the pet again.
if one could have a healing pet with only one bar space and have a magicka heal overtime without using restro staff then I would like to bet that sorcs would be a lot more survivable while still also preserving class identity.

StaticWave

KilianDermoth wrote: »

StaticWave wrote: »

Stacking shield with healing is actually pretty OP tho lol.

Any other class has access to exactly this. Templars for example can even shield stack (their in class shield + light armor shield for example) + have a reliable burst heal that cant be killed and doesnt have to be double slotted. And they even get a superior Ball of Lightning skill next patch.

So you are saying templars are just absolutely OP right now? Cool, maybe we should try to tell this all the templar mains.

Templar can’t build full damage and benefit from bigger shields.

StaticWave

Jsmalls wrote: »

StaticWave wrote: »

Hybridization + old shield is a recipe for disaster. Here's a random max magicka build I put together with 56k mag, 2.6k regen, and 22k HP. Impen isn't needed because old shields weren't crittable. ZERO investment into HP other than DDF and max HP is still 22k. Infused Resto staff back bar for perma 452 SD because Defending isn't needed. Stam sustain is plenty with Energy Overload gives 1k stam back and High Elf passive. Check the stats and the tooltip for Vigor and Curse/Frag/Ele Wep:











Almost 19k Curse tooltip, 15.5k Frag tooltip before the 66% extra damage (or 25.5k with the 66% extra damage), and 14k Elewep tooltip. Vigor tooltip is also 26k. All of this while having a 25k total shield (Hardened + Dampen) that can't be critted.

Sorc would become one of the most broken classes in an instant if we buffed it to its old glory.

@StaticWave

I mean I know you threw it together but come on, let's not put a setup together for tooltips to make the class look like they have insane damage when they don't. This setup doesn't have major resolve, needs potion for major sorcery (which means no extra stamina recovery), has 19k health walking into the fight, has non existent stamina recovery despite having a stamina spammable and virtually all health pool heals tied to stamina (overload won't be enough sustain nor will you have good uptime of it if you're depending on it for stamina). You'd be micromanaging your shields the entire fight spending 2 gcds applying them and having to reapplying them before finishing any chance at a burst cuz you'll die in two moves with those resistances and health pool. Mine as well just do a 10k spell damage build with nothing else into it and post those tooltips, would at least be higher.

That was an example of a build using old shields in today’s meta.. I think I’ve made it clear several times lol

StaticWave

@Jsmalls you don’t need major resolve or 25k HP with old shields. That’s the point I was trying to make.

Old shields were uncrittable and didn’t benefit from armor, so Major Resolve was useless. And when you can spam 25k pseudo HP, you don’t need 25k HP.

Bushido2513

StaticWave wrote: »

@Jsmalls you don’t need major resolve or 25k HP with old shields. That’s the point I was trying to make.

Old shields were uncrittable and didn’t benefit from armor, so Major Resolve was useless. And when you can spam 25k pseudo HP, you don’t need 25k HP.

I must have missed something. I wouldn't think anyone would ever vote for no crit shields. Pretty much anything but no crit shields, they were ridiculous. Rallying cry already shows what things look like when you start taking crit dmg down.

Just asking for a reliable burst heal or even a reliable strong hot maybe!

Jsmalls

@StaticWave

Every Sorc ran major resolve in those days, because even though it was an incredibly strong defense (no argument there), as soon as those shields went down due to high pressure (really high pressure mind you haha) or the more likely reason extended offensive push, one CC and you were dead (I still vastly prefer active defense over passive defense to fight against), hell the camo hunter burst out of stealth one shot you if you had your shield down out of combat. Not to mention the light armor skill shield only absorbed Magicka based attacks during a majority of those times. Hardened and healing ward were the two major components.

Poss

Sergykid wrote: »

sorcs have kinda an identity now, nothing should be changed really.
magsorcs are in a good spot, they are just harder to perform than they used to, and so the "majority" sees it as weak. But will be even better with coming shield buffs.
stamsorc is in a very good spot already, think that any buff to "sorc" will boost this style too

I’m sorry but how can you say magsorcs are in a good place right now? Have you played one in pvp recently?

StaticWave

Jsmalls wrote: »

@StaticWave

Every Sorc ran major resolve in those days, because even though it was an incredibly strong defense (no argument there), as soon as those shields went down due to high pressure (really high pressure mind you haha) or the more likely reason extended offensive push, one CC and you were dead (I still vastly prefer active defense over passive defense to fight against), hell the camo hunter burst out of stealth one shot you if you had your shield down out of combat. Not to mention the light armor skill shield only absorbed Magicka based attacks during a majority of those times. Hardened and healing ward were the two major components.

@Jsmalls You aren't getting the point I was trying to make. Let me quote the person I was responding to:

ForumBully wrote: »

I am curious to see how the shields of then would stack up to the damage of now...but they were pretty strong

So the entire section where I posted the build with no Major Resolve was a hypothetical scenario where old shields were brought back in today's hybridization meta. I was responding to that person above.

Everything I've said is accurate as that was how sorcs played back then. Old shields did not benefit from armor, but they couldn't be critted. This leaves zero need for Major Resolve or Impen traits, which lets you have 1 extra slot without needing Chudan and run 7 Divines.

This is exactly how sorcs with old shield would play in today's meta. They can stack everything into damage like they used to, while also having access to Vigor and hybridization. It's a recipe for disaster.

StaticWave

Bushido2513 wrote: »

StaticWave wrote: »

@Jsmalls you don’t need major resolve or 25k HP with old shields. That’s the point I was trying to make.

Old shields were uncrittable and didn’t benefit from armor, so Major Resolve was useless. And when you can spam 25k pseudo HP, you don’t need 25k HP.

I must have missed something. I wouldn't think anyone would ever vote for no crit shields. Pretty much anything but no crit shields, they were ridiculous. Rallying cry already shows what things look like when you start taking crit dmg down.

Just asking for a reliable burst heal or even a reliable strong hot maybe!

I was responding to someone's question about how old shields would compete in today's meta.