Reduce the damage gap between purple and gold weapons

DrNukenstein

No. Don't do that. I'd rather they just make gold mats more accessible and available. Especially since the high performance players that generate mass amounts of gold mats seem to have gone on an exodus.

Besides you really only need gold main hand and chest. Everything beyond that is for the sweats. A gold heavy chest and melee weapon is ~250k worth of mats in todays economy. That's just expensive enough to give a player something to do. A reachable, gratifiable, short term goal with a significant impact on the players power. It's a good thing.

Brrrofski

It's pretty cheap anyway.

It's like 40k to gold a weapon

Kisakee

StarOfElyon wrote: »

I craft A LOT. I have a lot of characters and I try different set-ups often. I would like to be in less of a gimped place with purple weapons. If I really like my set-up, I'll gold the weapons out. But I don't see a problem with bringing the lower qualities up some. It's like, hey, I'm not going to make the top end any worse (so don't worry, you're not affected) but I'm going to bring the lower end up some. I don't see a problem with that.

I'm crafting full golden gear sets including jewelry just for when i want to test something that crossed my mind. If you struggle to even gold out weapons stop being casual or do daily writs with all of your characters every day and you won't have any problems with mats. And don't ask for unnecessary changes.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

Hard Pass. This is the easy part of the damage gap to close on your own. Golding out your weapons is just not that resource intensive. At the absolute most, you are talking about 32 gold mats for a full build. That just isn't that much in the grand scheme of things.

Lets also not forget that nobody wants their gear nerfed, which is exactly what you are proposing. If anything, they should increase the power gap between purple and gold jewelry and armor in my opinion. I wouldn't feel so bad about spending a few million worth of resources on gold jewelry or armor if it actually meant something.

LittlePinkDot wrote: »

StarOfElyon wrote: »

If you want to raise the floor, this will be one way to do it. Some of us broke mfs need to rock purple weapons sometimes. Increase the value of green, blue, and purple quality to close the gap with gold weapons.

I have a better idea. Make gold mats easier to get.

Guessing I am not telling you anything you dont already know, but crafting writs are the answer here. I have thousands and thousands of gold mats, more than I will ever need. Its all from writs. I dont even bother doing writs anymore outside of the anniversary event. They give you everything you need to play the game, and its easy to grind up a few alts to do a handful every day. I have never purchased a gold mat in this game, and I have more gold gear than I could ever equip even if they tripled the number of character slots.

OBJnoob

I think a lot of people are being obtuse about this. Some people don't PvP and they resent needing to go for certain things-- Vigor for instance. And mostly we say, well, you only have to do it once, just grit your teeth and do it. Some people don't like vet dungeons but hey, pick a monster helm you like-- you only have to do it once, grit your teeth and do it. Well some people don't do crafting. I'm one of those people. Collecting and refining mats or doing writs every day is not like the others. It isn't a one time thing. It is an every day thing. It's a ritual.

I only PvP (but of course sometimes go get antiquities or monster masks as needed.) It's the only thing I find fun. As a result, I'm always broke. Golding out two weapons, buying a piece or two of a new set, redoing your skill points maybe and redoing CP for a new build on a new character... All that costs about 100k every time you do it. To some of you that's chump change. For others-- it's a small fortune.

How much gold do you make doing dungeons? How much do you make from PvP? Why are writs such a money making thing? Comparatively, it requires 0 skill, so why such a huge reward and necessity?

If digging up rocks and plants for an hour a day is what it takes then no thank you and I'll stay broke. I only get to play for like two hours a day anyway. And okay so that's my decision that's my bad... But why IS the money-making ratio so skewed in favor of such a silly thing? And if there is a solution why not entertain it?

Making purple weapons a little stronger wouldn't hurt a thing. In fact it'd bring it more in line with other armor. People (that aren't game-rich,) don't normally gold out their armor. Most guides say it isn't necessary. So why is the main hand weapon SO necessary? It doesn't have to be. Just cuz we're all used to it doesn't mean it shouldn't change.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

OBJnoob wrote: »

I think a lot of people are being obtuse about this. Some people don't PvP and they resent needing to go for certain things-- Vigor for instance. And mostly we say, well, you only have to do it once, just grit your teeth and do it. Some people don't like vet dungeons but hey, pick a monster helm you like-- you only have to do it once, grit your teeth and do it. Well some people don't do crafting. I'm one of those people. Collecting and refining mats or doing writs every day is not like the others. It isn't a one time thing. It is an every day thing. It's a ritual.

I only PvP (but of course sometimes go get antiquities or monster masks as needed.) It's the only thing I find fun. As a result, I'm always broke. Golding out two weapons, buying a piece or two of a new set, redoing your skill points maybe and redoing CP for a new build on a new character... All that costs about 100k every time you do it. To some of you that's chump change. For others-- it's a small fortune.

How much gold do you make doing dungeons? How much do you make from PvP? Why are writs such a money making thing? Comparatively, it requires 0 skill, so why such a huge reward and necessity?

If digging up rocks and plants for an hour a day is what it takes then no thank you and I'll stay broke. I only get to play for like two hours a day anyway. And okay so that's my decision that's my bad... But why IS the money-making ratio so skewed in favor of such a silly thing? And if there is a solution why not entertain it?

Making purple weapons a little stronger wouldn't hurt a thing. In fact it'd bring it more in line with other armor. People (that aren't game-rich,) don't normally gold out their armor. Most guides say it isn't necessary. So why is the main hand weapon SO necessary? It doesn't have to be. Just cuz we're all used to it doesn't mean it shouldn't change.

I have some sympathy to what you are saying, but this is an MMO not PVP in a shooter where everyone is automatically on the same playing field. For better or worse, you need to engage in the economy or you are going to be at a disadvantage, and in my opinion, you should be. Character building is an important aspect in ES games and any MMO. MMOs are massive games and the economy is an important aspect of that, but I hear similar arguments from my friends who do nothing but trial runs. They are always hurting for mats and oh wait, guess what else, Spell/Weapon power pots.

If all you do is PVP, well you should have ample AP for anything in the golden vendor, and Spell power pots can be bought with AP and sell like hot cakes.

End of the day, you need to find some way to make money in ESO. I dont particularly enjoy crafting writs. Its not like they are fun or exciting (some people probably get that RNG thrill with drops I suppose). But Objectively, if you are going to devote a small percentage of your gameplay to making yourself a wealthy person in Tamriel (engaging in the economy), there is no better bang for your buck (its the most efficient possible use of your time). Considering you can do them while watching netflix, its just not that much of a chore.

haelgaan

gold mats are runaway crazy stupid expensive now, at least on PC. I'd rather see ZOS increase the supply of gold mats to reduce the market pricing, than to change the game mechanics

StarOfElyon

chessalavakia_ESO wrote: »

It's actually kind of interesting how the weapon stats are set up.

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Bows

You start off with a 143 point gap between gold and white gear which remains until level 50.

As a result someone in white gear has just under 55% of the stat of someone with a gold weapon to start with coming from the weapon.

The % gap decreases until level 50 where you halt at just under 85% of the golds damage with white gear.

Then, when you go in to CP levels you start with a 131 point gap till CP 140.

At CP 150, the gap increases to 210 and at CP 160 it further increases to 298.

If you look at heavy armor you won't see this style of funny business.

For heavy armor you start with a 336 point gap till 50 then you have a 308 point gap all the way up with CP.

I'd suggest the gap's existence is deliberate with the intent to make people grind to upgrade to gold at the end for weapons.

Thanks for showing the numbers. I still like my suggestion to buff the damage of purple weapons some. For those who gold their weapons because they want the maximum % of damage, nothing changes for them at all. They are literally unaffected.

Somber97866

Just no! Gosh

StarOfElyon

Brrrofski wrote: »

It's pretty cheap anyway.

It's like 40k to gold a weapon

Quadruple that if you're doing 2 front bar and 2 back bar weapons. 160k.

StarOfElyon

haelgaan wrote: »

gold mats are runaway crazy stupid expensive now, at least on PC. I'd rather see ZOS increase the supply of gold mats to reduce the market pricing, than to change the game mechanics

I wouldn't be opposed to that either.

oldbobdude

But there isn’t that much of a difference between purple and gold now in my opinion.

Somber97866

I have to agree with that! Personally I think that they should have more of a gap between it considering how much some of that stuff cost. I feel kind of cheated when it comes to two handed weapons compared to staves it doesn't entirely different discussion.
Do you need me to donate some gold matts to you? Just do your daily crafting!

OBJnoob

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

...
there is no better bang for your buck (its the most efficient possible use of your time). Considering you can do them while watching netflix, its just not that much of a chore.

I appreciate your sympathy, especially because you're right, so it's big of you to understand. It's my bed, I made it, now I shall lay in it. That's fair. Yes, in MMOs, it is fair to be expected to do some of everything.

But let's think about your last words, which I quoted, and how it corresponds to some of what I said.

Compared to dungeons/trials and PvP, why does something you can mindlessly do while watching TV pay so much better than anything else?

There's a problem here. Somewhere. Maybe it's in the gap between purple and gold weapons (a similar change was just made to the bloodthirsty trait on jewelry, in case anyone is thinking this idea is without precedent.) Or maybe the drop-rate should be increased so the price goes down. Or maybe doing writs while watching Netflix shouldn't make you as rich as it does.

Hapexamendios

No, just no.

Thecompton73

C'mon man, really? I basically only PvP but make at least 250K gold a week just posting the good rewards for the worthy I get on the trader guild I joined through the guild finder. On the off occasion I don't hit the 250K mark I put in 20K as a donation to keep the spot in Mournhold and still walk with 150-200K for the week.I don't know how there are still people that need Mara's or Rally Cry pieces but they sell like hotcakes. If my RNG is bad and I don't get enough good RftW drops I use AP and buy pots, Akiviri motifs or deadly strikes pieces and those all sell quickly as well. I'm not a huge fan of the economy simulation part of the game but with just a little engagement making money is brain dead easy.

Lumenn

OBJnoob wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

...
there is no better bang for your buck (its the most efficient possible use of your time). Considering you can do them while watching netflix, its just not that much of a chore.

I appreciate your sympathy, especially because you're right, so it's big of you to understand. It's my bed, I made it, now I shall lay in it. That's fair. Yes, in MMOs, it is fair to be expected to do some of everything.

But let's think about your last words, which I quoted, and how it corresponds to some of what I said.

Compared to dungeons/trials and PvP, why does something you can mindlessly do while watching TV pay so much better than anything else?

There's a problem here. Somewhere. Maybe it's in the gap between purple and gold weapons (a similar change was just made to the bloodthirsty trait on jewelry, in case anyone is thinking this idea is without precedent.) Or maybe the drop-rate should be increased so the price goes down. Or maybe doing writs while watching Netflix shouldn't make you as rich as it does.

I'm sure some could expand on this a bit more, but for me, unless you're buying reduction scrolls left and right(something that wasn't an option when I started) you spend a lot of time mastering crafting. In this game crafting doesn't have a LOT going for it. Style? Can change that willy nilly. Furniture? Expensive and a select market for it. Master writs? To buy more crafting stuff...there needs to be a draw to bring non hardcore crafters to the bench, and a paycheck plus some mats are that draw. Otherwise, why bother unless you care about style, a marketable trade, and furniture. Now yes, you can skip it, but if you don't do the deed, you don't get the check.

Speaking of that, on a maxed character it's roughly 5k if you do all the daily writs. I'd rack up more than that in gold farming a dungeon for my stickerbook several times over. If you absolutely refuse to craft, to sell gear/items, then you fight for it. You can easily do more than a writs worth doing dungeons. Become an assassin/thief and sell to the fence. Max those skill lines out and you can make some money.

Purple vs. gold weapons. Considering I need more gold mats (a rarer item)than purple to updrade, I think it's about where it should be for weapons. Armor and jewelry should be a bigger difference in my opinion.

bmnoble

the1andonlyskwex wrote: »

ArchangelIsraphel wrote: »

StarOfElyon wrote: »

I craft A LOT. I have a lot of characters and I try different set-ups often. I would like to be in less of a gimped place with purple weapons. If I really like my set-up, I'll gold the weapons out. But I don't see a problem with bringing the lower qualities up some. It's like, hey, I'm not going to make the top end any worse (so don't worry, you're not affected) but I'm going to bring the lower end up some. I don't see a problem with that.

You seem to have a habbit of thinking people find this unnessicary because they'll be affected in some way. I'm not at whatever this "top end" is your referring to. I dont crunch numbers, and don't particularly give much thought to end game content unless I really want to play it with friends. Having a golded weapon isn't even a min/max thing, it's pretty average for most players, even those who don't seek endgame, to gold a weapon set at a certain point.

But I also don't find it hard to gold out a weapon whenever I want to, and I'm attempting to tell you how you can solve your own issue by running around gathering mats. Picking up things off the ground. Refining them. It's all you have to do. Golding out a weapon is not difficult if you're willing to put the effort in to do it. I don't see why dev time should be put into fixing a problem that already has a solution.

You don't have to hold yourself down when the materials are readily available to you.

Without ESO Plus, gathering mats and maintaining the supplies necessary to do writs takes up a lot of valuable (and limited) inventory space. Also, not everybody finds those activities fun or has so much gaming time that they can afford to spend it on non-fun activities. Even just buying mats with gold is a big deal/expense if you're not also selling things through the guild-restricted player-to-player trading system.

Even when I first started the game before I joined any trade guilds still managed to accumulate enough gold from thieving, to gold out my weapons.

Sure it wasn't as quick as doing daily writs, back then took a few days(20 - 30 minutes a day to reach fencing cap) of fencing to the cap on a single character, at most to save up the gold needed now it would take around a week using one character, a couple days or less if using multiple characters, with the maxed out fencing capacity.

Even without ESO+ you don't need to do writs on every character just gathering up enough mats for a few can still bring you in a stable gold supply, won't be as quick as someone with ESO+ and a lot of characters but it's hardly unattainable.

As for OP, see no reason to change purple weapons, it's not a min max thing to gold out weapons that is the one piece of gear most people gold out at the bare minimum just for the extra damage it provides. The armour and rings/necklaces however most I know leave them at blue or purple quality unless they are doing group content or regular PVP.

All of my alts only have golded out weapons and purple everything else, I say leave it alone, it's not that hard to gold out your weapons.

ArchangelIsraphel

Thecompton73 wrote: »

C'mon man, really? I basically only PvP but make at least 250K gold a week just posting the good rewards for the worthy I get on the trader guild I joined through the guild finder. On the off occasion I don't hit the 250K mark I put in 20K as a donation to keep the spot in Mournhold and still walk with 150-200K for the week.I don't know how there are still people that need Mara's or Rally Cry pieces but they sell like hotcakes. If my RNG is bad and I don't get enough good RftW drops I use AP and buy pots, Akiviri motifs or deadly strikes pieces and those all sell quickly as well. I'm not a huge fan of the economy simulation part of the game but with just a little engagement making money is brain dead easy.

This right here, agree completely. If someone does PVP regularly, they can rake in quite a bit of money to get whatever they need. There's plenty of rewards accessible through no means other than PVP that can be sold to those that don't want to touch PVP. There's also easy money in Hakeijo or doing IC dailies for tokens that net you things like the timbercrow costume that sell really well. During the times when I'm strictly doing pvp I feel just as well off as I do when I'm farming mats or anything else. It's all about being versatile and putting the effort into trying to understand the value of the rewards given by whatever your currently doing.

Somber97866

I wish they would widen the gap

CompM4s

No

Treeshka

I think this is fine. They should increase the gap between purple and gold body pieces.

vsrs_au

Another vote for widening the purple to gold gap, then the very high prices for gold upgrade materials may actually be worth it.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

StarOfElyon wrote: »

Brrrofski wrote: »

It's pretty cheap anyway.

It's like 40k to gold a weapon

Quadruple that if you're doing 2 front bar and 2 back bar weapons. 160k.

Which can be farmed in less than 3 hours in a million different ways. If you are setup to do writs, it can be done in under 45 minutes of gameplay, and that's just the gold currency reward. Do writs for any length of time and you dont even think twice about using gold mats because you are swimming in them. Literally sitting on north of 1500 temp alloys and I make gold weapons in multiple traits all the time. I have never needed to purchase a gold mat, not once, not ever. I haven't done or needed to do writs consistently in years.

I also have zero incentive to sell my gold mats. Why on earth would I? I have more gold than I know what to do with, again all from writs, and those gold mats will be worth more tomorrow than they are today. Gold doesnt increase in value just sitting in your bank, but crafting mats absolutely do. I view my craft bag log a stock portfolio that thanks to rampant inflation in this game, is always going up in value.

Jusey1

haelgaan wrote: »

gold mats are runaway crazy stupid expensive now, at least on PC. I'd rather see ZOS increase the supply of gold mats to reduce the market pricing, than to change the game mechanics

The problem is that they have increase the supply of gold mats and increase chances of getting them overtime, but the prices keep going up. That's a community problem that ZOS can't really do anything about, unless they really want to add a new feature that would destroy the community's economy (such as removing guild traders in favor of a central exchange place).

jad11mumbler

StarOfElyon wrote: »

If you want to raise the floor, this will be one way to do it. Some of us broke mfs need to rock purple weapons sometimes. Increase the value of green, blue, and purple quality to close the gap with gold weapons.

Gold and gold mats are both so easy to get, unless you're changing gear every week it shouldn't be a problem for anyone except the newest of players.

vsrs_au

jad11mumbler wrote: »

StarOfElyon wrote: »

If you want to raise the floor, this will be one way to do it. Some of us broke mfs need to rock purple weapons sometimes. Increase the value of green, blue, and purple quality to close the gap with gold weapons.

Gold and gold mats are both so easy to get, unless you're changing gear every week it shouldn't be a problem for anyone except the newest of players.

Really? I find chromium plating very *difficult* to get, its drop rate is very low, and I have to spend an excessive amount of time mining platinum seams.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

Jusey1 wrote: »

haelgaan wrote: »

gold mats are runaway crazy stupid expensive now, at least on PC. I'd rather see ZOS increase the supply of gold mats to reduce the market pricing, than to change the game mechanics

The problem is that they have increase the supply of gold mats and increase chances of getting them overtime, but the prices keep going up. That's a community problem that ZOS can't really do anything about, unless they really want to add a new feature that would destroy the community's economy (such as removing guild traders in favor of a central exchange place).

I could solve the problem in an instant, see my above post for context.

Remove gold currency rewards from crafting writs, and increase gold mat drop rate slightly to compensate.

What would happen?

Well, for people like myself that are swimming in both gold currency and gold mats, now my easy supply of gold currency is turned off. This does two things. One, it would be a much needed source of downward pressure on inflation, because there is less new currency entering the economy every day. That alone would reduce prices. But also, it would be an incentive for me to sell the thousands of gold mats in my crafting bag when I need gold that I no longer easily get every day, which increases supply and lowers price. Also the increase in gold mat drop rate as compensation is also an increase in supply and a downward pressure on prices.

The problem we have now is that the best source of gold mats is also the best source of printing new gold currency (crafting writs), so the people with the gold mats have no incentive to sell them. I have thousands of gold mats and millions and millions of gold currency, far more than I need, and pretty much all is from writs.

Selling my excess gold mats makes no sense whatsoever. Its the real life equivalent of keeping all your wealth in your 0% interest checking account. If I log off for 3 months, the amount of gold in my bank doesn't change, but the value of my gold mats will absolutely increase. If I didn't get gold currency from writs rewards, I would be required to sell my excess mats when I need an influx of currency. I have NEVER sold a gold mat in all my time in ESO because it is financially a foolish decision as long as my gold currency supply is meeting my needs, and thanks to gold currency from writs, it always does.

Would it be a popular move at first? No, people would rage, but it would go a long way to solving both the broader inflation issue and the more specific issue of gold mat prices being through the roof.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

vsrs_au wrote: »

jad11mumbler wrote: »

StarOfElyon wrote: »

If you want to raise the floor, this will be one way to do it. Some of us broke mfs need to rock purple weapons sometimes. Increase the value of green, blue, and purple quality to close the gap with gold weapons.

Gold and gold mats are both so easy to get, unless you're changing gear every week it shouldn't be a problem for anyone except the newest of players.

Really? I find chromium plating very *difficult* to get, its drop rate is very low, and I have to spend an excessive amount of time mining platinum seams.

Chromium is certainly the outlier. Writs definitely help. They are also the one survey I try to stay on top of. My biggest issue is that I had pretty much stopped doing writs by the time chromium got introduced, so it do force me back into the writ game a bit. Its the only gold mat I give a second thought to using. Thankfully, between the golden vendor and Trial HMs, I usually can get most of what I need, so not a huge issue to make some gold jewelry from time to time. I haven't done writs on all my toons since the last anniversary event, and still have enough to make 15-20 pieces of jewelry. Probably have enough surveys stockpiled to make another 5-10 in a pinch.

Also remember, that Gold Jewelry is barely noticeable. Its just not worth making gold jewelry on anything but a near meta build for PVP or score pushing in PVE. This is even more true if the trait is robust or arcane. Gold jewelry or lack thereof is never the reason you lost a fight in PVP or wiped in a PVE prog. I am sure the best groups could show an objective benefit on a perfect leaderboard run, but that's about it.

Truthfully the greatest benefit to gold jewelry (in bloodthirsty) for most people is that it can certainly be the difference in a dummy parse if you are trying to hit a minimum number for a trial group to accept you. Even then, the difference aint much.

kargen27

"Well, for people like myself that are swimming in both gold currency and gold mats, now my easy supply of gold currency is turned off. "

and those new to the game, how do they go about making gold? Early in the game that bit of gold revenue really helps.