New Q4 system will be some kind of ‘Endless Dungeon‘

Kappachi

Faulgor wrote: »

I think my main issue is that an Endless Dungeon doesn't sound like a new system as they advertised for Q4, but just a new arena the kind of which we used to get with Q4 zone DLCs.

In his letter, Matt also said that players want "content that utilizes our already existing zones to add new things to do", and so far, I have seen nothing this year that would address this. It basically screams veteran overland, but alas ...

For now I just hope there's more to it that they can't talk about yet.

Just means the endless dungeon will likely feature tilesets from every existing dungeon/zone probably, if so it'll keep it interesting if it's truly endlessly generated and could even give roleplayers something to look forward to as they try to reason out all the areas/floors of the dungeon.

Jaraal

Kappachi wrote: »

Faulgor wrote: »

I think my main issue is that an Endless Dungeon doesn't sound like a new system as they advertised for Q4, but just a new arena the kind of which we used to get with Q4 zone DLCs.

In his letter, Matt also said that players want "content that utilizes our already existing zones to add new things to do", and so far, I have seen nothing this year that would address this. It basically screams veteran overland, but alas ...

For now I just hope there's more to it that they can't talk about yet.

Just means the endless dungeon will likely feature tilesets from every existing dungeon/zone probably, if so it'll keep it interesting if it's truly endlessly generated and could even give roleplayers something to look forward to as they try to reason out all the areas/floors of the dungeon.

I've always enjoyed the portals in Imperial City, where you fight four common daedra and then one tougher one, then four more and two tougher ones, and then close the portal and loot the reward chest. It would be cool to see the portals last longer, with more waves, and increasing number and quality of enemies. And let it be "endless," meaning that you can keep fighting until you lose. And perhaps spawn the pinion after a few waves so you can close it whenever you feel the need. Then let the reward scale based on how well you did.

Etny2k

If this is how I imagine it then it would be a place to farm experience. I craved something like this for Fallout 76. Why should I port around all day with loading screens hunting for xp when devs can just make an endless kill dungeon and I do it til I run out of ammo. This might be different for ESO than Fallout cause ESO world has many more monsters to get xp from. But in the end it would be the solution to easier xp farm.

Papasears1982

Vrienda wrote: »

Aaaand my interest is gone. Cutting a dungeon and story DLC for an endless coop dungeon? Didn't they see how Torghast flopped for World of Warcraft?

Did u miss the 2 new dungeons coming in spring and the 30hours of story content coming with Necrom release?

alternatelder

Papasears1982 wrote: »

Vrienda wrote: »

Aaaand my interest is gone. Cutting a dungeon and story DLC for an endless coop dungeon? Didn't they see how Torghast flopped for World of Warcraft?

Did u miss the 2 new dungeons coming in spring and the 30hours of story content coming with Necrom release?

We literally lost a story and dungeon dlc this year. Why are you intentionally ignoring that?

Cameron991

Tbh I wish they went with this a different way I think Q3 dlc being replaced with fixes was good but replacing Q3 and Q4 just for an endless dungeon sounds very dry. I wish instead they gave us another zone in Q4 with the endless dungeon being apart of that. I want to see the northern part of the televanni peninsula. For us pvpers and questers we are going to pretty much have to wait a full year for more zone content and new region that sounds dull. Excited for the chapter though

Mayrael

I imagine it could be fun if:
1. No anti-solo mechanics (like bosses that give you unbreakable CC etc.)
2. Good loot table
3. Increasing difficulty with each "stage"


EDIT:
And about the "missing" dungeon or story - there is a lot of us who wanted QoL year patch which would focus on fixing bugs, improving performance etc.

Destai

Given my time here and on Reddit, I think there's been very little requests for roguelike features like an endless dungeons. Sounds like this is something they're giving us in lieu of the Q3 dungeons.

I just hope the rewards are attractive. Dungeons now have motifs and gear sets to earn. I'm hoping they have at least that, if not more rewards like furnishing plans. It'll be interesting to see how it impacts dungeon-running populations.

I'm cautiously excited about it, will be something fun to run with my wife.

Darkstorne

Mayrael wrote: »

I imagine it could be fun if:
And about the "missing" dungeon or story - there is a lot of us who wanted QoL year patch which would focus on fixing bugs, improving performance etc.

The issue here is, that's always been a misconception for how game development works.

You don't tell your texture artists, writers, level designers, encounter team etc to "please go work on engine code optimizations and bug fixes instead for a few months". That's mostly an entirely separate job role and team. So all that's been accomplished here is providing ZOS an excuse to produce less content under the guise that they're giving you exactly what you asked for.

Another source of copium that had been floating around was "maybe they've created a super-sized Chapter by adding what would have been the Q4 zone (ie Apocrypha) into the Chapter's zone (Necrom) for the largest Chapter yet. We're not getting less zone content overall, just all bunched into the summer release." But Rich recently confirmed in an interview that Necrom's size is roughly the same as all previous Chapters were.

So they really are just committing significantly fewer resources and man hours to ESO this year, on top of reusing a lot of art assets from the Vvardenfell Chapter (first time we've ever seen so much asset reuse in a Chapter), and we're left wondering... is this how it will be every year from now on? Or is this a one-off so that their team can get a head-start on 2024's content which will mark ESO's tenth anniversary, for which they might understandably want to blow the doors off with a huge Chapter. 2023 is objectively and undeniably a lower-effort output though, and we just have to hope the quality of the content in Necrom is enough to outweigh the loss in quantity.

Destai

Darkstorne wrote: »

Another source of copium that had been floating around was "maybe they've created a super-sized Chapter by adding what would have been the Q4 zone (ie Apocrypha) into the Chapter's zone (Necrom) for the largest Chapter yet. We're not getting less zone content overall, just all bunched into the summer release." But Rich recently confirmed in an interview that Necrom's size is roughly the same as all previous Chapters were.

So they really are just committing significantly fewer resources and man hours to ESO this year, on top of reusing a lot of art assets from the Vvardenfell Chapter (first time we've ever seen so much asset reuse in a Chapter), and we're left wondering... is this how it will be every year from now on? Or is this a one-off so that their team can get a head-start on 2024's content which will mark ESO's tenth anniversary, for which they might understandably want to blow the doors off with a huge Chapter. 2023 is objectively and undeniably a lower-effort output though, and we just have to hope the quality of the content in Necrom is enough to outweigh the loss in quantity.

I started thinking similarly to your comment shortly after the reveal, and Rich's comment just reinforced it. Fewer releases with the same headcount isn't bad, especially given the gravity of bugs we've seen since Greymoor. We can only hope they're taking a more sober approach on their development pace. It is hard not to feel like they're shifting resources away. If they are truly working on performance, they have a lot of trust to regain on that.

I'm not as excited for the new zone as I was at the reveal. The reuse of assets seem pretty pronounced, and they're pulling a lot from previous TES games too. I'll probably do the story once, get the WBs/Dolmens and Skyshards, and do the stickerbook.

Conversely, I'm actually happy with less dungeons per year, because of how I consume content and what my goals are. I can see where it might be different for some though. I'm mostly focused on stickerbook and group content, completing those tends to take me longer than a zone would.

In the end, the hopium is wearing off for me. It feels like they're increasing monetization at the expense of the game's longevity and enjoyment. Rewards seems to be a frequent topic; one I don't think they're open to addressing. Actually addressing that would get me more excited than an expansion at this point.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

About 85% of my playtime in ESO is PVE dungeons and Trials. The idea of a dungeon with no end is frankly not appealing to me in the slightest. I never liked Zombies in COD. I realize not apples to apples, but its the closest thing to an endless dungeon I have experienced, well that and Ms. Pac-Man.

Elvenheart

Based on what we actually know for sure about the endless dungeon and the new chapter I am excited and can’t wait for it to happen. Will that change as more information comes out? Will any of the possible postulations in this topic turn out to be true? Only time will tell! 🧙‍♂️

SilverBride

I imagine it as a cross between a dungeon and an arena. I'm not sure what to expect but I am interested in checking it out.

What I'm wondering is if there is going to be one endless dungeon, or one endless dungeon for each zone, or just one for now with new ones added in future chapters.

TX12001rwb17_ESO

I wonder if the dungeon is "truly" endless it will be something like this, It takes a bunch of hand crafted rooms

- Ayleid Hallway 1
- Ayleid Hallway 2
- Ayleid Hallway 3
- Ayleid Hallway 4
- Ayleid Hallway 5

Each of these rooms is designed that they can connect with a different set of rooms and it will be set up randomly, sometimes Ayleid Hallway 3 will be connected to Ayleid Junction 6 and sometimes it will be Ayleid Hallway 2 connection to Ayleid Junction 4 and many of these dungeons are set up so they can spawn a set of enemies from an Ayleid themed leveled list which will determine what enemies you will encounter.

XSTRONG

If the Endless dungeon was an Arena why wouldnt they just call it a Endless arena.

I have read they had something like an endless dungeon in wow but I have never played wow and will never do so I dont know about that.

I would guess you will run like a circle in the dungeon and when you get past the last part of the dungeon it will automatically spawn a new instance for you after opening a door or something in that way it is endless!

It will probably get harder and harder the more new instances it spawns for you but im sure there is a max level of difficulty, after reaching max difficulty the dungeon will just keep on going on the max difficulty which i hope have great rewards and some kind of currency only for Endless Dungeons.

XSTRONG

This is my idea of reward system in the new Endless dungeon, I personally would live in this dungeon farming

A NPC that gives raid like quest for the endless dungeon daily and/or weekly.

When you accept the quest and enter the dungeon the dungeon forms itself depending on what quest you have.

The quest that the Npc have warrys from Superior, Epic and Legandary Who is the most rarest raides with the highest rewards.

The Quest can be something like reaching a certain dungeon level, collect x amount of these stones from monsters.
The bigger quests Epic and Legandary should be more grindy and/or harder maybe be as weekly quest.

You can also run the endless dungeon without picking up a quest to earn XP, regular loot and maybe a currency like system where you can pick up these Stones and trade them for goodies at the NPC.

ThelerisTelvanni

If we get an endless dungeon, I'd be varry happy if I get to choose what kind of dungeon I get. So I can choose I want to explore an Ayleid Ruin filled with the enemy type Ayleid undead. Or I want to visit a deadric Ruin of Sheogorath filled with his respective servants.

I'd love to be able to go in there solo or with a companion. Also with 1-3 friends so I can visit with a regular dungeon group if needed. A dificulty selection with normal and veteran might be also interesting. After all sometimes I want something nice and relexing, while other times I need a challange.

As for rewards I'd like to finde cool sets, furniture and furnitureplans for the fitting dungeon style, as well as some character costumisation stuff.

Terces

I didn't play Torghast but it wasn't even the only attempt at an "Endless Mode" that WoW tried, there was also the Proving Grounds which wasn't popular either. I'm not sure if the PG system is still in the game but I did it once at launch and then never again. Just not for me.

I don't know if I'd try some kind of Endless Mode again, but I hope it turns out fun for those who want it. I might try it if you can pop in for 10 minutes, clear a room, get some loot and exit - I'd enjoy more interesting content that isn't as time-intensive as arenas can be for example.

Kappachi

Destai wrote: »

Given my time here and on Reddit, I think there's been very little requests for roguelike features like an endless dungeons. Sounds like this is something they're giving us in lieu of the Q3 dungeons.

I just hope the rewards are attractive. Dungeons now have motifs and gear sets to earn. I'm hoping they have at least that, if not more rewards like furnishing plans. It'll be interesting to see how it impacts dungeon-running populations.

I'm cautiously excited about it, will be something fun to run with my wife.

sounds to me like you're not browsing hard enough, this is the one feature I think was missing from ESO after coming here from Anarchy Online/Phantasy Star Online 2, all my previous favorite MMOs had some kind of endless dungeon and I had definitely asked for this kind of thing, though not on the forums.

Seraphayel

Kappachi wrote: »

Destai wrote: »

Given my time here and on Reddit, I think there's been very little requests for roguelike features like an endless dungeons. Sounds like this is something they're giving us in lieu of the Q3 dungeons.

I just hope the rewards are attractive. Dungeons now have motifs and gear sets to earn. I'm hoping they have at least that, if not more rewards like furnishing plans. It'll be interesting to see how it impacts dungeon-running populations.

I'm cautiously excited about it, will be something fun to run with my wife.

sounds to me like you're not browsing hard enough, this is the one feature I think was missing from ESO after coming here from Anarchy Online/Phantasy Star Online 2, all my previous favorite MMOs had some kind of endless dungeon and I had definitely asked for this kind of thing, though not on the forums.

It's still not a very popular wish for a new feature. To say it wasn't asked for by some random guys on Reddit or the forum is disingenuous, but it was definitely far down the line of requested new things to get.

Castagere

Just the fact that they use the term buddy is just sneaky. Why couldn't they just say a companion or another player is needed? Zos does this kind of crap way too much now.

SeaGtGruff

Castagere wrote: »

Just the fact that they use the term buddy is just sneaky. Why couldn't they just say a companion or another player is needed? Zos does this kind of crap way too much now.

"Buddy" doesn't sound even remotely sneaky to me. It might not be exhaustively explicit, as some people apparently need it to be; but calling it "sneaky" seems harsh and judgy.