Can We Be Better, Please?

EozZoe1989

yea it is what it is,
and i like multiplaying.. and solo so .. iam good

thorwyn

Feel like the developers are in a no win situation now. The combat changes seem to be universally disliked, but if they do revert them then the toxicity the community has shown will be reinforced.

That is completely their fault.

I personally don’t want to be represented by a community that feels toxicity, negativity, and personal attacks is the path to change. We aren’t there yet, but we are close, so that’s where I hope we can look at our community and say,”we should be better.” And no, I don’t care to hear,” but ZOS…”

You are not being represented by anyone. You are an individual part of a community just like everybody else here and if you think you have something to contribute, do it in any shape or form that seems appropriate to you. And let the rest of the community do the same. [snip]

[edited for bait]

renne

Iselin wrote: »

ZOS' style of making pronouncements about changes, never actively discussing or acknowledging valid criticism of said changes is itself disrespectful to us.

Literally this. In my time in the game the number of times I've seen ZOS ask for feedback on a new patch and then utterly disrespect the time and effort people have put in on the PTS to give them that feedback and proceeded to live massive bugs, utterly broken patches, etc. etc. (That they then push to console anyway knowing all these issues exist but refusing to acknowledge it even though it's been talked about all over the forums for weeks, because they refuse to delay content they know is horrendously broken because the poor PC people have had to suffer through it)

THAT is disrespectful. People testing on the PTS volunteer their time to do it and ZOS can't even be bothered acknowledging the issues they find, even if they can't fix them before they push the content live to PC first.

DMuehlhausen

Riptide wrote: »

They need to wade in, here. Substantively.

And have been needing to do so for years.

Devs will never wade through the forums. It's a complete waste of time.

starkerealm

thorwyn wrote: »

Feel like the developers are in a no win situation now. The combat changes seem to be universally disliked, but if they do revert them then the toxicity the community has shown will be reinforced.

That is completely their fault.

I personally don’t want to be represented by a community that feels toxicity, negativity, and personal attacks is the path to change. We aren’t there yet, but we are close, so that’s where I hope we can look at our community and say,”we should be better.” And no, I don’t care to hear,” but ZOS…”

You are not being represented by anyone. You are an individual part of a community just like everybody else here and if you think you have something to contribute, do it in any shape or form that seems appropriate to you. And let the rest of the community do the same. [snip]

[edited for bait]

In fact, they specifically shut down the class rep program last month. Literally the team that was supposed to represent your feedback to the devs is gone, and then they did this.

karekiz

MaraxusTheOrc wrote: »

Look, I’m not going to white knight the changes in 35. I haven’t had a chance to join the PTS, but my initial reaction is one of significant skepticism.

That said, the hyperbolic and adversarial forums posts are not doing us any favors. Trust goes both ways. If the developers see our feedback after any patch is “I’m canceling, ESO is dead, you ruined everything,” why would they look at this current patch differently?

I get it. There is frustration, the belief that you’re a customer and entitled to this or that, but perhaps if we take time to frame our critiques in a more constructive manner it might help our relationship with the team. The posters who highlighted the hard DPS checks in recent trials as a conflicting design principle are doing exactly that.

ESO brings a lot of us joy. The developers are people too. There’s enough toxicity in the world. ESO can be a pretty welcoming community, so let’s not lose sight of that.

U35 is the death of the one thing ESO does right. Combat. If you at all champion this its toxic for ALL players. Want to know the last devs that said "we know more".

They made Shadowlands for WoW. That worked out well.

shadyjane62

What they have done does not deserve better from us.

pklemming

Not seen the death threats, but heard about them.

It is a game and I am annoyed, but it is a game. People need to consider things in context. Issuing physical threats to anyone over a change of numbers deserves them being prosecuted at a minimum.

Anyway, just cos I am annoyed, doesn't mean I would ever want anything like that to happen to any of the team. You broke my toy, that is all

Pevey

pklemming wrote: »

People need to consider things in context. Issuing physical threats to anyone over a change of numbers deserves them being prosecuted at a minimum.

Anyway, just cos I am annoyed, doesn't mean I would ever want anything like that to happen to any of the team. You broke my toy, that is all

Of course, totally agree.

I'm angry, for sure. I'm angry about the changes, and I'll be honest that I'm also angry at the people who made them. I don't think that's unreasonable.

But I certainly don't wish anyone harm, physical or otherwise. That would be way beyond the pale. That's not what's happening here.

That said, there is no telling what ZOS employees are getting in their DMs, here and on social. I hope anyone making personal threats will see charges brought. I assume/hope ZOS has ways of dealing with that and protecting their employees from that.

JustAGoodPlayer

Only 9 people agree

But yes to be too much dissapointed is not an option too, may be it will be fixed in a good way.

But say honest, last 3 years updates was not really good in combat part of the game and game becomes worse than before each of that updates Skills do not work and a lot of problems, big DPS difference, OP classes.

So yes it is not good, but it is understandable why people are angry.

And too much really random unnecessary changes !

chessalavakia_ESO

MaraxusTheOrc wrote: »

Feel like the developers are in a no win situation now. The combat changes seem to be universally disliked, but if they do revert them then the toxicity the community has shown will be reinforced. That was essentially the root of my original post. I personally don’t want to be represented by a community that feels toxicity, negativity, and personal attacks is the path to change. We aren’t there yet, but we are close, so that’s where I hope we can look at our community and say,”we should be better.” And no, I don’t care to hear,” but ZOS…”

The negativity/toxicity is reinforced because game developers consistently choose to ignore people otherwise.

You could gradually lower the toxicity in the gaming environment towards the developers if every couple months you had the community managers send the developers a list of topics where they felt the people were nice and detailed and have the developers respond to a few of them.

Players that want responses will gradually start to copy the behavior of people getting responses.

You could also likely cut down on negativity/toxicity towards developers by involving corporate more in the balancing/design process so that corporate could take more of the heat for negative reactions and so that corporate might put a damper on some of the less popular decision making or at least spread it out more/message it better.