ESO's Content Creators are moving on

TechMaybeHic

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Gaeliannas wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

PvP is literally getting some of the most costly and difficult fixes a company can do, a server re-architecture. Nothing can be done until then. Steamers will just have to deal or stream other games. Don't get what the point is of complaining about pvp performance when they have already acknowledged it and undertaking such a massive fix.

Will believe it when I see it happen. So far it was just another in a long line of yearly announcements to placate the player base for yet another year, with zero follow up or follow through, as usual.
<glances at pinned PVP thread>

I mean go ahead. But they have been consistently doing things all along. They tried removing procs, they changed CP, etc. That they didn't work doesn't mean the effort hasn't been clearly visible.

Tried and predictably failed. Points to effort, but more at avoiding what's needed than a serious attempt at a fix. I mean even if some of those worked; would it really be a fix to have shutoff game function?

And even now, if they even are sincerely going through with server architecture. What confidence in it working is expected after a year of performance that the game measurably got worse, followed by a year of these tests that amounted to nothing, then another chunk of a year before hearing about this server architecture only after a public relations botch?

As people get frustrated, they'll drop and only results will bring them back. Not just streamers either.

Xandreia_

spartaxoxo wrote: »

PvP is literally getting some of the most costly and difficult fixes a company can do, a server re-architecture. Nothing can be done until then. Steamers will just have to deal or stream other games. Don't get what the point is of complaining about pvp performance when they have already acknowledged it and undertaking such a massive fix.

They have been "fixing it" for years but then nothing gets done and we just get the same copy paste "we are looking into it" post over and over again

Troodon80

Jaraal wrote: »

Gaeliannas wrote: »

As for Steam only, why would that even make a difference? Are Steam users somehow different than NA PC users, EU PC users, Console users? Are they somehow not a simple subset of everyone who plays ESO (or games in general)? I am pretty sure we are all playing the same game, regardless of how we choose to access it. We aren't talking a small sampling of players here, Steam has millions of subscribers, how they choose to spend their game time is highly reflective of the gaming world as a whole.

Exactly. I don't get why people think Steam players have different tastes and values than other ESO players. It's certainly a large enough sample of users to identify trends with.

It has little to do with taste and more to do with publicity/advertising, I would say. Games get advertised to you if you look at other games in those categories, or if your friends own them.

If you look at sites which track platforms with trophies or achievements, you see that only a very small population (17-20%) get the Level 50 achievement. That would already infer that, purely in terms of populations, ESO relies more on people who pick the game up for... maybe a week, play casually, doing a couple quests, and then drop it, people who never even make it to level 50. Presumably they are also the reason for the Cold Storage/Sharding. To remove the 70-85% of accounts who haven't logged on in years out of the main database.

We don't know how many of those people who have "left" fall into that category, nor do we know how many of those migrated over to the ZOS version, a slow but steady migration showing the steam statistics as a falling game when in reality they have simply shifted to a different provider of the game. Like this person. As I also mentioned in that post, as of around 2017, there were issues with the Steam version which caused a number of people to migrate to the ZOS version of the game. Those statistics, like all statistics, are open to interpretation.

As for content creators, I've known a great many content creators who try ESO on Twitch and in general the viewership is abysmal. They've yet to get their footing on Twitch or YouTube. People who watch them are largely friends. Then they stop.

How many content creators there are is not necessarily a good indicator of game health. You can see the difference when there is an official stream versus any of the stream team members or other casual streamers. The casual streamers have less than 100 in most cases I've seen. The stream team members have more than 100. Then we come to the official streams, and they often get to or exceed 50,000. Why are those 50,000 not watching other streamers? Probably for the same reason I'm not. I'm playing the game, I don't need to watch someone else play it at the same time.

Lephrel

Most MMOs have a large community of players who have played the game for many years, maybe even since launch. With ESO this isn't the case anymore. The exodus of long term players has a problem for a long time now. Because ZOS slowly stripped ESO of everything that used to make it fun and because performance was allowed to decline steadily, most 5+ years players have left the game.
Looking at ESO streamers this is very apparent: Sypherpk, Lefty Lucy, KristoferESO, KodiPVP, Fengrush - all the OG streamers are gone.

Elsonso

Lephrel wrote: »

MMOs have a large community of players who have played the game for many years, maybe even since launch. With ESO this isn't the case anymore. The exodus of long term players has a problem for a long time now. Because ZOS slowly stripped ESO of everything that used to make it fun and because performance was allowed to decline steadily, most 5+ years players have left the game.

I would agree, being (1) a long term player from launch, and (2,3,4) a long term player from launch that sees ZOS chasing away long term players from launch with a lack of timely fixes, seemingly laid back approach to performance, game play changes that drastically impact how people play, and decisions that are very polarizing.

It is great that ZOS feels that their game needs to evolve over time to attract new players and do new things, but it would be cool if they did that without first chasing away a portion of the long term players. They don't even attempt to sell their changes and build grass roots support. Or... if they do, they are not doing it right.

Influencers, streamers, and content creator are not immune to this process. We can see it when they stop playing ESO to play other games and actively promote other games over ESO, or just drop out of sight.

Gaeliannas

Jordan.nick11b14_ESO wrote: »

Gaeliannas wrote: »

karekiz wrote: »

.

Gaeliannas wrote: »

defcon.dealer1b14_ESO wrote: »

As I said, steam only, this is the norm for any game (especially one that is 8 years old) and the game has plenty of players, investors and are still pumping out content. I call that "thriving".

Apparently you have a different definition of thrive than the accepted standard, that's cool. The disconnect is, I was going by the actual definition, which ESO is doing the opposite of at the moment according to available data:

Well, what is exactly thriving? Is it Lost Ark? Is it WoW? FF14? Which FF14 by Steam charts hit its peak on November 29th (95K Users). It has fallen 50% on steam charts since then in one year (34K Users as of April 4th).

https://steamcharts.com/cmp/39210,306130#1y

Is actually a good example of comparisons if were just randomly deciding things. One full year for both games.

How other games are doing is kind of immaterial to the conversation at hand, which is content creators are leaving ESO after update 33, and it has been theorized that this is because their viewership has left. We aren't really talking about how other games are doing, just that ESO doesn't seem to be doing so well after numerous recent fumbles. Others postulate ESO is doing great, even growing, regardless of data to the contrary.

Well it's great to hear it's going to be fixed; what more can we ask? If they devs have acknowledged the issue and have said they're invested in fixing it--isn't that a win?

What more can we ask than to be told for what, 4-5 years now that "We are working on it"? I don't know, maybe some progress or actual results? Results are a win, everything else is just wind.

LalMirchi

I do personally feel that the streamers and "influencers" are a megre drop in the ocean, how about a massive mainstream advertisement in a wide setting? Getting the message out to the general public? This company does not lack the gold

Vaoh

LalMirchi wrote: »

Perhaps this is a good thing? IMO games should not be wagged by the tail.

I respect the vision that the creators of ESO hve established and will continue to follow the game.

What vision? Their combat balance shifts multiple times every year lmao. And fyi losing content creators is not good.

I don’t think people understand just how insanely popular this MMO would be if there weren’t so many drastic missteps being made.

spartaxoxo

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Gaeliannas wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

PvP is literally getting some of the most costly and difficult fixes a company can do, a server re-architecture. Nothing can be done until then. Steamers will just have to deal or stream other games. Don't get what the point is of complaining about pvp performance when they have already acknowledged it and undertaking such a massive fix.

Will believe it when I see it happen. So far it was just another in a long line of yearly announcements to placate the player base for yet another year, with zero follow up or follow through, as usual.
<glances at pinned PVP thread>

I mean go ahead. But they have been consistently doing things all along. They tried removing procs, they changed CP, etc. That they didn't work doesn't mean the effort hasn't been clearly visible.

Tried and predictably failed. Points to effort, but more at avoiding what's needed than a serious attempt at a fix. I mean even if some of those worked; would it really be a fix to have shutoff game function?

And even now, if they even are sincerely going through with server architecture. What confidence in it working is expected after a year of performance that the game measurably got worse, followed by a year of these tests that amounted to nothing, then another chunk of a year before hearing about this server architecture only after a public relations botch?

As people get frustrated, they'll drop and only results will bring them back. Not just streamers either.

Sure. I agree with everything here and don't expect people to continue to play a game that's not working for them. Regardless, a fix is being worked on and they have very visibly tried other things.

I don't think it's fair to say that they haven't tried. I think it's fair to say they've constantly failed. It's simply demonstrably false that nothing has been done to try. They have tried and failed for years. That's already bad enough but they have not ignored it and are not currently ignoring it.

They also already working on one of the biggest fixes they could possibly do, so there's really nothing else for them to but work on that fix. This one will either succeed or failed, but it's already in progress.

Lysette

It depends as well much on what kind of game play you like, if you see the game's performance being better or worse. From my perspective the game runs better than ever before - so there is progress, but it might not be everywhere. I hope that the redesign of core server elements will solve some of the group performance problems and enable mass battles in cryo again (out of self-interest even, if more will be in cyro, then they won't be in overland and that will be beneficial for my game play).

SeaGtGruff

I don't know why some people are suggesting that any decline in ESO PvP streamers is related to Update 33, because most of the ones I used to watch (and admittedly, there were maybe only half a dozen or so who I followed regularly) had moved on to other games long before Update 33-- like, a year or more ago.

And most of those streamers have been streaming a number of other games rather than sticking with the same one-- in fact, some of them were streaming other games back when they were also streaming ESO. In other words, they were pretty much always variety streamers, even if they did stream ESO most of the time back when they played ESO.

Only one former ESO PvP streamer who I follow has been consistently playing the same game since moving on from ESO, and that game is World of Warships. They've been playing it exclusively (as far as I've seen) rather than jumping from one game to another as some of the other former ESO streamers have been doing.

But those PvP streamers moved on from ESO long before Update 33. And that's okay. Most of the non-MMO streamers I've watched have gone through one or more of the single-player TES games and then moved on to other games, because that's how most gamers play-- they play through a game to "beat" it, then put it aside and pick up some other game to play through and "beat." Occasionally you'll see a streamer who seems to stick almost exclusively with a particular game or game series, but they're the exception rather than the rule.

Of the PvP gamers who do still stream ESO, the ones I prefer to watch are the ones who are obviously enjoying themselves and the game. That goes for PvE streamers as well. I don't especially enjoy listening to people griping about whatever game they're playing, about how unskilled their teammates are, or bashing the people they're playing against, or just griping about life and the world in general.

As far as streamers in general-- PvE, PvP, MMO, single-player, etc.-- I usually prefer ones who give interesting or insightful commentary, whether about the game or just life in general. That's because I'm almost always playing ESO or one of the other TES games at the same time that I'm watching Twitch, and unless I'm doing something that doesn't require my attention (such as daily crafting writs), I'm typically listening to the streamer more than watching them. Therefore I'm most inclined to tune in to streamers with pleasant and engaging personalities, or whose commentary I find instructive or interesting.

Synaptic

Lephrel wrote: »

Most MMOs have a large community of players who have played the game for many years, maybe even since launch. With ESO this isn't the case anymore. The exodus of long term players has a problem for a long time now. Because ZOS slowly stripped ESO of everything that used to make it fun and because performance was allowed to decline steadily, most 5+ years players have left the game.
Looking at ESO streamers this is very apparent: Sypherpk, Lefty Lucy, KristoferESO, KodiPVP, Fengrush - all the OG streamers are gone.

I still remember Fengrush's rant videos ... good times

prof-dracko

IMO a big part of the problem is the lack of new content. There are four updates each year, and of those only one has any major lasting impact. The Chapter has a lot to do, but a semi-dedicated player will get that cleaned up in a month or two. The DLC even quicker. And the four Dungeons are unique, but not something everyone really cares about, nor do they contribute much to the whole experience. Only a few weeks after they drop, it can be hard finding a group of four to do any of the DLC dungeons even as far back as Falkreath and Bloodroot unless it's their Undaunted day, and sometimes not even then.

Personally I think they need to drop these big stretches of nothing. I get that new areas take a long time to develop, but smaller releases done more frequently with maybe one or two big yearly events might be a better business strategy. Something to keep players continually interested besides rehashed events and reskinned pet/mounts/outfits as rewards.

Maybe drop a few new small quests in existing zones, or have a rota or events like fishing competitions or dragon slaying raids every week instead of reserving them for scheduled festivities. Something that incentivizes players to gather and interact. Since Deadlands I just felt as if I've done everything in the game I wanted to do. Every repeatable quest at least once. Every trial and dungeon on at least normal. And I just don't feel the need or drive to keep exploring. Probably wont until High Isle gives me something new.

Synaptic

Stamicka wrote: »

Way back in 2015 when I was looking for a game to play, I came across a SypherPK video where he was playing in Cyrodiil as a Stamblade. PvP looked so fun and watching him play convinced me to buy the game. I’ve been playing the game for 7 years now.

All this to say that streamers and YouTubers play an important part in attracting people to the game. I imagine many potential PvP oriented ESO customers have decided not to purchase the game after watching a streamer badmouth PvP or after seeing no PvP content at all.

PvPers are already a shrinking minority of the playerbase, but the loss of streamers will only make the PvP playerbase get smaller.

It was very similar for me as well, I already had friends playing the game but I wasn't 100% sold on it until I saw some of SypherPK's 1vX videos. The videos I remember where he was showcasing different PvP builds were well edited, fun and engaging, and that's ultimately what got me very interested in this game.

I know Deltia's still going at it but even he's expressed some dissatisfaction with the state of the game and PvP specifically on his streams.

DaveMoeDee

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

SerafinaWaterstar wrote: »

Still not understanding why they are a thing…..

Yep. I don't get this whole streaming thing. Let alone why it should be 1) an indication of a game's health; or 2) a job you can earn a living at.


/oldmanyellsatcloud

As another old man, let me say that Twitch is powerful advertising. It leads to a lot of new users. It creates an influx of new players when players with a lot of followers play a game. As players who don't have access to the login information, it is an available metric we can look at.

I don't know how much that means long term, but we could say the same about all promotional events, like free weekends.

As far as being a job, that is the nature of being an entertainer. You make money so long as there are people interested in sending money your way.

DaveMoeDee

ADarklore wrote: »

The problem I think we are having is that when a content streamer (PVE especially) posts builds or finds success with certain skills... ZOS sees it and then nerfs those skills (it happened recently to Carve and Stampede). So why bother spending your time to offer builds if ZOS is just going to turn around and nerf those skills making those builds, and therefore your time, pointless?!?

Further, I think a lot of people are also playing other games, Elden Ring comes to mind. There has to reach a point in a streamer's life where streaming THE SAME content over and over and over gets old... so it doesn't surprise me that PVP streamers would need a break or move on.

If the audience interest was there and the gameplay was still fun, they would stick with the game and mix in a little variety.

Celephantsylvius_Bornasfinmo

Sounds like someone watched Sawman's video about content creators.

Well it is kind of true. With a lack in innovative game designs: PVE/PVP well you won't see that crowd enjoying/sharing as much as before and it's already hard to get old friends back into the game, so I believe it.

When the card game drops they'll be here either way, even if they don't like the idea or not.

Then time will tell if it's worth staying for it or not.

defcon.dealer1b14_ESO

Gaeliannas wrote: »

defcon.dealer1b14_ESO wrote: »

As I said, steam only, this is the norm for any game (especially one that is 8 years old) and the game has plenty of players, investors and are still pumping out content. I call that "thriving".

Apparently you have a different definition of thrive than the accepted standard, that's cool. The disconnect is, I was going by the actual definition, which ESO is doing the opposite of at the moment according to available data:

Definition of Thrive
1: to grow vigorously : FLOURISH
2: to gain in wealth or possessions : PROSPER
3: to progress toward or realize a goal despite or because of circumstances

As for Steam only, why would that even make a difference? Are Steam users somehow different than NA PC users, EU PC users, Console users? Are they somehow not a simple subset of everyone who plays ESO (or games in general)? I am pretty sure we are all playing the same game, regardless of how we choose to access it. We aren't talking a small sampling of players here, Steam has millions of subscribers, how they choose to spend their game time is highly reflective of the gaming world as a whole.

Yes, my definition of thriving is on par with the accepted standard. Your's is not, and that's ok.

Yes, consoles and pc's have millions as well...and yes, if those accurate numbers ( not from 3rd party 'guesstimate's ) were released from ZOS/Bethesda, they would most certainly count......for consoles and pc's only.

To say the console numbers and or pc numbers represent the entire player base, would be ridiculous. Just as it is for whatever steam shows.

Gorem

well its what happens when a game becomes greedy, milks the cash cow dry, instead of focus on fixing things they break everytime they screw up the games base code with new content.

i say build a team to reboot the game entirely on UE5 like other older games are doing behind the scenes. 60% performance increase alone on server loads with the new nanite model texture merging. i think it would make the game upkeep easier to manage and work on, and have far less issues when new content is released. Would Free up resources for creating better content, increase house item counts which will increase creativity, Almost Eliminate Lag in PVP, they wouldn't have to worry about gear proc mechanics causing problems. i could go on and on but it would be the best solution to all of the headaces they are faced with currently. Especially now they are working on WOW in EU5, that alone would hurt them, might wanna jump on board so they don't get left behind.

TechMaybeHic

prof-dracko wrote: »

IMO a big part of the problem is the lack of new content. There are four updates each year, and of those only one has any major lasting impact. The Chapter has a lot to do, but a semi-dedicated player will get that cleaned up in a month or two. The DLC even quicker. And the four Dungeons are unique, but not something everyone really cares about, nor do they contribute much to the whole experience. Only a few weeks after they drop, it can be hard finding a group of four to do any of the DLC dungeons even as far back as Falkreath and Bloodroot unless it's their Undaunted day, and sometimes not even then.

Personally I think they need to drop these big stretches of nothing. I get that new areas take a long time to develop, but smaller releases done more frequently with maybe one or two big yearly events might be a better business strategy. Something to keep players continually interested besides rehashed events and reskinned pet/mounts/outfits as rewards.

Maybe drop a few new small quests in existing zones, or have a rota or events like fishing competitions or dragon slaying raids every week instead of reserving them for scheduled festivities. Something that incentivizes players to gather and interact. Since Deadlands I just felt as if I've done everything in the game I wanted to do. Every repeatable quest at least once. Every trial and dungeon on at least normal. And I just don't feel the need or drive to keep exploring. Probably wont until High Isle gives me something new.

I disagree with having more updates. I think they should take all content additions and put it in a yearly patch as one big thing, then focus on fixing the rest of the year. As is, we barely go a month before the next patch is on PTS and focus is on that while things are still broken from the last patch.

prof-dracko

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

prof-dracko wrote: »

IMO a big part of the problem is the lack of new content. There are four updates each year, and of those only one has any major lasting impact. The Chapter has a lot to do, but a semi-dedicated player will get that cleaned up in a month or two. The DLC even quicker. And the four Dungeons are unique, but not something everyone really cares about, nor do they contribute much to the whole experience. Only a few weeks after they drop, it can be hard finding a group of four to do any of the DLC dungeons even as far back as Falkreath and Bloodroot unless it's their Undaunted day, and sometimes not even then.

Personally I think they need to drop these big stretches of nothing. I get that new areas take a long time to develop, but smaller releases done more frequently with maybe one or two big yearly events might be a better business strategy. Something to keep players continually interested besides rehashed events and reskinned pet/mounts/outfits as rewards.

Maybe drop a few new small quests in existing zones, or have a rota or events like fishing competitions or dragon slaying raids every week instead of reserving them for scheduled festivities. Something that incentivizes players to gather and interact. Since Deadlands I just felt as if I've done everything in the game I wanted to do. Every repeatable quest at least once. Every trial and dungeon on at least normal. And I just don't feel the need or drive to keep exploring. Probably wont until High Isle gives me something new.

I disagree with having more updates. I think they should take all content additions and put it in a yearly patch as one big thing, then focus on fixing the rest of the year. As is, we barely go a month before the next patch is on PTS and focus is on that while things are still broken from the last patch.

That wouldn't really solve the issue of there being a massive stretch of time where nothing new happens. Putting all of it out at once might up activity for a few months, but eventually everyone would finish the content and the only thing to do is sit around and wait for the next dump of new another year away. Content fixes or not, that'd get very boring, and activity would massively drop during those off-months.

When I suggest new updates more frequently I mean maybe a quest or two each month to always make sure there's something going on. All the bug fixes in the world mean nothing if there's bugger all to do most of the year once you've experienced all the old content you're willing to sit through. And maybe if they did only put out smaller things once a month, there'd be less broken things to fix every time and the maintenance as a whole wouldn't be as tedious to sit through.

Madarc

Vaoh wrote: »

I don’t think people understand just how insanely popular this MMO would be if there weren’t so many drastic missteps being made.

This sounds like something out of a textbook for personal coaches: chapter - "Motivational help and comfort despite mistakes made."
Up to a point, I actually agree with these thoughts.
However, I think that such a thing works only temporarily to increase sucsess through popularity. Not really something to build long term and rewarding success on.

As the proverb says: The better is always the enemy of the good.
Sure,...there is supposedly nothing really better right now in this genre ,..... yet....

But...i think people quickly forget....
even games that once seemed to be the best and most important and worth their money.

Well,..I hope ZOS manages to get a better reputation despite all the bad publicity at the moment.
At least in my memory.

sarahthes

defcon.dealer1b14_ESO wrote: »

Simple really.

The more games they roll...the more ppl they will have sub...the more money they sponge from those ppl.

Every game has up's n downs with patches, updates, maintenance, new content etc etc.... (i.e...I'm having issues logging in from my NA PS5 now)

Whoever those "content creators" are, should understand one thing....the fans of this game will roll, regardless if they turn their cams on or not.

Like one person said.....I only tolerate them when there's drops.

LOL variety streaming tends to cost us streamers both viewers and subs. Switching games entirely is the kiss of death for any streamer under 1000 average viewers.

It's far safer for a small streamer to stick to just one game to build up their viewership. ESO only has small streamers, so those who switch or go variety are doing so because they aren't enjoying ESO anymore, not because they think they'll make more money.

Btw, anyone with fewer than ~100 average viewers likely isn't even getting a twitch payout every month. Each sub is only worth $1.50-2.50 for the streamer, Twitch takes the rest...

twev

wolfie1.0. wrote: »

My personal perspective is that while I respect all streamers and will try to support them. Eso is a game that is a lot more fun to play vs watch someone else play. Vs a game like dark souls or elden ring where it's the opposite

From conversations I've had with friends/guildies and other players - I believe that a fair number of solo players watch streams (or at least have them on in the background or on a 2nd monitor) just for the company and trading info in real time with other players.
Sometimes players just want to watch how other people handle dynamic situations or areas they are having troubles with, (sometimes watching to see how much better or worse other players did), and a percentage of viewers are also new players with lots of questions about the big game that has lots of unknowns in it.

Streams in and of themselves don't tend to be something that players will often watch for periods of time as a primary focus of attention unless there is a game update release or a rah-rah event with drops.

Vaoh

Madarc wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

I don’t think people understand just how insanely popular this MMO would be if there weren’t so many drastic missteps being made.

This sounds like something out of a textbook for personal coaches: chapter - "Motivational help and comfort despite mistakes made."
Up to a point, I actually agree with these thoughts.
However, I think that such a thing works only temporarily to increase sucsess through popularity. Not really something to build long term and rewarding success on.

As the proverb says: The better is always the enemy of the good.
Sure,...there is supposedly nothing really better right now in this genre ,..... yet....

But...i think people quickly forget....
even games that once seemed to be the best and most important and worth their money.

Well,..I hope ZOS manages to get a better reputation despite all the bad publicity at the moment.
At least in my memory.

The bad publicity is not new though. Whether AoE Caps, or Scalebreaker DoT changes, or even their implementation of Account-Wide achievements..... ZOS has a poor rep amongst its community which spans for a very long time.

Thecompton73

Lazarus_Rising wrote: »

Unkillable self heal tank builds were always in game and are the most defended playstyle by the pvp community. The only time i can remember, when there was no super tanky meta was in elsweyr because of the dots. Then there was such an outcry since nobody wanted to equip purge because it did interfere with the OP playstyle.

There have always been a few such builds, yes. However after update 33 those builds are easily the majority. Seeing full groups of nothing but DK's using stamina damage skills while all rocking resto staffs has become the typical experience in Cyro since the update. You either run one yourself or are at a serious disadvantage as they have really strong damage and enough recovery/mitigation/heals to indefinitely survive being outnumbered 4v1 if you do happen to catch them solo.
Seeing 80% of the population at any given time on the same class with the same build is just incredibly boring. I've been playing PvP in this game for about 7 years and this meta is by far the worst for having diversity in Cyro.

Madarc

Vaoh wrote: »

The bad publicity is not new though. Whether AoE Caps, or Scalebreaker DoT changes, or even their implementation of Account-Wide achievements..... ZOS has a poor rep amongst its community which spans for a very long time.

Yes, unfortunately true.
Imho the creators don't treat what little good is left of "Bethesda's The Elder Scrolls" as it deserves.
More than that, they are moving in a direction that takes away the series' identity. It's becoming more and more arbitrary.
Less and less individuality. And it's sinking more and more into the mass of competing offerings.
Maybe just in the attempt to assert itself in every way possible in the market of this genre.
ESO becomes a kind of jack-of-all-trades, can do a lot but nothing really well anymore.

Nevertheless i'm still curious, what may come soon.
Who knows? Maybe there will be a huge development surprise that will blow us all away?.

Gaeliannas

.

Madarc wrote: »

Nevertheless i'm still curious, what may come soon.
Who knows? Maybe there will be a huge development surprise that will blow us all away?.

I would welcome that with open arms! Sooner rather than later though, been waiting for quite a number of years already.

Gaeliannas

defcon.dealer1b14_ESO wrote: »

To say the console numbers and or pc numbers represent the entire player base, would be ridiculous. Just as it is for whatever steam shows.

Well Steam is a subset of PC players, a 20-50,000 concurrent player subset apparently. I am curious though, why you feel one platform is not representative of the overall game health? All platforms are accessing the same game, just getting there differently is all. I personally don't see a difference between them, especially judging by the feedback, all platforms seem to be experiencing all the same issues, once they are all on the same patch levels. I know people on these forums like to play the PC vs Console card all the time, but in the end, we are all playing the same core game.

Molydeus

Gaeliannas wrote: »

defcon.dealer1b14_ESO wrote: »

To say the console numbers and or pc numbers represent the entire player base, would be ridiculous. Just as it is for whatever steam shows.

Well Steam is a subset of PC players, a 20-50,000 concurrent player subset apparently. I am curious though, why you feel one platform is not representative of the overall game health? All platforms are accessing the same game, just getting there differently is all. I personally don't see a difference between them, especially judging by the feedback, all platforms seem to be experiencing all the same issues, once they are all on the same patch levels. I know people on these forums like to play the PC vs Console card all the time, but in the end, we are all playing the same core game.

Because they all have different player counts and arguably target different population groups.