Overland Content Feedback Thread

CP5

SilverBride wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

AlexanderDeLarge wrote: »

You're pretending as if there wasn't a mass exodus of veteran PvE players JUST THIS YEAR due to changes made to the endgame.

If that many end game players really left the game then there are even fewer players left to utilize a separate veteran overland if there was one.

Isn't this exactly the situation you and many others found yourselves in before one-tamriel? Like, exactly the same?

No it's not. I was responding to someone who said that there was "a mass exodus of veteran PvE players JUST THIS YEAR due to changes made to the endgame". They did not say these players left because overland was too easy.

You left because you were dissatisfied with the game, you came back when things changed, for the better I will add. You did say "If that many end game players really left the game then there are even fewer players left to utilize a separate veteran overland if there was one." which implies the mentality that "if the player group most likely to use this feature left, then it isn't needed," despite the fact your own past shows players are willing to return to the game if things improve. You, among others, are discrediting the positive impact this option, whatever form it may take, could very well bring back many players who have left. But so many ignore them and go on about how this will split the community, while at the same time ignoring those who have already been split away by virtue of not being here.

So, my point is that you left dissatisfied, ZOS changed things, and you came back. The game was made better on a whole for it. We have players leaving now, dissatisfied, and the comments of many here write it off as a non-issue or that things shouldn't change for people leaving, which goes against ZOS's past actions and the actions of a company intent on their product lasting. Also, all the points that were raised by AlexanderDeLarge and myself from the last page similarly address these points, if you wished to respond to them directly.

SilverBride

AlexanderDeLarge wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

No it's not. I was responding to someone who said that there was "a mass exodus of veteran PvE players JUST THIS YEAR due to changes made to the endgame". They did not say these players left because overland was too easy.

Yet anywhere, almost anytime the game is brought up in casual conversation, you hear and see the same complaints about lack of difficulty and clunky combat.

I have never once heard anyone complain that overland is too easy anywhere but on the forums. I play every day and I see others playing and helping each other with World Bosses and Harrowstorms and Vents. They aren't saying "I don't need help with this World Boss because overland is so easy!"

I see others playing and enjoying themselves and that is a much bigger indicator of satisfaction than a post on a forum.

Elsonso

SilverBride wrote: »

AlexanderDeLarge wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

No it's not. I was responding to someone who said that there was "a mass exodus of veteran PvE players JUST THIS YEAR due to changes made to the endgame". They did not say these players left because overland was too easy.

Yet anywhere, almost anytime the game is brought up in casual conversation, you hear and see the same complaints about lack of difficulty and clunky combat.

I have never once heard anyone complain that overland is too easy anywhere but on the forums. I play every day and I see others playing and helping each other with World Bosses and Harrowstorms and Vents. They aren't saying "I don't need help with this World Boss because overland is so easy!"

I see others playing and enjoying themselves and that is a much bigger indicator of satisfaction than a post on a forum.

I see people standing at a world boss or dolmen (like) place waiting for other people to arrive, so even if ZOS does something about overland, it looks like some overland content is already too hard.

SilverBride

CP5 wrote: »

You left because you were dissatisfied with the game, you came back when things changed, for the better I will add. You did say "If that many end game players really left the game then there are even fewer players left to utilize a separate veteran overland if there was one." which implies the mentality that "if the player group most likely to use this feature left, then it isn't needed," despite the fact your own past shows players are willing to return to the game if things improve. You, among others, are discrediting the positive impact this option, whatever form it may take, could very well bring back many players who have left. But so many ignore them and go on about how this will split the community, while at the same time ignoring those who have already been split away by virtue of not being here.

So, my point is that you left dissatisfied, ZOS changed things, and you came back. The game was made better on a whole for it. We have players leaving now, dissatisfied, and the comments of many here write it off as a non-issue or that things shouldn't change for people leaving, which goes against ZOS's past actions and the actions of a company intent on their product lasting. Also, all the points that were raised by AlexanderDeLarge and myself from the last page similarly address these points, if you wished to respond to them directly.

The situations you describe are not the same. Many players left the early game and made it clear that the difficulty of the Cadwell's Silver and Gold zones and the forced grouping of Craglorn was the reason. Cadwell's Silver and Gold were not being played by the majority of the players. The game was failing and they had to do something.

Today there is no mass exodus of players saying they are leaving because they think overland is too easy. It's been this way for 7 years now and is thriving.

Blackbird_V

SilverBride wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

You left because you were dissatisfied with the game, you came back when things changed, for the better I will add. You did say "If that many end game players really left the game then there are even fewer players left to utilize a separate veteran overland if there was one." which implies the mentality that "if the player group most likely to use this feature left, then it isn't needed," despite the fact your own past shows players are willing to return to the game if things improve. You, among others, are discrediting the positive impact this option, whatever form it may take, could very well bring back many players who have left. But so many ignore them and go on about how this will split the community, while at the same time ignoring those who have already been split away by virtue of not being here.

So, my point is that you left dissatisfied, ZOS changed things, and you came back. The game was made better on a whole for it. We have players leaving now, dissatisfied, and the comments of many here write it off as a non-issue or that things shouldn't change for people leaving, which goes against ZOS's past actions and the actions of a company intent on their product lasting. Also, all the points that were raised by AlexanderDeLarge and myself from the last page similarly address these points, if you wished to respond to them directly.

The situations you describe are not the same. Many players left the early game and made it clear that the difficulty of the Cadwell's Silver and Gold zones and the forced grouping of Craglorn was the reason. Cadwell's Silver AND Gold were not being played by the majority of the players. The game was failing and they had to do something.

Today there is no mass exodus of players saying they are leaving because they think overland is too easy. It's been this way for 7 years now and is thriving.

Have we not rebutted the Cadwell's Gold and Silver argument multiple times already? We've already said it was a pile of *** as well as Craglorn, at a time where Veteran Ranks were a thing (which was awful) and years later things have changed. Scaling works a whole lot differently now than it did in Cleopatra's time.

SilverBride

Blackbird_V wrote: »

Have we not rebutted the Cadwell's Gold and Silver argument multiple times already?

I don't agree with those rebuttals.

I play every day and I see what's actually happening in game.

Sarannah

First of all I'm against a tougher or veteran overland, especially when it would grant extra rewards.

But I felt I had to post this: For those advocating for tougher/veteran overland, keep in mind many players are doing more in overland than just combat. Afking, excavating/scrying, inventory management, banking, selling, talking to quest NPC's/listening to dialogue, watching the scenery, roleplaying, guildevents, taking screenshots, checking questlog, checking the map, respeccing, crafting, chasing leads, chatting with other players, gearing, etc. Combat is only a very tiny portion of all that is going on in overland.

PS: Have completed about two and a half zones in the last week. There are many players always out and about.

Blackbird_V

Sarannah wrote: »

First of all I'm against a tougher or veteran overland, especially when it would grant extra rewards.

But I felt I had to post this: For those advocating for tougher/veteran overland, keep in mind many players are doing more in overland than just combat. Afking, excavating/scrying, inventory management, banking, selling, talking to quest NPC's/listening to dialogue, watching the scenery, roleplaying, guildevents, taking screenshots, checking questlog, checking the map, respeccing, crafting, chasing leads, chatting with other players, gearing, etc. Combat is only a very tiny portion of all that is going on in overland.

PS: Have completed about two and a half zones in the last week. There are many players always out and about.

Those "many players" can carry on doing that. Those who want a more challenging time can opt in for a Veteran Overland. We've been asking for it to be optional for throughout this thread.

I'd rather do all the above in a more difficult scenario. It's no fun killing everything in 1-2 abilities and being able to sit there and tank a pack of adds for a minute. It's boring.

SilverBride

What exactly would players do in a veteran overland that they can't do now?

The quests are going to be the same.
The resource nodes are going to be the same.
Antiquities will be the same.
The achievements are going to be the same because they probably won't add a veteran version of every overland achievement after they just pared them down with Account Wide Achievements.
The landscape will be the same.
Players will probably still run past that pack of wolves in their way as they travel to quest objectives just like they do now.

So what are players going to do besides the same exact things they can do now? It doesn't matter if it takes 10 hits to kill a wolf as opposed to 2 if most players will just be running past these mobs anyway.

Then what about the towns and guild traders? Will there be guild traders for hire in a veteran overland? No guild will want their trader in a veteran overland that has very few players using it.

There are just too many factors not being considered with this proposition.

colossalvoids

Hope you're aware that different instances right now have the same exact guild traders, that's how the game functions. It's not like it would create a completely different game every time you changing one. As for towns being hubs, have you seen how players "disappear" when you're going into the places in old zones where the narrative changed the town due to your actions? That's a potential way to make towns a universal hub for all difficulties, for example. Yet again that's for Devs to decide, we're here just to express our frustration with the game's issues, not to propose solutions for an old as dust engine with a broken code on top that probably can't do the most basic functions still. No one is truly familiar with it either, we can talk about what was already done and observed speculating if that's even possible still after some reworks. If they see an issue it's fine, if not it's also fine.

As for "what would y'all do there" personally I'd be finally enjoying questing. Not just clicking through story yawning but actually playing through it, same as you do in dungeons currently. Not just a visual novel but with a gameplay matching the narrative.

Blackbird_V

SilverBride wrote: »

What exactly would players do in a veteran overland that they can't do now?

The quests are going to be the same.
The resource nodes are going to be the same.
Antiquities will be the same.
The achievements are going to be the same because they probably won't add a veteran version of every overland achievement after they just pared them down with Account Wide Achievements.
The landscape will be the same.
Players will probably still run past that pack of wolves in their way as they travel to quest objectives just like they do now.

So what are players going to do besides the same exact things they can do now? It doesn't matter if it takes 10 hits to kill a wolf as opposed to 2 if most players will just be running past these mobs anyway.

Then what about the towns and guild traders? Will there be guild traders for hire in a veteran overland? No guild will want their trader in a veteran overland that has very few players using it.

There are just too many factors not being considered with this proposition.

We're 156 pages deep in this thread?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

[snip]
[edited for baiting]

SilverBride

colossalvoids wrote: »

Hope you're aware that different instances right now have the same exact guild traders, that's how the game functions.

The instances to accommodate the amount of players on at one time are all identical. A veteran overland would be different with more powerful mobs. If it's not different then what is the point of having it?

colossalvoids wrote: »

As for "what would y'all do there" personally I'd be finally enjoying questing. Not just clicking through story yawning but actually playing through it, same as you do in dungeons currently. Not just a visual novel but with a gameplay matching the narrative.

I never said it that way. I said "So what are players going to do besides the same exact things they can do now?"

Veteran overland wouldn't change questing at all. The quests will still be the same as they are now and players will still run past those wolves as they are traveling to the next quest objective. Players always do what's the easiest and no one is going to take the time to kill every mob they see as they are questing.

So how will questing be more enjoyable when the quests are the exact same as they are now?

spartaxoxo

SilverBride wrote: »

So how will questing be more enjoyable when the quests are the exact same as they are now?

Even if they only changed the bosses, it would be more enjoyable because the boss would feel like a threat. It's hard to take them seriously as a world ending threat when I have to AFK to get the most out of them.

colossalvoids

SilverBride wrote: »

colossalvoids wrote: »

Hope you're aware that different instances right now have the same exact guild traders, that's how the game functions.

The instances to accommodate the amount of players on at one time are all identical. A veteran overland would be different with more powerful mobs. If it's not different then what is the point of having it?

colossalvoids wrote: »

As for "what would y'all do there" personally I'd be finally enjoying questing. Not just clicking through story yawning but actually playing through it, same as you do in dungeons currently. Not just a visual novel but with a gameplay matching the narrative.

I never said it that way. I said "So what are players going to do besides the same exact things they can do now?"

Veteran overland wouldn't change questing at all. The quests will still be the same as they are now and players will still run past those wolves as they are traveling to the next quest objective. Players always do what's the easiest and no one is going to take the time to kill every mob they see as they are questing.

So how will questing be more enjoyable when the quests are the exact same as they are now?

You have no idea how instances can be implemented neither do we. It could be "same" one with battlespirit-like debuff, literally anything they can come up with according to their idea of doing it right.

If you still not understanding what's the point I'd suggest re-read the entire thread, no one is going to hand held one player through all of that again and again on every single page like a broken record. It's all here already.

As a side note, I'm still puzzled with this fixation on wolves couple of users having, is there Tamrielic wolves society meeting nearby or something? It's not about wolves, far from it.

nb_rich

Jeez this seems to be such a big topic lol anyways I have more feedback for

Overland should be preparation for dungeons, trials and pvp, but with it being so easy it doesn’t actually prepare us.

I look back at when I first started playing eso and I only new how to use cleave lol. I pretty much used cleave to complete every zone story. When I got into my first trial I knew nothing about mechanics or rotations so I was running around trying to cleave all my enemies and was getting killed, luckily not kicked from the group lol.

The zone stories/overland needs to have stronger enemies in certain areas so we have to start learning about rotations, trying different skills and even learn some mechanics so people can smoothly get into group content.

CP5

SilverBride wrote: »

What exactly would players do in a veteran overland that they can't do now?

The quests are going to be the same.
The resource nodes are going to be the same.
Antiquities will be the same.
The achievements are going to be the same because they probably won't add a veteran version of every overland achievement after they just pared them down with Account Wide Achievements.
The landscape will be the same.
Players will probably still run past that pack of wolves in their way as they travel to quest objectives just like they do now.

So what are players going to do besides the same exact things they can do now? It doesn't matter if it takes 10 hits to kill a wolf as opposed to 2 if most players will just be running past these mobs anyway.

Then what about the towns and guild traders? Will there be guild traders for hire in a veteran overland? No guild will want their trader in a veteran overland that has very few players using it.

There are just too many factors not being considered with this proposition.

To answer your points.

• I'd actually participate in it, rather than skipping year after year of content knowing full well it'll all be forgettable as I fall asleep in the face of world ending threats
• If I wanted to farm mats, I'd go to normal, just like people already do when farming gear for sticker book progress
• Who cares if antiquities are the same, that isn't the issue
• Who cares if the achievements are the same, I'm not getting them now because I'm not participating in the content due to boredom
• Who cares if the physical landscape is the same? I haven't explored it yet because I don't find it engaging to do so
• And for your last point, I'd actually care about engaging groups of enemies if the fights were more demanding, because I actually enjoy the gameplay in ESO. In games with good gameplay, the act of playing the game alone can be fun, in Dragon's Dogma there is this dungeon called Bitterblack Isle, which is essentially 3 eso-esque dungeons back to back with 3 bosses in it, and I found myself running laps in that place from the joy of the gameplay alone. If it wasn't me shepherding a herd of sheep and instead was a combat/puzzle, I'd be far more willing to actually fight the big bads army rather than run past it.

So yes, if things were changed, people's behavior would change as well. No matter how little you care about that form of gameplay yourself does not change that other people would actually prefer and engage with an option if it were given. As it is, I ignore the content entirely unless I feel compelled to blitz across the land to get antiquity leads, then I'm gone, so actually taking part and caring about the content is rather important.

Then the argument about guild traders, as was already pointed out, are the same across all instances of the same zone as is. Do you genuinely feel that would change? Would need to change? Just as the argument you raised of "needing to double all the achievements" that sounds more like trying to throw mud at the idea to make it look worse when those 'issues' don't even exist.

Many people are not engaging with the content at all, are dissatisfied, and leaving, just like you had in the past and when ZOS changed things the game improved, and you came back, why deny that to others? Please again see the comments I've been mentioning that responded to yours as I'd like to see your opinion on them, or continue to act as if we're speaking a different language. This isn't a contest to be 'won,' ZOS could add an option, not impact you, and leave the game better for it, and constantly fighting against those who have a different perspective than you doesn't help the long term health of the game.

SilverBride

CP5 wrote: »

I'd actually participate in it, rather than skipping year after year of content knowing full well it'll all be forgettable as I fall asleep in the face of world ending threats...

If I wanted to farm mats, I'd go to normal, just like people already do when farming gear for sticker book progress...

The quests would still be the same. The only difference is the trash mobs would take a few more hits to defeat. And as you pointed out players will use normal overland to farm and other activities.

Also these quests can only be done once per character so once those are complete what will keep players in veteran overland?

So if veteran overland would only be used to do quests that are identical to the current normal overland quests
and can only be done once, why bother making a separate instance that won't even be used for anything else?

SilverBride

spartaxoxo wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

So how will questing be more enjoyable when the quests are the exact same as they are now?

Even if they only changed the bosses, it would be more enjoyable because the boss would feel like a threat. It's hard to take them seriously as a world ending threat when I have to AFK to get the most out of them.

Challenge banners for story bosses would accomplish this. It doesn't require a completely separate instance that will mostly be unused.

CP5

To the point about "the quest would be the same," I'm currently not doing the content. The biggest piece of content for every chapter every year, for the last few years. If they added an option I'd have years worth of content to catch up on, and even double back on all the old content with the 17 characters I have that haven't done it, maybe even level one of the new classes through questing, which is something I've tried to do for both one of my wardens and necromancers but gave up.

So again, your own personal lack of interest in this option does not invalidate other people interest in it, and as I've stated, simply tweaking enemy damage done/received values does not adequately change things, hence why using instances, something ZOS still uses in overland and everywhere else, would be a simple option to give people a more engaging world to explore and participate in, regardless of if you'd never use it and see it as a waste.

Because, as unfair as you see a challenging overland, companions were a waste of resources to pvp'ers who can't use them at all, the card game was a waste of resources to those who don't play it, but they weren't a waste for ZOS to make because many people do use them. Just because you wouldn't use it does not mean it has any less of a place to be.

CP5

nb_rich wrote: »

Jeez this seems to be such a big topic lol anyways I have more feedback for

Overland should be preparation for dungeons, trials and pvp, but with it being so easy it doesn’t actually prepare us.

I look back at when I first started playing eso and I only new how to use cleave lol. I pretty much used cleave to complete every zone story. When I got into my first trial I knew nothing about mechanics or rotations so I was running around trying to cleave all my enemies and was getting killed, luckily not kicked from the group lol.

The zone stories/overland needs to have stronger enemies in certain areas so we have to start learning about rotations, trying different skills and even learn some mechanics so people can smoothly get into group content.

To respond to this and bring up points that haven't come around for a few months, this is exactly what I would want a 'veteran overland' to be. A place where ESO's gameplay could shine through fully, with enemies who were meaningful and where players actually have to pay attention to who they're fighting and what's going on.

I remember doing a vet equivalent dungeon not having food and being given some for the first time, seeing my health go up by 50% and being amazed, never needing to use the food before. I remember the first time I dropped a negate, having used the storm atronach all the way until halfway through my silver zones, and being surprised that it locked down all enemies hit. Or how I leveled restoration to 50 by using radiating regen to counter the damage stonefalls flame atronachs did in my first silver zone where I struggled, when all I needed to do was explore the sorc toolkit to find surge as an option which I use to this day to great effect.

Giving players a place to engage with the games combat, without it being held back since every zone needs to be a beginner-friendly zone, would allow people a place to learn at their own pace and give people who enjoy the gameplay the world to enjoy exploring again. It always feels like a disappointment doing anything in the world after running the more recent dungeons and knowing that ZOS can make things fun and engaging, yet the world has to remain simple because no other option is there.

SilverBride

CP5 wrote: »

To the point about "the quest would be the same," I'm currently not doing the content.

That is your choice but it doesn't explain why a player would want to quest in veteran overland if nothing about the quests are different. If wanting more difficult story bosses is a factor that can easily be addressed with challenge banners.

CP5

... Because that's the point? So the process of questing isn't a tedious chore, that the combat encounters that make up the spine of almost every quest and of nearly every major quest line are actually worth participating in? The solo-instances for quest areas are already an easy enough target to modify for the individual the instance was made for, but the majority of questing is a part of the world.

How would a challenge banner work for a quest boss in overland? How much more effort would it take for ZOS to not only make the modified enemy, but add an intractable to the world and script it to apply these buffs to the intended target(s) as needed. And as I have mentioned before, more challenging enemies enrich the experience of exploring the world, it draws in my attention and makes me focus.

I mentioned before how the threat of enemies alone made me care more about my time walking along a dark road in Dragon's Dogma simply because there was a chance of danger, but as is I ride through overland on one screen while watching a video on the other. So having the actual enemies in the world be more challenging has its purpose, and it would be the reason people would be going there. You may not care for it, but it would be an option many would use because many people came to ESO for the world and stayed because they enjoyed the gameplay, this option would provide both.

SilverBride

nb_rich wrote: »

Overland should be preparation for dungeons, trials and pvp, but with it being so easy it doesn’t actually prepare us.

Overland is for questing and telling the story. The only way to learn how to do dungeons, trials and PvP is to do dungeons, trials and PvP. There is no need to learn these things while questing. Besides the fact that many players don't participate in end game context anyway.

[Edited to clarify]

SilverBride

CP5 wrote: »

... Because that's the point? So the process of questing isn't a tedious chore, that the combat encounters that make up the spine of almost every quest and of nearly every major quest line are actually worth participating in?

The quests will be the same. The story won't change to be more interesting. And since these can only be done once per character what will keep a player in veteran overland once these are complete?

CP5

Even the original mario taught players from the beginning. Many players are reluctant to do group content, either because they know they aren't ready, or because their inexperience leaves them behind at every turn. The only place for people to learn solo are the two arenas, but those places are more a testing ground for those with some experience already than a place for people to freshly learn. Having a version of overland that allows things like healing npcs to warrant being priority targets, or tank npcs being tanky and encouraging the use of armor debuffs, or enemy aoes that have enough threat to force the player to actually move, things like that are more engaging than just 'click on npcs enough to win' and actually serve as a place for people to learn and improve.

Just because it isn't how you prefer the game doesn't mean it is uncalled for, and saying "Overland is for questing and telling the story" would be like me saying "Trials are for hard core combat" as an argument for removing normal trials. It doesn't make sense, and adding options increases the scope of players who would participate in the content. Also, which content are you referring to when you say "many players don't participate in that content anyway."?

CP5

SilverBride wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

... Because that's the point? So the process of questing isn't a tedious chore, that the combat encounters that make up the spine of almost every quest and of nearly every major quest line are actually worth participating in?

The quests will be the same. The story won't change to be more interesting. And since these can only be done once per character what will keep a player in veteran overland once these are complete?

I am not doing the content. It is being done by me 0 times. If the core gameplay that follows the story content, aka a save the world quest line involves fighting an army of bad guys, so combat is core gameplay to that story, is dull and forgettable, I don't feel invested to continue it. When I wanted to finish the Rift main quest line to unlock the daily to get the motif, I went to western skyrim to do the quest line in order, and quit when I was in a swamp looking for clues or something. I was face to face with the big bad and thought to myself only "how many arrows can fit in his face?"

That doesn't encourage me to continue, knowing this end of the world threat isn't worth my time. The story would actually be made more interesting if I actually felt the year long bad guy actually was a challenge, like the original Doshia who showed the deadric invasion plot of the main story and fighters guild was serious. I fought her and thought to myself, this is just one of their scouts, and I was more invested in the story because I knew the deadric army was something to be taken seriously. ESO is a video game, it tells its stories in an interactive way, the way that interaction is done matters, and overland fails many with how it only offers one experience that is designed to accommodate new players.

SilverBride

CP5 wrote: »

Just because it isn't how you prefer the game doesn't mean it is uncalled for, and saying "Overland is for questing and telling the story" would be like me saying "Trials are for hard core combat" as an argument for removing normal trials. It doesn't make sense, and adding options increases the scope of players who would participate in the content. Also, which content are you referring to when you say "many players don't participate in that content anyway."?

Trials are there to provide a challenge for those who enjoy that. I am not sure what removing their normal mode would accomplish but there is no connection between this and overland, which is a completely different type of content.

And this still doesn't answer how the same quests and stories would be more interesting or what would keep players in veteran overland once the quests were complete.

TaSheen

nb_rich wrote: »

Jeez this seems to be such a big topic lol anyways I have more feedback for

Overland should be preparation for dungeons, trials and pvp, but with it being so easy it doesn’t actually prepare us.

I look back at when I first started playing eso and I only new how to use cleave lol. I pretty much used cleave to complete every zone story. When I got into my first trial I knew nothing about mechanics or rotations so I was running around trying to cleave all my enemies and was getting killed, luckily not kicked from the group lol.

The zone stories/overland needs to have stronger enemies in certain areas so we have to start learning about rotations, trying different skills and even learn some mechanics so people can smoothly get into group content.

Well, overland doesn't need to prepare me for any of that. I don't do group content, dungeons, trials, pvp - first because it's not content I have any interest in any more, and second because it would be really tacky to dump my mega ping into a group and expect them to put up with it.

But as long as the harder overland is completely optional I don't care if it arrives. My fear is that "optional" will not be how ZOS decides to enable it....

If it's an across the board ramping up of difficulty, we'll see if it's possible for me to manage it. If not, I'll drop my 3 annual subs and make my merry way back to Oblivion and Skyrim.

spartaxoxo

nb_rich wrote: »

Overland should be preparation for dungeons, trials and pvp, but with it being so easy it doesn’t actually prepare us.

Overland is supposed to prepare users for normal dungeons and deliver a story. It is tutorial content not intended to teach advanced techniques yet. It does a good job of it.

If they ever do a separate instances it absolutely shouldn't be about teaching new to vet people. It should instead be tuned to like VMA or VVH and be a challenge for people who are already vet level IMO

Blackbird_V

SilverBride wrote: »

nb_rich wrote: »

Overland should be preparation for dungeons, trials and pvp, but with it being so easy it doesn’t actually prepare us.

Overland is for questing and telling the story. The only way to learn how to do dungeons, trials and PvP is to do dungeons, trials and PvP. There is no need to learn these things while questing. Besides the fact that many players don't participate in end game context anyway.

[Edited to clarify]

The amount of people I've had to not only carry, but explain in-depth for over an hour in basic dungeons like vCoA II is far too much. It goes to show that this is not a training place, especially when pugging. Now, I do not mind if they listen and try, but the ones that don't are the worst. Then you get the other kind that spam acid spray, die, die, die, die, die, die, die, die, die, die, then leaves the dungeon. It goes to show that their overland build of just spamming 1 ability DOES NOT teach you the basics of combat. Not only that, it's unfair on all parties: the ones that want to do the dungeon have to then wait for someone to fill the gap - further wasting our time, and the casual since they've wasted their time and not learned the basics, as a dungeon run can NOT do that, or at least, effectively.

CP5 wrote: »

[...] like the original Doshia who showed the deadric invasion plot of the main story and fighters guild was serious. I fought her and thought to myself, this is just one of their scouts, and I was more invested in the story because I knew the deadric army was something to be taken seriously. ESO is a video game, it tells its stories in an interactive way, the way that interaction is done matters, and overland fails many with how it only offers one experience that is designed to accommodate new players.

I remember really struggling to do Doshia before 1T. Learnt there that those orbs heal the boss, but if you destroy them it heals you. I don't think that many people actually know about that interaction, because like who tf cares? Nowdays you can ignore it. Any harvester will just die now anyway without a threat, if it heals so what? It's like +0.6seconds more to kill. Woaw. However, before 1T killing that orb for the heal was 100% worth doing, but now it's a waste of time.

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