Weighted RNG in U32

lillybit

oterWitz wrote: »

colossalvoids wrote: »

So the last nail into RNG complaints with this one, drops would be adjusted according to what you already collected so no more 10 resto staves in a row for some of ya. Just making sure people are informed about something good nowadays.

As someone who's relying on your helpful forum posts after the fact, can someone clarify "Weighted" RNG? When I first read it I assumed it meant there was still a chance, albeit a lesser one, of pulling an item you already have, while RNG was weighted toward pulling something you don't yet have.

But the comments here make it look like "Weighted" = only pulling what you don't already have, which is both generous and extremely weighted, if you follow my thinking.

From what I understood, you'll only get things you don't already have in your collections until it's full, then it'll go back to how it is now. So if you only need a dagger and an inferno, you'll definitely get one of those two weapons. Things will only drop from the same places tho so you'll still need to do the last boss for weapons.

Aelsioln

colossalvoids

oterWitz wrote: »

colossalvoids wrote: »

So the last nail into RNG complaints with this one, drops would be adjusted according to what you already collected so no more 10 resto staves in a row for some of ya. Just making sure people are informed about something good nowadays.

As someone who's relying on your helpful forum posts after the fact, can someone clarify "Weighted" RNG? When I first read it I assumed it meant there was still a chance, albeit a lesser one, of pulling an item you already have, while RNG was weighted toward pulling something you don't yet have.

But the comments here make it look like "Weighted" = only pulling what you don't already have, which is both generous and extremely weighted, if you follow my thinking.

As I remember they've started with that you'll have better chances of pulling the new item but when I was quickly recapping this feature to some people who aren't watching but curious they started answering some questions I'd assume and it was more like you'll be pulling new items until sticker book would be done but we'll get precise information on it on Monday when PTS patch notes would come.

kargen27

B0SSzombie wrote: »

I'm curious though.

They said overland chests won't be Weighted. But what about Dungeon/Trial Chests? Or Arena Chests from killing a boss? What about Coffers as rewards for clearing a quest/Trial?

Had this playing in the background while doing other stuff but I think they said chests would all stay the same because they don't want people just farming the chests. They don't want to guarantee a Medusa Inferno staff from a chest so players don't worry about going to last boss.

MasterSpatula

I've been playing really sporadically this year due to weariness with a lot of the decisions ZOS makes.

This, though, might bring me back to hard core.

SerraKBella

I wish this would apply to monster shoulders! I've spent so many keys trying to get the right one to drop (Lord Warden - I'm looking at you)

Indigogo

Amber Plasm resto, you will be mine!

Wolf_Eye

Finally, Spell Power Cure Reso staffs will exist for the first time, lol.

SirAndy

Am i the only one who immediately thought "great, they're prepping us for a upcoming gear cap increase"?

Maybe i'm just old and bitter ...

redspecter23

SirAndy wrote: »

Am i the only one who immediately thought "great, they're prepping us for a upcoming gear cap increase"?

Maybe i'm just old and bitter ...

With stickerbook, crafting and this new RNG system, the only thing a cap increase would do is make us all upset about the gold mats we threw away on old gear and in 3 months, everything would be exactly the way it is right now anyway.

That doesn't mean they won't do it of course just to make people remake a pile of gear, but any grind associated with gear has already been done.

The better thing to do is just remove gear levels altogether and have it scale with you as you level up. It only really matters for lowbies where you lose power as you level up due to gear levels and the small amount of time that your account is at champion level but not 160 yet. Once you hit cp160, you just forget gear levels even exist.

Ippokrates

Luke_Flamesword wrote: »

It's very good change, now it will be possibile to actually collect everything. Hehe, there will be new behaviour in dungeons - after every boss players will stop, go to inventory and bind new item just to avoid double in next boss

Well, most medium bosses drop armours, which are quite easily to collect, so only last one would give you guaranteed jewelry or weapon. Only trials could be inflicted by this issue and of course chests.

However... IMHO with this change, people would be more focused on gameplay and achievements than item grinding, because they will now that it would be possible to collect everything in reasonable perspective

Ippokrates

And I almost forgot - GJ ZOS

Sheezabeast

SirAndy wrote: »

Am i the only one who immediately thought "great, they're prepping us for a upcoming gear cap increase"?

Maybe i'm just old and bitter ...

I mean honestly with the CP cap raised and armor cap being 160, my mind thinks it would be rational that they would raise it to 200 eventually. But that's just my brain liking 200 numerically more than 160. To me 150 and 200 make more sense progression-wise than 150 to 160. Yes I would be really, really pissed. I would have to regrind a LOT. I would have to regrind for mats and armor and jewelry. But would I do it for numerical OCD? Eh.....I'm still using blue jewelry because I don't want to pay for purple crafted jewelry for some builds. And some builds I have made purple jewelry for, I have not splurged for gold jewelry yet. So if now, I can still compromise the stat difference between blue and purple and purple and gold for as long as Summerset has been out, I may be able to handle regrinding armor cap changes. But I would complain. But eat it for numerical pleasing OCD reasons.

oterWitz

I just realized that, as most sets have thirteen weapons/shield plus two jewelry pieces and three sets per dungeon, 45 will be the magic "max" number for farm runs, of which there will be plenty going around when the system comes out. And it'll be interesting to see if the people on the eso armory leaderboard do a push to see who is first to complete the stickerbook (though perhaps they'll still get hung up by pvp sets since those aren't affected, I'm not sure).

Very much looking to PTS on Monday, and then when this goes live

Aznarb

ooh didn't see that, that great will definitely made me back to farm ! :>

Rishikesa108

I'm a RNG's victim... so I DO appreciate this step, ZOS.
Just a question: is this applied also for leads and trophies or just for gear and weapons ? Thanks in advance

colossalvoids

Rishikesa108 wrote: »

I'm a RNG's victim... so I DO appreciate this step, ZOS.
Just a question: is this applied also for leads and trophies or just for gear and weapons ? Thanks in advance

Dungeons, trials and arenas.
As far as I remember there's not much overlapping places for leads to drop and monster trophies are one per type so not sure how can they help with any of that.

Bl4ckR3alm93

EF321 wrote: »

Ok, I actually do see a problem with this now... I farm purple jewelry (or gold in trials) rather than reconstruct lower quality and upgrade. Normally jewelry has like 50% chance to drop (or something high at least, not 1 in 14). So it is easy to get full set of jewelry quick. With this system, to get that second ring, you will havebto collect everything first. And if you first done on normal and got blue neck, even worse.

Still would rather take this trade off. Once your done collecting everything which wont take long, it'll revert back to normal.

cptqrk

As someone who has suffered for an eternity in their MMO life (looking mostly at you EQ and WoW) I welcome this change / addition.

I just hope this won't diminish the number of people running dungeons or trials they no longer 'need' anything from.

Rudrani

is this gonna be legal, or will someone get wrist slapped for... collecting everything except pSir fire, or pBM fire... and then selling runs? (cuz they know they will get it and can trade it)

Rudrani

Alaztor91 wrote: »

This is a good change but I have to wonder if ZOS realizes how this is going to impact stuff like Dungeon Finder for example. If I already have the Monster Helm ini th all 3 weights there is no reason for me to run the dungeon on Vet unless you really want that purple jewelry, and if I have all the 3 sets 100% completed for that specific dungeon then there is no reason to run it at all unless I'm missing achievements, leads or it's pledge day.

I think that eventually as more and more players 100% complete their sets that this is going to have a negative effect on queue times, specially when you are queuing for stuff that is DLC or not the daily pledge(not like it doesn't already happens, but it's just going to be more notorious as more players complete their sets)

Also, it would be nice if they implement this system for the Horned Dragon and Fanged Worm styles from BG.

i think they keep the nerf/new stuff cycle uptime going well enuff for that

Ippokrates

Rudrani wrote: »

Alaztor91 wrote: »

This is a good change but I have to wonder if ZOS realizes how this is going to impact stuff like Dungeon Finder for example. If I already have the Monster Helm ini th all 3 weights there is no reason for me to run the dungeon on Vet unless you really want that purple jewelry, and if I have all the 3 sets 100% completed for that specific dungeon then there is no reason to run it at all unless I'm missing achievements, leads or it's pledge day.

I think that eventually as more and more players 100% complete their sets that this is going to have a negative effect on queue times, specially when you are queuing for stuff that is DLC or not the daily pledge(not like it doesn't already happens, but it's just going to be more notorious as more players complete their sets)

Also, it would be nice if they implement this system for the Horned Dragon and Fanged Worm styles from BG.

i think they keep the nerf/new stuff cycle uptime going well enuff for that

No need for that. Plenty of people doing vet stuff to get keys they can spend on random chests that gives them motifs. Plus even if you have full collection, you still need TC to use the stickerbook, so normal queue wouldn't be harm either.

zaria

oterWitz wrote: »

colossalvoids wrote: »

So the last nail into RNG complaints with this one, drops would be adjusted according to what you already collected so no more 10 resto staves in a row for some of ya. Just making sure people are informed about something good nowadays.

As someone who's relying on your helpful forum posts after the fact, can someone clarify "Weighted" RNG? When I first read it I assumed it meant there was still a chance, albeit a lesser one, of pulling an item you already have, while RNG was weighted toward pulling something you don't yet have.

But the comments here make it look like "Weighted" = only pulling what you don't already have, which is both generous and extremely weighted, if you follow my thinking.

Yes has some tested this on the PTS?

I assume its an weighted RNG, say you have an 25-50% chance of getting an missing item from collection, else you get the standard loot table.
Say you run an dungeon where you miss the light monster helmet. On the last boss you have an 50% chance of getting the missing helmet as in light if you have an 50+16.5% chance for missing item. you have an 16.5% chance of getting an heavy.
After getting the light helmet you have 1/3 chance of any weight again.

Luke_Flamesword

Nope, it's more simple - you will always get a thing that you don't have collected, so if you have light monster helm, next time you will get medium or heavy. So 3 runs of vets gives you 100% chance for full collection of masks. After that it will be old system rng again.

oterWitz

zaria wrote: »

oterWitz wrote: »

colossalvoids wrote: »

So the last nail into RNG complaints with this one, drops would be adjusted according to what you already collected so no more 10 resto staves in a row for some of ya. Just making sure people are informed about something good nowadays.

As someone who's relying on your helpful forum posts after the fact, can someone clarify "Weighted" RNG? When I first read it I assumed it meant there was still a chance, albeit a lesser one, of pulling an item you already have, while RNG was weighted toward pulling something you don't yet have.

But the comments here make it look like "Weighted" = only pulling what you don't already have, which is both generous and extremely weighted, if you follow my thinking.

Yes has some tested this on the PTS?

I assume its an weighted RNG, say you have an 25-50% chance of getting an missing item from collection, else you get the standard loot table.
Say you run an dungeon where you miss the light monster helmet. On the last boss you have an 50% chance of getting the missing helmet as in light if you have an 50+16.5% chance for missing item. you have an 16.5% chance of getting an heavy.
After getting the light helmet you have 1/3 chance of any weight again.

It's like Luke_Flamesword said, if you do a monster helm run and are only missing the light version, you will 100% get the light version (the extremely generous interpretation, if we're going from my old post ). Once you collect the light, it's back the the old system where each weight has a 1/3 chance to drop. The PTS threads have been pretty good about clarifying this. For example, running a dungeon will still require killing the end boss to get weapons and jewelry, while the other bosses drop body pieces.

It has been difficult to test this on the PTS, for me at least, because creating a template character also fills your stickerbook which made the new system impossible to test on your account afaik.

The remaining questions I don't recall seeing answers to are 1) whether bosses with named set pieces can still have a chance to drop them while rolling on the weighted RNG table, or if these pieces just count for their stickerbook item and won't drop again until the rest of your stickerbook for that dungeon/trial/arena/overland is full. I'd suspect it's the latter case but I'm not sure. And 2) Whether coffers earned for completing trials are affected by this new item set curation. Other coffers, such as Undaunted shoulders and PvP coffers, aren't affected so I'd expect these aren't either. But again, I'm not sure.

colossalvoids

Rudrani wrote: »

is this gonna be legal, or will someone get wrist slapped for... collecting everything except pSir fire, or pBM fire... and then selling runs? (cuz they know they will get it and can trade it)

Yeah it's absolutely legit, zos thought pattern is that it would settle over time and economics will recover by itself according to Rich.

Artemis_X_

The only weapon not to drop for me in Arx is the inferno Staff.... How much can I make offering runs now!?

zaria

Wolf_Eye wrote: »

Finally, Spell Power Cure Reso staffs will exist for the first time, lol.

Got mine first from the key vault after the second anniversary event.

oterWitz wrote: »

zaria wrote: »

oterWitz wrote: »

colossalvoids wrote: »

So the last nail into RNG complaints with this one, drops would be adjusted according to what you already collected so no more 10 resto staves in a row for some of ya. Just making sure people are informed about something good nowadays.

As someone who's relying on your helpful forum posts after the fact, can someone clarify "Weighted" RNG? When I first read it I assumed it meant there was still a chance, albeit a lesser one, of pulling an item you already have, while RNG was weighted toward pulling something you don't yet have.

But the comments here make it look like "Weighted" = only pulling what you don't already have, which is both generous and extremely weighted, if you follow my thinking.

Yes has some tested this on the PTS?

I assume its an weighted RNG, say you have an 25-50% chance of getting an missing item from collection, else you get the standard loot table.
Say you run an dungeon where you miss the light monster helmet. On the last boss you have an 50% chance of getting the missing helmet as in light if you have an 50+16.5% chance for missing item. you have an 16.5% chance of getting an heavy.
After getting the light helmet you have 1/3 chance of any weight again.

It's like Luke_Flamesword said, if you do a monster helm run and are only missing the light version, you will 100% get the light version (the extremely generous interpretation, if we're going from my old post ). Once you collect the light, it's back the the old system where each weight has a 1/3 chance to drop. The PTS threads have been pretty good about clarifying this. For example, running a dungeon will still require killing the end boss to get weapons and jewelry, while the other bosses drop body pieces.

It has been difficult to test this on the PTS, for me at least, because creating a template character also fills your stickerbook which made the new system impossible to test on your account afaik.

The remaining questions I don't recall seeing answers to are 1) whether bosses with named set pieces can still have a chance to drop them while rolling on the weighted RNG table, or if these pieces just count for their stickerbook item and won't drop again until the rest of your stickerbook for that dungeon/trial/arena/overland is full. I'd suspect it's the latter case but I'm not sure. And 2) Whether coffers earned for completing trials are affected by this new item set curation. Other coffers, such as Undaunted shoulders and PvP coffers, aren't affected so I'd expect these aren't either. But again, I'm not sure.

Regarding named pieces, is that not the quest rewards from dungeon quests?
I assume they are not included here.

warsteheineub17_ESO

zaria wrote: »

Regarding named pieces, is that not the quest rewards from dungeon quests?
I assume they are not included here.

I think oterWitz was refering to items like "The Unbroken", a flame staff for the Spell Power Cure set.

Ippokrates

zaria wrote: »

Wolf_Eye wrote: »

Finally, Spell Power Cure Reso staffs will exist for the first time, lol.

Got mine first from the key vault after the second anniversary event.

oterWitz wrote: »

zaria wrote: »

oterWitz wrote: »

colossalvoids wrote: »

So the last nail into RNG complaints with this one, drops would be adjusted according to what you already collected so no more 10 resto staves in a row for some of ya. Just making sure people are informed about something good nowadays.

As someone who's relying on your helpful forum posts after the fact, can someone clarify "Weighted" RNG? When I first read it I assumed it meant there was still a chance, albeit a lesser one, of pulling an item you already have, while RNG was weighted toward pulling something you don't yet have.

But the comments here make it look like "Weighted" = only pulling what you don't already have, which is both generous and extremely weighted, if you follow my thinking.

Yes has some tested this on the PTS?

I assume its an weighted RNG, say you have an 25-50% chance of getting an missing item from collection, else you get the standard loot table.
Say you run an dungeon where you miss the light monster helmet. On the last boss you have an 50% chance of getting the missing helmet as in light if you have an 50+16.5% chance for missing item. you have an 16.5% chance of getting an heavy.
After getting the light helmet you have 1/3 chance of any weight again.

It's like Luke_Flamesword said, if you do a monster helm run and are only missing the light version, you will 100% get the light version (the extremely generous interpretation, if we're going from my old post ). Once you collect the light, it's back the the old system where each weight has a 1/3 chance to drop. The PTS threads have been pretty good about clarifying this. For example, running a dungeon will still require killing the end boss to get weapons and jewelry, while the other bosses drop body pieces.

It has been difficult to test this on the PTS, for me at least, because creating a template character also fills your stickerbook which made the new system impossible to test on your account afaik.

The remaining questions I don't recall seeing answers to are 1) whether bosses with named set pieces can still have a chance to drop them while rolling on the weighted RNG table, or if these pieces just count for their stickerbook item and won't drop again until the rest of your stickerbook for that dungeon/trial/arena/overland is full. I'd suspect it's the latter case but I'm not sure. And 2) Whether coffers earned for completing trials are affected by this new item set curation. Other coffers, such as Undaunted shoulders and PvP coffers, aren't affected so I'd expect these aren't either. But again, I'm not sure.

Regarding named pieces, is that not the quest rewards from dungeon quests?
I assume they are not included here.

I only guess, but named pieces are rather in trophies departament, not regular drop, because it is not always dropped by final boss but also minibosses and even mobs ;p