Should there be Justice System punishments for...

LettuceBrain

Yes, there should be some fine for unnecessary use of flashy abilities / dueling in towns.

My issue isn't so much the dueling (though it can be annoying), it is the sorc pets on top of stations and NPCs. I think it would be better if outside of combat pets get despawned in towns. For the dueling, the NPC radius idea someone had seems great.

Nastassiya

No, they're perfectly fine doing what they're doing.

No, you're in a public place and the guards would enforce it if the law states we can't duel in public. As they do not permit it then we are fine to do this. Don't tell me that when you see me, in Vivec, I cant cover my face because it makes you uncomfortable do you?

kadochka

Yes, there should be some fine for unnecessary use of flashy abilities / dueling in towns.

Nastassiya wrote: »

No, you're in a public place and the guards would enforce it if the law states we can't duel in public. As they do not permit it then we are fine to do this. Don't tell me that when you see me, in Vivec, I cant cover my face because it makes you uncomfortable do you?

I was suggesting that, as one of the options, the guards would enforce it, and ask you to stop.

As for that last part, I'd like to remind you that irl politics are frowned upon in the forums... so that opinion is not needed. Please do not bring that here.

EvilAutoTech

Years ago, I promoted an idea I called "city limits". It would restrict many activities in any area that would be considered a city (places where you can zoom the world map past the standard zone zoom). I suggested mounts, dueling, pets and spells with extreme visual effects should not be allowed. I still think that I would like to have this implemented, but I'm sure there are players who would call it game-breaking.

However, you cannot tell other players that they are not allowed to use game features that they paid for. No dueling in town or near any wayshrine is just ridiculous.

My current thoughts concerning dueling center around arenas. I think 1 per alliance and 1 in each chapter zone (including Wrothgar and Craglorn) would be enough if implemented correctly. Put a wayshrine in the middle and give duelers an incentive to use them. Tournaments from time to time, earning small amounts of gold or utility items would be a good start. Services like a bank, vendors and guild traders could be placed around the perimeter to give duelers a home rather than just trying to control how others play the game. I mean, theres always the single player games if you want to avoid people.

kadochka

Yes, there should be some fine for unnecessary use of flashy abilities / dueling in towns.

EvilAutoTech wrote: »

Years ago, I promoted an idea I called "city limits". It would restrict many activities in any area that would be considered a city (places where you can zoom the world map past the standard zone zoom). I suggested mounts, dueling, pets and spells with extreme visual effects should not be allowed. I still think that I would like to have this implemented, but I'm sure there are players who would call it game-breaking.

I would not disable mounts (nor non-combat pets), since they aren't that disruptive. The others makes sense, yes.

EvilAutoTech wrote: »

However, you cannot tell other players that they are not allowed to use game features that they paid for. No dueling in town or near any wayshrine is just ridiculous.

Nobody has paid anything to duel. They're not losing anything by being asked to move, like.. 30-50 ft away from the wayshrine, out into the 'non-town' areas.

On the topic of tournaments... I absolutely suck at PvP, but that's a funky idea!

Arahallris

No, they're perfectly fine doing what they're doing.

The only player skills that need to be punishable are sorc pets. You could argue warden bears, though at least they're of the living plane and aren't flying in your face they get a free pass.

kadochka

Yes, there should be some fine for unnecessary use of flashy abilities / dueling in towns.

Arahallris wrote: »

The only player skills that need to be punishable are sorc pets. You could argue warden bears, though at least they're of the living plane and aren't flying in your face they get a free pass.

big fluffy butts in my way... trying to click on the shrine! But who's gonna tell a BEAR to move?!

Ackwalan

In the real world, dueling was usually outlawed. people that wanted to duel had to do so outside the city limits or risk being arrested. If a guard sees you dueling, you should get a bounty similar to stealing an apple. You can still duel inside a city, you just have to be selective where you duel.

It would add roleplaying aspect to dueling.

Sylvermynx

(...or something else. Add your ideas below, but be nice! and no swearing!)

@kadochka - I believe @Nastassiya is speaking of her character in game (likely a dunmer). I doubt it's in relation to RL.

kadochka

Yes, there should be some fine for unnecessary use of flashy abilities / dueling in towns.

Sylvermynx wrote: »

@kadochka - I believe @Nastassiya is speaking of her character in game (likely a dunmer). I doubt it's in relation to RL.

Oh, good lord. Not clear at all.
Alright, fine. Doesn't change my opinion on the fact that yall need to duel NOT inside the bank... but at least it's clearer now.

Bradyfjord

(...or something else. Add your ideas below, but be nice! and no swearing!)

I've not often had these behaviors affect me. But if it a justice system is to be implemented I would like a zone with a warning so people can move away if they want. These zones should only be near merchants/craft stations/writ turn-in areas.

The zone's effects would be as follows:

• Impossible to cast/activate skills, spells, momentos, and so forth.
• Gives a count down, from 5 - 1. At 1, all buffs/debuffs on the player are cleansed. (pets are buffs and thus dispelled)
• Dispel all powers and effects.
• Certain buffs would remain such as ESO+, XP pots, and other similar effects.

I would like it this way so people who are chilling with a friend while crafting can move away if they wish to keep their flappy friends summoned out. It should also prevent dueling with anything but light/heavy attacks.

Hollyniss

No, they're perfectly fine doing what they're doing.

Duels in the city doesn't bother me. Sometimes I watch people duel in towns even if I never partake in it myself. As for the dyeing issue I just go to another station. The pet issue is more of a zos problem, they should make it to where pets don't interfere with interactions. I don't expect sorcs or wardens to put their pets away because the devs made it to where pets block things. I just deal and move on or go to another station if need be. They have to remove the pets from the skill bar in order to unsummon and then put it back when out of town. As for despawning them in town I don't think that would solve the issue because there are places outside of towns when you're questing where you have to interact with doors, npcs, ect. It'd make much more sense in the long run to have it to where you can interact through the pets or maybe an option to hide other players pets.

SilverBride

Yes, there should be some fine for unnecessary use of flashy abilities / dueling in towns.

danno8 wrote: »

Perhaps come up with a better solution than banning dueling in towns or fining those who do it.

It's not hard to just step outside town to duel.

Viewsfrom6ix

No, they're perfectly fine doing what they're doing.

Dueling is hardly the problem here. Most people that care about dueling don't even duel in populated areas.

This is a video game and not a simulation of how real life law works.

I feel like these restrictions only satisfies RP. The real annoying thing are people's pets and assistants.

kargen27

SilverBride wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

What city allows fighting in the streets? The guards uphold other common laws such as stealing, and if you attack an npc you will suffer consequences, so why allow dueling? Dueling is fighting.

Because both have agreed to the duel and will not accidently hurt others. An NPC doesn't agree to have his/her pockets picked or to be attacked.

And what about the innocent bystanders who get hit and are covered with ice for instance? Did they agree to be involved?

It doesn't matter if they agree to fight, or if others who unwillingly get hit by the effects are hurt or not. Logically, fighting in the streets is not acceptable behavior. Guards are there to uphold the laws and keep peace.

It doesn't hurt anyone if my Vampire accidentally uses her ultimate in town but she will get whacked down by the guards because of her transformation. And it doesn't hurt anyone if my Necromancer accidentally summons her minion in town, but she will suffer the same fate.

The guards don't tolerate anything that can be perceived as a violent act. So why is it logical that they turn their backs on players fighting?

You are applying logic from our world. Tamriel maybe duels are the accepted way to solve disputes while vampirism and necromancy is still frowned upon?

SilverBride

Yes, there should be some fine for unnecessary use of flashy abilities / dueling in towns.

kargen27 wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

The guards don't tolerate anything that can be perceived as a violent act. So why is it logical that they turn their backs on players fighting?

You are applying logic from our world. Tamriel maybe duels are the accepted way to solve disputes while vampirism and necromancy is still frowned upon?

That is speculation.

But the fact remains that it is very easy to just step out of town to duel. It also shows consideration for others, which is something we could use more of.

DarcyMardin

Yes, there should be some fine for unnecessary use of flashy abilities / dueling in towns.

At least ban it anywhere near the bank, crafting stations and outfit stations.

LalMirchi

No, they're perfectly fine doing what they're doing.

No as this will probably introduce a sleuth of bugs for us to bear.

MissingCosmos

No, they're perfectly fine doing what they're doing.

A lots of people being annoying just the sake of it. I dont think they should be punished in some way because they don't really hurt anybody. Like spammers you can easily ignore them. But i think there should be "reduce" option for effects. It will probably help at a lots of cases. But i think punishing annoying people is unnecessary.

ThorianB

(...or something else. Add your ideas below, but be nice! and no swearing!)

Once you enter town combat pets should be unsummoned/hidden automatically and any flying non combat pets should be grounded. Duels should not be allowed inside of towns. Especially near wayshrines, crafting areas, and undaunted tents.

Sangwyne

No, they're perfectly fine doing what they're doing.

kadochka wrote: »

...spam-casting or dueling in towns? Specifically, on or around crafting / dye stations, or in enclosed spaces like around merchants or in banks.
The fines would probably be small, like the ones you get for minor thievery, but honestly, if you're the jerk that decides to run past while I'm outfit-designing and spam a bunch of big glowy AoE effects, all the while fully knowing what you're doing...

Edit: for those answering no, can you explain why? Are you seriously not bothered by the people dueling and casting big flashy spells in your face while you're trying to dye your armor? or by the lag behind your map when people decide dropping DK Standard on the central wayshrine is a cool thing to do? Am I alone in this?????

"Oi oi mate, you got a loicense for those abilities?" Now you too can experience the joy of playing Necro and getting randomly fined in town for casting.

And if you're having issues with a single skill being used near a wayshrine, you might wanna look into upgrading your Etch-A-Sketch. My rig is a veritable hunk of junk, I got the entire thing, monitor, cables, computer, mouse, keyboard and all, off a place that literally had "Discount" in their name for about the same as I pay to have takeout delivered (seriously, that stuff is expensive, how do they calculate those fees??), and I've never had issues with DK standard tanking my framerate.

ZOS_ConnorG

Greetings all,

After review we have had to edit or remove several posts for rule violations, mostly Inappropriate Content. Ensure when engaging in a discussion that you keep said discussion civil, constructive, and within the rules. Remember that discussions of real world politics are not allowed on the forums.

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Tandor

(...or something else. Add your ideas below, but be nice! and no swearing!)

I'd prefer to have dueling disabled in towns and crafting stations. I don't think using the Justice System would help, not least because innocent passers-by often find themselves caught up in duels e.g. by their weapons being unsheathed and I'd hate them to get punished by the guards.

Hydra9268

Recommend creating dueling arenas where the victor can win fabulous prizes from an arena master. That serves a two-fold purpose of moving duels away from towns and crafting stations.

I would also add arena viewing seating where players can earn prizes for watching duels. For example, watch for an hour and acquire a motif or a random house item (the more rare item have lower percentages).

Perhaps the devs can add the arenas to the three faction's capital city outlaw refuges.

cyberjanet

Yes, there should be some fine for unnecessary use of flashy abilities / dueling in towns.

Tethilia wrote: »

One way we could fix dueling in towns is by making Dueling Pits in some outlaw havens.

Hammerdeath Arena is in a base game area and is designed for duelling.
Colosseum of the Old Ways in Artaeum gives you achievements for duelling there.
And almost every house (not starter apartments) can be turned into a duelling arena.

I like the idea of tavern brawls. But even in a tavern brawl, people either get ejected or arrested.

Jierdanit

No, they're perfectly fine doing what they're doing.

kadochka wrote: »

danno8 wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

danno8 wrote: »

Or maybe we should all just lighten up a bit and realize that in an MMO you share the world space with others and there will be things others do that annoy you, and things you do that annoy others.

So those who want repercussions for dueling in town should "just lighten up a bit and realize that in an MMO you share the world space with others", but those who are dueling don't have to offer the same consideration to those around them?

Perhaps come up with a better solution than banning dueling in towns or fining those who do it.

How about asking ZoS to make casted buffs have no effect on other players while within towns?

Seriously? How does disallowing dueling in certain spots not sound like a proper fix, especially compared to that? sorry, I just don't see how that makes any sense.

Because other people than you might want to duel in cities, or rather not have to tell someone theyd like to duel to go out of the city with them, because its not possible to duel inside...

Seriously what is so terrible about 2 ppl dueling each other in a city?
Not like theyre hurting you by doing that.
The only thing they may disturb is the looks of a very small part of a city and i think its very possible to just ignore that and go on with what you wanted to do without having to do anything about it.

twev

(...or something else. Add your ideas below, but be nice! and no swearing!)

I'd be more than fine with certain areas being cordoned off from pets entering or dueling occurring, or maybe at least muting spammed abilities within the area.

Tandor

(...or something else. Add your ideas below, but be nice! and no swearing!)

Hydra9268 wrote: »

Recommend creating dueling arenas where the victor can win fabulous prizes from an arena master. That serves a two-fold purpose of moving duels away from towns and crafting stations.

I would also add arena viewing seating where players can earn prizes for watching duels. For example, watch for an hour and acquire a motif or a random house item (the more rare item have lower percentages).

Perhaps the devs can add the arenas to the three faction's capital city outlaw refuges.

Or go afk for an hour...

silvermistktralasub17_ESO

(...or something else. Add your ideas below, but be nice! and no swearing!)

Mind you, I myself have visual issues exacerbated by flashy spells (mostly healing staff, but some psijiic and templar abilities too). However, there are specific reasons that it would be a very bad idea to allow player characters, at the least, to go after others who 'disturb the peace'. And that is what is most commonly asked for by those wanting a 'justice system'. On the other hand, I managed to very easily, one night, while waiting for writs to stop, convince people to silence those gaudy spells. I stated that, at that point, my character was turning off the 'prevent attacking innocents', and, should someone else force her to become a target of such blinding spells, she would attack the nearest npc, and the bounty, because she was under their effects (it was healer staff uses, specifically, that time), would transfer to the one who had cast on her. I also pointed out that the character in question had maxed TG, DB, and legerdemain trees, so would actually end up with a far lesser bounty (and it would decrease faster) than theirs would, should they continue to harass me. It caused people to rethink, as it was a direct threat to their 'pocket books', and that generally is a smarter way to convince people not to continue annoying things. But, not everyone can do that. I just know that allowing players, especially to go after other players, even in a 'justice system' in a non-pvp area, is a very bad idea. And will always be so. There are reasons the only times I've ever been in cyrodiil have been to visit the golden vendor or to grab the tables needed for my house (I run guild house)...and I personally refuse to get involved in pvp at all. But allowing pcs to do that would be a very bad idea, because there are many who do not know restraint, and would not learn it from this.

SilverBride

Yes, there should be some fine for unnecessary use of flashy abilities / dueling in towns.

Jierdanit wrote: »

Seriously what is so terrible about 2 ppl dueling each other in a city?
Not like theyre hurting you by doing that.
The only thing they may disturb is the looks of a very small part of a city and i think its very possible to just ignore that and go on with what you wanted to do without having to do anything about it.

It is disruptive. This is why other mmos have disabled dueling in towns.

Why is there such opposition to just stepping out of town to duel? It is such a simple solution that leaves everyone happy, so why the resistance?

I think I know the answer, unfortunately. Some players just want the attention. Others just enjoy disrupting others. Some want both.

It would be a smart move on ZoS's part to eliminate situations with a high propensity for conflict among the player base.