What's the deal with Jewelry crafting?

Mobius0

I'm sure this has been complained about since the beginning of time, but what's the deal with jewelry craft being overall 10 times more difficult than other skills, even though it is IMO one of the least valuable crafting skills? Why has this gone on for so long the way it currently is?

Let's just start with leveling jewelry. I literally maxed every single other crafting skill in the time it took me to get to like level 21 in jewelry. I was initially shocked by this, because I assumed it would be FASTER than most of the other skills, since it is less valuable of a craft skill (Woodworking applies to crafting 6 things, clothing 14 things, blacksmithing 13 things, but jewelry just 3, or technically only 2.).

And to make matters worse, what's the deal with platings? I scratch my head as to why it is so much more expensive and/or time consuming to upgrade jewelry. It is absolutely 100% arbitrarily more difficult than improving other items, and there is no rational argument as to why it is so.

In my opinion, you should get double the XP for deconstructing jewelry, since it drops so much less frequently. You should also get double the mats from it.

Also, grains need to go. Leave it so it's 4 platings for gold, and award a plate instead of a grain in every instance you currently get a grain. Either that or increase grain rewards by 10 fold.

Would this make it significantly more easy to upgrade jewelry? Yep. And since it's less valuable of a skill than the others, I think that's just fine. Plus you get a less significant boost by golding jewelry anyways.

This seems like one of those things that has just remained stupid because it's been stupid for so darn long, everyone has gotten used to it.

tmbrinks

Mobius0 wrote: »

I'm sure this has been complained about since the beginning of time, but what's the deal with jewelry craft being overall 10 times more difficult than other skills, even though it is IMO one of the least valuable crafting skills? Why has this gone on for so long the way it currently is?

Let's just start with leveling jewelry. I literally maxed every single other crafting skill in the time it took me to get to like level 21 in jewelry. I was initially shocked by this, because I assumed it would be FASTER than most of the other skills, since it is less valuable of a craft skill (Woodworking applies to crafting 6 things, clothing 14 things, blacksmithing 13 things, but jewelry just 3, or technically only 2.).

And to make matters worse, what's the deal with platings? I scratch my head as to why it is so much more expensive and/or time consuming to upgrade jewelry. It is absolutely 100% arbitrarily more difficult than improving other items, and there is no rational argument as to why it is so.

In my opinion, you should get double the XP for deconstructing jewelry, since it drops so much less frequently. You should also get double the mats from it.

Also, grains need to go. Leave it so it's 4 platings for gold, and award a plate instead of a grain in every instance you currently get a grain. Either that or increase grain rewards by 10 fold.

Would this make it significantly more easy to upgrade jewelry? Yep. And since it's less valuable of a skill than the others, I think that's just fine. Plus you get a less significant boost by golding jewelry anyways.

This seems like one of those things that has just remained stupid because it's been stupid for so darn long, everyone has gotten used to it.

There are multiple "other" sources for gold jewelry. The golden vendor, trials, etc... that in many cases you don't even have to upgrade the jewelry.

You only have 3 slots to upgrade for jewelry, as opposed to 9-11 for the other crafts, so less upgrading.

It already takes reduced amounts 4 versus 8 for like the other crafts.

Jewelry writs drop guaranteed grains when you do them at maximum level. No other craft has guaranteed improvement material drops. You can get get full plating from writs!

Jewelry master writs are the most voucher dense of any of the master writs (yes, I know they're borderline worth doing because of the rarity of platings). Would need massive adjustments.

ZoS explicitly stated that they wanted jewelry to be more difficult to do because they didn't want to dilute people running trials and the rewards there, or dilute about the only worthwhile thing to buy with AP, which is gear from the golden to trade and sell for gold.

They already made some significant adjustments to bring it in line (it was much, much more of a grind initially).

And upgrading from purple to gold for traits like Infused/Bloodthirsty is absolutely a big change

santhoranb16_ESO

Because they want gold juwelry being kind of rarer and harder to achieve. Everything else was always easy golden-out, Juwels you could only get from Trials/high tier rewards/the golden . And they wanted to keep those prices up and rare as they introduced the juwel upgrade/crafting.
Else the prices from the golden in cyro would be kind of strange if upgrading would be by far cheaper.

Mobius0

Again, arbitrary reasons. They have it unreasonably difficult "because they want to," is literally all I am hearing.

Golden vendor shmolden vendor. Just adjust golden vendor prices to be in line with the new values. Or allow you to choose the trait.

tmbrinks

Mobius0 wrote: »

Again, arbitrary reasons. They have it unreasonably difficult "because they want to," is literally all I am hearing.

Golden vendor shmolden vendor. Just adjust golden vendor prices to be in line with the new values. Or allow you to choose the trait.

all I'm hearing is that you just "want it easy"

I'll keep doing my writs and deconstructing extra gear from trials and having multiple platings available to sell each week because I've already golded out pretty much every set I could use on my tanks, healers and dps.

You want something. Do something to earn it. Don't ask for handouts.

Pink_E_808

I've got three characters with jewelry crafting maxed out even though my main is currently my only crafter. I took every piece of jewelry, from intricate to purple, from my travels and put it into my bank for two of my alts to decon and I had them both up to 50 really quick.

RubyKnight

Zos makes very frequent changes to specs/ sets through regular buffing and nerfing. I have not known another mmo company to do it as regular and often as Zos do. This isnt a complaint but really just pointing out that the time it takes to gold everything there is likely to see a lot of changes that mean constantly golding...which takes so long for jewellery.

One month dots are buffed, then nerfed, then direct damage then aoe now proc. it is endless but my patience to gold jewellery...well i have better things to do with my time

AgentZenish

Leveling Jewelry crafting pays for itself quickly with the amount of chromium and zircon grains you get dropped. Just buy up cheap blues and greens or do dolmens.

preevious

The only problem, with jewelcrafting, it that when someone wants I to craft some jewel, and I tell them the prices for purple jewels, they sometimes think I try to scam them.
When a player is uninterrested in the market, it's hard to convince him that zircon is that expensive ..

(and if they as for gold .. god helps me !)

radiostar

They never wanted crafted sets to be as good as dropped, especially not with jewels. Notice how it's easier to make up to blue jewels, then harder to make purple and yellow. Just Z being Z.

Fur_like_snow

I actually like that jewelry is a luxury and not as easily made irrelevant like the other crafting lines. Zircon plating is one of the few commodities that hasn’t been devalued by the bot farmers unlike wax.

newtinmpls

tmbrinks wrote: »

all I'm hearing is that you just "want it easy"
.

Then you aren't listening

I have Jewelry maxed on three characters, do writs most days, don't farm "compulsively" but I do farm a bit, and have been messing with Jewelcrafting since it came out.

I don't buy mats in general, never have bought Jewelry mats, and don't do trials. I'm not enough of a "super trader" to be able to afford the gold vendor prices often (probably 5-6 times ever).

In my entire jewelcrafting career I've accumulated/made/refined a very few chromium plates
-One I used to make a Master Writ teakettle for my housing.
-Golded one Necropotence necklace (and of course this was the week before we were notified of massive nerfs incoming)
-I have three left.

I'm not necessarily asking for it to be changed...but I'm irritated at the idea that somehow it's "not difficult".

MistyRonin

Do some dolmens. In few rounds you'll have enough jewelry to upgrade it to the next rank.

Mobius0

tmbrinks wrote: »

all I'm hearing is that you just "want it easy"

I'll keep doing my writs and deconstructing extra gear from trials and having multiple platings available to sell each week because I've already golded out pretty much every set I could use on my tanks, healers and dps.

You want something. Do something to earn it. Don't ask for handouts.

You so golded out, you spit butter.

Actually yes, I do want it easy. EasiER at least. I think that was pretty clear in my post.

It's only logical that the less useful crafting skill not be so expensive.

And if I hear another person tell me I need to make multiple characters to do writs, I think I will puke. I shouldn't have to grind 15 characters and do writs all day long in order to get what I need. I should be able to get it just fine with ONE character, or the system is downright broken.

This game is already grindy enough as it is. In fact, I would go so far to say that this game is just as bad of a grind as Eastern MMO's, and that's friggin' crazy. As I learned the game, I was astounded by every new grind upon grind upon grind upon grind that I was faced with, that I hadn't realized was a thing. The level grind in this game is as bad as bloody Lineage2, you have to max your craft skills in order to afford upgrading, then you have to grind upgrade mats, you have to grind dungeons to get your gear (God forbid you have to get a weapon, because that can get insane.), you have to grind transmutation crystals, you have to grind Undaunted levels, Psijic order quests, skill points, monster shoulders (what is it, like 12% chance you get the shoulders you need each box?), etc. etc, etc..

And as someone mentioned...say you decide to change your build, or your gear. Now you have to go through all of it all over again!

Caligamy_ESO

grind dolmens, decon the jewelry you'll be 50 crafting in no time

and gold jewelry just isn't worth the hassle for the 1%'ish boost it gives

Everest_Lionheart

OP get in some doleman runs and decon all that jewelry, most of it is useless anyway. Also if you’ve got Summerset open every urn, coffer, jewelry box and chest you come across. If you’ve got multiple toons funnel all that stuff through your bank and decon it on the one you are trying to level up. All those trash pieces add up. And as you are leveling up make sure you put skill points into it as well so you pick up better trash items to decon. Or find a guild mate that’s loaded in platinum and have them make you a bunch of rings to decon. Notice a pattern here?

Daily writs are a big source as well but I got there fast by just deconing all the junk I was never going to use anyway.

belial5221_ESO

Just buy and decon intricate CP150-160 jewelery,you can level jewelery crafting fast.I did it on all my 10 chars,and took no time,though it is pricey,but I make enoguh selling mats and crafting it for others as needed.It's not a thing that is useless,maybe to you,but alot of pl make and upgrade jewelery cause it's easier than farming it.

Mobius0

I know how to level it. Any of those methods are still MUCH slower than raising the other skills, which is the problem with it.

Everest_Lionheart

Deconstruction is how I raised nearly every other skill except enchanting where you can translate all the runes for a huge upfront gain if you’ve got the craft bag and hoard everything and alchemy where you also learn the properties of the reagents and than make a bunch of potions to level it up. Provisioning just learn recipes and make food.

Going the decon route you also make experience and gold. Plus you can level up other skills along the way.

Now the case you make for psijic and mages guilds is 100% valid. Those quests feel like grinds for the sake of grinds and on new toons it’s a real pain because you don’t have anything beyond a few starter zones open so you have to get creative with how your move about.

Alliance and Undaunted are OK. Just play BGs for your alliance skills, short matches guaranteed points and extra equipment and transmute stones. Undaunted = more keys = more coffers. Does need a faster progression though because it takes several cycles to max it out.

Disturbed_One

Mobius0 wrote: »

tmbrinks wrote: »

all I'm hearing is that you just "want it easy"

I'll keep doing my writs and deconstructing extra gear from trials and having multiple platings available to sell each week because I've already golded out pretty much every set I could use on my tanks, healers and dps.

You want something. Do something to earn it. Don't ask for handouts.

You so golded out, you spit butter.

Actually yes, I do want it easy. EasiER at least. I think that was pretty clear in my post.

It's only logical that the less useful crafting skill not be so expensive.

And if I hear another person tell me I need to make multiple characters to do writs, I think I will puke. I shouldn't have to grind 15 characters and do writs all day long in order to get what I need. I should be able to get it just fine with ONE character, or the system is downright broken.

This game is already grindy enough as it is. In fact, I would go so far to say that this game is just as bad of a grind as Eastern MMO's, and that's friggin' crazy. As I learned the game, I was astounded by every new grind upon grind upon grind upon grind that I was faced with, that I hadn't realized was a thing. The level grind in this game is as bad as bloody Lineage2, you have to max your craft skills in order to afford upgrading, then you have to grind upgrade mats, you have to grind dungeons to get your gear (God forbid you have to get a weapon, because that can get insane.), you have to grind transmutation crystals, you have to grind Undaunted levels, Psijic order quests, skill points, monster shoulders (what is it, like 12% chance you get the shoulders you need each box?), etc. etc, etc..

And as someone mentioned...say you decide to change your build, or your gear. Now you have to go through all of it all over again!

this is one of the least grinding MMOs in existence. Welcome to the genre.

Arkangeloski

Get a lv 50 jeweler to craft you a bunch of 150cp rings or necks and you will get to lv 50 in 30 minutes with about 5k platinum, and jewelry crafting is more like enchanting when it comes to grinding by yourself and you can’t steal , cleanse and decon like in blacksmithing , clothing or woodworking. Good source of jewelry dolmens and battlegrounds (win or loose). The only thing I can relate to is the double refining, I wouldn’t mind if they make it 8 platings for upgrading as long as I can get full platings from refining ores instead of ten grains from 1,000 platinum dust. I’m not a fan of diluted double refining so you can grind 4x the amount to get 1 upgraded gold piece of jewelry.

Danikat

preevious wrote: »

The only problem, with jewelcrafting, it that when someone wants I to craft some jewel, and I tell them the prices for purple jewels, they sometimes think I try to scam them.
When a player is uninterrested in the market, it's hard to convince him that zircon is that expensive ..

(and if they as for gold .. god helps me !)

One option is to ask them to provide the materials, at least for upgrading. If they really can get it cheaper than good for them, and if not they'll soon realise your price is reasonable.

(I may be cynical but I suspect some of these people are well aware of the cost of the items they want, but they're hoping you don't and you'll do it for cheap, or even free, especially when they're asking for someone in the same guild to craft it 'as a favour'.)

Mobius0

this is one of the least grinding MMOs in existence. Welcome to the genre.

Man, I've been playing MMOs since back when they were text only on pay by the minute dial up.

Crazy how people are taking this grind mentality and acting like it's the way MMOs should be. Maybe that's why there's been no new successful MMOs in forever, because crap mentalities like this ruined them.

If I'm forced to so something that isn't fun, ad infinitum simply because you want me to play your game longer, that's not the kind of thing I can get behind as a player.

I'm not saying everything should be a breeze. But I think it's pretty reasonable to say that jewelry crafting is disproportionately difficult compared to the other skills, with no sound reason as to why.

Mix

I've leveled JC on 8 characters(for writs!) and by far the easiest way is to make CP150 white jewelry on main character and then bank and mass decon (this feature is so amazing for leveling) and repeat. Platinum Ounces are usually pretty cheap and your newly max JC characters will start making gold with the writs awarding a grain of upgrade mat daily

For leveling my first character, at Summerset launch, it was definitely more painful. All jewelry existing before Summerset couldn't be deconned so I just let it take me awhile and not try to grind it which was exactly how i leveled my other crafting skills the first time around. I just smashed every piece of jewelry I found, tried some dolmens but that was rather boring. NOW you could find a friendly guildmate to make CP150 white pieces for you to smash and mail them, just make sure you compensate them for the time and gold to mail them all (or trade them in person which still is painfully slow sounding to me - mail would probably be simpler)

Mobius0

Yet I don't even have to do that with the other skills. I can max them all in no time just deconstructing my normal mob drops.

The fact that you have to use a second character to cheese your way through it doesn't somehow justify it being fine the way it is. Plus it requires either the help of someone, or grinding at least one character to 50 the normal way.

Seems if I'm to succeed in this game I have to make an army of alts, lol. (For transmute crystals too.).

midgetfromtheshire

Mobius0 wrote: »

I'm sure this has been complained about since the beginning of time, but what's the deal with jewelry craft being overall 10 times more difficult than other skills, even though it is IMO one of the least valuable crafting skills? Why has this gone on for so long the way it currently is?

Let's just start with leveling jewelry. I literally maxed every single other crafting skill in the time it took me to get to like level 21 in jewelry. I was initially shocked by this, because I assumed it would be FASTER than most of the other skills, since it is less valuable of a craft skill (Woodworking applies to crafting 6 things, clothing 14 things, blacksmithing 13 things, but jewelry just 3, or technically only 2.).

And to make matters worse, what's the deal with platings? I scratch my head as to why it is so much more expensive and/or time consuming to upgrade jewelry. It is absolutely 100% arbitrarily more difficult than improving other items, and there is no rational argument as to why it is so.

In my opinion, you should get double the XP for deconstructing jewelry, since it drops so much less frequently. You should also get double the mats from it.

Also, grains need to go. Leave it so it's 4 platings for gold, and award a plate instead of a grain in every instance you currently get a grain. Either that or increase grain rewards by 10 fold.

Would this make it significantly more easy to upgrade jewelry? Yep. And since it's less valuable of a skill than the others, I think that's just fine. Plus you get a less significant boost by golding jewelry anyways.

This seems like one of those things that has just remained stupid because it's been stupid for so darn long, everyone has gotten used to it.

Out of any of the crafting skill lines for gear, jewellery crafting is the most valuable. If you run any complete build for PvE and PvP, the necklace and two rings will always be present. Body pieces have choices from three and weapons have choices from two.

The few sources in the game for gold jewellery prior to jewellery crafting still need to remain viable. Some pvpers use the gold vendor as their major source of income every weekend.

tmbrinks

midgetfromtheshire wrote: »

Mobius0 wrote: »

I'm sure this has been complained about since the beginning of time, but what's the deal with jewelry craft being overall 10 times more difficult than other skills, even though it is IMO one of the least valuable crafting skills? Why has this gone on for so long the way it currently is?

Let's just start with leveling jewelry. I literally maxed every single other crafting skill in the time it took me to get to like level 21 in jewelry. I was initially shocked by this, because I assumed it would be FASTER than most of the other skills, since it is less valuable of a craft skill (Woodworking applies to crafting 6 things, clothing 14 things, blacksmithing 13 things, but jewelry just 3, or technically only 2.).

And to make matters worse, what's the deal with platings? I scratch my head as to why it is so much more expensive and/or time consuming to upgrade jewelry. It is absolutely 100% arbitrarily more difficult than improving other items, and there is no rational argument as to why it is so.

In my opinion, you should get double the XP for deconstructing jewelry, since it drops so much less frequently. You should also get double the mats from it.

Also, grains need to go. Leave it so it's 4 platings for gold, and award a plate instead of a grain in every instance you currently get a grain. Either that or increase grain rewards by 10 fold.

Would this make it significantly more easy to upgrade jewelry? Yep. And since it's less valuable of a skill than the others, I think that's just fine. Plus you get a less significant boost by golding jewelry anyways.

This seems like one of those things that has just remained stupid because it's been stupid for so darn long, everyone has gotten used to it.

Out of any of the crafting skill lines for gear, jewellery crafting is the most valuable. If you run any complete build for PvE and PvP, the necklace and two rings will always be present. Body pieces have choices from three and weapons have choices from two.

The few sources in the game for gold jewellery prior to jewellery crafting still need to remain viable. Some pvpers use the gold vendor as their major source of income every weekend.

careful, those reasons have already been stated as "arbitrary" by the OP.

Taleof2Cities

Mobius0 wrote: »

I know how to level it. Any of those methods are still MUCH slower than raising the other skills, which is the problem with it.

I leveled jewelry crafting 1-50 in about an hour and a half ... from buying the purple Eagle Eye gear set coffers in Bruma and then deconning the jewelry.

Could be done in less than an hour ... but I had inventory issues at the time and had to make trips back and forth to the jewelry table.

Mobius0

midgetfromtheshire wrote: »

Out of any of the crafting skill lines for gear, jewellery crafting is the most valuable. If you run any complete build for PvE and PvP, the necklace and two rings will always be present. Body pieces have choices from three and weapons have choices from two.

The few sources in the game for gold jewellery prior to jewellery crafting still need to remain viable. Some pvpers use the gold vendor as their major source of income every weekend.

Jewelry adds no raw armor or damage like armor/weapons do. Maybe if it added spell resistance or damage or something, I could say it is more valuable.

And just because the broken system has caused an avenue for certain people to make money off of it, doesn't somehow make it fine. Neither does the guy with gold teeth who swims in gold coins and can afford 10 manor houses who can afford to have everything "golded."

Even if I were to concede to you that jewelry crafting was of equal value to the other skills (which I won't), then I would still be able to logically argue that it should at least be equal in difficulty to them.

Of course, I get that people who went through the grind, don't necessarily like the idea of others getting it more easily. Nor do those wealthy enough that it's a non-factor for them, and thus would prefer to not lose their economical edge over others.

Incidentally, both of those reasons are bad reasons to not fix it

Everest_Lionheart

Mobius0 wrote: »

midgetfromtheshire wrote: »

Out of any of the crafting skill lines for gear, jewellery crafting is the most valuable. If you run any complete build for PvE and PvP, the necklace and two rings will always be present. Body pieces have choices from three and weapons have choices from two.

The few sources in the game for gold jewellery prior to jewellery crafting still need to remain viable. Some pvpers use the gold vendor as their major source of income every weekend.

Jewelry adds no raw armor or damage like armor/weapons do. Maybe if it added spell resistance or damage or something, I could say it is more valuable.

And just because the broken system has caused an avenue for certain people to make money off of it, doesn't somehow make it fine. Neither does the guy with gold teeth who swims in gold coins and can afford 10 manor houses who can afford to have everything "golded."

Even if I were to concede to you that jewelry crafting was of equal value to the other skills (which I won't), then I would still be able to logically argue that it should at least be equal in difficulty to them.

Of course, I get that people who went through the grind, don't necessarily like the idea of others getting it more easily. Nor do those wealthy enough that it's a non-factor for them, and thus would prefer to not lose their economical edge over others.

Incidentally, both of those reasons are bad reasons to not fix it

The jewelry enchants absolutely add raw damage. Try a build with weapon/spell damage enchants on them and try one without. You will see a huge difference especially if you’ve got them in the infused trait (sorry bloodthirsty but you got the nerf hammer) This is why jewelry is harder to level because it is a huge modifier to your overall power.

ZaroktheImmortal

Jewelry is a pain to level not just because of having to find materials oh and they don't have a perk to get materials mailed to you and on top of all this unlike others that simply get a material type to upgrade it you instead get grains of the upgrade material and have to collect 10 to make a single one of the upgrade material.