Is it legit to queue in the LFG as another role?

Suna_Ye_Sunnabe

This is exactly why I stopped pugging dungeons entirely. I used to very much enjoy pugging vet dungeons every day, as strange as it sounds, on my healers and tanks, and giving inexperienced groups direction. I'm a veteran player with high damage and scores of achievements and skins, but I have no tolerance for people who wish to inconvenience others for the sake of getting into a dungeon faster, regardless of how "easy" the dungeon is. Nine times out of ten, the faker doesn't even have the necessary dps to make up for the fact that they've robbed the group of a true healer or tank, and if they do have decent dps, they run around the dungeon as if it's only them in there, solo, and make everyone else's experiences miserable. The groups that I ran with that were successful were all their correct role, and I helped many pugs get their achievements that way. The fake roles were so bad though that I can still to this day never run dungeons on my dds, as there will inevitably either be a fake tank or healer. So I've given up altogether on it for every role... The attitudes of these selfish players is truly disgusting and off-putting. Again, I don't care if you have 150k dps: you cause inconvenience to the group by your actions as a short-cut taker, and you don't deserve to finish the dungeon while the rest of the team wishes to work together and carry their own weight. It's both presumptuous and arrogant to assume you know what another group wants or needs outside the established roles, and to try to circumvent the queue time in that manner is cheating the entire group. The queue would be far more populated if everyone did their proper part. And if you do wish to run with three dps or no tank, there's always creating your own groups for that. Forcing that playstyle onto your unsuspecting group members is both unnecessary and insulting.

derpy_cat1234

I queue as fake healer for everything that isn't the more difficult vet hm dlc dungeons. I say "hi" at the start,carry the group and say "ty for run" at the end. Literally never had ANY issue. So imo its a case by case basis. In my case run is smooth and faster then with a healer. Tho tbh i don't really pug at all anymore.

idk

Elsonso wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Elsonso wrote: »

People doing it are considered scum of the earth by other players.

I would suggest if this were true on even a semi-broad scale then we would no longer have fake tanks and healers because players would be vote kicking them from the group most of the time.

I dunno. Maybe. If you read the forums, "fake tanks" and people who have combat pets out in town rank pretty low on the social scale. There might be some cheaters in PVP that rank higher. If you read the forums.

Are you suggesting that players would rather come to the forums and complain about fake tanks than actually doing something about it, something that makes sense like kicking them from the group?

If so, then you truly labeled the real problem and it is not the fake tanks, but those who complain about them.

DarcyMardin

If you can carry everyone in the group and play all the roles, just solo the dungeon and leave the rest of us to play the dungeon the way it was designed to be played.

Grandchamp1989

It is absolutely abusing the system to que up fake.

I do however allow it if the person got enough damage and game sense to not be a burden on the team.

GF was in vet yesterday, got a fake healer who pulled the entire dungeon and then wiped on the first boss.
She kindly suggested it probably wasn't a good idea to que up fake in that instance and was told to **** off.

Many times you get a horrible attitude with people who want to skip que line.
Many of them are very toxic in my experience.

svendf

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

AzucarSalado wrote: »

Hello,

I have seen a few of DD queuing as tank a lot of DD as Healer (yesterday, in the 3 pledges I did) .

I think this is not game intended, it breaks the game and goes against other fellow DD that have to wait 20 minutes before entering a pledge . Does ESO care about it? Is it reportable?

Of course; if you want do do solo runs, 3dd or whatever you like, you are totally free to do it but, IMHO, do not use the LFG.

Any thoughts?

Cheers.-

Veteran or normal ?
I like normal runs to be quick and for most normal dungeons, 3DD+1healer OR 3DD+1 tank, or even 4DD are a more efficient combination than the holy trinity. Therefore I don't mind people queuing in the "wrong" role - provided they know how to deal with a run without tank/healer.

If you want to be sure that your group is the way you want it to be - make your own with your guilds or in zone. If you use the grouping tool (aka LFG), be ready for anything and adapt. If you have expectations, do not PUG.

If people like to go 3DD + Healer or 3DD + tank or even 4DD they should form their own group and not use other people time for nonsens.

For people out there, who do fake que as healer or tank. Remember one thing. You take my spot and other´s, who play aand enjoy the game.

anitajoneb17_ESO

svendf wrote: »

If people like to go 3DD + Healer or 3DD + tank or even 4DD they should form their own group and not use other people time for nonsens.

Same old song... "If you want to do thing your way, do your own thing" but that applies both ways and the way the game's set up now, the responsibility of doing their own thing falls onto those who insist on "clean" 2DD+1H+1T runs.

You cannot change people according to your personal wishes. But you can pick your people.

svendf wrote: »

For people out there, who do fake que as healer or tank. Remember one thing. You take my spot and other´s, who play aand enjoy the game.

For people out there who do fake queue as healer or tank, remember one thing : you make my runs quicker and more fun, and you help getting a faster queue for everybody.

Luckylancer

If you can survive after taunting bosses and going in to mob packs first, you are tank. Who cares if you are actualy a DD eith inner fire sloted to taunt?

If you can heal people before they die, you are healer. Who cares if you are a dd that sloted 1-2 healing skills?

There is nothing wrong as long as the player dont fail the role. I never que dd for normal dungeons and I do the bare minimum of role I que: going in first, perma taunt bosses, heal people

LashanW

OP what do you mean "legit"? Afaik, there are no hard rules against queuing with a fake role. So it's not really a bannable offence to my knowledge. It's just a moral issue of potentially ruining the experience and time of 3 other people.

Me personally, I don't mind fake tanks as long as they run a taunt skill and use it on bosses and not die. For DDs that fake tank but don't have a shred of decency to slot a taunt and that causes inexperienced new players to die (because boss is charging them and they panic), I usually talk with the group and initiate a vote kick.

ThePianist wrote: »

Try slotting aoe skills and support skills to help with the algorithms. All classes have access to Arrow barrage, Caltrops, Echoing Vigor and Purge. If you slot skills mainly for pvp and que for a dungeon, it will take a long time.

Play prime time weekend hours and only slot pvp skills, then que for a dungeon. I guarantee you the que will be over an hour.

Umm, what algorithms?

ThePianist wrote: »

If you really want to go farm a set at a certain dungeon then you can physically go there and enter the dungeon by yourself. For example, Unhallowed grave is in Bangkorai. Go solo, and chances are you will run into a group that’s already there. We don’t know how many unhallowed grave “pocket dimensions” there are, maybe 10 or 20, but I don’t think the game generates an entire dungeon for a group, that’s too much server load.

If you manually go into a dungeon without being in a group, you will never run into any other player in there. Group dungeons/trials are always instanced per group. It's not a public dungeon/delve.

Juhasow

It's legit when their DPS is above 50% of group DPS and it's scum when it's lower

Rexy18

It's not so bad if it's a fake healer, only 2-3 DLC hardmodes require one. If it's a fake tank you can just kick before 1st boss

Elsonso

idk wrote: »

Elsonso wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Elsonso wrote: »

People doing it are considered scum of the earth by other players.

I would suggest if this were true on even a semi-broad scale then we would no longer have fake tanks and healers because players would be vote kicking them from the group most of the time.

I dunno. Maybe. If you read the forums, "fake tanks" and people who have combat pets out in town rank pretty low on the social scale. There might be some cheaters in PVP that rank higher. If you read the forums.

Are you suggesting that players would rather come to the forums and complain about fake tanks than actually doing something about it, something that makes sense like kicking them from the group?

If so, then you truly labeled the real problem and it is not the fake tanks, but those who complain about them.

It is so tempting to agree, but no. I think that the people who comment in here are taking action in the game. Chances are, it is something worse than being a 'fake tank', and worse than kicking them from the group.

JanTanhide

It shouldn't happen but it does. Way too many people do it. I don't do it. If it's a Normal dungeon they are easy to solo except the ones with the mechanics for more than one player. So in those cases I just solo if I want to run them.

But yeah, players have a ton of reasons for fake roles and they always justify it to themselves that it is OK. There is nothing that can be done about it except vote kicking the fake role player. Usually that won't happen in a Normal dungeon run but for Vet runs when you get a Fake Tank they get booted pretty quickly.

Fake Healers tend to not get kicked as much because with three DD's the group usually blows through the dungeons and most players I know slot a Heal Skill to keep their character alive.

rexagamemnon

Normal dungeons, yes because normal dungeons are easy for the most part.
Vet dungeons, its not a problem unless your dps output negates the need for a tank or healer i dont see the problem.

JanTanhide

Sanctum74 wrote: »

Unfortunately it’s not reportable so all you can do is vote to kick the selfish players. This is why i just solo dungeons, no wait no drama.

You can report them. It just won't make a difference in my opinion.

the1andonlyskwex

Luckylancer wrote: »

If you can survive after taunting bosses and going in to mob packs first, you are tank. Who cares if you are actualy a DD eith inner fire sloted to taunt?

If you can heal people before they die, you are healer. Who cares if you are a dd that sloted 1-2 healing skills?

There is nothing wrong as long as the player dont fail the role. I never que dd for normal dungeons and I do the bare minimum of role I que: going in first, perma taunt bosses, heal people

I don't know what other people in this thread think, but in my opinion you're not a fake if you're actually trying to do the role. In fact, for most dungeons, you're probably better off healing or tanking with a hybrid-ish build instead of an Alcast-style trial build.

Where things go wrong is when the fake healer doesn't even try to heal, or the fake tank doesn't taunt, or is constantly dying or dodging hits that they should be taking or blocking.

Also, specifically regarding tanks, I think you're leaving out one of the most important parts of the job. You need to keep the boss relatively still. If you taunt the boss and then survive by kiting it around the room, you're not a real tank, and you're almost certainly hurting your team's DPS (no matter how much you bring yourself). The reason this is a problem is because it pulls the boss out of ground-based AoE and forces melee DDs to chase you, both of which reduce DPS dramatically.

svendf

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

svendf wrote: »

If people like to go 3DD + Healer or 3DD + tank or even 4DD they should form their own group and not use other people time for nonsens.

Same old song... "If you want to do thing your way, do your own thing" but that applies both ways and the way the game's set up now, the responsibility of doing their own thing falls onto those who insist on "clean" 2DD+1H+1T runs.

You cannot change people according to your personal wishes. But you can pick your people.

svendf wrote: »

For people out there, who do fake que as healer or tank. Remember one thing. You take my spot and other´s, who play aand enjoy the game.

For people out there who do fake queue as healer or tank, remember one thing : you make my runs quicker and more fun, and you help getting a faster queue for everybody.

Hahaha lol good one. Just remember out there all you, who like fake´s - today went well tomorrow you will be running in circles after the fake and boss. It´s so funny and fast.

santhoranb16_ESO

You can queue whatever you wish, as long as you can fullfill that role and do it properly.
If you queue as a tank and cant hold the boss or eat damage like crazy, then you'll get a kick vote from me immediately. But if you manage well, i dont care what sets you wear or what cp points you've spent on.

scorpius2k1

Oh you mean those players who que up with the incorrect role, don't care to say anything to the group and typically cause a lot of unnecessary wipes and content being way harder than it needs to be?

Let's laugh a bit shall we? My group couldn't even finish Vet Wayrest Sewers I yesterday because DPS fake tanked. Last boss one shots if you aren't careful. Then to make things worse they blamed the legit group and make comments like "you guys die easy" and puts sword and board on with a taunt skill and still dies because they had wrong gear and 16k HP. Sure, it's the groups fault because THEY chose a false role. That was hilarious right? I'm sure some reading this actually think it is funny. Maybe next time it will be you ticked off because of the same things then?

It's ridiculous how easy it is to change roles on the fly BECAUSE of abusers like that and something CLEARLY needs to be done. It's not right to waste others time because they felt it was OK to hop in front of the que line while legit players waited. Sure, the bigger problem is the LFG tool and the fact that DPS far outweigh Tank/Heal roles (said every MMO ever). It is what it is but there should be something done, but nothing ever will.

/r

Sarannah

Queueing as a fake role is cheating the system, and spitting on your fellow players who did wait in queue. Wasting their dungeon run and time.

Therefor I am really hoping ZOS will soon hire someone that queue's atleast 5 times a day as a DD(give them front queue access), and gives every fake role a 10 day account ban. Even if most cheaters will not get hit with the ban, it will be enough to scare alot of them away from cheating the queue-system. *Second time getting caught = 1 month account ban, third time a 6-month account ban.*

Fake roles are actually chasing away new players.

zaria

Dovakhan wrote: »

Fur_like_snow wrote: »

Would you rather wait 40 minutes instead of 20 for a single pledge? Whatever keeps the queues popping or else players just get bored and play something else.

Of course, it's sooo much better to have 13k HP tanks, or healers who don't heal at all and screw up the rest of your group just because you don't want to wait, right?

Answering the OP: no, it isn't. If you wanna do a fast RND, then make a decent healer or tank. Heck, my crafter is a makeshift healer with just Restoration staff skills and Energy Orb, and it's already more than enough for Normal and non-DLC Vet.

And maybe with more tanks-healers and less hackandslash dudes, queues would go faster indeed. After all, it's precisely DD's the ones who should have no problem queuing to begin with, as you require 2 of them per group, as opposed to 1 tank/healer.

This, any magic build can heal well enough for dungeons outside of vet dlc, just level up an restoration staff.
Now a lot depend on the dungeon. Think all has had the feeling, stuff melting and you thought you selected normal by mistake. Or the opposite, random normal and things take forever and people dying, yes it has to be an vet dlc

derpy_cat1234

Everyone talkin about fake healers and fake tanks no one is talking about fake dds, smh... You know, 10k group dps. Why would i ever queue as a tank or a healer when 95% of pugs light attack>shield as a rotation? Looking at the replys, the people who think vscp hm needs a nerf are also the ones who say ban fake roles. What about them huh? They put minimum effort in,making a run that should be 15mins max take an hour.

BKTHNDR

Just yesterday I was in a group of randoms running vet Wayrest I for the Undaunted daily and someone queued up as a tank but really wasn't. We couldn't beat the last boss because he was too squishy to take the hits and couldn't hold aggro off the rest of us. He ended up leaving the group after dying 3 times. After he left, we got an actual tank and finished the boss without issue.

scorpius2k1

BKTHNDR wrote: »

Just yesterday I was in a group of randoms running vet Wayrest I for the Undaunted daily and someone queued up as a tank but really wasn't. We couldn't beat the last boss because he was too squishy to take the hits and couldn't hold aggro off the rest of us. He ended up leaving the group after dying 3 times. After he left, we got an actual tank and finished the boss without issue.

Yep. Same EXACT thing happened to our group yesterday in Wayrest I. Today, a fake healer for Spindleclutch II hm. That was a little interesting. Mostly seeing the ones doing it are lower levels. Been noticing it a lot more during the free play event, not sure if related or just bad timing.

Sarannah

Low DPS is still DPS... they waited till a LONG queue was over to get into the dungeon. So even though they are bad at their role, they are not a fake-role. Noone would wait in the longest queue(DPS) when they are actually a tank or healer hehe

Jeremy

AzucarSalado wrote: »

Hello,

I have seen a few of DD queuing as tank a lot of DD as Healer (yesterday, in the 3 pledges I did) .

I think this is not game intended, it breaks the game and goes against other fellow DD that have to wait 20 minutes before entering a pledge . Does ESO care about it? Is it reportable?

Of course; if you want do do solo runs, 3dd or whatever you like, you are totally free to do it but, IMHO, do not use the LFG.

Any thoughts?

Cheers.-

It's not "legit" as far as I'm concerned. Lying about your role in order to cut in line of other more honest DPS players is one of the few things I'll actually vote to kick for.

Jaimeh

It's a bad practice and it's very frustrating to the rest of the group. The other day, I was in a group with fake healer, and yes full proper healers are not really needed in dungeons, but check this: they had a sword/board and a 2h. When I remarked on it, they said 'it's more effective'. How?? As a healer, they were not effective, as a DD, they were not effective, they would only be effective as a tank, but in stead they decided to queue as healer

Dovakhan

dimitrisp1 wrote: »

I queue as fake healer for everything that isn't the more difficult vet hm dlc dungeons. I say "hi" at the start,carry the group and say "ty for run" at the end. Literally never had ANY issue. So imo its a case by case basis. In my case run is smooth and faster then with a healer. Tho tbh i don't really pug at all anymore.

Again, good for you. But for every carrier out there, there are a dozen bad fake tanks and healers.

FrancisCrawford

There is no excuse for being utterly fake in your role.

Any character whose attribute points are in magicka can put together a decent healing build. So if you want to queue as a healer, actually go as one.

Tanking is more a matter of player skill -- can you survive boss aggro (ditto trash packs) if you're taking most/all of it? If yes, it should be easy to throw together a tanking build, even though it will be lower on health than is optimal.

AlnilamE

dimitrisp1 wrote: »

Everyone talkin about fake healers and fake tanks no one is talking about fake dds, smh... You know, 10k group dps. Why would i ever queue as a tank or a healer when 95% of pugs light attack>shield as a rotation? Looking at the replys, the people who think vscp hm needs a nerf are also the ones who say ban fake roles. What about them huh? They put minimum effort in,making a run that should be 15mins max take an hour.

Do you slot a heal? And do you know when to use it?