Malacath's Band of Brutality: Is it brutal enough in terms of damage?

Dracane

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

It is actually very weak and not nearly as strong as people make it out to be.
It's not 25% damage, but 14% for most of my abilities. Crit on the other hand is always a true multiplier and even if you have just 20-30% crit damage left because of enemy impenetrable, it is better than Malacath's.

I find it stupid that damage done scales of some non sensual base value instead of just giving me what it promises.

It's buggy. Amplitude and off balance dmg increase CP reduce your damage while wearing Malacath ring (instead of increasing it)...

I always test things without Amplitude and I do not have the off balance CP.
My crystal shard proc casually only increases by 10% on hit damage. The only attack that actually seems to get 25% is a hard casted crystal shard.

So I think this ring is not worth it. I prefer the rng burst of crits, even though I generally do not like to rely on luck.
It's either very buggy or underpowered.

Ragnaroek93

Dracane wrote: »

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

It is actually very weak and not nearly as strong as people make it out to be.
It's not 25% damage, but 14% for most of my abilities. Crit on the other hand is always a true multiplier and even if you have just 20-30% crit damage left because of enemy impenetrable, it is better than Malacath's.

I find it stupid that damage done scales of some non sensual base value instead of just giving me what it promises.

It's buggy. Amplitude and off balance dmg increase CP reduce your damage while wearing Malacath ring (instead of increasing it)...

I always test things without Amplitude and I do not have the off balance CP.
My crystal shard proc casually only increases by 10% on hit damage. The only attack that actually seems to get 25% is a hard casted crystal shard.

So I think this ring is not worth it. I prefer the rng burst of crits, even though I generally do not like to rely on luck.
It's either very buggy or underpowered.

Sounds even more buggy tbh.

Dracane

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

It is actually very weak and not nearly as strong as people make it out to be.
It's not 25% damage, but 14% for most of my abilities. Crit on the other hand is always a true multiplier and even if you have just 20-30% crit damage left because of enemy impenetrable, it is better than Malacath's.

I find it stupid that damage done scales of some non sensual base value instead of just giving me what it promises.

It's buggy. Amplitude and off balance dmg increase CP reduce your damage while wearing Malacath ring (instead of increasing it)...

I always test things without Amplitude and I do not have the off balance CP.
My crystal shard proc casually only increases by 10% on hit damage. The only attack that actually seems to get 25% is a hard casted crystal shard.

So I think this ring is not worth it. I prefer the rng burst of crits, even though I generally do not like to rely on luck.
It's either very buggy or underpowered.

Sounds even more buggy tbh.

Whatever the case may be, if I give away all my crit damage, then I demand an actual 25% to all my stuff. Not some strange ZoS math basedamage 25% that only ends up being 10%. I want 25%!

I wish things in this game would actually give you what they say.

katorga

Dracane wrote: »

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

It is actually very weak and not nearly as strong as people make it out to be.
It's not 25% damage, but 14% for most of my abilities. Crit on the other hand is always a true multiplier and even if you have just 20-30% crit damage left because of enemy impenetrable, it is better than Malacath's.

I find it stupid that damage done scales of some non sensual base value instead of just giving me what it promises.

It's buggy. Amplitude and off balance dmg increase CP reduce your damage while wearing Malacath ring (instead of increasing it)...

I always test things without Amplitude and I do not have the off balance CP.
My crystal shard proc casually only increases by 10% on hit damage. The only attack that actually seems to get 25% is a hard casted crystal shard.

So I think this ring is not worth it. I prefer the rng burst of crits, even though I generally do not like to rely on luck.
It's either very buggy or underpowered.

Sounds even more buggy tbh.

Whatever the case may be, if I give away all my crit damage, then I demand an actual 25% to all my stuff. Not some strange ZoS math basedamage 25% that only ends up being 10%. I want 25%!

I wish things in this game would actually give you what they say.

Assuming the bugs get ever get fixed.....

The other way to look at it is that you can drop some percentage of your damage build and replace it with defensive sets, different cp choices, more health, proc sets, heavy armor, whatever, and stay right where you were in terms of damage output.

Somewhere in that mix is going to be a monster strong pvp build.

relentless_turnip

Hey guys

I have done some extensive testing on the PTS and utilising UESP due to base crit resist not working.
So I don't know where the damage is applied, but it ends up being about +16% on your normal damage. So in no cp PvP this is the same as a critical strike against 7 impen without any extra investment in crit. In cp it is a little more ambiguous, but has pretty much the same difference.

This seems pretty balanced to me... Obviously to someone wearing less than 7 impen it still benefits to invest in crit, but with malacalth you are guaranteed 16% more damage on every attack. This regardless of your opponent's crit resist.

Dracane

relentless_turnip wrote: »

Hey guys

I have done some extensive testing on the PTS and utilising UESP due to base crit resist not working.
So I don't know where the damage is applied, but it ends up being about +16% on your normal damage. So in no cp PvP this is the same as a critical strike against 7 impen without any extra investment in crit. In cp it is a little more ambiguous, but has pretty much the same difference.

This seems pretty balanced to me... Obviously to someone wearing less than 7 impen it still benefits to invest in crit, but with malacalth you are guaranteed 16% more damage on every attack. This regardless of your opponent's crit resist.

Take away from this 16% damage the other sets that you lose to equip this ring. Be it a monster set piece or a 5 set piece. So you lose a bit more elsewhere.

I find this ring to be a trap to bait fools. Looks so good on paper, but is just a damage nerf in reality. It would only be good if it actually gave 25% damage.

Might be a decent push to raise your general damage a bit. But you lose those rng crits that just enable you to kill certain opponents that you will never kill without some crits aligning in the right moment. I think we are on a treacherous path this Malacath. Well played Daedric Lord, Well played. That is one way to make mortals lose.

HankTwo

What a lot of people here don't seem to understand is that all percentage based modifiers in this game except mitigation are additive to each other. That means you have to add up every single % damage increase first and then multiply it with your base damage. Doing the calculations this way like ZOS does is not wrong per se, but it is fundamentally important to understand this before you can have any kind of meaningful conversation about items like malacaths band.

Note, that this doesn't just apply to passives and items, some skills also have percentage damage modifiers, like flurry for example. In the end this means that the more percentage damgage modifiers you already have, the less you will benefit from an item like malacaths band (relatively speaking).

Some examples:
If you dont have any damage modifiers malacaths band should give you a true increase of 25% damage
If you already have a sum of 25% damage modifiers malacaths band will give you only a 1.5 / 1.25 = 1.2 --> 20% damage increase
On the last hit of flurry on a build without any additional damage modifiers malacaths band will only give you a 4.25 / 4 = 1.0625 --> 6.25% damage increase

Now, I don't know if beyond that malacaths band is truly bugged, but when people say malacaths band increases your damage by X% it is absolutely meaningless information unless they also list evey single other percentate damage modifier (passives, items, CP, ...) they have.

Apart from this I think malacaths band shoud't affect any damage sources that can't crit to begin with (--> proc sets!), since its downside of not letting you crit doesnt affect them at all (so there also should be no benefit).

Maulkin

Dracane wrote: »

Take away from this 16% damage the other sets that you lose to equip this ring. Be it a monster set piece or a 5 set piece. So you lose a bit more elsewhere.

I find this ring to be a trap to bait fools. Looks so good on paper, but is just a damage nerf in reality. It would only be good if it actually gave 25% damage.

Might be a decent push to raise your general damage a bit. But you lose those rng crits that just enable you to kill certain opponents that you will never kill without some crits aligning in the right moment. I think we are on a treacherous path this Malacath. Well played Daedric Lord, Well played. That is one way to make mortals lose.

Not necessarily. You can have two 5-piece proc sets and a monster set and malacath and have a spare slot.

For example:
Monster set, Front proc (3 Body + front-bar weapon), Back proc (2 body, necklace, back-bar weapon), Malacath ring, spare ring.

I mean in that scenario you would just put either of your proc sets on the final ring so you get 4th piece bonus on both bars but you get the idea. You don't have to sacrifice anything so long as you build right.

It will make single bar proc sets more valuable and it's particularly efficient for proc damage builds in no-CP. For example I can go Zaan/Skoria, Overwhelming/Auroran (front), Icy Conjuror (back) with malacath and let my proc sets do burst for me. You say you need rng crit to kill, but if you proc Overwhelming and Zaan on someone while Icy is ticking, a Curse is also about to explode and a Frag is proc'ed... that is tremendous rng burst even without the crits. Just a different type of rng gamble.

And if you want more sustain you can put Lich or Warlock on backbar. Works a treat.

EDIT: Corrected cause Caluurion requires crits.

Dracane

Maulkin wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Take away from this 16% damage the other sets that you lose to equip this ring. Be it a monster set piece or a 5 set piece. So you lose a bit more elsewhere.

I find this ring to be a trap to bait fools. Looks so good on paper, but is just a damage nerf in reality. It would only be good if it actually gave 25% damage.

Might be a decent push to raise your general damage a bit. But you lose those rng crits that just enable you to kill certain opponents that you will never kill without some crits aligning in the right moment. I think we are on a treacherous path this Malacath. Well played Daedric Lord, Well played. That is one way to make mortals lose.

Not necessarily. You can have two 5-piece proc sets and a monster set and malacath and have a spare slot.

For example:
Monster set, Front proc (3 Body + front-bar weapon), Back proc (2 body, necklace, back-bar weapon), Malacath ring, spare ring.

I mean in that scenario you would just put either of your proc sets on the final ring so you get 4th piece bonus on both bars but you get the idea. You don't have to sacrifice anything so long as you build right.

It will make single bar proc sets more valuable and it's particularly efficient for proc damage builds in no-CP. For example I can go Zaan/Skoria, Overwhelming/Auroran (front), Icy Conjuror (back) with malacath and let my proc sets do burst for me. You say you need rng crit to kill, but if you proc Overwhelming and Zaan on someone while Icy is ticking, a Curse is also about to explode and a Frag is proc'ed... that is tremendous rng burst even without the crits. Just a different type of rng gamble.

And if you want more sustain you can put Lich or Warlock on backbar. Works a treat.

EDIT: Corrected cause Caluurion requires crits.

While that is true, your stats would be horrible with this. This might work on a templar, but on a magicka sorcerer which you use as an example? You have no magicka to fuel your shields and barely much self damage. And dealing damage with a class abilitiy to proc overwhelming surge? Not so easy to reliably produce for a class that has no class spammable. And oh gods, that 200 shock damage per second that remains from surge after battle spirit and mititgations... tremendous.

Maulkin

Dracane wrote: »

Maulkin wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Take away from this 16% damage the other sets that you lose to equip this ring. Be it a monster set piece or a 5 set piece. So you lose a bit more elsewhere.

I find this ring to be a trap to bait fools. Looks so good on paper, but is just a damage nerf in reality. It would only be good if it actually gave 25% damage.

Might be a decent push to raise your general damage a bit. But you lose those rng crits that just enable you to kill certain opponents that you will never kill without some crits aligning in the right moment. I think we are on a treacherous path this Malacath. Well played Daedric Lord, Well played. That is one way to make mortals lose.

Not necessarily. You can have two 5-piece proc sets and a monster set and malacath and have a spare slot.

For example:
Monster set, Front proc (3 Body + front-bar weapon), Back proc (2 body, necklace, back-bar weapon), Malacath ring, spare ring.

I mean in that scenario you would just put either of your proc sets on the final ring so you get 4th piece bonus on both bars but you get the idea. You don't have to sacrifice anything so long as you build right.

It will make single bar proc sets more valuable and it's particularly efficient for proc damage builds in no-CP. For example I can go Zaan/Skoria, Overwhelming/Auroran (front), Icy Conjuror (back) with malacath and let my proc sets do burst for me. You say you need rng crit to kill, but if you proc Overwhelming and Zaan on someone while Icy is ticking, a Curse is also about to explode and a Frag is proc'ed... that is tremendous rng burst even without the crits. Just a different type of rng gamble.

And if you want more sustain you can put Lich or Warlock on backbar. Works a treat.

EDIT: Corrected cause Caluurion requires crits.

While that is true, your stats would be horrible with this. This might work on a templar, but on a magicka sorcerer which you use as an example? You have no magicka to fuel your shields and barely much self damage. And dealing damage with a class abilitiy to proc overwhelming surge? Not so easy for a class that has no class spammable.

It's a glass cannon build. Works a treat on no-CP. Admittedly less so with magsorc and moreso with other classes that have gapclosers to keep the pressure like NB, Templar and DK. Even Warden works great. In the case of two offensive proc-sets you can compensate your horrible sustain with Deep Thoughts and playing the chicken game with LOS.

In those builds Malacath is a great enhancer. Buffing Zaan, Icy and Overhelming by 25% with a single item is not to be joked at. There will be a lot of rage whispers afterwards

Dracane

Maulkin wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Maulkin wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Take away from this 16% damage the other sets that you lose to equip this ring. Be it a monster set piece or a 5 set piece. So you lose a bit more elsewhere.

I find this ring to be a trap to bait fools. Looks so good on paper, but is just a damage nerf in reality. It would only be good if it actually gave 25% damage.

Might be a decent push to raise your general damage a bit. But you lose those rng crits that just enable you to kill certain opponents that you will never kill without some crits aligning in the right moment. I think we are on a treacherous path this Malacath. Well played Daedric Lord, Well played. That is one way to make mortals lose.

Not necessarily. You can have two 5-piece proc sets and a monster set and malacath and have a spare slot.

For example:
Monster set, Front proc (3 Body + front-bar weapon), Back proc (2 body, necklace, back-bar weapon), Malacath ring, spare ring.

I mean in that scenario you would just put either of your proc sets on the final ring so you get 4th piece bonus on both bars but you get the idea. You don't have to sacrifice anything so long as you build right.

It will make single bar proc sets more valuable and it's particularly efficient for proc damage builds in no-CP. For example I can go Zaan/Skoria, Overwhelming/Auroran (front), Icy Conjuror (back) with malacath and let my proc sets do burst for me. You say you need rng crit to kill, but if you proc Overwhelming and Zaan on someone while Icy is ticking, a Curse is also about to explode and a Frag is proc'ed... that is tremendous rng burst even without the crits. Just a different type of rng gamble.

And if you want more sustain you can put Lich or Warlock on backbar. Works a treat.

EDIT: Corrected cause Caluurion requires crits.

While that is true, your stats would be horrible with this. This might work on a templar, but on a magicka sorcerer which you use as an example? You have no magicka to fuel your shields and barely much self damage. And dealing damage with a class abilitiy to proc overwhelming surge? Not so easy for a class that has no class spammable.

It's a glass cannon build. Works a treat on no-CP. Admittedly less so with magsorc and moreso with other classes that have gapclosers to keep the pressure like NB, Templar and DK. Even Warden works great. In the case of two offensive proc-sets you can compensate your horrible sustain with Deep Thoughts and playing the chicken game with LOS.

In those builds Malacath is a great enhancer. Buffing Zaan, Icy and Overhelming by 25% with a single item is not to be joked at. There will be a lot of rage whispers afterwards

I am glad you take it with the same humor.
But rage whispers you say? You intruige me, Maulkin the Golden... It would be worth it just for that. Ice Conjurer interests me. I never knew it is even used though after they butchered it on the pts before it ever went live.

All the meta classes have access to easy purges though... so what is it even worth.

Maulkin

Dracane wrote: »

Maulkin wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Maulkin wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Take away from this 16% damage the other sets that you lose to equip this ring. Be it a monster set piece or a 5 set piece. So you lose a bit more elsewhere.

I find this ring to be a trap to bait fools. Looks so good on paper, but is just a damage nerf in reality. It would only be good if it actually gave 25% damage.

Might be a decent push to raise your general damage a bit. But you lose those rng crits that just enable you to kill certain opponents that you will never kill without some crits aligning in the right moment. I think we are on a treacherous path this Malacath. Well played Daedric Lord, Well played. That is one way to make mortals lose.

Not necessarily. You can have two 5-piece proc sets and a monster set and malacath and have a spare slot.

For example:
Monster set, Front proc (3 Body + front-bar weapon), Back proc (2 body, necklace, back-bar weapon), Malacath ring, spare ring.

I mean in that scenario you would just put either of your proc sets on the final ring so you get 4th piece bonus on both bars but you get the idea. You don't have to sacrifice anything so long as you build right.

It will make single bar proc sets more valuable and it's particularly efficient for proc damage builds in no-CP. For example I can go Zaan/Skoria, Overwhelming/Auroran (front), Icy Conjuror (back) with malacath and let my proc sets do burst for me. You say you need rng crit to kill, but if you proc Overwhelming and Zaan on someone while Icy is ticking, a Curse is also about to explode and a Frag is proc'ed... that is tremendous rng burst even without the crits. Just a different type of rng gamble.

And if you want more sustain you can put Lich or Warlock on backbar. Works a treat.

EDIT: Corrected cause Caluurion requires crits.

While that is true, your stats would be horrible with this. This might work on a templar, but on a magicka sorcerer which you use as an example? You have no magicka to fuel your shields and barely much self damage. And dealing damage with a class abilitiy to proc overwhelming surge? Not so easy for a class that has no class spammable.

It's a glass cannon build. Works a treat on no-CP. Admittedly less so with magsorc and moreso with other classes that have gapclosers to keep the pressure like NB, Templar and DK. Even Warden works great. In the case of two offensive proc-sets you can compensate your horrible sustain with Deep Thoughts and playing the chicken game with LOS.

In those builds Malacath is a great enhancer. Buffing Zaan, Icy and Overhelming by 25% with a single item is not to be joked at. There will be a lot of rage whispers afterwards

I am glad you take it with the same humor.
But rage whispers you say? You intruige me, Maulkin the Golden... It would be worth it just for that. Ice Conjurer interests me. I never knew it is even used though after they butchered it on the pts before it ever went live.

These will probably get moderated out but I get these almost on a daily basis in BGs with a procblade build.

Dracane

Maulkin wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Maulkin wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Maulkin wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Take away from this 16% damage the other sets that you lose to equip this ring. Be it a monster set piece or a 5 set piece. So you lose a bit more elsewhere.

I find this ring to be a trap to bait fools. Looks so good on paper, but is just a damage nerf in reality. It would only be good if it actually gave 25% damage.

Might be a decent push to raise your general damage a bit. But you lose those rng crits that just enable you to kill certain opponents that you will never kill without some crits aligning in the right moment. I think we are on a treacherous path this Malacath. Well played Daedric Lord, Well played. That is one way to make mortals lose.

Not necessarily. You can have two 5-piece proc sets and a monster set and malacath and have a spare slot.

For example:
Monster set, Front proc (3 Body + front-bar weapon), Back proc (2 body, necklace, back-bar weapon), Malacath ring, spare ring.

I mean in that scenario you would just put either of your proc sets on the final ring so you get 4th piece bonus on both bars but you get the idea. You don't have to sacrifice anything so long as you build right.

It will make single bar proc sets more valuable and it's particularly efficient for proc damage builds in no-CP. For example I can go Zaan/Skoria, Overwhelming/Auroran (front), Icy Conjuror (back) with malacath and let my proc sets do burst for me. You say you need rng crit to kill, but if you proc Overwhelming and Zaan on someone while Icy is ticking, a Curse is also about to explode and a Frag is proc'ed... that is tremendous rng burst even without the crits. Just a different type of rng gamble.

And if you want more sustain you can put Lich or Warlock on backbar. Works a treat.

EDIT: Corrected cause Caluurion requires crits.

While that is true, your stats would be horrible with this. This might work on a templar, but on a magicka sorcerer which you use as an example? You have no magicka to fuel your shields and barely much self damage. And dealing damage with a class abilitiy to proc overwhelming surge? Not so easy for a class that has no class spammable.

It's a glass cannon build. Works a treat on no-CP. Admittedly less so with magsorc and moreso with other classes that have gapclosers to keep the pressure like NB, Templar and DK. Even Warden works great. In the case of two offensive proc-sets you can compensate your horrible sustain with Deep Thoughts and playing the chicken game with LOS.

In those builds Malacath is a great enhancer. Buffing Zaan, Icy and Overhelming by 25% with a single item is not to be joked at. There will be a lot of rage whispers afterwards

I am glad you take it with the same humor.
But rage whispers you say? You intruige me, Maulkin the Golden... It would be worth it just for that. Ice Conjurer interests me. I never knew it is even used though after they butchered it on the pts before it ever went live.

These will probably get moderated out but I get these almost on a daily basis in BGs with a procblade build.

Some of these comments... It's like saying "Your pets killed me, not you."
These proc sets are what you give everything else away for. I find them legit, although I personally do not like them, as I need stat candy for my eyes.

Maulkin

Dracane wrote: »

Maulkin wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Maulkin wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Maulkin wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Take away from this 16% damage the other sets that you lose to equip this ring. Be it a monster set piece or a 5 set piece. So you lose a bit more elsewhere.

I find this ring to be a trap to bait fools. Looks so good on paper, but is just a damage nerf in reality. It would only be good if it actually gave 25% damage.

Might be a decent push to raise your general damage a bit. But you lose those rng crits that just enable you to kill certain opponents that you will never kill without some crits aligning in the right moment. I think we are on a treacherous path this Malacath. Well played Daedric Lord, Well played. That is one way to make mortals lose.

Not necessarily. You can have two 5-piece proc sets and a monster set and malacath and have a spare slot.

For example:
Monster set, Front proc (3 Body + front-bar weapon), Back proc (2 body, necklace, back-bar weapon), Malacath ring, spare ring.

I mean in that scenario you would just put either of your proc sets on the final ring so you get 4th piece bonus on both bars but you get the idea. You don't have to sacrifice anything so long as you build right.

It will make single bar proc sets more valuable and it's particularly efficient for proc damage builds in no-CP. For example I can go Zaan/Skoria, Overwhelming/Auroran (front), Icy Conjuror (back) with malacath and let my proc sets do burst for me. You say you need rng crit to kill, but if you proc Overwhelming and Zaan on someone while Icy is ticking, a Curse is also about to explode and a Frag is proc'ed... that is tremendous rng burst even without the crits. Just a different type of rng gamble.

And if you want more sustain you can put Lich or Warlock on backbar. Works a treat.

EDIT: Corrected cause Caluurion requires crits.

While that is true, your stats would be horrible with this. This might work on a templar, but on a magicka sorcerer which you use as an example? You have no magicka to fuel your shields and barely much self damage. And dealing damage with a class abilitiy to proc overwhelming surge? Not so easy for a class that has no class spammable.

It's a glass cannon build. Works a treat on no-CP. Admittedly less so with magsorc and moreso with other classes that have gapclosers to keep the pressure like NB, Templar and DK. Even Warden works great. In the case of two offensive proc-sets you can compensate your horrible sustain with Deep Thoughts and playing the chicken game with LOS.

In those builds Malacath is a great enhancer. Buffing Zaan, Icy and Overhelming by 25% with a single item is not to be joked at. There will be a lot of rage whispers afterwards

I am glad you take it with the same humor.
But rage whispers you say? You intruige me, Maulkin the Golden... It would be worth it just for that. Ice Conjurer interests me. I never knew it is even used though after they butchered it on the pts before it ever went live.

These will probably get moderated out but I get these almost on a daily basis in BGs with a procblade build.

Some of these comments... It's like saying "Your pets killed me, not you."
These proc sets are what you give everything else away for. I find them legit, although I personally do not like them, as I need stat candy for my eyes.

You give a lot away indeed, people that don't play it don't realise.

It's a great one trick pony build, you turn it on someone and they can explode. Very efficient if you can keep pressure on a single opponent. But you spend a lot of your time running because the second you get focused by more than 1 player you simply can't survive with 3 offensive proc sets. If the other team is ganging up on me or supporting eachother, i will often end up with negative KDR because I'm completely cancelled out by that. If they run in 1 by 1, like headless chickens, I can pick them off, go 25-0 and get rage whispers aplenty.

relentless_turnip

I am personally not a fan of proc sets, but malacalth will be a massive buff for those that use them.

Zaan is probably the only one I think goes too far. Only because it literally kills players for you, where as other proc sets are just added pressure.

LuxiasCaelum13

Honestly i think y'all are overreacting a little bit. A lot, actually.
Yes, the ring is powerful, but some guys are ignoring several facts about combat dynamics.

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First: the builds

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You guys are assuming a fully damaging build, with little to no resistances/sustain. Sure, the damage also affects proc sets, but if your enemy is going full glass-cannon he should be fairly squishy too, so as long as you keep some distance and defense it shouldn't be a huge problem. Any fight between a reasonably tanky char and a glass cannon in a 1v1 scenario will be won 9/10 times by the tankier character, because the guy will always be capable to witstand the damage and make the opponent to waste resources while the glass cannon relies in one specific combo/proc condition to win, and when they don't have that condition they can't just take all the damage, which invalidates the whole "but it increases proc damage" argument. Some might say: "but how many times outside duels are you gonna be in a 1v1 scenario?" which is true, but to be fair most of the times the fights, both in BG and Cyro will be XvX, so that plays in favor of glass cannon builds, but sooner or later (more sooner than later) they will get caught and/or unable to scape, which means instant death.

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Second: How to combine sets

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Now on live we have this standarized setup: 2/5/5. Right now we can have a monster set and two five piece sets. Some builds can go with 2/5/3+arena, and instead of a secondary 5 piece set they run a 3 piece set like potentates and some arena weapons like Asylum or BRP. Now, as they stand, mythic items are pretty much a replacement for monster sets. What combinations do we have? If you try to use 2/5/5 you'll have to sacrifice the 5th piece to use the mythic item, losing the full benefit from the last set. How about 2/5/3+arena? It happens the same, you have to either sacrifice the last piece from the 5pc set, the 3rd piece of the secondary set or the arena weapon. 5/5/mythic is by far the best combination, because you might not wear a monster set, but even if you run an arena weapon backbar you'll still have 4 bonuses from your frontbar set active. What i'm trying to say with this is that mythic items are not suited for all builds, some characters will benefit more from using classic setups than mythics, and this happens specially with the band of brutality.

Let's just do a quick reminder of all the classes. Here i'll be talking based in my experience when playing them:

Necromancers: Using this ring, is, in theory, a big loss. Remember how necromancers have extra crit chance when in execute range for each grave lord skill slotted. Sure, having 25% extra damage is pretty much like dealing crits constantly, but is worth for them to lose a 5pc bonus or a monster set? Having extra 25% damage is worth losing potential 300+ weapon/spell damage/recovery/anything in addition to execute crits? I don't think so. Even for magicka users having sets providing an extra pet, or any other effect would be more beneficial.

Nightblades: And lose their cloak guaranteed crit? Hell no. Maybe for brawler NBs not relying on crits this would be an option, but let's be real, how many non-gank NBs are to not consider ganking the signature playstile of NBs?. Both magblades and stamblades rely a lot in the cloak+spammable combo to keep their pressure, so losing this massive bonus, which allows them to use other supportive sets instead of running full damage is not an option.

Templars: The same example as necros, with the big difference being their extra critical damage, instead of the increased crit chance for executes. Combined with their many built-in crit buffs like jabs or reflective light that would be more like a loss. This ring would be basically like negating piercing spear. It may also increase the damage from burning light, but is it really worth to build only around that? How many aedric spear skills do templars use besides the spammable and the ult to make burning light proc with enough consistency to make a theoretical 25% damage increase worth it?

Wardens: Actually one of the few classes i can see using this, both stam and mag, nothing to say here. Great healing, defense and offense, this ring sounds like a treat for them.

Sorcerers: Yes and no. Stamsorcs would deal some definetely needed damage, but they would lose crit surge, one of their most important skills. The same goes with magsorcs, being their zoo variants the only ones i can see using this consistently, since they don't have to be specially defensive thanks to the LoS their pets provide.

Dragonknights: I imagine magDks being able to use this pretty efficiently, but definetely not stamDks, for the same reasons i mentioned earlier, they are arguably the best pvp tanks out there, so why would they sacrifice a valuable monster set or any other offensive/defensive bonus for this? Maybe for other mythics, like the snow treaders, to avoid getting snared, but for damage? I think stamDKs would benefit more from other damage sources which can increase their healing tooltips rather than a flat 25% dmg increase.

---

Third, the tooltips

---

This is some sort of continuation of the previous point. Imagine three theoretical builds for this purpose:
Build A) 1 kena+1 veli+5 new moon+5 hundings/wathever you like most to boost damage stats
Build b) 2 selene/veli+5 red mountain+ 5 wathever proc sets you like most
Build C) 5 new moon + 5 hundings/the same i said with A + Malacath band of brutality.

(All of these examples apply for magicka setups too, obviously)

Now let's make them fight.
b) is going to deal insane amounts of damage at the moment the sets proc at the same time, but outside that, he won't get much benefit it terms of stats or defensive tools, he relies only on this one specific gimmick. Even if b) switched one set for this ring, dealing extra 25% damage with two procs won't deal the same damage as three procs, given they proc at the same time. Even if they aren't synced is way more reliable to have three procs dealing damage within short gaps of time than dealing more damage with two proc sets but with more time between procs. Not to mention that procs are really easy to avoid. Caluurion? If your opponent doesn't have any funcional neuron sure, it works wonders, but for everyone else is a trick that works the first time, specially due the long-ass animation. Zaan? CC to avoid more pressure, block, LoS and heal. Selene? Dodge. Veli? There is like a kilometer of distance between the spores, and it can proc on dots too, so the opponent might just not be in front of you when the set procs. All of these sets are nice, but when the enemy knows the trick they lose all their effectiveness. Hell, even if b) switches his gear for a 5pc sustain/defensive set+proc+malacath's ring, having only 1 enhanced proc won't allow for any strategy against any experienced player, since his main damage source can be easily avoided or outhealed. Procs like sheer venom, viper, and all of their kind are another story though. The damage dealt would be pretty good, specially in no CP, but that's nothing a regular build coulnd't do.

C) will deal lots of damage, sure, and can still crit heal, but for how much? Compare the raw damage provided by the ring with the extra utility of all the three sets that A) has. More damaging stats/resources means more healing, more dodge rolls, bigger shields, and overall extra utility in your belt, and keep in mind, A) can crit heal too, and for more than b), because the ring doesn't affect healing. So at the end of the day, the ring only favors playes who stay in the offense, players with low crit chance, players with built-in defense in ther skillset or with 1combo KO strategies, while players who focus more on survivability will find any other gear setup more useful.
You can't kill me if i streak away from you, or if i LoS with cloak, or if i dodge your attacks, or if i block with my shield while healing, or if i hide behind my pets forcing you to target them. It's not like if the ring can invalidate everything by just overpowering your enemies, or do you think people will just stand still waiting for you to kill them?

In conclusion i'd say it won't be as much overpowered as people is fearing. It looks great on paper, and i'm sure it will perform great for its intended role, but not to the point where everything else becomes useless or where a 10% nerf is needed.

Crixus8000

Wolf_Watching wrote: »

Why is no-cp and bgs a baseline for anything? First of all that campaign should be locked to anyone above a certain amount of cp tbh

Lol. No cp is far more balanced than carry cp pvp imo. Guess that's why bgs force no cp too.

Joinovikova

Its sad but now pvp will be decided not by skill but by no life farming of this sauron ring of power.. only full heavy proc set based builds will be allowed to play any pvp.

Gilvoth

i bet we see that you do more damage with it OFF then with it on.

Xebov

BohnT2 wrote: »

No those 25% are already highly overtuned in PvP as they give you the damage you'd deal with crits but on every single hit.
That means it basically gives a 100% crit bonus while also ignoring any investment people did to combat crits.

It's one of the most game breaking sets this game has ever seen, what makes it worse is that it'll highly affect the meta and change how builds have to work.

I think you miss some pieces here.

No matter what combination of gear you wear you will loose the last set bonus on something, except for some edge case builds where players already wear incomplete sets.

You cannot crit, except for abilities that guarantee a crit. This means that all sets that proc on crit will not work. It also means that set bonuses that give crit become useless. Which in turn limits the available sets.

I might be wrong, but when it comes to this item i have the strong feeling that some ppl forget to factor these things in and end up with higher theoretical damage than they would reach in reality.

BaiterOfZergs

Feel like you can find some decent builds running 5+3+2+1 or any other viable combination outside of 5+5+2.

The way people build for damage will just change, this isn’t the first damage modifier that functions according to Zos math.

shrekt4303

If I have 15% crit chance in bg, yeah I'd probably run it. Builds specifically built without crit would benefit the most. I could see heavy armoured individuals running it to push up their damage, or light armored individuals building for penetration. Classes that get bonuses to crit chance or damage probably shouldnt run it if the goal is to do alot of damage. I could see it being strong with builds focused on dots like an axe wielding stamdk.

Draevik

This item is insanely op in NO-CP... not borderline. It IS lol. I did a build and the damage is insane. You don't need to worry about crits and crit resist won't save anyone from your onslaught. It is going to be ridiculous.

TTK will be 1-3 seconds i reckon.

Davadin

olsborg wrote: »

If they made this ring not buff item sets/proccs such as grothdarr, zaan or selene etc...it would be more balanced imo.

wait. the 25% damage also affects set damages??? not just your skills or LA/HA?


holy ***.

LuxiasCaelum13

Xebov wrote: »

I think you miss some pieces here.

No matter what combination of gear you wear you will loose the last set bonus on something, except for some edge case builds where players already wear incomplete sets.

You cannot crit, except for abilities that guarantee a crit. This means that all sets that proc on crit will not work. It also means that set bonuses that give crit become useless. Which in turn limits the available sets.

I might be wrong, but when it comes to this item i have the strong feeling that some ppl forget to factor these things in and end up with higher theoretical damage than they would reach in reality.

Not only that, but ppl is still freaking out with proc sets. Like, you guys know that all heavy hitting proc sets are easily avoidable, and poison sets like viper or sheer venom are not strong enough to make them gamebreaking right?

And btw, talking about sacrificing things to wear this ring, skills that guarantee crits, like artherial burst, can't crit.

BohnT2

LuxiasCaelum13 wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

I think you miss some pieces here.

No matter what combination of gear you wear you will loose the last set bonus on something, except for some edge case builds where players already wear incomplete sets.

You cannot crit, except for abilities that guarantee a crit. This means that all sets that proc on crit will not work. It also means that set bonuses that give crit become useless. Which in turn limits the available sets.

I might be wrong, but when it comes to this item i have the strong feeling that some ppl forget to factor these things in and end up with higher theoretical damage than they would reach in reality.

Not only that, but ppl is still freaking out with proc sets. Like, you guys know that all heavy hitting proc sets are easily avoidable, and poison sets like viper or sheer venom are not strong enough to make them gamebreaking right?

And btw, talking about sacrificing things to wear this ring, skills that guarantee crits, like artherial burst, can't crit.

Oh my sweet summerchild, be ready for a rude awakening once people acquired it.

People defending this set have no clue how much this will impact the meta.

LuxiasCaelum13

BohnT2 wrote: »

LuxiasCaelum13 wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

I think you miss some pieces here.

No matter what combination of gear you wear you will loose the last set bonus on something, except for some edge case builds where players already wear incomplete sets.

You cannot crit, except for abilities that guarantee a crit. This means that all sets that proc on crit will not work. It also means that set bonuses that give crit become useless. Which in turn limits the available sets.

I might be wrong, but when it comes to this item i have the strong feeling that some ppl forget to factor these things in and end up with higher theoretical damage than they would reach in reality.

Not only that, but ppl is still freaking out with proc sets. Like, you guys know that all heavy hitting proc sets are easily avoidable, and poison sets like viper or sheer venom are not strong enough to make them gamebreaking right?

And btw, talking about sacrificing things to wear this ring, skills that guarantee crits, like artherial burst, can't crit.

Oh my sweet summerchild, be ready for a rude awakening once people acquired it.

People defending this set have no clue how much this will impact the meta.

I already wrote a response talking about why is not gonna be so overpowered, so yes, i think i already know pretty well.

Dracane

BohnT2 wrote: »

LuxiasCaelum13 wrote: »

BohnT2 wrote: »

LuxiasCaelum13 wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

I think you miss some pieces here.

No matter what combination of gear you wear you will loose the last set bonus on something, except for some edge case builds where players already wear incomplete sets.

You cannot crit, except for abilities that guarantee a crit. This means that all sets that proc on crit will not work. It also means that set bonuses that give crit become useless. Which in turn limits the available sets.

I might be wrong, but when it comes to this item i have the strong feeling that some ppl forget to factor these things in and end up with higher theoretical damage than they would reach in reality.

Not only that, but ppl is still freaking out with proc sets. Like, you guys know that all heavy hitting proc sets are easily avoidable, and poison sets like viper or sheer venom are not strong enough to make them gamebreaking right?

And btw, talking about sacrificing things to wear this ring, skills that guarantee crits, like artherial burst, can't crit.

Oh my sweet summerchild, be ready for a rude awakening once people acquired it.

People defending this set have no clue how much this will impact the meta.

I already wrote a response talking about why is not gonna be so overpowered, so yes, i think i already know pretty well.

you state so many wrong things in your post starting from your missconception that crits are stronger than normal hits from malacath which they aren't you have to use a crit damage focused build in order to get more damage from crits than regular hits from malacath.

This means every single time your build not using malacath doesn't crit you lose damage and even if you crit you only get equal damage.
Even if you'd hit for a little bit more damage on crits you'll lose damage in your burst combo.
Assuming you play stamwarden and your basic combo is shalks+light attack+bash+wrecking blow+light attack+2h ult over 2 gcds.
That means 6 damage instances, not counting enchantment procs, not counting dots.
Even if your build has a crit chance of 65% which is already ridicoulus to begin with.
In order for every single damage instance to crit you have a chance of 0.65^6= 0.075 or 7.5%.
From this we can then make another step to find out how many times we have to perform our burst combo in order to have a X% chance for this to happen.
n>= ln(1- percentage chance we want the result to occure) / ln(1-percentage chance the result occurs)

if we want all skills to crit once with a chance of 90% for it to happen it'll take us 29.5 -> 30 tries to have this 90% chance for it to happen.

Of course we'd have to weigh the different damage instances differently to be more accurate but it won't change the result in any meaningful way.

Keep in mind this result is already based on a niche build that has already less damage than a regular build due to opportunity costs.

Going further down your arguments you state that tanks can't use this set which is horribly wrong.
You don't have to give up any sets especially not on stamina specs using 1h+s on one bar.
You can easily run the following set combination: 2 monster, 1 malacath, 3 Body first set, 2 body + 2 jewelry second set and 2 weapon first set --> 2/1/5/4 and on backbar you'll have 2/1/4/5 when using sword and board.

Sets which can be used easily with this setup: NMA (front), Stuhn's(either), cyrodiils crest (back), deadly strikes (front), clever alchemist (back), 7th legion (either), essence thief (either), spriggan (front), titanborn (front)
and that's just a small range of the stamina sets, not even counting damage proc sets.

The only sets that get hurt by this setup are Fury, unchained aggressor, pariah, yandir's might and some others.

I hope this shows you the most blatant flaws of your reasoning

I think the reason he thinks that tanks can not use malacath, is that it does not give flat damage, but %. And 25% of little is still not much. So a tank who has small base damage to begin with, won't get stellar results from malacath.

Still this is such an overreaction. Even if it gave 25% damage to anyone, which it does not seem to do, it would not be that terrible. Multiple people seem to have come to the conclusion that it's merely 16% damage in most cases or less. It is not worth it. I would even call it underpowered... If I get cursed, then I want to get kissed. But Malacath only licks me swiftly.

HankTwo

BohnT2 wrote: »

LuxiasCaelum13 wrote: »

BohnT2 wrote: »

LuxiasCaelum13 wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

I think you miss some pieces here.

No matter what combination of gear you wear you will loose the last set bonus on something, except for some edge case builds where players already wear incomplete sets.

You cannot crit, except for abilities that guarantee a crit. This means that all sets that proc on crit will not work. It also means that set bonuses that give crit become useless. Which in turn limits the available sets.

I might be wrong, but when it comes to this item i have the strong feeling that some ppl forget to factor these things in and end up with higher theoretical damage than they would reach in reality.

Not only that, but ppl is still freaking out with proc sets. Like, you guys know that all heavy hitting proc sets are easily avoidable, and poison sets like viper or sheer venom are not strong enough to make them gamebreaking right?

And btw, talking about sacrificing things to wear this ring, skills that guarantee crits, like artherial burst, can't crit.

Oh my sweet summerchild, be ready for a rude awakening once people acquired it.

People defending this set have no clue how much this will impact the meta.

I already wrote a response talking about why is not gonna be so overpowered, so yes, i think i already know pretty well.

you state so many wrong things in your post starting from your missconception that crits are stronger than normal hits from malacath which they aren't you have to use a crit damage focused build in order to get more damage from crits than regular hits from malacath.

This means every single time your build not using malacath doesn't crit you lose damage and even if you crit you only get equal damage.
Even if you'd hit for a little bit more damage on crits you'll lose damage in your burst combo.
Assuming you play stamwarden and your basic combo is shalks+light attack+bash+wrecking blow+light attack+2h ult over 2 gcds.
That means 6 damage instances, not counting enchantment procs, not counting dots.
Even if your build has a crit chance of 65% which is already ridicoulus to begin with.
In order for every single damage instance to crit you have a chance of 0.65^6= 0.075 or 7.5%.
From this we can then make another step to find out how many times we have to perform our burst combo in order to have a X% chance for this to happen.
n>= ln(1- percentage chance we want the result to occure) / ln(1-percentage chance the result occurs)

if we want all skills to crit once with a chance of 90% for it to happen it'll take us 29.5 -> 30 tries to have this 90% chance for it to happen.

Of course we'd have to weigh the different damage instances differently to be more accurate but it won't change the result in any meaningful way.

Keep in mind this result is already based on a niche build that has already less damage than a regular build due to opportunity costs.

Going further down your arguments you state that tanks can't use this set which is horribly wrong.
You don't have to give up any sets especially not on stamina specs using 1h+s on one bar.
You can easily run the following set combination: 2 monster, 1 malacath, 3 Body first set, 2 body + 2 jewelry second set and 2 weapon first set --> 2/1/5/4 and on backbar you'll have 2/1/4/5 when using sword and board.

Sets which can be used easily with this setup: NMA (front), Stuhn's(either), cyrodiils crest (back), deadly strikes (front), clever alchemist (back), 7th legion (either), essence thief (either), spriggan (front), titanborn (front)
and that's just a small range of the stamina sets, not even counting damage proc sets.

The only sets that get hurt by this setup are Fury, unchained aggressor, pariah, yandir's might and some others.

I hope this shows you the most blatant flaws of your reasoning

Its not that simple, though. To make a fair comparison for malacath's band we have to look at

a) alternative item options --> here other mythic items are the most fair comparison. Lets look at ring of the wild hunt for example with 15 % extra speed in combat. How much do you think this would be worth compared to extra damage? Lets say for now 15 % speed is roughly equal in worth to 8 % extra damage.

b) make estimates of the variables that affect malacaths band total effetiveness: crit chance (CC), crit damage (CD), damage done (DD) and critical resistance (CR).

The question is, under which circumstances would malacaths band be on average equal in effectiveness to alternative options (we'll use the roughly 8 % worth of extra damage here for other mythic items as an estimation)? Lets look at the equation:

(1 + DD + 0.08) * (1 + CD - CR) * CC + (1 + DD + 0.08) * (1 - CC) = (1 * DD + 0.25)

Now, this equation has a lot of variables, but of course we can check it for some different estimations. First lets estimate a 25 % crit resistance in no CP. Then lets look at 2 different cases.

1) A light/medium armor build with rather high, but still common, crit stats for no CP: 10 % flat damage done modifiers, a 70 % crit damage modifier and 40 % crit chance

--> (1 + 0.1 + 0.08) * (1 + 0.7 - 0.25) * 0.4 + (1 + 0.1 + 0.08) * (1 - 0.4) = 1.3924
or if we don't take the 8 % damage into accoubt: 1.298 + 15 % extra speed

vs malacaths band: 1 + 0.1 +0.25 = 1.35
In this case using a different item than malacaths band looks more useful to me.

2) A heavy armor build with low crit stats and more raw damage multipliers: 20 % flat damge done modifiers, a base 50 % crit damage modifier and 20 % crit chance

--> (1 + 0.2 + 0.08) * (1 + 0.5 - 0.25) * 0.2 + (1 + 0.2 + 0.08) * (1 - 0.2) = 1.344
or if we don't take the 8 % damage into account: 1.26 + 15 % extra speed

vs malacaths band: 1 + 0.2 + 0.25 = 1.45
In this case using malacaths band definitely looks much more beneficial.

Now, an important question is which builds are more dangerous offensive wise in the current meta. I'd say currently builds with strong crit (unless they sacrifice too much for it) still definitely have an edge, while next patch malacaths band will mostly be a big buff for low crit builds. Big question is how much crit resitance people will run next patch and if ZOS will nerf the 1.3k flat crit resistance that people will get.

Other than that I think malacaths band should not affect proc sets and maybe be nerfed to + 20 % damage. But I don't think that it will be broken OP, at least compared to the other strong mythic items (mythic items will be a big buff to the builds you describe anyway, not just malacaths band).

Edit: To make things clear, if we look at malacaths band in a vacuum then yes, it looks undoubtfully OP. But if we take into consideration the other strong mythic items it looks more in line. Personally I really dislike that they introduce such strong items behind both a paywall and a huge grind, but thats just how ZOS operates now.

BohnT2

Dracane wrote: »

BohnT2 wrote: »

LuxiasCaelum13 wrote: »

BohnT2 wrote: »

LuxiasCaelum13 wrote: »

Xebov wrote: »

I think you miss some pieces here.

No matter what combination of gear you wear you will loose the last set bonus on something, except for some edge case builds where players already wear incomplete sets.

You cannot crit, except for abilities that guarantee a crit. This means that all sets that proc on crit will not work. It also means that set bonuses that give crit become useless. Which in turn limits the available sets.

I might be wrong, but when it comes to this item i have the strong feeling that some ppl forget to factor these things in and end up with higher theoretical damage than they would reach in reality.

Not only that, but ppl is still freaking out with proc sets. Like, you guys know that all heavy hitting proc sets are easily avoidable, and poison sets like viper or sheer venom are not strong enough to make them gamebreaking right?

And btw, talking about sacrificing things to wear this ring, skills that guarantee crits, like artherial burst, can't crit.

Oh my sweet summerchild, be ready for a rude awakening once people acquired it.

People defending this set have no clue how much this will impact the meta.

I already wrote a response talking about why is not gonna be so overpowered, so yes, i think i already know pretty well.

you state so many wrong things in your post starting from your missconception that crits are stronger than normal hits from malacath which they aren't you have to use a crit damage focused build in order to get more damage from crits than regular hits from malacath.

This means every single time your build not using malacath doesn't crit you lose damage and even if you crit you only get equal damage.
Even if you'd hit for a little bit more damage on crits you'll lose damage in your burst combo.
Assuming you play stamwarden and your basic combo is shalks+light attack+bash+wrecking blow+light attack+2h ult over 2 gcds.
That means 6 damage instances, not counting enchantment procs, not counting dots.
Even if your build has a crit chance of 65% which is already ridicoulus to begin with.
In order for every single damage instance to crit you have a chance of 0.65^6= 0.075 or 7.5%.
From this we can then make another step to find out how many times we have to perform our burst combo in order to have a X% chance for this to happen.
n>= ln(1- percentage chance we want the result to occure) / ln(1-percentage chance the result occurs)

if we want all skills to crit once with a chance of 90% for it to happen it'll take us 29.5 -> 30 tries to have this 90% chance for it to happen.

Of course we'd have to weigh the different damage instances differently to be more accurate but it won't change the result in any meaningful way.

Keep in mind this result is already based on a niche build that has already less damage than a regular build due to opportunity costs.

Going further down your arguments you state that tanks can't use this set which is horribly wrong.
You don't have to give up any sets especially not on stamina specs using 1h+s on one bar.
You can easily run the following set combination: 2 monster, 1 malacath, 3 Body first set, 2 body + 2 jewelry second set and 2 weapon first set --> 2/1/5/4 and on backbar you'll have 2/1/4/5 when using sword and board.

Sets which can be used easily with this setup: NMA (front), Stuhn's(either), cyrodiils crest (back), deadly strikes (front), clever alchemist (back), 7th legion (either), essence thief (either), spriggan (front), titanborn (front)
and that's just a small range of the stamina sets, not even counting damage proc sets.

The only sets that get hurt by this setup are Fury, unchained aggressor, pariah, yandir's might and some others.

I hope this shows you the most blatant flaws of your reasoning

I think the reason he thinks that tanks can not use malacath, is that it does not give flat damage, but %. And 25% of little is still not much. So a tank who has small base damage to begin with, won't get stellar results from malacath.

Still this is such an overreaction. Even if it gave 25% damage to anyone, which it does not seem to do, it would not be that terrible. Multiple people seem to have come to the conclusion that it's merely 16% damage in most cases or less. It is not worth it. I would even call it underpowered... If I get cursed, then I want to get kissed. But Malacath only licks me swiftly.

And you don't see the issue with a 1pc set that gives you a huge damage increase with no detriment?