ZOS any intent to address the RNG issues from this event?

huntgod_ESO

Plenty of threads about folks who had abysmal RNG and were unable to get enough fragments for the memento or pet and even with tickets were unable to purchase all the required fragments.

Do you guys have any plans to change this so that folks participating in the event can at least acquire the rewards for the event without having to spend actual money in the cash shop for your tickets?

You guys have done some things in the past I thought were questionable but this is the first time I feel like you have done something directly abusive to the player base with the designed intent to push cash shop sales of tickets as a bad run with RNG makes it impossible to earn the rewards without it.

Kel

They want you to buy tickets from the crown store.
Working as intended, unfortunately. So no, they won't address it. It's plain cash grab. Any one can see that.

huntgod_ESO

Kel wrote: »

They want you to buy tickets from the crown store.
Working as intended, unfortunately. So no, they won't address it. It's plain cash grab. Any one can see that.

I unfortunately feel the same way, just figured I'd give an opportunity to address it or them to make a Mea Culpa with assurances that they wouldn't use RNG this way on non tradeable items moving forward.

I am particularly concerned as we have the Sovereign Sow coming up, with only 8 chances to get 7 fragments...which if not a guaranteed drop is going to be a huge kick in the the proverbial nuts.

DaveMoeDee

It's math. They knew that some people would get horrible outcomes and some would get good outcomes. They understand the distribution curve of outcomes we would experience. What is there to address? They know what would happen but chose that design anyway.

The problem is their choice of design. The results are too varied from person to person for doing the same thing and the grind to overcome bad outcomes is absurdly long. And if you don't get fragments in your strongbox, what do you get? Filler or gear you can already get from other dailies. If the drop rate on second dropboxes wasn't so absurdly low, this system could have been acceptable.

huntgod_ESO

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

It's math. They knew that some people would get horrible outcomes and some would get good outcomes. They understand the distribution curve of outcomes we would experience. What is there to address? They know what would happen but chose that design anyway.

The problem is their choice of design. The results are too varied from person to person for doing the same thing and the grind to overcome bad outcomes is absurdly long. And if you don't get fragments in your strongbox, what do you get? Filler or gear you can already get from other dailies. If the drop rate on second dropboxes wasn't so absurdly low, this system could have been acceptable.

So my hope would be that they did not foresee this and that they expected the RNG to still be high enough that any player would be able to compensate for it with ticket purchased fragments. I'd also hope they didn't expect the extra box drops to be so woefully bad as to not help alleviate this as well.

So my hope, would again be that this was a Mea Culpa moment and they would take steps to address it for folks that were unable to complete the rewards, either by providing a blanket drop to them, or all players.

If this isn't the case, I want to know so I can revise my expectations moving forward, if they do this same awful RNG for the Jester's Event and the Sow, I know not to bother renewing my sub, for example.

Nomadic_Atmoran

huntgod_ESO wrote: »

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

It's math. They knew that some people would get horrible outcomes and some would get good outcomes. They understand the distribution curve of outcomes we would experience. What is there to address? They know what would happen but chose that design anyway.

The problem is their choice of design. The results are too varied from person to person for doing the same thing and the grind to overcome bad outcomes is absurdly long. And if you don't get fragments in your strongbox, what do you get? Filler or gear you can already get from other dailies. If the drop rate on second dropboxes wasn't so absurdly low, this system could have been acceptable.

So my hope would be that they did not foresee this and that they expected the RNG to still be high enough that any player would be able to compensate for it with ticket purchased fragments. I'd also hope they didn't expect the extra box drops to be so woefully bad as to not help alleviate this as well.

So my hope, would again be that this was a Mea Culpa moment and they would take steps to address it for folks that were unable to complete the rewards, either by providing a blanket drop to them, or all players.

If this isn't the case, I want to know so I can revise my expectations moving forward, if they do this same awful RNG for the Jester's Event and the Sow, I know not to bother renewing my sub, for example.

They aren't inexperienced with RNG. Its been something they've mastered long before this event and its very unlikely that this was a misstep on their part when we have seen absolutely nothing from them regarding the complaints. Radio-silence is a damning sign that they knew what they were doing and they had every intention of releasing it the way it is.

DaveMoeDee

huntgod_ESO wrote: »

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

It's math. They knew that some people would get horrible outcomes and some would get good outcomes. They understand the distribution curve of outcomes we would experience. What is there to address? They know what would happen but chose that design anyway.

The problem is their choice of design. The results are too varied from person to person for doing the same thing and the grind to overcome bad outcomes is absurdly long. And if you don't get fragments in your strongbox, what do you get? Filler or gear you can already get from other dailies. If the drop rate on second dropboxes wasn't so absurdly low, this system could have been acceptable.

So my hope would be that they did not foresee this and that they expected the RNG to still be high enough that any player would be able to compensate for it with ticket purchased fragments. I'd also hope they didn't expect the extra box drops to be so woefully bad as to not help alleviate this as well.

So my hope, would again be that this was a Mea Culpa moment and they would take steps to address it for folks that were unable to complete the rewards, either by providing a blanket drop to them, or all players.

If this isn't the case, I want to know so I can revise my expectations moving forward, if they do this same awful RNG for the Jester's Event and the Sow, I know not to bother renewing my sub, for example.

It isn't the 'RNG' that they would think would be 'high enough'. It is the drop rates.

The math is really straightforward based on the drop rates and the number of days of the event. It is hard to imagine they didn't do the math to compute that out.

It is possible that there is a bug that made the second strongbox much less likely than they planned, which made it so pretty much no one is willing to do the grind to get more strongboxes. But barring an error in coding the droprates, it is hard to imagine that this wasn't the intention.

Rave the Histborn

huntgod_ESO wrote: »

Plenty of threads about folks who had abysmal RNG and were unable to get enough fragments for the memento or pet and even with tickets were unable to purchase all the required fragments.

Do you guys have any plans to change this so that folks participating in the event can at least acquire the rewards for the event without having to spend actual money in the cash shop for your tickets?

You guys have done some things in the past I thought were questionable but this is the first time I feel like you have done something directly abusive to the player base with the designed intent to push cash shop sales of tickets as a bad run with RNG makes it impossible to earn the rewards without it.

Why would they change the rng? I haven't seen a post that isn't pure hyperbole or over exageration about the event

Linaleah

Kel wrote: »

They want you to buy tickets from the crown store.
Working as intended, unfortunately. So no, they won't address it. It's plain cash grab. Any one can see that.

yeah, i have to agree with that.

we had plenty of events before, where some people were luckier then others, but that bad rng could at least be somewhat alleviated via trading between players.

this had to have been done on purpose. if you are feeling charitable, you could maybe hope that they did it to save us some bag space. but then... why make farming extra boxes and drop rates in first boxes of the day so bad?

huntgod_ESO

Rave the Histborn wrote: »

huntgod_ESO wrote: »

Plenty of threads about folks who had abysmal RNG and were unable to get enough fragments for the memento or pet and even with tickets were unable to purchase all the required fragments.

Do you guys have any plans to change this so that folks participating in the event can at least acquire the rewards for the event without having to spend actual money in the cash shop for your tickets?

You guys have done some things in the past I thought were questionable but this is the first time I feel like you have done something directly abusive to the player base with the designed intent to push cash shop sales of tickets as a bad run with RNG makes it impossible to earn the rewards without it.

Why would they change the rng? I haven't seen a post that isn't pure hyperbole or over exageration about the event

Yeah I've addressed your experience in one of the other threads..."it worked for me, so it's fine" isn't really applicable, not that it ever is.

I entered the event with tickets, purchased a berry and then had to use every other ticket I got to buy fragments and still came up one short, I didn't spend the tickets frivolously, just had bad RNG which is a problem since I actively participated in the event every day and as such should have been able to get the rewards without having to purchase two tickets from the cash shop.

You got lucky, as I am sure many others did, that doesn't validate the flawed approach they took to event rewards this time around.

huntgod_ESO

Linaleah wrote: »

Kel wrote: »

They want you to buy tickets from the crown store.
Working as intended, unfortunately. So no, they won't address it. It's plain cash grab. Any one can see that.

yeah, i have to agree with that.

we had plenty of events before, where some people were luckier then others, but that bad rng could at least be somewhat alleviated via trading between players.

this had to have been done on purpose. if you are feeling charitable, you could maybe hope that they did it to save us some bag space. but then... why make farming extra boxes and drop rates in first boxes of the day so bad?

Exactly, which is why I've never complained before, in the past I could make up for the lack of RNG by buying the pieces I needed with in game gold, the only option in this event involves spending real money.

VaranisArano

Rave the Histborn wrote: »

huntgod_ESO wrote: »

Plenty of threads about folks who had abysmal RNG and were unable to get enough fragments for the memento or pet and even with tickets were unable to purchase all the required fragments.

Do you guys have any plans to change this so that folks participating in the event can at least acquire the rewards for the event without having to spend actual money in the cash shop for your tickets?

You guys have done some things in the past I thought were questionable but this is the first time I feel like you have done something directly abusive to the player base with the designed intent to push cash shop sales of tickets as a bad run with RNG makes it impossible to earn the rewards without it.

Why would they change the rng? I haven't seen a post that isn't pure hyperbole or over exageration about the event

One positive reason ZOS might change the RNG drop rate on the 2nd+ strongbox is to encourage players to actually play the zone to get more of them. Particularly given that the rewards in them weren't substantially different than the rewards in, say, Plunder Skulls. Memento pieces, style mats, trophy items, etc.

Personally, I took a look at the drop rate for a second strongbox that other players had, said "Screw spending hours grinding to get another one" and popped into Murkmire just long enough to get my first one and then left every day. The strongboxes did not provide any incentive to actually play in Murkmire beyond the bare minimum primarily because the RNG drop rate was so bad.

This assumes that ZOS actually intends for the strongboxes to attract players to Murkmire for additional play after the first, of course, as opposed to making them deliberately rare knowing that the 1st strongbox of the day is insufficient for most players to accumulate both sets of non-tradable collectible parts.

PrimusNephilim

RNG went down as planed...ZOS wants you to buy from the crown store.

AlnilamE

I_am_Groot wrote: »

RNG went down as planed...ZOS wants you to buy from the crown store.

Well, in that case, it was a total flop according to this poll:

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/515033/murkmire-celebration-whats-your-final-score/p1

A total of 4% of respondents say they used pearls to get enough tickets.

gatekeeper13

Bad RNG = More tickets from Crown Store = More money

They aint fixing anything. RNG works as intended.

Kiralyn2000

AlnilamE wrote: »

I_am_Groot wrote: »

RNG went down as planed...ZOS wants you to buy from the crown store.

Well, in that case, it was a total flop according to this poll:

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/515033/murkmire-celebration-whats-your-final-score/p1

A total of 4% of respondents say they used pearls to get enough tickets.

Yep.

And of course there were "lots" of threads from people complaining about bad RNG - the people who got hit with bad RNG are going to complain. The people who didn't (or don't care as strongly) have no reason to come post.
(it's been basic psychological knowledge for decades - you'll get a higher % of complaints than praise, because the people with complaints are more likely to speak up.)


...and then there's the aspect of "large populations". If something terrible happening is only a 1 in 1000 chance, that's not bad right? Ok, but you've got 2 million people doing it. Statistically, 2000 people are going to have that "1 in 1000" chance hit them. And if 500 of them come complain about it, you see a massive outcry.



(edit: reminds me of when I was playing WoW, and they added the Alchemy Masteries - or whatever it was called. 15% chance to craft a duplicate <something> that you'd specialized in. One of the specialties was a 1-a-day craft. So you get a bunch of people yelling "OMG, haven't gotten a double craft in 14 days! System broken!" And then you point out that missing 14 days of a 15% chance is something like 1 in 100k. And there were 8+ million people playing at the time. Yeah, a couple dozen people getting that run of bad luck is totally in line with the system working properly. But the forum sees a "bunch" of people all with the same complaint. Clearly, it's a deliberate screw!)

VaranisArano

AlnilamE wrote: »

I_am_Groot wrote: »

RNG went down as planed...ZOS wants you to buy from the crown store.

Well, in that case, it was a total flop according to this poll:

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/515033/murkmire-celebration-whats-your-final-score/p1

A total of 4% of respondents say they used pearls to get enough tickets.

Mmm. 4% of 280 voters (as of last look).

There's two reasons I'm leery of drawing any conclusions about the profitability/flop of this event from ZOS' perspective from that poll.

1. As with all forum polls, its a tiny, self-selecting sample size that really has no way of being representative of the wider population of the game. We've got no idea what actual ticket sales were, just that 12 out of 280 people bought at least 1 ticket with crowns.

2. We have no idea what benchmark ZOS' accounting/marketing department may have set for expected event ticket sales from the whole playerbase. Event tickets sales are pure profit for them, so for all we know, 4% of the entire playerbase buying tickets could well be profitable enough for them to meet that benchmark.

We just don't know enough to judge whether or not it was a flop or not from ZOS' perspective.

I'm sure we'll find out when ZOS starts figuring out ticket drops and rewards for the events that come after the Anniversary.

Brandathorbel

VaranisArano wrote: »

AlnilamE wrote: »

I_am_Groot wrote: »

RNG went down as planed...ZOS wants you to buy from the crown store.

Well, in that case, it was a total flop according to this poll:

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/515033/murkmire-celebration-whats-your-final-score/p1

A total of 4% of respondents say they used pearls to get enough tickets.

Mmm. 4% of 280 voters (as of last look).

There's two reasons I'm leery of drawing any conclusions about the profitability/flop of this event from ZOS' perspective from that poll.

1. As with all forum polls, its a tiny, self-selecting sample size that really has no way of being representative of the wider population of the game. We've got no idea what actual ticket sales were, just that 12 out of 280 people bought at least 1 ticket with crowns.

2. We have no idea what benchmark ZOS' accounting/marketing department may have set for expected event ticket sales from the whole playerbase. Event tickets sales are pure profit for them, so for all we know, 4% of the entire playerbase buying tickets could well be profitable enough for them to meet that benchmark.

We just don't know enough to judge whether or not it was a flop or not from ZOS' perspective.

I'm sure we'll find out when ZOS starts figuring out ticket drops and rewards for the events that come after the Anniversary.

we also don't know how many people got fed up with Zos and quit or returning players that came back for event that realize zos is getting worse and never coming back.

Rave the Histborn

huntgod_ESO wrote: »

Rave the Histborn wrote: »

huntgod_ESO wrote: »

Plenty of threads about folks who had abysmal RNG and were unable to get enough fragments for the memento or pet and even with tickets were unable to purchase all the required fragments.

Do you guys have any plans to change this so that folks participating in the event can at least acquire the rewards for the event without having to spend actual money in the cash shop for your tickets?

You guys have done some things in the past I thought were questionable but this is the first time I feel like you have done something directly abusive to the player base with the designed intent to push cash shop sales of tickets as a bad run with RNG makes it impossible to earn the rewards without it.

Why would they change the rng? I haven't seen a post that isn't pure hyperbole or over exageration about the event

Yeah I've addressed your experience in one of the other threads..."it worked for me, so it's fine" isn't really applicable, not that it ever is.

I entered the event with tickets, purchased a berry and then had to use every other ticket I got to buy fragments and still came up one short, I didn't spend the tickets frivolously, just had bad RNG which is a problem since I actively participated in the event every day and as such should have been able to get the rewards without having to purchase two tickets from the cash shop.

You got lucky, as I am sure many others did, that doesn't validate the flawed approach they took to event rewards this time around.

First off you didn't need to purchased 2 tickets, the event will be back next year. This seems to be a common occurance now though is that this is the "average players rng" when in reality this is no where close to the case.

I also want to point out that "it worked for me, so it's fine" isn't really applicable, not that it ever is. isn't applicable to your argument either. If my experience in the event doesn't count your yours isn't a reliable measure either

Rave the Histborn

AlnilamE wrote: »

I_am_Groot wrote: »

RNG went down as planed...ZOS wants you to buy from the crown store.

Well, in that case, it was a total flop according to this poll:

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/515033/murkmire-celebration-whats-your-final-score/p1

A total of 4% of respondents say they used pearls to get enough tickets.

Well luckily polls arent reliable measures to gauge things XD

Tigerseye

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

AlnilamE wrote: »

I_am_Groot wrote: »

RNG went down as planed...ZOS wants you to buy from the crown store.

Well, in that case, it was a total flop according to this poll:

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/515033/murkmire-celebration-whats-your-final-score/p1

A total of 4% of respondents say they used pearls to get enough tickets.

Yep.

And of course there were "lots" of threads from people complaining about bad RNG - the people who got hit with bad RNG are going to complain. The people who didn't (or don't care as strongly) have no reason to come post.
(it's been basic psychological knowledge for decades - you'll get a higher % of complaints than praise, because the people with complaints are more likely to speak up.)


...and then there's the aspect of "large populations". If something terrible happening is only a 1 in 1000 chance, that's not bad right? Ok, but you've got 2 million people doing it. Statistically, 2000 people are going to have that "1 in 1000" chance hit them. And if 500 of them come complain about it, you see a massive outcry.



(edit: reminds me of when I was playing WoW, and they added the Alchemy Masteries - or whatever it was called. 15% chance to craft a duplicate <something> that you'd specialized in. One of the specialties was a 1-a-day craft. So you get a bunch of people yelling "OMG, haven't gotten a double craft in 14 days! System broken!" And then you point out that missing 14 days of a 15% chance is something like 1 in 100k. And there were 8+ million people playing at the time. Yeah, a couple dozen people getting that run of bad luck is totally in line with the system working properly. But the forum sees a "bunch" of people all with the same complaint. Clearly, it's a deliberate screw!)

That theory doesn't really work, here, as you don't get an automatic forum invite.

You have to apply to post here and most players don't.

So, most of the posters replying to that thread were already existing forum members.

That can and does skew conversations in various, non-representative, directions...

However, unless most of the people posting on that thread were brand new posters, who signed up specifically to post a complaint on that thread (which they don't seem to be), it doesn't back up the theory that things only seem bad, here, because people with bad RNG are more likely to speak up.

Tigerseye

...and I will also just add that there were several players complaining about this event, this morning, in guild chat, while no one was defending it.

OK, I know that is purely anecdotal evidence, but it does suggest, to me at least, that disappointment has been more the norm, when it comes to this event, than satisfaction.

Tigerseye

Linaleah wrote: »

Kel wrote: »

They want you to buy tickets from the crown store.
Working as intended, unfortunately. So no, they won't address it. It's plain cash grab. Any one can see that.

yeah, i have to agree with that.

we had plenty of events before, where some people were luckier then others, but that bad rng could at least be somewhat alleviated via trading between players.

this had to have been done on purpose. if you are feeling charitable, you could maybe hope that they did it to save us some bag space. but then... why make farming extra boxes and drop rates in first boxes of the day so bad?

Well, it won't work on me.

Either I work in the game, or I may pay a reasonable amount of money for something (if I like it enough).

I won't both work and pay for the same things, simultaneously.

That would be ridiculous.

FierceSam

[Snip]

If something should be earned in game, it should be earned by playing the game.

If they want to sell something, it should be clear what the item costs.

In all cases they should be completely transparent about it.

Personally I couldn’t care less about the latest cash cow (or pig), but players who do deserve to be treated better.

[Edited for bashing]

daemonios

FierceSam wrote: »

[Snip]

If something should be earned in game, it should be earned by playing the game.

If they want to sell something, it should be clear what the item costs.

In all cases they should be completely transparent about it.

Personally I couldn’t care less about the latest cash cow (or pig), but players who do deserve to be treated better.
[Edited for bashing]

That's cute, but it goes against game monetization 101. It actually goes like this:

If something should be earned in game, make it as grindy as possible and offer an alternative in the clown store. In fact, offer fancier and more outrageous alternatives in the clown store than those you can earn in-game (e.g apex mounts, costumes, skins).

If they want to sell something, obfuscate the real price. One tier of fake currency offered regularly at different discount rates is good to make it hard to put a price tag on stuff. A second tier of fake currency behind which you put the fanciest and most outrageous items, and which can only be obtained by first spending the primary fake currency, is even better. How much did you say that 600 gem mount cost in real money?

In all cases, be completely opaque with regard to marketing/monetization decisions. Never justify yourself. Never apologize. If you say something, someone will use your words against you. If you stay silent, you will be defended by white knights and can dismiss any arguments as not your own.

Rave the Histborn

FierceSam wrote: »

[Snip]

If something should be earned in game, it should be earned by playing the game.

If they want to sell something, it should be clear what the item costs.

In all cases they should be completely transparent about it.

Personally I couldn’t care less about the latest cash cow (or pig), but players who do deserve to be treated better.
[Edited for bashing]

It was earned in game

they give you the option to buy it in the crown store and they even give you the currency to do it

they can't get more transparent than that

if you couldn't care less you wouldn't be posting

daemonios

Rave the Histborn wrote: »

FierceSam wrote: »

[Snip]

If something should be earned in game, it should be earned by playing the game.

If they want to sell something, it should be clear what the item costs.

In all cases they should be completely transparent about it.

Personally I couldn’t care less about the latest cash cow (or pig), but players who do deserve to be treated better.
[Edited for bashing]

It was earned in game

Depending on luck, right? I got 3 pet fragments and 2 memento fragments from opening the gold chests every single day of the event. I ended up buying 4 fragments from the Impresario to complete the pet, but was annoyed enough with this event and not excited enough about the memento to do the same, so I left it at 2 out of 7 fragments. And it bears repeating: in past events, luckier players were able to gift or trade rewards with others. That option has been removed.

Rave the Histborn wrote: »

they give you the option to buy it in the crown store and they even give you the currency to do it

Come again? I think you're mistaking the Impresario with the clown store. The only currency they "give you" is event tickets, and those are limited. If you need more, you need clowns. And you don't get clowns for free. Whether you get them with a sub, or buy them, or trade for them with in-game gold, every clown has been paid by someone with real money.

Rave the Histborn wrote: »

they can't get more transparent than that

Really? Do you know the drop rate for the gold boxes (outside the guaranteed 1 per day)? Do you know the drop rate for the pet/memento fragments? I personally got 5 fragments from this event, that's less than half the boxes I opened. There is exactly one thing, and one thing only, that is transparent here: the goal of driving clown sales with these events.

Rave the Histborn wrote: »

if you couldn't care less you wouldn't be posting

I don't care about lots of stuff on which I have opinions. My opinions aren't valid or invalid depending on whether or not I care, and I have posted on topics about which I don't personally care one way or another.

Inaya

RNG is RNG. Same thing that lets one player get the weapon they want on the first time they try and some other poor person is on their 20th run, one player steals a million gold pattern and some other poor person only steals 27g greenies.

Every MMO I've ever played has had RNG and everyone in every game complained about it one time or another. Hell in WOW it took me 2 years on 8 characters running once a week for Ashes of Alar. I NEVER saw the Mimiron mount drop and I took a friend in since he had never been in before and it dropped for him!

I got 3 pet fragment in 2 gold boxes a couple days before event end and ended up using tickets to complete it. I did get quite a few motifs (doing the event on 3 characters) but for the most part RNG hated me like it always does. Some people are luckier than others.

Linaleah

Inaya wrote: »

RNG is RNG. Same thing that lets one player get the weapon they want on the first time they try and some other poor person is on their 20th run, one player steals a million gold pattern and some other poor person only steals 27g greenies.

Every MMO I've ever played has had RNG and everyone in every game complained about it one time or another. Hell in WOW it took me 2 years on 8 characters running once a week for Ashes of Alar. I NEVER saw the Mimiron mount drop and I took a friend in since he had never been in before and it dropped for him!

I got 3 pet fragment in 2 gold boxes a couple days before event end and ended up using tickets to complete it. I did get quite a few motifs (doing the event on 3 characters) but for the most part RNG hated me like it always does. Some people are luckier than others.

hey listen. I've been trying to get a big love rocket for years now. I still don't have it. however. and this is an important distinction. that big love rocket? is NOT sold in blizzard's cash shop. and even if you participate in buying wow tokens with gold, you STILL cannot just buy it. do i hate that its so rng dependant? a little, yes. I wish i could just buy it with event tokens the way you can buy a pink flamingo mount. but. it still is not the same as what we have happening here in this event.

Rave the Histborn

daemonios wrote: »

Rave the Histborn wrote: »

FierceSam wrote: »

ZOS should grow a bigger pair and come clean.

If something should be earned in game, it should be earned by playing the game.

If they want to sell something, it should be clear what the item costs.

In all cases they should be completely transparent about it.

Personally I couldn’t care less about the latest cash cow (or pig), but players who do deserve to be treated better.

It was earned in game

Depending on luck, right? I got 3 pet fragments and 2 memento fragments from opening the gold chests every single day of the event. I ended up buying 4 fragments from the Impresario to complete the pet, but was annoyed enough with this event and not excited enough about the memento to do the same, so I left it at 2 out of 7 fragments. And it bears repeating: in past events, luckier players were able to gift or trade rewards with others. That option has been removed.

Rave the Histborn wrote: »

they give you the option to buy it in the crown store and they even give you the currency to do it

Come again? I think you're mistaking the Impresario with the clown store. The only currency they "give you" is event tickets, and those are limited. If you need more, you need clowns. And you don't get clowns for free. Whether you get them with a sub, or buy them, or trade for them with in-game gold, every clown has been paid by someone with real money.

Rave the Histborn wrote: »

they can't get more transparent than that

Really? Do you know the drop rate for the gold boxes (outside the guaranteed 1 per day)? Do you know the drop rate for the pet/memento fragments? I personally got 5 fragments from this event, that's less than half the boxes I opened. There is exactly one thing, and one thing only, that is transparent here: the goal of driving clown sales with these events.

Rave the Histborn wrote: »

if you couldn't care less you wouldn't be posting

I don't care about lots of stuff on which I have opinions. My opinions aren't valid or invalid depending on whether or not I care, and I have posted on topics about which I don't personally care one way or another.

1) Everything in the game is based on luck, just like every other MMO. It doesnt help your argument it hurts it.

The last event was Midyear Mayhem nothing was bound and you could freely trade them. It didnt change the attitudes of people then or now it just shows that a certain portion of the player base wants everything served to them as easily as possible.

2) If you can't manage to figure out how to maximize your tickets that's your problem not ZOS's. They give you tons and tons of chances to get the mementos.

3) The drop rate is irrelevant for extra boxes. They are meant to be low and they don't have to give them out at all. B as used on the past events/forum posts it isnt any different than the rest.

4) k lol

huntgod_ESO

Rave the Histborn wrote: »

2) If you can't manage to figure out how to maximize your tickets that's your problem not ZOS's. They give you tons and tons of chances to get the mementos.

You keep making this assertion despite comments to the contrary. Including my own personal experience, which involve appropriate use of tickets and being unable to complete the two rewards without purchasing tickets from the crown store.

For the record, I don't waste my tickets and haven't missed one since they started giving them out. I have all four feathers to make my next indrik as well as a waiting nascent indrik already assembled.