Omg bgs change IS THE BEST CHANGE IN ESO HISTORY.

Lucious90

DarcyMardin wrote: »

The obvious solution, to my mind, would be two separate queues, one for solo players and one for pre-formed groups. That way experienced teams who like to play together could get into much more balanced matches with other experienced teams.

Jeez, Guild Wars 1 had a system like this, and that was almost 20 years ago. How hard can it be?

ZeNi Is ObViOuSlY cAtErInG tO tHe CaSuAl PlAyEr

mursie

Paganini wrote: »

Iam in personal will avoid ever playing bg's again after this change. After joining the 4th or 5th match with a team, where 2 of your 4 mates don't even wear impenetrable and get one shoted every time.... This is just a waste of time and i don't want to play 4vs3vs2 (just an example).

i see this comment all the time. it saddens me because it shows a clear misunderstanding of the change proposed.

let me explain - in the current system, you had a chance of being paired with 2 mates that don't wear impen... and your opponents had a chance of being a premade. and you had a miserable experience.

in the proposed stated - you also have a chance of having 2 mates that don't wear impen... but here is the beauty - SO DOES YOUR OPPONENT. that's right, because ques will now NOT be polluted with premades looking to pug stomp uncoordinated players... everyone has an equal and fair opportunity to play a balanced match...one where teammates on both sides of the aisle may or may not be wearing impen.

(snip) he needs his coordinated team at all times to participate in pvp and will resign from playing going forward because the deck is no longer completely stacked in his favor - well i gotta say, if you do decide to sit out on bg's going forward... that's addition by subtraction.

(snip)

(edited for profanity and bashing)

Gravord

mursie wrote: »

Paganini wrote: »

Iam in personal will avoid ever playing bg's again after this change. After joining the 4th or 5th match with a team, where 2 of your 4 mates don't even wear impenetrable and get one shoted every time.... This is just a waste of time and i don't want to play 4vs3vs2 (just an example).

i see this comment all the time. it saddens me because it shows a clear misunderstanding of the change proposed.

let me explain - in the current system, you had a chance of being paired with 2 mates that don't wear impen... and your opponents had a chance of being a premade. and you had a miserable experience.

in the proposed stated - you also have a chance of having 2 mates that don't wear impen... but here is the beauty - SO DOES YOUR OPPONENT. that's right, because ques will now NOT be polluted with premades looking to pug stomp uncoordinated players... everyone has an equal and fair opportunity to play a balanced match...one where teammates on both sides of the aisle may or may not be wearing impen.

(snip) he needs his coordinated team at all times to participate in pvp and will resign from playing going forward because the deck is no longer completely stacked in his favor - well i gotta say, if you do decide to sit out on bg's going forward... that's addition by subtraction.

(snip)

(edited for profanity and bashing)

So because potatoes are too lazy to improve their gear, build and gameplay ppl who did put effort into all that and organizing teams are penalized and forced to carry those potatoes around? Not recalling getting paid for it. Prefer to play with ppl of my choosing.

Lucious90

mursie wrote: »

Paganini wrote: »

Iam in personal will avoid ever playing bg's again after this change. After joining the 4th or 5th match with a team, where 2 of your 4 mates don't even wear impenetrable and get one shoted every time.... This is just a waste of time and i don't want to play 4vs3vs2 (just an example).

i see this comment all the time. it saddens me because it shows a clear misunderstanding of the change proposed.

let me explain - in the current system, you had a chance of being paired with 2 mates that don't wear impen... and your opponents had a chance of being a premade. and you had a miserable experience.

in the proposed stated - you also have a chance of having 2 mates that don't wear impen... but here is the beauty - SO DOES YOUR OPPONENT. that's right, because ques will now NOT be polluted with premades looking to pug stomp uncoordinated players... everyone has an equal and fair opportunity to play a balanced match...one where teammates on both sides of the aisle may or may not be wearing impen.

(snip) he needs his coordinated team at all times to participate in pvp and will resign from playing going forward because the deck is no longer completely stacked in his favor - well i gotta say, if you do decide to sit out on bg's going forward... that's addition by subtraction.

(snip)

(edited for profanity and bashing)

why should you limit how he enjoys the game because you don't like premades and either cant or refuse to get your own premade to balance out the books? You say polluted by premades but yet if I say Im tired of BGs being polluted by filthy casuals who cant coordinate I get called toxic, this post is just as toxic of not more

Just implement 2 ques, unranked that cant have premades in it, and ranked that allows premades.

Lets remember this game is a ONLINE game for christ sake, theres going to be group content and peer to peer interaction with people you can work with and not work with and BG is in its purest sense group content.

svartorn

They should have just made two separate queues for solo players and ranked/competitive BGs like WoW did.

Lucious90

svartorn wrote: »

They should have just made two separate queues for solo players and ranked/competitive BGs like WoW did.

wow has had it for a while now. I hope Zeni is using this as an oportunity to fix ques and find a good way to implement rated

Luke_Flamesword

I like this change. Random group always will be weaker than premade group where you have some strategy, compatible skills, probably voice communication etc. It's just not fair for players with no team - it's not matter of skill, it's just impossible to be that good with random people (even good players with right gear and experience), because we don't know each other, we can't discuss strategy, we can't pick gear and skills that idealy balance whole team.

Premade's will be now not happy, because they lose unfair advantage. Sorry but organised groups vs random groups it's never a fair match. I understand frustration of friends, who will be lost opportunity of playing together in BGS, but we don't have perfect solution for everybody, so the best option is more fair option - no more premades...

Gravord

Luke_Flamesword wrote: »

Premade's will be now not happy, because they lose unfair advantage

Unfair? They put effort into finding right ppl to team up, into building towards team synergy and plenty other details to make it work well.

Luke_Flamesword wrote: »

but we don't have perfect solution for everybody

Yes we do. 3 types of q:
1. Solo q only, fast matches
2. Any group size q, slower matches, teams of 2-3-4 take priority and solo players filling up the gaps
3. Premade vs premade in 4vs4 arena, deathmatch only. Could be additionally implemented with option of guild vs guild challenge as many other games have.

As a solo player you can q for nr 1 or 2 or both to speed up your q. As a group of 2-3 you can choose only option 2. As full premade Option 2 and 3. Simple, effective, not penalizing ppl putting effort to organize themselves in a frikin multiplayer game.

svartorn

I can't imagine thinking garbage like "Premade's will be now not happy, because they lose unfair advantage"

I bet they enjoy watching professional sports without organized teams.

Araneae6537

I’m not happy about the change. Sure, sometimes going up against a premade team seems impossible, but all the more satisfying if you do manage to pull together a win. While I enjoy queuing solo, I have the most fun queuing with a friend and found it most helpful for me to learn how the different types worked. I’m sad that we’ll no longer be able to queue together.

Araneae6537

Battlegrounds are a TOTALLY different game than Cyrodiil. I love BGs because they are fast, intense, clear objectives, fun. Cyrodiil is soooo not my thing, whether by myself or with a group. So no, it is no solution at all, those of us who enjoyed playing BGs with friends, to wander around Cyrodill looking for whatever to do... Oh, and Alliance is a thing there too so I may not even be able to group with friends on the characters we want, even if Cyrodill was at all entertaining.

phoenixkungfu

Araneae6537 wrote: »

I’m not happy about the change. Sure, sometimes going up against a premade team seems impossible, but all the more satisfying if you do manage to pull together a win. While I enjoy queuing solo, I have the most fun queuing with a friend and found it most helpful for me to learn how the different types worked. I’m sad that we’ll no longer be able to queue together.

So there is so much variety in eso for group play. However there is very little options for competitive solo pvp that is on a level playing field. I love bgs having a solo q. It's the same concept as a shooter game that has free for all, team deathmatch, and. Ground war.
Ground war is cyrodiil.
Deathmatch is the sewers
Free for all is bgs.
I love the changes very much. This is my favorite direction of all time in this game. Thank you eso and stay strong in this decision. I know there is controversy but honestly there is plenty of options for group play.

Chaos2088

I think it is a great change!

Luke_Flamesword

Unfair? They put effort into finding right ppl to team up, into building towards team synergy and plenty other details to make it work well.

Exactly - this need some effort and time, so not everyone have time or willingness to invest so much just for BGS. For example I have very random times of work in real life, so I can't predict when I will have time to play with other people. I just want to casually join BGS when I have some time free. I really like BGS, but I can't make a whole team - for me is ok to play with strangers, even with less experienced. It's random, so for it's ok if I have sometimes weak team. Unfortunantely even with good, but random team sometimes with don't any chance with premade "tornado". It's fun only for one side. Besides this, I think that a lot of people tries BGS for first time and after being tottaly crushed by premades, they never back. This makes BGS fun for some elitists with team, not for everyone.

Yes we do. 3 types of q:

It's perfect if we have a lot of players. I'm afraid we don't have enough for 2q, 3q is definitely too much. I hope that change will bring many new players to BGS - maybe 2q (random and premade temat) will be work.

I bet they enjoy watching professional sports without organized teams.

Yeah, maybe they enjoy watching professional sports where organized teams fight versus random bunch of people

LucyferLightbringer

Awesome change, love it. With the risk of being farmed by try-hard premades nullified i look forward to playing occasional bgs for fun again. Good job ZOS.

PizzaCat82

Maybe they can identify roles in the BGs akin to Tank/DPS/Healer and add a queue for that. Cant' be any worse than dungeon finder.

Lucious90

Luke_Flamesword wrote: »

I like this change. Random group always will be weaker than premade group where you have some strategy, compatible skills, probably voice communication etc. It's just not fair for players with no team - it's not matter of skill, it's just impossible to be that good with random people (even good players with right gear and experience), because we don't know each other, we can't discuss strategy, we can't pick gear and skills that idealy balance whole team.

Premade's will be now not happy, because they lose unfair advantage. Sorry but organised groups vs random groups it's never a fair match. I understand frustration of friends, who will be lost opportunity of playing together in BGS, but we don't have perfect solution for everybody, so the best option is more fair option - no more premades...

Since you realize it make a change, get some friends together, make or join a guild, dont *** about it to the developers and punish those who actually put in the work to have a well coordinated team, or dont. I still get pvp licks in when I dont run in an organized premade or even I get my group when I drop solo to work as much as possible and have taken premades

Lucious90

phoenixkungfu wrote: »

Araneae6537 wrote: »

I’m not happy about the change. Sure, sometimes going up against a premade team seems impossible, but all the more satisfying if you do manage to pull together a win. While I enjoy queuing solo, I have the most fun queuing with a friend and found it most helpful for me to learn how the different types worked. I’m sad that we’ll no longer be able to queue together.

So there is so much variety in eso for group play. However there is very little options for competitive solo pvp that is on a level playing field. I love bgs having a solo q. It's the same concept as a shooter game that has free for all, team deathmatch, and. Ground war.
Ground war is cyrodiil.
Deathmatch is the sewers
Free for all is bgs.
I love the changes very much. This is my favorite direction of all time in this game. Thank you eso and stay strong in this decision. I know there is controversy but honestly there is plenty of options for group play.

No one is ever on a level playing ground, MMO pvp isnt the same as a shooter, BGs is a team based event that rewards team work thats by the very idea of the 4v4v4 they are TEAMs, Im happy with 2 ques, not 1 where I cant group up with my friends outside of Cyrodiil

Khaleesi8688

I just want to know how all the solos intend to communicate with the group when someone gets separated or when info about the other team needs relayed or a certain enemy needs focused down, etc. You gonna stop mid fight and type it out? How do you coordinate and strategize when you can't communicate quickly mid fight?

LucyferLightbringer

Khaleesi8688 wrote: »

I just want to know how all the solos intend to communicate with the group when someone gets separated or when info about the other team needs relayed or a certain enemy needs focused down, etc. You gonna stop mid fight and type it out? How do you coordinate and strategize when you can't communicate quickly mid fight?

We wont communicate, and neither will the other teams. We will just jump in and have pure fun without ruining it by being try-hards. Insane aint it?

Lucious90

LucyferLightbringer wrote: »

Khaleesi8688 wrote: »

I just want to know how all the solos intend to communicate with the group when someone gets separated or when info about the other team needs relayed or a certain enemy needs focused down, etc. You gonna stop mid fight and type it out? How do you coordinate and strategize when you can't communicate quickly mid fight?

We wont communicate, and neither will the other teams. We will just jump in and have pure fun without ruining it by being try-hards. Insane aint it?

I feel like thats already in the game..... i think its Im......Imp.....Imperial......ah! Imperial City!

But seriously put premades back in or open up a second que

mursie

Gravord wrote: »

So because potatoes are too lazy to improve their gear, build and gameplay ppl who did put effort into all that and organizing teams are penalized and forced to carry those potatoes around? Not recalling getting paid for it. Prefer to play with ppl of my choosing.

i agree with you that a group que is needed. i've said that in my posts on this topic.
that said, reading comments from people saying they will not play structured battleground pvp because they can't que premades into pugs draws zero sympathy from me. that's just bush league.

coordinated groups should play against coordinated groups. and that functionality needs to be added.

mursie

Lucious90 wrote: »

why should you limit how he enjoys the game because you don't like premades and either cant or refuse to get your own premade to balance out the books? You say polluted by premades but yet if I say Im tired of BGs being polluted by filthy casuals who cant coordinate I get called toxic, this post is just as toxic of not more

Just implement 2 ques, unranked that cant have premades in it, and ranked that allows premades.

Lets remember this game is a ONLINE game for christ sake, theres going to be group content and peer to peer interaction with people you can work with and not work with and BG is in its purest sense group content.

i agree with you - there should be group and solo que.

Gravord

LucyferLightbringer wrote: »

We wont communicate, and neither will the other teams. We will just jump in and have pure fun without ruining it by being try-hards. Insane aint it?

Communicating in online game - try hards ? Daaaaamn...

mav1234

best change in history - for solo players.

lack of a group queue will drive some of us out.

i get solo players don't want to run into premades and I am ok with that. understandable honestly.

just don't understand why they are pulling out an option for those of us that want to play with our friends to do so. it isn't like we are asking for a new feature - this already exists. making a solo-only queue is the new feature.

IMO, leave the current queue as it is, and make a solo-only queue. Let solo players queue for both, they can take whichever pops first, or they can stick to the solo only queue if they don't ever want to run into groups. let people in groups of 2 or 4 queue for the group queue.

mav1234

mursie wrote: »

Gravord wrote: »

So because potatoes are too lazy to improve their gear, build and gameplay ppl who did put effort into all that and organizing teams are penalized and forced to carry those potatoes around? Not recalling getting paid for it. Prefer to play with ppl of my choosing.

i agree with you that a group que is needed. i've said that in my posts on this topic.
that said, reading comments from people saying they will not play structured battleground pvp because they can't que premades into pugs draws zero sympathy from me. that's just bush league.

coordinated groups should play against coordinated groups. and that functionality needs to be added.

I agree completely... I am fine with asking group queues to play other group queues... IMO this would improve the game in many ways.

as mursie says, we need to have a group queue...

this "experiment" is missing an important treatment: what happens when you have both group and solo queues? if the ultimte goal of zos is to have both (as many speculated), then we need to 1) know that, and 2) might as well test it!

phoenixkungfu

I think 2 ques is a possibility after a season of solo ques. Without a doubt pre made groups has killed bgs. I think after a time period of a completely level playing field of competitive gameplay free of any advantage. eso will have a unbias number rank of good solo players. Then they can create a group option.. I see the goal. I just hope eso stay the path. But most of all if the population remain small. my biggest hope is bgs is alway focus around the idea that this is a solo gameplay focus content first.

Casterial

Bandaid to the real issue, nice job appraising a shortcut.

Lucious90

It actually amazes me how many people want solo content in a multiplayer Role playing game, especially in content that that puts you in groups but allows you to bring your friends. Then they get pissed, because someone brings their friends in the group who actually coordinate and complain that these premade groups are the issue.

Khaleesi8688

LucyferLightbringer wrote: »

We wont communicate, and neither will the other teams. We will just jump in and have pure fun without ruining it by being try-hards. Insane aint it?

Lol so trying to win means you're a try hard now huh? If that's how most the solos feel why not just add a no rewards BG so you guys can have your fun and the rest of us can still play with other people who find it fun to actually work with our friends and make an effort to win. Or ya know, you could always group with others who don't care about actually trying. Then theoretically it wouldnt matter if you're up against a premade right? Cuz you don't care about winning.