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Flame Lash is a completely useless skill now.
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Xvorg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭MaskedHuman wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »Since flame lash is useless now... maybe ZOS can convert it to stamwhip finally?
Since Flame lash is garbage, ZoS could reduce the dmg of power lash, but make it execute enemies under 50% health, escalating like JB or reverse slash, instead of the heal.
Oh, and making the skill scale with the higher type of dmg, stam or magicka (like soul trap, but fire and poison instead of magical and physical dmg)
That sounds like a disaster tbh. StamDK doesn't need more buffs nor does it need whips and MagDK just needs to be able to power lash, same ability, same everything, just not a 15 second cooldown on it
Do you really think flame lash is good? As I said above, the skill was destroyed after morronerf/nerfmire/nerfsewyr changes.
Now is just a meh heal attached to very unreliable mechanic (5 light attacks are cheaper)...
the skill should be buffed instead of nerfed, but you know, ZoS always nerfs something that should be buffed, so you stay happy with your crappy skill, not making any change to it.
Change everythig to change nothing... that should be the motto of this development team.Sarcasm is something too serious to be taken lightly
I was born with the wrong sign
In the wrong house
With the wrong ascendancy
I took the wrong road
That led to the wrong tendencies
I was in the wrong place at the wrong time
For the wrong reason and the wrong rhyme
On the wrong day of the wrong week
Used the wrong method with the wrong technique1 -
MaskedHuman✭✭✭MaskedHuman wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »Since flame lash is useless now... maybe ZOS can convert it to stamwhip finally?
Since Flame lash is garbage, ZoS could reduce the dmg of power lash, but make it execute enemies under 50% health, escalating like JB or reverse slash, instead of the heal.
Oh, and making the skill scale with the higher type of dmg, stam or magicka (like soul trap, but fire and poison instead of magical and physical dmg)
That sounds like a disaster tbh. StamDK doesn't need more buffs nor does it need whips and MagDK just needs to be able to power lash, same ability, same everything, just not a 15 second cooldown on it
Do you really think flame lash is good? As I said above, the skill was destroyed after morronerf/nerfmire/nerfsewyr changes.
Now is just a meh heal attached to very unreliable mechanic (5 light attacks are cheaper)...
the skill should be buffed instead of nerfed, but you know, ZoS always nerfs something that should be buffed, so you stay happy with your crappy skill, not making any change to it.
Change everythig to change nothing... that should be the motto of this development team.
6.1k crit heals in pvp each tick for 3 times is pretty good, idk wym, I've always been wrecking people with flame lash, even against other magdks running molten whip. It was always a good ability, it just required better setups compared to molten whip which is literally brainless. With this change? it's *** terrible. On live? it's pretty good.EP MagDK - Former emperor, Magplar - The Flawless Conqueror, StamDK - The merciless, Stamden - The merciless, MagNB, The merciless.
DC MagDK (Main) The Flawless Conquerer, StamDK - The Flawless Conqueror, Stamden - Former emperor, Stamsorc - The merciless, Stamblade - The merciless, StamDK - The merciless, Stamplar - The merciless, Stamnecro, The merciless.1 -
Elwendryll✭✭✭✭✭
✭Well, I tried it on PTS, the power lash doesn't consume it, so you can use it 3 times during the off-balance window. And then 15s cooldown. So you can do like Stun -> Flame Lash -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> anything -> 15s cooldown. Is it bad? I don't know, I don't play mDK.PC - EU - France - AD
Main character: Qojikrin - Khajiit Sorcerer Tank/Stamina DD - since March 25, 2015.
Guildmaster of Oriflamme: Focus on 4 player endgame content.
Member of Brave Cat Trade, Panda Division and Toadhuggers.
All 4-man trifectas - TTT, IR, GH1 -
Xvorg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭MaskedHuman wrote: »MaskedHuman wrote: »MartiniDaniels wrote: »Since flame lash is useless now... maybe ZOS can convert it to stamwhip finally?
Since Flame lash is garbage, ZoS could reduce the dmg of power lash, but make it execute enemies under 50% health, escalating like JB or reverse slash, instead of the heal.
Oh, and making the skill scale with the higher type of dmg, stam or magicka (like soul trap, but fire and poison instead of magical and physical dmg)
That sounds like a disaster tbh. StamDK doesn't need more buffs nor does it need whips and MagDK just needs to be able to power lash, same ability, same everything, just not a 15 second cooldown on it
Do you really think flame lash is good? As I said above, the skill was destroyed after morronerf/nerfmire/nerfsewyr changes.
Now is just a meh heal attached to very unreliable mechanic (5 light attacks are cheaper)...
the skill should be buffed instead of nerfed, but you know, ZoS always nerfs something that should be buffed, so you stay happy with your crappy skill, not making any change to it.
Change everythig to change nothing... that should be the motto of this development team.
6.1k crit heals in pvp each tick for 3 times is pretty good, idk wym, I've always been wrecking people with flame lash, even against other magdks running molten whip. It was always a good ability, it just required better setups compared to molten whip which is literally brainless. With this change? it's *** terrible. On live? it's pretty good.
It was good, now is meh
1- Power lash used to stun off balance enemies, so if you were able to proc off balance without a stun and then whip again the guy, you had a second powerlash available
2- It used to be undodgeable
3- It was a free cast
4- It had an 8 mts range
5- It had a lower cost
6- It didn't have a heal as strong as now, but it was a bursty one, not a semi HoT
If you thik now is strong... sorry, it is quite bad compared to what it used to be. I thought that root immunity seemed to be the last nail in the coffing, but I was wrong. Off Balance immunity is much worse.
Not to metion the increase in CC immunity after break free. Now instead of counting 6 to have a window to use your proc after a stun, you have to count to 9. Compared with the 5 secs in a NB to use spectral bow, or the 33% chances on a sorc to proc frags, it is stupid even thinking about slotting the skill.
@ZOS_Gilliam, did you even check mDKs mechanics before launching this.... change? And if you are planning to go this way, how are you addressing those issues? Because the skill is useless, and the class is pretty much pointless with all the nerfs you gave us.Sarcasm is something too serious to be taken lightly
I was born with the wrong sign
In the wrong house
With the wrong ascendancy
I took the wrong road
That led to the wrong tendencies
I was in the wrong place at the wrong time
For the wrong reason and the wrong rhyme
On the wrong day of the wrong week
Used the wrong method with the wrong technique4 -
Muskrap✭✭✭YeahMaskedHuman wrote: »No matter how they change it, they have to change it or it is a dead ability. Molten Whip will be the only choice if it goes live like that.
The only thing that power lash has over molten whip is the heal, if they gutted off balance THAT hard, flame lash will be literally absolutely garbage
You can get 3 power lashes off of the 8s of off balance, that doesnt seem like its gutted0 -
ThePhantomThorn✭✭✭✭Elwendryll wrote: »Well, I tried it on PTS, the power lash doesn't consume it, so you can use it 3 times during the off-balance window. And then 15s cooldown. So you can do like Stun -> Flame Lash -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> anything -> 15s cooldown. Is it bad? I don't know, I don't play mDK.
wait...
*** thats op.
0 -
MaskedHuman✭✭✭YeahMaskedHuman wrote: »No matter how they change it, they have to change it or it is a dead ability. Molten Whip will be the only choice if it goes live like that.
The only thing that power lash has over molten whip is the heal, if they gutted off balance THAT hard, flame lash will be literally absolutely garbage
You can get 3 power lashes off of the 8s of off balance, that doesnt seem like its gutted
yes, 3 and then a 15 second cooldown. I didn't know power lash was an ult and I could only use it a few times every 15 seconds lmaoElwendryll wrote: »Well, I tried it on PTS, the power lash doesn't consume it, so you can use it 3 times during the off-balance window. And then 15s cooldown. So you can do like Stun -> Flame Lash -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> anything -> 15s cooldown. Is it bad? I don't know, I don't play mDK.
Yes it's bad, no core class ability should have a 15 second cooldown, I can get a leap faster than that lmao.EP MagDK - Former emperor, Magplar - The Flawless Conqueror, StamDK - The merciless, Stamden - The merciless, MagNB, The merciless.
DC MagDK (Main) The Flawless Conquerer, StamDK - The Flawless Conqueror, Stamden - Former emperor, Stamsorc - The merciless, Stamblade - The merciless, StamDK - The merciless, Stamplar - The merciless, Stamnecro, The merciless.3 -
lucky_Sage✭✭✭✭✭They just need to revert the changeDC PC NA
Magdk - main
Stamcro - alt
AD PS4 NA -retired (PC runs way better to play on console)
magdk
magblade
stamplar
magden
magsorc0 -
Somewhere✭✭✭✭ThePhantomThorn wrote: »Elwendryll wrote: »Well, I tried it on PTS, the power lash doesn't consume it, so you can use it 3 times during the off-balance window. And then 15s cooldown. So you can do like Stun -> Flame Lash -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> anything -> 15s cooldown. Is it bad? I don't know, I don't play mDK.
wait...
*** thats op.
Kind of. Basically you will have a massive hot going for a short time, but not when you need it because of the off balance changes. Further, the enemy player simply has to dodge it to deny the healing. Power lash doesn't do that much extra damage anyway.1 -
MaskedHuman✭✭✭ThePhantomThorn wrote: »Elwendryll wrote: »Well, I tried it on PTS, the power lash doesn't consume it, so you can use it 3 times during the off-balance window. And then 15s cooldown. So you can do like Stun -> Flame Lash -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> anything -> 15s cooldown. Is it bad? I don't know, I don't play mDK.
wait...
*** thats op.
No it's not.EP MagDK - Former emperor, Magplar - The Flawless Conqueror, StamDK - The merciless, Stamden - The merciless, MagNB, The merciless.
DC MagDK (Main) The Flawless Conquerer, StamDK - The Flawless Conqueror, Stamden - Former emperor, Stamsorc - The merciless, Stamblade - The merciless, StamDK - The merciless, Stamplar - The merciless, Stamnecro, The merciless.5 -
Hotdog_23✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭My hope is ZOS looks at this and does the skill some to make it more effective since is was gutted some.0 -
Ryanoxx✭✭✭
TBH, flame lash has been destroyed like 10 times now since Morrowind. Good old flame lash, with free undodgeable 8 mts range and stunning powerlash was OK
I agree that flame lash has received too many nerfs but this one is just too much. Currently I still prefere flame lash even though Molten is more burst but with this change flame lash will just be useless.MagDk
MagSorc
MagBlade
StamSorc
StamBlade
PC EU
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCfCJgxeGLB1iyPGoXXthLKQ?view_as=subscriber0 -
Ryanoxx✭✭✭Elwendryll wrote: »Well, I tried it on PTS, the power lash doesn't consume it, so you can use it 3 times during the off-balance window. And then 15s cooldown. So you can do like Stun -> Flame Lash -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> anything -> 15s cooldown. Is it bad? I don't know, I don't play mDK.
Powr Lash already didn't consume off balance. This change is just nerfing an ability that alread has been inferior to Molten Whip.MagDk
MagSorc
MagBlade
StamSorc
StamBlade
PC EU
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCfCJgxeGLB1iyPGoXXthLKQ?view_as=subscriber3 -
brandonv516✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭MaskedHuman wrote: »YeahMaskedHuman wrote: »No matter how they change it, they have to change it or it is a dead ability. Molten Whip will be the only choice if it goes live like that.
The only thing that power lash has over molten whip is the heal, if they gutted off balance THAT hard, flame lash will be literally absolutely garbage
You can get 3 power lashes off of the 8s of off balance, that doesnt seem like its gutted
yes, 3 and then a 15 second cooldown. I didn't know power lash was an ult and I could only use it a few times every 15 seconds lmaoElwendryll wrote: »Well, I tried it on PTS, the power lash doesn't consume it, so you can use it 3 times during the off-balance window. And then 15s cooldown. So you can do like Stun -> Flame Lash -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> anything -> 15s cooldown. Is it bad? I don't know, I don't play mDK.
Yes it's bad, no core class ability should have a 15 second cooldown, I can get a leap faster than that lmao.
Hmm...seems fair.
I don't think I can get 3 Spectral Bows off in 15 seconds. Seems fair.1 -
Nerftheforums✭✭✭✭✭
✭brandonv516 wrote: »MaskedHuman wrote: »YeahMaskedHuman wrote: »No matter how they change it, they have to change it or it is a dead ability. Molten Whip will be the only choice if it goes live like that.
The only thing that power lash has over molten whip is the heal, if they gutted off balance THAT hard, flame lash will be literally absolutely garbage
You can get 3 power lashes off of the 8s of off balance, that doesnt seem like its gutted
yes, 3 and then a 15 second cooldown. I didn't know power lash was an ult and I could only use it a few times every 15 seconds lmaoElwendryll wrote: »Well, I tried it on PTS, the power lash doesn't consume it, so you can use it 3 times during the off-balance window. And then 15s cooldown. So you can do like Stun -> Flame Lash -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> anything -> 15s cooldown. Is it bad? I don't know, I don't play mDK.
Yes it's bad, no core class ability should have a 15 second cooldown, I can get a leap faster than that lmao.
Hmm...seems fair.
I don't think I can get 3 Spectral Bows off in 15 seconds. Seems fair.
With the difference that a bow has an average 20k tt, whereas a power lash tops at like 14/15k maybe...3 -
brandonv516✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Nerftheforums wrote: »brandonv516 wrote: »MaskedHuman wrote: »YeahMaskedHuman wrote: »No matter how they change it, they have to change it or it is a dead ability. Molten Whip will be the only choice if it goes live like that.
The only thing that power lash has over molten whip is the heal, if they gutted off balance THAT hard, flame lash will be literally absolutely garbage
You can get 3 power lashes off of the 8s of off balance, that doesnt seem like its gutted
yes, 3 and then a 15 second cooldown. I didn't know power lash was an ult and I could only use it a few times every 15 seconds lmaoElwendryll wrote: »Well, I tried it on PTS, the power lash doesn't consume it, so you can use it 3 times during the off-balance window. And then 15s cooldown. So you can do like Stun -> Flame Lash -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> anything -> 15s cooldown. Is it bad? I don't know, I don't play mDK.
Yes it's bad, no core class ability should have a 15 second cooldown, I can get a leap faster than that lmao.
Hmm...seems fair.
I don't think I can get 3 Spectral Bows off in 15 seconds. Seems fair.
With the difference that a bow has an average 20k tt, whereas a power lash tops at like 14/15k maybe...
Depends on the build sure, but they are still comparable skills. Both have pros and cons of course.
But I still don't see this change as a terrible one.1 -
Nerftheforums✭✭✭✭✭
✭brandonv516 wrote: »Nerftheforums wrote: »brandonv516 wrote: »MaskedHuman wrote: »YeahMaskedHuman wrote: »No matter how they change it, they have to change it or it is a dead ability. Molten Whip will be the only choice if it goes live like that.
The only thing that power lash has over molten whip is the heal, if they gutted off balance THAT hard, flame lash will be literally absolutely garbage
You can get 3 power lashes off of the 8s of off balance, that doesnt seem like its gutted
yes, 3 and then a 15 second cooldown. I didn't know power lash was an ult and I could only use it a few times every 15 seconds lmaoElwendryll wrote: »Well, I tried it on PTS, the power lash doesn't consume it, so you can use it 3 times during the off-balance window. And then 15s cooldown. So you can do like Stun -> Flame Lash -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> anything -> 15s cooldown. Is it bad? I don't know, I don't play mDK.
Yes it's bad, no core class ability should have a 15 second cooldown, I can get a leap faster than that lmao.
Hmm...seems fair.
I don't think I can get 3 Spectral Bows off in 15 seconds. Seems fair.
With the difference that a bow has an average 20k tt, whereas a power lash tops at like 14/15k maybe...
Depends on the build sure, but they are still comparable skills. Both have pros and cons of course.
But I still don't see this change as a terrible one.
No, they are not comparable. They really are not. On a glass cannon nb the bow gets up to 23/5k without too many fancy buffs, just rally and an infused berserker glyph. A glass cannon magdk with 2 damage sets and bs gets to max max max 15k. There is literally no comparison, one is a punch, the other a grenade.2 -
brandonv516✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Nerftheforums wrote: »brandonv516 wrote: »Nerftheforums wrote: »brandonv516 wrote: »MaskedHuman wrote: »YeahMaskedHuman wrote: »No matter how they change it, they have to change it or it is a dead ability. Molten Whip will be the only choice if it goes live like that.
The only thing that power lash has over molten whip is the heal, if they gutted off balance THAT hard, flame lash will be literally absolutely garbage
You can get 3 power lashes off of the 8s of off balance, that doesnt seem like its gutted
yes, 3 and then a 15 second cooldown. I didn't know power lash was an ult and I could only use it a few times every 15 seconds lmaoElwendryll wrote: »Well, I tried it on PTS, the power lash doesn't consume it, so you can use it 3 times during the off-balance window. And then 15s cooldown. So you can do like Stun -> Flame Lash -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> anything -> 15s cooldown. Is it bad? I don't know, I don't play mDK.
Yes it's bad, no core class ability should have a 15 second cooldown, I can get a leap faster than that lmao.
Hmm...seems fair.
I don't think I can get 3 Spectral Bows off in 15 seconds. Seems fair.
With the difference that a bow has an average 20k tt, whereas a power lash tops at like 14/15k maybe...
Depends on the build sure, but they are still comparable skills. Both have pros and cons of course.
But I still don't see this change as a terrible one.
No, they are not comparable. They really are not. On a glass cannon nb the bow gets up to 23/5k without too many fancy buffs, just rally and an infused berserker glyph. A glass cannon magdk with 2 damage sets and bs gets to max max max 15k. There is literally no comparison, one is a punch, the other a grenade.
Did you really just compare a Stamina build with a Magicka build?
I'm not arguing it any further but both Magicka burst abilities are comparable.0 -
Nerftheforums✭✭✭✭✭
✭brandonv516 wrote: »Nerftheforums wrote: »brandonv516 wrote: »Nerftheforums wrote: »brandonv516 wrote: »MaskedHuman wrote: »YeahMaskedHuman wrote: »No matter how they change it, they have to change it or it is a dead ability. Molten Whip will be the only choice if it goes live like that.
The only thing that power lash has over molten whip is the heal, if they gutted off balance THAT hard, flame lash will be literally absolutely garbage
You can get 3 power lashes off of the 8s of off balance, that doesnt seem like its gutted
yes, 3 and then a 15 second cooldown. I didn't know power lash was an ult and I could only use it a few times every 15 seconds lmaoElwendryll wrote: »Well, I tried it on PTS, the power lash doesn't consume it, so you can use it 3 times during the off-balance window. And then 15s cooldown. So you can do like Stun -> Flame Lash -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> anything -> 15s cooldown. Is it bad? I don't know, I don't play mDK.
Yes it's bad, no core class ability should have a 15 second cooldown, I can get a leap faster than that lmao.
Hmm...seems fair.
I don't think I can get 3 Spectral Bows off in 15 seconds. Seems fair.
With the difference that a bow has an average 20k tt, whereas a power lash tops at like 14/15k maybe...
Depends on the build sure, but they are still comparable skills. Both have pros and cons of course.
But I still don't see this change as a terrible one.
No, they are not comparable. They really are not. On a glass cannon nb the bow gets up to 23/5k without too many fancy buffs, just rally and an infused berserker glyph. A glass cannon magdk with 2 damage sets and bs gets to max max max 15k. There is literally no comparison, one is a punch, the other a grenade.
Did you really just compare a Stamina build with a Magicka build?
I'm not arguing it any further but both Magicka burst abilities are comparable.
Dude...
https://en.m.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=1547070 -
jcm2606✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭One is ranged, the other is melee. One just requires 5 consecutive light attacks (or 2.5 heavy attacks) to access, the other requires wasting a CC or dodge roll to access. One has super high burst damage with a mediocre heal attached only in melee range, the other has mid burst damage with a strong heal attached. They're not comparable, at all, and if you think they are, you're just as bad as the devs.4 -
MaskedHuman✭✭✭brandonv516 wrote: »MaskedHuman wrote: »YeahMaskedHuman wrote: »No matter how they change it, they have to change it or it is a dead ability. Molten Whip will be the only choice if it goes live like that.
The only thing that power lash has over molten whip is the heal, if they gutted off balance THAT hard, flame lash will be literally absolutely garbage
You can get 3 power lashes off of the 8s of off balance, that doesnt seem like its gutted
yes, 3 and then a 15 second cooldown. I didn't know power lash was an ult and I could only use it a few times every 15 seconds lmaoElwendryll wrote: »Well, I tried it on PTS, the power lash doesn't consume it, so you can use it 3 times during the off-balance window. And then 15s cooldown. So you can do like Stun -> Flame Lash -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> anything -> 15s cooldown. Is it bad? I don't know, I don't play mDK.
Yes it's bad, no core class ability should have a 15 second cooldown, I can get a leap faster than that lmao.
Hmm...seems fair.
I don't think I can get 3 Spectral Bows off in 15 seconds. Seems fair.
seriously......? comparing spectral bow to power lash.... now I understand why people hate forums.Nerftheforums wrote: »brandonv516 wrote: »MaskedHuman wrote: »YeahMaskedHuman wrote: »No matter how they change it, they have to change it or it is a dead ability. Molten Whip will be the only choice if it goes live like that.
The only thing that power lash has over molten whip is the heal, if they gutted off balance THAT hard, flame lash will be literally absolutely garbage
You can get 3 power lashes off of the 8s of off balance, that doesnt seem like its gutted
yes, 3 and then a 15 second cooldown. I didn't know power lash was an ult and I could only use it a few times every 15 seconds lmaoElwendryll wrote: »Well, I tried it on PTS, the power lash doesn't consume it, so you can use it 3 times during the off-balance window. And then 15s cooldown. So you can do like Stun -> Flame Lash -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> anything -> 15s cooldown. Is it bad? I don't know, I don't play mDK.
Yes it's bad, no core class ability should have a 15 second cooldown, I can get a leap faster than that lmao.
Hmm...seems fair.
I don't think I can get 3 Spectral Bows off in 15 seconds. Seems fair.
With the difference that a bow has an average 20k tt, whereas a power lash tops at like 14/15k maybe...
more like a bow has an average of 25k tt, and power lash has an average of 13kEP MagDK - Former emperor, Magplar - The Flawless Conqueror, StamDK - The merciless, Stamden - The merciless, MagNB, The merciless.
DC MagDK (Main) The Flawless Conquerer, StamDK - The Flawless Conqueror, Stamden - Former emperor, Stamsorc - The merciless, Stamblade - The merciless, StamDK - The merciless, Stamplar - The merciless, Stamnecro, The merciless.2 -
SnikerPKK✭✭✭MaskedHuman wrote: »
- Off Balance now lasts 7 seconds from player sourced abilities and sets.
- Off Balance is no longer reapplied to a target for 15 seconds once the original source of Off Balance ends. This cooldown is displayed as a debuff on targets once they are affected.
This completely kills Flame lash, A core Magicka Dragonknight ability that relies on having enemies Off balance consistently to get the heal and damage.
If you don't know what Flame lash does, here it is:Lash an enemy with flame, dealing xxxx Flame Damage. If you strike an enemy that is immobile or stunned, you set them Off Balance. Targeting an Off Balance enemy changes this ability into Power Lash, allowing you to lash an enemy at half cost to deal xxxx Flame Damage and heal you for xxxx over 2 seconds. This effect can occur once every 3 seconds.
so now, as a Magicka Dragonknight, I won't be able to even use a core ability. This is the exact same thing that happened with Charged Ice blockade and they nerfed roots because of it, effecting MagDKs the most because of talons.
Here's my suggestion. Either make Flame lash have a rule break and be able to ignore the Off balance cooldown, or add a new condition for the ability that lets the second hit of power lash on a rooted/stunned target always do a power lash, keeping the original 3 second cooldown.
me and my friends love the change and think it adds an intzesresting mechanic into the game, me and my friends agreed that such burst being acquired in such a tiny amount of time is too broken to be in the game and it is beeter that it iso cooldown and it adds skill cause timing burst is harder now2 -
brandonv516✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭MaskedHuman wrote: »brandonv516 wrote: »MaskedHuman wrote: »YeahMaskedHuman wrote: »No matter how they change it, they have to change it or it is a dead ability. Molten Whip will be the only choice if it goes live like that.
The only thing that power lash has over molten whip is the heal, if they gutted off balance THAT hard, flame lash will be literally absolutely garbage
You can get 3 power lashes off of the 8s of off balance, that doesnt seem like its gutted
yes, 3 and then a 15 second cooldown. I didn't know power lash was an ult and I could only use it a few times every 15 seconds lmaoElwendryll wrote: »Well, I tried it on PTS, the power lash doesn't consume it, so you can use it 3 times during the off-balance window. And then 15s cooldown. So you can do like Stun -> Flame Lash -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> anything -> 15s cooldown. Is it bad? I don't know, I don't play mDK.
Yes it's bad, no core class ability should have a 15 second cooldown, I can get a leap faster than that lmao.
Hmm...seems fair.
I don't think I can get 3 Spectral Bows off in 15 seconds. Seems fair.
seriously......? comparing spectral bow to power lash.... now I understand why people hate forums.
Chill lol.
They are both burst abilities with fairly comparable tooltips.
That's where the comparison ends of course, as they each have obvious differences with their own pros and cons.Edited by brandonv516 on January 22, 2020 9:33PM0 -
Siohwenoeht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Can Zenimax stop *** touching *** that doesn't need to be touched?! Who was complaining about this?!
I assume it's partly a response to the "too many stuns/snares/cc in PVP" threads. But again there are unintended consequences across the board. Flame lash, dizzy, lightning heavy attack builds, all of them are affected by this."It is a lovely language, but it takes a very long time saying anything in it, because we do not say anything in it, unless it is worth taking a long time to say, and to listen to." - Treebeard0 -
lucky_Sage✭✭✭✭✭MaskedHuman wrote: »
- Off Balance now lasts 7 seconds from player sourced abilities and sets.
- Off Balance is no longer reapplied to a target for 15 seconds once the original source of Off Balance ends. This cooldown is displayed as a debuff on targets once they are affected.
This completely kills Flame lash, A core Magicka Dragonknight ability that relies on having enemies Off balance consistently to get the heal and damage.
If you don't know what Flame lash does, here it is:Lash an enemy with flame, dealing xxxx Flame Damage. If you strike an enemy that is immobile or stunned, you set them Off Balance. Targeting an Off Balance enemy changes this ability into Power Lash, allowing you to lash an enemy at half cost to deal xxxx Flame Damage and heal you for xxxx over 2 seconds. This effect can occur once every 3 seconds.
so now, as a Magicka Dragonknight, I won't be able to even use a core ability. This is the exact same thing that happened with Charged Ice blockade and they nerfed roots because of it, effecting MagDKs the most because of talons.
Here's my suggestion. Either make Flame lash have a rule break and be able to ignore the Off balance cooldown, or add a new condition for the ability that lets the second hit of power lash on a rooted/stunned target always do a power lash, keeping the original 3 second cooldown.
me and my friends love the change and think it adds an intzesresting mechanic into the game, me and my friends agreed that such burst being acquired in such a tiny amount of time is too broken to be in the game and it is beeter that it iso cooldown and it adds skill cause timing burst is harder now
Yeah but Magdk burst and sustain is so heavily dependent on ult so. How easy it is for a Magdk get get off balance if you don’t have ult then you will never be able to kill 15 second cd is a long time in pvpDC PC NA
Magdk - main
Stamcro - alt
AD PS4 NA -retired (PC runs way better to play on console)
magdk
magblade
stamplar
magden
magsorc1 -
MaskedHuman✭✭✭brandonv516 wrote: »MaskedHuman wrote: »brandonv516 wrote: »MaskedHuman wrote: »YeahMaskedHuman wrote: »No matter how they change it, they have to change it or it is a dead ability. Molten Whip will be the only choice if it goes live like that.
The only thing that power lash has over molten whip is the heal, if they gutted off balance THAT hard, flame lash will be literally absolutely garbage
You can get 3 power lashes off of the 8s of off balance, that doesnt seem like its gutted
yes, 3 and then a 15 second cooldown. I didn't know power lash was an ult and I could only use it a few times every 15 seconds lmaoElwendryll wrote: »Well, I tried it on PTS, the power lash doesn't consume it, so you can use it 3 times during the off-balance window. And then 15s cooldown. So you can do like Stun -> Flame Lash -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> Anything -> Power Lash -> anything -> 15s cooldown. Is it bad? I don't know, I don't play mDK.
Yes it's bad, no core class ability should have a 15 second cooldown, I can get a leap faster than that lmao.
Hmm...seems fair.
I don't think I can get 3 Spectral Bows off in 15 seconds. Seems fair.
seriously......? comparing spectral bow to power lash.... now I understand why people hate forums.
Chill lol.
They are both burst abilities with fairly comparable tooltips.
That's where the comparison ends of course, as they each have obvious differences with their own pros and cons.
I'll believe you when you can find me a clip of a magdk hitting 20k power lashes on squishy targets. not molten whip, cuz I think you confused the two.EP MagDK - Former emperor, Magplar - The Flawless Conqueror, StamDK - The merciless, Stamden - The merciless, MagNB, The merciless.
DC MagDK (Main) The Flawless Conquerer, StamDK - The Flawless Conqueror, Stamden - Former emperor, Stamsorc - The merciless, Stamblade - The merciless, StamDK - The merciless, Stamplar - The merciless, Stamnecro, The merciless.0 -
Somewhere✭✭✭✭I'm kind of baffled at people thinking Power Lash is even a burst skill at all. It literally increases the damage of your spammable from a base 822 to 976. By comparison crystal fragments does 1112 damage, spectral bow does 1627 damage, and scorch deals 1109 damage.
Power Lash is not a burst skill, you use it to maintain pressure while granting yourself healing. DK using Flame Lash need to rely more on Leap to deal burst damage. That doesn't mean that the skill is better or inferior to the other skills I listed because the heal is quite strong, but to be comparing this skill to a burst skill isn't accurate. They don't perform the same job function. Molten Whip is the burst skill. After even a single cast of any other Ardent Flame ability Molten Whip does more damage than the Power Lash.Edited by Somewhere on January 22, 2020 11:21PM3 -
MaskedHuman✭✭✭a MagDK friend of mine wanted to say this but he doesn't have a forum account:
Offbalance is 7s with a cooldown of 15s. 7s with 2s whip cooldown means that in that 22s you have only 3 POTENTIAL powerlashes.
You only have a 1s respite, so if any of those powerlashes is staggered more than 1gcd, you lose 1 as the offbalance would end. Now, the first one, after the setup lash is either going to miss since they will roll out of foss, or you will have to stagger it, which means to actually get 3 lashes you will have to hit each one on the dot.
Only one of these will actually be able to be timed into a CC since you require CC to be able to get offbalance in the first place. So we are actually talking about only one guaranteed lash per player every 22s. That is awful. Sustain is trash as is
So. My proposal is remove it completely from this offbalance system. Make it so that a powerlash is instantly proc'd on any immobile enemy, no setup lash needed, and remove
the powerlash cooldown as it would then be dictated by the CC cooldowns itself. Obviously as no setup lash would be needed the "half price" effect would be removed, and the heal would be halved too, as it would be able to be used slightly more often. The offbalance can be kept on the powerlash, or honestly it could be removed since mdks won't use the exploiter cp passive and won't make use of it to CC or return resources through heavy.
This would make the interractions work as following:
*Fossilize guarantees one powerlash hit, anything after can be avoided.
*Roots give the option of a powerlash hit if they are not rolled/removed/immune to. This is a lesser chance as roots are every 3s. It would return some functionality to roots since the auto root cooldown meant that using fossilize and for example talons were redundant as it would remove fossilize's root.
*If the enemy for some reason doesn't break free then you would be able to get off multiple lashes, giving the power lash a unique functionality as almost an execute via stamina.
*It would still function as the more attrition based attack with less damage compared to the set burst molten.EP MagDK - Former emperor, Magplar - The Flawless Conqueror, StamDK - The merciless, Stamden - The merciless, MagNB, The merciless.
DC MagDK (Main) The Flawless Conquerer, StamDK - The Flawless Conqueror, Stamden - Former emperor, Stamsorc - The merciless, Stamblade - The merciless, StamDK - The merciless, Stamplar - The merciless, Stamnecro, The merciless.2 -
MaskedHuman✭✭✭I'm kind of baffled at people thinking Power Lash is even a burst skill at all. It literally increases the damage of your spammable from a base 822 to 976. By comparison crystal fragments does 1112 damage, spectral bow does 1627 damage, and scorch deals 1109 damage.
Power Lash is not a burst skill, you use it to maintain pressure while granting yourself healing. DK using Flame Lash need to rely more on Leap to deal burst damage. That doesn't mean that the skill is better or inferior to the other skills I listed because the heal is quite strong, but to be comparing this skill to a burst skill isn't accurate. They don't perform the same job function. Molten Whip is the burst skill. After even a single cast of any other Ardent Flame ability Molten Whip does more damage than the Power Lash.
+EP MagDK - Former emperor, Magplar - The Flawless Conqueror, StamDK - The merciless, Stamden - The merciless, MagNB, The merciless.
DC MagDK (Main) The Flawless Conquerer, StamDK - The Flawless Conqueror, Stamden - Former emperor, Stamsorc - The merciless, Stamblade - The merciless, StamDK - The merciless, Stamplar - The merciless, Stamnecro, The merciless.0