PVP exploiter/cheater

[Deleted User]

Hello everyone,

Recently we've had to remove a few posts for flaming and baiting, both being against the Forum Rules. For further posts be sure to stay constructive and respectful to avoid action on one's own account.

Thank you for understanding.

Dusk_Coven

Lybal wrote: »

It'd be very very bad work if the 1st case is the one in place, any competent dev knows it, players could modify their client to send 2 abilities and bypass GCD.

Are we talking about the devs that shipped out the Onyx Indrik summon animation that caused localized crashes? https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/496288/hotfix-for-dragon-rise-crashing-oct-3
The ones that let couldn't fix mount sprint until now when it's normalized and too late?

stephbay123

I got bombarded with messages from someone on PS4 saying I cheat, use a special pad and ruin the game. I’m not very good and not sure how to animation cancel. Sometimes it’s just luck for me that I kill someone quick. It may not be learn to play but learn that sometimes you die quick if caught unawares and just man up

Demra

I don't get it. Every couple of months somebody posts a series of videos of somebody who have recorded themselves flying, being invisible and invincible through cheat that they sell, than the moderator delete that thread and everybodygoing back to screaming there is no such thing as cheats cuz if there were - there would be a video...

StormeReigns

stephbay123 wrote: »

I got bombarded with messages from someone on PS4 saying I cheat, use a special pad and ruin the game. I’m not very good and not sure how to animation cancel. Sometimes it’s just luck for me that I kill someone quick. It may not be learn to play but learn that sometimes you die quick if caught unawares and just man up

To be accused of cheating when you haven't. No matter you having greater or lesser skills than your opponent is automatically winning against them. Next time you see them, you sit still and do absolutely nothing in return, just politely let them know you understand their difficulties and took pitty on them and gave them a fighting chance and believe it would be unfair to them if you moved.

SeaGtGruff

Drako_Ei wrote: »

They are not casting 5 skills in 1 second, some classes can queue damage, like wardens, magsorcs, necromancers, templars...

I don't know about queueing damage, but lately I've been having a lot of problems with delayed-action damage. This is while I'm trying to earn my event tickets in the Rimmen Necropolis, so when it invariably happens I worry that it might cause me to lose my tickets. And it isn't a new problem by any means.

At some point-- for whatever reason, it's always worst in the section where the skyshard is-- my attack animation freezes with my greatsword lifted back ready to swing, and no amount of key-pressing has an effect. I can still run around, I still take hits even though the MOBs' animation doesn't show them attacking me, and apparently my attacks are still going through even though that part of the animation is frozen, because sometimes the amount of experience I've just earned will pop up in the corner even though the MOBs are still standing there and I'm still reared back with my sword frozen in place. Then suddenly the animation for my attacks will go through, and for about 2 seconds my greatsword is a blur of attacks. Afterward I usually can't loot the corpses, so I have to go a little bit away from them and attack something else, after which I can usually go back and loot the corpses.

Desyncs and lags like that can definitely look like firing off an ability 12 times in 1 second despite cooldown-- although as I said, often I'm clearly taking and doing damage on the server side, even though on the client side the lack of animation makes it look like I'm not attacking them and they're not attacking me. I guess I should be grateful that the server doesn't think I'm spamming skills unnaturally fast, because I'd be upset if I lost my tickets due to being logged out for spamming over an issue I have no control over.

Lybal

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

Lybal wrote: »

It'd be very very bad work if the 1st case is the one in place, any competent dev knows it, players could modify their client to send 2 abilities and bypass GCD.

Are we talking about the devs that shipped out the Onyx Indrik summon animation that caused localized crashes?
The ones that let couldn't fix mount sprint until now when it's normalized and too late?

Bugs in a game are normal, if you find a game without bugs, it's either a really simple game or devs are more likely gods than humans.
Progamming is a very complicate thing and TESO is a huge machine made by a lot of people, some glitchs that can look stupid and very easy to fix can be in reality a complex task, it takes time and they have to focus their time on what they think is the most worth it.
Undo for example, I'm pretty sure they're aware about the situation of the skill and all, I don't know how the skill works exactly, but I believe that it works in such a way that they decided it would take them too much time to fix it and they prefer to spend it for something else.
I'm pretty sure they're also not totally free to decide on what they should spend their time too.

+ I believe that mount sprint was intended to work this way and they decided to change it for some reasons, I could be wrong, maybe it was such a minor thing which doesn't hurt anyone that they thought it wasn't worth their time.

I'm not really talking about a bug there in your quote, decide what is done by the client and what is done by the server is important to prevent cheating and some other things, there are other ways to prevent it but that's part of it, and make the check for GCD server side really is something that I think is very important and "basic", that would be a way too obvious possible cheat and it would be on top of their priority list imho.

It's not because there are major issues that devs are incompetent.

I'm not really that competent in programming, that's a minor part of my work but I know a lot of people working in this domain and I learned most with them, but I'm still probably not the best to talk in details about that stuff and I might have told some wrong stuff in my explanations there (if some people wants to correct me don't hesitate).

For more explanations from someone probably more competent than me to talk about this, check the answer of Starkerealm on this thread : https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/495485/how-do-bugs-make-it-to-live/p1
Programming and software development is something really complex and it's not because it looks simple, that it is simple, especially for something as big as ESO.

SeaGtGruff

Sometimes the best way to fix a program is to rewrite it rather than patch it. That's why I'm thinking that a lot of issues might not be addressed until next year when the next version gets released.

Alienoutlaw

to many ppl complaining about a part of the game they clearly DO NOT understand! PvP does not work the same way PvE does, we are NOT scripted Mobs with a set damage output, we have 100's if not 1000's of hours invested in our tactics and game play, we can and do out think the average PvE player, you WILL NOT be used to our burst damage or the speed in which we can kill someone who is Ill prepared to fight. we fight fast and hard if thats cheating because you cant keep up then GUILTY

starkerealm

Lybal wrote: »

Not to mention that screens used the seconds on the chat as proof, but the GCD in ESO is less than a second (0,85 or 0,9 sec, I'm not totally sure on this point)...

Going from memory, it's 1s or 1.1s for abilities, 0.9s for light/heavies. But, yeah, basically.

starkerealm

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

Lybal wrote: »

It'd be very very bad work if the 1st case is the one in place, any competent dev knows it, players could modify their client to send 2 abilities and bypass GCD.

Are we talking about the devs that shipped out the Onyx Indrik summon animation that caused localized crashes? https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/496288/hotfix-for-dragon-rise-crashing-oct-3
The ones that let couldn't fix mount sprint until now when it's normalized and too late?

I realize this might surprise you, but the mount behavior wasn't a bug. It was intended design. So, really, this comes across as saying, "they changed their minds on something, clearly they're incompetent!"

starkerealm

Alienoutlaw wrote: »

to many ppl complaining about a part of the game they clearly DO NOT understand! PvP does not work the same way PvE does, we are NOT scripted Mobs with a set damage output, we have 100's if not 1000's of hours invested in our tactics and game play, we can and do out think the average PvE player, you WILL NOT be used to our burst damage or the speed in which we can kill someone who is Ill prepared to fight. we fight fast and hard if thats cheating because you cant keep up then GUILTY

It goes beyond this. Locking up an opponent in PvE, long enough to kill them, is about simple mechanics. Killing another player can be as simple as overloading their ability to process information.

Alienoutlaw

starkerealm wrote: »

Alienoutlaw wrote: »

to many ppl complaining about a part of the game they clearly DO NOT understand! PvP does not work the same way PvE does, we are NOT scripted Mobs with a set damage output, we have 100's if not 1000's of hours invested in our tactics and game play, we can and do out think the average PvE player, you WILL NOT be used to our burst damage or the speed in which we can kill someone who is Ill prepared to fight. we fight fast and hard if thats cheating because you cant keep up then GUILTY

It goes beyond this. Locking up an opponent in PvE, long enough to kill them, is about simple mechanics. Killing another player can be as simple as overloading their ability to process information.

i was trying to keep it simple but yes i agree

Dusk_Coven

starkerealm wrote: »

I realize this might surprise you, but the mount behavior wasn't a bug. It was intended design. So, really, this comes across as saying, "they changed their minds on something, clearly they're incompetent!"

So when your mount stamina bar ran down to zero, and you could keep sprinting your mount... what's that?
If it's "normal", then when my character's stamina bar runs down to zero, I should be able to keep sprinting too?
Let's be realistic here. At very, very, least it's a UI display error. And that would be an extremely kind interpretation since UI display errors shouldn't be that hard to fix.
They even have a CP milestone power that gives you infinite sprint outside of combat. When's that kicked in for anyone? Oh, wait, everyone has it!
The worst part isn't even the infinite sprint -- it's the devs really not openly talking about it. They should at least acknowledge what was going on.
Saw in Vivec zone the other day a new player asking why they could keep sprinting their mount when the bar was empty -- even newbs know something is wrong.

starkerealm

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

I realize this might surprise you, but the mount behavior wasn't a bug. It was intended design. So, really, this comes across as saying, "they changed their minds on something, clearly they're incompetent!"

So when your mount stamina bar ran down to zero, and you could keep sprinting your mount... what's that?

Intended behavior.

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

If it's "normal", then when my character's stamina bar runs down to zero, I should be able to keep sprinting too?

Only if you're a horse.

From what I understand, originally, other mount types were going to have different "racial" perks unique to them. The infinite sprint was a horse specific trait and was the first implemented.

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

Let's be realistic here. At very, very, least it's a UI display error. And that would be an extremely kind interpretation since UI display errors shouldn't be that hard to fix.

It wasn't a UI error. It was intended behavior.

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

They even have a CP milestone power that gives you infinite sprint outside of combat. When's that kicked in for anyone? Oh, wait, everyone has it!

The primary purpose for that wasn't to extend your sprint duration, it was to allow you to have full Stam armor if someone ambushed you after you'd been running for extended periods.

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

The worst part isn't even the infinite sprint -- it's the devs really not openly talking about it. They should at least acknowledge what was going on.

They have. It's been years since the topic was discussed. Last time I remember a discussion on the topic was probably 2015.

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

Saw in Vivec zone the other day a new player asking why they could keep sprinting their mount when the bar was empty -- even newbs know something is wrong.

No, they understand that something doesn't behave the way they expected. That doesn't mean it's wrong.

leepalmer95

This entire topic is stupid.

SeaGtGruff

If it's intended behavior, why are they getting ready to fix it? Or were the threads where people were talking about coming changes to mounts mistaken?

leepalmer95

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

If it's intended behavior, why are they getting ready to fix it? Or were the threads where people were talking about coming changes to mounts mistaken?

Its not a fix, they're making a design change.

It's been like thata sinse release, if it was a problem is would of been changed by now.

SeaGtGruff

So they're changing it now because it's not a problem? Okay. TBH, I never even noticed that it was behaving that way until the threads about the upcoming change brought it to my attention. (Yeah, I have dozens of mounts and historically speaking I've not been riding any of them regularly-- up until the Doom Wolf mount, that is. I also have dozens if non-combat pets who almost never get taken out, other than the Haunted House Cat who has a permanent home on my bed.)

Wolfkeks

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

I realize this might surprise you, but the mount behavior wasn't a bug. It was intended design. So, really, this comes across as saying, "they changed their minds on something, clearly they're incompetent!"

So when your mount stamina bar ran down to zero, and you could keep sprinting your mount... what's that?
If it's "normal", then when my character's stamina bar runs down to zero, I should be able to keep sprinting too?
Let's be realistic here. At very, very, least it's a UI display error. And that would be an extremely kind interpretation since UI display errors shouldn't be that hard to fix.
They even have a CP milestone power that gives you infinite sprint outside of combat. When's that kicked in for anyone? Oh, wait, everyone has it!
The worst part isn't even the infinite sprint -- it's the devs really not openly talking about it. They should at least acknowledge what was going on.
Saw in Vivec zone the other day a new player asking why they could keep sprinting their mount when the bar was empty -- even newbs know something is wrong.

Actually not a bug but intended:

Is it normal that a horse can continue to sprint even if it runs out of stamina? I think players don’t appreciate that trait, since it seems to do nothing. – Chris J.

Yes, horses can sprint indefinitely without consuming stamina. That said, stamina is still valuable for two other reasons: It protects you from being dismounted when attacked, and if you rapidly press the sprint key you will get big boosts of speed on your mount (but at a much higher stamina cost). Of note, only horse mounts have the endless sprint trait. Other upcoming mount types will have different special traits.

https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/1019

Looks like they wanted to change it with different mount species but never did. I understand the confusion.

starkerealm

Wolfkeks wrote: »

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

I realize this might surprise you, but the mount behavior wasn't a bug. It was intended design. So, really, this comes across as saying, "they changed their minds on something, clearly they're incompetent!"

So when your mount stamina bar ran down to zero, and you could keep sprinting your mount... what's that?
If it's "normal", then when my character's stamina bar runs down to zero, I should be able to keep sprinting too?
Let's be realistic here. At very, very, least it's a UI display error. And that would be an extremely kind interpretation since UI display errors shouldn't be that hard to fix.
They even have a CP milestone power that gives you infinite sprint outside of combat. When's that kicked in for anyone? Oh, wait, everyone has it!
The worst part isn't even the infinite sprint -- it's the devs really not openly talking about it. They should at least acknowledge what was going on.
Saw in Vivec zone the other day a new player asking why they could keep sprinting their mount when the bar was empty -- even newbs know something is wrong.

Actually not a bug but intended:

Is it normal that a horse can continue to sprint even if it runs out of stamina? I think players don’t appreciate that trait, since it seems to do nothing. – Chris J.

Yes, horses can sprint indefinitely without consuming stamina. That said, stamina is still valuable for two other reasons: It protects you from being dismounted when attacked, and if you rapidly press the sprint key you will get big boosts of speed on your mount (but at a much higher stamina cost). Of note, only horse mounts have the endless sprint trait. Other upcoming mount types will have different special traits.

https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/1019

Looks like they wanted to change it with different mount species but never did. I understand the confusion.

My suspicion is, the different mount types and their perks were originally planned back before the Crown Store was a thing. So, at that point, putting unique traits on different mount types wouldn't have been a pay wall. The way the game works now, mounts are more of a cosmetic choice. We ride a lightning bear or a Clouded Leopard Senche because we want to, not because we get the best stats.

So, yeah, it seems likely that original plan was jettisoned when mounts were overhauled with 1.5 or 1.6. (I forget which.)

ZOS_JesC

Greetings, we've removed a handful of comments and closed this thread as it is no longer constructive.