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Can we look at lingering hp pots?
Urusovite
✭✭✭
Lingering health pots really need to be looked at in my opinion. Defense at the cost of damage would be a good way to approach a rework to these, as well as a means to fix the tank meta. While you have the 30% increased healing from major vitality, your damage is reduced by 30% to compensate. When major vitality runs out, the debuff is gone as well. That would be a lot better and make them more of a defensive option to allow you to "reset" rather than a free 15sec god-mode to go on offense with limited risk.
I've always mained a medium sDK and been more of a small-scale/solo player, so take that as you will and be aware of how it might affect my bias. I really cannot stand the 7th/fury lingering hp cheese people can throw on and then all of a sudden be able to go toe-to-toe with the best simply because their gear setup is good.
Edited by Urusovite on July 28, 2019 6:56AM I've always mained a medium sDK and been more of a small-scale/solo player, so take that as you will and be aware of how it might affect my bias. I really cannot stand the 7th/fury lingering hp cheese people can throw on and then all of a sudden be able to go toe-to-toe with the best simply because their gear setup is good.
PS4 NA
Medium Stam Dk since launch
Technologically incompetent I'm told
Solo play is the only way
Medium Stam Dk since launch
Technologically incompetent I'm told
Solo play is the only way
5
-
Emma_Overload✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭No.
Wait until Update 23 goes live before you start begging for healing nerfs. The damage is going to be insane.#CAREBEARMASTERRACE17 -
Urusovite✭✭✭Emma_Overload wrote: »No.
Wait until Update 23 goes live before you start begging for healing nerfs. The damage is going to be insane.
I can't tell if you play or not. I didn't ask for a nerf to healing even though I 100% agree healing ward, regeneration, and vigor need to be reduced before live. I asked for a debuff to accompany the buff. The healing remains the same, but the damage you deal is reduced during the duration of 30% increased healing. The fact I have seen you defending the 5.1.2 healing ward change tells me you really don't know what you are talking about. Sorry not sorry.PS4 NA
Medium Stam Dk since launch
Technologically incompetent I'm told
Solo play is the only way14 -
Insco851✭✭✭✭✭
✭Emma_Overload wrote: »No.
Wait until Update 23 goes live before you start begging for healing nerfs. The damage is going to be insane.
I can't tell if you play or not. I didn't ask for a nerf to healing even though I 100% agree healing ward, regeneration, and vigor need to be reduced before live. I asked for a debuff to accompany the buff. The healing remains the same, but the damage you deal is reduced during the duration of 30% increased healing. The fact I have seen you defending the 5.1.2 healing ward change tells me you really don't know what you are talking about. Sorry not sorry.
You are citing 15 seconds- My guess the major vitality lingering health pot. There are other lingering pots as well that would end up useless if you tied this debuff to the lingering portion over the vitality portion. Js0 -
Urusovite✭✭✭Emma_Overload wrote: »No.
Wait until Update 23 goes live before you start begging for healing nerfs. The damage is going to be insane.
I can't tell if you play or not. I didn't ask for a nerf to healing even though I 100% agree healing ward, regeneration, and vigor need to be reduced before live. I asked for a debuff to accompany the buff. The healing remains the same, but the damage you deal is reduced during the duration of 30% increased healing. The fact I have seen you defending the 5.1.2 healing ward change tells me you really don't know what you are talking about. Sorry not sorry.
You are citing 15 seconds- My guess the major vitality lingering health pot. There are other lingering pots as well that would end up useless if you tied this debuff to the lingering portion over the vitality portion. Js
Yes. Specifically the major vitality buff.Edited by Urusovite on July 28, 2019 6:55AMPS4 NA
Medium Stam Dk since launch
Technologically incompetent I'm told
Solo play is the only way0 -
universal_wrath✭✭✭✭✭Emma_Overload wrote: »No.
Wait until Update 23 goes live before you start begging for healing nerfs. The damage is going to be insane.
I can't tell if you play or not. I didn't ask for a nerf to healing even though I 100% agree healing ward, regeneration, and vigor need to be reduced before live. I asked for a debuff to accompany the buff. The healing remains the same, but the damage you deal is reduced during the duration of 30% increased healing. The fact I have seen you defending the 5.1.2 healing ward change tells me you really don't know what you are talking about. Sorry not sorry.
30% damage reduce to you is a nerf. Please don't make my stam sorc suffer. My class does not have any healing bonuses like dk with major mending and healing recieved. We only have a skill that gives major vitality and it's too expensive and useless mostly ouside of pve and the buff only last 2 secs. Please stop that, not everyone wears heavy armor or dk/warden, you reduce the dmg I do, you just put too much pressure on my, because I can't even deal enough dmg to others fighting. Might as well die when using lingering pots6 -
Urusovite✭✭✭universal_wrath wrote: »Emma_Overload wrote: »No.
Wait until Update 23 goes live before you start begging for healing nerfs. The damage is going to be insane.
I can't tell if you play or not. I didn't ask for a nerf to healing even though I 100% agree healing ward, regeneration, and vigor need to be reduced before live. I asked for a debuff to accompany the buff. The healing remains the same, but the damage you deal is reduced during the duration of 30% increased healing. The fact I have seen you defending the 5.1.2 healing ward change tells me you really don't know what you are talking about. Sorry not sorry.
30% damage reduce to you is a nerf. Please don't make my stam sorc suffer. My class does not have any healing bonuses like dk with major mending and healing recieved. We only have a skill that gives major vitality and it's too expensive and useless mostly ouside of pve and the buff only last 2 secs. Please stop that, not everyone wears heavy armor or dk/warden, you reduce the dmg I do, you just put too much pressure on my, because I can't even deal enough dmg to others fighting. Might as well die when using lingering pots
Your stam sorc is irrelevant to the topic of the major vitality buff on potions and how balanced that is. Classes without major mending do not have it for a reason. 30% damage reduction is not a nerf to the healing aspect of the potions. The healing would remain unchanged, but the damage you deal while having that healing potential would be greatly reduced as a fair cost.PS4 NA
Medium Stam Dk since launch
Technologically incompetent I'm told
Solo play is the only way1 -
universal_wrath✭✭✭✭✭universal_wrath wrote: »Emma_Overload wrote: »No.
Wait until Update 23 goes live before you start begging for healing nerfs. The damage is going to be insane.
I can't tell if you play or not. I didn't ask for a nerf to healing even though I 100% agree healing ward, regeneration, and vigor need to be reduced before live. I asked for a debuff to accompany the buff. The healing remains the same, but the damage you deal is reduced during the duration of 30% increased healing. The fact I have seen you defending the 5.1.2 healing ward change tells me you really don't know what you are talking about. Sorry not sorry.
30% damage reduce to you is a nerf. Please don't make my stam sorc suffer. My class does not have any healing bonuses like dk with major mending and healing recieved. We only have a skill that gives major vitality and it's too expensive and useless mostly ouside of pve and the buff only last 2 secs. Please stop that, not everyone wears heavy armor or dk/warden, you reduce the dmg I do, you just put too much pressure on my, because I can't even deal enough dmg to others fighting. Might as well die when using lingering pots
Your stam sorc is irrelevant to the topic of the major vitality buff on potions and how balanced that is. Classes without major mending do not have it for a reason. 30% damage reduction is not a nerf to the healing aspect of the potions. The healing would remain unchanged, but the damage you deal while having that healing potential would be greatly reduced as a fair cost.
Why sorc don't have any healing bonuses? If you talk about healing power, DK, warden, templar, nightblade, and necromancer have higher healing output. Talking about defense, templar, warden, dk...etc have higher defensise and survivability. Damage? All other classes same or better than sorc. People might argue sorc combo, that is timed burst, all other class are almost as close or higher in dmg than sorc.
In regards to healing pots, there is no poit if you keep spaming heals and 1 or 2 people on top of you bounding your ass and you can't apply any pressure. If you don't put any pressure on your attackers, no matter how much you heal, you will die, right after the vitality buff end, because you exhausted your stam for block instead of being offensive, and magicka for heals. Beside, not everyone uses lingering pots for the vitality buff, some use it for speed, dmg buff, resource return, ...etc.
If you want to tune down lingering pots, why not tune down tri stat pots as well, they give everything and increase your recovery by large amount.2 -
Emma_Overload✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Emma_Overload wrote: »No.
Wait until Update 23 goes live before you start begging for healing nerfs. The damage is going to be insane.
I can't tell if you play or not. I didn't ask for a nerf to healing even though I 100% agree healing ward, regeneration, and vigor need to be reduced before live. I asked for a debuff to accompany the buff. The healing remains the same, but the damage you deal is reduced during the duration of 30% increased healing. The fact I have seen you defending the 5.1.2 healing ward change tells me you really don't know what you are talking about. Sorry not sorry.
You asked for lingering pots to get "looked at", which is just a shady way of asking for a nerf. You're not fooling anybody. We all know what a request-for-nerf post looks like.
And no, none of the heals you mentioned need to be reduced until the majority of players can see for themselves if they need to be nerfed. ZOS gave them the values they have on PTS for a reason, and from what I've seen the reason is that we are entering an insane DOT damage era.
The fact that you don't realize any of this tells me that you are a very inexperienced player.
Edited by Emma_Overload on July 28, 2019 12:52PM#CAREBEARMASTERRACE13 -
Urusovite✭✭✭Emma_Overload wrote: »Emma_Overload wrote: »No.
Wait until Update 23 goes live before you start begging for healing nerfs. The damage is going to be insane.
I can't tell if you play or not. I didn't ask for a nerf to healing even though I 100% agree healing ward, regeneration, and vigor need to be reduced before live. I asked for a debuff to accompany the buff. The healing remains the same, but the damage you deal is reduced during the duration of 30% increased healing. The fact I have seen you defending the 5.1.2 healing ward change tells me you really don't know what you are talking about. Sorry not sorry.
You asked for lingering pots to get "looked at", which is just a shady way of asking for a nerf. You're not fooling anybody. We all know what a request-for-nerf post looks like.
And no, none of the heals you mentioned need to be reduced until the majority of players can see for themselves if they need to be nerfed. ZOS gave them the values they have on PTS for a reason, and from what I've seen the reason is that we are entering an insane DOT damage era.
The fact that you don't realize any of this tells me that you are a very inexperienced player.
"Inexperienced" Lol. Here, I'll post some clips of myself then you do yours. We'll see who's inexperienced. I am not in support of a dot meta but the solution to the dot meta is not over-buffing heals to compensate rendering bursty play-styles obsolete. This is indeed a nerf thread and I'm not asking it the way I am to be "shady" either. It's simply the way I talk. Lingering health pots are a carry.
Here are some of my clips btw, show me yours.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wuVDoPlUfno
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4E7fiE-GLg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_WKKlKeBck
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgGC67vIfcE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_c2-pQhY9kEDeathlord92 wrote: »No
This surprises me to be honest. Especially as a follower to Paradox's channel. Does the tank meta not bother you? Why do you disagree?No_Division wrote: »Just sit and wait to play the game first. Or use defile+better build lol.
Builds didn't used to matter so much at one point. That was back when many veteran players called the game fun and balanced at least on console.Edited by Urusovite on July 28, 2019 2:09PMPS4 NA
Medium Stam Dk since launch
Technologically incompetent I'm told
Solo play is the only way3 -
MincVinyl✭✭✭✭✭@Urusovite before you said you believe healing ward, regeneration, and vigor need to be reduced before hitting live, why is that?
The vigor change makes solo heals stronger and group heals weaker with more burst potential.1 -
Urusovite✭✭✭@Urusovite before you said you believe healing ward, regeneration, and vigor need to be reduced before hitting live, why is that?
The vigor change makes solo heals stronger and group heals weaker with more burst potential.
A 35-60k vigor tooltip makes the game too easy. In my opinion, they were all over-buffed. I like that it is better for solo players and the direction they are going, but that was too much. A smaller buff would have been a lot more reasonable.PS4 NA
Medium Stam Dk since launch
Technologically incompetent I'm told
Solo play is the only way1 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I do not think lingering health potions requires Vitality so you are begin far to vague for Zos to figure out what you are talking about. Yea, we know but you are trying to talk to Zos.
Further, your stam DK is irrelevant to the discussion. Use Defile, fracture and other means to reduce the targets healing received and damage taken.3 -
Urusovite✭✭✭I do not think lingering health potions requires Vitality so you are begin far to vague for Zos to figure out what you are talking about. Yea, we know but you are trying to talk to Zos.
Further, your stam DK is irrelevant to the discussion. Use Defile, fracture and other means to reduce the targets healing received and damage taken.
I specifically mentioned major vitality tied to potions so it’s not vague at all. Stam dk is irrelevant to the discussion so I do not get your point. Stam dk has nothing to do with the potions but the current meta right now is a prime example of how the potions over perform. That is the only reason I brought it up.
PS4 NA
Medium Stam Dk since launch
Technologically incompetent I'm told
Solo play is the only way1 -
No_Division✭✭✭Emma_Overload wrote: »Emma_Overload wrote: »No.
Wait until Update 23 goes live before you start begging for healing nerfs. The damage is going to be insane.
I can't tell if you play or not. I didn't ask for a nerf to healing even though I 100% agree healing ward, regeneration, and vigor need to be reduced before live. I asked for a debuff to accompany the buff. The healing remains the same, but the damage you deal is reduced during the duration of 30% increased healing. The fact I have seen you defending the 5.1.2 healing ward change tells me you really don't know what you are talking about. Sorry not sorry.
You asked for lingering pots to get "looked at", which is just a shady way of asking for a nerf. You're not fooling anybody. We all know what a request-for-nerf post looks like.
And no, none of the heals you mentioned need to be reduced until the majority of players can see for themselves if they need to be nerfed. ZOS gave them the values they have on PTS for a reason, and from what I've seen the reason is that we are entering an insane DOT damage era.
The fact that you don't realize any of this tells me that you are a very inexperienced player.
"Inexperienced" Lol. Here, I'll post some clips of myself then you do yours. We'll see who's inexperienced. I am not in support of a dot meta but the solution to the dot meta is not over-buffing heals to compensate rendering bursty play-styles obsolete. This is indeed a nerf thread and I'm not asking it the way I am to be "shady" either. It's simply the way I talk. Lingering health pots are a carry.
Here are some of my clips btw, show me yours.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wuVDoPlUfnohttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4E7fiE-GLghttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_WKKlKeBckhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgGC67vIfcEhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_c2-pQhY9kEDeathlord92 wrote: »No
This surprises me to be honest. Especially as a follower to Paradox's channel. Does the tank meta not bother you? Why do you disagree?No_Division wrote: »Just sit and wait to play the game first. Or use defile+better build lol.
Builds didn't used to matter so much at one point. That was back when many veteran players called the game fun and balanced at least on console.
They are a carry because you have major mending+12% healing on your class fighting pugs without proper builds lol3 -
Urusovite✭✭✭No_Division wrote: »Emma_Overload wrote: »Emma_Overload wrote: »No.
Wait until Update 23 goes live before you start begging for healing nerfs. The damage is going to be insane.
I can't tell if you play or not. I didn't ask for a nerf to healing even though I 100% agree healing ward, regeneration, and vigor need to be reduced before live. I asked for a debuff to accompany the buff. The healing remains the same, but the damage you deal is reduced during the duration of 30% increased healing. The fact I have seen you defending the 5.1.2 healing ward change tells me you really don't know what you are talking about. Sorry not sorry.
You asked for lingering pots to get "looked at", which is just a shady way of asking for a nerf. You're not fooling anybody. We all know what a request-for-nerf post looks like.
And no, none of the heals you mentioned need to be reduced until the majority of players can see for themselves if they need to be nerfed. ZOS gave them the values they have on PTS for a reason, and from what I've seen the reason is that we are entering an insane DOT damage era.
The fact that you don't realize any of this tells me that you are a very inexperienced player.
"Inexperienced" Lol. Here, I'll post some clips of myself then you do yours. We'll see who's inexperienced. I am not in support of a dot meta but the solution to the dot meta is not over-buffing heals to compensate rendering bursty play-styles obsolete. This is indeed a nerf thread and I'm not asking it the way I am to be "shady" either. It's simply the way I talk. Lingering health pots are a carry.
Here are some of my clips btw, show me yours.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wuVDoPlUfnohttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4E7fiE-GLghttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_WKKlKeBckhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgGC67vIfcEhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_c2-pQhY9kEDeathlord92 wrote: »No
This surprises me to be honest. Especially as a follower to Paradox's channel. Does the tank meta not bother you? Why do you disagree?No_Division wrote: »Just sit and wait to play the game first. Or use defile+better build lol.
Builds didn't used to matter so much at one point. That was back when many veteran players called the game fun and balanced at least on console.
They are a carry because you have major mending+12% healing on your class fighting pugs without proper builds lol
I don’t use them too often, but they are a carry on any class... stamplar, stam sorc, stam dk, doesn’t matter.
PS4 NA
Medium Stam Dk since launch
Technologically incompetent I'm told
Solo play is the only way1 -
Urusovite✭✭✭Spartabunny08 wrote: »L2p issue, move along
Pretty sure I been Xing the likes of you long before you even knew what a 5 piece was.
PS4 NA
Medium Stam Dk since launch
Technologically incompetent I'm told
Solo play is the only way1 -
TriangularChicken✭✭✭✭@Urusovite before you said you believe healing ward, regeneration, and vigor need to be reduced before hitting live, why is that?
The vigor change makes solo heals stronger and group heals weaker with more burst potential.
A 35-60k vigor tooltip makes the game too easy. In my opinion, they were all over-buffed. I like that it is better for solo players and the direction they are going, but that was too much. A smaller buff would have been a lot more reasonable.
what build has a 60k vigor tooltip? 7 divines build?1 -
Lapin_Logic✭✭✭✭✭Lingering health pots really need to be looked at in my opinion. Defense at the cost of damage would be a good way to approach a rework to these, as well as a means to fix the tank meta. While you have the 30% increased healing from major vitality, your damage is reduced by 30% to compensate. When major vitality runs out, the debuff is gone as well. That would be a lot better and make them more of a defensive option to allow you to "reset" rather than a free 15sec god-mode to go on offense with limited risk.
I've always mained a medium sDK and been more of a small-scale/solo player, so take that as you will and be aware of how it might affect my bias. I really cannot stand the 7th/fury lingering hp cheese people can throw on and then all of a sudden be able to go toe-to-toe with the best simply because their gear setup is good.
Add the damage nerf to 7th/Fury if THAT is the problem, make, let the set Burst... Then make them impotent for 20 seconds or so, the real problems is the sets are badly optimized and amplified with power creep, the class is practically irrelevant just pop an ulti and swing batter batter batter with a gagillion weapon damage, your nerf to pots and certain buffs are moot, if a circus clown is going to gank you they will do it anywhere with any armor and any healing, making them "reset" for 15 seconds after you are dead is the same as them having to charge their ulti for x seconds. Don't tell me that 15 seconds is going to make any difference to a godly invincible tank healing his ass off with the exact same WD behind his heals just because he is hitting you slightly less hard, fix the causes not fringe problems with 1 setup.0 -
Urusovite✭✭✭TriangularChicken wrote: »@Urusovite before you said you believe healing ward, regeneration, and vigor need to be reduced before hitting live, why is that?
The vigor change makes solo heals stronger and group heals weaker with more burst potential.
A 35-60k vigor tooltip makes the game too easy. In my opinion, they were all over-buffed. I like that it is better for solo players and the direction they are going, but that was too much. A smaller buff would have been a lot more reasonable.
what build has a 60k vigor tooltip? 7 divines build?
Indeed, an unrealistic build would have 60k vigor tooltips. However, considering my tooltip on live is 26k in medium without major vitality, 50k isn’t unreasonable on the pts using a standard build (on dk specifically hence the large range I gave). Just going off some tooltip pictures I’ve seen.Lapin_Logic wrote: »Lingering health pots really need to be looked at in my opinion. Defense at the cost of damage would be a good way to approach a rework to these, as well as a means to fix the tank meta. While you have the 30% increased healing from major vitality, your damage is reduced by 30% to compensate. When major vitality runs out, the debuff is gone as well. That would be a lot better and make them more of a defensive option to allow you to "reset" rather than a free 15sec god-mode to go on offense with limited risk.
I've always mained a medium sDK and been more of a small-scale/solo player, so take that as you will and be aware of how it might affect my bias. I really cannot stand the 7th/fury lingering hp cheese people can throw on and then all of a sudden be able to go toe-to-toe with the best simply because their gear setup is good.
Add the damage nerf to 7th/Fury if THAT is the problem, make, let the set Burst... Then make them impotent for 20 seconds or so, the real problems is the sets are badly optimized and amplified with power creep, the class is practically irrelevant just pop an ulti and swing batter batter batter with a gagillion weapon damage, your nerf to pots and certain buffs are moot, if a circus clown is going to gank you they will do it anywhere with any armor and any healing, making them "reset" for 15 seconds after you are dead is the same as them having to charge their ulti for x seconds. Don't tell me that 15 seconds is going to make any difference to a godly invincible tank healing his ass off with the exact same WD behind his heals just because he is hitting you slightly less hard, fix the causes not fringe problems with 1 setup.
I appreciate you offering reasoning for your disagreement, but I’d like to remind you that 30% damage reduction is pretty penalizing if applied to yourself. You are correct that both fury and 7th were a large part of the problem. The major vitality buff is as well in my opinion. I welcome the buff but there needs to be a cost for something so powerful and so easy to obtain. That’s all I’m suggesting. The ability to survive and manage resources all while doing damage used to be harder. It was made far too easy and the skill-gap was as decreased as a result.
Edited by Urusovite on July 28, 2019 8:38PMPS4 NA
Medium Stam Dk since launch
Technologically incompetent I'm told
Solo play is the only way1 -
Lapin_Logic✭✭✭✭✭TriangularChicken wrote: »@Urusovite before you said you believe healing ward, regeneration, and vigor need to be reduced before hitting live, why is that?
The vigor change makes solo heals stronger and group heals weaker with more burst potential.
A 35-60k vigor tooltip makes the game too easy. In my opinion, they were all over-buffed. I like that it is better for solo players and the direction they are going, but that was too much. A smaller buff would have been a lot more reasonable.
what build has a 60k vigor tooltip? 7 divines build?
Indeed, an unrealistic build would have 60k vigor tooltips. However, considering my tooltip on live is 26k in medium without major vitality, 50k isn’t unreasonable on the pts using a standard build (on dk specifically hence the large range I gave). Just going off some tooltip pictures I’ve seen.Lapin_Logic wrote: »Lingering health pots really need to be looked at in my opinion. Defense at the cost of damage would be a good way to approach a rework to these, as well as a means to fix the tank meta. While you have the 30% increased healing from major vitality, your damage is reduced by 30% to compensate. When major vitality runs out, the debuff is gone as well. That would be a lot better and make them more of a defensive option to allow you to "reset" rather than a free 15sec god-mode to go on offense with limited risk.
I've always mained a medium sDK and been more of a small-scale/solo player, so take that as you will and be aware of how it might affect my bias. I really cannot stand the 7th/fury lingering hp cheese people can throw on and then all of a sudden be able to go toe-to-toe with the best simply because their gear setup is good.
Add the damage nerf to 7th/Fury if THAT is the problem, make, let the set Burst... Then make them impotent for 20 seconds or so, the real problems is the sets are badly optimized and amplified with power creep, the class is practically irrelevant just pop an ulti and swing batter batter batter with a gagillion weapon damage, your nerf to pots and certain buffs are moot, if a circus clown is going to gank you they will do it anywhere with any armor and any healing, making them "reset" for 15 seconds after you are dead is the same as them having to charge their ulti for x seconds. Don't tell me that 15 seconds is going to make any difference to a godly invincible tank healing his ass off with the exact same WD behind his heals just because he is hitting you slightly less hard, fix the causes not fringe problems with 1 setup.
I appreciate you offering reasoning for your disagreement, but I’d like to remind you that 30% damage reduction is pretty penalizing if applied to yourself. You are correct that both fury and 7th were a large part of the problem. The major vitality buff is as well in my opinion. I welcome the buff but there needs to be a cost for something so powerful and so easy to obtain. That’s all I’m suggesting. The ability to survive and manage resources all while doing damage used to be harder. It was made far too easy and the skill-gap was as decreased as a result.
Some reasoning, for 1 there is the fact as 70% of other heavy armo builds won't use the potion because they can't kill anything anyway (seeing as they don't have damage bonuses) so are just a cancer to them, also light armour builds won't use them because the trade off will never let them survive enough, also they probably want a pot with Resources/Stealth/Crit spell damage. So the potion will be pointless in most cases.
Next, 30% damage reduction is a significant hit yes I agree, it's just in the vast majority of 1 v 1 a burst is the win when you are ready to deploy it 1/2 v X small scale a burst on the best in the group sees the trash following them fall to a wizened old man weasing on them and if you are Fengrush then there is that many ults being dropped he could just say "It's Go time" and run forward and type /DanceRedguard while everyone dies around him, so I honestly don't think it will have an effect, or at least the one you are aiming for, especially against the tanky Mo fo with a billion WD heals. Also the thing is if he is so tanky and healy it's just prolonging the inevitable death to his burst and he will use that to interupt anyone reviving and resetting his buffs and combo but now has a bit more time to heavy attack and restore stamina.
I understand they want a "Berserker" build to be possible but I honestly think Heavy armor needs to be locked out of high damage but focus on being a "Survivable Berserker" who can wade across a battlefield shrugging people off by punishing those who attack them with their own damage (like DK spikes) instead of the ZOS berserker who is just a murder machine/ganker who gets more resistance than the other gankers in medium and light and needs a little time to proc.0 -
Firstmep✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Only if it applies to the vitality provided by sets too, like brp resto which you know every magicka setup uses now or will next patch.0 -
KillsAllElves✭✭✭✭✭L O L
I had to edit this, i almost forgot-the word this thread brings to mind is [ TRIGGERED ].Edited by KillsAllElves on July 28, 2019 10:29PM1 -
EtTuBrutus✭✭✭✭✭In abyss's's's's's defense, he's a good player that is small group/ solo only.
Lingering health vitality pots are incredibly cost effective for what they do. In conjunction with major mending, vitality, dk passives impacting the insane increase to healing, abyss is going to be a challenge to bring down solo.1 -
Urusovite✭✭✭KillsAllElves wrote: »L O L
I had to edit this, i almost forgot-the word this thread brings to mind is [ TRIGGERED ].
I wouldn't say that. I respond the same way people respond to me. If they claim I need to L2P, I only ask for evidence. Drop a few videos of some mad skills and shut me up. I will admit when I feel a player is far better than me. If they disagree and tell me why then I'm willing to discuss with them. If they just disagree without reasoning then I ask them why. You too look like you want a reaction and I don't understand why you would waste your time on a thread you aren't willing to contribute to.PS4 NA
Medium Stam Dk since launch
Technologically incompetent I'm told
Solo play is the only way2 -
Urusovite✭✭✭Lapin_Logic wrote: »TriangularChicken wrote: »@Urusovite before you said you believe healing ward, regeneration, and vigor need to be reduced before hitting live, why is that?
The vigor change makes solo heals stronger and group heals weaker with more burst potential.
A 35-60k vigor tooltip makes the game too easy. In my opinion, they were all over-buffed. I like that it is better for solo players and the direction they are going, but that was too much. A smaller buff would have been a lot more reasonable.
what build has a 60k vigor tooltip? 7 divines build?
Indeed, an unrealistic build would have 60k vigor tooltips. However, considering my tooltip on live is 26k in medium without major vitality, 50k isn’t unreasonable on the pts using a standard build (on dk specifically hence the large range I gave). Just going off some tooltip pictures I’ve seen.Lapin_Logic wrote: »Lingering health pots really need to be looked at in my opinion. Defense at the cost of damage would be a good way to approach a rework to these, as well as a means to fix the tank meta. While you have the 30% increased healing from major vitality, your damage is reduced by 30% to compensate. When major vitality runs out, the debuff is gone as well. That would be a lot better and make them more of a defensive option to allow you to "reset" rather than a free 15sec god-mode to go on offense with limited risk.
I've always mained a medium sDK and been more of a small-scale/solo player, so take that as you will and be aware of how it might affect my bias. I really cannot stand the 7th/fury lingering hp cheese people can throw on and then all of a sudden be able to go toe-to-toe with the best simply because their gear setup is good.
Add the damage nerf to 7th/Fury if THAT is the problem, make, let the set Burst... Then make them impotent for 20 seconds or so, the real problems is the sets are badly optimized and amplified with power creep, the class is practically irrelevant just pop an ulti and swing batter batter batter with a gagillion weapon damage, your nerf to pots and certain buffs are moot, if a circus clown is going to gank you they will do it anywhere with any armor and any healing, making them "reset" for 15 seconds after you are dead is the same as them having to charge their ulti for x seconds. Don't tell me that 15 seconds is going to make any difference to a godly invincible tank healing his ass off with the exact same WD behind his heals just because he is hitting you slightly less hard, fix the causes not fringe problems with 1 setup.
I appreciate you offering reasoning for your disagreement, but I’d like to remind you that 30% damage reduction is pretty penalizing if applied to yourself. You are correct that both fury and 7th were a large part of the problem. The major vitality buff is as well in my opinion. I welcome the buff but there needs to be a cost for something so powerful and so easy to obtain. That’s all I’m suggesting. The ability to survive and manage resources all while doing damage used to be harder. It was made far too easy and the skill-gap was as decreased as a result.
Some reasoning, for 1 there is the fact as 70% of other heavy armo builds won't use the potion because they can't kill anything anyway (seeing as they don't have damage bonuses) so are just a cancer to them, also light armour builds won't use them because the trade off will never let them survive enough, also they probably want a pot with Resources/Stealth/Crit spell damage. So the potion will be pointless in most cases.
Next, 30% damage reduction is a significant hit yes I agree, it's just in the vast majority of 1 v 1 a burst is the win when you are ready to deploy it 1/2 v X small scale a burst on the best in the group sees the trash following them fall to a wizened old man weasing on them and if you are Fengrush then there is that many ults being dropped he could just say "It's Go time" and run forward and type /DanceRedguard while everyone dies around him, so I honestly don't think it will have an effect, or at least the one you are aiming for, especially against the tanky Mo fo with a billion WD heals. Also the thing is if he is so tanky and healy it's just prolonging the inevitable death to his burst and he will use that to interupt anyone reviving and resetting his buffs and combo but now has a bit more time to heavy attack and restore stamina.
I understand they want a "Berserker" build to be possible but I honestly think Heavy armor needs to be locked out of high damage but focus on being a "Survivable Berserker" who can wade across a battlefield shrugging people off by punishing those who attack them with their own damage (like DK spikes) instead of the ZOS berserker who is just a murder machine/ganker who gets more resistance than the other gankers in medium and light and needs a little time to proc.
That is fair. It may not have the outcome I am looking for. With the changes to fury and 7th, I feel like its a good direction to counter this super-tank DD meta we're in (even though they still aren't awful). I'm just worried the healing potential next patch is far too high. I'm not in favor of a dot meta either, but there are better ways to fix that rather than homogenize the game and give over-powered HoTs to everyone. Finding a balance between healing and sustain and damage used to be a lot harder and was an element of skill in the game. You popped your heals at the right moments to conserve resources and you had to choose when to go on defense and offense. You didn't have it all at once.PS4 NA
Medium Stam Dk since launch
Technologically incompetent I'm told
Solo play is the only way1 -
KillsAllElves✭✭✭✭✭KillsAllElves wrote: »L O L
I had to edit this, i almost forgot-the word this thread brings to mind is [ TRIGGERED ].
I wouldn't say that. I respond the same way people respond to me. If they claim I need to L2P, I only ask for evidence. Drop a few videos of some mad skills and shut me up. I will admit when I feel a player is far better than me. If they disagree and tell me why then I'm willing to discuss with them. If they just disagree without reasoning then I ask them why. You too look like you want a reaction and I don't understand why you would waste your time on a thread you aren't willing to contribute to.
Im used to seeing care bears cry about the stupidest things on this forum, reading your replies you were triggered and quite easily so! Youre begging for another nerf.
Btw. L2p7
