Let's talk about the healing changes...

Sanguinor2

NaranjaIslands wrote: »

This thread started out REALLY GOOD. Then people started getting emotional. I would've loved to have been able to scroll through constructive conversation about the healing changes, but instead I felt the need to skip at least 4 pages of people being dramatic. I expect this thread to get moderated, or locked soon. Hopefully just moderated.

ANYWAY - I enjoy playing as a dedicated healer to support my teammates. I will always opt to play as a healer in dungeons/ trials, and I have the most fun by supporting my team while clearing harder content. This motivation has lead me to learn so much more about the game, and has helped me increase my skill level as a player at a very reasonable pace.

To be honest, I enjoy the support aspect of playing a healer more than the actual healing itself. Don't get me wrong, I keep everyone topped off without hesitation, but if there was a separate role for support then I'd probably play that more. Instead I have 5 alts fully dedicated to healing, and I use a Templar as my main for vet dungeons/ trials.

I'm concerned about the changes to healing that the patch notes reveal, but I'm hoping that the PTS phase will tweak some things so that these changes will be much more reasonable.

Kind of off topic, but what's the likelihood of ZOS implementing a role purely geared towards being a support group member? I would have more variety as far as what roles my alts play, but I'm thinking that'll never happen. It's an interesting thought nonetheless.

They´d have to rebalance a lot of Content for a new role to be added, what are you gonna drop in 4 man for it? One dd? Or one healer? If the answer is dd then all Content Needs to be reworked, if the answer is healer why even Change something?

hexnotic

N/A

D0PAMINE

So will Tanks be running orbs as well? I know some already have been.

Seraphayel

NaranjaIslands wrote: »

Sanguinor2 wrote: »

NaranjaIslands wrote: »

This thread started out REALLY GOOD. Then people started getting emotional. I would've loved to have been able to scroll through constructive conversation about the healing changes, but instead I felt the need to skip at least 4 pages of people being dramatic. I expect this thread to get moderated, or locked soon. Hopefully just moderated.

ANYWAY - I enjoy playing as a dedicated healer to support my teammates. I will always opt to play as a healer in dungeons/ trials, and I have the most fun by supporting my team while clearing harder content. This motivation has lead me to learn so much more about the game, and has helped me increase my skill level as a player at a very reasonable pace.

To be honest, I enjoy the support aspect of playing a healer more than the actual healing itself. Don't get me wrong, I keep everyone topped off without hesitation, but if there was a separate role for support then I'd probably play that more. Instead I have 5 alts fully dedicated to healing, and I use a Templar as my main for vet dungeons/ trials.

I'm concerned about the changes to healing that the patch notes reveal, but I'm hoping that the PTS phase will tweak some things so that these changes will be much more reasonable.

Kind of off topic, but what's the likelihood of ZOS implementing a role purely geared towards being a support group member? I would have more variety as far as what roles my alts play, but I'm thinking that'll never happen. It's an interesting thought nonetheless.

They´d have to rebalance a lot of Content for a new role to be added, what are you gonna drop in 4 man for it? One dd? Or one healer? If the answer is dd then all Content Needs to be reworked, if the answer is healer why even Change something?

Yeah I agree with you. Adding a new role would need a huge overhaul, but it was just something that this conversation had me curious about.

Why would it need a huge overhaul? Just shift all of the buffs, debuffs and resource management tools from tanks/healers to a new supporting DPS role. And there you have your question as to which spot they’ll take. RIFT (another MMORPG) had this wonderful class called “Archon“ that was this support DPS.

Sanguinor2

Seraphayel wrote: »

Why would it need a huge overhaul? Just shift all of the buffs, debuffs and resource management tools from tanks/healers to a new supporting DPS role. And there you have your question as to which spot they’ll take. RIFT (another MMORPG) had this wonderful class called “Archon“ that was this support DPS.

And who is gonna make up for the lost dps? If the support dps does the same as dps as the full dps, why even have full dps?

Seraphayel

Sanguinor2 wrote: »

Seraphayel wrote: »

Why would it need a huge overhaul? Just shift all of the buffs, debuffs and resource management tools from tanks/healers to a new supporting DPS role. And there you have your question as to which spot they’ll take. RIFT (another MMORPG) had this wonderful class called “Archon“ that was this support DPS.

And who is gonna make up for the lost dps? If the support dps does the same as dps as the full dps, why even have full dps?

The support DPS does not deal the same DPS, it’s a middle of the road between tank/healer and “real“ DPS.

Encounters where you have a DPS race because of timers you can easily change by adjusting timers, every other encounter doesn’t really need fixing. Power creep is real and the DPS skyrocketed, there wouldn’t be a problem to tune it down significantly when some slight adjustments are made.

Sanguinor2

Seraphayel wrote: »

The support DPS does not deal the same DPS, it’s a middle of the road between tank/healer and “real“ DPS.

Encounters where you have a DPS race because of timers you can easily change by adjusting timers, every other encounter doesn’t really need fixing. Power creep is real and the DPS skyrocketed, there wouldn’t be a problem to tune it down significantly when some slight adjustments are made.

Would require to rebalance a lot of Content it might be an interesting Concept for some but I doubt we´ll see it happen.

Rustyfish101

NaranjaIslands wrote: »

This thread started out REALLY GOOD. Then people started getting emotional. I would've loved to have been able to scroll through constructive conversation about the healing changes, but instead I felt the need to skip at least 4 pages of people being dramatic. I expect this thread to get moderated, or locked soon. Hopefully just moderated.

Yea I've been more or less just sitting back until everything cleared up which it seems like it has. (Please just remove those comments this thread has been very interesting for me to have been keeping up with this past little bit.)

Just waiting for the PTS to reinstall and download and then I'm off to see if the changes are as bad as they seem on (digital) paper. I find that's often been the case with nerfs but then again as a healer we've never really had nerfs like this one before so I'm quite intrigued... if anyone is able to hop on PTS atm I'd love to hear how its actually performing in game.

idk

usmcjdking wrote: »

Orb needs to be outright reworked IMO. Change is fine in concept, but there have been times where I launched an orb in the wrong *** direction and that *** ain't ever gonna get synergized.

Point target ground hot with a floating bubble would be better suited - like a big green Lord Warden ball.

If casting a new orb canceled out the first one that would take care of your concern. I wonder if it works that way on PTS. Will check.

Good point.

MehrunesFlagon

Seraphayel wrote: »

CipherNine wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

Seraphayel wrote: »

CipherNine wrote: »

maxjapank wrote: »

I do wonder how many current healers will continue to play a healer role next patch. Most of the players I see cheering about this patch are not healers. They are dps, with a large number of them stamina dps. And dps, in general, have never been interested in healing for anything. The changes they are making are quite vast. I suspect that some healers, who enjoy the current game play, will be turned off from these changes. Only time will tell. But wouldn't it be hilarious if dps begin complaining in the future about a lack of healers for pledges, pvp, and trials. Or maybe they won't. Maybe they will get their desire to 4-man or 12-man dps everything.

I am a healer and I have no interest in playing a DPS i find it boring. I don't want to tank that much either. So if they destroy the healer role and make boring and not fun to play. Then I won't be playing anymore. Especially since I don't want to play any other role

How would the healer role be less complex or more boring after that patch when healing gets more difficult and you have to do more now to achieve a similar result? By limiting Orb/Springs (ab)use to one instance at a time you have to find other ways of compensating which makes the role more and not less interesting. Relying on solely two skills to get the job done is what I call boring.

To all who will respond with “there’s more to healing than just Springs/Orb spam“ yes absolutely, there is. So why the obsession with those two skills (or at least Orbs) if there’s so much more a healer has to do? All the reactions to the Orb changes are exactly the reason it gets changed. Too much leverage on one single skill.

Are you a healer? Do you play a healer on a regular basis?

based on a lot of his posts he obviously doesn't do the harder content. because he thinks healers shouldn't be expected to keep the group buffed and help with group sustain. Which are big parts of being a healer in ESO. So I can't take any what he thinks seriously

This is a blatant lie and was put into my mouth after I said what I generally expect from a healer role in MMORPGs and not how I am healing in ESO.

No,actually it's an inference.

Jeremy

halucin0g3n wrote: »

With these changes other healer races than Templars will be refused in trials. Templars has blazing spear so they can provide more resources. Persons who made these changes i believe they never played the game.

The real problem is this game doesn't have a support class - so people look to healers and tanks to provide buffs to damage and resource regeneration instead of actual tanking and healing.

From what I've seen - these new changes are actually beneficial to healers who are not Templars.

Regeneration:

Increased the healing per tick by approximately 98%, but reduced duration to 10 seconds. It now only hits 1 ally per cast.
Increased cost to 2700 from 2160.
Rapid Regeneration (morph): This morph now doubles the frequency but halves the duration.
Alchuri Templar Healer /dps

The regen from Restoration Staff is one of the better heals available to all healers - especially after these buffs if this insert is to be believed. So from a pure healing perspective - It's hard for me to see how these changes are anything but a buff to healers generally - including the non Templar variety. Healers aren't suppose to be resource batteries anyway. They are suppose to be, well... healers.

MehrunesFlagon

Jeremy wrote: »

halucin0g3n wrote: »

With these changes other healer races than Templars will be refused in trials. Templars has blazing spear so they can provide more resources. Persons who made these changes i believe they never played the game.

The real problem is this game doesn't have a support class - so people look to healers and tanks to provide buffs to damage and resource regeneration instead of actual tanking and healing.

From what I've seen - these new changes are actually beneficial to healers who are not Templars.

Regeneration:

Increased the healing per tick by approximately 98%, but reduced duration to 10 seconds. It now only hits 1 ally per cast.
Increased cost to 2700 from 2160.
Rapid Regeneration (morph): This morph now doubles the frequency but halves the duration.
Alchuri Templar Healer /dps

The regen from Restoration Staff is one of the better heals available to all healers - especially after these buffs if this insert is to be believed. So from a pure healing perspective - It's hard for me to see how these changes are anything but a buff to healers generally - including the non Templar variety. Healers aren't suppose to be resource batteries anyway. They are suppose to be, well... healers.

In this game they are resources batteries as you put it.

Jeremy

Seraphayel wrote: »

NaranjaIslands wrote: »

Sanguinor2 wrote: »

NaranjaIslands wrote: »

This thread started out REALLY GOOD. Then people started getting emotional. I would've loved to have been able to scroll through constructive conversation about the healing changes, but instead I felt the need to skip at least 4 pages of people being dramatic. I expect this thread to get moderated, or locked soon. Hopefully just moderated.

ANYWAY - I enjoy playing as a dedicated healer to support my teammates. I will always opt to play as a healer in dungeons/ trials, and I have the most fun by supporting my team while clearing harder content. This motivation has lead me to learn so much more about the game, and has helped me increase my skill level as a player at a very reasonable pace.

To be honest, I enjoy the support aspect of playing a healer more than the actual healing itself. Don't get me wrong, I keep everyone topped off without hesitation, but if there was a separate role for support then I'd probably play that more. Instead I have 5 alts fully dedicated to healing, and I use a Templar as my main for vet dungeons/ trials.

I'm concerned about the changes to healing that the patch notes reveal, but I'm hoping that the PTS phase will tweak some things so that these changes will be much more reasonable.

Kind of off topic, but what's the likelihood of ZOS implementing a role purely geared towards being a support group member? I would have more variety as far as what roles my alts play, but I'm thinking that'll never happen. It's an interesting thought nonetheless.

They´d have to rebalance a lot of Content for a new role to be added, what are you gonna drop in 4 man for it? One dd? Or one healer? If the answer is dd then all Content Needs to be reworked, if the answer is healer why even Change something?

Yeah I agree with you. Adding a new role would need a huge overhaul, but it was just something that this conversation had me curious about.

Why would it need a huge overhaul? Just shift all of the buffs, debuffs and resource management tools from tanks/healers to a new supporting DPS role. And there you have your question as to which spot they’ll take. RIFT (another MMORPG) had this wonderful class called “Archon“ that was this support DPS.

That would actually be an easy way to fix this problem without having redesign the game. Just rename one of the DPS slots support. That way players who queue for that role can balance their character out between damage and support-oriented abilities. This is a great idea, actually.

Jeremy

MehrunesFlagon wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

halucin0g3n wrote: »

With these changes other healer races than Templars will be refused in trials. Templars has blazing spear so they can provide more resources. Persons who made these changes i believe they never played the game.

The real problem is this game doesn't have a support class - so people look to healers and tanks to provide buffs to damage and resource regeneration instead of actual tanking and healing.

From what I've seen - these new changes are actually beneficial to healers who are not Templars.

Regeneration:

Increased the healing per tick by approximately 98%, but reduced duration to 10 seconds. It now only hits 1 ally per cast.
Increased cost to 2700 from 2160.
Rapid Regeneration (morph): This morph now doubles the frequency but halves the duration.
Alchuri Templar Healer /dps

The regen from Restoration Staff is one of the better heals available to all healers - especially after these buffs if this insert is to be believed. So from a pure healing perspective - It's hard for me to see how these changes are anything but a buff to healers generally - including the non Templar variety. Healers aren't suppose to be resource batteries anyway. They are suppose to be, well... healers.

In this game they are resources batteries as you put it.

Not according to the role definition in the Activity Finder they aren't.

According to this game: a healer's job is to: Heal and protect allies, keeping them alive throughout the battle. I see nothing in that description about being a resource battery.

MehrunesFlagon

Jeremy wrote: »

Seraphayel wrote: »

NaranjaIslands wrote: »

Sanguinor2 wrote: »

NaranjaIslands wrote: »

This thread started out REALLY GOOD. Then people started getting emotional. I would've loved to have been able to scroll through constructive conversation about the healing changes, but instead I felt the need to skip at least 4 pages of people being dramatic. I expect this thread to get moderated, or locked soon. Hopefully just moderated.

ANYWAY - I enjoy playing as a dedicated healer to support my teammates. I will always opt to play as a healer in dungeons/ trials, and I have the most fun by supporting my team while clearing harder content. This motivation has lead me to learn so much more about the game, and has helped me increase my skill level as a player at a very reasonable pace.

To be honest, I enjoy the support aspect of playing a healer more than the actual healing itself. Don't get me wrong, I keep everyone topped off without hesitation, but if there was a separate role for support then I'd probably play that more. Instead I have 5 alts fully dedicated to healing, and I use a Templar as my main for vet dungeons/ trials.

I'm concerned about the changes to healing that the patch notes reveal, but I'm hoping that the PTS phase will tweak some things so that these changes will be much more reasonable.

Kind of off topic, but what's the likelihood of ZOS implementing a role purely geared towards being a support group member? I would have more variety as far as what roles my alts play, but I'm thinking that'll never happen. It's an interesting thought nonetheless.

They´d have to rebalance a lot of Content for a new role to be added, what are you gonna drop in 4 man for it? One dd? Or one healer? If the answer is dd then all Content Needs to be reworked, if the answer is healer why even Change something?

Yeah I agree with you. Adding a new role would need a huge overhaul, but it was just something that this conversation had me curious about.

Why would it need a huge overhaul? Just shift all of the buffs, debuffs and resource management tools from tanks/healers to a new supporting DPS role. And there you have your question as to which spot they’ll take. RIFT (another MMORPG) had this wonderful class called “Archon“ that was this support DPS.

That would actually be an easy way to fix this problem without having redesign the game. Just rename one of the DPS slots support. That way players who queue for that role can balance their character out between damage and support-oriented abilities. This is a great idea, actually.

Thus making it take even longer in queue because everyone wants to dps. Let's not forget about fake support roles either.you will have that to deal with.

Royaji

Jeremy wrote: »

halucin0g3n wrote: »

With these changes other healer races than Templars will be refused in trials. Templars has blazing spear so they can provide more resources. Persons who made these changes i believe they never played the game.

The real problem is this game doesn't have a support class - so people look to healers and tanks to provide buffs to damage and resource regeneration instead of actual tanking and healing.

From what I've seen - these new changes are actually beneficial to healers who are not Templars.

Regeneration:

Increased the healing per tick by approximately 98%, but reduced duration to 10 seconds. It now only hits 1 ally per cast.
Increased cost to 2700 from 2160.
Rapid Regeneration (morph): This morph now doubles the frequency but halves the duration.
Alchuri Templar Healer /dps

The regen from Restoration Staff is one of the better heals available to all healers - especially after these buffs if this insert is to be believed. So from a pure healing perspective - It's hard for me to see how these changes are anything but a buff to healers generally - including the non Templar variety. Healers aren't suppose to be resource batteries anyway. They are suppose to be, well... healers.

So you are proposing that healers should be happy about a skill that just more than doubled in cost (1 target instead of 2 + cost increase), has no reliable way of targeting and is absolutely not viable at healing a 12 man group (under perfect conditions (every cast hitting a new person) two healers will need 6 GCDs to apply Regeneration to everyone and it will have to be reapplied 4 GCDs later)?

Yep, great buffs we are talking about here...

CP5

Jeremy wrote: »

halucin0g3n wrote: »

With these changes other healer races than Templars will be refused in trials. Templars has blazing spear so they can provide more resources. Persons who made these changes i believe they never played the game.

The real problem is this game doesn't have a support class - so people look to healers and tanks to provide buffs to damage and resource regeneration instead of actual tanking and healing.

From what I've seen - these new changes are actually beneficial to healers who are not Templars.

Regeneration:

Increased the healing per tick by approximately 98%, but reduced duration to 10 seconds. It now only hits 1 ally per cast.
Increased cost to 2700 from 2160.
Rapid Regeneration (morph): This morph now doubles the frequency but halves the duration.
Alchuri Templar Healer /dps

The regen from Restoration Staff is one of the better heals available to all healers - especially after these buffs if this insert is to be believed. So from a pure healing perspective - It's hard for me to see how these changes are anything but a buff to healers generally - including the non Templar variety. Healers aren't suppose to be resource batteries anyway. They are suppose to be, well... healers.

Don't try to heal a trial with a single target heal, its a bad idea.

Jeremy

MehrunesFlagon wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

Seraphayel wrote: »

NaranjaIslands wrote: »

Sanguinor2 wrote: »

NaranjaIslands wrote: »

This thread started out REALLY GOOD. Then people started getting emotional. I would've loved to have been able to scroll through constructive conversation about the healing changes, but instead I felt the need to skip at least 4 pages of people being dramatic. I expect this thread to get moderated, or locked soon. Hopefully just moderated.

ANYWAY - I enjoy playing as a dedicated healer to support my teammates. I will always opt to play as a healer in dungeons/ trials, and I have the most fun by supporting my team while clearing harder content. This motivation has lead me to learn so much more about the game, and has helped me increase my skill level as a player at a very reasonable pace.

To be honest, I enjoy the support aspect of playing a healer more than the actual healing itself. Don't get me wrong, I keep everyone topped off without hesitation, but if there was a separate role for support then I'd probably play that more. Instead I have 5 alts fully dedicated to healing, and I use a Templar as my main for vet dungeons/ trials.

I'm concerned about the changes to healing that the patch notes reveal, but I'm hoping that the PTS phase will tweak some things so that these changes will be much more reasonable.

Kind of off topic, but what's the likelihood of ZOS implementing a role purely geared towards being a support group member? I would have more variety as far as what roles my alts play, but I'm thinking that'll never happen. It's an interesting thought nonetheless.

They´d have to rebalance a lot of Content for a new role to be added, what are you gonna drop in 4 man for it? One dd? Or one healer? If the answer is dd then all Content Needs to be reworked, if the answer is healer why even Change something?

Yeah I agree with you. Adding a new role would need a huge overhaul, but it was just something that this conversation had me curious about.

Why would it need a huge overhaul? Just shift all of the buffs, debuffs and resource management tools from tanks/healers to a new supporting DPS role. And there you have your question as to which spot they’ll take. RIFT (another MMORPG) had this wonderful class called “Archon“ that was this support DPS.

That would actually be an easy way to fix this problem without having redesign the game. Just rename one of the DPS slots support. That way players who queue for that role can balance their character out between damage and support-oriented abilities. This is a great idea, actually.

Thus making it take even longer in queue because everyone wants to dps. Let's not forget about fake support roles either.you will have that to deal with.

Allowing players to focus on support would likely alleviate the problem with fake roles - because it would give people another option that likely isn't going to be overly-crowded for players who do not like to tank or heal.

Longer queue times for DPS would probably happen. But oh well. They would just have to start considering playing support themseleves instead of expecting tanks and healers to do it for them. ^^

D0PAMINE

So I guess the Orb can be activated by everyone and not vanish when one person uses it. That alone makes my blood pressure drop a bit.

Jeremy

CP5 wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

halucin0g3n wrote: »

With these changes other healer races than Templars will be refused in trials. Templars has blazing spear so they can provide more resources. Persons who made these changes i believe they never played the game.

The real problem is this game doesn't have a support class - so people look to healers and tanks to provide buffs to damage and resource regeneration instead of actual tanking and healing.

From what I've seen - these new changes are actually beneficial to healers who are not Templars.

Regeneration:

Increased the healing per tick by approximately 98%, but reduced duration to 10 seconds. It now only hits 1 ally per cast.
Increased cost to 2700 from 2160.
Rapid Regeneration (morph): This morph now doubles the frequency but halves the duration.
Alchuri Templar Healer /dps

The regen from Restoration Staff is one of the better heals available to all healers - especially after these buffs if this insert is to be believed. So from a pure healing perspective - It's hard for me to see how these changes are anything but a buff to healers generally - including the non Templar variety. Healers aren't suppose to be resource batteries anyway. They are suppose to be, well... healers.

Don't try to heal a trial with a single target heal, its a bad idea.

I assumed the new regen could be used on multiple targets by casting it multiple times. If that is the case - it should increase it's healing capability on the group.

MehrunesFlagon

Jeremy wrote: »

MehrunesFlagon wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

halucin0g3n wrote: »

With these changes other healer races than Templars will be refused in trials. Templars has blazing spear so they can provide more resources. Persons who made these changes i believe they never played the game.

The real problem is this game doesn't have a support class - so people look to healers and tanks to provide buffs to damage and resource regeneration instead of actual tanking and healing.

From what I've seen - these new changes are actually beneficial to healers who are not Templars.

Regeneration:

Increased the healing per tick by approximately 98%, but reduced duration to 10 seconds. It now only hits 1 ally per cast.
Increased cost to 2700 from 2160.
Rapid Regeneration (morph): This morph now doubles the frequency but halves the duration.
Alchuri Templar Healer /dps

The regen from Restoration Staff is one of the better heals available to all healers - especially after these buffs if this insert is to be believed. So from a pure healing perspective - It's hard for me to see how these changes are anything but a buff to healers generally - including the non Templar variety. Healers aren't suppose to be resource batteries anyway. They are suppose to be, well... healers.

In this game they are resources batteries as you put it.

Not according to the role definition in the Activity Finder they aren't.

According to this game: a healer's job is to: Heal and protect allies, keeping them alive throughout the battle. I see nothing in that description about being a resource battery.

Don't use that load of garbage for a definition.Also health is not the only resource that needs healing.I'm afraid you were the one who coined that term.In this game with the way things work you have to learn to read between the lines.Say for example you wanted the dps to provide their own major fracture.that has alot of ways of going wrong.I imagine alot with less knowledge would use the sword and board taunt.Also with skill like elemental drain as a healer you also get some resource return from it.Same thing with orbs.If you are in a trial where there is more than one healer,you can benefir from that as well. More resources for you right.

Jeremy

Royaji wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

halucin0g3n wrote: »

With these changes other healer races than Templars will be refused in trials. Templars has blazing spear so they can provide more resources. Persons who made these changes i believe they never played the game.

The real problem is this game doesn't have a support class - so people look to healers and tanks to provide buffs to damage and resource regeneration instead of actual tanking and healing.

From what I've seen - these new changes are actually beneficial to healers who are not Templars.

Regeneration:

Increased the healing per tick by approximately 98%, but reduced duration to 10 seconds. It now only hits 1 ally per cast.
Increased cost to 2700 from 2160.
Rapid Regeneration (morph): This morph now doubles the frequency but halves the duration.
Alchuri Templar Healer /dps

The regen from Restoration Staff is one of the better heals available to all healers - especially after these buffs if this insert is to be believed. So from a pure healing perspective - It's hard for me to see how these changes are anything but a buff to healers generally - including the non Templar variety. Healers aren't suppose to be resource batteries anyway. They are suppose to be, well... healers.

So you are proposing that healers should be happy about a skill that just more than doubled in cost (1 target instead of 2 + cost increase), has no reliable way of targeting and is absolutely not viable at healing a 12 man group (under perfect conditions (every cast hitting a new person) two healers will need 6 GCDs to apply Regeneration to everyone and it will have to be reapplied 4 GCDs later)?

Yep, great buffs we are talking about here...

From what I see - yeah I would expect healers to be happy. It increases the tick by 98%, I would gladly take having to cast an ability twice for double the potency. After reading this change - it's actually making me think of breaking out my healer again as regeneration is one of the few heals you don't have to be staring at a person to cast on or have them stacked on top of you.

Jeremy

MehrunesFlagon wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

MehrunesFlagon wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

halucin0g3n wrote: »

With these changes other healer races than Templars will be refused in trials. Templars has blazing spear so they can provide more resources. Persons who made these changes i believe they never played the game.

The real problem is this game doesn't have a support class - so people look to healers and tanks to provide buffs to damage and resource regeneration instead of actual tanking and healing.

From what I've seen - these new changes are actually beneficial to healers who are not Templars.

Regeneration:

Increased the healing per tick by approximately 98%, but reduced duration to 10 seconds. It now only hits 1 ally per cast.
Increased cost to 2700 from 2160.
Rapid Regeneration (morph): This morph now doubles the frequency but halves the duration.
Alchuri Templar Healer /dps

The regen from Restoration Staff is one of the better heals available to all healers - especially after these buffs if this insert is to be believed. So from a pure healing perspective - It's hard for me to see how these changes are anything but a buff to healers generally - including the non Templar variety. Healers aren't suppose to be resource batteries anyway. They are suppose to be, well... healers.

In this game they are resources batteries as you put it.

Not according to the role definition in the Activity Finder they aren't.

According to this game: a healer's job is to: Heal and protect allies, keeping them alive throughout the battle. I see nothing in that description about being a resource battery.

Don't use that load of garbage for a definition.

Sorry but that's not a "load of garbage". That is how the game itself defines the job of healers. And I'll take the game's definition over your own.

CP5

Jeremy wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

halucin0g3n wrote: »

With these changes other healer races than Templars will be refused in trials. Templars has blazing spear so they can provide more resources. Persons who made these changes i believe they never played the game.

The real problem is this game doesn't have a support class - so people look to healers and tanks to provide buffs to damage and resource regeneration instead of actual tanking and healing.

From what I've seen - these new changes are actually beneficial to healers who are not Templars.

Regeneration:

Increased the healing per tick by approximately 98%, but reduced duration to 10 seconds. It now only hits 1 ally per cast.
Increased cost to 2700 from 2160.
Rapid Regeneration (morph): This morph now doubles the frequency but halves the duration.
Alchuri Templar Healer /dps

The regen from Restoration Staff is one of the better heals available to all healers - especially after these buffs if this insert is to be believed. So from a pure healing perspective - It's hard for me to see how these changes are anything but a buff to healers generally - including the non Templar variety. Healers aren't suppose to be resource batteries anyway. They are suppose to be, well... healers.

Don't try to heal a trial with a single target heal, its a bad idea.

I assumed the new regen could be used on multiple targets by casting it multiple times. If that is the case - it should increase it's healing capability on the group.

Either you're using the 5s duration morph, which if you cast non stop, will only heal 5 people at one time. 10 people at a time for the 10s morph but that means you're doing nothing but spamming it. If the skill still hit 2 people per cast the time invested would be half but it's too clunky of a skill for any trial group to use on the norm.

Jeremy

CP5 wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

halucin0g3n wrote: »

With these changes other healer races than Templars will be refused in trials. Templars has blazing spear so they can provide more resources. Persons who made these changes i believe they never played the game.

The real problem is this game doesn't have a support class - so people look to healers and tanks to provide buffs to damage and resource regeneration instead of actual tanking and healing.

From what I've seen - these new changes are actually beneficial to healers who are not Templars.

Regeneration:

Increased the healing per tick by approximately 98%, but reduced duration to 10 seconds. It now only hits 1 ally per cast.
Increased cost to 2700 from 2160.
Rapid Regeneration (morph): This morph now doubles the frequency but halves the duration.
Alchuri Templar Healer /dps

The regen from Restoration Staff is one of the better heals available to all healers - especially after these buffs if this insert is to be believed. So from a pure healing perspective - It's hard for me to see how these changes are anything but a buff to healers generally - including the non Templar variety. Healers aren't suppose to be resource batteries anyway. They are suppose to be, well... healers.

Don't try to heal a trial with a single target heal, its a bad idea.

I assumed the new regen could be used on multiple targets by casting it multiple times. If that is the case - it should increase it's healing capability on the group.

Either you're using the 5s duration morph, which if you cast non stop, will only heal 5 people at one time. 10 people at a time for the 10s morph but that means you're doing nothing but spamming it. If the skill still hit 2 people per cast the time invested would be half but it's too clunky of a skill for any trial group to use on the norm.

Maybe for trials it won't be as good since there are more targets. But for your standard group of 4 this is a very nice change in my opinion. it gives players who use a restoration staff a powerful regen that might actually be able to keep someone alive through significant damage without having to rely on clumsy frontal healing spells or begging them to stack around you.

Royaji

Jeremy wrote: »

Royaji wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

halucin0g3n wrote: »

With these changes other healer races than Templars will be refused in trials. Templars has blazing spear so they can provide more resources. Persons who made these changes i believe they never played the game.

The real problem is this game doesn't have a support class - so people look to healers and tanks to provide buffs to damage and resource regeneration instead of actual tanking and healing.

From what I've seen - these new changes are actually beneficial to healers who are not Templars.

Regeneration:

Increased the healing per tick by approximately 98%, but reduced duration to 10 seconds. It now only hits 1 ally per cast.
Increased cost to 2700 from 2160.
Rapid Regeneration (morph): This morph now doubles the frequency but halves the duration.
Alchuri Templar Healer /dps

The regen from Restoration Staff is one of the better heals available to all healers - especially after these buffs if this insert is to be believed. So from a pure healing perspective - It's hard for me to see how these changes are anything but a buff to healers generally - including the non Templar variety. Healers aren't suppose to be resource batteries anyway. They are suppose to be, well... healers.

So you are proposing that healers should be happy about a skill that just more than doubled in cost (1 target instead of 2 + cost increase), has no reliable way of targeting and is absolutely not viable at healing a 12 man group (under perfect conditions (every cast hitting a new person) two healers will need 6 GCDs to apply Regeneration to everyone and it will have to be reapplied 4 GCDs later)?

Yep, great buffs we are talking about here...

From what I see - yeah I would expect healers to be happy. It increases the tick by 98%, I would gladly take having to cast an ability twice for double the potency. After reading this change - it's actually making me think of breaking out my healer again as regeneration is one of the few heals you don't have to be staring at a person to cast on or have them stacked on top of you.

They also cut the duration in half. And I'm still waiting for you to explain how is Regeneration such a buff in a 12 man... Healing 4 mans is not hard and is not even required in most cases.

Vajrak

DPS support exists --- Magcro, Magden, and Templars.

Jeremy

Royaji wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

Royaji wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

halucin0g3n wrote: »

With these changes other healer races than Templars will be refused in trials. Templars has blazing spear so they can provide more resources. Persons who made these changes i believe they never played the game.

The real problem is this game doesn't have a support class - so people look to healers and tanks to provide buffs to damage and resource regeneration instead of actual tanking and healing.

From what I've seen - these new changes are actually beneficial to healers who are not Templars.

Regeneration:

Increased the healing per tick by approximately 98%, but reduced duration to 10 seconds. It now only hits 1 ally per cast.
Increased cost to 2700 from 2160.
Rapid Regeneration (morph): This morph now doubles the frequency but halves the duration.
Alchuri Templar Healer /dps

The regen from Restoration Staff is one of the better heals available to all healers - especially after these buffs if this insert is to be believed. So from a pure healing perspective - It's hard for me to see how these changes are anything but a buff to healers generally - including the non Templar variety. Healers aren't suppose to be resource batteries anyway. They are suppose to be, well... healers.

So you are proposing that healers should be happy about a skill that just more than doubled in cost (1 target instead of 2 + cost increase), has no reliable way of targeting and is absolutely not viable at healing a 12 man group (under perfect conditions (every cast hitting a new person) two healers will need 6 GCDs to apply Regeneration to everyone and it will have to be reapplied 4 GCDs later)?

Yep, great buffs we are talking about here...

From what I see - yeah I would expect healers to be happy. It increases the tick by 98%, I would gladly take having to cast an ability twice for double the potency. After reading this change - it's actually making me think of breaking out my healer again as regeneration is one of the few heals you don't have to be staring at a person to cast on or have them stacked on top of you.

They also cut the duration in half. And I'm still waiting for you to explain how is Regeneration such a buff in a 12 man... Healing 4 mans is not hard and is not even required in most cases.

My comments aren't limited to trials. And if you think healing 4 mans is easy - you obviously do not pug very often.

But even in trials, I would expect the new regen capable of more healing now. 98% is a huge buff.

Royaji

Jeremy wrote: »

Royaji wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

Royaji wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

halucin0g3n wrote: »

With these changes other healer races than Templars will be refused in trials. Templars has blazing spear so they can provide more resources. Persons who made these changes i believe they never played the game.

The real problem is this game doesn't have a support class - so people look to healers and tanks to provide buffs to damage and resource regeneration instead of actual tanking and healing.

From what I've seen - these new changes are actually beneficial to healers who are not Templars.

Regeneration:

Increased the healing per tick by approximately 98%, but reduced duration to 10 seconds. It now only hits 1 ally per cast.
Increased cost to 2700 from 2160.
Rapid Regeneration (morph): This morph now doubles the frequency but halves the duration.
Alchuri Templar Healer /dps

The regen from Restoration Staff is one of the better heals available to all healers - especially after these buffs if this insert is to be believed. So from a pure healing perspective - It's hard for me to see how these changes are anything but a buff to healers generally - including the non Templar variety. Healers aren't suppose to be resource batteries anyway. They are suppose to be, well... healers.

So you are proposing that healers should be happy about a skill that just more than doubled in cost (1 target instead of 2 + cost increase), has no reliable way of targeting and is absolutely not viable at healing a 12 man group (under perfect conditions (every cast hitting a new person) two healers will need 6 GCDs to apply Regeneration to everyone and it will have to be reapplied 4 GCDs later)?

Yep, great buffs we are talking about here...

From what I see - yeah I would expect healers to be happy. It increases the tick by 98%, I would gladly take having to cast an ability twice for double the potency. After reading this change - it's actually making me think of breaking out my healer again as regeneration is one of the few heals you don't have to be staring at a person to cast on or have them stacked on top of you.

They also cut the duration in half. And I'm still waiting for you to explain how is Regeneration such a buff in a 12 man... Healing 4 mans is not hard and is not even required in most cases.

My comments aren't limited to trials.

But even in trials, I would expect the nrew regen capable of more healing now. 98% is a huge buff.

And the problem in this thread is limited to trials... Healing four people in a situation where healing is not even needed (1 tank/3 DD will be even more potent next patch) is not hard. Healing twelve people through a serious healcheck is a problem. And you might not be aware, but damage in trials does not happen on a one by one basis. All twelve players take heavy damage simultaneously and single target HoTs will do jacksh*t to save your group there.

Jeremy

Royaji wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

Royaji wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

Royaji wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

halucin0g3n wrote: »

With these changes other healer races than Templars will be refused in trials. Templars has blazing spear so they can provide more resources. Persons who made these changes i believe they never played the game.

The real problem is this game doesn't have a support class - so people look to healers and tanks to provide buffs to damage and resource regeneration instead of actual tanking and healing.

From what I've seen - these new changes are actually beneficial to healers who are not Templars.

Regeneration:

Increased the healing per tick by approximately 98%, but reduced duration to 10 seconds. It now only hits 1 ally per cast.
Increased cost to 2700 from 2160.
Rapid Regeneration (morph): This morph now doubles the frequency but halves the duration.
Alchuri Templar Healer /dps

The regen from Restoration Staff is one of the better heals available to all healers - especially after these buffs if this insert is to be believed. So from a pure healing perspective - It's hard for me to see how these changes are anything but a buff to healers generally - including the non Templar variety. Healers aren't suppose to be resource batteries anyway. They are suppose to be, well... healers.

So you are proposing that healers should be happy about a skill that just more than doubled in cost (1 target instead of 2 + cost increase), has no reliable way of targeting and is absolutely not viable at healing a 12 man group (under perfect conditions (every cast hitting a new person) two healers will need 6 GCDs to apply Regeneration to everyone and it will have to be reapplied 4 GCDs later)?

Yep, great buffs we are talking about here...

From what I see - yeah I would expect healers to be happy. It increases the tick by 98%, I would gladly take having to cast an ability twice for double the potency. After reading this change - it's actually making me think of breaking out my healer again as regeneration is one of the few heals you don't have to be staring at a person to cast on or have them stacked on top of you.

They also cut the duration in half. And I'm still waiting for you to explain how is Regeneration such a buff in a 12 man... Healing 4 mans is not hard and is not even required in most cases.

My comments aren't limited to trials.

But even in trials, I would expect the nrew regen capable of more healing now. 98% is a huge buff.

And the problem in this thread is limited to trials... Healing four people in a situation where healing is not even needed (1 tank/3 DD will be even more potent next patch) is not hard. Healing twelve people through a serious healcheck is a problem. And you might not be aware, but damage in trials does not happen on a one by one basis. All twelve players take heavy damage simultaneously and single target HoTs will do jacksh*t to save your group there.

This thread is about the changes to healing. NO where in the OP did it say this conversation was only about veteran trials. Not every comment I make has to be about what you want to talk about.

Though even in a trial situation - I would still imagine this new regen would outperform the old. So it's a moot point anyway. And you might not be aware, but damage doesn't happen on a one by one basis in a lot of 4 mans either.