Elsweyr Healer changes (Informational)

OneKhajiitCrimeWave

The change to Mend Wounds and by extension Symbiosis means I may have to retest it on my DK healer (Olorime's and Elegant with Bogdan) As the buffs to light and heavies should more effectively carry over than before.

Definitely gives me something to think about overall.

Baltharuch

Competitively this doesn't really change much, it's mostly quality of life changes imo. PoTL being on a 9 second duration is an amazing templar healer change and makes it much much easier to keep up. DKs still don't have a synergy but perform and offer the group comp everything perfectly as a tank. Sorcs will still use warhorn/atro and be there just for their synergy. Minor Vulnerability is easy as hell to apply as a healer so nightblades having it built-in on a useless-in-pve skill is well... useless.

Mend Spirits is still gunna be awkward as hell to use and I'm assuming it will not proc enchants OR ult charge as normal light attacks vs a boss do so you'd essentially be gimping yourself. Imagine doing a rotation like Ele drain > la on ally > blockade > la on ally> bar swap > springs etc. You'd be jumping your screen to look at the boss to debuff, an ally to la, the floor for olorime/springs placement, another ally somewhere to la, the boss to reapply dots etc. Your screen would be all over the place especially on console and you'd have to do all that while avoiding mechanics to use mend spirits fully.

Earthgore rewards bad players by providing a free get out of jail card for the entire group every proc. I see alot of healers have their constant mistakes fixed by it and I'll be glad to finally see people learn how to heal/support without being carried by the set. I'm seriously questioning some groups on my server on being able to clear harder content without that earthgore carry now.

Oumalakasha

Tasear wrote: »

😓 missed more...

Undocumented Change -Funnel health heals 2 allies now

Nice catch. Interesting change.

Kingslayer513

SirMewser wrote: »

Idk why you guys are calling Tasear a liar and giving her a hard time.

You either believe her word or not, the change is new, but she isn't and has always represented a voice for the healer community.

If you're so skeptical, go download the pts and try it for yourself.
It hasn't even been up for more than a day yet and you guys are demanding people to do crap for you, sheesh. Pricks.

Quit white knighting. It's an intriguing claim and we are merely asking if it's been tested or just based on interpretation of the patch notes. You can get off your high horse now.

psychotic13

Whats BiS monster set for PvE now then? Bogdan? Or something else?

Valkysas154

Mend Wounds i really want to use this skill but there is 1 major draw back and that's not being able to regen with heavy attacks so it will stay as a useless skill to me

ectoplasmicninja

Valkysas154 wrote: »

Mend Wounds i really want to use this skill but there is 1 major draw back and that's not being able to regen with heavy attacks so it will stay as a useless skill to me

Heavy attacks with Mend Wounds do restore resources now.

SirMewser

Kingslayer513 wrote: »

SirMewser wrote: »

Idk why you guys are calling Tasear a liar and giving her a hard time.

You either believe her word or not, the change is new, but she isn't and has always represented a voice for the healer community.

If you're so skeptical, go download the pts and try it for yourself.
It hasn't even been up for more than a day yet and you guys are demanding people to do crap for you, sheesh. Pricks.

Quit white knighting. It's an intriguing claim and we are merely asking if it's been tested or just based on interpretation of the patch notes. You can get off your high horse now.

Not sure if white knight is a ***, sexism, an unwanted 'hero' (pervert), or just nerd humor but...

I prefer men.

No, she was on pts, she didn't pull this out of her arse too.

"Undocumented Change -Funnel health heals 2 allies now"

It's no one's fault when you can't put two things together, neither does that justify being mean because it wasn't more obvious.

Not to be rude black knight, but you can get off your horse. You'll be closer to
hell, so make yourself feel right at home.

Thraben

People will probably be dissappointed when they realize that Necro healers` many skill options lack potency.

They were built up for a "purge bot" role in PvP, but to be honest, I´d still rather have a MagSorc for that.

I think particularly the healing tether is not nearly strong enough to motivate people to actually use it. And the ghost´s heal is just too low compared to Chokethorn, Matriarch or ... anything really - even when buffed by 40%.

Tasear

Baltharuch wrote: »

Competitively this doesn't really change much, it's mostly quality of life changes imo. PoTL being on a 9 second duration is an amazing templar healer change and makes it much much easier to keep up. DKs still don't have a synergy but perform and offer the group comp everything perfectly as a tank. Sorcs will still use warhorn/atro and be there just for their synergy. Minor Vulnerability is easy as hell to apply as a healer so nightblades having it built-in on a useless-in-pve skill is well... useless.

Mend Spirits is still gunna be awkward as hell to use and I'm assuming it will not proc enchants OR ult charge as normal light attacks vs a boss do so you'd essentially be gimping yourself. Imagine doing a rotation like Ele drain > la on ally > blockade > la on ally> bar swap > springs etc. You'd be jumping your screen to look at the boss to debuff, an ally to la, the floor for olorime/springs placement, another ally somewhere to la, the boss to reapply dots etc. Your screen would be all over the place especially on console and you'd have to do all that while avoiding mechanics to use mend spirits fully.

Earthgore rewards bad players by providing a free get out of jail card for the entire group every proc. I see alot of healers have their constant mistakes fixed by it and I'll be glad to finally see people learn how to heal/support without being carried by the set. I'm seriously questioning some groups on my server on being able to clear harder content without that earthgore carry now.

I thought about that. If we are speaking competitively necro tank can use it's own synergy, so only need orbs per tradition for alkoash. Still I agree dragon knights aren't in a good place, but nightblade utility offers enough that if someone wanted to they could surely convince a group of it's competiveness now.

Tasear

Talking about my experience with necro.

Visual are so much fun and I can actually seen a lot of them used in gameplay unlike cough warden.

Gameplay wise currently the corpse mechic doesn't work really well for healers. In particalar I belive skil is called renewing dead. I just don't see how you can move away from a corpse and use as a mechic to heal people with only 3 sec on corpses. I can feel the gameplay sytle and it can be fun, but I don't think most people will take advantage of it..


Tooltip for aoe heal that removes negate effects was hard to understand actually. Turns out it works like earthgore in removing 3 negate effects in it's aoe range. This is similar but different from Templar healers.

I think best part of the class though is bars can feel very full with just class skills but skill can use the typical setups.

......

Tasear

My analysis of Elsweyer and future of healers is as such. Necro, Warden, Templar, and Sorc will be picks for end game healers, though sorc for all wrong reasons in pve. Necro and Warden, or Templar and Warden will be powerful healer combinations to take in trials. I say this because major maim and protection on 12 people each. Sorc will be weird but once people see the light with negate it won't be strange skill lacking in some ascepts but defiantly will be able to wierdly compete. Nightblade I think is on the right track but falls slightly sort for the top pack.



Funnel health now that it only heals, I think really heal 3 allies instead of 2. This is a fair if you could healing ritual on Templar can only do 3 allies per second too. So it could give interesting alternative. I would like to complain about path's raidus, but another time

Instead of increasing the heal of ash cloud and such cinder storm why not give allies who walk in it minor vitality or apply it to a synergy. Also cinder storm antimation really sucks for thinking of the cinder from volcano... but another time.

@ZOS_RobGarrett please look at this for nightblade healers and dk healers. It's same ideas but small changes to way it's designed could could significantly improve game play and identity for these two healers.


P.S since you are touching issue with sorc shields mind looking at how warden gives same minor buff but heals, and gives magicka stamina regain... How does it make sense for Sorc (magic default class) to do less.. Consider letting Sorc class have major intellect instead of minor like warden.

@ZOS_BrianWheeler please consider

Tasear

found something else

Toppling Charge (morph): Fixed an issue where this ability and the Explosive Charge morph could not be CC broken until the stagger completed if you were interrupted by the ability. This ability and its morphs will now always apply Off Balance to the target, rather than requiring them to be interrupted, since targets were automatically set Off Balance if interrupted anyway.

This gives alternative especially for tanks especially off balance and interrupt, but on same token can be used on healers if they want.

Thraben

Has anyone found a use of the new Mend Wounds light attack? The Heavy one is great, but the light one is somewhat... pointless, even as warden, or with empower: It does the same thing as the channel, but worse.

Maybe they should give it back its HoT, or make it 5m AoE... or something.

Tasear

Thraben wrote: »

Has anyone found a use of the new Mend Wounds light attack? The Heavy one is great, but the light one is somewhat... pointless, even as warden, or with empower: It does the same thing as the channel, but worse.

Maybe they should give it back its HoT, or make it 5m AoE... or something.

If you are really good at tab targeting can use it as a burst heal on allies. It's fun in battlegrounds and cydrolli where you have more change to react and use the skill.

Namarkas

Tested Mend wounds, and it still doesn't charge ultimate -> will stick to not using it.
Unquestionably better than before though

Tasear

Namarkas wrote: »

Tested Mend wounds, and it still doesn't charge ultimate -> will stick to not using it.
Unquestionably better than before though

That sounds more like a bug. I never personally noticed cause it does charge ultimate when using shalks.

Namarkas

Tasear wrote: »

Namarkas wrote: »

Tested Mend wounds, and it still doesn't charge ultimate -> will stick to not using it.
Unquestionably better than before though

That sounds more like a bug. I never personally noticed cause it does charge ultimate when using shalks.

Shalks themselves trigger the warden passive that generates ultimate. I mean the generation that get's triggered by light attacks/roll dodge and the like on any class

Nightingale707

Mend wounds will not proc your enchantment and not regen ultimate since you do not hit an enemy... with makes it totally useless...
As long as it is not something like "your light and heavy attacks against enemies deal only xx% of their usualy damage and additionally heal and ally for xx health" the skills is not useable for healers imo

Tasear

Namarkas wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

Namarkas wrote: »

Tested Mend wounds, and it still doesn't charge ultimate -> will stick to not using it.
Unquestionably better than before though

That sounds more like a bug. I never personally noticed cause it does charge ultimate when using shalks.

Shalks themselves trigger the warden passive that generates ultimate. I mean the generation that get's triggered by light attacks/roll dodge and the like on any class

Shalks the set.

Oumalakasha

Yeah I am very happy with how they changed Mend Wounds but think they need to work more on how it interacts more with enchants, ultimate generation, and other light/heavy attack-based interactions. For example, I do not get major mending while heavy attacking on my resto bar or with Wisdom of Vanus equipped. Oddly enough, the heavy attack seems to proc the heavy attack Lotus Blossom heal every second. Perhaps it could register heavy attack-based procs to be every 2-3 hits or after x amount of time while channeling.
I could see it being problematic for enchants, so even something like a flat increased healing done while the skill is active would be a makeshift way of making up for this.

Namarkas

Tasear wrote: »

Namarkas wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

Namarkas wrote: »

Tested Mend wounds, and it still doesn't charge ultimate -> will stick to not using it.
Unquestionably better than before though

That sounds more like a bug. I never personally noticed cause it does charge ultimate when using shalks.

Shalks themselves trigger the warden passive that generates ultimate. I mean the generation that get's triggered by light attacks/roll dodge and the like on any class

Shalks the set.

Ah I see, but Shalks is only minor heroism. It can stack with the "light attack" regen, which is 3 ult/s, vs 1/1.5 ult/s

Tasear

Oumalakasha wrote: »

Yeah I am very happy with how they changed Mend Wounds but think they need to work more on how it interacts more with enchants, ultimate generation, and other light/heavy attack-based interactions. For example, I do not get major mending while heavy attacking on my resto bar or with Wisdom of Vanus equipped. Oddly enough, the heavy attack seems to proc the heavy attack Lotus Blossom heal every second. Perhaps it could register heavy attack-based procs to be every 2-3 hits or after x amount of time while channeling.
I could see it being problematic for enchants, so even something like a flat increased healing done while the skill is active would be a makeshift way of making up for this.

Would be really nice if this worked with overload again. 😢

Iskiab

Oumalakasha wrote: »

Yeah I am very happy with how they changed Mend Wounds but think they need to work more on how it interacts more with enchants, ultimate generation, and other light/heavy attack-based interactions. For example, I do not get major mending while heavy attacking on my resto bar or with Wisdom of Vanus equipped. Oddly enough, the heavy attack seems to proc the heavy attack Lotus Blossom heal every second. Perhaps it could register heavy attack-based procs to be every 2-3 hits or after x amount of time while channeling.
I could see it being problematic for enchants, so even something like a flat increased healing done while the skill is active would be a makeshift way of making up for this.

I’ve been meaning to test it but haven’t gotten around to it. Do your light attacks have to be targeted on your ally? I’m thinking pvp applications and typically target opponents rather then allies.

Namarkas

I am sorry to be the bearer of this news, but negate did not become a gamechanger. I was just on the pts on normal asylum. Result:
Wrecked by breath in a negate
Wrecked by Storm of the heavens in a negate
Damaged by a lightning field in a negate
Damaged by the cone in a negate
#feelsbadman

Oumalakasha

Iskiab wrote: »

Oumalakasha wrote: »

Yeah I am very happy with how they changed Mend Wounds but think they need to work more on how it interacts more with enchants, ultimate generation, and other light/heavy attack-based interactions. For example, I do not get major mending while heavy attacking on my resto bar or with Wisdom of Vanus equipped. Oddly enough, the heavy attack seems to proc the heavy attack Lotus Blossom heal every second. Perhaps it could register heavy attack-based procs to be every 2-3 hits or after x amount of time while channeling.
I could see it being problematic for enchants, so even something like a flat increased healing done while the skill is active would be a makeshift way of making up for this.

I’ve been meaning to test it but haven’t gotten around to it. Do your light attacks have to be targeted on your ally? I’m thinking pvp applications and typically target opponents rather then allies.

Your light attacks with Mend Wounds? Yes as far as I understand, the ally you hit with the LA/HA is always the one will will be affected. You cannot LA/HA enemies while you have it active but you can still use other skills normally.
If you are referring to its interaction with Lotus Blossom, the LB proc will still maintain its smart target functionality. When I was playing with it yesterday, I was spamming LA/HA on people and while all at full health, LB would sometimes heal me, sometimes the target, and sometimes a random ally, so it functioned independently of Mend Wounds. However it is a bit hard to thoroughly test stuff when it's just based on testing on naked players at the Elsewyr spawn point.

Tasear

Namarkas wrote: »

I am sorry to be the bearer of this news, but negate did not become a gamechanger. I was just on the pts on normal asylum. Result:
Wrecked by breath in a negate
Wrecked by Storm of the heavens in a negate
Damaged by a lightning field in a negate
Damaged by the cone in a negate
#feelsbadman

Then it sounds bugged...

Namarkas

Tasear wrote: »

Namarkas wrote: »

I am sorry to be the bearer of this news, but negate did not become a gamechanger. I was just on the pts on normal asylum. Result:
Wrecked by breath in a negate
Wrecked by Storm of the heavens in a negate
Damaged by a lightning field in a negate
Damaged by the cone in a negate
#feelsbadman

Then it sounds bugged...

tbh I would have also interpreted the Negate "fix" as something rather specifc, and ZOS not telling what actually was fixed. Like "Tommy reported 2 months ago that when an enemy player uses /playdead in his negate he can cast ground abilites. This was now fixed". Something of that sort, not "Negate now cancels all ground effects whatsoever for its whole duration"

edit: Negate Magic:
Fixed an issue where this ability would fail to continue suppressing Area of Effect abilities inside of the area.
"An issue" can mean "a general issue" or "a specific issue".

Tasear

Namarkas wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

Namarkas wrote: »

I am sorry to be the bearer of this news, but negate did not become a gamechanger. I was just on the pts on normal asylum. Result:
Wrecked by breath in a negate
Wrecked by Storm of the heavens in a negate
Damaged by a lightning field in a negate
Damaged by the cone in a negate
#feelsbadman

Then it sounds bugged...

tbh I would have also interpreted the Negate "fix" as something rather specifc, and ZOS not telling what actually was fixed. Like "Tommy reported 2 months ago that when an enemy player uses /playdead in his negate he can cast ground abilites. This was now fixed". Something of that sort, not "Negate now cancels all ground effects whatsoever for its whole duration"

It worded as it continues to cancel aoe ground effects. Like at very least I except to negate fires in elden hollow 2 in a negate bubble.

phantasmalD

Nightingale707 wrote: »

Mend wounds will not proc your enchantment and not regen ultimate since you do not hit an enemy... with makes it totally useless...
As long as it is not something like "your light and heavy attacks against enemies deal only xx% of their usualy damage and additionally heal and ally for xx health" the skills is not useable for healers imo

You do know that the skill can be toggled off, right? By activating the skill you turn back to 'normal mode' and can attack like normal.