Racial PvE, PvP Feedback and some Recommended Changes using Test Data(Previously Performed)

susmitds

Greetings,

I spent a significant part of the last few days testing 650+ PvE DPS parses across races and class with guild mates, collecting data samples and then analyzing the raw data into comparable formats and finally presented the data into an easy to read format here -> https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/455092/raid-buffed-dps-comparison-of-each-race-by-class-tests-graphs-interpretation-and-final-score/p1
During this testing, I learn certain things about the races, which is more subjective in nature, rather than objective. I will give some details of this subjective data below.
For PvP, it is not that straight forward, as it is not finitely possible to test data objectively, without having access to wide-spread balance information. However, given certain constraints and known tendencies, we can closely approximate the efficiency of particular races in particular builds and overall PvP performance.
I present my feedback on a par race basis down below.

Altmer

PvE - They are very effective as Magicka DPS. Sustain is similar to Live and feels okayish. Needs some sustain support for best performance.

PvP - Max stat builds got nerfed, more spell damage means that magic damage using builds got buffed. Max recovery builds got nerfed.

Suggested Changes - None, even though I initially thought, they are OP, after testing, I would say they are very balanced.

Bosmer

PvE - That sustain boost feels real good. Of all stamina races, they feel most natural to execute rotations with. This shows on how high consistent parses are. They might just eclipse Redguard on any build that does not use Weapon spammables by a neglible difference.

PvP - They are buffed significantly in PvP too, sustain wise. Though Stealthy passive loss is regrettable, the new roll bonus speed is times more powerful, for every playstyle, even stealthy ones. It is so good that it even might require adjustment. Bosmer, dodging with bow in Stealth, sneaks faster than running. Looks like, finally AD has an answer for a true Brawler race.

Suggested Changes - None.

Khajiit

PvE - They are rather good damage dealers across most roles with two major flaws, which can even be considered deal breakers for a good number of players. These are poor sustain and extremely bad consistentency/very high variance for every role. This can be understood easily by studying the line graphs in the data sample above. These two issues compound each other. I will explain further below.

The characteristics of this race is the lowest static damage increase stats(Max Stamina/Magicka, Weapon/Spell Damage) even lesser than non-DD races. They are literally carried by their critical chance of 8%, which is huge but entirely luck based. Base sustain is rather poor, compared to every other race. Adding more sustain will come at the cost of further drop of raw damage, which is not really preferable for a race, lacking static damage multipliers.

This can cause major shifts in raid DPS, depending on crit rate of hard hitting abilities in burn phases. This can seen very prominently in the tests. Tn some cases, the initial two Major Force burn phases, resonated perfectly with the crits, DPS stayed high, and I went with low resource strain to the final burn and execute phases. Some cases, the opposite happened causing the initial phases to last stages, forcing a heavy attack in the worst possible time of Major Force execution phase, which is a huge DPS loss. There is where a negative spiral can start, where the worse your sustain, the lesser your DPS gets, further straining sustain and the cycle continues. This is why, Khajiit is going to be a generally very unforgiving race to play with.

For e.g, getting a 50k Bow Proc and 5 back to back 55k+ Killer's Blade during the final Major Force buffed execution phases is an incredible boost to DPS. There is also the chance of opposite with a heavy attack, non crit Bow proc and non-crit executes, wrecking the DPS results. Unlike Dunmer, Orc, Bosmer, Redguard or even Imperial, the only static damage increase passive for Khajiit Stamblade is 750 Stamina, which is significantly lesser than 2000 stamina or 250 weapon damage or both. This alone cannot make up for RNGesus failing me.

This instability will skew more towards the lower side of the spectrum for most players, that realistically can not execute perfect rotations for whatever the reason. For higher end players, classes like Dunmer and Orc may be more appealing, as they tends to get similar high parses as the Khajiit, without the low parses due to their static damage increase. Only real solution to somewhat stabilize their DPS, while keeping their overall critical nature intact is to slightly fix their sustain. Essentially, PvE wise, Khajiit are unstable Dunmer with more unforgivable rotations and that is not a really good thing for the race's viability.

PvP - In PvP, they are literally inferior versions of Dunmer. The primary reason is that, their strongest passive(8% crit) is nullified by the rampant amount of crit resist, most players use. The average PvPer runs anything between 2500 to 4000 crit resist, virtually making that passive useless while Dunmer's Weapon/Spell damage shines here as well. Their resources are lesser than that of Dunmer. Their 5m sneak reduction passive is inferior to Flame Resist and Burning Immunity. Their new tri-stat recovery is a shadow of its previous self for PvP builds. This causes Khajiit to be one of the weakest PvP races, lacking an identity.
Also, from @Left4Daud 's tests, https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/455172/a-visual-of-khajiits-new-stealth-capability-stacking-is-quite-extreme/p1, it is shown that the new Stealth passive allows Khajiits to buff Sneak to true Invisibility levels, which means Sneak does not break at all, even when face to face with an enemy. This is massively abusable if left in the game in this state. Changing this passive to the Previous 3m sneak reduction with some additional stealth features might be great.

Suggested Changes
Robustness - 150 Stamina/150 Magicka Recovery. The Health recovery of 100 is virtually useless in every single build in the game.
Feline Ambush - 8% Weapon/Spell Critical Hit Chance. Decreases your sneak radius by 3m and increases your speed when hidden by 12%. This would give Khajiit a proper identity(Stealth mobility unit)

Breton

PvE - They are the smoothest magicka DPS. Sustain is the greatest of any race in the game. Can go fully glass cannon in PvE, with minimal group support.

PvP - Max stat builds got nerfed, however their sustain might allow going fully glass cannon. Their natural defense should be handy as well.

Suggested Changes - None.

Redguard

PvE - They have the highest sustain of all stamina races, higher than Bosmer. However, their sustain is primarily conditional and will drop considerably in real fights, while Bosmer's sustain is unconditional. They synergize with builds using weapon spammables the best. Their weapon cost reduction passive affects ultimates as well. They are great tanks as well for the conditional sustain.

The redguard passive still gives really higher Stamina return alone than the Bosmer regen, without even considering the reduction passive. Yes, this will fall in values in fights with breaks, but essentially the difference between Bosmer and Redguard is hard to feel in PvE. The sustain for both, is good enough to hold out for PvE basically. The ultimate reduction for Ballista will even it in real fights.

PvP - Essentially they are Bosmer without the Speed buff and with Weapon skill sustain instead. Should do good for Stamsorcs and StamDKs.

PvP wise, however, the conditional sustain will be great for builds which use Blocking as primary defense, far better than Bosmer in regards. From what I feel, ZOS balanced Bosmer vs Redguard from a PvP standpoint, where Bosmer is better for Hit and Run builds, while Redguard is better for hold your ground builds.

Suggested Changes - None.

Orc

PvE - Great for most stamina DPS tests. Tends to come out to top of other races for most classes. Their sustain, when weapon skills are prioritized is good and decreases need for any group sustain.

PvP - Used to the one of the best PvP stamina races. If anything, they are just going to get better. Possibly the best PvP stamina race.

Suggested Changes - None.

Nord

PvE - Performly fairly well for most stamina races, synergizing further with StamDK with their Ult generation passive. Same passive made them indisputablely winners in the PvE tank category. Possibly great race for healers as well now.

PvP - That ultimate generation can be built around for a great number of builds. Easily, one of the best Stamina PvP races, this time.

Suggested Changes - None.

Argonian

PvE - Performly fairly well for most magicka races, as well certain stamina races. High tri-stat recovery makes them still the best sustain tank in the game. They make great healers too.

PvP - Still, should one of the best PvP races with bursty tri-stat sustain.

Suggested Changes - None.

Dunmer

PvE - They perform incredibly well in raids, having the highest buffed stamina DPS numbers almost across the board, while maintaining great magicka DPS numbers as well. This is weird, considering they are a hybrid race. Their natural sustain is low but they have the highest static DPS increase in the stamina side, which allows group sustain help reach high parses, without losing out much on consistency. Essentially, a less random version of Khajiit.

PvP - They should be very good for all PvP builds, with their massive resource stack and raw damage bonus.

Suggested Changes
Dynamic - 2000 Magicka. This should allow them to be at least, not inferior to Altmer for every aspect of magicka DPS, theoritically at the cost of stamina.
Resist Flame - 650 stamina, 2310 Flame Resist and Burning Immunity. This would keep them as a great contender for stamina DPS, while also not making them superior to pure stamina DPS races.
They would have the theoretical highest raw numbers for both sides without the sustain, showing their lore wise destructive nature.
Further info below.

Realistically, it would not change anything. What it would do however, is mathematically balance the race better. I mean, Dunmer was topping pretty much every stamina DPS charts by a hair, being a hybrid race on PTS and magicka race on live. 500 lesser stamina is unnoticeable. However, it would do justice to majority of the dunmer players in the game, who use magicka characters. It matches the raw magicka damage of Altmer, which fits the lore of dunmeri folk as basically Altmer who lost their magicka restoring nature for physical prowess, still retaining their destructive nature.

If you want proof of this, it can be seen in the magicka DPS charts, where Dunmer average parses in the 60k zone are less than 200 less than that of Altmer, in spite of having 750 lesser magicka and 200 regen equivalent sustain.

Imperial

PvE - Performly fairly well for most stamina races and their health is useful for magicka characters too. They make good tanks as well. However, in the grand scheme of things, they are essentially replaceable, as somebody better exists for all roles. Nords make better PvE tanks, Argonians make better PvP tanks, Most classes beat it in Stam DPS or Mag DPS, Khajiit and Dunmer are better hybrids, Orcs and Nords make better PvP brawlers.

PvP - Their high resources are great for PvP builds in general. They should make great PvP tanks.

Suggested Changes
Red Diamond - When you deal Direct Damage you have a 15% chance to heal for 1750. When you block Direct Damage you have a 15% chance to gain 1750 Stamina. 2 sec CD. This would make them very good pure tanks for PvE and brawlers for PvP, while also displaying their lore wise weapon discipline. The CD will be there to stop it from being OP.

This is my honest feedback for the racial changes. Thanks for reading.

@ZOS_Gilliam @ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_RobGarrett @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_Finn

Joy_Division

This is excellent feedback

Minno

Joy_Division wrote: »

This is excellent feedback

agreed. well thought out!

nsmurfer

Probably the only real feedback on these forums and not baseless doomsaying

themaddaedra

That's good stuff. I honestly believe that Dunmer is perfectly good as it is, there's like zero point in trying to put it in line with Altmer, as they are already doing the best stam parses. But then again giving them a lil more magicka wouldn't shift anything badly anyway.

This just came to me while reading this, i find this Khajiit inconsistency very lore-friendly. Because they have this duality in their very nature, as in Masser and Secunda or sand and forest.

I also feel like being able to pull the best numbers should come a bit risky.

Good stuff tho.

susmitds

themaddaedra wrote: »

That's good stuff. I honestly believe that Dunmer is perfectly good as it is, there's like zero point in trying to put it in line with Altmer, as they are already doing the best stam parses. But then again giving them a lil more magicka wouldn't shift anything badly anyway.

This just came to me while reading this, i find this Khajiit inconsistency very lore-friendly. Because they have this duality in their very nature, as in Masser and Secunda or sand and forest.

I also feel like being able to pull the best numbers should come a bit risky.

Good stuff tho.

The dunmer is balanced around being good for both magicka and stamina but are leaning heavily towards the stamina side. So much, so that it is objectively better than some pure stamina races in certain situations. Pulling a bit towards the magicka side will actually balance it better in the overall picture.

As for Khajiit, the inconsistent nature will always be there. A little better sustain will give the player a bit more breathing room to deal with it. I think for the vast majority of players, the risk is not worth the gain. As, it currently stands in PTS, the Khajiit parses were the most unforgiving ones. It would also improve their overall position in PvP, where they are lacking.

Teeba_Shei

With the health stacking meta in pvp to avoid burst I feel like the changes from % scaling hp to static stats is an overall nerf.

John_Falstaff

@themaddaedra , how is duality related to inconsistency? I don't find anything lore-friendly in that, and I don't think risk should be something as gimmicky as "risk of not doing high damage", that's just silly. ^^

And it is likely stems from sustain issues, so I'll support a bump to the regen (and removal of the utterly useless health recovery bonus).

satanio

susmitds wrote: »

Imperial

PvE - Performly fairly well for most stamina races and their health is useful for magicka characters too. They make good tanks as well. However, in the grand scheme of things, they are essentially replaceable, as somebody better exists for all roles. Nords make better PvE tanks, Argonians make better PvP tanks, Most classes beat it in Stam DPS or Mag DPS, Khajiit and Dunmer are better hybrids, Orcs and Nords make better PvP brawlers.

PvP - Their high resources are great for PvP builds in general. They should make great PvP tanks.

Suggested Changes
Red Diamond - When you deal Direct Damage you have a 15% chance to heal for 1750. When you block Direct Damage you have a 15% chance to gain 1750 Stamina. 2 sec CD. This would make them very good pure tanks for PvE and brawlers for PvP, while also displaying their lore wise weapon discipline. The CD will be there to stop it from being OP.

This is my honest feedback for the racial changes. Thanks for reading.

@ZOS_Gilliam @ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_RobGarrett @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_Finn

As an IMPERIAL LIVES MATTER activist, I support this suggestion.

Spread the message, Imperial Lives Matter!

themaddaedra

John_Falstaff wrote: »

@themaddaedra , how is duality related to inconsistency? I don't find anything lore-friendly in that, and I don't think risk should be something as gimmicky as "risk of not doing high damage", that's just silly. ^^

And it is likely stems from sustain issues, so I'll support a bump to the regen (and removal of the utterly useless health recovery bonus).

As in Masser and Secunda, as in sand and forest, as in high and low. I thought it was pretty obvious. And it's just some thought i catched while reading, doesn't include a suggestion or anything.

And i still stand with the idea, if it doesn't have a minus side, game would be full of kitty parse queens, as it's capable of pulling the highest numbers in both magicka and stamina. You can support whatever you like anyway.

vesselwiththepestle

Why don't you suggest a buff to Imperial sustain/damage for dps role?

I like the idea to use Red Diamond for sustain. However, it should be active. Like 15% chance to heal, 15% chance to get some stamina back when you deal direct damage. Tanks are dealing direct damage, too.

zaria

Synapsis123 wrote: »

With the health stacking meta in pvp to avoid burst I feel like the changes from % scaling hp to static stats is an overall nerf.

Its an pretty easy way to solve that problem, change more burst into or dots or nerf but make cheaper
That is unless hit by an organized group obviously

sneakymitchell

Health recovery is still good to have. Not very great if a vampire mainly.

JobooAGS

The only thing I would change racewise is dunmer. If you ignore sustain, altmer has the highest potential for mag and dunmer for stam meanwhile dunmer is supposed to be more of a hybrid. Making max magicka 2k and max stam 500-650 for dunmer should be a fair change.

Imperial as a dd is lacking though, it can use some changes

MashmalloMan

@susmitds

Thanks for all the effort, I'd have to agree on most of your conclusions.

I agree on the Regen change for Khajiit. Flat HP Regen is not as useful as 20%. While niche, it synergized with Troll King. Without % increases, I'd prefer them drop the stat all together and focus on a bit of state/mag reg. Useless.

I'd disagree on not changing Redguard, I'm thinking about changing my RG toons because it is so niche, Bosmer is so close in sustain and not conditional at all. In actual application outside dummy DPS parses. Bosmer appear better for PvP and PvE.

"Bosmer

They might just eclipse Redguard on any build that does not use weapon abilities
by by a neglible difference."

Stam sorc and bow bow snipe builds, that's it. Stam DK has venomous claw.

"Redguard

PvE - They have the highest sustain of all stamina races, higher than Bosmer. However, their sustain is primarily conditional and will drop considerably in real fights, while Bosmer's sustain is unconditional. They synergize with builds using weapon spammables the best. Their weapon cost reduction passive affects ultimates as well. They are great tanks as well for the conditional sustain.

PvP - Essentially they are Bosmer without the Speed buff and with Weapon skill sustain instead. Should do good for Stamsorcs and StamDKs."

No doubt, Stam sorc is the most to benefit from this, but even Stam DKs in PvE should just be spamming venomous claw. Bow bow builds gain here as well.

For PvP, might be really nice for heavy builds due to less stam Regen multipliers esp in no CP. However the stam Regen is always ticking and a lot of engagements are about dropping in and out of combat, you can bounce back quicker with sta regen from bosmer.

Weapon ultimate cost reduction is nice, but you'd probably have to build yourself specifically around that to get proper use. Most people use dawnbreaker that sees no benefit from RG.

My point is RG feels extremely niche, while it performs well for very specific scenarios and builds, the idea of these changes were to make builds more versatile and diverse. They failed here.

Bosmer and Orc both provide more versatility, as well as more unique passives outside of just stamina sustain for a test dummy.

Change the 8% cost reduction on weapon skills to something like:
-- 4% cost reduction on every skill. (Templar passive)
-- 5% cost reduction on all mag/sta abilities (Sorc passive)
-- 7% cost reduction on all stamina abilities like Breton (less interesting imo, doesn't help mag users at all)

John_Falstaff

@themaddaedra , sand and forest are inconsistent? Um... okay. ^^ And yes, I can support whatever I like.

@sneakymitchell , health recovery was good to have as percentage boost, and mainly because it amplified already high base health recovery given by Troll King (+1.5k health regen). 20% health recovery combined with other boosts used to amplify high base recovery by a good amount (say, with 4-stat gold food and base recovery, 20% could amount to ~400 health added to already ample healing ticks). 100 recovery added to base is a meager value in comparison.

As things stand, outside of Troll King, health recovery is a very minor thing. Besides, game offers numerous ways of converting primary stats into health - faster, and with far better efficiency, so boosting stamina/magicka regen will let you pop a heal faster than boosted health recovery would top health off. And unlike health recovery, it also helps your combat when you're topped off on health and don't have to spend resources on healing.

Tanis-Stormbinder

Great post thank you for your efforts

susmitds

@Marshall1289 The redguard passive still gives really higher Stamina return alone than the Bosmer regen, without even considering the reduction passive. Yes, this will fall in values in fights with breaks, but essentially the difference between Bosmer and Redguard is hard to feel in PvE. The sustain for both, is good enough to hold out for PvE basically. The ultimate reduction for Ballista will even it in real fights.
PvP wise, however, the conditional sustain will be great for builds which use Blocking as primary defense, far better than Bosmer in regards. From what I feel, ZOS balanced Bosmer vs Redguard from a PvP standpoint, where Bosmer is better for Hit and Run builds, while Redguard is better for hold your ground builds.

Azyle1

I agree 100% with all of this (My biased-ness says especially Khajiit)

susmitds

themaddaedra wrote: »

And i still stand with the idea, if it doesn't have a minus side, game would be full of kitty parse queens, as it's capable of pulling the highest numbers in both magicka and stamina. You can support whatever you like anyway.

This is valid for only Templars and that too by a very small margin. The inconsistency issues affect Templars too, more so than NB or Warden due to lesser sustain. Even for Templars, only the top level will get better averages with Khajiit due to the unforgiving nature amplified with lower class sustain.

For rest of the classes, once in a while you will a really high parse, beyond what other races get by a small margin, but on average your parses will be lower, decreasing the overall numbers. This is taking Major Force into consideration. Without it, the values fall more.

nsmurfer

I have one small suggestion though.

susmitds wrote: »

Feline Ambush - 8% Weapon/Spell Critical Hit Chance. Decreases your sneak radius by 3m and increases your speed when hidden by 12%. This would give Khajiit a proper identity(Stealth mobility unit)

@ZOS_Gilliam @ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_RobGarrett @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_Finn

Your suggestion is about this is great and imo, needed to define the race in PvP. Only issue is it fixes NB Khajiit's viability in PvP. But for all other races, PvP identity will lack identity

Another option would be "Decreases your sneak radius by 3m and increases your speed by 8% at all times."
This will help all classes. The value is lesser than orc or bosmer as it is always up.

Minno

Bump. We have too many noise threads lately, need to balance out the salt with some hardy feedback 🍞.

Urvoth

I think the changes overall were fairly good, but I just wish Altmer got a straight 150-200 recovery instead of the proc. The proc just makes recovery way more inconsistent in PvE and nerfs it hard in PvP.

Lord_Eomer

Good feedback, make sense but dunmer Stamina bonus should not be decreased as many players wanted to play Dunmer as Stamm DD.

Decreasing stamina bonus will kill Dunmer potentional as Stam DD

susmitds

Lord_Dexter wrote: »

Good feedback, make sense but dunmer Stamina bonus should not be decreased as many players wanted to play Dunmer as Stamm DD.

Decreasing stamina bonus will kill Dunmer potentional as Stam DD

@Lord_Dexter That would be a 600 Stamina Decrease, which is less useful for stamina builds than weapon damage. It wouldn't decrease Average parses by anymore than 150 at the 60K stamina parse range. Dunmer on averages get 1st place in almost every stamina class parse by more that. Say, for example, from my tests, Dunmer is 1st place on StamNB with around 400 DPS higher than 2nd place Orc, which is a pure stamina race. Again, in the StamDK parses, Dunmer is 1st and has 700 DPS higher than Bosmer, a pure stamina race.

A definitive proof of this, is the fact that Dunmers averages only around 200 DPS lesser than Altmer in the 60K magicka parses, in spite of having 750 less magicka and 200 less equivalent regen. Magicka builds gain more from max magicka and still the difference is so low.

Lord_Eomer

susmitds wrote: »

Lord_Dexter wrote: »

Good feedback, make sense but dunmer Stamina bonus should not be decreased as many players wanted to play Dunmer as Stamm DD.

Decreasing stamina bonus will kill Dunmer potentional as Stam DD

@Lord_Dexter That would be a 600 Stamina Decrease, which is less useful for stamina builds than weapon damage. It wouldn't decrease Average parses by anymore than 150 at the 60K stamina parse range. Dunmer on averages get 1st place in almost every stamina class parse by more that. Say, for example, from my tests, Dunmer is 1st place on StamNB with around 400 DPS higher than 2nd place Orc, which is a pure stamina race. Again, in the StamDK parses, Dunmer is 1st and has 700 DPS higher than Bosmer, a pure stamina race.

A definitive proof of this, is the fact that Dunmers averages only around 200 DPS lesser than Altmer in the 60K magicka parses, in spite of having 750 less magicka and 200 less equivalent regen. Magicka builds gain more from max magicka and still the difference is so low.

Dunmer showing good parses for Stam DD, decreasing max stam would affect their max pool.

Not in a favuor of decreasing Stam on Dumbers.

susmitds

Lord_Dexter wrote: »

susmitds wrote: »

Lord_Dexter wrote: »

Good feedback, make sense but dunmer Stamina bonus should not be decreased as many players wanted to play Dunmer as Stamm DD.

Decreasing stamina bonus will kill Dunmer potentional as Stam DD

That would be a 600 Stamina Decrease, which is less useful for stamina builds than weapon damage. It wouldn't decrease Average parses by anymore than 150 at the 60K stamina parse range. Dunmer on averages get 1st place in almost every stamina class parse by more that. Say, for example, from my tests, Dunmer is 1st place on StamNB with around 400 DPS higher than 2nd place Orc, which is a pure stamina race. Again, in the StamDK parses, Dunmer is 1st and has 700 DPS higher than Bosmer, a pure stamina race.

A definitive proof of this, is the fact that Dunmers averages only around 200 DPS lesser than Altmer in the 60K magicka parses, in spite of having 750 less magicka and 200 less equivalent regen. Magicka builds gain more from max magicka and still the difference is so low.

Dunmer showing good parses for Stam DD, decreasing max stam would affect their max pool.

Not in a favuor of decreasing Stam on Dumbers.

I would say that the change will barely noticeable and would make raw damage wise equivalent to altmer. It will give them the highest raw damage for both stam and mag, kind of where lorewise they stand.

nsmurfer

You should tag some class reps. All test and hard work is useless, if zos never knows it.

@FeaR Turbo @Alcast @Masel @Checkmath

StarOfElyon

Urvoth wrote: »

I think the changes overall were fairly good, but I just wish Altmer got a straight 150-200 recovery instead of the proc. The proc just makes recovery way more inconsistent in PvE and nerfs it hard in PvP.

This is great for me since I use mainly class abilities. I understand it's not so great for others. My Templar really needs this though

Dracane

StarOfElyon wrote: »

Urvoth wrote: »

I think the changes overall were fairly good, but I just wish Altmer got a straight 150-200 recovery instead of the proc. The proc just makes recovery way more inconsistent in PvE and nerfs it hard in PvP.

This is great for me since I use mainly class abilities. I understand it's not so great for others. My Templar really needs this though

Templar is the winner in all of this, that's clear.
I hate this new passive as well though. It does have potential, but there is no way I am going to profit from it in all its potential in most situations. I either use a class ability too early and miss the cooldown or way too late. This passive can go from decent looking to very poor, very quickly.

I wish it would proc on just any magicka ability or any stamina ability depending on which ressource is higher, or just turn into flat regen. It's really quite underwhelming right now. I am not a fan of static numbers.

Checkmath

nsmurfer wrote: »

You should tag some class reps. All test and hard work is useless, if zos never knows it.

@FeaR Turbo @Alcast @Masel @Checkmath

Oh no I got tagged....

Anyway, good stuff. I can agree with most of what OP said.
In my opinion Khajiit is fine, thanks to the high crit they have pretty consistent high damage. You may say, that luck is involved and affects dps parses, which is not necessarely true. But yeah I guess, that it can be frustrating, when a parse does not go that well, when some of the big hits did not crit.
For PvP I do not agree with high crit chance is something irrelevant. Crit healing is very important and several classes perform very well with high crit ratings. Also nullifying crit damage requires very high crit chance, so that in cp PvP even with 3000 crit resistant you barely negate base crit damage. So I darte to say, that crit is by far not useless in PvP.
About %-amps of health regen: I am actually glad, that this is gone. Without much sacrifices it was easy to acquire very high numbers of health regen just by using a race with health regen bonus, trollking and a tri pot. This allowed people staying in fights too long, when they actually should not. Reaching around 5k health regen was easy, which just kind of carries people (it is a free 5k heal every 2 seconds not halfed by battlespirit).