Stamsorc needs an overhaul.

Aedrion

Hello there forum

I don't know if 2019 was going to bring us class overhauls but given how we'll be getting Necromancers, there isn't a better time to suggest some class changes. On that topic, I'd like to suggest an overhaul to stamsorcs. Now, before you scroll down to write your comment and slam me and my ideas into the ground, hear me out. Then you can bash me, ok? Ok!

Stamsorcs, much like magblades, suffer from an identity problem. The class itself is so tuned to one playstyle, magicka for sorcs and stamina for NB's, that the other playstyle lacks power and focus. Magblades get away with hiding how utterly mediocre they are right now because of cloak but stamsorc does not. They are in a sh*tty spot and need charity.

Now, I know what you might be thinking. DUDE! Stamsorc is great! It's got speed, sustain, works well with DoTs, I kick ass on stamsorc you just need to L2P, really.

But if that were so, then where's all the stamsorcs? Why aren't they prevalent all over the place? When is the last time you saw Hurricane on your death recap? When's the last time you saw a notorious stamsorc and thought 'Oh, better not take this fight alone'? The answer is simple, they're gone. They're playing stamden, which is in a much better spot right now and does all that stamsorc does, but better.

To bring stamsorc on the level of other classes that are in a good spot at the moment, I suggest the following changes to existing skills and some actual new skills since the class has only 1 stamina ability that deals damage. Yup, just one. Hurricane, everything else does no damage. The class is 80% guild and weapon skills and 20% class skills. Weird right?

Dark Deal: Cast time reduced to 1 second
Reason: 1.3 seconds is clunky and doesn't click with the GCD. Also, the skill was given that cast time for being so powerful and instantly delivering a lot of resources. Now that that is no longer the case, 1 second is better suited.

Hurricane: Duration increased to 20 seconds where the last 10 seconds deal its full damage.
Reason: It only does its full damage for those last 5 seconds, assuming you let it drop off. It's also your biggest defensive buff however so you will try to refresh timely. This means its full damage usually ticks only 3-4 times.

Critical Surge: Grants Minor Savagery for its duration
Reason: Sorcs lack buffs and debuffs and since most have to use heavy armour due to having to eat most damage, crit isn't easy to acquire. The small buff would also help stamsorcs keep their crit chance reasonably decent for this skill to heal them.

Bolt Escape: Both Streak and Ball Lightning now follow terrain, making the sorc flash forward instantly, with no delay across the ground. You dodge attack during streak.
Reason: Sorcs will know, this skill feels clunky. It roots you before moving, doesn't get you up a slope and if you go down a slope, you then fall down. With this change, it might not be able to get sorcs into funny spots but it will at least always move them reliably and offer brief protection. You ARE a flash of lightning after all.

Chain Lightning: Merge both current morphs of Mage Fury and make the other one stamina. Deals about the same damage as Ransack and chains to 2 nearby enemies for 75% and 50% of its damage respectively. Deals an extra bit of damage - but not nearly as much as Mage Fury - to the primary target if it's below 25% health. 10 meters range.
Reason: Stamina sorcerer severely lacks usable class skills that can be spammed. By having a decent class skill that also pressures foes who are low on HP, the class won't need to rely on weapon skills as heavily as it does now.

Air Atronach: Merge both morphs of Storm Atronach and make the other one summon a mobile but weaker air atronach. The air atronach has a 20 second duration and deals decent melee damage to 1 foe, applying major fracture. It will also spin its blades every once in a while, applying minor maim. It doesn't have a synergy and has less HP than Storm Atronach.
Reason: Give stamsorcs at least one ult that caters to their needs. Also, this one has been asked for by everyone, for ages. This also makes the pet-linked passives actually do something for stamsorcs.

Cyclone: Merge both morphs of Encase and make the other one stamina. It hurls forth a slow moving but wide cyclone of wind that immobilises enemies caught in its path for 3 seconds, as well as applying a physical damage DoT for 8 seconds after. The cyclone can be avoided by staying out of its path or rolling away.
Reason: Encase is the magicka immobilise that buffs the caster and deals instant damage. Cyclone offers stamina another useful class skill for damage and a way to exploit the class' main supposed strength, speed.

Unstable Clannfear: Make this morph stamina so the damage scales with stamina and weapon damage. Upon using the heal, it also removes snares. The Clannfear lasts for 30 seconds so it has to be recast but doesn't require double barring.
Reason: Have at least 1 pet work while using a stamina build. Instead of having no pet choices. Stamina currently renders Daedric Summoning a dead skill line. Snare removal behind a pet offers stamsorc a way to avoid the snare meta that currently renders its main strength mute.

Bound Armaments: Remove the +11% light attack damage and make it grant +5% stamina instead of 8%. Make it increase blocking power by 20% when slotted and upon use, grants 2 stacks of empowerment, making next light attack deal 40% more damage for 4 seconds.
Reason: This skill is so bad and feels so bad to slot, but we have to for the passives. This way, it actually serves a purpose and can be used defensively and offensively

Overload: Suppresses the current weapon enchants on your weapons and overloads them, causing each light attack with your weapon to deal overloads respectable damage. A heavy attack causes a lighting explosion around your target, dealing overload damage to all nearby targets. Restores magicka for Eenrgy Overload and restores stamina for Power Overload.
Reason: Overload was always a gimmick, used to deal immense damage as a gank. The recent update pretty much eliminated the use of this skill entirely. I haven't seen anyone using overload in ages and it's clunky and weak to boot for an ult. With this change, overload reliably does damage that still can be countered by avoiding the attack it's tied to.

Badassery: Make more class skills look badass and flash lightning all over da place.
Reason: No f'cking reason, son! UNLIMITED POWERRRR!




Alright! Thanks for reading all this. Now you can bash me into the ground if you're so inclined by saying this would make stamsorc OP, that streak is already the best skill in the universe, that I'm a noob who can't play and that you got killed once by a stamsorc so obviously, they're fine.

Cheerio people!

Crixus8000

Well said. I think stamsorc is lacking so much right now and you pointed out many of the issues, and have a lot of good suggestions.

Stamsorc was good before because it had 2 strong points being sustain and speed. Stamsorc lacks survivability so being able to escape and use los made up for that, and stamsorc lacks damage so being able to focus damage through sets because of high sustsain made up for that. Now speed has been gutted, and with dark deal nerf and needing to cast forward momentum twice as much it means we lost our 2 strengths.

Imo the best spammable choice for stamsorc is dizzy swing and stamsorc just lacks the surviavbility to be able to use that effectively when outnumbered. More choice of class skills and some changes like you mentioned would go a long way to help with that.

I love your change to bolt escape. The skill is just so clunky that I unslotted it. You already mentioned the issues it has, and your proposal would really help stamsorc get some defence back.

And I also love the idea of a stam ult like atro, it would help us and give us some identity.

One thing I hate about stamsorc though is the lack of passives. Most passives don't do anything for us and the daedric protection passive is very important now, since stamsorc lacks healing and needs more help with sustain this patch. Most stamsorcs use troll king and this works well with it, but needing to slot bound armaments just to get this seems unfair when you compare it to nightblade that gest 15% hp, stam and mag and doesn't need to slot a skill to get it. I need to slot bound armaments on both bars just to get more healing/sustain, and bound armaments is such a bad skill. This passive should just give the recovery without needing to slot anything.

I don't like how stamsorc currently is. It relied on speed a lot and zos made it clear they didn't want speed to be as effective as it was, so they took stamsorcs main defence and gave nothing back. I need around 800 recovery more than last patch to feel the same, my speed is completely gone and my damage/survivability are worse to make up for it, so my char is much worse in every way.

MashmalloMan

@Crixus8000 I can help you with a speedy build I use right now that has been getting me to top of BG team dmg/kills/assists etc. Crazy survivability with still very high dmg. Sustain may be the only issue, but let dark deal carry you to the heavens.

I actually like the change to dark deal, I precast it along with other buffs now and weave it in normal fights after cc breaks.

Of course my build is really only good for BG, a 1v1 scenario either requires some heavy attacking or dipping in and out of fights.

I love the idea of a stam air atro, made a post awhile back if your curious here. My objective was to come up with more utility for groups as we currently provide very little.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/438419/stam-sorc-air-atronach#latest

I haven't updated it in a while. However point still stands for me, provide major berserk for team more often. Smaller size, melee range, can move and specializes with AoE. I wanted to make it easy enough to make with just popping hurricane on the atro to make it simple enough, however others have suggested a spinning blade attack. I think that's what makes the charged atro so bad. It's not passive and requires an animation to cast. Not exactly great dps.

I don't want stam sorcs to be op, I just want them to be more fun. We are missing a lot of buffs and debuffs other classes get access to so we're "weak" alone, but on par in a group.

SUSTAIN: If you play redguard like many others in pve, the changes to redguard passives with 8% cost reduction buff stam sorcs who rely on spamming weapon abilities and +2k sta helps us more than other sta classes because of the 8% from bound armor.

Nice post, I like some of the ideas you bring up.

Tasear

If we only had spell crafting or something that gave us individual diversity...

ZarkingFrued

Aedrion wrote: »

Hello there forum

I don't know if 2019 was going to bring us class overhauls but given how we'll be getting Necromancers, there isn't a better time to suggest some class changes. On that topic, I'd like to suggest an overhaul to stamsorcs. Now, before you scroll down to write your comment and slam me and my ideas into the ground, hear me out. Then you can bash me, ok? Ok!

Stamsorcs, much like magblades, suffer from an identity problem. The class itself is so tuned to one playstyle, magicka for sorcs and stamina for NB's, that the other playstyle lacks power and focus. Magblades get away with hiding how utterly mediocre they are right now because of cloak but stamsorc does not. They are in a sh*tty spot and need charity.

Now, I know what you might be thinking. DUDE! Stamsorc is great! It's got speed, sustain, works well with DoTs, I kick ass on stamsorc you just need to L2P, really.

But if that were so, then where's all the stamsorcs? Why aren't they prevalent all over the place? When is the last time you saw Hurricane on your death recap? When's the last time you saw a notorious stamsorc and thought 'Oh, better not take this fight alone'? The answer is simple, they're gone. They're playing stamden, which is in a much better spot right now and does all that stamsorc does, but better.

To bring stamsorc on the level of other classes that are in a good spot at the moment, I suggest the following changes to existing skills and some actual new skills since the class has only 1 stamina ability that deals damage. Yup, just one. Hurricane, everything else does no damage. The class is 80% guild and weapon skills and 20% class skills. Weird right?

Dark Deal: Cast time reduced to 1 second
Reason: 1.3 seconds is clunky and doesn't click with the GCD. Also, the skill was given that cast time for being so powerful and instantly delivering a lot of resources. Now that that is no longer the case, 1 second is better suited.

Hurricane: Duration increased to 20 seconds where the last 10 seconds deal its full damage.
Reason: It only does its full damage for those last 5 seconds, assuming you let it drop off. It's also your biggest defensive buff however so you will try to refresh timely. This means its full damage usually ticks only 3-4 times.

Critical Surge: Grants Minor Savagery for its duration
Reason: Sorcs lack buffs and debuffs and since most have to use heavy armour due to having to eat most damage, crit isn't easy to acquire. The small buff would also help stamsorcs keep their crit chance reasonably decent for this skill to heal them.

Bolt Escape: Both Streak and Ball Lightning now follow terrain, making the sorc flash forward instantly, with no delay across the ground. You dodge attack during streak.
Reason: Sorcs will know, this skill feels clunky. It roots you before moving, doesn't get you up a slope and if you go down a slope, you then fall down. With this change, it might not be able to get sorcs into funny spots but it will at least always move them reliably and offer brief protection. You ARE a flash of lightning after all.

Chain Lightning: Merge both current morphs of Mage Fury and make the other one stamina. Deals about the same damage as Ransack and chains to 2 nearby enemies for 75% and 50% of its damage respectively. Deals an extra bit of damage - but not nearly as much as Mage Fury - to the primary target if it's below 25% health. 10 meters range.
Reason: Stamina sorcerer severely lacks usable class skills that can be spammed. By having a decent class skill that also pressures foes who are low on HP, the class won't need to rely on weapon skills as heavily as it does now.

Air Atronach: Merge both morphs of Storm Atronach and make the other one summon a mobile but weaker air atronach. The air atronach has a 20 second duration and deals decent melee damage to 1 foe, applying major fracture. It will also spin its blades every once in a while, applying minor maim. It doesn't have a synergy and has less HP than Storm Atronach.
Reason: Give stamsorcs at least one ult that caters to their needs. Also, this one has been asked for by everyone, for ages. This also makes the pet-linked passives actually do something for stamsorcs.

Cyclone: Merge both morphs of Encase and make the other one stamina. It hurls forth a slow moving but wide cyclone of wind that immobilises enemies caught in its path for 3 seconds, as well as applying a physical damage DoT for 8 seconds after. The cyclone can be avoided by staying out of its path or rolling away.
Reason: Encase is the magicka immobilise that buffs the caster and deals instant damage. Cyclone offers stamina another useful class skill for damage and a way to exploit the class' main supposed strength, speed.

Unstable Clannfear: Make this morph stamina so the damage scales with stamina and weapon damage. Upon using the heal, it also removes snares. The Clannfear lasts for 30 seconds so it has to be recast but doesn't require double barring.
Reason: Have at least 1 pet work while using a stamina build. Instead of having no pet choices. Stamina currently renders Daedric Summoning a dead skill line. Snare removal behind a pet offers stamsorc a way to avoid the snare meta that currently renders its main strength mute.

Bound Armaments: Remove the +11% light attack damage and make it grant +5% stamina instead of 8%. Make it increase blocking power by 20% when slotted and upon use, grants 2 stacks of empowerment, making next light attack deal 40% more damage for 4 seconds.
Reason: This skill is so bad and feels so bad to slot, but we have to for the passives. This way, it actually serves a purpose and can be used defensively and offensively

Overload: Suppresses the current weapon enchants on your weapons and overloads them, causing each light attack with your weapon to deal overloads respectable damage. A heavy attack causes a lighting explosion around your target, dealing overload damage to all nearby targets. Restores magicka for Eenrgy Overload and restores stamina for Power Overload.
Reason: Overload was always a gimmick, used to deal immense damage as a gank. The recent update pretty much eliminated the use of this skill entirely. I haven't seen anyone using overload in ages and it's clunky and weak to boot for an ult. With this change, overload reliably does damage that still can be countered by avoiding the attack it's tied to.

Badassery: Make more class skills look badass and flash lightning all over da place.
Reason: No f'cking reason, son! UNLIMITED POWERRRR!




Alright! Thanks for reading all this. Now you can bash me into the ground if you're so inclined by saying this would make stamsorc OP, that streak is already the best skill in the universe, that I'm a noob who can't play and that you got killed once by a stamsorc so obviously, they're fine.

Cheerio people!

Dont mess with bound armaments lol. Just for slotting it I get more recovery from passives, more light attack damage, 8% more stamina, and a powerful activated blocking buff. If anything buff how long the block buff lasts. I can run this on frontbar and atro ulti on my backbar and enjoy a constant 20% recovery to stam and health.

Crixus8000

@Marshall1289

I mainly play solo/smallscale so it's very different for me.

Today I was playing around with cowards gear. So I had orc, steed and major expedition and I couldn't escape being chased. Even magdks could catch me in melee range. Speed is just terrible atm because of getting snared so often and by how bugged it is. For example snares very often go through immunity, so you have to stop sprinting so often and basically spam forward, and then sometimes it doesn't even remove the snare, then some skills like chains stop you from being able to sprint for a short time ect

Pvp atm has so much powerful damage that has 0 skillful counters. like bleeds/oblivion, they go through resists and block and hit so hard. Then all the proc sets that deal ult level damage. Then snipes hitting over 10k from 40m away and applying defile. Some other classes have ways of at least helping, like cloak is pocket los, it's so good, and abilities that stop projectiles. Stamsorc doesn't really have anything. Your slower than everyone chasing you because your perma snared and they have rapids, so you are basically forced to soak up damage and on a squishy class that doesn't work well.

MashmalloMan

Dark Deal: Cast time reduced to 1 second.

I agree. Mainly because it's not actually 1.3 seconds. All channel times feel clunky with a short delay... If flurry was REALLY .6 seconds, it should fit in a 1 light attack -> flurry 1.1 time frame but it doesn't. I think it ends up closer to 1.3- 1.4 seconds in a rotation.

Other players still need to be able to punish you, if not on purpose, but randomly if the sorc is silly enough to use it during an interrupt. The 1.3 seconds with the .2-3 second delay after cast makes it feel closer to 2 seconds than 1.3.

In heavy armor. Unless your recasting it for the 20 sec stam over time. It's better to just heavy attack weave in a lot of fights. It provides what feels like the same instant sta return.

Hurricane: Duration increased to 20 seconds where the last 10 seconds deal its full damage.

I think you meant to say that it remains the same increase of +150% with 10% each second, maxing out at the 15 sec mark giving you +5 seconds at max dmg if it's 20 seconds instead of 15. I'm pretty sure it gets 10% per second each second now.

I like some of this idea. I proposed a similar idea to an air atro. I think it's a bit overloaded though, hurricanes duration I'm happy with. It's the only dynamic thing about our build. 20 seconds may be too long. I'd prefer them to change the +150% dmg to be reached at 10 seconds instead of 15 and keep the duration the same.

It use to be +15% dmg per second until they nerfed it with morrowind I think for a total of 225%? This skill is also very costly and our sustain is garbage of all the stam classes.

Adding +5 seconds to a 9m range aoe self buff dot is crazy strong with the execute passive. Don't forget that we have that.

I'd propose 15 second duration, +150% dmg reached at 10 seconds instead of 15. Add +2 seconds of slow/snare immunity like wings. Reduce cost by 10%. Even this may be overloaded, I think the 2 seconds is mostly a good QOL change, the dmg is reaching maybe..

Critical Surge: Grants Minor Savagery for its duration

Can't agree, sorry, that is reserved as a group buff from NBs. If anything minor berserk or major savagery is more useful. Allows pvp heavy armor users to unslot camo hunter or crit pots OR gives us better solo dps and less reliance on a healer for minor berserk uptime which we severely lack.

I really like the major brutality, don't take that away please. If I need to spend money on pots 24/7 for trash pve content I'll be annoyed. They should make this skill heal pets too, especially if going for a sta pet.

Bolt Escape: Both Streak and Ball Lightning now follow terrain, making the sorc flash forward instantly, with no delay across the ground. You dodge attack during streak.

I like the idea of it being able to dodge. They need to completely rework this ability. I stopped slotting it for over a year. No space. No utility. My speed build does fine without it.

Directional, cast backwards and side ways. Buffs other builds and allows it to behave as a kiting tool. It's easy enough to charge anyway. Not op. Fixing the momentum problem and super high cost will help builds that don't use magicka. Base cost + 50% each time is WAY too high.

Chain Lightning: Merge both current morphs of Mage Fury and make the other one stamina. Deals about the same damage as Ransack and chains to 2 nearby enemies for 75% and 50% of its damage respectively. Deals an extra bit of damage - but not nearly as much as Mage Fury - to the primary target if it's below 25% health. 10 meters range.

Cool, love it. Might be too much to ask for a new skill for us, but both morphs are so minimal at best right now anyway. It's pulling at teeth hoping for JUST 1 stamina ultimate.

Air Atronach: Merge both morphs of Storm Atronach and make the other one summon a mobile but weaker air atronach. The air atronach has a 20 second duration and deals decent melee damage to 1 foe, applying major fracture. It will also spin its blades every once in a while, applying minor maim. It doesn't have a synergy and has less HP than Storm Atronach.

I just want any version of an air atro, idk at this point. Check out my post from my other comment. I REALLY don't think you should remove the synergy, we provide absolutely NOTHING right now to our groups without that. We need more group debuffs/buffs to actually feel less selfish.

Cyclone: Merge both morphs of Encase and make the other one stamina. It hurls forth a slow moving but wide cyclone of wind that immobilises enemies caught in its path for 3 seconds, as well as applying a physical damage DoT for 8 seconds after. The cyclone can be avoided by staying out of its path or rolling away.

I love it, but it is a cc tool. With the direction they're taking I doubt this will ever happen unfortunately. We also have weapon skill lines as an argument for providing too many dmg skills. We could probably only get 1 spammable or 1 execute or 1 dot. I think I'd prefer the chain lightning or a spammable. Hurricane is like our DoT.

Unstable Clannfear: Make this morph stamina so the damage scales with stamina and weapon damage. Upon using the heal, it also removes snares. The Clannfear lasts for 30 seconds so it has to be recast but doesn't require double barring.

They should make all pets instant cast, 30 sec durations. Agreed, but I don't want to take away tanks heal. If anything it should be on a different skill. Until you figure that out, we can't take away they're tanking tool and the scaling of dmg has never been it's purpose. It really doesn't scale properly even if using max magicka.

The skill would need to change to scale off max sta, change it's tooltip dmg to scale like a proper dps pet. Remove the % based heal and add it to another skill for tanks. Really, the entire daedric summoning line needs to be reworked.

Bound Armaments: Remove the +11% light attack damage and make it grant +5% stamina instead of 8%. Make it increase blocking power by 20% when slotted and upon use, grants 2 stacks of empowerment, making next light attack deal 40% more damage for 4 seconds.

Giving it a purpose I agree with, I didn't understand why they changed this DPS ability to work for tanks too when they could of added something like minor berserk. The passive block dmg is better for sure, I don't really like the empowerment mechanic but I can get behind this. I don't think it would be powerful enough for a dps rotation in pve with only 2 empowers. You'd have to weave it every 2 skills the same way wardens weave shalks, 3 empowers would be better, but 40% is very strong.

Overload: Suppresses the current weapon enchants on your weapons and overloads them, causing each light attack with your weapon to deal overloads respectable damage. A heavy attack causes a lighting explosion around your target, dealing overload damage to all nearby targets. Restores magicka for Eenrgy Overload and restores stamina for Power Overload.

I like making 1 restore sta and 1 magicka but once again I feel like if we need to choose only 1 new ult, I'd prefer air atro. The skill is currently pretty strong, just costs a lot to use.

I'd prefer something unique to melee. We have a lot of aoe, this can be a single target ult.

We do not have a gap closer. Every light attack is a mini 10m range charge. This fits the speed theme, every light attack you do a quick uppercut that can still be weaved, but it keeps you on your target. Think of doom fist from overwatch. Physical dmg and same increased light attack dmg like current overload. Heavy attack could be a conal ground slam that costs more with a slight duration to cast like any heavy attack. Roots enemies or slows.

MashmalloMan

@Crixus8000

Yeah BG is a different ball game. This is for no cp too. I honestly think it could work for you but in Xv1 your screwed with sta sorc anyway. Bolt escape needs to be reworked.

Focus on speed and survival. I use steed, orc, 3 swift acc, 6 heavy 1 med, quick cloak.

TK/Impreg/7th legion. 2H back bar nirn VMA axe. Every piece well fitted.

Slot bound armor front bar and storm atro back for passives.

Artaeum takeaway broth, even more hp regen with +% multipliers.

This makes the build have high reduced sprint cost which even med armor doesn't provide, high cost reduction on roll dodge like med armor. Crazy high hp recov with crazy high synergy from passives from race/heavy/class/pots. DMG is still very good.

Front bar, using 2x daggers, biggest problem is heavy armor targets where you can't add as much bleeds. This would be more preference, but higher crit means more reliability on crit surge for me.

Using crit pots for for major savagery/major endurance/major fortitude.

Being in heavy armor with constant HoT from crit surge/forward momentum/TK/hp regen and vigor when needed. Roll dodging is cheap. HA means more dark deals. Quick cloak means crazy dmg mitigation.

Skills:
Quick cloak/Hurricane/Rending Slashes (Spammable)/Steel Tornado/Bound Armor [Dawnbreaker]
Stampede/Forward Momentum/Crit Surge/Dark Deal/Vigor [Atro]

Happy to see they aren't completely ruining my orc pvp build with racial passive changes. However my focus on hp regen is unfortunate to lose a bit of... More dmg at least. Same speed. Less max hp/sta... why 600.. it should be 1k like other race changes.

Crixus8000

Marshall1289 wrote: »

@Crixus8000

Yeah BG is a different ball game. This is for no cp too. I honestly think it could work for you but in Xv1 your screwed with sta sorc anyway. Bolt escape needs to be reworked.

Happy to see they aren't completely ruining my orc pvp build with racial passive changes. However my focus on hp regen is unfortunate to lose a bit of... More dmg at least. Same speed. Less max hp/sta... why 600.. it should be 1k like other race changes.

I play no cp yeah but cyro instead of bgs. And in cyro as a solo/smallscale your going to be getting xv1d all the time, and stamsorc has 0 defence for this. Speed doesn't work well here. Like I said I used orc, steed and major expidition and stll magicka chars could catch me, because of how bugged and op snares are.

But yes a bolt escape rework to move better and actually give defence like dodging while it's active would help a lot. But I still think stamsorc needs more usable passives, some buffs/debuffs like every other class has and not needing to waste a slot on each bar to get the sustain passive other classes get for free.

ChunkyCat

I main a stam sorc in BG. Stam sorc is fine.

The game doesn’t revolve around your ability to 1vX. Is it possible? Yes. Does the class need to be reworked to make it easier? No.

L2P

TBois

Stam sorc needs physical overload, if air atro doesn't follow me I might as well use negate.

Edit: I'm just afraid zos will give us an immobile air stomach and call it a day.

Crixus8000

ChunkyCat wrote: »

I main a stam sorc in BG. Stam sorc is fine.

The game doesn’t revolve around your ability to 1vX. Is it possible? Yes. Does the class need to be reworked to make it easier? No.

L2P

Again bgs and cyrodiil are very different things so saying stamsorc is fine because you can do well with it in bgs does not make it true. I can go into bg play a full dmg setup with spin2win and get many kills, that doesn't make it good. And bgs are only one part of pvp.

Stamsorc lacks in cyrodil though, it hardly has anything going for it. And when outnumbered you have no defence anymore, like I said even stacking speed and magicka chars can catch me, so when a larger group starts fighting me I just have to roll over ? Bolt escape needs a change to be a useful escape tool.

And if stamsorc is fine then why have most of them changed to other classes ? Most stamsorcs on my friendlist and who I know in game have changed to either stamden or stamblade, I guess that was because they diddn't want to be a godly stamsorc though right...

ChunkyCat

Crixus8000 wrote: »

ChunkyCat wrote: »

I main a stam sorc in BG. Stam sorc is fine.

The game doesn’t revolve around your ability to 1vX. Is it possible? Yes. Does the class need to be reworked to make it easier? No.

L2P

Again bgs and cyrodiil are very different things so saying stamsorc is fine because you can do well with it in bgs does not make it true. I can go into bg play a full dmg setup with spin2win and get many kills, that doesn't make it good. And bgs are only one part of pvp.

Stamsorc lacks in cyrodil though, it hardly has anything going for it. And when outnumbered you have no defence anymore, like I said even stacking speed and magicka chars can catch me, so when a larger group starts fighting me I just have to roll over ?

And if stamsorc is fine then why have most of them changed to other classes ? Most stamsorcs on my friendlist and who I know in game have changed to either stamden or stamblade, I guess that was because they diddn't want to be a godly stamsorc though right...

You’re right BG and Cyrodiil are different. It’s much easier to escape in Cyrodiil than in BG. If your goal is take on a Zerg by yourself, again, the game isn’t designed that way.

If you’re talking about PvE, pretty much every Stam class has a similar rotation and the difference is negligible. If you’re all about those leaderboard PvE trials, go with whatever the new BiS Meta.

As to why all of your friends are “changing to other classes”, how the eff should I know. They’re your friends, not mine. But it’s laughable that you’re basing your argument for a stam sorc rework because you “know people” who no longer play the class.

But hey, get your response in. I’m done with this pointless thread.

Aedrion

ChunkyCat wrote: »

I’m done with this pointless thread.

Good, stay away. You've been nothing but denigrating to everybody here anyway.

wsmith97ub17_ESO

Looks on youtube, see's all the big names trashing everybody with sorc and claiming it to be OP.

Looks here, nobodies, no skillers like me saying buff their OP class...

This OP has made me dumber for reading it. I will join you all on the short bus now, kthxbyediafirl.

Faulgor

In PvE, stamsorc just has nothing going for them. They aren't just the worst (at least in my parses) stam DPS class, they are also dreadfully boring. Hurricane is your only active class skill you use (which also looks terrible as it makes you downright invisible in many environments), everything else is copy-pasted from every other stamina build in the game. Sustain is also really bad compared to other classes.

I'm not sure how to tackle all of this in the best way, but I still wish we had a stamina-based curse DoT, possibly disease damage (think Peryite).

Aedrion

wsmith97ub17_ESO wrote: »

Looks on youtube, see's all the big names trashing everybody with sorc and claiming it to be OP.

Link a few videos? Recent ones please. More than one please.

MashmalloMan

wsmith97ub17_ESO wrote: »

Looks on youtube, see's all the big names trashing everybody with sorc and claiming it to be OP.

Looks here, nobodies, no skillers like me saying buff their OP class...

This OP has made me dumber for reading it. I will join you all on the short bus now, kthxbyediafirl.

Reworking a class doesn't necessarily mean making it OP. The class doesn't have much going for it buff/debuff/unique skills/group utility skill wise. Can't even provide our group buff to people in pve reliably because who the hell uses a dark magic ability in pve as a stam sorc.

Asking for unique skills that are balanced properly is not asking for much. There isn't a single physical ultimate in the sorcs tool kit. It's boring. There's little choice.

If you don't agree with OP, try being constructive. Whats wrong with what he asked for, I know I don't agree with all of it, but I seek changes for my favourite class.

Crixus8000

Marshall1289 wrote: »

wsmith97ub17_ESO wrote: »

Looks on youtube, see's all the big names trashing everybody with sorc and claiming it to be OP.

Looks here, nobodies, no skillers like me saying buff their OP class...

This OP has made me dumber for reading it. I will join you all on the short bus now, kthxbyediafirl.

Reworking a class doesn't necessarily mean making it OP. The class doesn't have much going for it buff/debuff/unique skills/group utility skill wise. Can't even provide our group buff to people in pve reliably because who the hell uses a dark magic ability in pve as a stam sorc.

Asking for unique skills that are balanced properly is not asking for much. There isn't a single physical ultimate in the sorcs tool kit. It's boring. There's little choice.

If you don't agree with OP, try being constructive. Whats wrong with what he asked for, I know I don't agree with all of it, but I seek changes for my favourite class.

Well said.

I don't want stamsorc to be op, I would just like it to have more options like the op listed.

Stamsorc has basically 0 buffs/debuffs, every other class does. Most passives do nothing for stamsorc where other classes can at least use most of them.

Stamsorc hardly has any skills either, it's basically a playable weapon/guild line.

Asking for things every other class has is fair imo.

And as for it's survivability a simple change to bolt escape would fix that, anyone who has used the skill knows how many issues it has and how clunky it is, we shouldn't even need to ask for that to get changed. I mean even calling it a class after it lost it's only 2 unique strengths feels weird.

TBois

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utClAmP9Rp8

Here's a clip trying to play to stam sorc's strengths using Bound Armaments for Light Attack Buff, Wrecking Blow for Empower, and Overload Light Attack weaved with Dawnbreaker. It's a medium armor build focusing on passive heals. I think it really highlights how clunky it is, and I'm still getting used to the combo due to this.

TBois

Well I'm getting a bit more used to the Overload combo. In my opinion it is still too clumsy for me to recommend to most players, but it can provide some solid burst for those who take the time to work with it.

https://youtu.be/gi2jR5drpdU

Ajax_22

Stamsorc has needed an overhaul since they overhauled the Stam class skills two years ago. There have been dozens of extremely well thought out, and detailed suggestions of changes we would like to see. Hopefully now that Wheeler is head of combat the classes that need some love can get it.

Doctor_Zeuss

I love this. Stam Sorc is my favorite theme of all the playstyles, but I’ve never liked how they rely so heavily on non-class skills. Things get boring. This is from a primarily PvE perspective.

Having different class abilities to use as dots and spammables, whether single target, cleave, or aoe, would bring so much life to a class that feels very empty, but that could be so much more.

mcagatayg

Major fracture when

Leocaran

Aedrion wrote: »

Encase is the magicka immobilise that buffs the caster and deals instant damage.

What instant damage? I remember a clunky morph which increases healing and a morph which blows up at the end of root.

Doctor_Zeuss

TBois wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utClAmP9Rp8

Here's a clip trying to play to stam sorc's strengths using Bound Armaments for Light Attack Buff, Wrecking Blow for Empower, and Overload Light Attack weaved with Dawnbreaker. It's a medium armor build focusing on passive heals. I think it really highlights how clunky it is, and I'm still getting used to the combo due to this.

@TBois
That’s a very interesting combo that I would have never figured out on my own. I know it’s not exactly smooth as is, but would it be possible to even throw in a Crushing Weapon on top of the empowered overload as well? I haven’t used overload since the changes, so I’m curious.

Also trying to think of other sources of empower that might be fun with this.

rafaelcsmaia

Doctor_Zeuss wrote: »

TBois wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utClAmP9Rp8

Here's a clip trying to play to stam sorc's strengths using Bound Armaments for Light Attack Buff, Wrecking Blow for Empower, and Overload Light Attack weaved with Dawnbreaker. It's a medium armor build focusing on passive heals. I think it really highlights how clunky it is, and I'm still getting used to the combo due to this.

@TBois
That’s a very interesting combo that I would have never figured out on my own. I know it’s not exactly smooth as is, but would it be possible to even throw in a Crushing Weapon on top of the empowered overload as well? I haven’t used overload since the changes, so I’m curious.

Also trying to think of other sources of empower that might be fun with this.

AFAIK they changed crushing weapon to not proc on overload LAs. It would make a hell of a combo if it did.

Thraben

wsmith97ub17_ESO wrote: »

Looks on youtube, see's all the big names trashing everybody with sorc and claiming it to be OP.

Looks here, nobodies, no skillers like me saying buff their OP class...

This OP has made me dumber for reading it. I will join you all on the short bus now, kthxbyediafirl.

I'm still waiting for the promised StamSorc OP videos. It is probably the least played class right now in Cyro, and people need some uplifting examples which don´t make them think: "Well I could do it better on my StamDK/StamWarden/StamBlade with mostly the same tactics, skills, and equipment".

Doctor_Zeuss

rafaelcsmaia wrote: »

Doctor_Zeuss wrote: »

TBois wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utClAmP9Rp8

Here's a clip trying to play to stam sorc's strengths using Bound Armaments for Light Attack Buff, Wrecking Blow for Empower, and Overload Light Attack weaved with Dawnbreaker. It's a medium armor build focusing on passive heals. I think it really highlights how clunky it is, and I'm still getting used to the combo due to this.

@TBois
That’s a very interesting combo that I would have never figured out on my own. I know it’s not exactly smooth as is, but would it be possible to even throw in a Crushing Weapon on top of the empowered overload as well? I haven’t used overload since the changes, so I’m curious.

Also trying to think of other sources of empower that might be fun with this.

AFAIK they changed crushing weapon to not proc on overload LAs. It would make a hell of a combo if it did.

Well shoot, thanks for the info. Does make sense. I mean you wouldn’t want 3 abilities going off at once right?

Like, say dawnbreaker, sub assault, crushing weapon.

TBois

Doctor_Zeuss wrote: »

TBois wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utClAmP9Rp8

Here's a clip trying to play to stam sorc's strengths using Bound Armaments for Light Attack Buff, Wrecking Blow for Empower, and Overload Light Attack weaved with Dawnbreaker. It's a medium armor build focusing on passive heals. I think it really highlights how clunky it is, and I'm still getting used to the combo due to this.

@TBois
That’s a very interesting combo that I would have never figured out on my own. I know it’s not exactly smooth as is, but would it be possible to even throw in a Crushing Weapon on top of the empowered overload as well? I haven’t used overload since the changes, so I’m curious.

Also trying to think of other sources of empower that might be fun with this.

Yeah I looked at other sources of empower, but wrecking blow came with empower and a spammable so I stuck with that.

Morgul667

I am fine with changing implosion but honestly it destroys the synergy with dots and bleed builds. This was the thing to keep stamsorc "okayish". By removing this I feel we need a buff or a class overhaul.

The fact that patch notes do not mention anything stamsorc related seriously worries me. I have no issue with this change for my magsorc but I see it as a big nerf for my stamsorc.

We need better passive and more daedric usefull skills. Today many stamsorc do not slot daedric abilities so a whole tree passive is useless.

Im not a big fan of overload or air atronach. Im more in favor or good passive synergies.