How much DPS do you need to pull in order to be a REAL DPS?

JinMori

AlienatedGoat wrote: »

Tannus15 wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

kathandira wrote: »

ryanfan wrote: »

So as many people have discussed, when queuing for vet dungeons, DLC dungeons and trials, having enough DPS can certainly help the group progress the content and make it a more enjoyable experience. No one likes to initiate a kick nor being kicked.

Many end game trial groups require combat metrics DPS parse before inviting you to the group so they know you are qualified.
Many YouTubers have created videos sharing their builds and DPS rotations to help people improve their skills and DPS.

But is hitting over 60k single target on parse really necessary for casual players who just want to try and complete the vet content?

For players who don't have end game trial gear, perfect rotation, nor BIS meta build, how much DPS does one need in order to be a REAL DPS for vet content (no hm), making the game enjoyable for oneself and as well as its teammates?

From what I've gathered:

Vet Dungeons: 15k+
Vet DLC Dungeons: 20k+
Vet Trials: 30k+

These aren't set in stone though.

To clear, it's lower than that.

Base Game Vet dungeons run under 10k for their DPS checks. (I forget, it's only like 6 or 7k for the hard checks.)

Most Vet DLC can be cleared at 15k

Vet base game trials check at around 12k.

Vet DLC trials check at around 20k (maybe 25k)

The problem is, most players want to bypass mechanics, or get out of specific phases quickly, which calls for higher DPS.

The more recent the content is, the higher the checks will be, except, a lot of fights don't depend on DPS checks at all. You can clear Thurvokun with three tanks if you wanted to, and you'd have a significantly easier time than if you were dealing with two 45k DPS who didn't understand the fight and wouldn't follow direction.

Understanding mechanics is way more important than raw DPS. This is also one place where you'll see a difference between endgame raid groups. Groups that prioritize players who can learn systems, and improve will do far better, long term, than ones that focus on just parse numbers. (And, before someone comes scampering in to defend their guild, yes, both of these kinds of groups do exist.)

There is no way you're clearing the twins in vMoL with 20k. You'll get overwhelmed by adds.
There is no way you're clearing the last boss in vHoF with 20k. You'll die in execute.

I've had groups clear vMoL with less than 20k DPS average. Twins are more about tank competency than it is about DPS.

I would like evidence for that claim, if you did do it or not, and to see how exactly it was done, because if you got it after the 150 wipe, than that's not really better than just not doing it at all, it's a waste of time, and you would just be better off in a group with more dps.

This is a typical response i see, all claim that they have done this and that with pretty low to ludicrously low dps, and use it as an argument that dps is not important, but where is the evidence? So we may judge? Because i too did some groups with low dps back when i was not as good, but it definitely was not very fun.

But i'm just elitist am i right?

Tannus15

AlienatedGoat wrote: »

Tannus15 wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

kathandira wrote: »

ryanfan wrote: »

So as many people have discussed, when queuing for vet dungeons, DLC dungeons and trials, having enough DPS can certainly help the group progress the content and make it a more enjoyable experience. No one likes to initiate a kick nor being kicked.

Many end game trial groups require combat metrics DPS parse before inviting you to the group so they know you are qualified.
Many YouTubers have created videos sharing their builds and DPS rotations to help people improve their skills and DPS.

But is hitting over 60k single target on parse really necessary for casual players who just want to try and complete the vet content?

For players who don't have end game trial gear, perfect rotation, nor BIS meta build, how much DPS does one need in order to be a REAL DPS for vet content (no hm), making the game enjoyable for oneself and as well as its teammates?

From what I've gathered:

Vet Dungeons: 15k+
Vet DLC Dungeons: 20k+
Vet Trials: 30k+

These aren't set in stone though.

To clear, it's lower than that.

Base Game Vet dungeons run under 10k for their DPS checks. (I forget, it's only like 6 or 7k for the hard checks.)

Most Vet DLC can be cleared at 15k

Vet base game trials check at around 12k.

Vet DLC trials check at around 20k (maybe 25k)

The problem is, most players want to bypass mechanics, or get out of specific phases quickly, which calls for higher DPS.

The more recent the content is, the higher the checks will be, except, a lot of fights don't depend on DPS checks at all. You can clear Thurvokun with three tanks if you wanted to, and you'd have a significantly easier time than if you were dealing with two 45k DPS who didn't understand the fight and wouldn't follow direction.

Understanding mechanics is way more important than raw DPS. This is also one place where you'll see a difference between endgame raid groups. Groups that prioritize players who can learn systems, and improve will do far better, long term, than ones that focus on just parse numbers. (And, before someone comes scampering in to defend their guild, yes, both of these kinds of groups do exist.)

There is no way you're clearing the twins in vMoL with 20k. You'll get overwhelmed by adds.
There is no way you're clearing the last boss in vHoF with 20k. You'll die in execute.

I've had groups clear vMoL with less than 20k DPS average. Twins are more about tank competency than it is about DPS.

It's understood that when people are talking about DPS numbers they mean single target on a target skelly, 3 or 6 mil. Supported or unsupported, I don't care.
It's a best case, no mechanics metric in a controlled environment.
No one says "I do 11k dps on St Olms and 35k on the storm atro and 9k on ra kotu". They say "I do 35k dps on a 3mil skelly".

I mention this because i'm assuming you're talking about effective dps on the boss.

Diminish

AlienatedGoat wrote: »

I've had groups clear vMoL with less than 20k DPS average. Twins are more about tank competency than it is about DPS.

This is pretty far-fetched my man. You realize you can hit 10k by just light attack spamming. Toss in 1 dot to your light attack spam and you are probably pushing 15k or a little higher; meaning, nearly what you are claiming. Please, get your group, I want to see a light attack dot spam group clear vMoL. Post it to YouTube, or hit me up with your Twitch. I am actually dying of anticipation waiting to see it.

RebornV3x

25k+ is fine anything more is great tho

ccfeeling

I believe 25k is fine with almost all content.

High coordination is required when the dps just touched the bottom line .

spartaxoxo

Valrien wrote: »

Bare minimum 30k, just because of how easy it is to get 30k DPS.

30k is not that easy, and most are way under that. Getting the right gear is not that easy, and a lot of people do not know how to rotate. That doesn't mean they are faking.

spartaxoxo

Glurin wrote: »

1

Not 1k or 100k or 1m, just 1.

That's all you need to qualify as a "real" DPS.

Pretty darn bad DPS and people would be right to kick you out of the group for it, but DPS nonetheless. There is no such thing as a "Fake DPS". Not unless they are pure healers queuing up as DPS because they hate short lines or something else insane like that.

My minimum is that they are pressing buttons. I don't care about the gear, or which skills they are using, or if their dps is ass. They aren't fake if they are trying. But, people know better than to play video games without pressing buttons. Someone not using any skill ever isn't actually trying, they are leeching.

spartaxoxo

JinMori wrote: »

AlienatedGoat wrote: »

Tannus15 wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

kathandira wrote: »

ryanfan wrote: »

So as many people have discussed, when queuing for vet dungeons, DLC dungeons and trials, having enough DPS can certainly help the group progress the content and make it a more enjoyable experience. No one likes to initiate a kick nor being kicked.

Many end game trial groups require combat metrics DPS parse before inviting you to the group so they know you are qualified.
Many YouTubers have created videos sharing their builds and DPS rotations to help people improve their skills and DPS.

But is hitting over 60k single target on parse really necessary for casual players who just want to try and complete the vet content?

For players who don't have end game trial gear, perfect rotation, nor BIS meta build, how much DPS does one need in order to be a REAL DPS for vet content (no hm), making the game enjoyable for oneself and as well as its teammates?

From what I've gathered:

Vet Dungeons: 15k+
Vet DLC Dungeons: 20k+
Vet Trials: 30k+

These aren't set in stone though.

To clear, it's lower than that.

Base Game Vet dungeons run under 10k for their DPS checks. (I forget, it's only like 6 or 7k for the hard checks.)

Most Vet DLC can be cleared at 15k

Vet base game trials check at around 12k.

Vet DLC trials check at around 20k (maybe 25k)

The problem is, most players want to bypass mechanics, or get out of specific phases quickly, which calls for higher DPS.

The more recent the content is, the higher the checks will be, except, a lot of fights don't depend on DPS checks at all. You can clear Thurvokun with three tanks if you wanted to, and you'd have a significantly easier time than if you were dealing with two 45k DPS who didn't understand the fight and wouldn't follow direction.

Understanding mechanics is way more important than raw DPS. This is also one place where you'll see a difference between endgame raid groups. Groups that prioritize players who can learn systems, and improve will do far better, long term, than ones that focus on just parse numbers. (And, before someone comes scampering in to defend their guild, yes, both of these kinds of groups do exist.)

There is no way you're clearing the twins in vMoL with 20k. You'll get overwhelmed by adds.
There is no way you're clearing the last boss in vHoF with 20k. You'll die in execute.

I've had groups clear vMoL with less than 20k DPS average. Twins are more about tank competency than it is about DPS.

I would like evidence for that claim, if you did do it or not, and to see how exactly it was done, because if you got it after the 150 wipe, than that's not really better than just not doing it at all, it's a waste of time, and you would just be better off in a group with more dps.

This is a typical response i see, all claim that they have done this and that with pretty low to ludicrously low dps, and use it as an argument that dps is not important, but where is the evidence? So we may judge? Because i too did some groups with low dps back when i was not as good, but it definitely was not very fun.

But i'm just elitist am i right?

Fun is subjective. A clear is a clear.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

JinMori wrote: »

AlienatedGoat wrote: »

Tannus15 wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

kathandira wrote: »

ryanfan wrote: »

So as many people have discussed, when queuing for vet dungeons, DLC dungeons and trials, having enough DPS can certainly help the group progress the content and make it a more enjoyable experience. No one likes to initiate a kick nor being kicked.

Many end game trial groups require combat metrics DPS parse before inviting you to the group so they know you are qualified.
Many YouTubers have created videos sharing their builds and DPS rotations to help people improve their skills and DPS.

But is hitting over 60k single target on parse really necessary for casual players who just want to try and complete the vet content?

For players who don't have end game trial gear, perfect rotation, nor BIS meta build, how much DPS does one need in order to be a REAL DPS for vet content (no hm), making the game enjoyable for oneself and as well as its teammates?

From what I've gathered:

Vet Dungeons: 15k+
Vet DLC Dungeons: 20k+
Vet Trials: 30k+

These aren't set in stone though.

To clear, it's lower than that.

Base Game Vet dungeons run under 10k for their DPS checks. (I forget, it's only like 6 or 7k for the hard checks.)

Most Vet DLC can be cleared at 15k

Vet base game trials check at around 12k.

Vet DLC trials check at around 20k (maybe 25k)

The problem is, most players want to bypass mechanics, or get out of specific phases quickly, which calls for higher DPS.

The more recent the content is, the higher the checks will be, except, a lot of fights don't depend on DPS checks at all. You can clear Thurvokun with three tanks if you wanted to, and you'd have a significantly easier time than if you were dealing with two 45k DPS who didn't understand the fight and wouldn't follow direction.

Understanding mechanics is way more important than raw DPS. This is also one place where you'll see a difference between endgame raid groups. Groups that prioritize players who can learn systems, and improve will do far better, long term, than ones that focus on just parse numbers. (And, before someone comes scampering in to defend their guild, yes, both of these kinds of groups do exist.)

There is no way you're clearing the twins in vMoL with 20k. You'll get overwhelmed by adds.
There is no way you're clearing the last boss in vHoF with 20k. You'll die in execute.

I've had groups clear vMoL with less than 20k DPS average. Twins are more about tank competency than it is about DPS.

I would like evidence for that claim, if you did do it or not, and to see how exactly it was done, because if you got it after the 150 wipe, than that's not really better than just not doing it at all, it's a waste of time, and you would just be better off in a group with more dps.

This is a typical response i see, all claim that they have done this and that with pretty low to ludicrously low dps, and use it as an argument that dps is not important, but where is the evidence? So we may judge? Because i too did some groups with low dps back when i was not as good, but it definitely was not very fun.

But i'm just elitist am i right?

20k sounds a bit low, but I think it would be doable. We were the 4th or 5th VMOL HM clear on PC/NA, we werent doing much more than 25k or so on average at the time. I think we did 5 backrooms plus lunar in our first HM clear. Our first vet clear (non HM) was like 2 patches before that, and we were definitively pulling less. Of course that was a different time, but the mechanics really havent changed.

It's a bit of a catch 22 if done recently. People that can follow mechanics that well are pulling way more DPS than they were more than 2 years ago. In other words, I think 20k average by today's standards is unlikely, but certainly not impossible.

spartaxoxo

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

JinMori wrote: »

AlienatedGoat wrote: »

Tannus15 wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

kathandira wrote: »

ryanfan wrote: »

So as many people have discussed, when queuing for vet dungeons, DLC dungeons and trials, having enough DPS can certainly help the group progress the content and make it a more enjoyable experience. No one likes to initiate a kick nor being kicked.

Many end game trial groups require combat metrics DPS parse before inviting you to the group so they know you are qualified.
Many YouTubers have created videos sharing their builds and DPS rotations to help people improve their skills and DPS.

But is hitting over 60k single target on parse really necessary for casual players who just want to try and complete the vet content?

For players who don't have end game trial gear, perfect rotation, nor BIS meta build, how much DPS does one need in order to be a REAL DPS for vet content (no hm), making the game enjoyable for oneself and as well as its teammates?

From what I've gathered:

Vet Dungeons: 15k+
Vet DLC Dungeons: 20k+
Vet Trials: 30k+

These aren't set in stone though.

To clear, it's lower than that.

Base Game Vet dungeons run under 10k for their DPS checks. (I forget, it's only like 6 or 7k for the hard checks.)

Most Vet DLC can be cleared at 15k

Vet base game trials check at around 12k.

Vet DLC trials check at around 20k (maybe 25k)

The problem is, most players want to bypass mechanics, or get out of specific phases quickly, which calls for higher DPS.

The more recent the content is, the higher the checks will be, except, a lot of fights don't depend on DPS checks at all. You can clear Thurvokun with three tanks if you wanted to, and you'd have a significantly easier time than if you were dealing with two 45k DPS who didn't understand the fight and wouldn't follow direction.

Understanding mechanics is way more important than raw DPS. This is also one place where you'll see a difference between endgame raid groups. Groups that prioritize players who can learn systems, and improve will do far better, long term, than ones that focus on just parse numbers. (And, before someone comes scampering in to defend their guild, yes, both of these kinds of groups do exist.)

There is no way you're clearing the twins in vMoL with 20k. You'll get overwhelmed by adds.
There is no way you're clearing the last boss in vHoF with 20k. You'll die in execute.

I've had groups clear vMoL with less than 20k DPS average. Twins are more about tank competency than it is about DPS.

I would like evidence for that claim, if you did do it or not, and to see how exactly it was done, because if you got it after the 150 wipe, than that's not really better than just not doing it at all, it's a waste of time, and you would just be better off in a group with more dps.

This is a typical response i see, all claim that they have done this and that with pretty low to ludicrously low dps, and use it as an argument that dps is not important, but where is the evidence? So we may judge? Because i too did some groups with low dps back when i was not as good, but it definitely was not very fun.

But i'm just elitist am i right?

20k sounds a bit low, but I think it would be doable. We were the 4th or 5th VMOL HM clear on PC/NA, we werent doing much more than 25k or so on average at the time. I think we did 5 backrooms plus lunar in our first HM clear. Our first vet clear (non HM) was like 2 patches before that, and we were definitively pulling less. Of course that was a different time, but the mechanics really havent changed.

It's a bit of a catch 22 if done recently. People that can follow mechanics that well are pulling way more DPS than they were more than 2 years ago. In other words, I think 20k average by today's standards is unlikely, but certainly not impossible.

A lot of this content was cleared with dps totals much lower than we have now. So no, you do not need to have the totals we can pull now to do that old content. It is nice but it is not mandatory.

But the people hitting those numbers back then are the same very coordinated and knowledgeable people that are hitting the big totals now. A group would have to very dedicated, willing to learn, etc to clear with those lower numbers. And if they were all those things they probably wouldn't have such low dps compared to what is available now.

It is what it is.

LightMaster7

Anyone measuring their dps by how they perform on a dummy is an idiot.

You just put on some single target enhanced dps sets and you can fanagle that *** all day.

Doesn't tell you how good that person is in a real dungeon, his actual skills or what that person is really capable of.

ArchMikem

20k - 25k is the standard average most players can achieve fairly easily with end-game gear.

Valrien wrote: »

AlienatedGoat wrote: »

Valrien wrote: »

AlienatedGoat wrote: »

Valrien wrote: »

Bare minimum 30k, just because of how easy it is to get 30k DPS.

If it was that easy, this thread wouldn't exist.

Neither would all the other DPS threads.

No, it's pretty easy. Threads like these spawn because there are people not even willing to do the bare minimum

That's elitism.

There are plenty of people willing to do the work, but it takes time and patience to get to that point.

Just because there are some bad and willfully ignorant DPS out there doesn't mean they all are.

Bro 30k can be achieved just with the right gear + dots + light attacks.

The bare minimum is light attack spam but smarter

Tell that to my StamSorc. Or my StamKnight. The only character I've managed to get to 30k+ is my StamBlade and that's because of higher Penetration and several hard hitting spammables.

AlienatedGoat

Valrien wrote: »

AlienatedGoat wrote: »

Valrien wrote: »

AlienatedGoat wrote: »

Valrien wrote: »

Bare minimum 30k, just because of how easy it is to get 30k DPS.

If it was that easy, this thread wouldn't exist.

Neither would all the other DPS threads.

No, it's pretty easy. Threads like these spawn because there are people not even willing to do the bare minimum

That's elitism.

There are plenty of people willing to do the work, but it takes time and patience to get to that point.

Just because there are some bad and willfully ignorant DPS out there doesn't mean they all are.

Bro 30k can be achieved just with the right gear + dots + light attacks.

The bare minimum is light attack spam but smarter

And how much time to get "the right gear"? How much time to learn how to properly weave LAs? Or learn how to manage DOTs for maximum uptime?

You're seeing this from only your perspective, and the fact that you think your perspective is the only one is why it's elitist.

You have to realize that someone at a lesser skill level is going to see things differently.

AlienatedGoat

JinMori wrote: »

AlienatedGoat wrote: »

Tannus15 wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

kathandira wrote: »

ryanfan wrote: »

So as many people have discussed, when queuing for vet dungeons, DLC dungeons and trials, having enough DPS can certainly help the group progress the content and make it a more enjoyable experience. No one likes to initiate a kick nor being kicked.

Many end game trial groups require combat metrics DPS parse before inviting you to the group so they know you are qualified.
Many YouTubers have created videos sharing their builds and DPS rotations to help people improve their skills and DPS.

But is hitting over 60k single target on parse really necessary for casual players who just want to try and complete the vet content?

For players who don't have end game trial gear, perfect rotation, nor BIS meta build, how much DPS does one need in order to be a REAL DPS for vet content (no hm), making the game enjoyable for oneself and as well as its teammates?

From what I've gathered:

Vet Dungeons: 15k+
Vet DLC Dungeons: 20k+
Vet Trials: 30k+

These aren't set in stone though.

To clear, it's lower than that.

Base Game Vet dungeons run under 10k for their DPS checks. (I forget, it's only like 6 or 7k for the hard checks.)

Most Vet DLC can be cleared at 15k

Vet base game trials check at around 12k.

Vet DLC trials check at around 20k (maybe 25k)

The problem is, most players want to bypass mechanics, or get out of specific phases quickly, which calls for higher DPS.

The more recent the content is, the higher the checks will be, except, a lot of fights don't depend on DPS checks at all. You can clear Thurvokun with three tanks if you wanted to, and you'd have a significantly easier time than if you were dealing with two 45k DPS who didn't understand the fight and wouldn't follow direction.

Understanding mechanics is way more important than raw DPS. This is also one place where you'll see a difference between endgame raid groups. Groups that prioritize players who can learn systems, and improve will do far better, long term, than ones that focus on just parse numbers. (And, before someone comes scampering in to defend their guild, yes, both of these kinds of groups do exist.)

There is no way you're clearing the twins in vMoL with 20k. You'll get overwhelmed by adds.
There is no way you're clearing the last boss in vHoF with 20k. You'll die in execute.

I've had groups clear vMoL with less than 20k DPS average. Twins are more about tank competency than it is about DPS.

I would like evidence for that claim, if you did do it or not, and to see how exactly it was done, because if you got it after the 150 wipe, than that's not really better than just not doing it at all, it's a waste of time, and you would just be better off in a group with more dps.

This is a typical response i see, all claim that they have done this and that with pretty low to ludicrously low dps, and use it as an argument that dps is not important, but where is the evidence? So we may judge? Because i too did some groups with low dps back when i was not as good, but it definitely was not very fun.

But i'm just elitist am i right?

Didn't say it was fun. I said we cleared.

As for whether you believe it or not, I honestly don't care.

emilyhyoyeon

I mainly play tank and I've had so many experiences with 20k total group DPS in vet dungeons. They're obviously easily doable but so long and boring to get through. I expect 25k+ per DD for a comfortable experience

MartiniDaniels

LightMaster7 wrote: »

Anyone measuring their dps by how they perform on a dummy is an idiot.

You just put on some single target enhanced dps sets and you can fanagle that *** all day.

Doesn't tell you how good that person is in a real dungeon, his actual skills or what that person is really capable of.

Lol, i guess there are some people which are good at dummy and in trials under cheerleader voice guidance, but don't remember mechanics and so of limited use in dungeons.. but it's very small %. If person can do at least 30k at dummy, any dungeon run with couple of such dps is cakewalk. Even if they don't know mechanics, you can explain them etc.. and if person does 5-10k like a big% of pugs guys, no amount of mechanic knowledge will save them in dlc vets..
I have huge number of runs as tank or healer where we wiped 10 times and then one "fake" dps leave, good one queues in and we finish boss from first try without problem.

So, yeah, there IS real dps - dps which can do it's job, and this is OP question - what amount of dummy dps is required for different levels of difficulty.

idk

I thought OP started off with race passives needing a rebalance but somehow I do not see that now so I am editing.

Beyond the DPS a player can go out, managing mechanic and staying alive is a key factor as one tackles more challenging content such as the DLC dungeons and post Craglorn vet trials.

While others have given great numbers, each guild and raid group sets their own requirements. There is a great tiered level of raiding guilds with players to help at each level. Many of those that get early clears in trials help other teams and guilds learn fights and more.

As for gear for someone who has not been raiding. With the exception of "perfect" gear which only drops in the two latest trials we can get the same gear in normal difficulty levels. Beyond that, there is great gear that is almost as good available outside of trials.

More important, a players skill is more important than the gear they equip and racial passives. Practice and ask for help from your raid guild. They are there to help you.

Kurat

I just wanna add that knowing the mechanics and staying alive is also very important. I often see ppl bragging about their high dps dead on the floor a lot. Remember that you can't do dps when ur dead and some " low dps noob" has to stop their dps to rez ur glass ass. People are so obsessed about their dps and show up in vet trial with 14k health. Also remember that the skelly u cheesed ur parse doesn't hit back.
Yesterday I attempted vHRC HM with one of my guilds who requires min 30k parse on 6mil for easier vet trials and 40k+ for harder ones. So everyone was at least 30k dps, some 45k+. And we failed horribly. Wipe after wipe at last boss. Half the group had never done hm and ppl just couldn't stay alive long enough to dps. Most of the fight was just rezing others. And group dps was barely over 100k. Skelly warriors lol

malicia

My casual guild requires 22k for the normal vet trials, and 28k for the progression group. The normal vet group has cleared all Craglorn trials, got speedruns on most.

Our progression group has cleared all Craglorn HMs, has cleared vCR (only on +0, yet).

More DPS is always nice, but we’re not aiming for the leaderboards as a rule. We do sometimes get top 100 scores, though.

mocap

DPS is not a big deal.

5000k boss and 50k group dps is 1.6 minute fight
5000k boss and 90k group dps is 1.0 minute fight. "Meh" difference.

However, group who deal 90k usualy play clean, perfectly know mechanics, so more DPS is always better (indirectly in this case).

MLGProPlayer

Kurat wrote: »

I just wanna add that knowing the mechanics and staying alive is also very important. I often see ppl bragging about their high dps dead on the floor a lot. Remember that you can't do dps when ur dead and some " low dps noob" has to stop their dps to rez ur glass ass. People are so obsessed about their dps and show up in vet trial with 14k health. Also remember that the skelly u cheesed ur parse doesn't hit back.
Yesterday I attempted vHRC HM with one of my guilds who requires min 30k parse on 6mil for easier vet trials and 40k+ for harder ones. So everyone was at least 30k dps, some 45k+. And we failed horribly. Wipe after wipe at last boss. Half the group had never done hm and ppl just couldn't stay alive long enough to dps. Most of the fight was just rezing others. And group dps was barely over 100k. Skelly warriors lol

Nobody with decent DPS is going to show up to vet content with 14k health.

If you know how to weave and what gear is BiS, you sure as *** know that food exists in the game (hell, food adds like 3-4k DPS to your parse just from the extra resources).

It's far more common to see low DPS players die from mechanics because they aren't familiar with the broader mechanics of the game either.

TheDarkShadow

15k non DLC dungeon
20k DLC dungeon
25k DLC dungeon HM and craglorn trials.
30k DLC trials and craglorn HM
35k+ DLC trial HM.

No cheese 6m solo parse.

Kurat

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Kurat wrote: »

I just wanna add that knowing the mechanics and staying alive is also very important. I often see ppl bragging about their high dps dead on the floor a lot. Remember that you can't do dps when ur dead and some " low dps noob" has to stop their dps to rez ur glass ass. People are so obsessed about their dps and show up in vet trial with 14k health. Also remember that the skelly u cheesed ur parse doesn't hit back.
Yesterday I attempted vHRC HM with one of my guilds who requires min 30k parse on 6mil for easier vet trials and 40k+ for harder ones. So everyone was at least 30k dps, some 45k+. And we failed horribly. Wipe after wipe at last boss. Half the group had never done hm and ppl just couldn't stay alive long enough to dps. Most of the fight was just rezing others. And group dps was barely over 100k. Skelly warriors lol

Nobody with decent DPS is going to show up to vet content with 14k health.

If you know how to weave and what gear is BiS, you sure as *** know that food exists in the game (hell, food adds like 3-4k DPS to your parse just from the extra resources).

It's far more common to see low DPS players die from mechanics because they aren't familiar with the broader mechanics of the game either.

Lol. U missing the point. They do have good gear and weave and sure use food. But not the one that increases your health. To cheese parse u dont need health. They use max resource and regen food/drink lol. And you are right, it increases their dps a lot. Also ppl are so obsessed and wear sets that are good for parsing but not great in heavy mechanic content where u gotta move around a lot. That's why always take peeps dps numbers with a grain of salt.

MJallday

Tannus15 wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

kathandira wrote: »

ryanfan wrote: »

So as many people have discussed, when queuing for vet dungeons, DLC dungeons and trials, having enough DPS can certainly help the group progress the content and make it a more enjoyable experience. No one likes to initiate a kick nor being kicked.

Many end game trial groups require combat metrics DPS parse before inviting you to the group so they know you are qualified.
Many YouTubers have created videos sharing their builds and DPS rotations to help people improve their skills and DPS.

But is hitting over 60k single target on parse really necessary for casual players who just want to try and complete the vet content?

For players who don't have end game trial gear, perfect rotation, nor BIS meta build, how much DPS does one need in order to be a REAL DPS for vet content (no hm), making the game enjoyable for oneself and as well as its teammates?

From what I've gathered:

Vet Dungeons: 15k+
Vet DLC Dungeons: 20k+
Vet Trials: 30k+

These aren't set in stone though.

To clear, it's lower than that.

Base Game Vet dungeons run under 10k for their DPS checks. (I forget, it's only like 6 or 7k for the hard checks.)

Most Vet DLC can be cleared at 15k

Vet base game trials check at around 12k.

Vet DLC trials check at around 20k (maybe 25k)

The problem is, most players want to bypass mechanics, or get out of specific phases quickly, which calls for higher DPS.

The more recent the content is, the higher the checks will be, except, a lot of fights don't depend on DPS checks at all. You can clear Thurvokun with three tanks if you wanted to, and you'd have a significantly easier time than if you were dealing with two 45k DPS who didn't understand the fight and wouldn't follow direction.

Understanding mechanics is way more important than raw DPS. This is also one place where you'll see a difference between endgame raid groups. Groups that prioritize players who can learn systems, and improve will do far better, long term, than ones that focus on just parse numbers. (And, before someone comes scampering in to defend their guild, yes, both of these kinds of groups do exist.)

There is no way you're clearing the twins in vMoL with 20k. You'll get overwhelmed by adds.
There is no way you're clearing the last boss in vHoF with 20k. You'll die in execute.

Agreed (I’ve completed both several
Times)

25k vMOL minimum
35k vhof minimum (upstairs on boss 1 ideally 40k)

Mechanics are just as important though. But I always thought for some reason vhof was easier than vMOL. It isnt

Vas plus 2 is next on my hit list (done plus 1)

Facefister

In a group with buffs and debuffs:

35k~40k on very static fights with minimum movements
20k~35k on dynamic fights

Dummy parses have no value. The dummy is only there for you to practice a somewhat basic rotation.

Kingslayer513

10k

That's bare minimum for vet level content. 10k is what I get on my pure healer just from AOEs and resto staff heavy attacks. People doing less than 10k are doing less dps than my healer that's not spec'd into damage at all, so I'd say that's a fake dps whether through choice or through lack of information.

Obviously, more difficult content will have a higher baseline than 10k, but if you're not doing at least 10k then sorry, you're not a "real" dps yet.

Kingslayer513

RebornV3x wrote: »

25k+ is fine anything more is great tho

ccfeeling wrote: »

I believe 25k is fine with almost all content.

C'mon, 25k will get you into pugs for vet crags. You don't need 25k for vet FG1 lol and that's the type of casual vet content OP is asking about.

Facefister

Kingslayer513 wrote: »

RebornV3x wrote: »

25k+ is fine anything more is great tho

ccfeeling wrote: »

I believe 25k is fine with almost all content.

C'mon, 25k will get you into pugs for vet crags. You don't need 25k for vet FG1 lol and that's the type of casual vet content OP is asking about.

If you do ~10k dps, stay in Spindle1 and FG1, don't attempt to get in other groups because you'll become a burden. Bare minimum 20k dps with basic equipment is easily doable as long as you take yourself and your role somewhat seriously.

Aurayna

My best character is Level 50 CP 435 BUT I have no idea where to find out how much DPS she has.

So my questions is this where can I find this info ?

I did put an addon hoping to tell me, but the writing was so tiny I couldn't even read it !

Something like AlcastHQ has on his screen would be good, when he runs a dungeon !

OR can you find the info without an addon ?

malicia

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